[HN Gopher] Hip hop historians who are racing to preserve its story
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Hip hop historians who are racing to preserve its story
Author : Geekette
Score : 129 points
Date : 2023-08-14 11:30 UTC (1 days ago)
(HTM) web link (www.wired.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.wired.com)
| aatd86 wrote:
| A whole lot of stuff on datpiff.com from the mixtape era.
| fidotron wrote:
| Maybe an unpopular opinion, but I believe when it all became
| known about what Afrika Bambaataa had been up to the whole
| foundations of hip hop as a credible art form fell away, and it
| has been in decline ever since. Maybe the offshoots are more
| commercially popular than ever but that serious audience seems to
| have given up on the core product.
| haste410 wrote:
| Who is the "serious audience" and what is the "core product"
| they've given up?
| atentaten wrote:
| What was he up to ? When did it become known?
| fidotron wrote:
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afrika_Bambaataa#Child_sexual_.
| ..
| atentaten wrote:
| Ok. That's abhorrent, but I can't make the leap to
| discredit the entire genre of Hip Hop based on the actions
| of an early pioneer.
| michaelt wrote:
| Given that a lot of 80s-90s hip hop music the musicians claimed
| to perpetrate murder, drug crime and sexual exploitation -
| would you expect the audience to much care?
| bdcravens wrote:
| Country music talks about drugs more than other genres
|
| https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-country/why-
| country...
| qbasic_forever wrote:
| Absolute garbage comment. Go listen to some 60s rock and it's
| nothing but the same themes. Jim Morrison and the Doors wrote
| songs about explicitly killing your father, doing drugs, etc.
| joshuakb wrote:
| Afrika Bambaataa undeniably played a significant role in the
| early days of hip hop, but his sound hasn't influenced the
| genre for over three decades. If we start discrediting half a
| century of art based on the actions of a single individual,
| we'll be left with very little. Should we consider techno and
| all its offshoots invalid because of Derrick May's sexual
| assaults? Write off rock as art because Jerry Lee Lewis married
| his 13-year-old cousin? Invalidate punk because Sid Vicious
| killed his gf? No serious fan of hip hop stopped listening
| because of this.
| dvngnt_ wrote:
| not at all. most listeners have no idea who he is. nor is he
| relevant in contemporary hiphop
| ndsipa_pomu wrote:
| Also its 50 year anniversary according to the BBC:
| https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/newsbeat-66471617
| ojbyrne wrote:
| The 50 year anniversary hype is everywhere.I personally agree
| with the last paragraph of the article:
|
| 'He also mentions that he finds the 50th anniversary of hip hop
| mile-marker a bit disingenuous. The birth of an entire movement
| can't be attributed to one act. "I'm definitely not a person to
| shit on hip hop's anniversary, or its founders," he says.
| "These influential figures are extremely important. They
| changed the world and they deserve recognition and they deserve
| compensation. One hundred percent, underlined, big cap, bold
| letters. Capitalism, industry, commerce require neat stories.
| But we also have to be like, is this the whole story, or is
| this a convenient story?" Likely the latter, and it's
| incomplete.'
| ndsipa_pomu wrote:
| There's certainly precedents in terms of black political
| poetry in music (The Last Poets, Gil Scott-Heron) and there
| was clearly a need for the disenfranchised to have a voice,
| but there's the other aspects such as graffiti, dancing and
| DJing that all came together over time.
| ndsipa_pomu wrote:
| I remember back in the day, listening to Tim Westwood on pirate
| radio was about the only exposure that hip-hop got in the UK.
|
| For people interested in the history of hip-hop, there's a series
| of excellent comic books:
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hip_Hop_Family_Tree
| Exmoor wrote:
| I've thought about this quite a bit. I'm a big fan of the record
| label Bear Family, a German label that specializes in releasing
| boxsets from R&B/Rock&Roll/Country artists from the 20's-70's.
| Want to hear every song The Carter Family ever recorded in their
| original incarnation? They have a 12 CD boxset for you! They
| generally do this be acquiring the original master tapes from the
| labels, which often include a lot of previously unreleased songs
| or alternate takes, and remastering them.
