[HN Gopher] Netflix: Piracy Is Difficult to Compete Against and ...
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Netflix: Piracy Is Difficult to Compete Against and Growing Rapidly
Author : notamy
Score : 58 points
Date : 2024-02-04 21:44 UTC (1 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (torrentfreak.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (torrentfreak.com)
| blowsand wrote:
| Are these claims actually quantified by any of the companies
| mentioned in the article?
|
| While there's no disagreement that "piracy" occurs, I'd love to
| see refreshed numbers around "potential paying customers" vs
| "because it's there but wouldn't otherwise buy" metrics.
|
| Also, that c&p is lazy and raises an eyebrow.
| h2odragon wrote:
| Do they still plan to compete by making their service suck more,
| through higher prices, more ads, and less content?
|
| I'm so glad I ripped all my DVDs
| SlightlyLeftPad wrote:
| Amen.
| avg_dev wrote:
| i read on twitter a while back about some tv writer who was
| really happy because they managed to find someone who sent them
| pirated dvds of their work. apparently when disney+ removed the
| show from their catalog, it was otherwise lost to the world.
| that is definitely not the promise of streaming services that i
| remember from when they was first starting to gain popularity.
| StopTheTechies wrote:
| The common supposition about video is that convenience makes the
| price worth it versus piracy. It'll be very interesting to see
| this unfold. Not only are streaming services in direct
| competition with a free option, but they'll have actual, real,
| not-market-inevitable competition for their "exclusively-
| negotiated" tv.
| znkynz wrote:
| Piracy has evolved too; You only need to look at how automated
| piracy can become; whether its the end of the people buying
| access to plex, or the automation offered by users of the
| Servarr stacks /Sonarr/Radarr etc
|
| Netflix invgestment in UX has lead to theUX being valued around
| piracy, rather than just downloading files from some website.
| frompdx wrote:
| It's even harder to compete when you don't have the content users
| want while charging more than ever.
| aqme28 wrote:
| I have found myself pirating more and more. Netflix and co aren't
| just losing on the available content and the price, the actual
| browsing experience is far better on the illegal streaming site I
| use.
| PlutoIsAPlanet wrote:
| Streaming became popular because it was easier than piracy and
| better than TV (watch anywhere, on demand, pickup where you left
| off etc).
|
| Streaming is no longer easier than piracy, why pay for 8
| different services and have to waste your time figuring out whats
| on what when you can just have one service for free, even if its
| illegal, and have it all under one roof.
|
| The services have taken the piss and now they'll get the
| repercussions of it.
| jerjerjer wrote:
| Streaming also had no ads which is now gated behind even more
| pricey plans.
| DoughnutHole wrote:
| Even an "ad-free" Netflix plan is infested with promotion of
| their in-house productions.
| cocoa19 wrote:
| Low price and no ads were two of the main selling points to
| ditch cable (along with stream whenever you want).
|
| We reached the point were price is almost as high as cable
| was (with the standard 4-5 subscriptions), and we have ads.
| This is not a surprise to most though, the question has
| always been when would it happen.
| dgfitz wrote:
| Of course this is 100% the correct reasoning.
|
| When I was a broke college kid I pirated all the things, and at
| the time wished, when I could afford it, I'd rather just pay.
| When I could, I did, for years. Now we're back at the path-of-
| least-resistance is pirating.
| eastbound wrote:
| But that means companies must sell for the marginal price of
| their website's ergonomics, not for the marginal price of
| producing movies.
|
| (Which is not a big loss, because I can't imagine producing
| the Netflix knockoffs be a hundredth the price of a 007).
| api wrote:
| Amazon Prime and Apple TV are easy. Just rent the movie. It's a
| few bucks like video rental shops back in the old days. You can
| also buy, though only Apple really allows downloading of bought
| content.
| achates wrote:
| Also piracy is a lot better now. With Plex you get to watch
| anywhere and save your place and there's automation software
| for torrents.
| bawolff wrote:
| > Piracy also threatens to damage our business, as its
| fundamental proposition to consumers is so compelling and
| difficult to compete against: virtually all content for free,"
| Netflix writes.
|
| People emphasize the "free" part, but it really is the "all
| content" part that makes piracy wins.
|
| Especially if you are not in the USA, often specific content
| isn't available at any price. Even if it is, its split across 5
| billion different confusing services.
|
| The killer feature of piracy is thar it just works, not that it
| is free.
| bojan wrote:
| Now, it doesn't just work. You need to download the thing, find
| the right format, get it to the TV in one way or another, hope
| that the subs are good.
|
| Compared to that, it's the streaming that just works. Except
| when it doesn't.
