[HN Gopher] The quest to decode the Mandelbrot set
       ___________________________________________________________________
        
       The quest to decode the Mandelbrot set
        
       Author : limbicsystem
       Score  : 192 points
       Date   : 2024-01-26 17:54 UTC (2 days ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (www.quantamagazine.org)
 (TXT) w3m dump (www.quantamagazine.org)
        
       | QuadmasterXLII wrote:
       | If you enjoyed learning about the Hashlife algorithm for Conway's
       | Game of Life, the bilinear approximation algorithm for computing
       | whether a point is in the mandelbrot set has the same je ne sais
       | quoi. No one has done a really accessible writeup of it yet, but
       | this blog post and the linked forum thread are a good start:
       | https://mathr.co.uk/blog/2022-02-21_deep_zoom_theory_and_pra...
        
         | RBerenguel wrote:
         | I did some research on this on the side for my dissertation,
         | but never published it. The fact centers approximate the
         | boundary generalises to almost any point in the plane as a
         | consequence of normality of some sequences, and generalises to
         | most families of complex iteration under very mild conditions.
         | I've had a preprint that I never felt like finishing for
         | something like 15 years lying around.
        
           | QuadmasterXLII wrote:
           | If you ever decide to put it out as-is, I'd love to read it!
        
       | keepamovin wrote:
       | Maybe Mandelbrot shape represents a state space or set of
       | possible transformations, configurations or relationships of
       | certain solvable or equilibrium dynamical systems, so maybe MLC
       | is true if there's a certain structure-preserving relationship
       | over sets of these dynamical systems.
        
       | sliken wrote:
       | Decades ago two mathematicians argued about the area of the
       | mandelbrot set. Both argued an asymtoically approaching different
       | numbers. They started a distributed project to calculate the
       | area.
       | 
       | I donated time on PA-risc workstations to the effort and was
       | surprised to hear that the 2 machines contributed more to the
       | final answer then 100s of other contributors. Something about how
       | HP's compiler/chip preserved more accurate in the intermediate
       | results than others. That surprised me since AFAIK the PA-risc is
       | just a normal 64 bit floating point unit, which doesn't every
       | have more precision for intermediate results. I believe PCs at
       | the time often used the x86, which has 80 bits of precision for
       | the intermediate results.
       | 
       | I believe the project was a success, but I don't remember the
       | conclusion.
        
         | shrx wrote:
         | More context here (alt.fractals discussion from February 1991)
         | [0]:
         | 
         |  _[...] by computing the area of the M-set using lots of terms
         | in a series (Laurent Series?), the upper bound of the area
         | seems to converge about at 1.72 (the graph gets quite flat, and
         | seems to have an asymptote there), and by counting pixals more
         | and more accurately, you seem to get a lower bound of very
         | close to 1.52. Both these bounds are close to the values the
         | methods would produce in the limit - that is, it is NOT the
         | case that these numbers would get closer if a finer grid were
         | used, or more terms were taken in the series. So, why the
         | difference of 10% or so? No one knows._
         | 
         | [0] https://ics.uci.edu/~eppstein/junkyard/mand-area.html
        
       | denton-scratch wrote:
       | > the word evoked the notion of a new kind of geometry --
       | something fragmented, fractional or broken.
       | 
       | But that's not what "fractal" means; it means "fractional
       | dimension". To say the word "fractal" evoked something is
       | subjective - evoked it for whom?
        
         | pohl wrote:
         | I suppose the dimension is the something, to be charitable.
         | 
         | Compare to the etymology section here
         | 
         | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fractal
        
         | pvg wrote:
         | For people who know similar-sounding words. Words can evoke
         | things well outside their etymology or denotation, one of the
         | many reasons people like and use words.
        
