[HN Gopher] Can we please just go back to using smaller wheels a...
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Can we please just go back to using smaller wheels and tires?
Author : rntn
Score : 26 points
Date : 2023-08-15 19:20 UTC (3 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (arstechnica.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (arstechnica.com)
| BugsJustFindMe wrote:
| It seems like the article should have been "Can we please go back
| to having spare tires in cars?" Shit happens. But these days half
| the cars available don't include spares or a place to put them.
| spicybright wrote:
| I've never seen a car without a spare in the US. Maybe only in
| sports/performance cars. What kind of cars are you talking
| about?
| LordGrey wrote:
| I own a 2010 Camaro SS and it doesn't have a spare. Part of
| that because those tires are HUGE -- I doubt I could fit one
| into my trunk -- but also because the front and rear tires
| are of different sizes. Which size should you carry?
|
| Chevy also put my battery in the trunk for weight
| distribution reasons, which makes the available space there
| even less. Maybe they felt they could do that because there
| was no spare.
|
| I love my Camaro but it is definitely a "pay to play"
| vehicle.
| justinator wrote:
| _> but also because the front and rear tires are of
| different sizes. Which size should you carry?_
|
| Oftentimes, spare wheels are very tiny compared to the
| wheel they're replacing and just made to get you to the
| tire place.
| LordGrey wrote:
| Yeah, every car other than the Camaro I've owned has had
| a donut spare tire. I forgot to address that my original
| comment.
|
| The challenge with a donut on my car is trying to fit
| over/around the brake calipers associated hardware.
|
| I've been lucky so far: in the 13 years I've own the car,
| I've had only one slow leak due to a nail. I haven't
| needed a spare _yet_.
| simplyaccont wrote:
| most of hybrid cars don't have spares. my wife's mini
| countryman didn't have spare (had runflats instead).
|
| there is a trend to put instead of spare inflation kit +
| sealant. costs savings and such
| supportengineer wrote:
| Have you seen a Tesla?
| Rebelgecko wrote:
| It's become relatively common over the last few years.
| Especially with EVs (probably a mix of cost reduction, weight
| reduction, and packaging problems). There's barely any EVs
| that come with spares (Rivian, F-150, that might be it). Some
| EVs based in ICE platforms like the Hyundai Kona have a place
| to put it at least, or you can get aftermarket ones that live
| in the back seat/trunk
| favorited wrote:
| The first car I ever bought new, a 2012 Hyundai Accent,
| didn't come with one. It was a comparatively cheap car, but
| it wasn't the cheapest package. A friend's Volvo sedan
| (approx. same model year) also didn't come with one. My newer
| Volkswagen did come with a donut, so I've definitely
| experienced both.
|
| Edit: none of these were hybrids or EVs, so it's not just
| batteries.
| massysett wrote:
| ? I didn't know not having a spare tire was even a thing. I've
| had flat tires twice and got back on the road in under 20
| minutes after changing the tire. I'm glad I now know this is a
| thing, so I can research new cars for this and avoid any model
| that has no spare.
| newaccount74 wrote:
| I think the problem is that tires are getting so big there's
| no place to store the spare. Especially on EVs where you need
| all the space you can get for the battery.
|
| That being said all the cars I looked at when I bought my car
| had a spare tire as an option (by default you wouldn't get
| one)
| eknkc wrote:
| One of my previous cars came with no spare but "run flat" tires
| (might be named something else). Basically they have strong
| sidewalls that do not collapse even without pressure. You can
| ride on them at much slower speeds to get to a tire shop. Loved
| those.
|
| My later cars both had no spares neither an emergency solution
| like the previous one had. I used a foam tire sealer once,
| worked wonders on a small puncture.
|
| Couple weeks ago I managed to completely fuck up a tire on my
| volvo with no spare. Had to call assistance number, they sent a
| tow truck.. Spent half a day sorting it out.
| elmerfud wrote:
| So much wrong in this article, but some things are correct. First
| a smaller rim and higher profile tire wouldn't have prevented the
| problem. Whatever was hit was hard enough to knock a dime-sized
| hole in his tire. That's almost three quarters of an inch or 18
| mm for the rest of the world. This isn't some light scrubbing on
| the sidewall or damaging your rim from a curb scrape. This is
| full on you blasted into something and poked a god-awful-sized
| hole into the side of your tire. No profile is going to save you
| from that.
