[HN Gopher] Ford 021C Concept Car (1999)
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       Ford 021C Concept Car (1999)
        
       Author : spking
       Score  : 74 points
       Date   : 2023-09-05 11:30 UTC (1 days ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (marc-newson.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (marc-newson.com)
        
       | ComputerGuru wrote:
       | Reminds me of the Nissan Pivo EV concept from 2005:
       | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nissan_Pivo
        
       | heyflyguy wrote:
       | I wonder how much this was influenced by Apple and iMacs of the
       | age
        
         | bee_rider wrote:
         | I wonder, had Wes Anderson established his aesthetic by 1999?
         | Because this would fit right in.
        
         | fidotron wrote:
         | There was a short lived 1950s retro revival around 1999 and
         | this looks totally in line with that.
        
         | agloe_dreams wrote:
         | Well...the designer of it also designed a minor product Apple
         | built later on called the 'Apple Watch'.
        
           | carabiner wrote:
           | Apple what? Never heard of it.
        
         | EL_Loco wrote:
         | First thing I thought when I looked at the pictures: "Looks
         | like the first iBook" The "clamshell" iBook was launched in
         | 1999, and the orange one looks like if this car was a laptop.
        
       | mk_stjames wrote:
       | This image gallery desperately needs a one-line addition of
       | something like                 >
       | imageElement.addEventListener('click', stopAutoScroll);
       | 
       | I get autoscrolling a gallery of images, but if I click on one or
       | click on some buttons, please stop! I want to look at one
       | specific image for longer than 3 seconds! If I go back manually
       | to look at one, don't override me and go forward again 3 seconds
       | later. I went back for a reason.
       | 
       | I see some irony in a designer who has a webpage that hasn't
       | fully thought out the UX. Maybe irony isn't the right word since
       | it's pretty par for the course.
        
         | [deleted]
        
       | lacoolj wrote:
       | This is what I would expect to find in the dictionary under the
       | words "nifty", "spiffy" and "cute".
       | 
       | I would totally buy one (cuz I would also expect it to cost under
       | $15k)
        
       | thecosas wrote:
       | Orange is a signature color of Ive and Newson.
        
         | shlubbert wrote:
         | The car is actually named after the color code for that
         | particular shade of orange -- Pantone 021 C!
        
       | bastardoperator wrote:
       | I'd roll it.
        
       | Aloha wrote:
       | It has real 1960 Falcon feels.
       | 
       | If it looks like a toy car, it is, it'd be virtually impossible
       | to fit that body onto a modern engineering package.
        
       | foobarian wrote:
       | Wow, look at all those buttons! Yes please :-)
        
       | ireallywantthat wrote:
       | So, Futuristic Design of 2023 is actually some old used design
       | from the past!
        
         | FridayoLeary wrote:
         | Car designers for a long time have been reduced to plundering
         | their back catalogues for inspiration. What they usually end up
         | with is some akward, bloated parody of the original with
         | elements that are impractical and come at the cost of common
         | sense. Just look at the entire "Mini" lineup.
        
       | aidenn0 wrote:
       | > The floor, which remains completely flat due to the front-
       | wheel-drive technology, ...
       | 
       | What about the exhaust? I always assumed that's what the bump in
       | the back-seat floor of all my FWD cars was for.
        
         | Domenic_S wrote:
         | Civic doesn't (didn't?) have a hump.
         | 
         | It's for:
         | 
         | 1. If the car is available in AWD, they don't have to make a
         | new floor pan
         | 
         | 2. Structural stiffness
         | 
         | 3. Exhaust/fuel routing
        
         | amacbride wrote:
         | The hump is typically housing the drive train in RWD or AWD
         | cars; the exhaust is relatively small and can be routed along a
         | flat floorpan.
        
       | nowooski wrote:
       | I'll take it.
        
       | jeffrallen wrote:
       | Shut up and take my money!
        
       | xwdv wrote:
       | I don't like this car, it's infantilizing. Feels like you're in a
       | Pixar movie driving this thing.
        
       | rolivercoffee wrote:
       | I remember really wanting this at the time. Amazing how jarring
       | the design of the radio is in comparison to the rest of the
       | interior. Also, interesting how they didn't think to design their
       | own entertainment system because... cars had third party
       | entertainment systems that's just the way it was!
        
