[HN Gopher] Launch HN: Stellar Sleep (YC S23) - An app that help...
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Launch HN: Stellar Sleep (YC S23) - An app that helps people with
insomnia
Hi HN - We're Ed and George, the team behind Stellar Sleep
(https://stellarsleep.com/). We spent the past 1.5 years developing
an app that helps people break the insomnia cycle using psychology.
Insomnia has been a personal struggle for both of us. George's
insomnia led to him quantifying his sleep for the last 7 years and
making questionable life choices like wearing orange (blue-light
blocking) goggles to evening social events. I (Ed) suffered from
chronic insomnia for over a year and tried everything from cutting
coffee, blocking blue light, to taking melatonin and antihistamine,
but couldn't find anything that worked. It took an immense amount
of energy for me to perform even the most mundane of tasks, such as
doing my laundry or ordering groceries. At night, I felt
overwhelming loneliness and resentment as I lay in bed wide awake,
mindlessly scrolling through reddit and browsing HN in the middle
of the night. I even bought a $500 research-grade EEG device to
track my sleep, which was honestly kind of depressing because it
showed that I was sleeping less than 4 hours per night for weeks
straight. When I finally decided to see a sleep specialist, I was
put on a 3-month long waiting list. Eventually, I was able to get
my insomnia treated. That finally helped. But it also made me
realize that the same therapy that I received could be delivered
online--there is no reason why anyone should have to wait 3 months
to get treatment. George and I both have experience in digital
health, so we decided to partner with sleep experts to create
Stellar Sleep. People with chronic insomnia often receive
inadequate care advice. They're told to try cutting back on coffee,
meditate more, or make their bedroom darker, when chronic insomnia
is often rooted in deeper, psychological issues (e.g., financial
anxiety, workplace stress...etc.). In fact, " _present research
[now] supports the view that sleep is causally related to mental
health difficulties_ " (Sleep Medicine Reviews, Dec 2021, doi:
10.1016/j.smrv.2021.101556). This matches up with what we observe--
over 50% of our users reported that they have been diagnosed with
depression, anxiety or other mental health conditions. Stellar
Sleep uses psychology to help chronic insomniacs get their lives
back. We start by understanding a person's immediate sleep-related
challenges and providing them with practical strategies for dealing
with them. Then, we drill down on the underlying psychological
drivers of a person's chronic insomnia and create a program to
resolve those drivers one by one. Participants spend 5-10 minutes
per day completing modules in the Stellar Sleep app. We launched
last August, and have already helped over 10,000 patients improve
their sleep permanently. Here's how one of our customers, Victoria,
describes her experience: " _I've had insomnia for about 5 years.
I was at the point of desperation, willing to try anything.
Insomnia feels very lonely. It's 2am and your spouse is asleep.
You're very alone with your anxious thoughts. About the mortgage
rates changing. About all the things you have to do tomorrow
without any sleep. It feels like you're trapped and alone. After
starting Stellar Sleep I've now started sleeping better for the
first time in 5 years. I've gotten hope back that I can be normal.
Most people who sleep well don't worry about sleep. A good night's
sleep should just be normal._" We have strong clinical data
showing that we're just as effective as in-person treatment and
have a year-long clinical study running with Harvard Medical School
/ Brigham & Women's Hospital paid for by the State of Massachusetts
and the US Department of Commerce. On average, our users sleep 74
minutes longer than before and spend 52% less time awake in the
middle of the night. If you have trouble with sleep, try our app
and let us know what you think! If you have any questions, please
feel free to ask and we will be happy to answer them. We look
forward to hearing your comments and experiences!
Author : edreichua
Score : 83 points
Date : 2023-08-08 13:35 UTC (9 hours ago)
| kumarski wrote:
| Godsend.
|
| I imagine like 90% of HN'ers suffer from insomnia.
| maxwell wrote:
| Why?
| lxe wrote:
| Please, please, please for the love of everything, stop with
| these 1000 question 10 minute-long onboarding surveys with fake
| loading screens that lead you to the payment page (or worse, an
| email form) regardless of your answers.
|
| These things are an insult to your users.
|
| I don't care if some marketer from noom wrote a pdf about how it
| "increased conversion".
|
| Just stop it. It's a horrible dark pattern.
| lukko wrote:
| I agree, I think it's awful. It's a waste of everyone's time
| and insulting to people who have a problem and feel slightly
| vulnerable. People aren't just numbers or conversion rates, and
| especially in digital health they should be treated
| respectfully.
| chasebank wrote:
| If the product actually worked, they wouldn't have to do this.