         | TheOtherHobbes wrote:
         | For people who don't know what a fractional dimension is. And
         | mostly don't care.
         | 
         | Fractal art of all kinds was part of a certain trend in 80s/90s
         | culture, which also influenced the look of the early Internet.
         | And electronic dance music, clubs, and raves.
         | 
         | It was maximalist, psychedelic, colourful, busy, inclusive,
         | recursive, and complex.
         | 
         | Whatever the math was doing, it was a very popular signifier of
         | certain kinds of experience.
         | 
         | I suspect it's not a surprise that if faded into the background
         | when the Internet began to commercialise and blandify in the
         | later 90s.
        
       | infogulch wrote:
       | Making a program to render a view of the Mandelbrot set is a fun
       | exercise, I recommend it.
       | 
       | I found a viewer that works in the browser:
       | 
       | > Mandelbrot Viewer is a universal (desktop and mobile) vanilla
       | JS implementation of a plain Mandelbrot set renderer - supporting
       | mouse, touch and keyboard interaction.
       | 
       | https://mandelbrot.silversky.dev/
        
         | brazzy wrote:
         | Here's my attempt done a long time ago, not very polished:
         | 
         | https://brazzy.de/en/Mandelbrot.php
         | 
         | Even for that, the actual Mandelbrot calculations were the
         | smaller part. It's really amazing how such a trivially simple
         | formula spawns such endless complexity.
        
           | rnentjes wrote:
           | I'll add my julia attempt that animates and works with webgl:
           | 
           | http://julia.perses.games/
        
           | swayvil wrote:
           | Complexity is trivial. That's the lesson here. It's human
           | perception that's special. It's special in that it has an
           | uncommonly low bar on what's considered impressively complex.
           | 
           | Which implies something important, no doubt.
        
         | QuadmasterXLII wrote:
         | If you want to keep zooming in the browser and have snappy gpu
         | accelerated performance while basically never hitting "reached
         | limit of numerical precision," check out
         | https://mandeljs.hgreer.com . The math to make this possible
         | gets pretty funky: I go over the tricks I used at
         | https://www.hgreer.com/JavascriptMandelbrot/
        
           | sapiogram wrote:
           | No scrolling with the scroll wheel though :(
        
             | QuadmasterXLII wrote:
             | The whole thing is a tower of spaghetti bit hacks in the
             | name of depth and speed. Embarassingly, it actually can't
             | actually render zoom levels that aren't powers of two and
             | I'm not sure how to change that.
        
               | LoganDark wrote:
               | Can you make it so that the position you clicked stays at
               | the same position after each zoom, rather than centering
               | it on your cursor? That way you can click multiple times
               | to zoom in on the same point.
        
           | tda wrote:
           | Thanks for creating this, I had some fun exploring the set.
           | What does the scale parameter stand for?
        
             | QuadmasterXLII wrote:
             | The color of each pixel is                   fragColor =
             | vec4(vec3(cos(c), cos(1.1214 * c) , cos(.8 * c)) / 2. + .5,
             | 1.);
             | 
             | Where c is the number of iterations divided by the scale.
        
           | tweetle_beetle wrote:
           | That really is very fast!
           | 
           | (I don't know if this is a known compromise of your technique
           | (I couldn't find it mentioned), but I occassionally get a
           | ring of varying thickness centred in the render with an
           | inverted coluring to the rest of the pixels, or sometimes a
           | solid colour. It varies is size and comes and goes without an
           | obvious correlation to zoom level.)
        
             | QuadmasterXLII wrote:
             | Yeah, I've been chasing that for a while. I've traced it to
             | subnormal float handling. Here's the scenario: if you
             | multiply the 32 bit float float 1 x 2^-127 by 1/8, you
             | can't get 1x2^-130 because 130 isn't representable in a 8
             | bit exponent. On the CPU or a modern GPU, this is special
             | cased to result in a "subnormal" float: .125 x 2^-127.
             | However, this adds a ton of extra complexitity to the FPU.
             | Old GPUs just gave up and say "It's zero." WebGL
             | standardized on the old GPU behavior, so a modern GPU
             | running webgl sets a flag to behave like the old GPUs.
             | 
             | I'm representing complex numbers as (real_mantissa + i *
             | imag_mantissa) * 2^exp where real_mantissa and
             | imag_mantissa are themselves 32 bit floats, and I can
             | reduce the frequency of the colored rings in my shader by
             | keeping the mantissas around ~1000 instead of ~1 (and
             | reducing the exponent to keep the value the same) so that
             | they are less likely to go subnormal, but I can't seem to
             | get rid of the colored rings entirely.
             | 
             | I don't actually know the pathway through the code from
             | subnormal underflow -> colored rings, but if you run a CUDA
             | renderer with the same algorithm, the rings appear when you
             | set the flag for "round subnormal floats to zero."
        