|
| Hip-Hop probably has a higher percentage of this material than
| almost any other genre, especially once you get to the
| mixtape/blog era. Unfortunately, most of this material was only
| released in unofficial forms, often on low-quality MP3s and often
| with some random dude shouting over the intro. A lot of these
| tracks were also recorded over unlicensed beats/samples, so even
| if clean recordings were available official release would be
| impossible.
| lostlogin wrote:
| > Unfortunately, most of this material was only released in
| unofficial forms, often on low-quality MP3s
|
| I know nothing about audio - is it possible to upscale the
| quality somehow? Improve the quality via some process?
| giantrobot wrote:
| Audio compression literally throws out data. It's audio the
| human ear isn't likely/able to hear but it's still gone.
| Different codecs and even different implementations of codecs
| throw out different audio data.
|
| Any sort of upscaling is going to involve a lot of guesses
| about what was thrown out. For every codec and implementation
| there will be a lot of possibilities of what the original
| data might have looked like. At the end of the process you
| likely aren't going to get a result that necessarily sounds
| better than the low quality encoding. There will likely be a
| lot of artifacts introduced by the upscaling.
|
| It's not impossible but something you'd need a specially
| trained AI to do I would think.
| lostlogin wrote:
| I work with a system which extrapolates data in the
| frequency domain to reduce noise in medical images and then
| doubles the images resolution in the x and y direction (so
| 4x the pixels). It's absolutely amazing.
|
| It'll be interesting to see if audio ever gets a similar
| treatment and in what areas it can be applied.
| PaulDavisThe1st wrote:
| Noise levels in contemporary audio is vanishingly small,
| and has not really been the target of any audio
| technology for quite a long time.
|
| Of course, restoration of older recordings is a separate
| issue, and that technology is 20-30 years old, at least
| (and very, very good).
| jl6 wrote:
| Technically no, pragmatically maybe...
|
| If the information has been lost through using a lossy codec
| like MP3, there's no getting it back.
|
| But there are "AI upscaling" techniques that use models to
| fill in the missing pieces. It isn't really restoring the
| original, more like painting over a crack in a style that is
| typically used by similar artists in similar contexts. Such
| models could produce a result conceptually similar to what a
| cover band might produce.
| WesternMAGeek wrote:
| Bear Family is amazing!
|
| I have a bunch of their box sets. Pure archival gold -
| including Jerry Lee Lewis making really crude jokes in between
| takes of a song.
|
| We need a Bear Family equivalent for hip-hop!
| michaelt wrote:
| _> Unfortunately, most of this material was only released in
| unofficial forms, often on low-quality MP3s and often with some
| random dude shouting over the intro._
|
| If that's the art form as it was experienced, do archivists
| _need_ to make a "better" version?
| tyre wrote:
| This is like asking if a recording of the 1996 Olympics
| should have to include all of the commercials.
|
| For historical purposes, sure, have that as an option, but
| lil wayne's mixtapes are not better off for the random DJs or
| website advertisements yelled over them. That's not the music
| he made.
| w-ll wrote:
| Lil Wayne does have producer tags on his offical mixtaps,
| its just a lot of sites add their own crap even on top of
| that.
| wahnfrieden wrote:
| It is those very versions which need preserving if that is
| what exists
| whinenot wrote:
| > A lot of these tracks were also recorded over unlicensed
| beats/samples
|
| That's the killer, right there. For example, the Beastie Boys
| album _Paul 's Boutique_ probably could not be released today
| as it samples an incredible number of other artists.[0]
|
| [0]https://open.spotify.com/playlist/7kI8XoDoiHcrG0aGmtvq1g
| zhengyi13 wrote:
| On a similar note, Danger Mouse's "The Grey Album" remixing
| Jay Z's The Black Album over samples from The Beatles' White
| Album... Amazing.
|
| It's pretty findable, but it's unfortunate that there's no
| canonical source.
| S_A_P wrote:
| A lot of hip hop still has unlicensed samples in it but the
| slices just keep getting smaller and less recognizable. And
| believe it or not a lot of the samples in Paul's Boutique
| were licensed. I do agree with you though that (maybe until
| recently as I think the price of sampling is softening
| somewhat with sites like tracklib) Paul's Boutique would be
| expensive to release today. Then there are stories like the
| Mark Ronson song ooh wee that he owns -25% of[0] because the
| boney m string riff took 100% of the publishing and Dennis
| Coffey drums took another 25%. So he theoretically lost money
| each play. Public enemy's it takes a nation of millions to
| hold us back is another album that would lose money to make
| today.