| People will pay lots of money for solving their sleep problems.
| edreichua wrote:
| We are still in the process of improving the survey, so your
| feedback is super valuable. So far, we have been over-indexing
| on helping our users figure out the severity of their insomnia
| and their sleep habits so we can create a personalized program,
| so our survey can be quite lengthy. Will definitely look into
| making it shorter. We do have pricing information in our FAQ
| (https://stellarsleep.com/faqs) but yes, it's easily missed on
| the page with other information. We'll look into making it
| clearer to our users.
| lxe wrote:
| Be honest, do the survey answers affect the resulting
| program? I literally put in random numbers and answers each
| time and it took me to the same exact payment page.
|
| There's also a "loading" screen that doesn't do anything
| except spin.
|
| You also throw in random interstitials all over the place
| making it even slower to onboard.
|
| You use savvyy nocode builder and this "onboarding" looks
| eerily similar to their "sleep app" template:
| https://trysavvy.com/example/sleep-reset-assessment.
|
| I see this playbook far too often. I'm sorry, but it sucks.
|
| Be honest with your users. Just provide them with clear info
| about what your service does and how it does it, and how much
| it costs, off the get go.
| edreichua wrote:
| Thank you for the feedback! We'll make information
| regarding pricing and program clearer to our users.
|
| Regarding your question, we do send the survey results to
| our backend, and based on that, we 1. generate a sleep
| report 2. assign you to one of several tracks we have. We
| also personalize your specific program within the track
| (e.g. we'll adjust your sleep restriction window based on
| your sleep efficiency etc).
| spdif899 wrote:
| You're missing the point - sure a long questionnaire is
| annoying but the real complaint here is the fact your site's
| primary CTA is to go straight into a survey that does not
| mention it will require payment afterwards.
|
| You're effectively holding users (and especially their data)
| hostage by exploiting sunk cost fallacy, rather than letting
| the value of your product stand on its own weight.
|
| Here is a recent thread on this exact topic with much more
| discussion about how user-hostile this is, and how it makes
| many assume that your primary goal is to collect data to sell
| rather than to help any individual with any benevolent task.
|
| Dear websites, stop asking for ransom sign-ups
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36962502
| edreichua wrote:
| Thanks for sharing! Will look into how we can make the fact
| that this is a paid app more apparent from the onset. We do
| have pricing information on our homepage
| (https://stellarsleep.com/faqs) but I'll be the first to
| admit that it's not easy to find.
| wussboy wrote:
| That is curious, since price is the first thing many
| people look for. You'd think it would be displayed
| prominently. The fact it's not almost makes one wonder if
| there is something untoward happening.
| asaddhamani wrote:
| It costs $63 per month and you need to pay quarterly. I
| guess that's why it's buried.
| robertlagrant wrote:
| Wow! Is this mostly meant to be prescribed rather than
| subscribed to?
| TylerE wrote:
| Nothing shows confidence in your product quite like
| requiring an extended lock-in, does it?
| hmcq6 wrote:
| the `/faqs` page is not the homepage.
|
| Why is pricing on the `/faqs` page and not it's own page?
|
| Hanlon's razor doesn't apply to YC backed startups. This
| is shady not sloppy.
| rmbyrro wrote:
| Your pricing is buried inside a collapsed FAQ? I was
| charitable to you when reading these comments, since I
| know sales is hard, but this is as shady as I've never
| seen before. It's a shame, because it casts a shadow on
| everything else and makes me question whether I should
| give you credit and really try this...
| ekanes wrote:
| I don't think you're really hearing the feedback here.
|
| When someone says "you're being shady" the right answer
| isn't "we'll look into how we can be less shady." The
| right answer is "oh snap, you're right. Sorry. We'll fix
| this asap please check back later today."
| mbesto wrote:
| Please, please, please stop listening to random engineers who
| aren't marketing people provide advice about marketing.
|
| Your business needs paying customers.
|
| That being said...the parent comment does make a valid point
| about this potentially being a dark pattern. I think a
| reasonable disclosure (small txt on bottom "free trial for 14
| days" or something like that) is probably a reasonable way to
| inform users.
| skupig wrote:
| GP is explicitly not interested in giving marketing advice.
| They're objecting to being tricked and manipulated.
| confoundcofound wrote:
| Future.co does this too and it was really irritating. 20
| screens of questions, interstitial ads for the product I'm
| signing up for sprinkled throughout, all to funnel me to a
| payment page for a service experience that isn't commensurately
| influenced by my inputs. They make you do an introductory call
| with your coach too, where much of that information could be
| provided instead, and in a more human way.
