[HN Gopher] Touch Pianist
___________________________________________________________________
Touch Pianist
Author : thunderbong
Score : 771 points
Date : 2023-09-08 09:56 UTC (1 days ago)
(HTM) web link (touchpianist.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (touchpianist.com)
| tantalor wrote:
| On web, opening up the "choose differnet piece" window, then
| clicking a piece does nothing.
|
| Expected would close the window and load a new piece.
| SkyArrow wrote:
| Open up developer tools, choose "toggle device toolbar" in the
| top left (or equivalent in other browsers), pick a tablet
| device, and set orientation to landscape. This lets you
| simulate touch events with your mouse.
| havaloc wrote:
| That works in Safari, but not Chrome for some reason.
| ldjb wrote:
| I'm using a Microsoft Surface and had the same problem when
| trying to click using the trackpad, but tapping it on the
| touchscreen worked.
| bestest wrote:
| I like the idea, but there's a delay. It's noticeable enough to
| be annoying and making it impossible to play out the pieces
| exactly as I would like to. It just feels like when I get in a
| rhythm I end up being one tick forward. Or is it just me?
| flappyeagle wrote:
| Are you using Bluetooth headphones? AirPods have a delay that
| makes playing rhythm games impossible
| bestest wrote:
| thank you. it was bluetooth to blame in general (was using
| external speakers). now all delays are one.
| Fnoord wrote:
| Bluetooth codec is to blame. Some Bluetooth codecs are
| (very) low latency.
|
| I used my phone speaker. My daughter (5) loved it, thank
| you.
|
| Was odd it only worked once in Firefox Mobille (Android). I
| had to install Vivaldi (badum-tsh) to get it to work again.
| Was a let down it was only one song.
| stavros wrote:
| There are more songs in the menu (I think).
| Fnoord wrote:
| Nope, coming soon. Was a disappointment for my kid after
| I told her there were more songs.
| bestest wrote:
| there are more. the menu is somewhat awkward. it wasn't
| working for me in chrome properly (wasn't able to choose
| other pieces). works ok in safari, had a blast with
| toccata and fugue in d minor.
| bdangubic wrote:
| no delay at all for me
| bestest wrote:
| ok, no delay on their app, and in there the experience is
| very satisfying. the web version seems to _feel_ somewhat
| better when using the touchpad instead of the keyboard, but
| still not the same.
| coldtea wrote:
| No delay on the web version to me. Probably depends on the
| system/browser/specs/etc.
| zzzeek wrote:
| i had that problem also and as a drummer I'm pretty sure I
| could press the spacebar with above-average steady time. I was
| using firefox though, maybe that matters.
| bestest wrote:
| I too have musical education. using osx on m2pro, tried
| safari / chrome / firefox -- nothing helped, the delay was
| maddening.
|
| "was" -- because indeed, blueetooth audio was the culprit.
| was using external speakers at the time I tried it first. now
| it's flawless and extremely enjoyable.
| frud wrote:
| That was nice.
| shashanoid wrote:
| WOW I love
| igtztorrero wrote:
| Love it ! I allways want to learn and play piano !
| michael1999 wrote:
| Lol. That's fun, and frustrating! I can't manage tempo just
| repeating the same key on my short-travel keyboard, and if I
| start wandering around the keyboard, my old piano lessons start
| messing up my "fingering".
| [deleted]
| petarb wrote:
| This is incredible. Thank you for sharing.
| pama wrote:
| With a lockdown-enabled iPhone I only get a loading page that
| says chrome highly recommended.
| cflyingdutchman wrote:
| iphone app is broken for me, and according to reviews, many
| others. I paid the $12 for full access and currently unplayable.
| Notes don't load, song does't start - help!
| Condition1952 wrote:
| could Apple give you a refund?
| Waterluvian wrote:
| I adore this because intentional or not it shows you how critical
| tempo and a bit of legato can be to giving the right piece the
| right mood.
|
| You have one singular job here and the way in which you do it
| drastically affects your interpretation of Beethoven.
| IAmGraydon wrote:
| Velocity is also critical, but it's doing that for you.
| gnrlst wrote:
| I only noticed half way through you could adjust velocity
| depending on vertical touch. Really nifty! More expressive
| and fun than I expected. Bravo.
| Timpy wrote:
| I noticed that too! This could be a fantastic learning
| tool, my music professor described how to crescendo into
| the tension and decrescendo into the release but being able
| to experiment with this tool could help you get an idea of
| what you want to do before your fingers have the right
| touch to do it.
| keymasta wrote:
| This was one of the first pieces I tried to learn as a kid. I
| would just restart it repeatedly because my Casio keyboard had a
| library of classical music on it that one could listen to by
| hitting a function key and then a unique white key. I think it's
| something that Casio did in the late 80s - mid 90s. They don't
| seem to use the old song library much or at all anymore, but I
| thought it was a great feature.
|
| So I'd just restart from the beginning and learn the next note.
| Guess-and-check. As an adult I've continually tried to learn to
| read sheet music, with frustration. So I learned jazz theory and
| invented my own music theory system. Now I encode most pieces
| harmonically in my brain. It would be cool to see this kind of
| indication in the app, so for example, the first couple lines:
| 3/4 |C#mi| | | |C#mi/B | | | |
| |A | |D/F#| |G#5(b6)|C#mi/G#|G#sus|G#7 | ...
|
| I like to use this as a jam idea, for example play it like a
| montuno.
| ktpsns wrote:
| Reminds me of https://hackertyper.com/ (and clones)
| [deleted]
| das_keyboard wrote:
| It seems like the Android version is not (yet) available despite
| it being advertised for Android.
| stouset wrote:
| I think it's the opposite. This is quite old software which
| hasn't received App Store updates in years. It's likely the
| Android version has been pulled from the store or otherwise
| bit-rotted.
| zengid wrote:
| Very cool, great job! It looks like this is using PIXI for the
| graphics?
| philbarr wrote:
| This is a great kind of thing for getting people into music.
| There's a piano in my local pub and when people say they "can't
| play piano" I'll play a 2-5-1 in C and tell them to hit any of
| the white notes. People love that they can make up their own
| tunes having never played before.
