[HN Gopher] How the first gen iPod was reverse engineered to run...
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How the first gen iPod was reverse engineered to run Rockbox
Author : Wowfunhappy
Score : 127 points
Date : 2023-12-07 14:23 UTC (8 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (mastodon.social)
(TXT) w3m dump (mastodon.social)
| uticus wrote:
| > Now the exploit was rewritten to read memory, and _blink_ out
| the contents using the LCD backlight. A LEGO construction was
| built and a webcam would register the binary stream of a few
| megabytes of memory contents. Slooooow.
|
| It both amazes me and cracks me up how exploits are accomplished.
| Given enough time and determination...
| HumblyTossed wrote:
| It's really cool how they did this and not to diminish it in
| any way, but this is really a form of bit banging that a lot of
| devs already understand how to do.
| echelon_musk wrote:
| You would probably appreciate this clip [0] from the AMC show
| Halt and Catch Fire where the character reads out the entire
| firmware from an IBM PC using lights.
|
| [0] https://youtube.com/watch?v=jSZwtrnKxf4
| bobchadwick wrote:
| Awesome story. I absolutely loved using Rockbox on my iRiver
| H320. I think I still have it kicking around somewhere.
| OfSanguineFire wrote:
| Fond memories of running Rockbox on my iPod Video. Today, like
| many, I want to get away from my smartphone that only distracts
| me, and I wish I had kept my old iPod and upgraded its storage to
| flash. I wonder what battery availability is like now.
|
| One of the many disappointing aspects of the PinePhone is that it
| would often stutter playing FLACs, something that Rockbox on
| weaker hardware never did.
| oaththrowaway wrote:
| I actually just bought a 6th gen ipod classic. Converted it to
| flash and put a new battery in. It's definitely an experience,
| but it's been a fun ride so far
| kayodelycaon wrote:
| I actually have a solution for this if you have an old apple
| device handy. You can load a profile on it using Apple
| Configurator 2 that disables web browsing and restricts which
| apps can be run. (I seem to remember this working without
| needing a business account.)
|
| I've got some old devices locked into single app mode this way.
| asciimov wrote:
| You can find batteries online for under $20. They aren't too
| difficult to replace if you are patient and take your time.
| (Easier on 5th gen and earlier iPods). You can even order
| larger sized batteries if you free up some space with a flash
| upgrade.
|
| Only big issue with replacement batteries is their quality.
| None of them will be as high quality as original Apple
| batteries.
| keyringlight wrote:
| One thing I'd advise from my experience a few months ago
| upgrading my 6th gen classic, take your time and be careful
| getting the right parts. Dimensions matter when it's getting
| crammed into a case, and for however much I'm not thrilled
| about apple using their own connectors or needing their
| software, I appreciate their physical design is elegant for
| working with their own parts - there's nothing wasted.
|
| The iFlash converter I used was for a single SD card, I was
| only planning on putting in a single SD card so that's all I
| got as it was the cheapest, and why not get a big huge
| battery. However, the SD card slot is taller off the PCB than
| a microSD slot and iFlash only use them on the multi-card
| JBOD adapters, that makes it conflict with the larger battery
| if I wanted to keep the slim casing. So then the options are
| to get a different iFlash, get a different battery that
| doesn't go into the SD card area, or as I did a new 'fat'
| 160GB case.
| dabluecaboose wrote:
| I'd highly recommend Elite Obsolete Electronics [1] for anyone
| who is interested in buying or repairing iPods nowadays. I
| found my brother's old iPod Video in my desk about a year ago
| and have been using it as a music player using parts and
| upgrades I sourced from eoe.
|
| They even have see-through faceplates and colored backplates,
| for those of us still nostalgic for late-90s early-00s see-
| through electronics in funky colors!
|
| [1] https://eoe.works/
| miki123211 wrote:
| Rockbox was definitely life-changing software for me. I was so
| proud when I first managed to get it installed, at the age of 10
| if that. I got a Sansa Clip Plus for about $25, an affordable
| price, even at that age, and Rockbox made it talk. Similar
| devices directly aimed at the blind marked are more expensive at
| least by an order of magnitude. It has served me well for years,
| up until 2016 or so, when I finally bit the bullet and switched
| over to listening on a smartphone full time. I definitely have
| very fond memories of generating audiobooks on my computer with
| text-to-speech software to play them later on the Sansa, though.
| gtroja wrote:
| I loved the sansa so much. I miss them
| greatquux wrote:
| rockbox + sansa clip at the gym + live jamband shows were the
| best. rockbox made it easy to just throw stuff on and play from
| a folder, no worrying about a "database" or how the mp3 tags
| would be interpreted or sorted, just put them in alpha order
| and you're good. and it did gapless mp3 with ease, it was so
| awesome!