         | majormajor wrote:
         | > Also, interesting how they didn't think to design their own
         | entertainment system because... cars had third party
         | entertainment systems that's just the way it was!
         | 
         | This was rarely true in 1999, at least in the US.
         | 
         | They often had ones that were standard DIN or double-DIN size,
         | but they were usually manufacturer-branded and styled with
         | buttons that matched the rest of the car.
         | 
         | But if you google image search a 1999 Ford Taurus interior
         | you'll see that not everyone was even then still sticking to
         | the easily-swappable standard. Compare to 1999 Camry, which had
         | standard size but came out of the factory with a Toyota-skinned
         | radio of one sort or another depending on options.
        
         | nobleach wrote:
         | In 1999 we still hadn't realized the wonder of reading mp3/wma
         | files burned onto a CD. Aiwa was the first brand I remember
         | opening that up. USB slots were next.
        
         | BucketsMcG wrote:
         | Actually at the time Ford's in-car entertainment was more
         | integrated than most. Unlike others, they fitted own-brand
         | audio systems which were either non-standard shapes and hard to
         | replace, or they were built in entirely. I think what we see
         | here's just an afterthought that got added late in the design
         | process.
        
         | dsr_ wrote:
         | Cars _should_ have third-party entertainment systems.
         | Everything about  'infotainment' systems is a terrible idea,
         | because integrating something that changes three to five times
         | in the life of the vehicle is stupid.
         | 
         | Put a nicely anchored 1/4-20 UNC mount in two or three
         | locations, put a USB port that speaks the standard audio
         | protocol next to each one, and connect those to an integrated
         | DSP/amplifier suitable for the car's speakers and microphones.
         | It will be good for three times the life of the car, and make
         | everyone's lives easier.
        
           | coldpie wrote:
           | Just use a 3.5mm jack. We solved this decades ago.
        
             | dontlaugh wrote:
             | Not quite, that doesn't allow integration with steering
             | wheel controls.
        
               | rdlw wrote:
               | Sure it does. Even headphones have controls built in to
               | the cable.
        
               | dontlaugh wrote:
               | That is not standardised across different headphone
               | manufacturers and often doesn't work. It doesn't work at
               | all on cars.
               | 
               | Analog protocols are not a good idea for this. Digital
               | with a decent protocol is much more reliable, whether
               | wired or not. In practice, the best option is either
               | wired CarPlay/Auto or bluetooth.
        
           | gregmac wrote:
           | > Cars should have third-party entertainment systems.
           | Everything about 'infotainment' systems is a terrible idea,
           | because integrating something that changes three to five
           | times in the life of the vehicle is stupid.
           | 
           | In my mind this has been largely solved for the past few
           | years with Android Auto / Carplay. It would be nice if there
           | was a true standard, but at the same time, there's only two
           | phone operating systems so it works.
           | 
           | If you're not familiar with it, there are some huge benefits
           | of the way it works:
           | 
           | * The system updates with your phone, not your car. Applies
           | to both hardware and software.
           | 
           | * Data plans are also tied to your phone, which you
           | presumably have anyway.
           | 
           | * Preferences are personal; my partner and I each get our own
           | music, podcasts, and suggested destinations.
           | 
           | * Personally I love that my music/podcasts follow me around.
           | I can browse and start listening to something in the car,
           | then hours later throw in my wireless ear buds and continue
           | from where I was while I mow the lawn.
           | 
           | There is also some level of upgradability from the car side,
           | too: I recently added a wireless android auto adapter to my
           | 2016 car. It was under $100, plugs into USB, and once I got
           | it paired to my phone, I basically get in and start the car
           | and in a few seconds the UI is there.
           | 
           | What I am skeptical about is that this will continue to be
           | solved for the next few years: there's always that chance
           | that Google will outright kill it, or Apple/Samsung/whoever
           | will become exclusive to a single car manufacturer, or the
           | manufacturers will somehow bungle this up with a subscription
           | model of some sort.
        
             | JohnBooty wrote:
             | In my mind this has been largely solved for the
             | past few years with Android Auto / Carplay.
             | 
             | I mean, yeah -- absolutely. For all the reasons you say.
             | 
             | But auto companies like Tesla and GM are now working hard
             | to _unsolve it_ because there 's no profit in it for them.
             | They want to control the experience and extract sweet,
             | sweet subscription revenue. So, I'm not sure how "solved"
             | it is.
        
