[HN Gopher] The Hofmann Wobble: Wikipedia and the problem of his...
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The Hofmann Wobble: Wikipedia and the problem of historical memory
Author : pepys
Score : 27 points
Date : 2023-12-21 21:02 UTC (2 days ago)
(HTM) web link (harpers.org)
(TXT) w3m dump (harpers.org)
| bawolff wrote:
| I find the writing style of pieces like this insufferable. Tell
| us the point you are trying to make!
|
| I read the whole thing (albeit i did skim parts), and i really
| don't know what point that the author is trying to make. That it
| is possible to use sock puppets on wikipedia to try to manipulate
| wikipedia? Yes, to a certain extent, but also not as much as
| people often imagine it is.
| trompe-le-monde wrote:
| It's a piece of short fiction written like a straightforward
| account of one fellow's history manipulating Wikipedia, which I
| suppose is easy to miss if you aren't familiar with the sort of
| stuff that Harper's tends to put out (which admittedly is
| sometimes insufferable). I think anybody looking for practical
| or technical insights in the piece will probably come up short,
| but I was impressed by its thematic depth w/r/t truth, personal
| integrity, etc.
| pvg wrote:
| Whatever the merits of the piece, the purpose of writing can be
| something beside the delivery of 'points'. It's perfectly fine
| if you don't like that but there's not much conversation to be
| had about the fact that you don't.
| bawolff wrote:
| Sure, but i don't think it really has anything interesting to
| say thematically either.
| anigbrowl wrote:
| The thing is the title is making an argument, but then the
| reader is subjected to a long meandering personal discourse.
| OK if you're on a long journey and want to be diverted,
| deeply annoying if you are sufficiently interested by the
| headline to want to engage with the argument. I used to
| admire this style of writing but as I've gotten older I have
| less patience with it; I'd rather just read a novel.
| mock-possum wrote:
| It's a very particular style of prose so I can see why you
| might have a strong negative reaction, but - honestly I have
| the opposite reaction.
|
| The narrator doesn't sound like a man whose morals I much
| respect - but the way the story is written is playful, all the
| little loops of foreshadowing and callback are fun; it reminds
| me a bit of Neal Stephenson, on the edge of trying too hard to
| be smart while also affecting mock humility - but winking at
| the audience the whole time. " _you're_ clever enough to be in
| on the joke," it reassures you.
|
| I think rather than seeing that style as an obstacle to the
| point being made, the style _is_ part of the point. It's a mode
| of storytelling to be enjoyed. (Or not, in your case.) The
| point is that the narrator is this wonderful character who is
| smarter than his surroundings and he gets up to mischief, the
| consequences of which echo farther than you might expect. Is
| one man truly responsible for shaping the way an entire
| generation thinks, by careful manipulation of Wikipedia? Could
| you well have done the same, if you were the right man, at the
| right time and place? Would you?
| bawolff wrote:
| Perhaps my issue is i find the premise unbelievable and lose
| suspension of disbelief, which makes me annoyed with the rest
| of the story.
|
| People try to manipulate wikipedia in this fashion every day.
| Many of those who do are much much more sophisticated than
| the protagonist in this story and the story doesn't take into
| account the checks & balances to prevent this sort of thing.
| Perhaps that's just the conceit for the story and we are
| supposed to accept it so that the rest of the story can take
| place. However stories about individuals getting ultimate
| power and then struggling with the moral implications of that
| are a dime a dozen. The only unique thing about this story is
| the premise, which i find obnoxiously simplified.
| pvg wrote:
| Careful, you keep adding this sort of detail and maybe take
| out some of the bombast ('insufferable', 'obnoxiously') and
| next thing you know, you'd end up with a perfectly
| reasonable personal critique of this thing!
| resolutebat wrote:
| The story is set in the early days of Wikipedia, when
| awareness of its power and restraints on manipulation were
| much weaker.
|
| As a wiki admin myself, what I found unbelievable is the
| length to which they supposedly went to maintain the
| subterfuge. Most sock puppets and PR flacks are glaringly
| obvious.
| starkparker wrote:
| Maybe you can run it through ChatGPT for a summary.
| RecycledEle wrote:
| Exactly!
|
| This article should be entered in an Obfuscated Programming
| contest.
|
| Why submit an article about a nasty break-up to HN?
| joemazerino wrote:
| Great writing.
| angelsbrood wrote:
| Banger
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(page generated 2023-12-23 23:02 UTC)