| Ylpertnodi wrote:
| The pedant in me is screaming -
|
| ii V I
| WWLink wrote:
| Here I was doing barre chords on the 2nd fret, 5th fret, and
| 1st fret on my guitar and wondering why it didn't sound good.
| ;)
| aldanor wrote:
| And then you show them the black blues note...
| kqr wrote:
| I was miserable for most of my piano lessons (I learned to
| sheet read well - I become a fairly adept piano-playing robot
| - but I never sort of "figured out" music more generally.)
| That said, one lesson my teacher played a basic blues chord
| progression and told me to hit anything on the blues G scale
| however I wanted. That was one of the most fun times I've had
| making music ever. Well, the only time that has been fun,
| actually.
| jefftk wrote:
| If you want to do this with someone who doesn't play, the
| experienced person can play in Eb and then the black notes
| make an Eb blues scale.
| yayitswei wrote:
| I do this too! D dorian works great as well.
| ADcorpo wrote:
| I am sorry if this is not the place to discuss it and will remove
| my comment if needed, but seeing websites "highly recommending"
| the use of Chrome seems like bad taste nowadays, especially with
| what's going on with WEI.
| thecosmicfrog wrote:
| It seems to work fine on Firefox for Android. I wonder what the
| author's concern is that he'd recommend Chrome?
| ADcorpo wrote:
| Maybe they only tested in Chrome and do not want to address
| complaints coming from users on a different web browser, who
| knows
|
| I just get real <<this website was optimized for internet
| explorer X>> vibes from this, I really do not want the web to
| end up back to this state.
| rockdoe wrote:
| It's not like putting that message there will stop those
| complaints, more like the opposite.
| trialect wrote:
| I love the way how NOONE mentions that it is not available on
| android: "We're sorry, the requested URL was not found on this
| server."
|
| https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.earslap.to...
| jacobp100 wrote:
| No audio on the website. No audio or graphics in the app (except
| menus). iPhone 12 mini on latest iOS 16
| superpope99 wrote:
| If you try this on Bluetooth headphones the latency will kill any
| rubato you're trying to inject into this
| junon wrote:
| I loved this. Unfortunately the android app seems to be taken
| down, so no La Campanella :(
| andybak wrote:
| Yeah. I spent money on it back in the day but it was never
| updated.
| shimonabi wrote:
| Can someone suggest some good piano learning software? I really
| don't like subscriptions.
|
| Many years ago I used Voyetra Teach Me Piano Deluxe which ran on
| Windows XP, but gave up after some time. I think I'd have to
| create a virtual machine to run that again. My town is so small I
| can't find a piano teacher.
| Popeyes wrote:
| https://sightreading.training/ might be useful for you.
|
| This old thread go mentioned a while ago
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16482104
| Condition1952 wrote:
| It would be great if I could see the music script instead of some
| bubbles
| adzm wrote:
| I was surprised I could recognize the song just from the
| bubbles without even having audio enabled
| ckocagil wrote:
| Rachmaninoff's Prelude (op 3 no 2) is incredibly fun to play!
| turtlebits wrote:
| Wishlist - As a piano player, the left and right hands really
| need to be broken up into separate rhythms (esp for grace notes),
| also it needs a sustain pedal. Maybe as an advanced feature.
| Matticus_Rex wrote:
| Google Play app link says "We're sorry, the requested URL was not
| found on this server."
|
| Surprisingly satisfying -- I think my heart rate dropped a good
| 10 bpm in a few minutes of playing. I'd love a little map to know
| how far I am in the song, and some way to work pedals for
| dynamics for more advanced users; I don't play piano, but I'm a
| musician and am familiar enough with many of these pieces to have
| opinions on the expression. If I could map it to custom keys that
| would be perfect -- I happen to have flight pedals. Obviously
| that's atypical.
| johtso wrote:
| Great choice of song! If you ever have access to a piano, I
| highly recommended trying to fumble your way through Beethoven's
| moonlight sonata, even if you don't know how to play piano.
|
| Not quite sure how to put it into words, but it's absolutely
| exhilarating hearing your own fingers produce these huge sounds
| and intense chord progressions. Every time I managed to find the
| right chord I'd get such a rush. "Oh no he didn't.. he went
| _there_!?"
|
| This webpage gives a little taste of that feeling. If you enjoyed
| it, try to give the real thing a go!
| purpleblue wrote:
| Moonlight Sonata 3rd Movement is one of the most exhilarating
| songs I've ever heard, if not the most. I can't believe a piece
| of music written a few hundred years ago still sounds so modern
| and exciting and new, it's an incredible work.
|
| I urge everyone to listen to it, specifically the 3rd movement.
| It really shocks me that Beethoven or anyone could write a
| piece of music so brilliant like that!
| jasonjayr wrote:
| One of my favorite 'reinterpretations' of the piece is by
| Meganeko, link here:
|
| https://soundcloud.com/meganeko/beethoven-moonlight-
| sonata-3...
| anonu wrote:
| Totally agree with this. Moonlight Sonata one of my favorite
| pieces to play while I was growing up. I recall showing my
| piano teacher I wanted to play it - she was classically trained
| and taught very advanced pianists (I was not one of those) -
| and I remember her just rolling her eyes. I kept playing it
| anyway in my free time...
| omoikane wrote:
| Moonlight Sonata is a great choice, the arpeggios makes the
| song quite recognizable.
|
| (I don't play the piano but have learned the guitar version of
| Moonlight Sonata, and it looks very much like this version.)
| vixen99 wrote:
| Not a bad idea for the first and maybe the second movement. The
| third is definitely for advanced students. Nevertheless if you
| have command of a few basic keyboard skills, learning to play a
| passage or two from a really advanced piece can be advantageous
| for later work though few teachers will recommend it. Let's go
| for the ultimate but assume you're not actually taking lessons!
|
| How about Ravel's Gaspard de la Nuit? Certainly one of the most
| difficult pieces ever written. It's quite possible to work
| productively on the first page of 'Ondine' and as with the
| Moonlight sonata, it's exhilarating to hear yourself play that
| exquisite tune - distilled as it were, into its essence. Plenty
| of other possibilities such as passages from Mozart piano
| concertos. A bonus is that one's appreciation of great artists
| becomes much enhanced.
