[HN Gopher] The New Essential Guide to Electronics in Shenzhen
___________________________________________________________________
The New Essential Guide to Electronics in Shenzhen
Author : kungfudoi
Score : 399 points
Date : 2023-12-16 17:25 UTC (1 days ago)
(HTM) web link (www.bunniestudios.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.bunniestudios.com)
| Animats wrote:
| It's good to know that Naomi Wu is still allowed to communicate
| with the outside world, a little.
| user_7832 wrote:
| Out of the loop, what happened with her?
| toomuchtodo wrote:
| Heavy hand of the CCP.
|
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37154414
|
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37154745
| user_7832 wrote:
| Thanks!
| toomuchtodo wrote:
| Happy to help!
| kmeisthax wrote:
| She tried to enforce the GPL on a Chinese company and the
| mainland Chinese government threatened her with... something.
| Speculation is rampant. Naomi had a Uighur wife, and mainland
| China is both homophobic _and_ currently doing ethnic
| cleansing of Uighurs in Xinjiang. In fact, her wife isn 't
| even allowed to leave the country, so it's entirely possible
| that they said "shut up or we jail her".
|
| The way that authoritarianism[0] works is that there are two
| sets of laws. The real laws are secret and ever changing.
| Sometimes they will change for just one person. The published
| laws are the excuses and punishments they will use against
| you for violating the real laws you were never told.
|
| [0] In any form of liberalism, the real laws will always be a
| subset of the published laws. The government is free to not
| enforce a law they think is obsolete, but they cannot invent
| a new law without telling anyone and make up a punishment for
| it.
| jancsika wrote:
| Is there any niche of vendors somewhat equivalent to free
| software zealots in Shenzhen? E.g., "you can boot this little
| keychain thingy without blobs."
| carom wrote:
| There are another few bunnie blogs [1] on that. The concept is
| called gongkai. It means open in the sense of IP is shared
| freely.
|
| 1. https://www.bunniestudios.com/blog/?p=4297
| jancsika wrote:
| Hm, if that's the case then why don't Western open source
| hardware projects just send a bilingual tourist over to
| Shenzhen to muck around until they connect with someone who
| can give them the docs needed to bootstrap the relevant
| firmware/drivers for the boards?
| aleph_minus_one wrote:
| My guess: legal concerns. What is legal (or at least
| tolerated) in China with respect to gongkai is not
| necessarily legal in the Western world.
| jancsika wrote:
| I'm just surprised there seems to be no bridge whatsoever
| between the two.
|
| Like the developer asks, "what's the address to set this
| bit?" and the tourist responds with whatever it is.
| DeathArrow wrote:
| Because that costs money.
| numpad0 wrote:
| Why wouldn't they be able to ask in IRC/Discord/whatever
| still works in Hong Kong? Or, just have a Taiwanese hacker
| guy in the group?
| contrarian1234 wrote:
| Do you know what he's up to?
|
| I remember he was working on some super encrypted FPGA phone
| ages ago.. and then I haven't hear his name in .. years?
| 0xCMP wrote:
| He is still working on it, the precursor, they're just
| starting development of the messaging app that will run on
| that dev platform and eventually run on the betrusted final
| device.
| jacquesm wrote:
| That is still one of the most interesting reverse engineering
| blog posts ever. In the 80's I was pretty good at this stuff,
| especially figuring out various over-the-wire protocols to
| get hardware to do stuff that it wasn't intended to do. But
| this is on an entirely different level.
| kmeisthax wrote:
| Gongkai sounds like what happens in piracy scenes, or perhaps
| more specifically the game modding and ROM hacking scene.
| People innovating and modifying without giving a crap about
| who-owns-what.
| wannacboatmovie wrote:
| There's plenty of free software thieves (the GPL violating
| kind) in Shenzhen. Sadly, there isn't a goddamn thing we can do
| about it.
|
| Go ahead, try enforcing the GPL in China. They'll just laugh in
| your face whilst trying to sell you the next shoddy widget on
| AliExpressazon.
| isnifailed wrote:
| So, exactly like in the West?
| cscurmudgeon wrote:
| False equivalence
|
| https://opensource.stackexchange.com/questions/11452/have-
| th...
|
| How many of those are in mainland China?m
|
| Even the neighboring country of Taiwan is careful about GPL
|
| https://www.leetsai.com/ltp-special-column/legal-issues-
| that...
| userbinator wrote:
| Incidentally, don't call Taiwan a "neighboring country"
| when in mainland China.
