[HN Gopher] 60% of Americans are living paycheck to paycheck, Re...
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60% of Americans are living paycheck to paycheck, Report says
Author : safaa1993
Score : 41 points
Date : 2023-11-22 19:22 UTC (3 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.blobstreaming.org)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.blobstreaming.org)
| ge96 wrote:
| I'm one baby... dumb choices, even hitting 6 figs, still poor/in
| debt ha. I did give some away though so wasn't just being
| wasteful. But I forgot my place considering I've been in debt
| since 2010.
| easeout wrote:
| Would you be open to illustrating in general terms what your
| situation is like?
| ge96 wrote:
| Sure this is a "burner" account
|
| I had a poor background but I had grants so I did have access
| to education but I was bad at it eg. failed. I was lucky to
| pick up web development to try and get rich from high traffic
| ads. That did not happen. I worked in factories/restaurants
| and did some freelancing. I landed my first W2 agency job at
| $40K/yr then $50K/yr. I climbed the ladder, SWE contractor
| job $84K/yr then a failed startup thing, $110K after that. I
| then quit my job since I didn't want to learn C#/.NET (dumb).
| Was hard to get a job for a couple months, about to go work
| in Amazon Warehouse till another local agency picked me up
| for $75K/yr where I'm at now.
|
| All the while I've been either burning money (eg. POS car
| repair, or expensive toys) or helping my families (last 3
| years) I think I gave them $60K+ in total. Current net worth
| is -$80K.
|
| Anyway I have been very fortunate/lucky I'm just dumb.
|
| I hate my job at the moment so I'm either going to get
| another job or get fired... repeat the debt implode cycle
| again.
| rngname22 wrote:
| Hating your job is a matter of the real, material
| conditions * your own perspective, optimism, ability to
| make lemonade out of lemons, and pain tolerance.
|
| Unfortunately it's often seen as easier to change the
| former than the latter (which seems to perhaps be developed
| throughout childhood and one's upbringing and former
| experiences), but I would perhaps try to brainstorm if you
| can ways to improve your own subjective perspective/lens
| itself. If you quit your prior job, and with your new one
| hate and want to quit it/think your discomfort for it'll
| get you fired, maybe you could try to reach out to those
| around you in your peer network (maybe a former dev
| coworker or boss or a current coworker and try to get their
| perspective on things). Maybe there's something with your
| own ability to tolerate discomfort or find solace in good
| aspects of your jobs that you could find.
| ge96 wrote:
| The thing is, without debt, my job is decent, people
| would be glad. But it is also brain dead development. We
| outsource our work and I just glue it together... And
| then they recently have really gotten into micromanaging
| where every minute of the day is tracked vs. hey, you
| have two weeks to complete this sprint. That's what an
| agency is I guess.
|
| My ideal job I'm not qualified for unless I do it as a
| hobby eg. robotics. So I will free myself financially
| eventually and then do that for fun.
|
| And I will continue to help my families since they're in
| a worse situation than me. Hopefully I remember being
| poor. I used to dream of having a Lamborghini Aventador
| but now I realize that money could buy me a house with
| land somewhere.
| shipscode wrote:
| Nothing dumb about helping your family, so it doesn't sound
| too bad to me all things considered.
| CoastalCoder wrote:
| Sorry things are looking so bleak. We're pulling for you.
| dangus wrote:
| I feel like this is not a very useful article without a
| comparison to data over time.
|
| I also think we could turn the numbers optimistic and say that
| 40% of Americans _not_ living paycheck-to-paycheck is pretty
| impressive.
|
| Finally, I think if you ask the question "are you worried about
| finances?" of course most people are going to say "yes."
| ImPostingOnHN wrote:
| _> I also think we could turn the numbers optimistic and say
| that 40% of Americans not living paycheck-to-paycheck is pretty
| impressive._
|
| I don't think we could say that at all. Only 40% isn't only
| unimpressive, it's depressing. The ideal would be 100%.
|
| _> I think if you ask the question "are you worried about
| finances?" of course most people are going to say "yes."_
|
| I think that's a safe bet at the moment, considering most
| Americans are living paycheck to paycheck at the moment.
| rayiner wrote:
| Sure, utopia is preferable to reality. But how is that a
| helpful assertion?
| ImPostingOnHN wrote:
| That is not an honest phrasing of what I said.
|
| More to the point, bad doesn't become good even if you
| can't do better. 40% is bad. If 40% was the best we can do,
| it would still be bad.
| fuzzfactor wrote:
| Look on the bright side, it means at least 30 to 40% remain
| to be fleeced before serious changes will be made.
| 082349872349872 wrote:
| Someone else's numbers gave 38% in 2012:
| https://consumerfed.org/press_release/many-families-struggle...
|
| ... which doesn't really say that much; I'll leave it to
| someone on your side of the Atlantic to find historical census
| data (eg https://www.census.gov/topics/income-
| poverty/wealth.html ) and cross index it against historical
| income data (eg
| https://www.census.gov/library/publications/2023/demo/p60-27...