| khazhoux wrote:
| Moonlight Sonata is a good example of how you can be "brain-
| limited" in learning a piece, rather than limited by technique
| and finger dexterity.
|
| Moonlight is very easy on the fingers. But the constant
| variations are a challenge for people with poor memorization
| and slow recall like myself. You hit an F# instead of G# on the
| third repeat of a pattern and it's all over.
| yawnxyz wrote:
| I agree! This really gives a taste of the feeling of playing
| moonlight for real on the piano.
|
| I also realized there are some notes I might have been playing
| wrong for many years (oops)
| hammock wrote:
| Moonlight sonata was hard for me, still is... because I only
| ever became fluent up to three sharps and three flats key
| signatures. And moonlight is in a key that is 4 sharps. Makes
| it very hard to fumble through
| acjohnson55 wrote:
| For me, my brain kind of locks in to the key signature
| eventually. It might be worth practicing scales and simple
| chord progressions in each key to try to imprint it in your
| brain. I found keys with lots of sharps and flats
| intimidating for a long time, too.
| tshaddox wrote:
| That's interesting. I suppose I was lucky, because I started
| as a kid with traditional piano lessons but lost interest
| around age 12, but my interest in piano was rekindled when I
| discovered the guitar and was introduced to the idea of
| playing by ear. I got back into piano by playing along with a
| lot of pop and rock songs, so E major has been a very
| comfortable key signature for me since it's such a great
| guitar key signature.
| dmoy wrote:
| Ease of playing the piece vs ease of sight reading the music
| is different though
|
| 5 flats is easier to play mechanically, imo, because hitting
| black keys is often easier
| hammock wrote:
| True. I never found it difficult to play aside from sight
| reading the key signature
|
| A lot of classical music is this way to be honest, there is
| a lot of formulaic composition (I don't mean that
| derogatory at all) and once you get the patterns it's easy
| to extend, maybe even play it like a fake book.
|
| I recall a lot of what we know was originally something
| closer to figured bass in the first place and later fully
| arranged by someone who wasn't the original composer. Or,
| take a look at Mozart Requiem for example, only a small
| percent of which was actually manuscribed by the man
| himself.
| acjohnson55 wrote:
| One thing to think about, if you're in common practice
| music, most of the accidentals will be there for a
| specific reason (e.g. chromatic grace notes, applied
| dominants, harmonic or melodic minor, parallel key
| borrowing, augmented sixth chord). Music theory classes
| can help understand these if you're not familiar. But the
| thing to know is whether the particular reason involves
| raising or lowering the natural note in the scale.
|
| One thing that frustrates me about music notation is that
| when you have a key signature with lots of flats or
| sharps, it's hard for me to tell at a glance what the
| accidental is doing relative to the key signature. I've
| gotta look back and remember what was the unmodified
| note.
| tuzemec wrote:
| When I started taking piano lesions a few years ago, one of the
| first rules that my teacher established was: "No Moonlight
| Sonata" -\\_(tsu)_/-
|
| My guess is that it resembles in a way playing "Smoke on the
| water" in a guitar shop.
| coldtea wrote:
| Smoke on the water is great starter song - and given that
| amateurs and new players are a large part of people buying
| guitars, makes sense as a guitar shop song too!
| krumpet wrote:
| Agreed! And a skilled teacher would start by teaching Smoke
| on the Water with dyads (two-note chords) and then use that
| as a starting point for two discussions. First, one about
| barre chords and second, one about the same chords in their
| open format.
|
| If the student is into classic rock, it's easy to expand
| this lesson into Cat Scratch Fever, Rock You Like a
| Hurricane, and Iron Man which are all similar to Smoke on
| the Water.
| volkk wrote:
| that's sad. a yearning musician should be able to learn and
| play whatever they want and whatever makes them feel a
| certain thing. moonlight sonata evokes something in me i
| can't explain (which is probably why it's a legendary piece).
| having strong opinions on what to play when learning feels so
| gatekeepy. i would have dropped that teacher quickly
| partdavid wrote:
| Actually, teachers are human beings and they're allowed to
| have preferences, likes and dislikes. It's okay that not
| every teacher is for every student 100% of the time.
| Something can be a bad student/teacher fit without it being
| a negative value judgment ("sad", "gatekeeping", "drop").
| volkk wrote:
| teachers are held to a higher standard because their
| responsibility is a lot higher than the average citizen,
| so while theyre fully allowed to do whatever they want
| and have preferences -- i won't hold them to a standard
| that i do an average person. they need to above all have
| the highest patience and the least amount of gatekeeping,
| full stop.
| mikepurvis wrote:
| My kids just started piano lessons last night and
| definitely I was a little unsure to hear one of them
| starting out with I Like Coffee ("the knuckle song"), but I
| quickly went through this same thought process myself: it's
| great they're off to a good start doing something that is
| fun and exciting for them.
| erikpukinskis wrote:
| Yes, but a teacher I think has the right to decide that
| after teaching the same song 500 times they never want to
| hear it again.
|
| I think people can be allowed one song they are tired of.
| thih9 wrote:
| I'd guess the reason would be different, I think that a
| person that gets bothered by music repetition would not
| work as a music teacher.
|
| You might avoid moonlight sonta, but then it's 500
| servings of fur elise.
| partdavid wrote:
| Or they've learned through their experience they simply
| don't like the kind of person who insists on learning the
| one song they like, and can't teach them well, so it's a
| good filter.
|
| But hey, not every teacher is for every student and vice-
| versa; and that's okay.
| volkk wrote:
| a major rule should instead be: "choose the song you love
| and let's learn it" -- tells me a lot more about the kind
| of teaching they do than off the bat shooting down songs.
| sounds obnoxious. teachers can do whatever they want ofc.