| TheEaterOfSouls wrote:
| Similar experience here. I grabbed a few Clip Zip/Plus players
| in 2015 because I figured they'd get harder and harder to find
| (prices were ridiculous) and might still use one for
| music/audiobooks if it weren't for the fact that I pretty much
| exclusively use bluetooth now. They were fast, had amazing
| battery life, and just did what they did really well. Maybe I'm
| just "doing something wrong" (I've never made real use of a
| streaming service, strip my audiobooks of DRM and play them in
| a media player rather than a dedicated app etc) but the modern
| phone experience just seems like a step backward when it comes
| to this.
| rendleflag wrote:
| 20-some odd years ago I added the initial bookmarking feature
| to Rockbox. None the MP3 players at the time targeted audiobook
| users so it wasn't a feature you could find on the market. With
| Rockbox, I just added it. Good times.
| kadoban wrote:
| I _still_ use Rockbox. The UI and performance is just really
| good. Probably doesn't hurt that it was one of the first pieces
| of software I ever contributed to (I only wrote a plugin/game,
| but it was still extremely satisfying), so I have a lot of fond
| feelings for it.
|
| It's gotten hard to find decent players that support it though. I
| hope one still exists to buy when my current one dies someday.
| tsujamin wrote:
| Likewise, RockBox is the only thing I've run my my current iPod
| Classic.
|
| The first time I ever used Linux/gcc as a kid was changing the
| rockbox bootloader to boot rockbox by default on an iPod nano
| dabluecaboose wrote:
| > The UI and performance is just really good.
|
| The performance is fantastic, but if you're installing it on an
| iPod let's not kid ourselves: It's clunky and awkward in
| comparison to the stock OS.
|
| I've tried to use the in-built tools to fix it as much as
| possible, such as hiding the "file browser" from the main page.
| Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be any way to rename
| "Database" to "Music" without recompiling the whole thing,
| which is what the cranky old guard seem to suggest for any
| minor UX suggestion on the forums.
| kadoban wrote:
| Maybe I just have different needs. All I ever want is to go
| in, pick an album or two, and hit play. I also use different
| hardware but typically it's consistent across hardware with
| similar number of buttons so I doubt that's much different.
| dabluecaboose wrote:
| Sure, I'm not saying it's _bad_ necessarily. And it 's
| probably an entirely different story on other hardware. I'm
| just frustrated that there's such a UX tradeoff on the iPod
| when some TLC could make it flat-out superior to stock.
| stefan_ wrote:
| It's a shame that there is no steady hardware supply because
| unfortunately they tend to die sooner or later (from humidity
| or just the 3.5mm wearing out).
|
| I do lots of listening on the phone nowadays of course but
| nothing beats a simple throwaway mp3 player for sports, can
| navigate them blind and get away with charging at most once a
| week.
| kadoban wrote:
| Yeah, even on my desk I like having a dedicated little
| device. It's easier to hit a phyical button than to hunt down
| the right app on my phone.
| dabluecaboose wrote:
| One neat little quirk I've discovered about Rockbox on the
| iPod (I'm assuming it works on other hardware) is that
| while plugged into a computer it acts as an external HID:
| You can play/pause, skip, previous, and change the volume
| using it as a remote for your computer.
|
| I've got plans to incorporate this to my office setup at
| some point rather than using media keys and an encoder.
| monocasa wrote:
| The first gen iPod had an html viewer?
| threeio wrote:
| yah this is the part that most people who owned a 1st gen
| spinwheel 5 button iPod g1 are trying to figure out ;) the only
| logical spot I could think of is maybe the copyright/TOC item?
| NoLsAfterMid wrote:
| That wouldn't have been accessible via disk mode, though, so
| you can't write to it without first rooting it.
| MBCook wrote:
| No, it didn't. I don't think.
|
| I assume they were referring to the first version they got
| Rockbox running on.
|
| Does anyone have more details on that part of the story?
| NoLsAfterMid wrote:
| This pdf[0] shows an iPod can view notes, but says you need
| to store them as a .txt.
|
| This O'Reilly snippet[1] claims the feature wasn't
| implemented until 2003, and even then explicitly states it
| could only store plain text.
|
| EDIT: The Notes app on the touch can import html files, but
| that doesn't sync up with either rockbox or disk mode.
|
| So I'm completely lost at what mechanic they're referring to.