         | crazygringo wrote:
         | I made quite a sophisticated viewer as a teen, but boy was it
         | slow to run back then, back on a 486.
         | 
         | Now people write viewers that run lighting fast in a browser
         | thanks to WebGPU! Like:
         | 
         | https://www.reddit.com/r/fractals/comments/o7l4bm/please_try...
        
           | IronBacon wrote:
           | I remember as a teen I did mine in 68000 assembly on a
           | Commodore Amiga to get it reasonable fast considering it was
           | running on a 16 MHz CPU -- i would say a few seconds to draw
           | the canonical image -- but IIRC it reached pretty fast the
           | limit of math precision.
           | 
           | At that time I didn't know what was a complex number, but was
           | fascinated by the whole concept of fractals and how complex
           | structures could be created with a relative simple program.
        
             | Baeocystin wrote:
             | A few seconds? Wow! I did a science fair project on the
             | Mandelbrot set using my Amiga 2000, and it took me a good
             | 45+ minutes to generate a single 320x200 color image. IIRC,
             | I wrote the generator in some variant of Pascal, and was so
             | happy with the performance increase over Basic on my
             | C=128...
             | 
             | I ran in to the precision limit pretty quickly, same as
             | you. I didn't understand computers well enough to know
             | that's what the problem was, and I remember spending hours
             | pouring over my code, trying to figure out where the bug
             | was. Good times. :D
        
               | vardump wrote:
               | The difference is probably you used floats and he/she
               | used fixed point (integers). Of course that way you do
               | run out of precision very quickly.
               | 
               | Software emulated floats on Amiga 2000 were really,
               | really slow.
        
               | IronBacon wrote:
               | If I'm not confusing it with something else, I seem to
               | recall that when zooming on the set the calculation was
               | nearly instantaneous. As you said, good times! ^__^
               | 
               | I still have that A500 but who knows where I put those
               | floppies, I'm tempted to turn it on but I'm scared the
               | PSU will blow itself...
        
           | BeetleB wrote:
           | I did it in QuickBasic (also on a 486).
           | 
           | Now _that 's_ slow.
        
           | chihuahua wrote:
           | I typed in a BASIC program for a C-64 from a computer
           | magazine. That was a popular mechanism for software
           | distribution back then.
           | 
           | I thought "this will never work", but I was amazed that it
           | did in fact work. I remember letting it run overnight to find
           | a complete 160x200 4-color image the next morning. Just
           | clearing the screen using a loop to fill 8192 bytes with 0s
           | took over a minute.
           | 
           | Everything about the computers at the time was so terrible, I
           | don't feel any nostalgia for those days or that technology.
        
           | dekhn wrote:
           | The one I wrote in BASIC on my Apple IIe never finished, it
           | hadn't even got the interesting bits of the set after a day
           | or so and I needed to play games.
           | 
           | FRACTINT was great because I could use my 286 and it was
           | fairly fast because used integer whenever possible.
        
       | martyvis wrote:
       | '"We've got to try to train a neural network to zoom around the
       | Mandelbrot set," Kapiamba joked.'
       | 
       | This actually sounds to me to be fine goal. An AI that sounds out
       | unexplored depths to reveal interesting sights that maybe
       | resemble what we see in the world at our level or cool patterns
       | that potentially are a delight to the eye would be pretty cool.
        