| doesn't make them good teachers
| Hadriel wrote:
| Naw, the priority is the student not the teacher
| tshaddox wrote:
| Smoke on the Water in a guitar shop is annoying simply
| because people playing loudly in guitar shops are annoying
| and that's one of the most widespread stereotypes of
| something an annoying person would play loudly at a guitar
| shop (incidentally, I'd argue that Stairway to Heaven is the
| more widespread stereotype).
|
| A guitar instructor shouldn't criticize a beginner student
| for wanting to learn Smoke on the Water, at least assuming
| it's in the instructor's wheelhouse--it's also okay for a
| particular instructor to offer a specific curriculum rather
| than taking requests from the student.
| thecosas wrote:
| Wonderwall :-)
| nathanaldensr wrote:
| Stairway to Heaven, a la Wayne's World.
| hotnfresh wrote:
| No Stairway? Denied!
| chileRick wrote:
| There's a Highway to Hell
| j7ake wrote:
| I had a similar teacher, but it was no fur elise
| ksenzee wrote:
| I started piano lessons at age 5, I've taught piano, and I
| still arrange music and accompany professionally from time to
| time, so I'm a fairly snobbish classically trained pianist,
| and it is my considered opinion that that is a lovely piece
| of music and every pianist should play it any time they want.
| If you teach, and you don't like the Moonlight Sonata, you
| should hold your nose and teach it anyway.
| gnulinux wrote:
| A lot of music teachers are like that. I personally consider
| it shitty. My friend's first violin teacher (when she was 10
| years old) made her do empty string bowing for a year. Just
| pull and push bowing. Now, don't get me wrong, technique is
| extremely important, and a lot of teachers have "if you can't
| do it well, don't do it" mentality. But really these people
| miss music is also tons of fucking fun. For a 10 year old
| infant, you really need a better curriculum to motivate her
| than just perfecting empty bowing.
|
| I tell people: you wanna play Rachmaninoff's Piano Concerto?
| Go fucking play it. I mean you're not gonna play it well,
| even some world-class pianists can't, but if it gives you
| pleasure to try, and motivates you to play piano, that's
| fine. If you're gonna be a professional pianist, or you're a
| student at university, it's an entirely different matter.
| Some people are just hobbyists, or they want to be composers
| and learn piano to help compose (which is an extremely
| important core skill for a composer). Those people can just
| sit down and play whatever they want, along with things that
| are at their level that they can perfectly play.
| noahtallen wrote:
| I give the Moonlight Sonata credit for me becoming a decent
| pianist. It was above my level when I was a kid, but I
| wanted to learn it, and my teacher encouraged that. With
| enough practice on a piece that was so far above my current
| ability, I _seriously_ leveled up as a pianist.
|
| My teacher's ability to help me learn what I wanted to
| learn made me so invested in piano as a kid. Many kids
| don't stick with music because (IMO) they can't find a way
| to enjoy it or be invested in it. For me, what I enjoyed
| happened to be Beethoven, but at other times I just wanted
| to improvise various modern songs. (Which can be as simple
| or as complex as you want, but a lot of classically trained
| teachers can't/won't/don't teach improvisation.)
|
| Technique and theory only get you so far. Being able to
| emotionally invest in your playing is what sets musicians
| apart, imo. And as you're growing as a musician (even when
| you're a kid), you're going to sound like shit if you just
| try to monotonously follow the instructions. I'm not sure
| enough music teachers get the importance of being
| personally and emotionally invested in the moment as you're
| playing. (One-buttock playing is a good word for this:
| https://youtu.be/r9LCwI5iErE)
|
| The choice of what you want to play is pretty important in
| keeping you invested.
| gnulinux wrote:
| This hits the nail. I agree that there are tons of music
| teachers, especially classically trained teachers who are
| like this. They can't/won't/don't teach improvising,
| composing, encourage you to develop your personal style,
| ask you to bring your favorite pieces to play, teach you
| musicianship etc... My own violin teacher taught me
| _nothing_ other than playing Bach et al. I did pass all
| those ABRSM violin exams, so people would call me a
| "good" violinist but I had absolutely zero idea when it
| comes to ear training, interval training, composing,
| improvising, listening to music, rhythmic training,
| notation, music theory etc. Nothing. Now as an adult, I'm
| composing, writing my own pieces I like that other
| musicians play, and I'm only now realizing how incredibly
| shitty my music education was. They made me a robot. I
| didn't learn any music, I just learned how to correctly
| move the bow.
| blowski wrote:
| This happened to my sister. She was having fun playing
| Disney and ABBA songs, then changed to a different teacher
| who discouraged her from playing anything but classical.
| She quit playing within a year and now refuses even to play
| her favourites.
| vidarh wrote:
| My guess is that reason is that Moonlight Sonata is not
| _hard_ to learn, just _tedious_ to teach a beginner, because
| of the endless repetition of relatively short phrases
| shifting and changing a little bit at a time.
|
| This is what makes it fantastic, but learning to play it is
| mostly learning a few phrases and recognizing the shifts,
| which I can imagine would drive your teacher nuts until
| you're at a stage where you can pick up the changes rapidly
| enough sight reading to not have to remember every
| transition.
|
| I'd guess - as a very mediocre piano player - that it's as a
| result low "bang for the buck" for a beginner on top of
| annoying to your teacher.
|
| Upside is once you get even just relatively mediocre at sight
| reading it's fairly simple to work your way through yourself.
| denotational wrote:
| Whilst the first movement is fairly technically
| straightforward, the last movement is pretty tricky and
| requires solid technique; I certainly wouldn't characterise
| it as "easy" even if it's not the hardest piece in the
| repertoire.
|
| If anything, the issue is that as a whole, the piece is
| fairly technically demanding, but the first movement is
| simply enough for most intermediate pianists to sight-read,
| so something that seems approachable soon becomes
| impossible for anyone below a certain level.
| vidarh wrote:
| I can buy that it's technically demanding to do the last
| movement _well_ , in the correct tempo, but learning it
| to a standard a relative beginner will be happy to
| achieve was not hard for me. But that may well be another
| distinction that makes it frustrating for a teacher to
| try to teach to a beginner, because, yes, it will likely
| be noticeably flawed.
