[HN Gopher] Plug and socket types around the world
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       Plug and socket types around the world
        
       Author : thunderbong
       Score  : 49 points
       Date   : 2023-09-19 14:56 UTC (8 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (www.worldstandards.eu)
 (TXT) w3m dump (www.worldstandards.eu)
        
       | Titan2189 wrote:
       | Who made this list of just naming them A - O? Why not use the
       | established standard names?
       | 
       | Probably a case of https://xkcd.com/927/
        
         | zdimension wrote:
         | The lettered naming convention is common and not new ([see](htt
         | ps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AC_power_plugs_and_sockets#Typ...))
         | 
         | In France, Switzerland and Germany I've heard the terms "type
         | C/E/F" (sometimes "Schuko"), but never CEE 7/3 or CEE 7/7.
        
       | pm215 wrote:
       | The one on this list that surprised me is type O, because it's
       | specific to Thailand and only standardised in 2006, which means
       | that in the 21st century somebody decided it was better to invent
       | a completely new plug-and-socket spec, rather than adopting any
       | of the pre-existing standards...
        
         | ilyt wrote:
         | Governments be like that
        
       | msy wrote:
       | One weird quirk I've discovered is 2-pin Swiss plugs appear to
       | have smaller diamater pins than EU ones, which means some EU-
       | compatiable plugs will not fit in CH sockets. Apple's BRA
       | adaptors work in CH sockets, KOR ones do not.
        
       | wppick wrote:
       | Interestingly and semi-related: in Japan, the electrical grid is
       | divided into two frequency standards: 50 Hz in the eastern part
       | of the country (including Tokyo), and 60 Hz in the western part
       | (including Osaka). Which was due to influence by German tech in
       | the east and American tech in the west. Electrical appliances
       | have to be labeled to indicate their compatible frequency to warn
       | customers
        
         | RetroTechie wrote:
         | On a side note: anyone know equipment that works on 60 Hz but
         | not 50 Hz, or vice versa? I don't mean what's specified on the
         | label, but actual operation. And ignoring efficiency
         | considerations. Just "works" or not.
         | 
         | There's clocks that use AC mains frequency as timebase.
         | Anything else?
        
           | jmwilson wrote:
           | Motors, wall warts with line-frequency transformers, or other
           | things that are an inductive load. Magnetic materials
           | designed for 60 Hz may saturate at 50 Hz, though usually
           | things designed for 50 Hz will at least sort of work at 60
           | Hz.
        
             | bluGill wrote:
             | Other than clocks almost everything is designed for 50 or
             | 60hz. it doesn't cost much more to design for either
             | frequency, and typically you don't care about the RPM
             | difference that much. By handling both you can just sell
             | your things around the world. A lot of money has been lost
             | because someone shipped something to a country it wasn't
             | designed for. Making a motor that can handle different
             | frequencies and voltages tends to be easier than the
             | logistics of getting the right thing to the right place
             | (most of the world is 100-120V, 200-240V, or 400-480V - and
             | those variations are easy to handle if you design for it).
        
       | sq_ wrote:
       | While traveling in Europe recently, I noticed that my adapter
       | from the US plug to the European one didn't always quite fit into
       | the sockets. I wonder now if I was seeing some small
       | incompatibility between Type E and F...
        
       | jeltz wrote:
       | F (and E) has partial and unsafe compatibility with G that they
       | fail to mention. I have seen people use that way too often in
       | Malta.
        
       | nonethewiser wrote:
       | I noticed Japan was only associated with one plug (type A). Does
       | this mean they don't have a grounded plug? Or just an omission?
        
         | mixmastamyk wrote:
         | Yes, no grounded plug that I've seen. Trying to find an adapter
         | to plug your grounded power supply in is a challenge.
        
         | hexmiles wrote:
         | In another table they also mention type B that has a grounded
         | plug:
         | 
         | https://www.worldstandards.eu/electricity/plug-voltage-by-co...
         | 
         | https://www.worldstandards.eu/electricity/plugs-and-sockets/...
        
