[HN Gopher] Flatpack field hospitals that can be airdropped to d...
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Flatpack field hospitals that can be airdropped to disaster zones
Author : tosh
Score : 171 points
Date : 2023-12-08 12:42 UTC (1 days ago)
(HTM) web link (www.theguardian.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.theguardian.com)
| syndicatedjelly wrote:
| This is what innovation in healthcare and med tech looks like.
| Versatile, affordable inventions that serve those in desperate
| need. Western med tech could learn a thing or two here.
| gumballindie wrote:
| Why would we downgrade to a tent?
| zakary wrote:
| Because in many places, especially disaster zones, a tent is
| a massive upgrade from the bare patch of dirt they often
| currently have to make do with.
|
| This isn't to replace an inner city hospital, this is the
| make it fast and cheap to deploy the basic necessities of
| medical care.
| carlosjobim wrote:
| My impression is that when a disaster strikes a Western
| country, they have the capacity to airlift the people in
| need of medical attention to real hospitals in areas that
| weren't struck, instead of putting up tents and barracks in
| the disaster zone.
| gumballindie wrote:
| Exactly, plus western countries are usually smaller and
| services arrive quickly at the scene.
| user_7832 wrote:
| Minor nit, but countries like the US or Canada are huge
| and rescues can take a lot of time. However you don't
| need a portable hospital more than a rescue helicopter
| for a few injured/lost hikers.
| pests wrote:
| There's nothing to downgrade. Youre starting with nothing.
| This kick-starts the process then you can upgrade to current
| levels if needed.
| darth_avocado wrote:
| Because it's cheaper, not everyone has pentagon budgets to
| set up a modern hospital in a disaster zone.
|
| Plus even if you did have all the fancy equipment, it takes
| forever to set up relief centers. After Hurricane Maria in
| Puerto Rico or after fired in Maui, it took days to setup
| basic relief centers. Imagine if you have these cheap "tent"
| hospitals available at every small nearby town, you could
| setup relief in a matter of hours.
| gumballindie wrote:
| Correct - but op said the west could learn a thing or two,
| when in fact it's the other way around.
| syndicatedjelly wrote:
| The West could learn a thing or two about how to produce
| affordable medical technology. Did you read the original
| article?
| robert_foss wrote:
| That.. is a tent.
| reactordev wrote:
| Yes, it is. A mobile field hospital is usually built around the
| premise of a tent. Germany, USA, UK, Russia - all have tent-
| based forward deployable field hospitals.
|
| https://www.dvidshub.net/image/6787138/348th-field-hospital-...
| jessriedel wrote:
| OK but the American field hospitals often only need to
| stabilize people because the expectation is that anyone
| needing serious treatment will be airlifted to expensive
| military hospitals in Germany or the US. In contrast, the
| victims of humanitarian emergencies in poor/developing
| countries usually need to be fully treated on site because
| they aren't getting airlifted anywhere :(
| reactordev wrote:
| That is correct. The forward deployable field hospitals are
| really nurse stations to stabilize any active medical
| emergency for transport or otherwise stop the emergency
| (not necessarily treat it, they'll do what they can).
| creshal wrote:
| This is a side effect of recent US conflicts being low-
| intensity COIN operations involving brigade sized or
| smaller assets that spend most of their time in garrison.
|
| In a conventional conflict mobilizing entire divisions, as
| the US is now preparing for again, you will see far more
| capable field hospitals again, because the US won't have
| the necessary capacity (either in terms of airlift volume
| nor existing hospital beds) to afford this luxury.
| Beached wrote:
| significant difference between the quality and stability of
| the two tents. the one in the article looks like a stick will
| tear it asunder.
| ant6n wrote:
| That's a proper, large military tent, not some 3ppl Retail
| campground affair.
|
| Which is kinda weird, even in retail, u can get 3m x 8m tents
| (or so) that could be carried in a helicopter.
| burntbridge wrote:
| Pretty sure this is just a PR exercise for the very gullible.
| Anyone who has seen a real operating theater and had experience
| of being outside will know this is nonsense. That tent is
| simply not big enough for one thing.
| rdl wrote:
| When I was in Iraq/Afghanistan 2004-2010, one of my favorite
| things was working with the military hospitals (I sold satcom to
| a variety of clients, including medical use for radiology, and
| then worked on radiology PACS stuff).