| cscurmudgeon wrote:
| It is a neighbor and a separate country though.
| neilv wrote:
| I get the impression that Western companies (and Chinese
| companies with non-disposable brands marketed in the West)
| _can_ have GPL enforced against them.
|
| For example: https://sfconservancy.org/activities/
|
| I know one of the other dynamics is when the GPL copyright
| holder is more of a crunchy-granola hippie guru, who might
| just want to lovingly bring the lost soul into the fold,
| because they know not what they do.
|
| That's really not a deterrent to the people who know
| exactly what they're doing.
|
| Personally, I'd like to see copyright holders be less
| flower-child toward abusers, and more like a Scout who was
| helping an elderly person across the street, when they were
| attacked by a group of violent racists. It's not time to
| turn the other cheek, but to grab a heavy stick.
| isnifailed wrote:
| Yeah, no, they can't. Plenty of western examples, such as
| Mikrotik.
| Animats wrote:
| > Go ahead, try enforcing the GPL in China.
|
| Naomi Wu has actually done that.[1]
|
| [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vj04MKykmnQ
| wannacboatmovie wrote:
| The same Naomi Wu that recently was visited by CCP goons
| who told her to mind her p's and q's? Yeah I don't see this
| happening again.
| faitswulff wrote:
| How is that relevant to enforcing GPL?
| obmelvin wrote:
| See this peer comment -
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=38669000
| chpatrick wrote:
| As far as I know it was because of "reactionary" tweets,
| not GPL enforcement.
| NicoJuicy wrote:
| No, it was after she went to a business that violated
| gpl.
|
| She put it on YouTube and then she got silenced.
| lvturner wrote:
| Assuming this linked video is accurate, your statement is
| not quite correct.
|
| https://youtu.be/3p7bl7eFaEo?si=kAXZHfA2lxbXlLv-
| NicoJuicy wrote:
| It got the attention of the government.
|
| And she doesn't advocate gpl anymore too.
|
| The one doesn't exclude the other.
| obscurette wrote:
| That's not how autocratic systems work. In any autocratic
| system you allowed to be somewhat independent. How
| independent? It depends on you position in hierarchy. But
| if you cross the line, you will get punished for all your
| independent actions and even thoughts. There is no
| "because of this and that". The only thing that matters
| is that you crossed the invisible line.
| NicoJuicy wrote:
| ReallySexyCyborg?
|
| Yeah, she tried that and then guess what happened...
|
| > Ok for those of you that haven't figured it out I got my
| wings clipped and they weren't gentle about it- so there's
| not going to be much posting on social media anymore and
| only on very specific subjects. I can leave but Kaidi can't
| so we're just going to follow the new rules and that's
| that. Nothing personal if I don't like and reply like I
| used to. I'll be focusing on the store and the occasional
| video. Thanks for understanding, it was fun while it
| lasted.
|
| https://twitter.com/RealSexyCyborg/status/16774808094508359
| 6...
|
| She stopped uploading YouTube videos 6 months ago after 7
| years.
|
| More here: https://www.hackingbutlegal.com/p/naomi-wu-and-
| the-silence-t...
| JimDabell wrote:
| That wasn't anything to do with attempting to enforce the
| GPL though.
| NicoJuicy wrote:
| It was all around the same time. A security vulnerability
| and gpl enforcement are the things she stopped since
| then.
|
| Except trying to start her business, which she still
| does.
| kahnclusions wrote:
| Wow, the police sent plainclothes thugs to her home to
| harass her, and her partner who is an Uygher is banned
| from leaving the country.
| DeathArrow wrote:
| I think many Chinese companies freely share code between
| them, regardless if it's open source or not. They just don't
| care about licenses and IP the way the West does.
|
| So, if you want to get the source code for X, you just have
| to learn Cantonese, go there and ask nicely.
| SeanLuke wrote:
| As a former good Cantonese speaker, now terrible, let me
| assure you that there is no way to ask anything nicely in
| Cantonese. It's a rough-and-tumble, loud, crude, obnoxious
| gutter language. It's awesome. So much better than
| Mandarin. There's a reason why Cantonese is always the go-
| to language for "misc bizarre foreign language spoken by
| asians in the background" in movies, well that and the very
| high number of first-rate actors available from Hong Kong's
| movie industry. It's my favorite language in the world.