       | MenhirMike wrote:
       | Moving from Europe to the US really made me appreciate recessed
       | power sockets - the standard US Power Socket is a crime against
       | engineering (and don't get me started on 120 vs 240V).
       | 
       | If I was Emperor of the Universe, I'd make the Type G plug the
       | only standard: Longer ground contact that makes contact first,
       | plastic cover on the plug-facing side of the hot/neutral
       | contacts, polarized because there's only one direction to plug
       | it, built-in fuse. Make it recessed, and it's perfect. And since
       | it's rated for 250V/13A, it's great for any household device that
       | doesn't need three-phase power.
       | 
       | Yes, it's chonky, but the more I learn about power plugs and
       | sockets, the more I see how well designed it is. Unless someone
       | from the UK knows if there are actual issues with it :)
        
         | petre wrote:
         | The G standard plug should be classified as a cold weapon as
         | it's so big and heavy and flat that it could be used as a mace
         | or as a booby trap for burglars.
        
         | gottorf wrote:
         | > the standard US Power Socket is a crime against engineering
         | (and don't get me started on 120 vs 240V)
         | 
         | What's so bad about a NEMA 5-15? I grant you it's not as fancy
         | as the Type G, but I've certainly never been shocked by it, so
         | I'm not sure if it's criminal.
         | 
         | US households have access to 240V if they want it (and most
         | homes have at least a clothes dryer outlet wired for this).
         | About the only thing I would really prefer to have 240V for is
         | an electric kettle.
        
           | MenhirMike wrote:
           | I've seen so many sockets that were worn down over time from
           | the weight of the plug just hanging out from it, usually
           | straight since most aren't angled. (because there's no strain
           | relief either, which a recessed socket would provide). So you
           | have plugs that are usually exposing parts of the plug thanks
           | to gravity.
           | 
           | Yes, it can be fixed by replacing the socket, but it's just
           | such a terrible design. (The 240V socket isn't much better -
           | if I was wiring my house for 240V, I guess I'd have to use
           | that one to be up to code, but I'd really consider importing
           | some Schuko sockets instead)
        
         | rndmio wrote:
         | The biggest issue with the UK plug is when it's been left
         | unplugged, lying pin up, in the dark. It's got to be the most
         | painful one to stand on.
        
           | stevekemp wrote:
           | It is true they can sting a little, but that aside I have a
           | strong preference for them too - almost certainly because i
           | grew up with them!
           | 
           | There's the obligatory Tom Scott video here, which always
           | gets shared, deservedly so, whenever the topic of plugs and
           | sockets comes up:
           | 
           | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UEfP1OKKz_Q
        
             | ilyt wrote:
             | The man haven't seen good plug in his life
        
           | andyjohnson0 wrote:
           | Can confirm. 2.4 times worse than lego.
        
       | esturk wrote:
       | After the whole lightning to USB-C plug fiasco for the iPhone, I
       | wonder if the EU will ever throw their weight to force certain
       | smaller countries to adopt more popular socket standards. It
       | might even be done in the name of "reducing e-waste".
       | 
       | Just looking over the list above, it seems like Type-J (Swiss &
       | Liechtenstein only) and Type-K (Denmark & Greenland only) are
       | prime candidates. I'm only looking at sockets within the EU
       | border btw.
        
         | Svip wrote:
         | Switzerland and Liechtenstein are outside the EU. As for the
         | type K, type F sockets are already permissible in Denmark, and
         | are not uncommon in newer installations. The page on type K
         | mentions that the expectation is that type K will be phased out
         | eventually, as newer installations use type F, but I haven't
         | really seen a lot of type F sockets, and there are no mandates
         | to change existing installations.
        
           | jeltz wrote:
           | Malta and Ireland use type G.
        
             | kyriakos wrote:
             | and Cyprus
        
         | [deleted]
        
         | Lukas_Skywalker wrote:
         | You need to take Type-J from my cold dead hands. The image
         | shows a quite important safety feature (and misses one):
         | 
         | The socket is recessed into the wall, and only the frontmost
         | part of the plug is conducting. That means that while you are
         | plugging it in, there is never any metal exposed. Contact can
         | only be made when the plug is already quite far in the socket.
         | 
         | The second feature would be to mount the socket upside down, so
         | the center hole (the ground contact) is on the top. Metal
         | objects falling down on the plug are prevented from making
         | contact with the two current-carrying contacts and usually
         | bounce right off the center contact.
        