       | hnfong wrote:
       | The Mandelbrot set is quite well known.
       | 
       | Yet something I learned recently blew my mind. It's about the
       | uncanny resemblance between the images generated by the
       | Mandelbrot set, and among all things, the popular image of
       | Buddha.
       | 
       | For example: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buddhabrot
       | 
       | Even when looking at the 2D Mandelbrot set renderings, I can't
       | help but wonder whether the similarity of the "bulbs" to the
       | rather unique Buddha "hairstyle" (of allegedly funny lumps of
       | hair) was just a coincidence.
       | 
       | Also, the tower-like makuta headdress in some Buddhist traditions
       | look exactly like the thin threads that connect the bulbs at
       | around (-2, 0).
       | 
       | I'm not saying they mean anything, but just something uncanny,
       | and once I learned about the resemblance, it's hard to unsee
       | it...
        
         | flohofwoe wrote:
         | Also see the Mandelbrot monk (before you get too excited, it
         | was a hoax)
         | 
         | https://abcnews.go.com/Technology/WhosCounting/story?id=9861...
        
         | ggambetta wrote:
         | > I can't help but wonder whether the similarity of the "bulbs"
         | to the rather unique Buddha "hairstyle" (of allegedly funny
         | lumps of hair) was just a coincidence.
         | 
         | Honest question: what _else_ do you think it could be, if not a
         | coincidence?
        
           | hnfong wrote:
           | Honest answer: some early Buddhist followers taking some form
           | of acid/mushrooms and saw geometric visions of the Mandelbrot
           | set and thought it was a divine manifestation of Buddha?
           | 
           | I mean, I don't think this is likely, but that's the best I
           | got.
           | 
           | I hear the brain likes to go into geometry mode when
           | hallucinogens are ingested, and I suppose the brain is
           | theoretically powerful enough to compute the Mandelbrot
           | sets...
        
             | armchairdweller wrote:
             | I have had similar thoughts.
             | 
             | The prominent modes and paths of this 2D probability
             | distribution also show some resemblance to the kabbalistic
             | tree of life, which is its own, but fairly related topic of
             | study. DMT use within a connected strand of this "inner
             | science" has been suspected.
             | 
             | Drawing more of these far-fetching connections: The complex
             | plane is related to several areas of physics, which might
             | somehow find expression in electromagnetic brain dynamics.
             | 
             | In any case, the buddhabrot distribution seems quite
             | understudied both from a scientific / mathematical PoV, and
             | from the perspectives of the occluded study of the "inner
             | realms".
        
             | fractaltemp wrote:
             | I've done a wide variety of hallucinogens. While I've seen
             | things that could be described as fractal (in that they are
             | nested and self similar), I've never seen a literal time
             | escape fractal. In my experience, hallucinations look more
             | like turbulent flow, like smoke. Deepdream isn't a terrible
             | first approximation, but may give you the impression that
             | the hallucinations are more dramatic or total than is
             | typical.
             | 
             | I can't rule this hypothesis out entirely, but I'm very
             | skeptical. Pareidolia seems more likely to me.
        
         | AlanYx wrote:
         | There are a few others well-known fractals apart from the
         | Buddhabrot that resemble real-world objects. My favourite is
         | the burning ship fractal:
         | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burning_Ship_fractal
         | 
         | I found these sorts of things really helpful in getting my kids
         | interested in fractals. They love the idea that there are
         | "things" they can find that are only viewable through math.
        
           | Y_Y wrote:
           | The burning ship is still my favourite object in mathematics
           | despite about twenty years of study since I first came across
           | it. In an echo of the famous story about Tamm and the Taylor
           | series error, I once had to explain the burning ship to
           | border control in an impromptu test of my credentials (though
           | I'm not sure if I'd have been shot if I got it wrong).
        
       | thanatos519 wrote:
       | My favourite way to think about this shape is
       | https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Unrolled_main_cardioid_...
       | 
       | ... It's all elephants. The -R spike at the main disc is period
       | 2, the fork around +/-i is period 3, and so on to infinity at
       | 0.25+0i.
       | 
       | MLC might just be one of those facts that is true but unprovable!
        