| jonatron wrote:
| There's not a lot of info about the Shenzhen SEZ Visa on arrival,
| but I can say that if you use the Luohu/Lo Wu port, aim to get
| there as they open because they don't get through many before
| they stop for lunch.
| juujian wrote:
| I got over half a dozen of those. Never remember there being
| much traffic anyways at the office where they issue those. Time
| period is ~2016--2019.
| jonatron wrote:
| My single data point is October 2023. I don't know if they're
| slower than they used to be.
| woutr_be wrote:
| I've gotten that visa countless times at the Lok Ma Chau border
| crossing, never had to wait more than 15-30 minutes really.
|
| There's now also 15-day visa free travel if you're one of 6
| countries: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-67516777
| dewey wrote:
| If you are coming from HK then Shekou port on arrival visa is
| also fast and painless (If you don't show up in the lunch break
| like I did).
| ofrzeta wrote:
| I have a hard time imagining how you can get into business with
| people in Huaqiangbei without speaking Mandarin even with that
| guide in hand but without an interpreter. But maybe it can work
| out with pointing and writing down arabic numbers?
| terminous wrote:
| Real time voice translation is getting really good. Standard
| text translation is pretty much perfect for technical details,
| but just may miss idioms. You just have your smartphones out,
| type your message, and show the translation to the other
| person. They read it and start typing on their phone, then show
| it to you. I got through China pretty painlessly this way, and
| it is so normal for many, especially the young. I went to one
| restaurant where they got the younger waiter when they saw me
| walk in, who I thought would speak English. She just knew the
| phone text translation ritual, but was an expert in that.
|
| But for millennia, people have gone to far away lands where
| they don't speak the language, and somehow managed to build
| trade routes without even having a dictionary or calculator. It
| is not that hard to work out a pidgin. Tons of things you can
| do with pointing and gesturing. Marco Polo would have killed to
| even have Google Translate circa 2010.
|
| I'll also assert with no evidence that it is generally harder
| for an English speaking engineer to successfully communicate a
| technical idea into business speak for English speaking VC
| investors than it is for an English speaking engineer to
| communicate a request to buy a specific part to a Mandarin
| speaking engineer.
| ClumsyPilot wrote:
| > I'll also assert with no evidence that it is generally
| harder for an English speaking engineer to successfully
| communicate a technical idea into business speak for English
| speaking VC investors than it is for an English speaking
| engineer to communicate a request to buy a specific part to a
| Mandarin speaking engineer
|
| sounds like a fun challange, probably true
| Saigonautica wrote:
| I've never done this in China, but I've done it in Vietnam
| (before I learned more of the language) and in Japan.
|
| It is surprising how much you can communicate by drawing
| circuit diagrams, sketches of oscilloscope traces, and
| equations! It works quite well!
|
| However one problem I encountered was that many (maybe
| most) vendors were not engineers and had no understanding
| of the parts sold. They just knew the name of the parts
| they had in stock, and how much they could sell them for,
| and that's it. Often they weren't even being paid -- it's a
| family business and they were just the niece or nephew that
| got roped in to vaguely watching the store while playing
| games on their phone.
|
| This was much more of an issue in Vietnam (Nhat Tao market)
| than in Tokyo (Tokyo Radio tower). In the latter there
| appeared to be quite a few retired engineers who were quite
| enthusiastic to meet someone who was looking for something
| specific. It was pretty neat, and I occasionally
| encountered someone with a wealth of knowledge!
| DeathArrow wrote:
| My baby son doesn't talk yet, aside of 5 words, but he still
| manages to transmit me what he wants by using his hands,
| muttering and mumbling on different tones. If I still don't
| get it, he grabs me by the hand and go show me what he wants
| by pointing his finger.
|
| I somewhat did the same when traveling to foreign countries
| and meeting people that don't speak any of the languages I
| speak.
| jonatron wrote:
| They usually have a calculator to show you prices. Translation
| apps that aren't Google work to some extent. Some speak enough
| English to haggle, so numbers mostly, and it's not hard to
| learn Chinese numbers.
| smackeyacky wrote:
| It's not quite as bad as that. I speak no Mandarin but managed
| to purchase parts in the markets just by gesticulating and
| having part numbers (where appropriate).
|
| A surprising number of the vendors had at least a little
| english - enough for commerce anyway.
| DeathArrow wrote:
| >I have a hard time imagining how you can get into business
| with people in Huaqiangbei without speaking Mandarin
|
| By speaking the same language as they do, which is Cantonese?