           | ilyt wrote:
           | > The socket is recessed into the wall, and only the
           | frontmost part of the plug is conducting. That means that
           | while you are plugging it in, there is never any metal
           | exposed. Contact can only be made when the plug is already
           | quite far in the socket.
           | 
           | Same thing for E/F... the actual metal connectors for power
           | are recessed in socket so when socket is in you can't touch
           | anything before it even connects power, because plug itself
           | covers the socket
           | 
           | But yeah, type J is more compact one, althought only 10 amps
           | is laughable
           | 
           | I'd rather have C13/C14 than any of those tbh
        
           | Cockbrand wrote:
           | While the compact-ness of Type J is very convincing, I
           | personally like Types E and F best. This is because the
           | ground is exposed, so you can quickly touch it to remove any
           | static charges from yourself. I do this f.e. before handling
           | circuit boards.
        
             | ilyt wrote:
             | Also only 10 amps
        
         | dist-epoch wrote:
         | That's not how the EU works.
         | 
         | All rules and regulations are really optional. If a country
         | flat out refuses to implement one of them nothing happens.
         | 
         | This is why all those complaining that "countries lost their
         | sovereignty to the EU" are hilarious because no such thing
         | happened.
        
         | petre wrote:
         | Type J is a good design, the Danish one is quite unique. Too
         | big. Schuko is too big as well. I installed Italian Type L/Type
         | C sockets for 10 amp type C plugs where I had half a module
         | left.
         | 
         | The EU has no jurisdiction over Switzerland and Lichtenstein.
        
       | tristor wrote:
       | While Type F is clearly (mostly) superior to all alternatives, I
       | wish Type K was the winner in Europe because it looks like a
       | smiley face.
        
         | jeltz wrote:
         | Personally I prefer type E despite growing up in a country with
         | type F. They are less prone to being annoying when build
         | quality is poor.
        
         | Svip wrote:
         | If you like that, you should see the hospital version:
         | https://www.avxperten.dk/stikkontakt/lk-fuga-stikkontakt-jor...
        
           | tristor wrote:
           | Ooh, I like that. Winky face is definitely even better than
           | smiley face. Also beats hospital plugs in the US, which are
           | identical visually to other plug types, except for a green
           | dot.
        
         | ilyt wrote:
         | I actually prefer E coz I can just connect to ground via
         | alligator clip if I need to
        
         | Cockbrand wrote:
         | Fans of the Scream movie franchise may prefer Type I.
        
       | dvh wrote:
       | This is one of the reasons aliens still didn't land here.
        
         | gizajob wrote:
         | "The good thing about standards is that there are so many to
         | choose from."
         | 
         | I'll never get bored of posting this nugget
        
       | kevincox wrote:
       | > Type N [...] 100 - 240 V
       | 
       | I was surprised to learn this. My Brazilian friend said you just
       | had to know what outlets in the house where 110 and which were
       | 220. If you got it wrong then the magic smoke came out.
       | 
       | Nothing wrong with the socket itself but the use for different
       | voltages is terrifying.
        
         | marcosdumay wrote:
         | Almost all of Brazil uses exclusively 220V. But the exception
         | is Sao Paulo, so it has to be supported.
        
           | matheusmoreira wrote:
           | 110-127 V is common in most of the brazilian southeast. Minas
           | Gerais, for example.
        
         | zzo38computer wrote:
         | I should expect that they ought to mark each one with the
         | voltage label to know what it is, if they do something like
         | that.
         | 
         | (Using a different shape might be even better, to avoid
         | plugging it wrong by accident or if it is dark and the label
         | cannot be read or it is faded and cannot be read, etc, and you
         | can more easily tell which device works with which plug because
         | the shape matches the devices being plugged too.)
        
           | RetroTechie wrote:
           | No, that still relies on users not being stupid.
           | 
           | Multiple AC standards in 1 building is just dumb, period.
        
             | bluGill wrote:
             | Multiple AC standards is just fine, so long as all the
             | sockets are physically different so you can't screw up.
             | Electricians are expected to know all the weird rules and
             | get things right, but normal people can't make a mistake so
             | it works.
             | 
             | Almost all US houses have two voltages, but since the
             | sockets are obviously incompatible it all works. I've seen
             | industrial buildings that have more than one grid
             | connection (and in one case they paid extra to ensure the
             | grid connections went to different sub stations)
        
         | bluGill wrote:
         | Not pictured, but the US also has a socket that looks like type
         | B, but it is for 220-240v (mostly used for window air
         | conditioners, or tools). It is not compatible with the normal
         | type A/B socket/plugs though because one of the pins is
         | sideways.
         | 
         | I once saw a house in the US which had outlets that would
         | accept either type, and you had to know if it was 120V or 240V.
         | IIRC this was a type A socket, but it would accept either
         | voltage.
        