             | amethyst wrote:
             | > What I am skeptical about is that this will continue to
             | be solved for the next few years: there's always that
             | chance that Google will outright kill it, or
             | Apple/Samsung/whoever will become exclusive to a single car
             | manufacturer, or the manufacturers will somehow bungle this
             | up with a subscription model of some sort.
             | 
             | Or the manufacturers decide they don't like users bypassing
             | their revenue models:
             | 
             | https://arstechnica.com/cars/2023/03/gm-confirms-its-
             | droppin...
             | 
             | FWIW, I absolutely love Carplay and paid extra to have
             | compatible head units installed in any of my previous cars
             | that didn't have built in support. It's been fantastic, but
             | I don't trust manufacturers to do what's in my own best
             | interest.
             | 
             | See also the recent Mozilla privacy findings for cars.
        
             | monknomo wrote:
             | Carplay &co are good right now, but as someone that hangs
             | on to cars for a long time, the trouble is that phones have
             | a much faster lifecycle than a car, and are pretty unlikely
             | to continue to work as smoothly as they do 20 years down
             | the line.
             | 
             | For example, I just junked a radio with a 30 pin ipod
             | connector. It was great and smooth in its day, but now, not
             | so much.
             | 
             | Could be we'll get lucky and the phones of 2043 will work
             | with the cars of 2023, but I think it's more likely that
             | the car will work and the infotainment stack will be a
             | half-functional ghost mall of tech in the middle of the car
        
               | gregmac wrote:
               | > and are pretty unlikely to continue to work as smoothly
               | as they do 20 years down the line.
               | 
               | This is a fair point... but also just what happens with
               | technology and time.
               | 
               | I assume you junked the radio not because it was broken
               | (that can happen to any gear) but because the 30-pin
               | interface itself is no longer desired -- it's no longer
               | the best way to get the content you want (ie: from your
               | phone).
               | 
               | This isn't really a different situation from a 20-year-
               | old car (CD player), 35-year-old car (cassette deck) or
               | 50-year-old car (8-track).
               | 
               | 20 years from now, if there's a market for it and it's
               | technically possible, someone will make adapters to get
               | AA/Carplay units to be compatible with whatever the
               | current technology is -- basically the 2043 equivalent of
               | a cassette adapter.
        
               | lotsofpulp wrote:
               | CarPlay and Android Auto is just an interface that allows
               | the phone the use the screen.
               | 
               | As long as Apple/Google maintain the ability to use the
               | interface in iOS and Android, it will continue to work.
               | 
               | Also, that would be a reason for cars to come with
               | replaceable head units.
        
           | mcculley wrote:
           | You need more than "the standard audio protocol". The
           | infotainment system should know a lot about the car's state
           | (e.g., RPM, turn signal activated/deactivated).
        
             | dsr_ wrote:
             | No, it shouldn't.
             | 
             | The car can feed media and mixing controls to the
             | amplifier; there's no need to send that elsewhere. Strict
             | separation of concerns. You want to play a "door is a jar"
             | announcement? Tell the amplifier to reduce all the other
             | channels to one-third their current volume and raise the
             | announcement channel, then undo that. No need to involve
             | the phone or tablet or mini-PC or MP3 player or subether
             | radio.
        
               | mcculley wrote:
               | How would the navigation app on CarPlay know whether or
               | not you have turned on your turn signal ahead of a turn?
               | Or know to pause navigation because the car is no longer
               | in gear?
        
           | Max-q wrote:
           | I used to think this. But the quality and integration of the
           | infotainment in new cars, for example Tesla, is so much
           | better than any extern unit I have tested, that now I really
           | appreciate the systems coming with the car.
           | 
           | I used to change the unit, amp and all speakers. Now my new
           | car is just working nicely unmodified.
        
             | gpderetta wrote:
             | Keyword being _new_. What happens in 3 years? 5? 10? Will
             | the manufacturer keep it up to date?
        
               | numpad0 wrote:
               | 1st-gen Tesla are now 11 years old(first production is
               | 2012). We already have answers and direction of motion;
               | they won't bother engineering replacement screens for
               | decade old cars, and they happily assist you with buying
               | more cars when you think your gigacast has a hairline.
        
           | numpad0 wrote:
           | Every cars produced from 1970s until yesterday afternoon have
           | one of that kind of standard mounting, colloquially called
           | 1DIN and 2DIN form factors. It's the shape of old car radios
           | and cassette player front panels. If you've ever wondered if
           | it's actually removable or it's just such an extremely
           | uniform and coincidental choice of aesthetics, it's actually
           | a standard slot. And there are endless aftermarket options.
           | Very few cars lacked support for it, but it's since been de
           | facto deprecated and being replaced by Android Auto and Apple
           | CarPlay.
           | 
           | > 1/4-20 UNC
           | 
           | ISO M8.
        
       | mc32 wrote:
       | Even today this could work as a 'citi' e-car with limited range.
       | The trunk or boot mechanism is garbage though. No need to mess
       | with that.
        