| ofrzeta wrote:
| You know, I got that idea from the Crowdsupply page that says
| "... sourcing tool for non-Mandarin speakers".
| lvturner wrote:
| It's MOSTLY Mandarin you will hear spoken in Shenzhen, while
| it is true that Guangdong province is generally Cantonese
| speaking - Shenzhen is a city mostly made up of migrants from
| all over China so Mandarin is the lingua franca.
|
| Somewhat related, as a result of this, Shenzhen is a great
| place to try out many different regional Chinese foods.
| Taniwha wrote:
| Most people are in Shenzhen are from other parts of China,
| you'll hear Mandarin (the default) Cantonese, Hakka, Hokkien
| etc - most people probably speak some dialect of Mandarin as
| well as their birth language
| Taniwha wrote:
| Buy and read the book - you can point at stuff in it, it's
| designed with that in mind - take a hand calculator so you can
| type numbers/prices - point at things, smile a lot
|
| Do learn a little Mandarin, start with Nihao = hello, Xiexie
| (shay shay) == thank you - na = that, zhe = this - bu = no, dui
| = correct - also yuan/kuai the currency (kuai is used
| interchangeably, a bit like "bucks").
|
| It's all pretty easy, everyone wants to do a deal, they want
| you to come back as a repeat customer
| jacquesm wrote:
| This comment could well serve as a template for a guide to
| use by anybody in a country where they don't speak the
| language.
|
| I'd add: be nice.
| asfarley wrote:
| Google translate, except for connector gender
| zeroCalories wrote:
| I don't plan on ever doing business in China, much less
| purchasing electronics, but the book looks very interesting from
| the index. Might buy a copy.
| toomuchtodo wrote:
| I bought the first one to send a copy to the Internet Archive
| for long term physical archival. Going to do the same with this
| release.
| narag wrote:
| I love the cover. Nice mix.
| lifeisstillgood wrote:
| >>> Since ... 2016, the population of Shenzhen has grown by over
| 2 million people, the metro system has added over one hundred
| kilometers of track, and dozens of new stations have been opened.
| The city's taxi and bus fleets were converted from gas to
| electric. The entirety of Huaqiangbei Road - the center of the
| electronic market district - has been torn up and replaced with a
| pedestrian boulevard.
|
| Holy crap. As a Brit we have recently spent 100 billion and twice
| that time to fail to build a railway between two cities, London
| still runs almost all petrol bus and taxis and ...
|
| As we have (hopefully) an election coming soon and might see some
| change I would be interested in _why_ the UK - who about 150
| years ago woukd have growth stats very similar to that - has got
| well, meh.
|
| The usual suspects for such terrible performance are
|
| - much lower starting point. It's easier to setup mobile phone
| masts than replace the POTS.
|
| - too much regulation (from safety to public consultations that
| allow NIMBYism to slow things down)
|
| - we are not growing - if the number of people buying mobile
| phones in year X is twice the number of people who already have a
| phone, then you can see a different market than if everyone keeps
| their phone for one extra year. Does something else play out for
| cities, streets and factories?
|
| - just money coming in. The UK is having serious lack of growth
| and presumably shenzen is not.
|
| Or is it, that "ooomph" ? a level of belief that tomorrow will be
| better?
| wannacboatmovie wrote:
| The West has safety regulations that are followed.
|
| If a building collapses or a train crashes in China, they just
| brick over it and build a new one.
| djmips wrote:
| Move fast and break things.
| toyg wrote:
| Yes. Also, rules and regulations on expropriation of land,
| relocation of people etc, with plenty of long appeal
| processes.
|
| China? "Go away or else".
| southerntofu wrote:
| I don't know where you live, but in France and surrounding
| countries expropriations are certainly "go away or else".
| It's very common for the cops to evict people for
| industrial projects that have been found illegal by
| tribunals, and it's not unheard of that the mafia itself
| beats up small owners until they "give up" their land. It's
| also common for people to get maimed protesting industrial
| projects (lose an eye, hand, foot due to military
| grenades), and not unheard of for them to die killed by the
| State (Vital Michalon, Remi Fraisse, etc).
|
| In France, most appeals processes you can have when your
| eviction has been decided can in fact not delay the
| eviction. You can be evicted before having your appeals
| hearing. The Grand Paris has already expropriated so many
| small owners (from popular districts) for the olympic games
| madness, and it's so common for farmers to be expropriated
| away from their lands to build crazy useless projects, such
| as the NDDL airport where residents had to defend
| themselves with molotov cocktails against more than 500
| riot cops trying to destroy their homes back in 2012.