           | mrgriscom wrote:
           | I think you're confusing a NEMA 5-20 (120V, 20A) and NEMA
           | 6-20 (240V, 20A). Each has one blade sideways but they're
           | mirror images of each other. T-slot varieties of both outlets
           | are common, which can accept both 15A and 20A versions of
           | their respective voltages. You won't find outlets that can
           | accept both a 120V and 240V plug.
           | 
           | (The standard US outlet "type B" is a NEMA 5-15)
        
       | LinAGKar wrote:
       | I'm guessing you read XKCD?
        
       | mixmastamyk wrote:
       | What about DC plugs for the home? Maybe the kitchen appliances
       | are the last that use AC natively?
        
         | bluGill wrote:
         | AC is strictly better for home use. You can just throw a
         | transformer at AC and you get a different voltage, and then a
         | couple diodes and capacitors give you the DC voltage you want.
         | DC is more complex (generally you turn DC into AC and throw it
         | into a transformer then back to DC - the only advantage of DC
         | is you can turn it into high frequency AC which allows for a
         | tiny transformer). Most things that want DC want very low
         | voltage DC, which doesn't travel long distances well, and there
         | are a number of different DC voltages things that want DC might
         | want.
        
           | mixmastamyk wrote:
           | USB Power Delivery handles these issues. I suppose if the
           | house is large there'd unfortunately need to be multiple
           | transformers, maybe one per room instead of per device.
        
           | danielhep wrote:
           | Almost all DC power supplies are switching power supplies
           | these days, which convert AC to DC first, then use DC-DC
           | converters to get to the final voltage. I would think AC
           | transformers are quite rare in homes these days. Maybeeee
           | some microwaves? But the majority of power consumption is
           | happening after rectifiers.
           | 
           | Edit: another thought, most chargers and other low power DC
           | power supplies will actually work just fine if you feed them
           | sufficiently high voltage DC rather than AC. The recifier
           | just doesn't do anything! I used to power my laptop charger
           | directly from a lithium battery at about 100 volts DC with no
           | trouble.
        
           | ianburrell wrote:
           | I got the impression there is one place for medium voltage DC
           | in the home. Solar panels have inverters to make AC from DC,
           | and batteries also need to convert DC to AC. It would be more
           | efficient if the solar panels and batteries were connected
           | directly with DC, and if there was a single, efficient
           | inverter. It makes the most sense to use the battery DC
           | voltage, and then solar panels have variable DC converter.
           | 
           | It would make sense for off-grid home to distribute DC. DC
           | appliances could be more efficient but they don't exist.
           | Everyone will use inverter and AC wiring.
        
         | ianburrell wrote:
         | AFAIK, there aren't any. There isn't any standard for voltage.
         | There isn't much demand or advantage for DC in the home. There
         | might be slight efficiency gain but have to replace all of your
         | appliances. Appliances which don't exist.
         | 
         | There are a bunch of DC power connectors but they are mainly
         | for connecting cables and for low voltage. Powerpole is my
         | favorite since genderless and maintains polarity, but can pull
         | out.
         | 
         | Boats, RVs, and off grid homes mostly use 12V DC. There are
         | some that are using 48V for efficiency and higher power
         | appliances. My understanding is that everything is hardwired.
         | Lots have inverters and AC plugs.
        
           | mixmastamyk wrote:
           | I exempted kitchen appliances, and suppose laundry too.
           | Sometimes these are on 220 which is a different circuit
           | already, right? Everything else in our place needs to be
           | converted to DC.
           | 
           | Edit: can't reply, so added below:
           | 
           | Our lighting has been LED for a decade. USB PD up to 240W
           | handles most of the other issues you mention. I have a USB
           | Fan at my desk. I think the issues are solvable if one is
           | motivated. ;-)
        
             | ianburrell wrote:
             | Why? Which DC voltage? The low voltage that use now is too
             | low voltage for running in the walls. You're going to need
             | converter boxes; DC-DC converters are more efficient but
             | you are going to have wall warts everywhere. Also, USB-C is
             | not enough power for things like TVs.
             | 
             | Plus, I have a bunch of things like fans and lamps that
             | need AC. So now going to have converter boxes from AC toDC.
             | 
             | Also, appliances are where all the efficiency gains are
             | because that is where all the power goes.
        
