[HN Gopher] Mesh shaders on RDNA graphics cards
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Mesh shaders on RDNA graphics cards
Author : ibobev
Score : 39 points
Date : 2024-01-17 10:01 UTC (13 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (gpuopen.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (gpuopen.com)
| sylware wrote:
| Could we get assembly or spir-v BHV shaders? Please? To avoid to
| pull that abomination of glsl compiler in mesa SDK? Thanks.
| Lichtso wrote:
| > we find that the technology has not been widely adopted in
| rendering engines so far
|
| That is funny considering that Vulkan has added support for mesh
| shading roughly a year ago [1]. And, if you take a look at the
| members list of the Khronos group, you will find that AMD is
| listed in the top category [2] (what ever Ikea is doing there).
|
| [1]: https://www.khronos.org/blog/mesh-shading-for-vulkan [2]:
| https://www.khronos.org/members/list
| SiempreViernes wrote:
| IKEA wants to render a lot of its product illustrations instead
| of having huge photo studios, that's probably why they are
| active in computer graphics.
| badgersnake wrote:
| Yep, they want to use VR and AR to sell furniture. I've heard
| far worse metaverse ideas than that.
| dylan604 wrote:
| Someone saw the scene from Fight Club and thought it was a
| good idea:
|
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCo-ZlznCa4
| Arrath wrote:
| Helpful to layout my living room without busting out the
| measuring tape and making a scaled model complete with
| furniture footprints to move around.
| seiferteric wrote:
| It's cheaper to create a 3D model of every product than to
| just take a picture of it?
| flumpcakes wrote:
| The 3D model probably already exists because it was
| designed in CAD.
|
| They probably have custom renderers for rendering the
| flat/cartoon illustrations for the assembly instructions,
| and PBR renders for rendering realistic views.
|
| Grab a bunch of of these resources and put them in a box
| and you have living room design without having to
| manufacture, assemble, light, and shoot it in the real
| world.
| V-eHGsd_ wrote:
| honestly they probably have the 3d model made already as
| part of the design process.
|
| eta: ope, I see someone beat me to the same comment.
| follower wrote:
| To expand on the sibling answer(s) to your question, there
| was a talk at the most recent Blender conference related to
| the topic of product visualisation which I found an
| enjoyable watch:
|
| * "Multiverse of madness - how we render millions of
| doors": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXEVncxtmxg
|
| Product visualisation seems to be a bit of a recurring
| theme for Blender talks over at least the past couple of
| years.
| wlesieutre wrote:
| They no doubt have 3D models already, just have to refine
| it with better materials for rendering.
|
| It's much easier to digitally assemble those models into a
| virtual kitchen scene than to build an actual kitchen.
| Especially things like a sink where you'd need to cut a
| custom countertop to mount it.
| kapperchino wrote:
| Alan wake 2 pretty much requires it too
| pjmlp wrote:
| So far they have only been having good support on the engines
| targeting DirectX 12 Ultimate, as usual Khronos APIs keep
| getting later to the party.
|
| IKEA most likely cares about WebGL and WebGPU, which in any
| case is irrelvant for Mesh Shaders as they are decades away to
| arrive in the browsers if past performance is any indication of
| Web 3D adopting native 3D features.
| hajile wrote:
| The big issue with adding features was mostly security (as I
| understand it). Then they realized that they were never going
| to achieve good performance with WebGL and Apple proposed
| porting Metal to the web as webGPU.
|
| There doesn't seem to be anything inherently insecure about
| mesh shaders and they now have working examples in both
| Vulkan and Metal, so I'd expect them to show up sooner rather
| than later.
| pjmlp wrote:
| From the same group of folks that refused to add compute
| shaders from OpenGL ES, throwing Intel's work into the
| garbage, forcing a complete application rewrite to use them
| on the Web.
| RetpolineDrama wrote:
| Vulkan only getting a mesh shader API a year ago when Nvidia
| shipped hardware in 2018 is a joke.
|
| I want Vulkan to be great, but it's painfully obvious it's
| behind.
| samus wrote:
| Khronos is inherently unable to be ahead since it is a
| consortium of vendors with stakes in computer graphics.
| Khronos APIs are standardizations and/or abstractions on top
| of the platform-specific APIs, and new APIs and features
| usually start out as vendor extensions. They get standardized
| only when they get stabilized and adopted by other vendors.
|
| This is exactly what happened with mesh shaders - nVidia
| shipped the first hardware, but the extensions could
| rightfully not be uplifted to a standard API before other
| vendors also delivered implementations, as that could
| inconvenience their efforts.
| ladyanita22 wrote:
| Vendor-specific extensions exist.
| pjmlp wrote:
| Don't hold your breath regarding Direct Storage like
| capabilities, or work graphs.
|
| It has been the same following DirectX lead, from GPU vendors
| collaboration with Microsoft, and extensions spaghetti as
| OpenGL.
|
| Additionally it seems GLSL is stagnant, and from 2023's panel
| the suggestion was to adopt HLSL instead as there is no
| budget for language research.
| ladyanita22 wrote:
| Proton already supports DirectStorage.
| pjmlp wrote:
| Of course it does, have to keep that Windows emulation
| going for Windows games on GNU/Linux.
| ladyanita22 wrote:
| That's not relevant. It runs VK as a backend. If it runs
| in Proton, it's because either Linux or Vulkan let's you
| do it natively.
| wlesieutre wrote:
| Nearly 10 years ago Ikea was rendering 75% of their product
| images, I'm sure it's even higher by now
|
| http://web.archive.org/web/20140627040243/http://www.cgsocie...
|
| Also, RIP CGSociety. Just went looking for that article and
| found they shut down earlier this month.
| Zetobal wrote:
| It's 100% for the cutouts and 80% for the "emotional" motifs.
| We still shoot but mainly for images with human interactions.
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