| robertlagrant wrote:
| It does seem basically the same as signing up for a scam
| success course.
| foolinaround wrote:
| What benefits can one perceive in the first 7 days, to make a
| decision on whether it is worth it or not?
| edreichua wrote:
| Great question! Our users see a 6 point improvement in ISI
| (insomnia severity index) on average in the first 7 days, which
| represent a categorical improvement in insomnia severity e.g.
| from severe (clinical) insomnia to moderate (clinical)
| insomnia, or moderate (clinical) insomnia to mild insomnia. ISI
| continues to improve during the program, and the benefits are
| sustained after that.
|
| Another important consideration is patient adherence (i.e. how
| likely someone is going to stay for the program), which is
| something that many digital health apps (and even in-person
| therapy) struggle with. A lot of this is influenced by personal
| preference too (do you prefer reading, or watching a video, or
| listening to an audio to consume content etc). So you can tell
| from the first 7 days if our approach resonates with you.
|
| We also have a 30-day moneyback guarantee, so if the program
| doesn't work for you, we'll be happy to issue a refund.
| unconvinced2354 wrote:
| I checked out the website. You answer a variety of questions and
| the website tells you "yes, you definitely have insomnia, and we
| can definitely help you", and then it asks you for your credit
| card. I've seen that before. What I haven't seen is even the most
| basic description of HOW it's going to help.
| edreichua wrote:
| We are still in the process of improving the survey, so your
| feedback is super valuable. So far, we have been over-indexing
| on helping our users figure out the severity of their insomnia
| and their sleep habits so we can create a personalized program.
|
| Just out of curiosity, what kind of information will be helpful
| for you? We thought of including a flow chart showing what
| you'll be doing each week (e.g. dealing with a racing mind,
| cognitive restructuring, stimulus control, sleep restriction
| etc.) on the program, and also some of the information in
| https://stellarsleep.com/science. Do you think that will be
| helpful?
| ThinkBeat wrote:
| I hate this shit.
|
| People making app for serious medical issues and telling people.
| they be cured. They just need to believe in the founders. believe
| in the app and then they shall be healed Hallelujah.
|
| It is the app version of snake oil, and tv healing. Keep your arm
| on the tv right now.
|
| How about we make a surgery app? For a monthly fee it will tell
| you how to perform safe surgery on your friends and neighbors.
| Have a side hustle. Avoid huge hospital bills.
|
| Oh we can't do that because it would be dangerous and unethical?
|
| Well the brain is an unknown number of magnitudes more
| complicated than our physical structure.
|
| The industry producing apps to "fix your brain" in 6 easy
| installments.
|
| There is a good reason people go to med school and spend a lot of
| time specializing. There is a good reason for psychologists going
| to school and specializing. and even then, they have a hard time
| knowing what to do, because the science is not there yet.
|
| Had you actually been able to to solve the complex collections of
| disorders and issues that may cause insomnia would you be looking
| at a Nobel prize.
|
| Not $10 every month on the app store. (or however much it is)
| 221qqwe wrote:
| > Not $10 every month on the app store. (or however much it is)
|
| $63 per month with a minimum 3 month subscription... so yeah...
|
| However, if we're being fair "treating" insomnia is not exactly
| surgery there are clearly "self-help" style approaches and
| general lifestyle changes which would be helpful for many/most
| people suffering from it.
|
| I mean that fact that you can't "cure" it 100% for everyone is
| not a good reason not to try. I don't think the all or nothing
| approach is very constructive. Helping some people to some
| extent is still better than nothing (no clue if the app is
| worth it or not, although given the pricing and the way it's
| presented, I'm also leaning towards snake oil)
| avinassh wrote:
| I don't get it. Can you explain does this work and helps me sleep
| better?
| brogrammernot wrote:
| I feel like the various readme and the landing pages do a good
| job of explaining the CBT-I psychology.
|
| What parts of the learn more sections or pages didn't make
| sense to you?
| qwytw wrote:
| Why is it worth paying 60$+ a month for a 3 month minimum
| subscription(what's with that anyway..)? You could buy
| multiple CBT-I books for that.
| darcien wrote:
| Do you have plan for offering regional pricing? After finding the
| pricing deep inside the knowledge base, I'm shocked at the
| monthly price which costs 20% of the minimum monthly pay in my
| area.
| edreichua wrote:
| Currently, we are not doing regional pricing, but you can pay
| for our app using your HSA/ FAS through our partnership with
| Flex: https://withflex.com/partners/stellar-sleep. We also
| offer financial assistance plan. Check out
| https://support.stellarsleep.com/portal/en/kb/articles/is-
| th.... We will respond to you within 1 business day.