|
| [0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ooh_Wee_(song)
| PerryDigital wrote:
| Just to note for the two posters above, and anyone else,
| Paul's Boutique is now on Spotify :)
|
| (So is three feet high and rising by De La Soul)
| stronglikedan wrote:
| Tangential, but I think the streaming services are preserving the
| story just fine on their own. No matter how many times I skip or
| dislike a hip hop song, they all keep shoving them down my throat
| with their recommendation engines. Very frustrating. /rant
| jmopp wrote:
| The article spends a great deal of time explaining why
| streaming services can't be relied on to preserve the history.
|
| Not to mention that a lot of early hip-hop might not have its
| samples cleared. These songs would not likely be on streaming
| services due to copyright issues. There is also the issue we've
| seen with streaming services disappearing huge chunks of the
| catalogues to avoid paying residuals. If we don't put effort
| into saving history, it can very easily get lost.
|
| On top of this, there's a distinction to be made between
| Top-100 pop music, and the artists who influenced them in their
| youth. If a random mixtape from the 80s had a huge influence on
| you as an artist, those who enjoy your music would love to get
| a listen of it.
| [deleted]
| jrm4 wrote:
| Please, stop.
|
| If you don't like the genre, then you are _absolutely in no
| position_ to comment usefully or intelligently on whether it is
| being preserved properly.
| rolobio wrote:
| I'm glad I'm not the only one. Apple's top music is always R&B,
| Rap, etc. I have never seen a song or radio I actually wanted
| to listen to. Guess its up to me to find all the new music?
| bazeblackwood wrote:
| So you don't pay a fair price for your music consumption and
| still complain about the quality of service?
| flangola7 wrote:
| They didn't imply anything about piracy.
| [deleted]
| lawgimenez wrote:
| I don't know if I am right but Twitter's growth back in 2010-2012
| had a huge boost in the datpiff hiphop era. I remember back then
| that when Twitter's fail whale crash logo will appear it means
| that Lil Wayne, Wiz Khalifa, Drake or Kendrick dropped a mixtape.
| chayesfss wrote:
| [dead]
| mikrl wrote:
| I don't know the original source, but it is the intro to one of
| the tracks on The Prodigy's 1998 mixtape 'the dirtchamber
| sessions'
|
| "Do you remember the days,
|
| When Kool Herc played,
|
| With a following of bands?
|
| If you don't, well then you won't
|
| (That's right!)
|
| Real hip hop, my man"
| ndsipa_pomu wrote:
| D.ST. The Home of Hip Hop
|
| https://genius.com/Dst-derek-showard-the-home-of-hip-hop-lyr...
| dep_b wrote:
| The blog era, that was so cool. The most rare stuff you could
| find, including some background. Now it's usually on YouTube
| mostly devoid of context and only single tracks.
| NickC25 wrote:
| There is some rare stuff on YouTube - check out this channel -
| https://www.youtube.com/@OGDonNinja
|
| Guy is a collector of old hip hop records and tapes from the
| 80s until early 2000s. They are all available on his channel in
| their dusty-sounding glory. Amazing.
| cing wrote:
| Heck yes. Music pirates have done a whole lot to help preserve
| hip-hop history by ripping/archiving countless rare/underground
| 12" and cassettes that are definitely not available on
| streaming platforms; we're talking alternative versions of
| songs like clean edits, remixes, acapellas, instrumentals which
| supported hip-hop producers and DJs in the early days.
|
| For example, check the posts in the early 2010's of sites like
| this, https://hiphop-thegoldenera.blogspot.com/, of course all
| the links are broken now.
| ndsipa_pomu wrote:
| Double Dee and Steinski mixes - their existence is due to
| pirates
| WilliamBerglund wrote:
| Only tangentially related, but this documentary is quite good
| https://www.imdb.com/title/tt2475454/
| debo_ wrote:
| I also really loved this documentary miniseries by Canadian
| artist Shad: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hip-Hop_Evolution
| dsir wrote:
| I think what's equally as important as the archiving is the
| aggregating of the information. It's one thing to have a story,
| or piece of content documented somewhere, but at the end of the
| day, people still need ways to find it.