|
| The Army Combat Support Hospital (think MASH tv-show...) guys
| could set something up like this really fast, but it was
| expensive hardware, required their own personnel, etc. This makes
| sense for the US military (massive logistics, budget, etc.), but
| not for others. Also worked (volunteer/charity) with some local
| clinics who didn't have these kind of resources, but did have
| great personnel, who could use more locally-acquired or bespoke
| solutions -- problem was it was slow, not uniform standard, etc.
|
| A cost-reduced, standardized, easily transportable hybrid is
| great. Ideally you'd use existing standardized readily available
| stuff with minimal medical/flown in stuff on top.
| omneity wrote:
| In terms of "airdroppability to disaster zones", hardly anything
| beats cardboard beds[0].
|
| It is true that the field hospital in TFA is a much comprehensive
| solution. I just wonder what an equivalent would be if designed
| with similar minimalistic principles to the cardboard bed.
|
| 0: https://www.fastcompany.com/90962654/this-simple-design-
| turn...
| etskinner wrote:
| I don't really get the point of this bed, how is it better than
| sleeping on the ground? The only reasons I can think of are
| insulation (which just a couple sheets of cardboard would do
| well, a 50% savings on material), and keeping away from pests
| like mice and cockroaches. Granted, those are decent reasons,
| but I wonder if spending the money elsewhere for disaster
| relief would be better. Am I missing something?
| azmodeus wrote:
| Could be good for hygiene for patients to not sleep on the
| floor though disinfecting a cardboard bed could be hard
| creshal wrote:
| Single-use / regularly replaced disposable beds might be
| more hygienic in practice than to hope the staff has enough
| time for thorough disinfection.
| SanjayMehta wrote:
| It can be hard to get up from the ground without assistance
| especially if you're injured or old.
|
| Also, an elevated position makes it easier for medical staff
| to check on patients.
| OJFord wrote:
| In addition to your reasons, and sibling's 'easier to get
| up', I'd add:
|
| - does actually look much more comfortable than the ground to
| me. The middle would give a bit into the cavity of the base,
| it's not just a sheet on the ground as I imagined reading
| your comment.
|
| - being raised makes it easier for medical personnel to
| attend to any injuries etc.
|
| - looks like a more clearly delimited arrangement, I imagine
| it would more easily become difficult to walk around people
| sleeping on the floor, as they'd sprawl out, lose the
| organised grid arrangement, etc.
|
| But I don't have any relevant experience to comment on how
| important any of that is, or if it's the best way to spend
| whatever cardboard beds cost in such a scenario.
| anigbrowl wrote:
| Have you ever slept on the ground? The air is a lot colder at
| ground level than even a foot or two above.
| lionkor wrote:
| Looks and sounds like it could use TeleSAN[1] as well!
|
| [1]: https://telesan.de/?lang=en
|
| disclaimer: i work at one of the companies that worked on this
| adhesive_wombat wrote:
| I've always thought it strange that countries like the UK with
| the NHS haven't standardised a modular hospital design where you
| can slot prefab modules into some framework. Need a CT suite on
| floor C? Labs on floor F? Need a new floor on top?
|
| And then (assuming the British government isn't feeling
| charitable, which is a good bet) you can export them at a profit
| or licence the design to other countries.
|
| Instead, every single hospital seems to be a money-pit full-
| custom design and changing one after the fact is almost entirely
| impossible without huge effort, which is why my latest medical
| appointment was done in an old laboratory, complete with lab
| benches round the walls with a high-school-style desk and two
| chairs awkwardly plonked in the middle.
|
| Obviously it's not a simple thing to design such a thing (not
| least the plumbing!), but the immense resources that go into full
| custom hospitals, the pain it causes when they become not what is
| needed, and the expense of modifying them really makes me think.
| bluedino wrote:
| The hospital construction industry is huge and wouldn't want
| that.
|
| And, a lot like college dorms, hospitals have become luxury.
| Basic hospitals would be a hard sell.
| adhesive_wombat wrote:
| > The hospital construction industry is huge and wouldn't
| want that.
|
| Sounds very much like a them problem (assuming a government
| since 1948 could show such intestinal fortitude).