| Even if we assume that this was a txt file and not html, that
| explicitly excludes the first gen iPod.
|
| [0]: https://manuals.info.apple.com/MANUALS/0/MA282/en_US/iPo
| d_cl...
|
| [1]: https://www.oreilly.com/library/view/ipod-and-
| itunes/0596008...
| zerocrates wrote:
| Reading down the thread they mention connecting to it over
| USB... the first iPods only talked Firewire didn't they? I had
| the 3rd gen (the odd-man-out design with the separate row of
| touch sensitive buttons above the wheel) and I distinctly
| remember the USB connection being a new and significant thing
| on that model.
| monocasa wrote:
| Also, the first gen iPod didn't have encrypted firmware. It
| was just an unencrypted blob on the disk.
| chedabob wrote:
| A later model had the firmware dumped via the piezo speaker
| http://www.ipodlinux.org/stories/piezo/
| rgovostes wrote:
| The archived version has the images that are referred to in the
| writing:
| https://web.archive.org/web/20050828114013/http://www.ipodli...
|
| I wonder why they could only use the piezo buzzer and not send
| cleaner audio out of the headphone port.
| monocasa wrote:
| The piezo was probably pretty close to a gpio line. There's
| normally a lot more setup involved getting true audio
| hardware going.
| tkiolp4 wrote:
| Wish Apple reintroduced the iPod (classic, shuffle). Can't listen
| music on my phone while running or playing sports (alone), it's
| just too clumsy.
| skydhash wrote:
| There's a plethora of devices ranging from $25 to thousands for
| playing exclusively music. The iPod was a nice piece of
| hardware, but for sports, I would just buy a cheap one and put
| my playlist on it.
| shortrounddev2 wrote:
| I got this little iPod nano-shaped Chinese Mp3 player[1]. It
| plays music and uses .m3u playlist files that are easy enough
| to edit on your PC. You can even set bookmarks in MP3 files
| so if you have a large audiobook file, you can save your
| place in it. It has some idiosyncrasies (such as not playing
| songs in order by default; the alphabetization is weird) but
| the killer features are: it's small, and I have literally
| never once run out the battery. I do charge it occasionally,
| but even after several hours of hiking, the battery indicator
| is at 3/3 bars.
|
| It takes a micro SD card so you can load music however you
| want and then just plug the SD card in
|
| [1] https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01LZVDMEL/ref=ppx_yo_d
| t_b...
| kstrauser wrote:
| I feel like Apple Watch + AirPods is the spiritual successor.
| That's my running and gym setup, anyway.
| iAkashPaul wrote:
| Whoa this took me back to using iPodWizard.net for all the
| firmware changes I did to customize my iPod & the dual boot with
| Rockbox was neat too!!
| jihadjihad wrote:
| Wow, Rockbox is one of those things I nearly completely forgot
| about. What a great blast from the past!
|
| I had a Toshiba Gigabeat [0] (even typing that out brings back
| memories...) that I ran Rockbox on, I probably still have it
| somewhere in the basement. The Gigabeat was sort of like a
| precursor to the Microsoft Zune, it used this software that I
| think got superseded by Zune and my model of Gigabeat didn't last
| long once the Zune came out. Fun times.
|
| 0: https://www.cnet.com/reviews/toshiba-gigabeat-s30-review/
| 65 wrote:
| My mind was a little less blown when I realized I misread Rockbox
| in the title for Roblox.
| firebot wrote:
| I loved rockbox on my sansa e200 series. That tetris clone was
| great.
| mannyv wrote:
| For everyone who loves the iPod, you've been able to convert
| iPods to flash for years now via an adapter. Stick Rockbox on it
| and you have an MP3 player than can hold > 1TB of data.
|
| It's a bummer that iPod OS can't really handle more than 50k
| tracks. For large collections the Rockbox UI sort of falls apart.
| My goal at one point was to put my SBD collection on iPods, and
| using the iPod OS I needed about 6 iPods. It would have been less
| if the iPod could handle more tracks.
|
| Maybe I'll take a hammer to Rockbox and start beating on it.
| AussieWog93 wrote:
| A bit off-topic, but Mastodon really is so much more pleasant to
| browse through than Twitter (don't have an account with either).
|
| You forget sometimes how bad the enshittification can get
| craftkiller wrote:
| My favorite was how the first android phone was rooted. They left
| a root terminal running in the background, so for example if on
| your homescreen you typed "reboot" and hit enter, your phone
| would reboot. So all you needed to do was launch a telnet daemon
| and you could telnet in and do whatever you wanted to the device.
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(page generated 2023-12-07 23:01 UTC)