|
| I think that's where social, discussion based platforms come in.
| I'm a huge hip-hop fan and have been running a page dedicated to
| giving people a space to discuss and share all things hip-hop.
|
| https://sociables.com/community/TheJive/board/trending
| jimt1234 wrote:
| Back when I first started listening to hip hop music (around
| 1982; i'm old), it wasn't easy to get your hands on it if you
| lived in the suburbs. Record stores in the suburbs didn't stock
| hip hop until the Beastie Boys' "Licensed to Ill" and Run DMC's
| "Raising Hell". I had a circle of friends that could get me
| bootlegs - basically, mixtapes from people with hip hop records.
| I threw all of them away years ago. And I've been kicking myself
| ever since. I miss those old mixtapes so much. One of them was
| Afrika Bambaataa's "Perfect beat", over and over, both sides of
| the cassette, for 60 minutes. I loved it, listened to it
| constantly, never got tired of it. Another was entirely "Roxanne"
| songs - "Roxanne's doctor", "Roxanne's a man", etc.
| mc32 wrote:
| I think people often recorded off the radio on to cassettes.
| Local stations played local artists. Or your friends would
| drive in to the city and you could come across the music.
| jimt1234 wrote:
| For me, it was Magic 108 in St. Louis, Missouri. However, I
| was so far out in the suburbs, Magic didn't always tune-in
| very well. I had lots of tapes with static. Also, in the
| early days, they played rap only late at nights, for a few
| hours before the "quiet storm".
|
| There was another AM radio station in St. Louis, a city
| college station, that used to have a segment called "The
| Rappin' Hour", where dudes would call-in and rap about their
| high school or whatever. I used to write rhymes in class,
| dreaming about calling into "The Rappin' Hour." LOL
| analog31 wrote:
| I remember that time, living in a suburb of Detroit. My first
| exposure to hip hop was on the radio, driving to my summer job.
| A lot of it seemed like it was being made on the spot, for
| instance there were references to recent local events and
| politics.
| ndsipa_pomu wrote:
| Roxanne - that name takes me back.
|
| I taped a pirate radio Tim Westwood show that was wholly
| dedicated to the Roxanne saga.
|
| Found this example of his show:
| https://archive.org/details/TheHipHopShow-19850917
| jrm4 wrote:
| A big thing in the background of all of this; America, perhaps
| the world, myself included, really hasn't come to properly reckon
| with the extent to which we all subconsciously think of Black
| American art (including hip-hop) as something to be "taken" or
| "used" or generally not culturally owned by Black folks, usually
| Americans.
|
| The example that sticks in my head: if I, a black guy, were to
| get into Irish step-dancing, that's great. I would never, though,
| suggest that it's "not just Irish, it's universal." I'd respect
| where it comes from.
|
| Yet we have ALL heard the well-meaning, but ultimately a bit
| harmful, exact same thing said about Hip-hop.
|
| I think this ends up having real life consequences; see e.g. the
| rise of (Rap)Genius.com. They got big on the back of rap lyrics
| without much respecting the artists AT ALL.
| nsajko wrote:
| > we all subconsciously think of Black American art (including
| hip-hop) as something to be "taken" or "used" or generally not
| culturally owned by Black folks, usually Americans
|
| It's a bit silly to try to prescribe or restrict "ownership" of
| culture. Culture is and always has been a product of sharing
| and mixing of existing traditions.
|
| EDIT: I think there's also some hidden issues at play here. You
| basically want people across the world to directly acknowledge
| "black citizens of USA" as an ethnicity (to protect "your"
| culture). Some problems with this:
|
| * You don't straight out say this, probably because skin-color-
| based ethnicity/nationalism is a touchy subject (e.g., white
| nationalism is basically taboo). But then how can you expect
| your request to be taken in good faith?
|
| * Your request is somewhat US-centric, as a "Black American"
| ethnicity would after all be just a US minority, presumably not
| even independent from the mainstream to the degree that, e.g.,
| many European minorities are in their countries.