       | pronoiac wrote:
       | For some fractals on the regular, Benoit Mandelbot on Mastodon -
       | https://botsin.space/@benoitmandelbot
        
       | DanielleMolloy wrote:
       | This view on the Mandelbrot iteration seems much more interesting
       | than the original set:
       | 
       | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buddhabrot
       | 
       | It is the probability distribution (i.e. the most frequent
       | locations visited) over the trajectory of the points that escape
       | the plane.
        
       | DanielleMolloy wrote:
       | Since the Mandelbrot iteration happens on the complex plane, is
       | there any recommended reading / research about its relation to
       | scientific fields where the complex plane is applied, like
       | mechanical oscillatory systems, quantum mechanics and
       | electromagnetism?
        
         | asplake wrote:
         | I had a couple of related questions. To what extent does
         | complex dynamics map to physical phenomena? And in the opposite
         | direction, how is renormalisation used outside of quantum
         | physics?
        
       | markisus wrote:
       | A very interesting cast of underdog characters appears in the
       | article.
       | 
       | You've got one guy with a relentless spirit to continue with
       | mathematics in is spare time after being blacklisted from
       | mainstream academia because of antisemitism.
       | 
       | Another is a childhood prodigy, who set the record for the
       | youngest American IMO team member, but got burned out as an adult
       | and went into finance but found his way back through the
       | mentorship of another mathematician.
       | 
       | And a third was a biology major. After graduating, he worked as a
       | baker. But he wanted a career change so he entered a master's
       | program in math and proved an impressive result.
        
         | dylan604 wrote:
         | Sounds like a couple of people decided to take an extended gap
         | year, and then came back more focused and in a better place for
         | the number crunching
        
         | fweimer wrote:
         | Note that the article refers to Soviet antisemitism: Jews were
         | denied academic jobs, and they couldn't move abroad to work in
         | their field, either. Not really related to mathematics as such
         | (and definitely not about the mathematical community rejecting
         | an antisemite).
        
           | eps wrote:
           | > they couldn't move abroad to work in their field
           | 
           | Nobody could do that, Jews or not.
        
       | OscarCunningham wrote:
       | What is the conjectured topology of the Mandelbrot set if MLC is
       | true?
       | 
       | My understanding is that there's a certain number of bulbs, each
       | centred around a point which becomes periodic with period p after
       | k steps. But how do they all stick together?
        
         | bongodongobob wrote:
         | The entire set is connected iirc.
        
           | qazxcvbnm wrote:
           | But what would be its homology, for instance?
        
             | OscarCunningham wrote:
             | It's known that it's connected and simply connected. So if
             | it's locally connected then I think it has to be
             | contractable.
        
         | clintonc wrote:
         | MLC stands for "Mandelbrot Locally Connected". It's not
         | obvious, but this is equivalent to the bulbs of the Mandelbrot
         | set (the domains of parameters where almost all points get
         | attracted toward periodic orbits) are dense in the Mandelbrot
         | set. Everyone believes it to be true.
        
           | OscarCunningham wrote:
           | Yes, but how exactly are the bulbs arranged? Wikipedia says
           | 'Not every hyperbolic component can be reached by a sequence
           | of direct bifurcations from the main cardioid of the
           | Mandelbrot set. Such a component can be reached by a sequence
           | of direct bifurcations from the main cardioid of a little
           | Mandelbrot copy'. Which sequences of bulbs have little copies
           | at the end of them? And how do the little copies attach?
        
             | clintonc wrote:
             | The combinatorics of how the Mandelbrot set is put together
             | is well-studied, and rather independent of MLC. The
             | arrangement of the bulbs on the boundary of the "main
             | cardiod" (which is where there is an attracting fixed
             | point) is described here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Man
             | delbrot_set#Main_cardioid_a.... Generally, the patterns are
             | given by something called Lavaur's Algorithm; see https://e
             | n.wikibooks.org/wiki/Fractals/Iterations_in_the_com... for
             | some explanation. Attachment points are always at the
             | "root" of the Mandelbrot set, which is the cusp of the main
             | cardioid.
             | 
             | A consequence of MLC is that the combinatorial picture
             | given by Lavaur's algorithm and related analyses is
             | "complete" -- all dynamical information is available from
             | the combinatorial models.
        