|
| > hospitals have become luxury
|
| Only if you allow the private sector to completely capture
| the entire industry from top to bottom including government
| and regulatory function (in the same way the US automotive
| industry made light trucks basically illegal where they
| could).
|
| That process of top-to-bottom capture having not yet been
| fully completed in the UK, I don't think you'll find an NHS
| hospital, even a new one, especially luxurious. A BUPA one,
| probably yes (but they also don't have expensive money sinks
| like grubby un-insured and un-moneyed patients, A&E
| departments to run or junior staff to train).
|
| And there's no reason you can't have luxury modules as an
| upsell, or even third party compatible models. It's how
| aircraft are configured. You get an empty fuselage and you
| choose the modules. But the difference is you could fit the
| same modules to the medical versions of Airbuses and Boeings.
| phone8675309 wrote:
| Some of this is already occurring. The company I work for makes
| mobile imaging solutions (CT, MRI, PET) that fit in the size of
| a shipping container and are often transported by semi-truck.
| There are hospital designs that leave bays for these trucks to
| pull into with a door on the side to get patients in and out on
| detachable tables. So a small hospital system that only has the
| money for a single CT or MRI scanner can move it from site to
| site in rotation to see patients instead of siting it at a
| single hospital and having to send patients further from home.
|
| Doing that on a larger scale would be the next step.
| bluGill wrote:
| Everyone wants their city to have.unique hospitals. Plus it is
| rare to build a new hospital, what they do typically is remodel
| an existing one so there is less gain.
|
| Elementary schools could also use a standard modular design,
| but every town would prefer to spend just a little extra for a
| custom design. The cost of a custom design isn't much more
| anyway, as all the parts are standard off the shelf. What a
| standard really gives is they don't make the gym too small for
| a.regulation basketball court and other details that are easy
| forget when specifying a custom building.
| adhesive_wombat wrote:
| Admittedly not much gain up front, if anything it might be
| more expensive than a really efficient custom design (though
| I think most recent UK hospitals are not cheap, one near me
| cost something like PS200 million and has 500 beds and took
| quite a while to design and build, would be interesting to
| what went to the design consultants).
|
| You can still put a custom fascia on it. Most recent large
| buildings fundamentally work that way anyway. Concrete
| inside, panels or bricks outside.
|
| The real gain comes in 20 years when you need to change
| things (medical technology changes, demographics change,
| multi-hospital organisations-trusts in the UK, networks in
| the US-change), and you find that you need to gut the whole
| place to do anything at all. So you either do that at huge
| expense, or you make do and do your consultations in a
| disused lab area with a waiting room in a corridor (because
| labs don't have waiting rooms, but now the lab work is done
| elsewhere, so it's what you got).
|
| Of course when it's all about "profit this quarter" (US) and
| "being tough on spending" (UK), having a major problem in 20
| years is not your problem.
| jakogut wrote:
| Lots of things are this way. School busses and fire engines are
| mostly all custom built to order. Fire apparatus at least make
| some sense, as the needs of every district vary, but school
| busses? I would think a few common models would suffice.
| vlovich123 wrote:
| I don't know. Are CT or MRI machines ever found on anything but
| the ground floor because of the weight of them / installation
| complexity?
|
| I agree that you want standardized designs, but modular stuff
| gets tricky because it's physical infrastructure not code (eg
| things can fairly physically in unintended ways if the supports
| aren't designed for it and designing supports for arbitrary
| undefined loads to be added later is tricky).
|
| At least that's my uninformed take.
| repiret wrote:
| At my local hospital, the MRI and CT are on the upper of two
| floors. They are heavy machines, but buildings can be built
| to support heavy machines.
| dwd wrote:
| Especially as the British did it first over 150 years ago. One
| of Brunel's lesser known innovations and highly successful as
| well.
|
| https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renkioi_Hospital
| senthil_rajasek wrote:
| I love these IKEA hospitals and the quote at the end of the
| article assembled it all together,
|
| "The hospital is a small contribution by India to humanitarian
| work around the world," she said. "We are now ready to share it
| with any country that needs it."
|
| It reflects a new way of thinking and a fresh world view. A
| vastly different view from the one I grew up in (80s)... Which
| was huge headlines in NYT about how poor countries need aid and
| western aid organizations are helping them. When in reality it
| was "relief theater".