         | nlunbeck wrote:
         | Yeah I was trying to figure out what that was all about. It
         | seems it's like a desk drawer? I can only assume it's to
         | preserve the silhouette when the trunk is opened, can't think
         | of any practical advantages
        
       | sahaskatta wrote:
       | Looks like Honda actually built something that looks somewhat
       | similar. It's real and available for sale:
       | https://www.honda.co.uk/cars/new/honda-e/overview.html
        
         | yaomtc wrote:
         | for sale in Europe and Japan.
        
       | adolph wrote:
       | The seat hinges remind me of those early Microsoft Surface
       | multilink hinges, although on second look are clearly different.
       | 
       | The drawer trunk might be an improved solution to the trunk
       | challenge of the Kammback form [1], which often becomes a
       | hatchback but sometimes results in a smallish trunk hatch like
       | the Audi A7. It probably is not as crashworthy insofar as
       | packaging squish-space though.
       | 
       | A big miss is the steering wheel. Reaching through the wheel to
       | the horn seems difficult. It's also been done before on various
       | Citroens. I would have liked to see something more interesting
       | using a mechanism like a Sbarro centerless wheel. [2, 3]
       | 
       |  _Enter the hinge. Or, as Microsoft dubbed it, the dynamic
       | fulcrum hinge. The connective tissue between the Surface Book's
       | base and display is an isopod-like piece of aluminum that flexes
       | back and forth thanks to four rotational points. It's "almost
       | like a carpet that rolls out," Groene says._ [0]
       | 
       | 0. https://www.wired.com/2015/10/story-behind-surface-books-
       | cra...
       | 
       | 1. https://en.wikipedia.org//wiki/Kammback
       | 
       | 2.
       | http://sbarro.phcalvet.fr/technique/roue_orbitale/roue_orbit...,
       | https://en.wikipedia.org//wiki/Centreless_wheel
       | 
       | 3. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sbarro_(automobile)
        
         | agloe_dreams wrote:
         | As someone who sold their Surface Book Recently...Microsoft
         | said a whole lot of words to make a truly awful hinge with a
         | very compromised design while this makes complete sense here.
         | 
         | The outcome of the hinge int he SB was that the product
         | couldn't fold flat. Part of the reason for the hinge was that
         | allowed less wobble due to their heavy 'clipboard' tablet half,
         | which was caused by a want to have a detached mode. The cost of
         | detaching was massive to the whole product, not only was the
         | hinge bulky and heavy, it also meant the system had to manage
         | multiple batteries and force the CPU to throttle aggressively
         | due to a lack of cooling in the thin frame. Power would need to
         | flow between halves but ultimately the top half needed to
         | charge more often than the bottom as the bottom half could not
         | directly power the CPU, this meant being on power still
         | discharged the battery. Simply put, the choice ruined the
         | product unless you had that specific need; especially when
         | those batteries started to wear. Did I mention that the
         | clipboard had less than 2 hours of battery life? It's no Galaxy
         | Chromebook, but it was a sadly compromised design. I sincerely
         | hope they rethink the surface laptop studio as well. What they
         | really need is to just make a thick Surface Pro that can just
         | do it all.
        
       | dusted wrote:
       | Interesting! They had the foresight to understand that cars would
       | become uglier, but even they couldn't imagine the idiocy which is
       | non-standard-formfactor entertainment systems.
        
         | lelanthran wrote:
         | > Interesting! They had the foresight to understand that cars
         | would become uglier,
         | 
         | Hah!
         | 
         | TBH, I actually like the outer design of this car (https://uplo
         | ad.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9f/Ford_021... )
         | 
         | very retro take on the iconic Cortina Mk2 (https://upload.wikim
         | edia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/62/1967_For...).
         | 
         | Better than looking like a blob of unconstrained jelly, like
         | all modern cars.
        
         | selykg wrote:
         | I think it looks rad. I'd honestly consider buying one if it
         | were electric. Though, I'd probably go with a different color
         | combo. I love the simple interior. The only thing I really
         | dislike about it is the steering wheel. It's giving me the same
         | "stupid as hell" vibes as the new Tesla steering wheels.
        
           | TotempaaltJ wrote:
           | I also love the look of this car. I think the closest thing
           | that's actually on the market might be the Honda e[0], but
           | the price isn't worth it for the limited range imo.
           | 
           | [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_e
        
       | psd1 wrote:
       | Yes please to swiveling seats. For when one person puts up the
       | tent while the others shout encouragement.
        
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