| krumpet wrote:
| Nobody should work with a pompous instructor who decides what
| is / isn't acceptable on an instrument. As a former guitar
| teacher, I would help my students learn whatever they wanted
| - Van Halen, Brittany Spears, Garth Brooks, whatever.
|
| All music has something of merit if you're willing to look
| for it.
| ilyt wrote:
| I mean I agree with you but I also understand not wanting
| to do the same fucking song done badly for millionth time.
| organsnyder wrote:
| > I also understand not wanting to do the same fucking
| song done badly for millionth time
|
| My wife is a piano teacher. This describes a large part
| of her job, especially since she focuses on beginners.
| She'd be so happy if she could teach "Moonlight Sonata"
| all day. "Old Macdonald" is much more common.
|
| My wife does feel looked-down-upon by some in her
| profession who see teaching advanced students as more
| prestigious. But the process of taking a student from
| beginner to Beethoven (not that she stops there with her
| students) is every bit as challenging as taking a student
| from Beethoven to Rachmaninoff.
| bborud wrote:
| I can't understand why someone would look down on people
| teaching beginners. If you teach beginners you play
| perhaps the most critical role in someone's development.
| For one, it is the stage where someone is going to decide
| if this is something they enjoy, and want to carry on
| doing, or not. Second, you are taking someone from
| nothing to something. That's a huge step.
| Moru wrote:
| We as a society need to step down our high horses. All
| jobs have a purpose without which our society would not
| be what it is today, good or bad.
| matsemann wrote:
| I remember someone many years arguing in the media that
| we shouldn't have the best coaches for the national
| soccer team. We should have the best coaches for our
| kids, and in a few years that would pay off tremendously.
| While I don't know how to do that in practice, that
| upside-down thinking kinda struck a cord with me. We
| should do that with more things.
| krumpet wrote:
| You're spot on.
|
| My wife is a middle school mathematics teacher (and a
| damn good one). Sooooo many former students (now high
| schoolers) have approached her and said, "Because of you,
| I excelled in math in high school...and I love it!"
|
| She had a student last year who actually told her in a
| very long letter, "You taught me that math matters. You
| taught me that I MATTER."
|
| The earliest teachers / coaches / mentors set the
| foundation which is absolutely critical for all future
| learning.
|
| Want to experience the highest of highs? Become a
| teacher. Alas, being do close to kids who are changing so
| rapidly (and often struggling with things outside of
| school) it also comes with some pretty deep lows.
| acjohnson55 wrote:
| I was a teacher and the enormity of the highs and lows is
| spot on. It's not a job for the faint hearted.
| vidarh wrote:
| I think it's more it's probably not a very effective piece
| to learn with. You can learn a few techniques from your
| teacher and then it's just practicing the variations and
| transitions, because it repeats roughly the same changes
| over and over. Learning the piece during your lessons is
| likely a waste.
| sdenton4 wrote:
| I have bad news concerning pop music.
| vidarh wrote:
| Very little pop music is as repetitive as the moonlight
| sonata. In that respect it is more closely related to
| trance than pop. Most pop music is also shorter, and an
| easier mix of even shorter movements.
|
| In other words, most of it will be over a lot sooner for
| the poor, suffering teacher.
| [deleted]
| black_puppydog wrote:
| Not sure that was the goal, but the text accompanying the first
| run makes it seem like I'm supposed to get the rhythm exactly
| in the spacing indicated on paper/screen.
|
| But one thing I love about the moonlight sonata is exactly how
| amazing one can play with the spacing of the notes. So yeah, I
| had a lot of fun with this but I'm not sure it's the best
| choice of piece. :P
| sandgiant wrote:
| Indeed! I think this is what makes this so fun. I can also
| highly recommend listening to various recordings of the
| moonlight sonata and notice how different it is depending on
| the precise timing the pianist uses.
| adrianmonk wrote:
| What you're talking about is called playing rubato
| (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tempo_rubato), and I think
| that is part of the point here. The control that you get over
| the timing allows you to express yourself musically / perform
| the music with your own interpretation.
|
| The instructions may be a bit unclear, but I think they are
| suggesting that it works better artistically if you play some
| parts evenly (the three-note sequences that repeat) and add
| your timing variations to the other parts. This creates a
| kind of a baseline of regularity that makes the variations
| stand out by contrast. (It also gives the feeling that you're
| capable of even, steady timing and the timing variations you
| do incorporate are there on purpose.)
| mccoyc wrote:
| The first movement is one of the only pieces I can play on the
| piano. Yes indeed, anyone can learn it! I came from a musical
| family, but never really put the effort into learning the
| piano.
|
| I'm not sure where I heard this, but Beethoven wrote this for
| one of his students that he was in love with. The first
| movement was purposefully written for a newcomer to be able to
| play--such as for whom he admired, but the third movement was a
| representation of his anger over being rejected, and is one of
| the hardest piano pieces to play.
| electroly wrote:
| That story is about Fur Elise, not Moonlight Sonata. The
| name, of course, meaning "for Elise," the name of the woman
| in question.
| jimbob45 wrote:
| The 3rd movement is not one of the hardest pieces to play.
| It's like medium-hard. It's not even the hardest sonata -
| that would be the Hammerklavier.
| chopin wrote:
| If one wants to play a well-known sonata I'd rather start
| with the Tempest. Considerably easier than Moonlights 3rd.
| And as beautiful imho, the 3rd movement especially.
| globular-toast wrote:
| I can't not cringe slightly when someone calls something like
| Moonlight Sonata a "song".
| johtso wrote:
| Reading back my comment now, I know what you mean! I guess
| "piece" would have been a better word, or even just "music".
| globular-toast wrote:
| Yeah, just music. I have heard people use song to mean any
| music before, though, so it's probably something I have to
| deal with. I do like some songs but 90% of the music I
| listen to is comprised of either tracks/records (electronic
| music) or pieces (classical).
| PM_me_your_math wrote:
| You're right. It is amazing.
| grondilu wrote:
| I would love to watch someone who's never heard Beethoven's
| moonlight sonata try this.