|
| So, maybe it's better where you live but please don't
| pretend the West is a marvelous land of human rights. I'm
| of course not saying China is a dream-like State of human
| bliss and safety ; they're a tyrannical regime crushing
| their population. I'm just saying if you scratch the
| surface, it's not _wildly different_ here (although
| comparatively better in some regards).
| Dah00n wrote:
| That is not at all how the system in China works..
| kmeisthax wrote:
| While mainland China's land ownership is more like a series
| of 99-year leases, those leases are notoriously difficult
| to break. There are loads of examples of buildings in China
| being built around a few land holdouts. In fact, it's so
| common that real estate developers in China call them "nail
| houses[0]".
|
| [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holdout_(real_estate)#Nai
| l_hou...
| southerntofu wrote:
| As a westerner myself, i think you have a misguided view of
| the West that's biased by a higher socio-economic status.
|
| Safety regulations are often _not_ followed in the West. See
| for example "Greenfell tower", "rue d'Aubagne Marseille" or
| "East palestine train derailment".
| Dah00n wrote:
| That's so biased, it reads like xenophobia. Have you seen the
| state of trains, railways, bridges, etc. in the US? China is
| a much safer place to travel on bridges, rail, etc.
| autocanopener wrote:
| As always, engineers on hacker news have like 2-3 year delay of
| news out of China. The rest of the world has already moved onto
| other countries.
|
| 1.) "just money coming in"
|
| Outflows of foreign direct investment in China have exceeded
| inflows for the first time as tensions with the U.S. over
| semiconductor technology and concerns about increased anti-
| spying activity heighten risks. FDI came to minus $11.8 billion
|
| https://asia.nikkei.com/Economy/Foreign-investment-in-China-...
|
| Moody's Cuts China Credit Outlook to Negative on Growing Debt
| Risks
|
| https://www.wsj.com/finance/moodys-cuts-chinas-credit-outloo...
|
| 2.) "the metro system has added over one hundred kilometers of
| track"
|
| China's Cities Are Buried in Debt, but They Keep Shoveling It
| On
|
| China has long pursued growth by public spending, even after
| the payoff has faded. Cities stuck with the bill are still
| spending -- and cutting essential services.
|
| https://www.nytimes.com/2023/03/28/business/china-local-fina...
|
| China orders local governments to cut exposure to public-
| private projects as debt risks rise
|
| https://www.reuters.com/markets/asia/china-orders-local-gove...
|
| 3.) "we are not growing"
|
| Shenzhen reports decrease in population
|
| The southern boomtown of Shenzhen reported a slight population
| decrease for 2022 -- a first since the city's founding in 1979.
|
| https://www.chinadaily.com.cn/a/202305/10/WS645b514ba310b605...
| ClumsyPilot wrote:
| > China's Cities Are Buried in Debt, but They Keep Shoveling
| It On
|
| Finance is fictional, trains are real. In the anglospheric
| West, when a spreadsheet and real world disagrees,
| Beancounters will believe their spreadsheet.
| hnthrowaway0315 wrote:
| There are a lot of contributing factors:
|
| 1. Shenzhen is sort of a tech center of Southern China so it
| requires good and new infras
|
| 2. Local governments are economically and politically
| encouraged to build infra (Google Tu Di Jing Ji ) in general
|
| 3. Infra is built faster and cheaper in China so Shenzhen is
| not an outlier. Usually it starts with some planning to build a
| line in a remote area (to save buyout costs) -> line gets built
| -> other infrastructures including super markets, post offices,
| whatever get built -> apartment buildings get built ->
| government gets paid back by taxes collected from real estate
| companies, super markets and other expanded economy entities
|
| 4. Some cities actually lost the bets on building new infras
| and this created a whole range of issues (Google Di Fang Zhai
| and Di Fang Rong Zi Ping Tai Gong Si Zhai )
| nirui wrote:
| A well-know thing is, rebuilding things was a fairly common
| (and for some, important) method for the local gov to raise
| funds.
|
| One instance in our city almost 10 years back, they built a
| perfectly acceptable 4-lane city road, and then completely
| rebuilt it again just few years later.
|
| Of course that method is no longer be used as wild as it did
| under chairman Xi and his uh... successful economic policy
| which greatly reduced the need of roads. But things are bit
| different back in 2016.