| ) to determine if --with a presumably consistent methodology--
| there have been any significant developments in who is living
| on what they have and who on what they have coming.
| gumballindie wrote:
| Wondering how the situation looks like in the uk. The country is
| basically in limp mode.
| clnq wrote:
| Generally, not good. Many SWEs in games want to leave for
| cheaper countries or countries with better pay (US). Our
| salaries are low, but we don't have a good social safety net to
| show for it (i.e. our public healthcare is practically
| inaccessible due to wait times in hospitals, and public dental
| -- forget about it). So it's a raw deal.
|
| I don't think about how people on average salaries live. Or
| people with kids, or both. It is too depressing of a thought.
| One third of kids now live in poverty, more than one in five
| adults -- a better stat thanks in part to professional DINK
| couples threading water. Poverty is below paycheck-to-paycheck.
|
| There are no clear prospects for things improving. No
| meaningful political action. See BBC, Guardian, etc for what
| the government is concerned about instead. There's no point
| turning this into a political discussion and beating the
| proverbial dead horse.
|
| Upskilling and migrating into more well paid jobs is hard. If
| you didn't have enough time to study outside of work before,
| now with the CPI rising and your real wage dropping, you have
| even less time.
|
| Even if it sounds grim, people are finding individual
| solutions, like leaving.
|
| The last two years in the games industry has seen a lot of
| attrition just from people becoming unable to sustain their
| lifestyles in the UK. And a lot of these people are
| exceptionally skilled 10+ years of exp professionals, and very
| driven, so they deserve at least an average lifestyle.
|
| What is going on thanks to Brexit and all that is an injustice
| to them. And good on them for looking out for themselves first.
| Whenever a colleague leaves for a better life elsewhere, I am
| happy.
| gumballindie wrote:
| Probably the most accurate description of what's happening in
| the uk.
|
| On your final paragraph, I can confirm that pay in east
| europe, and the standard of living, are higher. I am in the
| uk but have links there and people just dont understand how
| someone can work in the uk in tech an not afford a property
| or a family, whereas in east european countries that's the
| norm. While it is not my case, I can absolutely tell that my
| peers in that region of the world are better off than i am,
| and by british standards i am pretty good.
|
| The irony of brexit is that somehow karma is turning the uk
| in that which it despised.
|
| The potholes in roads, failing health care, rising poverty,
| increasing government corruption and an ever increasing mass
| of people demanding dubious political action, makes me think
| the culture of the uk has seriously regressed in that it
| can't sustain itself.
|
| There is almost no company that has provided a service
| without more than minor issues in the past couple of years
| and thats alarming.
|
| I frequently read stats about various uk institutions, such
| as hospitals or schools and they all have official good and
| outstanding reviews while google and other review sites show
| a very grim reality. This means the uk is faking statistics
| to appear better than it is.
|
| I am extremely worried about the country. I dont think it
| will exist for long and it will split into its historical
| regions.
| asylteltine wrote:
| Considering how I see people spending money in the mall, I'm not
| surprised
| user568439 wrote:
| I never understood people living like this. I've never lived
| paycheck to paycheck even though with my first job as SWE 1 month
| after my graduation I was earning 900EUR a month. I went to live
| on my own because it was in another city and of course I had to
| share apartment with more people during 5 with years. I did that
| until I had a salary where the rent for living alone in a place I
| liked was below 30% of my netto salary.
|
| The only debt I ever had is my mortgage and I have savings to
| cover for at least 3 years without working. Without counting that
| I would get unemployment plus some other investments that would
| protect me more.
|
| All this lifestyle didn't stop me from traveling a lot (sometimes
| for months) and having nice things. But except for the home down
| payment, I never spent more in a year than I earned.
|
| But I also admit that I missed a lot of good investment
| opportunities due to my risk aversion
| lovich wrote:
| Bud if you had a software job one month out of college I don't
| think you've really had to interface with how bad shit gets.
|
| A large group of these people are having a revenue problem, not
| a spending problem
|
| I walked out of college in the Great Recession with a 900/month
| student loan debt and paying 500/month for rent in the
| shittiest apartment in the area with two roommates. I could
| only get minimum wage jobs that would send you home if you ever
| got close to full time so you didn't get benefits. Working
| 50-60 hours a week got me about 1400-1700 a month before tax. I
| frequently had to steal food if I wanted to eat even every
| other day and healthcare was completely out the window. There
| was no improving that situation by being more careful about
| spending because there was nothing to cut. That was paycheck to
| paycheck with zero luxuries and not even all the necessities
| jewayne wrote:
| At some point I came to realize that a large chunk of the
| population in my country (USA) live their entire lives
| paycheck-to-paycheck, never getting ahead. I think even in the
| very best of times, this number never gets below 20% or so. And
| that's not to say that all these people are irresponsible, far
| from it. Often it's just some combination of low/unpredictable
| income and life happening too fast.
|
| Anybody who has the opportunity to build wealth (as I have) has
| to recognize that at least part of that is luck.
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(page generated 2023-11-22 23:02 UTC)