| dceddia wrote:
| Oh man! Thank you for posting this. I saw this here on HN _years_
| ago and loved it, and then could never find it again. Judging by
| the YouTube videos linked from the page, it looks like 8 years
| ago?! I got chills playing through it. Awesome to see that it 's
| still up on the internet after all those years.
|
| It's interesting to compare the comments here to the original
| launch 8 years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9490372
|
| And the Reddit post from the same time:
| https://old.reddit.com/r/InternetIsBeautiful/comments/34vcmz...
| dang wrote:
| Thanks! Macroexpanded:
|
| _Touch Pianist - Tap in Rhythm and Perform Your Favourite
| Music_ - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9490372 - May
| 2015 (100 comments)
| quakeguy wrote:
| Wow!
| vermes22 wrote:
| Clicked on the link to see the post's year and quite surprised
| that 8 years ago was actually 2015 and not 2005 as my system 1
| (Kahneman) memory imagined at first!!!
| j7ake wrote:
| If there was a way to adjust volume based on force that would be
| a game changer.
| pstorm wrote:
| The higher on the screen you play, the more velocity!
| saaaaaam wrote:
| As my piano teacher used to say, "what did the piano do to you to
| make you hit it quite so hard?" This is known as the "Moonlight"
| sonata not the "thunder and timpani" sonata.
|
| It's a great demo but the dynamic range of your piano robot is
| horrible.
|
| Oh! Can I adjust the dynamics based on where I touch? I take it
| back! Bad workman blames his tools etc.
| thruway516 wrote:
| "Thunder and Timpani sonata" sounds like it would be a
| fantastic piece especially if written by Beethoven
| qwertymon wrote:
| [flagged]
| Hadriel wrote:
| i cant change the music? clicking isnt working
| Calamitous wrote:
| I had to switch to Safari for the menus to work correctly.
| fdgjgbdfhgb wrote:
| Wow, this really puts in to perspective how hard the Appassionata
| is - I could barely keep up with the tempo doing the trills with
| one hand, I can't even imagine actually playing it. One day maybe
| :^D
| jacquesm wrote:
| Once upon a time I realized that Bach had invented macro
| expansion. The occasion was me trying to figure out why Partita
| 1 doesn't sound at all the way the notes are written, and what
| is that little wavy thing over the notes? It turns out that
| that little ornament expands into an 8 note sequence centered
| on the note written. Not that there weren't plenty of notes
| already on that page...
|
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9etK1RuN2jc
|
| 42 seconds in.
| quafan wrote:
| [flagged]
| lostNFound wrote:
| Sad to see author abandoned it. Last iOS update 8 years ago. Not
| working in current iOS.
| darkerside wrote:
| As someone who paid many of these Beethoven sonatas growing up, I
| love this. It's like guitar hero! You get to not worry about a
| whole class of things and just focus on your timing and dynamics.
|
| It would be really cool to be able to work voicing in, but I
| can't think of a way short of another piano!
|
| Random question, but... why is everyone in this thread referring
| to volume as velocity?? I feel like I'm taking crazy pills.
| sthatipamala wrote:
| I think that's the term used for synth music
| turtlebits wrote:
| More pieces and menu "button" don't work for me on Chrome.
|
| It'd be nice to see actual note lengths and rests so the user can
| learn how to read actual notation, maybe as an alternate view.
| Popeyes wrote:
| Quite entertaining it as the volume knob on my keyboard counted
| as an interaction.
| CapsAdmin wrote:
| I thought it was very interesting how something so simple was
| able to make me zone in. Even though I can only control the rythm
| and velocity, it really _felt_ as if I was playing somehow.
| dddddaviddddd wrote:
| I love that they have the Bach Partita -- I used to listed to
| this piece on repeat https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vuPr9m98XQQ
| Knowing the melody makes it a lot easier to 'play' in this app.
| qwertymon wrote:
| [flagged]
| dwighttk wrote:
| Weird lag on my iPhone...maybe Bluetooth headphones are to blame?
| bestest wrote:
| quite probably. had the same issue on osx safari desktop with
| bluetooth speakers.
| oerpli wrote:
| If one were really great with this - would it be possible to
| reproduce both the Richter and the Gould version of the WTC 1
| Prelude in C Major (except maybe some flourishes)?
|
| For reference, the first few minutes of these links:
|
| - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1osi_pQcUdM -
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pjnKuhcfB6U
| verelo wrote:
| Prelude in C is what i went to try look for before hitting the
| upgrade screen!
|
| Agreed, that piece changes so much with tempo, i was excited to
| play with it.
| Nezteb wrote:
| I wanted to see how fast I could play the entire song:
|
| const interval = setInterval(() => document.getElementById('pixi-
| canvas').dispatchEvent(new MouseEvent("mousedown", {bubbles:
| true})), 0);
| alana314 wrote:
| rip headphone users :D
| tiborsaas wrote:
| Thank you for this snippet, it inspired me to play to add some
| randomish groove :) function play(i) {
| document.getElementById('pixi-canvas').dispatchEvent(new
| MouseEvent("mousedown", {bubbles: true})); const
| wave1 = Math.sin(i); const wave2 = Math.sin(i * 8);
| const mod = ((1 + wave1 * wave2 * wave2) * .5) * 350;
| delay = 150 + mod; i += 0.01;
| setTimeout(() => { play(i); //
| console.log(delay); }, delay); };
| play(Math.PI);
|
| Here's the wave: https://www.desmos.com/calculator/aqs7thumdm
| drukqs wrote:
| As a professional pianist that's spent the past couple of years
| obsessing over questions of tempo, breath, phrasing, movement and
| musicality, this app really tickles my fancy.
|
| Some casual observations:
|
| - As someone who has delved a little in DAWs and working with
| MIDI, one thing that struck me is when controlling velocity with
| on a physical, linear scale, exactly how _little_ extra velocity
| is needed to voice a melody properly. For example, playing
| Moonlight on my phone, I play the opening notes as quietly as
| possible and voice the melody by playing a few bare
| "millimetres" more to voice it.
|
| - It has really forced me to know the music in a different
| fashion, as a single, additive rhythm as opposed two hands with
| two independent rhythms. For example, the first few bars when the
| melody enters in Moonlight sonata: I wasn't sure if I keep the
| fidelity of the dotted-eighth rhythms verses the triple eighths,
| or if I turn it into essential a sextuplet.