|
| Second the trend of using these wheels and tire combinations is
| partially because consumers want that look but primarily for
| stability of these obnoxiously sized chassis to body ratio that
| people want in vehicles. Partially due to emissions standards and
| partially due to ride comfort manufacturers are using car chassis
| and bolting on effectively high profile truck bodies to them
| (that's your typical crossover). You put on a 14-in rim with a
| 75% sidewall tire you have a handling nightmare that will result
| in rollovers. Sticking a large rim with a small profile tire
| greatly reduces that.
|
| Lastly, yes larger rims are heavier and result in more unsprung
| weight but the trade-off is (for a factory setup) always worth it
| for increased handling and stability. This can reduce ride
| comfort but since you're on a car chassis anyway the suspension
| is making up the difference for what the tires used to do back in
| the '80s and '70s and '60s.
|
| This author seriously needs to go find a bone stock car from the
| mid-70s or even the late 60s and compare it to what he has today.
| I give this your range because bias tires are just garbage and by
| the late 60s most manufacturers had started installing radials at
| that point. Still cars were given high profile tires. A sports
| car would not be uncommon to have a 225 65 R15 tire. Total mush
| with atrocious handling. Still if you're going to smack curbs
| enough to put dime-size holes in it the only thing it might save
| is scratching up your steel rim which was also god awful heavy
| compared to modern alloy rims that are bigger.
|
| If you want smaller wheels and tires you need to go with smaller
| overall vehicles. Manufacturers don't do this for looks as their
| primary reason. They do it because it's what's required to keep
| the car safe and stable and meet the safety standards that are
| mandated. Nobody wants smaller cars because the safety rating
| goes through the floor because smaller cars you can only make
| them so safe due to the weight constraints of having a smaller
| car.
| spread_love wrote:
| _Throw some D 's on that bitch [to keep the car safe and stable
| and meet the mandated safety standards]_
|
| -- Rich Boy
| mikestew wrote:
| That's all well and good, but you can't tell me that I need 20"
| wheels on my Ioniq 5 instead of 19"s just because I got the
| glass roof. I'd rather have the 10 extra miles of range with
| the 19"s.
|
| OTOH, everyone who sees the car, almost to a person, comments
| on how much they like the wheels.
| inferiorhuman wrote:
| In a word: no.
|
| The rubber band tires are almost entirely for show. A 2024
| Camry weighs in around 3,300 lbs and comes stock with 205/65-16
| tires. A 1998 BMW 528i comes in somewhere north of 3,500 lbs
| and came stock with 225/60-15 tires that have a taller sidewall
| than the Camry. You'd be hard pressed to convince me that the
| Camry rides and handles better. Nobody wants
| smaller cars because the safety rating goes through the floor
|
| A 2023 Corolla and 2000 3-series are roughly the same weight.
| Both got "good" ratings from the IIHS across all the tests.
| newaccount74 wrote:
| > No profile is going to save you from that.
|
| Low profile tires are stiffer and should therefore be damaged
| more easily.
|
| There's no way to tell from the story how the accident
| happened, but I wouldn't rule out that a more flexible tire
| would have just deformed instead of tearing.
| UniverseHacker wrote:
| I have a big modern German SUV that came with 20" wheels...
| going down to 17 massively improved ride quality and offroad
| ability without hurting stability or handling significantly.
| There are some reasons why we don't want to go back to 60s
| wheel sizes, but they still should be a lot smaller than they
| are now.
| twoWhlsGud wrote:
| Consumer Reports, which presumably has test driven a wider
| array of cars than you or me, is pretty much constantly
| complaining about how the trend toward larger wheels is
| compromising ride quality. (In particular, when discussing trim
| levels they often count the larger rims you get with higher
| trim levels as a negative.)
|
| Given that the weight and size of vehicles has constantly been
| increasing (largely due to the auto co's "nice family you got,
| pity if something ... happened to it" marketing campaigns) some
| increase in size would make sense from a perf standpoint. I
| think the author's argument is that it's gone far beyond that.
| And CU, at least, seems to agree.
| orangepurple wrote:
| People equip cars with huge wheels for the same reason homeowners
| plant large swaths of grass over highly productive land: the
| aristocratic image of being able to afford to waste and being
| above the peasantry.
|
| Donks are a clear cut example of this within that subculture.
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