|
| Good luck.
| netaustin wrote:
| Totally. During the early months of the pandemic when NYC was
| hit super hard, Samaritan's Purse set up a tent hospital in
| Central Park directly opposite the main campus of Mt. Sinai
| which was a marvel to see, I would run and cycle past it nearly
| every day. Another of my common running routes took me past the
| USNS Comfort, docked at Pier 90, and the Javits Center, which
| hosted yet another modular hospital. Then a little later, a
| modular morgue on Randall's Island, which is now the site of a
| modular migrant encampment.
|
| I later read that because of strict policies relating to a
| notion that only the "simple" cases, of which there were few,
| could be transferred, the temporary hospital facilities ended
| up underutilized. But the ability to surge capacity in a
| specific area is hardly constrained to parts of the world with
| fewer hospital beds. Public health crises and natural disasters
| in the USA are perfect candidates for this technology.
|
| I hope we can test this quickly, and if it works, buy a bulk
| pack.
| sbrorson wrote:
| Inflatable buildings used for disaster relief. They can be
| trucked or air-lifted into place, then quickly inflated.
|
| https://federalfabrics.com/
| cushychicken wrote:
| Proudly made in Lowell, Massachusetts. <3
| sbrorson wrote:
| Yes, they still make textiles in Lowell!
| Finnucane wrote:
| "can be . . . assembled faster than an Ikea bookcase. . . . It
| takes five trained people one hour to assemble the cubes "
|
| Unsaid--five trained people need more than an hour to assemble an
| Ikea bookcase.
| kjkjadksj wrote:
| Must have gotten the Ikea assemblers from McKinsey
| malwarebytess wrote:
| I'm not seeing any innovation here as distinct from what is
| already done for inexpensive field hospitals, except that it's in
| a retail tent.
|
| > Sharma says the hospital is the first of its kind in India, but
| is reluctant to make any grander claim as she is not certain of
| similar developments in other countries.
|
| Oh.
| jeffrallen wrote:
| MSF uses inflatable hospitals: https://msf.org.au/innovation-
| inflatable-hospital
|
| More choices for more contexts is more good!
| AlphaWeaver wrote:
| > A tablet computer included in the cube pack is programmed to
| minimise assembly errors, and an alarm sounds if the wrong
| equipment is put in any given cube.
|
| This is incredibly smart! Guessing Ultra Wideband beacons in some
| of the equipment, so you know what cube it's in!
| westurner wrote:
| The red ResponsePod tents tare designed for temperature extremes,
| 100mph wind, and rain.
|
| They're not very disposable.
|
| _Cardboard_ tents are more sustainable than single-use tents.
|
| Med tents, sheets, and scrubs could be made of antimicrobial hemp
| fabric.
|
| Pop-up _Hub tents_ like ShiftPod, Gazelle, and the Coleman
| Instant are quick to set up and sturdier than replaceable and
| splintable tent poles.
|
| - [ ] ENH: Tent pole splint and/or spares
|
| Tunnel tents also have high ceilings.
|
| Round structures like [geodesic] domes fare better in wind than
| sharp corners due to wind shearing force.
|
| Geodesic dome hub kits work with local lumber or other.
|
| Heaxayurt: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hexayurt :
|
| > _A hexayurt is a simplified disaster relief shelter design.[2]
| It is based on a hexagonal geodesic geometry adapted to
| construction from standard 4x8 foot sheets of factory made
| construction material, built as a_ yurt. _[3] It was invented by
| Vinay Gupta. [4] Hexayurts are common at Burning Man. [5]_
|
| Is there a passive thermal roofline container modification for
| latrines and dispensaries? TODO link
|
| - [ ] Heat pumps for disaster relief shipping containers
|
| In searching for the shipping container by the ResponsePod folks,
| I just found an awning specifically for the area between multiple
| shipping containers in a corral configuration; prefabricated
| container shelter.
|
| I couldn't find the link. It's a standard sized shipping
| container emergency response disaster relief dispensary with HVAC
| but not yet heat pumps FWIU.
|
| - [ ] An open set of plans and modular interface specs for
| disaster relief shipping containers
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