|
| - I found that some quicker figures, such as the opening of
| Mozart's "Alla turca" are best achieved by using the actual
| fingering I would use in the original. At a certain speed, in
| order to achieve the rhythmic precision required, I had to use
| piano technique.... on my phone screen.
| ctenb wrote:
| Very fun. Though nothing seems to work in Chrome except for the
| tutorial piece.
| Raed667 wrote:
| I found it ironic that the app recommends chrome, while track
| selection only worked in Firefox for me.
| yankput wrote:
| The site is from 2015.
| rockdoe wrote:
| There's no reason sites from 2000 would no longer work,
| unless they use APIs that weren't properly standardized.
|
| I guess that's why it recommends Chrome. Hah.
| ctenb wrote:
| Same indeed
| franky47 wrote:
| I love how tapping an irregular rhythm (eg xx-xx-x-) gives
| Beethoven a progressive metal vibe.
| tgv wrote:
| Or hitting four keys at the same time in a waltz rhythm (so a
| "one" that's slightly longer that two and three). I couldn't
| make this piece sound funky, though, probably because of the
| triplets that all move in the same direction. But try Rach's Op
| 39, no 6. You can play it like salsa/son.
| mpsprd wrote:
| Funnily enough, I found gymnopedie #1 harder to play, even if I
| actually already played on the piano. Its like if muscle memory
| of actual piano was fighting it.
| cloogshicer wrote:
| Does anyone know how this does the playback in the browser?
|
| Is it WebAudio?
|
| I tried to reverse engineer it but couldn't figure it out.
| thruway516 wrote:
| Creator has a nice writeup here:
| https://earslap.com/article/the-browser-sound-engine-behind-...
| 0x445442 wrote:
| Piano Hero with one thumb, I like it!
| thatxliner wrote:
| It's kind of funny how trills work in here.
| julianeon wrote:
| App idea inspired by this that I'd like to see:
|
| Something like this, that has a big library of songs, where you
| specify the delay between notes and the speed at which it is
| played (ideally w/all notes displayed so it can be really really
| customized).
| btbuildem wrote:
| Very pretty.
|
| But. Have you tried pronouncing the name of the website out loud?
| sidechaining wrote:
| I don't get it?
| magic123_ wrote:
| Love it! It could be even more awesome if the velocity of each
| key press had an impact of the volume, that way we could control
| two properties at once.
| dietketchup wrote:
| Velocity is controlled by where you tap the screen (vertically)
| magic123_ wrote:
| Ah yes indeed, but I don't think it can be controlled if
| you're using a physical keyboard. For instance if I play
| using the keypad on my keyboard, 1 could be pianissimo and 9
| fortissimo.
| glonq wrote:
| I installed this on my phone and have never had so much fun with
| a 6-inch pianist.
| norsurfit wrote:
| And my mom said I'd never learn piano without practicing!
| glitchc wrote:
| Nah, it's no good. Especially with the Moonlight Sonata. Each
| chord in a bar requires both left and right hand notes. I try to
| press a key with each hand, but that counts as two keystrokes,
| whereas it should only count for one. It teaches the wrong muscle
| memory, definitely some work needed around chords.
| x0n wrote:
| You is doing it wrong. This game is not about chords, it's
| about tempo.
| glitchc wrote:
| Unfortunately it doesn't feel like a game. It's a bit too
| close to the real thing. The multiple dots often beg for a
| multi-finger press. If it's really meant to be a tempo game,
| why not show one dot, chord or otherwise?
| thruway516 wrote:
| Wow! Thankyou very much! That was beautiful. New and genuinely
| good ideas are truly rare and I feel you've possibly discovered
| something here. I can just imagine the possibilities if one could
| also somehow vary the dynamics as well just with touch. Alas
| force-touch screens are probably not coming soon to consumer
| cellphones soon but now I can visualize a good reason for them.
| Edit- apparently this was from 8 years ago. The app does not
| appear to work on my modern iphone 2nd edit- it looks like I can
| vary loudness or softness depending on where I tap on my phone,
| at least on the website 3rd edit: Having way too much fun just
| playing the moonlight sonata at different tempi with different
| loud and soft passages. Tapping as fast as I can with 2 fingers
| is a new revelation of this piece!
| A_Duck wrote:
| Beware that at least on my iPhone 14 the app doesn't work -- no
| visuals, which makes it impossible to use properly
|
| That aside, this is an amazing idea. Would happily pay for a
| working version
| SubiculumCode wrote:
| One thing I noticed about this piece is that the one thing that
| kills its spirit is too steady of a tempo...
|
| it is actually quite amenable to an extremely loose
| interpretation of tempo, with swings of 300% in the pace feeling
| both natural and moving
|
| ....like the tempest of the storm...sometimes racing, sometimes
| deliberate. Try it here by listening t the mood of the music and
| clicking faster or slower...its quite amazing.
| Loodvigvanbtovn wrote:
| [flagged]
| greatNespresso wrote:
| Love it! No tutorial needed, works on mobile, relaxing
| yafbum wrote:
| Pretty cool... the third movement of that piece would be...
| something else!
| Kaibeezy wrote:
| Model M piano is clicky
| Elias-Braun wrote:
| Made my day : D
| danpalmer wrote:
| I'm not sure I get it. On desktop I just click to play the next
| beat? On mobile there's no audio (in Safari or Chrome). And the
| track selection appears to be broken?
|
| Have I missed something? What's the pull here?
| dceddia wrote:
| It doesn't make sounds on my mobile Chrome either (iOS) but
| I've noticed other sites don't either. I'm guessing there's a
| setting somewhere that I denied once long ago and now it can't
| play sounds :/ If anyone knows what that might be please let me
| know!
| Matticus_Rex wrote:
| Is your phone on silent?
| dceddia wrote:
| Hahah yes, yes it was.
| krumpet wrote:
| Honestly, I don't understand what the pull is either. This is
| just cow clicker for music. I appreciate the design and
| interactivity, which is nice, but maybe because I'm a
| musician, I don't understand what is fun about this.
