[HN Gopher] Hickory DNS
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       Hickory DNS
        
       Author : ctz
       Score  : 51 points
       Date   : 2023-10-05 15:49 UTC (7 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (bluejekyll.github.io)
 (TXT) w3m dump (bluejekyll.github.io)
        
       | bluejekyll wrote:
       | Nice to see this here, also see the cross post on the Prossimo
       | Blog (same just more official looking):
       | https://www.memorysafety.org/blog/announcing-hickory-dns/
       | 
       | Since the title here doesn't state so, this is a direct
       | continuation of the work that's been going on for the last 8
       | years on Trust-DNS. When Josh and the ISRG started discussing
       | with me putting more direct effort behind the project there were
       | some concerns about the Trust-DNS trademark. "Trust" and "DNS"
       | being common words that appear together often when folks refer to
       | their own DNS software or services. So then we started discussing
       | a rebranding.
       | 
       | Over the next couple of weeks I'll be applying the brand name to
       | the repo and all the crates, etc., so please be patient as we
       | perform some of the necessary tasks associated with this
       | rebranding effort.
       | 
       | I'm personally really excited about ISRG's involvement and their
       | entire Prossimo project, and I'm hoping this opens a great new
       | chapter for Hickory DNS.
        
       | WarOnPrivacy wrote:
       | _The Hickory DNS project supports DNSSEC, DoT, DoH, and DoQ._
       | 
       | DoQ? It's DNS over QUIC.
       | 
       | QUIC? _Quick UDP Internet Connections (pronounced quick) is an
       | experimental transport layer network protocol designed by
       | Google._
       | 
       | Google? Is QUIC like AMP and Manifest v3, something Google
       | created to maximize Google wealth & internet crappiness? I don't
       | know.
       | 
       | Do you know if QUIC is awful or helpful? Ever play with DoQ?
        
         | bluejekyll wrote:
         | I suppose it also depends on your position on DoH as well, as a
         | I know some folks don't like the idea of clients avoiding local
         | DNS resolvers when using it.
         | 
         | The simple answer is that DoQ, and Quic, are more efficient at
         | connection establishment when setting up a TLS connection it
         | reduces the total round trips for TLS from 6 to 3, which is
         | pretty assume for reducing latency.
         | 
         | While Google developed it, I don't think there is anything
         | inherent to it that makes using it any different that using TCP
         | and/or TLS like people do today.
        
           | toast0 wrote:
           | Isn't TCP + TLS, with false start or TLS 1.3 also three round
           | trips?
           | 
           | C: SYN -> S
           | 
           | S: SYN + ACK -> C
           | 
           | C: ACK -> S
           | 
           | C: Client hello -> S (no need for two separate packets, but
           | almost everyone sends the no data ack)
           | 
           | S: Server hello, certificate, server hello done -> C
           | 
           | C: client key exchange, change cipher spec, finished,
           | application data -> S
           | 
           | S: change cipher spec, finished, application data -> C
           | 
           | In theory, you could use tcp fast open to shave a round trip,
           | and you can use TLS 1.3 early data to get to application data
           | on the second round trip where there's a session to resume,
           | if the client sent data is OK to replay.
        
             | bluejekyll wrote:
             | Yes I think you're correct with pre established
             | connections, etc, TLS 1.3, there are definitely
             | efficiencies there.
        
         | aidenn0 wrote:
         | QUIC is very useful. It's basically the 50% of SCTP[1] needed
         | for HTTP/3, with mandatory encryption and delivered over UDP so
         | that middleboxes don't freak out over it.
         | 
         | 1: Stream Control Transport Protocol
         | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stream_Control_Transmission_Pr...
        
           | o11c wrote:
           | Note that the actual SCTP is flawed in several ways, even
           | ignoring the middlebox problem and tooling problems.
        
           | throwawaaarrgh wrote:
           | I don't understand why anyone imagines "middleboxes" (there's
           | an overloaded term) won't implement QUIC, drop connections
           | that don't use their CA cert, and then fuck with the
           | connection by mitm. ISPs might not in the west, but they sure
           | as fuck will in less liberal societies, and every corporate
           | network will eventually.
           | 
           | The entire point of "middleboxes" is to solve a problem on a
           | network you control. The problem doesn't go away "because
           | encryption". They're just going to find another way to do
           | what they want, because the protocol gods refuse to add
           | needed features. Whoever decided that this was going to solve
           | the problem didn't spend more than 5 minutes thinking about
           | it. It's actually creating more problems.
        
             | aidenn0 wrote:
             | Well it definitely makes it so middleboxes are highly
             | unlikely to _misinterpret_ QUIC as anything pre-existing.
             | Plenty of things will notice SCTP (whether or not
             | encapsulated in UDP) and muck things up (or just drop
             | everything).
        
         | mcpherrinm wrote:
         | Dns over Quic is RFC 9250. Quic is RFC 9000.
         | 
         | Quic is the transport that underlies HTTP/3.
         | 
         | While it started at Google, many others were involved in its
         | design and deployment, including the browsers, web servers, and
         | large parties like the CDNs.
        
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       (page generated 2023-10-05 23:01 UTC)