|
| I'll admit I'm putting words into your mouth, but clearly
| there's lots of things being left unsaid every time these
| discussions come up, so I don't feel too bad.
| jrm4 wrote:
| Wow.
|
| First response literally DOES THE THING I'm specifically
| warning against. That's AMAZING.
| [deleted]
| hluska wrote:
| You managed to take a simple statement and twist it into
| something ugly. In doing so, all you did was prove their
| point.
|
| Finally, your finale about how you don't feel too bad was in
| unbelievably bad taste. Social skills don't seem to be your
| forte.
| aesch wrote:
| Look at the influence of sampling in hip hop. Sampling is
| literally taking music from different time periods, genres,
| cultures and making something new from it. If the mothers and
| fathers of hip hop had respected cultural ownership hip hop
| would never have been born in the first place.
|
| For any piece of culture to stay culturally relevant it must be
| "taken" and "used" and evolve.
|
| I agree that we should respect and acknowledge the founders of
| the culture, but once it is set free in the world it has to be
| shared to grow and thrive.
| jl6 wrote:
| What does it mean for hip-hop to be culturally owned by black
| folks? What does it mean for non-black hip-hop artists?
| mmx4332 wrote:
| It doesn't mean anything. Nobody can "own" something like
| that. And nobody "owes" anything either to anyone else.
| jrm4 wrote:
| It means that you should acknowledge the culture of the
| people who started it, not too much more than that?
|
| It can get dicey and weird at times, and there's a lot of
| details that one could get into, and that's good homework to
| do -- but I definitely find that the vast majority of popular
| white rappers do a good job of this, e.g. Eminem.
| PaulDavisThe1st wrote:
| > the people who started it
|
| what constitutes the start? DJ Kool Herc? If you asked him,
| he would list his influences and predecessors... do they
| not count ? If you try to demarcate some sort of cultural
| "break" where X becomes Y, how do you do that? And how do
| you handle subsequent cultural "breaks" that presumably, by
| the same logic, create something new. How do you handle
| parallel flows that then converge (such as electro-funk
| evolving under the influence of kraftwerk, and then
| becoming the first thing actually named "hip-hop") ?
|
| This is all nonsense. Culture is not "owned".
|
| Almost all the best culture in the world is mongrel culture
| that arose from someone who grew up in one culture(s) being
| exposed to other cultures and mixing them together in a way
| that generally reflects as much upon the individual as or
| more than the source cultures.
|
| Hip-hop is no different in this respect to any other form
| of human expression. If there's an art form that seems
| "pure" to you, the most likely explanation is that you
| haven't gone far enough into the past to understand how it
| is also just another mongrel form.
| qntty wrote:
| A piece of culture is important in proportion to the reluctance
| of people to assign an owner to it, whether legal or otherwise.
| No one would criticize a Frenchman for using Newton's Laws
| because it belongs to the British. Someone who is really
| enthusiastic about something will emphasize that it is
| universally appreciated. E.g., Shakespeare being put on by
| diverse cultures, Islam trying to spread itself to every corner
| of the world, Chinese silk being exported to anyone who will
| buy it, etc.
|
| If I was a hip hop artist, there would be no bigger insult than
| assigning ownership of my art to a specific culture. If it's
| really so great, it should speak to everyone. If this isn't
| true of Irish step dancing, it's because it's a relatively
| trivial art form. You can trivialize hip hop too if you want,
| but it's not necessarily doing hip hop artists any favors.
| jrm4 wrote:
| Would you _really_ make this argument with any other cultural
| contribution? Come on.
|
| You think it's _insulting_ to assign the Hula to Hawaiians?
| This makes NO sense.
| qntty wrote:
| I don't know the significance of hula, but if it doesn't
| aspire to be something great, then assigning it to
| Hawaiians wouldn't be an insult, since it doesn't
| contradict their own view of it.
|
| People will often times contextualize things to downplay
| it's importance. For example, if I think it's disrespectful
| to talk about hip hop in a certain way, you can
| contextualize my view by saying it's an outgrowth of early
| 21st century American progressive legitimation narratives.
| I want my views to be universal, but by placing them in the
| context of a certain country, time, and ideology, they are
| downplayed.