         | vilunov wrote:
         | Pretty sure the standard DC plug is USB.
        
       | Gabrys1 wrote:
       | Note: type E looks like it could be polarized, but it's not. It's
       | also annoying to use when you have a big plug as it often blocks
       | two outlets.
        
         | dfox wrote:
         | The solution for right-angle plugs blocking adjacent sockets
         | are angled sockets.
         | 
         | For a correctly designed appliance the polarization should not
         | matter and as today most appliances have CEE E/F plugs which
         | are compatible with inherently not polarized Schuko there is
         | not much space for designing it wrong.
         | 
         | Across the EU there is a bunch of various normative and ad-hoc
         | standards about which pin should be the live one in Type E
         | socket. And well, one would expect that there are only three
         | ways how that can be standardized including don't care, but no,
         | there also exist standards that say "always on left, even if
         | the socket is upside down" (the reasoning is something along
         | the lines that if a child sticks a 100mm nail into the socket
         | it is going to be into the right hole)
        
       | Svip wrote:
       | Type E and F's plug are shown in their combined version (the
       | Schuko), which is the standard today. I have two old appliances
       | (an egg cooker from the 1980s and a sauce machine from the early
       | 1990s), which have the type F and type E plugs, respectively,
       | i.e. not the combined form. Living in Denmark, the usual K to
       | Schuko plug is using the E socket (i.e. "French ground"), which
       | makes it hard for me to find a grounded socket for my egg cooker
       | (which I believe is German). (Though, because this converter
       | takes up a bit of space, on some appliances, I have removed the
       | Schuko plug and replaced it with a type K plug to reduce space
       | required. I have been thinking of doing the same for the egg
       | cooker, but there is something quaint about an actual type F
       | plug.)
        
         | beAbU wrote:
         | What on earth is a sauce machine?
        
       | bloopernova wrote:
       | I know people make fun of the UK plug for being too chunky, but I
       | really like its solidity. It feels like it will actually survive
       | a few years in a home. Plus assembling them at school was always
       | fun.
        
         | mixmastamyk wrote:
         | Ok at home... for a fridge? But traveling with them is another
         | story.
        
         | RetroTechie wrote:
         | And supporting a fuse in the plug!
         | 
         | Not to everyone's liking, but there's something to be said for
         | that.
        
       | MeteorMarc wrote:
       | Now I become curious how many types of converter plugs between
       | type A-O do actually exist!
        
       | gizajob wrote:
       | Best - Type G Worst - Type I
        
       | pathartl wrote:
       | I know type L is not great because it's not polarized, but I
       | think it's the best looking socket out of any of the ones listed.
        
         | nrr wrote:
         | Somewhat paradoxically, it's actually safer from a consumer
         | safety perspective to assume that you don't have a polarized
         | connector. The big reason is that the consumer can see fit to
         | make modifications to meet their circumstances.
         | 
         | If the culture here in the US of filing down the wider blade on
         | polarized plugs so they'll mate with an unpolarized receptacle
         | is anything to go by, people just want to use their stuff,
         | safety be damned.
        
           | pathartl wrote:
           | Of course. Ideally we'd be able to have all appliances be
           | polarizing agnostic and write that into any standards, and
           | then be able to enforce those standards.
        
           | bluGill wrote:
           | Polarization is only safer in the case of a screw in light
           | plug (ie light bulb) where the design makes it likely you
           | will touch one of the live wires - if that wire is the one
           | connected to ground you can safely touch it.
        
         | ilyt wrote:
         | Oh you funny man, thinking we have polarized ones!
         | 
         | Brits do I think, but most of the eu has unpolarized ones.
         | 
         | One of the common 2 socket wall sockets for example have just
         | straight bars connecting 2 sockets being 180 degrees rotated,
         | so each socket have line and neutral on different connector.
         | 
         | So if you say put a tester in it, one socket will read
         | "correct" while other will read "L/N reversed"
        
         | slategruen wrote:
         | Saves a lot of space too. One thing that's bothered me with
         | most popular socket variants is how wide their power strips
         | usually become.
         | 
         | I think the Italian one is the most practical variant that
         | unfortunately isn't as ubiquitous. It (1) occupies less space,
         | (2) reversible, (3) sticks to the wall more firmly unlike the
         | flat-pronged ones in North America.
        
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       (page generated 2023-09-19 23:01 UTC)