| beart wrote:
| Software has completely automated all of these steps. The
| only barrier is the initial set up, which a non-technical
| person can figure out over a weekend.
| xattt wrote:
| [delayed]
| skeaker wrote:
| Right, streaming can win on convenience but loses so hard on
| content that it has begun to cancel out any reason to use it.
| Netflix really was great back when it was just getting really
| popular and had both consistent content and a just-works
| video player, but to stay popular it needed to keep both, and
| it hasn't.
|
| Piracy _can_ do the other things you mentioned automatically
| by the way, but I agree that it 's less "just-works" for the
| average person given the setup involved.
| everyone wrote:
| For me one of the biggest draws of file-sharing is that I
| find it so easy.
|
| The streaming service way would involve finding where the
| show is, accounts, credentials, godawful UI, ads, spam,
| potential malware,+ many other constantly changing and
| evolving inconveniences.
|
| File-sharing way is just so fast and easy to comprehend for
| me, search for the show on one site, pick the quality I want,
| download the files and then do whatever I want with them.
| Also it hasnt changed in decades.
| lm28469 wrote:
| There are a lot of websites for illegal streaming, it's plug
| and play, even easier to use than Netflix, and their catalog
| is very often up to date with what you can find on torrent
| trackers
| skeaker wrote:
| Yep. This video is played for laughs but I was shocked to learn
| how much of it was true and not just satire:
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvhv7bgmz64
|
| Content being fragmented and constantly coming and going is a
| massive problem for users. Netflix used to be the go-to to find
| just about any given show or film, but has become a mystery box
| where the contents change on a near-daily basis. Piracy is
| reliable and simple instead, and works like Netflix used to:
| Just search up what you want to watch and you're golden. It has
| been and always will be a service problem.
| ensignavenger wrote:
| Not only free and all (most), but less hassle, too. A pirate
| doesn't need to worry about digital restrictions if they
| haven't upgraded their TV, HDMI cables, and streaming boxes,
| web broweswers, etc. to all support whatever BS the the big
| streaming providers are pushing.
| jwells89 wrote:
| Delayed availability also bolsters piracy. In the age of the
| internet, people don't want to watch foreign shows weeks or
| months after they've aired in their country of origin, but
| within mere hours of original airing so they can ride the
| global wave of discussion after each episode.
|
| A six month delay for example will completely miss the bulk of
| the show's online relevance and even a week is enough to
| seriously dampen enthusiasm in the region. This isn't the 90s
| or prior decades where viewers are entirely reliant on local
| licensees to know what's available.
|
| Studios, distributors, and streaming services are seriously
| shooting themselves in the foot by not pulling all stops to
| make sure all shows are simultaneously available worldwide.
| mistermann wrote:
| > When we started looking for similar mentions by other
| businesses, we stumbled upon similar concerns and, strangely
| enough, some identical ones. Apparently, there's quite a bit of
| copying going on, _as SEC filings from several companies include
| identical passages_.
|
| I smell a coordinated initiative to buy some "democracy".
| chaostheory wrote:
| What annoys me about Netflix is that they go out of their way to
| limit the platforms that you can watch their service from.
| Currently, I cannot watch Netflix with a modern client that
| streams better than 480P on my Quest headset.
| jMyles wrote:
| ...it's difficult to compete against even when you have the state
| willing to make threats of violence on your behalf if they
| utilize the competing model.
|
| It seems like this says more about the future of so-called
| "intellectual property" than it does about these particular
| companies or these particular practices.
| ilrwbwrkhv wrote:
| Piracy is a moral imperative. The internet was supposed to be
| free and break down barriers. Instead what we have now is a show
| available in the UK but not available in the US. This is not
| acceptable.
|
| This plus the fact that actual artists get a pittance, means the
| flag will fly high till companies learn.
|
| Also piracy has become much more reliable these days. There are
| systems which will make sure you get 4k streams based on any
| genre you enjoy. New shows from around the world. No need to wait
| for Netflix to add it to your countries playlist that to hidden
| behind garbage UX.
|
| At the end of the day it is about availability, user control,
| artist benefits and showing the middle finger to large
| corporations.
|
| That is the hacker mindset. That is what I grew up with in the
| early 2000s and it is substantially better than what we are
| "supposed" to do now. Hope that makes sense.
| MattPalmer1086 wrote:
| No, it absolutely isn't a moral imperative, quite the reverse.
|
| I don't know where you get the idea that the internet was
| "supposed" to be "free" or why the fact that a global transport
| network for information exists implies that everything
| transported over it should not require any payment.
|
| The logical endpoint of your position is that you will get what
| you pay for: content that costs almost nothing to produce.