| Ylpertnodi wrote:
| Try speeding it up and slowing it down: it's not guitar
| hero.
|
| Took me a few seconds.
|
| Also, on mobile you can mega-tap.
| cdfuller wrote:
| I had to switch off silent mode on iPhone for audio to work.
| Any chance it's the same issue for you?
| danpalmer wrote:
| Bingo! Thank you. Turning off silent mode and refreshing the
| page fixed it.
|
| That's very strange though, I wonder if it uses a weird sort
| of web calling API or something for the audio. I've never had
| an issue with audio in web pages before, and even the youtube
| video the page embeds sounds fine. It seems quite poor UX (of
| Safari? Chrome?) to require turning off silent mode - many
| people never turn it off so it's not very discoverable, and
| then forgetting to turn it back on again could be pretty bad.
| tantalor wrote:
| You're confused why a feature called "silent mode" would
| make your phone not make sound?
| jamie_ca wrote:
| iOS has changed over time, such that silent mode affects
| notification and interaction sounds but not multimedia -
| I can still listen to music or watch videos regardless of
| whether the phone is on silent or not.
| organsnyder wrote:
| "Silent mode" is not the same as "mute". With the former
| you still expect to hear sound if you're using a function
| where sound is critical.
| adrianh wrote:
| You are not alone! It's indeed very bad UX on the part of
| Apple.
|
| I run a website with music education tools and we had to
| make a dedicated help page for this particular annoyance:
|
| https://www.soundslice.com/help/en/player/troubleshooting/2
| 3...
| intrasight wrote:
| I had audio in Safari. But it didn't start right away.
| danpalmer wrote:
| How long does it take to start? I've given it a few minutes
| and still nothing. I'm on fast stable wifi and the audio
| worked immediately on a desktop on the same wifi so I can't
| imagine it's having trouble downloading the samples.
| intrasight wrote:
| Safari iOS - started in after perhaps 8 taps
| grav wrote:
| Nice idea. I'm really missing a way to contol the dynamics. Maybe
| just mapping 1-9 keys to a velocity scaling?
| gnrlst wrote:
| On touchscreen vertical height of the touch is mapped to
| velocity - really nifty
| theoperagoer wrote:
| This is so cool. I'm a huge classical music fan.
|
| I wish you could distinguish between "right" and "left" hand
| keypresses to control each line separately
| david927 wrote:
| yes! This was my request as well.
|
| And maybe a "learn" mode where you can see the original timing
| or the timing of a famous interpretation, like ghosts in video
| games.
|
| Love it! Thanks so much for doing this.
| Ylpertnodi wrote:
| Magic! Using velocity for accents, tapping out odd-time
| signatures on a regular piece is so much fun! #Zappafan
| bowsamic wrote:
| I don't really get it
| tomelders wrote:
| In music, the performer can either perform the music as
| written, or they can inject emotion into the piece by changing
| the velocity and timing of the notes. This app lets you inject
| the emotion through timing, even though you don't actually know
| how to play piano.
|
| It also lets you focus entirely on the "feel" of the piece.
|
| I found it really fun.
| kaichanvong wrote:
| such a Great choice of song, especially since plugging round the
| ears any headphone, earphones to help the player's enjoyment. How
| they push it out into MIDI is beyond...
| joshspankit wrote:
| I immediately got OG iOS app vibes and wanted it on my iPad..
|
| But the reviews...
|
| There are _ads_ on top of in-app purchases?
|
| And the fact that there are _songs_ for $0.99 (which let's be
| honest are probably sourced from freely-available MIDI files and
| plugged in to the already-made engine).
|
| I'm going to heartbrokenly stick to the web version.
| lysp wrote:
| That was a lot of fun. I know the first movement off by heart so
| that was fairly easy.
|
| Third movement was much more fun - trying to get some of the
| timing on that was pretty tricky. Had to alternate between 2
| fingers and then throw in the 3rd one for some of the trills.
| j7ake wrote:
| This is like the piano version of hacker typer.
|
| https://hackertyper.com/
| 7thaccount wrote:
| What's the first song? Beethoven's what symphony?
| maxweylandt wrote:
| https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piano_Sonata_No._14_(Beethov...
| hackton wrote:
| Beethoven Sonata No. 14 "Moonlight"
| philbarr wrote:
| Let's hope it doesn't have the third movement in it or else
| we'll be needing new keyboards.
| nyanpasu64 wrote:
| It does have the third movement. I tried it for shits and
| giggles:
|
| - Playing fast sections of a song is like mashing through a
| cutscene, but it's easier to press quickly (not sure at a
| consistent pace) with multiple fingers. The original piano
| music was meant for multiple fingers as well.
|
| - The hardest part is advancing the right number of
| buttons. I don't even know the right number of notes in the
| trills, and would kinda prefer if the website automatically
| advanced through trills finer than a 16th note, so it's
| less likely to end up desynced with the actual piece (I'm
| not sure if you get used to it with learning each piece or
| not).
|
| - The website has noticeable audio latency, which makes it
| hard to associate keypresses and which sound came out in
| fast sections.
| amiga386 wrote:
| I tried out Rondo alla turca, and it's almost like a puzzle,
| because it's mixing left and right hand into one stream, and if
| you were used to doing those two separately, you're going to futz
| it
| jdjdjdjdjduuuu wrote:
| [flagged]
| [deleted]
| scop wrote:
| I love this, especially for Bach's counterpoint. To be able to go
| through pieces I know at a speed I dictate, giving myself however
| long I want to "hear" the chords in their relation to the
| previous chords, is just magic.
| pluc wrote:
| [flagged]
| clouddrover wrote:
| It's quite similar to this one:
|
| https://sunebear.github.io/Piano-Flow/#/pieces
| totetsu wrote:
| That one seems to be counting finger touch down and lift off as
| a click on ios
| dobladov wrote:
| Another one similar:
| https://artsandculture.google.com/experiment/nAEJVwNkp-FnrQ
| blazebegin1 wrote:
| [dead]
| petermcneeley wrote:
| Same energy: https://hackertyper.net/
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