[HN Gopher] Mexican cartels are fifth-largest employers in the c...
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Mexican cartels are fifth-largest employers in the country, study
finds
Author : kumarski
Score : 48 points
Date : 2023-09-21 19:09 UTC (3 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.theguardian.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.theguardian.com)
| sandworm101 wrote:
| Lol. And in an interesting symmetry, prisons are the largest
| employers in many areas of the United States. The prison
| industry, or "corrections" more broadly, probably breaks the top
| five in _most_ US states.
| stareatgoats wrote:
| Lol yea! Come to think of it it might even be preferable to
| have cartels replace law enforcement everywhere. Just think, no
| restrictions on drugs of any kind, and if anyone makes a fuss,
| just shoot them. Genius, sweet and simple.
|
| edit: /s
| fatfingerd wrote:
| They also hire the same PR people..
|
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35096436
| chucksta wrote:
| >Organised crime groups in Mexico have about 175,000 members -
| making them the fifth-biggest employer in the country,
| according to new research published in the journal Science
|
| Country in context is Mexico not US
| sandworm101 wrote:
| But the US is where most of the drugs go after mexico. It is
| a multinational industry.
| mminer237 wrote:
| Drugs isn't even where the cartels make most of their money
| anymore, is it? I was under the impression iron mining was
| their #1 source of revenue nowadays with avocados, limes,
| and logging also being big money-makers.
| hiatus wrote:
| Avocados are expensive sure but how can you beat
| $24/gram? Trade risk of spoilage for risk of seizure.
| proc0 wrote:
| Would you rather have cartels or prisons?
| beardog wrote:
| If you look at the top employers for any given medium sized
| town it will usually be school systems, a hospital, jail, and a
| Walmart.
|
| If you're lucky you also get a distribution center or meat
| packing plant!
| [deleted]
| darth_avocado wrote:
| > The authors argue that the best way to reduce the bloodshed
| would be to cut cartel recruitment
|
| Okay, but how? The whole article goes on about reducing
| recruitment, and how incarceration isn't the answer, but never
| specified how do you reduce recruitment?
| 6stringmerc wrote:
| Based on my studies since things really kicked off in 2010 it
| persists because of poverty mostly. Mostly rural places kind of
| fighting similar turf battles they have for generations.
| Alliances come and go.
|
| The profit motive is real but honestly it doesn't trickle down
| to the cannon fodder. Sometimes you can tell when they got shot
| down by the authorities and then a gun was tossed next to their
| body. Street gangs LA Chicago rural gangs in Michocan and old
| traditional "we ain't changing shit" in Nectar Lima.
|
| Fuel theft, extortion, prostitution...same old stuff really
| just an environment and culture quite unique to outsiders.
| Chino Antrax. Boats Blancas. The resting place for Z-3 El
| Lazca...
| ahzhou wrote:
| I'm not even sure how Mexico manages to dig itself out. The only
| way to root out the cartels seems to just hope that the US
| figures out how to manage its drug market.
|
| It's a pity - Mexico is so rich in culture but is just absolutely
| crushed by the US's demand for drugs.
| mminer237 wrote:
| Honestly, I think the US could magically stop all drug imports
| tomorrow and it would barely affect the cartels. They're
| essentially just the government of Mexico and tax all
| industries accordingly. They can get by fine off protection
| money, iron, avocados, limes, etc.
| nwienert wrote:
| The US is a very rich country that is very close by, _of
| course_ the drugs flow there. To single out the US is like
| blaming trees for forest fires. They 're part of the the
| problem, but it makes it seem like you just want an easy thing
| to point a finger at, whereas the grim reality is that it's
| complex and theres a ton of players and plans that'd need to go
| into motion to ever improve things.
| jonahbenton wrote:
| A large contingent of the population that arrived on the soil
| that is now the US did so to be predatory, to take advantage
| of others. As a nation the US has long history of this, of
| course slavery being the most notable, the extinction of the
| natives a grim near second, but the more subtle history of
| what are called con men is unique to the US, and different in
| degree but not in substance. Drugs are just one further
| example. Guns are related (to defend against predation). And
| unfortunately like many other things in the US, this
| predatory disease spreads.
| hombre_fatal wrote:
| This just seems like polishing your hobby horse rather than
| responding to anything stated upstream in the convo.
|
| So, Americans wanting drugs and Mexico being able to
| provide them is related to or caused by an inherent
| predatory trait that Americans have that's first
| demonstrated by pioneers a few hundred years ago?
|
| Or was it just an "America bad" interjection?
| ahzhou wrote:
| I agree it's complex.
|
| I'm not blaming the US. Like most problems in the world, it's
| a result of circumstance, not because there's a bad guy. It's
| not like there's a magical solution to market forces applying
| to drugs.
|
| My point is more that the geopolitical reasons for the
| cartel's existence means that Mexico has much less agency in
| solving it than they would like.
| [deleted]
| lp0_on_fire wrote:
| The cartels are involved with things other than drugs, too.
| It's also pretty laughable to think that even if the US "demand
| for drugs" evaporated overnight the cartels would just throw up
| their hands and say "guess we have to go legit now!".
| moralestapia wrote:
| This is the thing that all the "legalize it" guys don't get,
| at all.
| hyperliner wrote:
| [dead]
| hombre_fatal wrote:
| What's the argument for that?
|
| People have all sorts of reasons for wanting legalization
| beyond disempowering drug cartels.
|
| Like keeping people out of prison for nonviolent crimes,
| building a culture of rehab over penalization, and creating
| legitimate drug markets instead of dangerous black markets,
| off the top of my head, that have nothing to do with
| whether cartels having other lucrative enterprises beyond
| drugs.
| patrick451 wrote:
| I don't think Mexico is _actually_ trying to root out the
| cartels. The corruption, bribes and threats are more powerful
| than Mexico 's will for rule of law. I don't disagree that U.S.
| demand for drugs plays an enabling role here, but it's telling
| that the cartels are based in Mexico and not within the U.S. A
| cartel kingpin could eliminate a huge problem class by not
| needing to get drugs across the border, but evidently that's
| easier than evading the DEA on their home turf. Why does Mexico
| not have an equally fear inspiring agency?
| hyperliner wrote:
| [dead]
| ahzhou wrote:
| Mexico has been a victim of corruption since before it was a
| nation. Its political system under the Spanish was designed
| for efficient resource extraction and labor exploitation. Its
| home-grown system in the 1930's was created for the
| consolidation of political power and money to the winners of
| it's revolution.
|
| Combine this with the fact that the drug market in the US is
| ~$150B, it's hardly surprising that the cartel pops up to
| service the demand while joining hands with the corrupt
| central government. Neither group cares about the people.
|
| To begin to tackle it as you suggest, I think Mexico needs a
| full blown revolution which somehow manages to resist the
| billions of dollars the cartels are sitting on. It's not like
| Mexican's aren't trying either - it's just that if they try
| too hard, they get publicly executed.
|
| Note that that herculean effort only addresses the supply
| problem. The demand will still be there until the US controls
| it's drug epidemic, which I don't think anyone knows how to
| do.
|
| As I mentioned above, I'm not assigning any blame. I think
| both countries are in some kind of extremely shitty local
| maxima where the problems are so difficult to solve that a
| minority of people are able to profit and perpetuate the
| status quo.
| proc0 wrote:
| Employer is an ironically sinister way of putting. Given their
| infamy with brutality, I can't imagine how the "employees" are
| treated.
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(page generated 2023-09-21 23:02 UTC)