| nox100 wrote:
| SF spent $1.6 billion and 10 years to make 2.7k line that no
| one rides
|
| https://sfist.com/2023/03/16/central-subway-ridership-alread...
|
| I love public transportation when it's good (Tokyo, Singapore,
| HK, Seoul, Paris, London, Berlin, Amsterdam, ...) but I have
| zero expectations for public transportation to get to "good"
| levels in any city in the USA except the 3 where it's already
| just so-so (NYC, Chicago, DC)
|
| As long as it's seen as "the thing poor people who can't afford
| a car use" it will always be funded and run as such. ... and
| feel like it. I never feel safe on SF nor NYCs public transit.
| vmurthy wrote:
| As a Sydneysider, I feel offended that you left us out ;-).
| Or included in the "..."
| bluGill wrote:
| Ny, chicago are not doing a good job of improving. I look
| less known cities to leapfrog them in 20 years.
| tim333 wrote:
| London's black cabs are now 50% electric and rising
| https://electrek.co/2023/12/07/half-of-londons-iconic-black-...
| jacquesm wrote:
| https://www.wired.co.uk/article/levc-geely-london-
| electric-b...
| Taniwha wrote:
| For a while Shenzen had both - but charged a 2 kuai tax if
| you got in a petrol cab (the electric ones were blue) - now
| they're all electric
| Taniwha wrote:
| This animation gives you a great idea of how fast it has grown
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Shenzhen_Metro_evolution....
|
| It's a modern subway (puts NY to shame) - I've been going since
| ~ 2010, almost every year a new line or two has opened up.
|
| From the beginning you get on the subway in Hong Kong, take a
| train to the end of the line, exit the subway, go thru customs,
| walk over a bridge, thru CN customs, and down into the green
| line subway station in Shenzhen. Now days there's also a high
| speed train from Hong Kong/Kowloon
| mlrtime wrote:
| Do they still have the arcades (markets) right at the train
| stop selling all kinds of fake goods? I used to go there and
| buy all kinds of knock-offs but they were not the best
| quality.
|
| Also, all my friends in HK said don't stray to far from that
| mall as it gets dangerous at night (This was around 2002) and
| I know "dangerous" is relative.
| kqr2 wrote:
| There used to be some hacker tours of Shenzhen via Dangerous
| Prototypes and Noise Bridge. Any other recent or current ones?
| TheLegace wrote:
| I own this book. It was invaluable navigating Shenzhen
| electronics markets. In Shenzhen it is easy to find any
| electronic part you need and has an extensive recycling
| ecosystem. You can find parts on the street which find it's way
| upstream and end up in completed phones. Those phones are then
| resold.
|
| That was my goal when I was there to build an iPhone in my hotel
| room by buying every individual part. And except for the
| thumbprint(because it needs to be reflashed) everything worked
| perfectly. I even named it my non-Sweatshop iPhone.
| conception wrote:
| That sounds like an amazing vlog/blog article. Any chance you
| made one?
| starkparker wrote:
| Not OP, but: https://www.strangeparts.com/how-i-made-my-own-
| iphone-in-chi...
|
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14100989
|
| EDIT: Noticed that's Naomi Wu with the top comment on that HN
| discussion.
| mensetmanusman wrote:
| How much cheaper was it?
| smashed wrote:
| It doesn't have to be about saving money.
| cortesoft wrote:
| > I even named it my non-Sweatshop iPhone
|
| Are the conditions at the parts factories any better than at
| the final assembly factory?
| KeplerBoy wrote:
| Probably. I guess the final assembly requires the highest
| amount of cheap relatively unskilled labor.
|
| Actual chip foundries are no sweat shops.
| ametrau wrote:
| Ha. I was thinking about that exact video when I saw the title.
| jacquesm wrote:
| Note this not so veiled warning in the text:
|
| "The other reason there won't be an electronic edition is that
| unlike bunnie, I'm a Chinese national. My offering an app or
| download specifically for English-speaking hardware engineers to
| install on their phones would be... iffy. If at some point "I" do
| offer you such a thing, I'd suggest you not use it."
|
| Especially the "I" bit.
| zoom6628 wrote:
| Placed my order out of respect for Bunnie and Naomi. Legends for
| different reasons but for any real hardware hacker they are
| worthy of due respect for their work, their communicating of it,
| and their sharing.
| short_throw wrote:
| Bunnie's "Hacking the Xbox" is still one of my favorite books
| ever. First read it as a teenager, it was my intro to
| bootloaders, encryption, copyright law, and so much more.
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