| cookie_monsta wrote:
| As a white guy I am aware of the minefield I am skipping
| merrily into here, but here goes:
|
| I can see the general point here, but don't think it applies as
| strongly to hip hop. Maybe it's just the circles I move in, but
| hip hop fans and artists seem to be quite aware of the origin
| stories and hold a particular reverence for the old school.
|
| Compare that to rock fans who wouldn't look further back than
| Presley (the king, lol) or green day fans who have never even
| heard of the stooges.
|
| Maybe it's because hip hop is a relatively young genre and ties
| to the old school fade as generations pass.
|
| If we're talking about money then yeah, sure - I'd be surprised
| if any of the creators made anything out of it compared to what
| corporate America does, but that's nothing new either. I don't
| know anything about (Rap)Genius.com, but I guess my question
| would be: what would you prefer to be happening that would
| respect the genre's origins but still allow it to grow?
| cheekibreeki2 wrote:
| I found a bunch of someone's abandoned belongings which included
| a number of vhs tapes. Some were hours of hip-hop TV recordings
| from those dial-your-favorite-song channels. It's crazy how the
| whole mainstream genre was full of positivity and peace and now
| it's been reduced to genocide and drugs.
| y-curious wrote:
| This is very relevant to me. There's a great song I heard on The
| Wire from HBO called "Analyze" by Sharpshooters [1]. Info on this
| group is almost non-existent; Only a brief synopsis repeated on
| Reddit and a few other sites. This was a song used on one of the
| most popular TV shows ever, I cannot imagine the amount of info
| being lost on lesser groups/songs.
|
| Also related, I LOVE MF DOOM. Collecting his discography is a fun
| little task, considering he appears on various albums using one
| of many monikers.
|
| [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMlCLw4aCqA
| yardie wrote:
| I'm just going to plug the non-profit whose mission is to archive
| and teach the history of hip-hop as well as mentor young artists.
| Until I got involved with them, I didn't realize how much history
| was being lost to time and neglect. If you grow up in it, you
| assume it will always be there.
|
| http://www.pathtohiphop.org/
| 10729287 wrote:
| A little off topic but funny enough to mention. Here in France,
| Skyblog.com is closing its doors in the next days. It was a blog
| platform ran by the #1 hiphop radio. It's not related to hip hop
| at all, even the radio only play crappy mainstream rap since 30
| years ago, but back in the days, it was an easy way for a lot of
| teens to have a voice on the Internet. It wasn't deep at all,
| often really dumb, and it was mocked even in 2000, but 20 years
| after remains the symbol of an era and there's still some nice
| joys that came out of it. It was worth archiving for all those
| reasons and we are glad INA (National Audiovisual Institute)
| saved all the content.
| cookie_monsta wrote:
| For the record (ha!), French hip hop is my favourite of all the
| "international" flavours. Some excellent DJs and producers and
| there's something about the smoothness of the accent that
| coincides very well with my tastes. Not understanding French
| and so not having to worry about problematic lyrics may add to
| the appeal;)
| zhengyi13 wrote:
| For anyone following along at home, MC Solaar might be a
| really good entry point into French Hiphop.
|
| Give La concubine de l'hemoglobine a try - talk about smooth.
| Hanschri wrote:
| ArchiveTeam is also currently archiving Skyblog!
|
| https://tracker.archiveteam.org/skyblog/
| aatd86 wrote:
| Just a nuance: the true number one hiphop radio was always
| generation 88.2 :-P
|
| SkyRock even has rock in its name.
|
| Just being playful :o)
| rurban wrote:
| Still missing Adriano Celentano's Prisencolinensinainciusol
| VikingCoder wrote:
| Hip-Hop Evolution on Netflix is really, really good. [1]
|
| Hip-hop is for sure not my favorite genre - but this series was
| fantastic.
|
| [1] : https://www.netflix.com/watch/80141893?trackId=200257859
| Ductapemaster wrote:
| Historically, I've only casually listened to the genre through
| friends or events. However, watching this show gave me such a
| new appreciation for the stories of the performers, the
| inspiration for their music, where the different styles come
| from, and the sheer brilliance of the producers and artists. It
| completely changed my opinion and respect for the genre.
|
| I can't recommend the show highly enough. My partner and I have
| watched it through at least twice.