               | OscarCunningham wrote:
               | Thank you, that's very helpful!
        
       | derbOac wrote:
       | Does anyone know of any good resources on Kolmogorov complexity
       | and fractals such as the Mandelbrot set? Or even on information
       | theory and fractals?
       | 
       | For some reason reading this article is making me wonder about
       | the difference between the information required to generate
       | something like a mandelbrot, knowing the underlying rule, and the
       | information required to represent it as it is, without following
       | the rule. Or e.g., the difference between the information of the
       | generating rule and the information implicitly represented
       | through the time or number of operations needed to generate it.
       | 
       | It seems like there's some analogy between potential and kinetic
       | energy, and kolmogorov complexity and something else, that I'm
       | having trouble putting my finger on. Even if you have a simple
       | generating algorithm that might be small in a kolmogorov
       | complexity sense, if that algorithm entails a repeating something
       | over a large number of operations, the resulting object would be
       | complex, so there's an implied total complexity as well as an
       | "generating" one.
       | 
       | Maybe this is some basic computational complexity concept but if
       | so I'm not recalling this, or am being dense. E.g., I'm used to
       | discussions of "compressibility" but not of the "generating
       | representation information cost" versus "execution cost".
        
         | dcow wrote:
         | I think you're forgetting that there's no definitive way to
         | represent something, compressed or raw. So while it's
         | interesting to acknowledge that we can compress data and
         | sometimes rather efficiently, I'm not sure it maps to anything
         | physical beyond the fact that decompressing data creates
         | entropy.
         | 
         | Perhaps you'd be interested in
         | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landauer%27s_principle. Turns out
         | there may be a minimum energy required to _decrease_ entropy.
         | Jade has a really good overview https://youtu.be/XY-mbr-
         | aAZE?si=7DvSs2DMudsh6gk8
        
         | kjqgqkejbfefn wrote:
         | > so there's an implied total complexity as well as an
         | "generating" one.
         | 
         | Dessalles's algorithmic simplicity theory of (cognitive)
         | relevance is formulated in these terms.
         | 
         | >Situations are relevant to human beings when they appear
         | simpler to describe than to generate
         | 
         | The discrepancy between generation complexity
         | 
         | >the complexity (minimal description) of all parameters that
         | have to be set for the situation s to exist in the "world"
         | 
         | i.e, the "pixels"
         | 
         | and description complexity
         | 
         | > the length of the shortest available description of s (that
         | makes s unique)
         | 
         | i.e. the mandelbrot formula
         | 
         | is named Unexpectedness in this framework.
         | 
         | https://telecom-paris.hal.science/hal-03814119/document
         | 
         | https://simplicitytheory.telecom-paris.fr/
         | 
         | Dessalles published a paper in 2022, Unexpectedness and Bayes'
         | Rule
         | 
         | https://cifma.github.io/Papers-2021/CIFMA_2021_paper_13.pdf
         | 
         | >A great number of methods and of accounts of rationality
         | consider at their foundations some form of Bayesian inference.
         | Yet, Bayes' rule, because it relies upon probability theory,
         | requires specific axioms to hold (e.g. a measurable space of
         | events). This short document hypothesizes that Bayes' rule can
         | be seen as a specific instance of a more general inferential
         | template, that can be expressed also in terms of algorithmic
         | complexities, namely through the measure of unexpectedness
         | proposed by Simplicity Theory.
         | 
         | Maybe there is a way to plug this into the
         | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buddhabrot fractal someone
         | mentioned above.
        
       | GuB-42 wrote:
       | If you are interested in rendering the Mandelbrot set in a
       | variety of ways, as well as its 3D extensions, look here:
       | https://iquilezles.org/articles/
       | 
       | The last part is about fractals, especially the Mandelbrot set.
       | With some theoretical and some practical articles.
        