| ESTheComposer wrote:
| The irony here is from their post history they are a business
| owner that made 4m in profits last year. Guess it's a moral
| imperative to steal from them eh?
| tacticalturtle wrote:
| I don't understand how it follows that if artists are paid a
| pittance, then the moral thing to do is to still consume their
| content - while depriving them of revenue from residuals.
| alexfromapex wrote:
| "We cracked down on account sharing, added a bunch of ads, DRM,
| and are seeing the logical response from annoyed consumers"
| SllX wrote:
| I mean Netflix has been losing to "just buy it in iTunes" for me
| for years. I don't watch a lot of movies, but when I do, it
| usually can't be found anywhere to stream so I just buy it.
|
| Their UI sucks, they don't want to integrate with the Apple TV
| app on my phone (search, Up Next, immediate access) because of
| competitive reasons, and they rarely have any decent movies
| anymore because they turned their entire business model to
| original serials, where "original" can mean they just bought the
| international distribution rights.
| avg_dev wrote:
| > We don't know where these references originate. Netflix has
| mentioned it for a while, that's for sure, and apparently, the
| use of this language is widespread and subject to rapid global
| growth.
|
| lol
| noman-land wrote:
| I sometimes wonder if more piracy will lead to more product
| placement directly in content and other insidious advertising
| strategies that would make up for the content being scooped up
| for free. It's still millions of eyes, after all.
| mtlmtlmtlmtl wrote:
| The streaming space desperately needs consolidation right now.
|
| Every rights holder having their own service has killed a lot of
| the convenience because you'll now need several different
| services to go through an entire TV show, for instance. And also
| because all services other than maybe Netflix have garbage
| software for your various devices. Because every service also has
| to support 8 different platforms. Video playback and scrubbing is
| buggy and laggy, the GUI for finding stuff is sluggish. On one
| service(I don't even remember which, they all blur together in my
| head), I tried to watch some House MD and half the episodes were
| missing the English audio track.
| wackget wrote:
| I have one point which I really feel exemplifies the entire
| Netflix experience: before you sign up, they do not give you a
| list of what's available to watch.
|
| Seriously, check out their website. It's basically a landing page
| which says "give us your money". The prices aren't even
| displayed.
|
| There is no list of shows, save for a few measly screenshots of
| featured/well-known titles. There is a search box which lets you
| search for titles, but nothing like a catalogue of offerings,
| which is the absolute bare minimum I'd expect to see before
| purchasing a service.
|
| I really cannot fathom why anyone would willingly give their
| hard-earned money to a company which doesn't even tell you what
| you're getting in exchange.
| seventytwo wrote:
| Well, well, well... its seems we've come full circle.
| SirMaster wrote:
| Music piracy used to be a big problem. I am not sure if it still
| is or not?
|
| Anyway, it feels like music piracy isn't close to what it was at
| its peak and that they figured out how to make it work.
|
| Is there a reason that video is so much different?
| AltF4me wrote:
| It's not fragmented like video is. You go to your favourite
| music streaming platform and listen. You don't need to check
| all 10 services you pay for to work out if the artist is
| available on it.
| cypress66 wrote:
| It's more expensive so they are greedier.
| cangeroo wrote:
| I'm concerned about the artists, the writers, and all the other
| people who put in the actual work, who deserve a livelihood and
| recognition.
|
| But the financiers, producers, and distributors have too much
| power and influence over the culture economy, to an extent where
| it's not unfair to ask whether they operate like a cartel, with
| heavy-handed nepotism, blacklisting, and politics.
|
| So yeah, I don't have sympathy for the streaming services.
| j1elo wrote:
| Only 6hrs ago this comment summarizes a big part of what's wrong
| with the streaming model today [1]:
|
| > _Disney+ removed Crater ~7 weeks after it was released, purely
| to reduce residuals and claim losses for lower tax bills[2]._
|
| [1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39252151
|
| [2]: https://kotaku.com/disney-streaming-crater-tax-rort-scam-
| wri...
| j-bos wrote:
| Last week we were going to watch See How They Run on Max, some
| things came so today we went to watch it... Aaaaand it's gone.
|
| I don't sail and I don't care enough to find an alternative.
| Today we drown in quality (if you know how to look)
| entertainment, why should I chase movies and shows that the
| runners clearly don't care for me to see? I imagine apathy is a
| bigger competitor to Netflix than even piracy.
| righthand wrote:
| Consumer: Netflix is hard to pay for when they raise prices twice
| in 3 months and describe the 2nd price raise as account lock
| down, the consequences are growing rapidly.
| righthand wrote:
| I definitely cancelled Netflix but I don't pirate their shows
| because there's nothing really worth pirating.
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