| steve76 wrote:
| [dead]
| arkaic wrote:
| The same goes for lots of the underground hardcore music. So much
| of it isn't even on spotify or it is but with the wrong year.
| Thankfully there are still existing blogspots that still house
| those rare LP rars
| darig wrote:
| [dead]
| Lolaccount wrote:
| https://archive.li/DtOVI
| ndsipa_pomu wrote:
| Rap is like a set-up, a lot of games
|
| A lot of suckers with colorful names
|
| I'm so-and-so, I'm this, I'm that
|
| Huh, but they all just wick-wick-wack
| porterbeats wrote:
| Hip-hop can be bland and shallow (like any other genre) but
| there's lots of unique and interesting music if one takes the
| time to get into it. Deltron 3030 (self titled) and MF DOOM's
| MM...FOOD are fantastic on a lyrical and production level
| harrylove wrote:
| The parent comment is quoting a classic bar from "My
| Philosophy" by Boogie Down Productions[0].
|
| [0] - https://genius.com/376131
| ndsipa_pomu wrote:
| Thanks. Seems like my comment's getting downvoted which I
| hope is just people not familiar with KRS-One.
|
| Edit: Never mind, it's gone positive now.
| chiefalchemist wrote:
| Which in the context of this thread / OP is proof that
| the history must not only be preserved, but must be
| promoted, honored, etc.
|
| I could of year ago I work at an agency and one of the
| new dev starter and said something about being into hip
| hop. I mentioned Rakim and the reply was, "Who?" Don't
| get me wrong, I respect Nas, Eminem, etc. (i.e., all the
| lyrical magicians) but they stand on the shoulders of The
| R.
| ndsipa_pomu wrote:
| Not knowing Rakim would be fighting talk round my way.
|
| A friend asked me a while ago to give him a list of the
| top ten (or fifteen) hip hop tracks that are important to
| me or the development of hip hop. I wasn't sure whether
| to include Last Poets as one of the first "rap" groups or
| whether Gil Scott-Heron should be considered the jazz
| ancestor. However, I then got stuck around the Tribe
| Called Quest and Busta Rhymes era.
|
| Obviously, "Follow The Leader" was my choice of Rakim
| track, but I'm having trouble with picking a single Tribe
| track - should really be the whole of Low End Theory
| along with a cheat sheet of the significant jazz samples
| that Q-Tip used.
| chiefalchemist wrote:
| Because it samples Grace Jones' "Slave to the Rhythm", I
| would have to go with "Bonita Applebum" (UK Remix). OK,
| maybe there are better ATCQ efforts but the vibe, sample
| and length (9+ minutes) make it a gem.
|
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXeJA5plkD8
|
| p.s. While there are so many memorable Rakim tracks and
| lyrics, I always like to point out the overlooked "What's
| on Your Mind". It's fookin' poetic genius. The images so
| vivid.
|
| The line about Liz Claiborne...you can smell it.
|
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sWlm2E4fb7E
|
| Edit: Video w/ lyrics:
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t3ENkIho8m4
| harrylove wrote:
| If I had to pick one ATCQ track that satisfies the
| condition, I'd pick "Jazz (We've Got)" which has a couple
| of samples from "Green Dolphin Street" plus the drums
| from "Don't Change Your Love".
| ndsipa_pomu wrote:
| I was more thinking of choosing between Check The Rhime
| (Grover Washington Jr. and a sublime use of Minnie
| Ripperton) as it's got such a kicking beat or Scenario
| (Brother Jack McDuff and a bit of Hendrix) due to its
| influence and being such a stand-out introduction to
| Busta Rhymes.
|
| Or Award Tour (Charles Earland, Weldon Irvine) or maybe
| just cheat and go for Excursions and Buggin Out (what a
| way to start an album).
| harrylove wrote:
| Agree on all fronts. Would also add Oh My God just for
| the Busta Rhymes inclusion.
| giantrobot wrote:
| Fuck. You guys made me want to grab my ATCQ albums out of
| the garage. My ears will be far happier than my lower
| back.
|
| *shakes fist*
| chiefalchemist wrote:
| Mind if I drop by...and break into your garage? :)
| giantrobot wrote:
| You can dig through the top layer of junk. It'll save my
| back for going through the second layer.