       | auroralimon wrote:
       | i've often wondered if mandelbrot is what you get when you do a
       | simple quadratic iterator in complex numbers, what are the
       | comparable sets for quaternions and octonions??
        
         | bunabhucan wrote:
         | https://en.m.wikibooks.org/wiki/Pictures_of_Julia_and_Mandel...
         | 
         | There's a whole world of this as well as iterating different
         | functions.
        
       | hermitcrab wrote:
       | I don't think I understand what 'locally connected' means. You
       | can easily choose a rectanglular area that contains 2 areas of
       | the set that are not joined.
        
         | nonsensikal wrote:
         | You don't get to choose a rectangle, you choose a point.
        
           | hermitcrab wrote:
           | The doesn't seem to fit with the comb analogy.
           | 
           | I still don't understand.
        
             | returningfory2 wrote:
             | I think this part of the article is incorrect.
        
               | matt-noonan wrote:
               | It's almost correct, but misses the point in an annoying
               | way that kind of ruins the example. What does work is
               | something like the subset of the plane given by { (x, y)
               | | x real, y rational } U { (0, y) | y real }. This is
               | connected, because you can walk from any point (x,y) to
               | any other point (x',y') by traveling horizontally to the
               | Y axis at (0,y), vertically to (0,y'), then horizontally
               | to (x',y'). But it isn't _locally_ connected away from
               | the Y axis because for a tiny enough open set S around a
               | point (x,y), there are other points in S that you can 't
               | get to from (x,y) without leaving S.
        
             | nhatcher wrote:
             | Non locally connected spaces are a bit pathological. Means
             | that given a point there is always a neighborhood of the
             | point (might be very small) that is connected. An example
             | of a connected but not locally connected is:
             | https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Topologist%27s_sine_curve
             | From (0, O) any neighborhood, no matter how small contains
             | points that belong to the curve but cannot reach (0, 0) and
             | stay in the neighborhood.
        
         | G3rn0ti wrote:
         | It means you can choose two points inside the Mandelbrot set
         | and always find a curve that connects the two without you ever
         | needing to lift the pencil.
        
           | hermitcrab wrote:
           | Isn't that "connected" rather than "locally connected"?
        
             | crazygringo wrote:
             | I'm aware that "locally connected" has a very specific
             | meaning in math:
             | 
             | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Locally_connected_space
             | 
             | Unfortunately I don't have the slightest idea what it
             | actually means... that article does not have any ELI5
             | sentence within it.
        
               | hermitcrab wrote:
               | >Unfortunately I don't have the slightest idea what it
               | actually means
               | 
               | Not just me then? ;0)
        
         | neilkk wrote:
         | Suppose you choose such a rectangle, let's say it incorporates
         | the 'fringe' of the main cardioid and the fringe of the biggest
         | circle. Within that rectangle, color green all the pieces which
         | connect to the main cardioid and blue all the pieces which
         | connect to the circle. Local connectedness means that there
         | won't be any points in that rectangle which have both blue and
         | green points arbitrarily close. So there are places where
         | 'locally non-connected parts' of the set can be close together,
         | but there must be a border between them, rather than them being
         | hopelessly entangled.
         | 
         | Strictly speaking, you would do this coloring with all
         | connected components of the intersection of your rectangle and
         | M. (And the rectangle could be any region.)
         | 
         | The example messes this up, although it is a correct example,
         | the square on the diagram showing the local piece containing
         | non-connected parts is wrong. The comb has more and more teeth,
         | infinitely many in a bounded space, on the left side. Only a
         | rectangle which includes the left edge properly shows why the
         | set isn't locally connected. The rectangle pictured includes
         | finitely many teeth which have a separation between them. A
         | rectangle overlapping the left edge of the comb would include
         | separate components which get arbitrarily close to that left
         | edge and so can't be separated by a border.
        