| lawgimenez wrote:
| There's a lot of great producers too on hiphop if one just
| takes time to appreciate the difficulty of creating a beat.
| ndsipa_pomu wrote:
| There was a cool website featured on here a little while
| back about Dilla-time.
|
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36189583
|
| https://pudding.cool/2023/06/groove/
| mytailorisrich wrote:
| Too many MC's take that word 'emcee' lightly.
|
| They can't Move a Crowd, not even slightly.
| aswanson wrote:
| Kris Parker on Hacker News. The planets have aligned.
| jimt1234 wrote:
| You might get a kick out of this:
| https://www.youtube.com/@djkennyparker/videos
| ndsipa_pomu wrote:
| Knowledge Reigns Supreme Over Nearly Everyone
| jimt1234 wrote:
| The Teacher!
| ndsipa_pomu wrote:
| In about four seconds, a teacher will begin to speak
| aswanson wrote:
| Let us begin...
| kawsper wrote:
| In Denmark we had MyMusic.dk, which later rebranded to
| Bandbase.dk, they were active from 1998 to 2013, they stored a
| lot of free underground music for a lot of up and coming artists.
|
| They died when their data host Nirvanix went bankrupt, they lost
| all of the media files (with no backups), but according to
| Wikipedia customers were given 14 days to move their data.
|
| A lot of culture disappeared that day :(
| FirmwareBurner wrote:
| _> customers were given 14 days to move their data_
|
| 14 days is not nearly enough for private customers to react.
| Often vacations can be longer than that, and people don't
| usually vacation with their laptops and external HDDs to places
| with fast broadband, just in case they need to make a
| spontaneous external backup of their cloud data. Imagine by the
| time you come home all your data is irrecoverably gone. That's
| fucking nuts.
|
| Should be at least 30 days by law.
| ilamont wrote:
| I recently got a <24 hour notice of a major price change from
| a Shopify app developer. On a Sunday.
|
| While not a backup-related issue, it forced a scramble on my
| end. I am sure hundreds of others didn't see it or couldn't
| react until well after the fact.
|
| Shopify said this is allowed per its developer TOS.
| FirmwareBurner wrote:
| _> Shopify said this is allowed per its developer TOS._
|
| Without any kind of legislation saying otherwise, these
| companies can put whatever the fuck they want in the TOS,
| which is the cheat code that allowed tech companies to
| extract obscene profits while completely skipping on
| customer support costs and legal liability.
|
| But this could always come to an end if there's political
| will to legislate. In my home country a new law was passed
| that says companies can't keep you on hold for more than 10
| minutes before you talk to a real human when you call
| customer support, and now companies are scrambling to hire
| enough customer support to deal with the new law because
| previously they'd leave you in a queue for 45 minutes on
| hold hoping you'd give up.
|
| So it's definitely possible to not fuck over consumers, all
| it needs is the proper regulations in place since you can't
| always rely on the good will of for-profit corporations.
| Yes, that will make it more expensive for tech businesses
| to operate and reduce their profit margins, but if your
| business was supposed to be profitable only when skirting
| the law, not offering customer support, and fucking over
| your customers on a whim, then I don't need your business
| to exist in the first place.
| mywittyname wrote:
| Perhaps companies who are effected need to class action
| this behavior, since there's clear economic damages that
| can result.
|
| The spectre of a multi-billion dollar lawsuit is probably
| going to be much more effective at encouraging "fair"
| behavior on these platforms than any sort of legislation
| could ever be. If legislation says 30 days, then 30 days
| it shall be. But if a court rules whatever is reasonable
| amount of time for a customer to act without suffering
| economic damages, then we might see some due diligence to
| ensure smooth migrations.
| FirmwareBurner wrote:
| Many global jurisdictions don't have the class action
| lawsuit framework system, it's mostly the US/Anglo
| countries that do.
|
| That's why the law baseline is important. It's how
| warranties must be 2 years across all EU.
| lexandstuff wrote:
| In Australia, we had ozhiphop.com/forum.
|
| It was a super active forum between 2001 - 2010. Really the
| only online meeting place for local hip-hop until social media
| took over. It was the launching place of many careers
| (including Action Bronson's albeit indirectly).
|
| Sadly all seems to be lost to history too.
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