           | hermitcrab wrote:
           | Thanks for taking the time to explain that. So, in terms I
           | find easier to understand, MLC would mean that if I:
           | 
           | -take any rectanglular section of the complex plain that
           | includes part or all of the Mandelbrot set
           | 
           | -draw the Mandelbrot set in black
           | 
           | -pick an arbitary black point and colour it red
           | 
           | -recursively colour every black point touching a red point
           | (flood fill)
           | 
           | Then every black point would be recoloured red. And this
           | would work with a pixel based image of the mandelbrot if the
           | image had a high enough resolution. Is that right?
        
             | neilkk wrote:
             | No, that's not right.
             | 
             | Do those first four steps. You wouldn't (necessarily) cover
             | every black point in your rectangle. Choose a remaining
             | black point and flood fill from that, say green. Keep on
             | doing this with different colours until you've covered
             | every black point in your rectangle. You have a bunch of
             | regions of different colours.
             | 
             | Now, if the different coloured regions are all nicely
             | separate, then your set is locally connected. Because each
             | point is either cleanly in one component or cleanly in the
             | other.
             | 
             | If on the other hand your drawing looks like https://common
             | s.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Julia_set_for_the_... with
             | mixed up boundaries where some points are infinitesimally
             | close to more than one colour, then it's not locally
             | connected.
             | 
             | The difficulty with intuition is that in our intuition,
             | coloured regions always have reasonable boundaries (think
             | countries in a map: the border can be wiggly but there's
             | never infinitely many tiny bits of one country mixed up in
             | the boundary of two others). In fractal geometry, things
             | like the Newton fractal picture above are quite usual.
        
               | hermitcrab wrote:
               | I think I understand now. Much appreciated! 'Locally
               | connected' seems like quite poor terminology.
        
       | bilsbie wrote:
       | I've always wondered if you could make fractals into some sort of
       | game.
        
         | netmare wrote:
         | There's MMCE+, the spiritual successor of Marble Marcher. I've
         | only played the original some years ago and it was pretty
         | awesome. You simply have to move a ball across a 3D fractal
         | surface that's constantly evolving in real-time!
         | 
         | Sadly, I can't run MMCE to test, since I'm using a PC and gfx
         | card from 2009.
         | 
         | +: https://michaelmoroz.itch.io/mmce
        
       | peter_d_sherman wrote:
       | >"When computers revealed all those smaller copies of the
       | Mandelbrot set within itself, Douady and Hubbard wanted to
       | explain their presence. They ended up turning to what's known as
       | _renormalization theory_ , a technique that physicists use to
       | tame infinities in the study of quantum field theories, and to
       | connect different scales in the study of phase transitions."
       | 
       | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renormalization
       | 
       | Rampant conjecture/speculation: In the future, perhaps some
       | Mathematician might discover a link between _Renormalization
       | Theory_ -- and the _Digits Of Pi_... since they seem related...
       | 
       | More specifically, between Renormalization Theory -- and
       | algorithms for the Digits of Pi.
       | 
       | Of which, one notable one is The Chudnovsky algorithm:
       | 
       | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chudnovsky_algorithm
       | 
       | Which leads to Binary Splitting:
       | 
       | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Binary_splitting
       | 
       | Which leads to Hypergeometric Series:
       | 
       | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypergeometric_function#The_hy...
       | 
       | Which leads to Gauss' continued fraction:
       | 
       | https://wikimedia.org/api/rest_v1/media/math/render/svg/4d54...
       | 
       | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypergeometric_function#:~:tex...
       | 
       | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gauss%27s_continued_fraction
       | 
       | Which leads to Analytic continuation of 3F2, 4F3 and higher
       | functions:
       | 
       | https://fredrikj.net/blog/2009/12/analytic-continuation-of-3...
       | 
       | Which leads to my brain hurting ("Put down that Math book and
       | step away from the Math!" <g>) -- because I can't handle all of
       | this Math for now! :-) <g> :-)
       | 
       | But there is this very cool picture there:
       | 
       | https://3.bp.blogspot.com/_rh0QblLk0C0/SzEG9q5FxaI/AAAAAAAAA...
        
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