| qwytw wrote:
| > but you can pay for our app using your HSA/ FAS through our
| partnership with Flex
|
| Presumably they can't? If they are not in the US..
| darcien wrote:
| TIL about HSA/FAS. Like what the sibling comment said, it's
| not a thing in my place. Thanks anyway, I'll check out the
| trial first.
| siliconc0w wrote:
| An issue with these health apps is that HIPAA doesn't protect
| your data on these platforms so they can sell your patient data
| (I have no knowledge whether they do but many similar apps do and
| if they 'exit' new ownership would be able to)
|
| My personal experience is that I have found 50mg Trazadone as
| needed to be pretty helpful (rarely need at this point, just
| knowing I have it as backup is nice or if I have one bad night it
| doesn't become a pattern), some of the Huberman sleep stuff like
| NSDR, and the usual sleep hygiene stuff (regular bedtime, blue
| light glasses, cooling the room a bit more).
| coremoff wrote:
| I noped out when you have to take the ISI to continue any further
| and then the only access to the results is via email (and wasn't
| a fan of the prechecked send-me-spam checkbox).
| georgewangsf wrote:
| Just to clarify, you do get your ISI score (and the sleep
| benchmarking information) immediately after you answer those
| relevant sections in the quiz, without having to enter your
| email. Entering your email basically just gives you the
| consolidated report in one place.
| edreichua wrote:
| Thank you for your feedback! The reason why we needed your
| email is because we generate your sleep report and your
| personalized program asynchronously in our backend, but we can
| definitely consider showing some of the results immediately
| after the quiz without gating it. That being said, we promise
| not to spam (on average we send no more than 3 emails to users
| who stop engaging), and you can always unsubscribe from our
| mailing list.
| coremoff wrote:
| I also think that this page shouldn't be burried in the
| knowledge base section: https://support.stellarsleep.com/port
| al/en/kb/articles/how-m...
|
| Given the dark pattern around email, I immediately assumed
| your monetization was going to be via selling ads or personal
| data - I see that might not be the case, however I think that
| not making this very clear from the start is consumer
| unfriendly, particularly when your customer base is a self-
| described sleep-deprived individual who probably has mental
| health issues (which describes me, FWIW).
| edreichua wrote:
| Ok this is super helpful. We do have a FAQ section with the
| same information (https://stellarsleep.com/faqs) but yes, I
| totally agree with you. I never even thought that our users
| might assume that we'll be selling ads or their personal
| data so this is very useful context. FWIW, we take privacy
| very seriously and we're HIPPA compliant. In fact, we do
| work with several sleep clinics where providers actually
| refer their patients to our app, so we have very strict
| protections when it comes to personal data and PHI.
| coremoff wrote:
| Thank you for this reply, it has been helpful - I will
| have another go this evening at home
| edreichua wrote:
| Of course, let me know if you have any questions. Feel
| free to ping us at founders@stellarsleep.com
| edreichua wrote:
| In case this is useful for anyone, you can pay for our app using
| HSA/ FAS through our partnership with Flex:
| https://withflex.com/partners/stellar-sleep. There is a 7-day
| trial with the option of canceling anytime within the app itself.
| We also have a 30-day money-back guarantee, so if you decide at
| any point within 30 days that the program is not for you, you can
| get a full refund, no questions asked.
| fswd wrote:
| to me it took quitting coffee. But it took over 200 days to begin
| to notice. It's not as simple as quitting coffee for a few weeks.
| and really, 1-2 years.
| mtalantikite wrote:
| Do you have any links to the research behind these CBT-I
| interventions? I'm curious what treatment looks like. I had never
| considered that I may have insomnia until just now, as I fall
| asleep fast and usually only wake up once during the night.
| However, I often wake up groggy and not feeling refreshed. I
| started tracking my sleep a couple months ago with a series 8
| Apple Watch and consistently see only 20-45 minutes in a "deep
| sleep" phase.
|
| I'd totally pay for this if it's something that might work, but
| honestly am skeptical about it working for my particular sort of
| sleep pattern. Congrats on the launch!
| edreichua wrote:
| Thanks! And yes, here are a few articles if you're interested:
|
| [1] https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-
| conditions/insomnia/in-d...
|
| [2] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6796223/
|
| There's also more information on
| https://stellarsleep.com/science.
|
| If you don't think you have insomnia (you fall asleep fast and
| you stay asleep long enough), then you probably don't have
| chronic insomnia, which is what our app is designed for. That
| said, if you find yourself feeling groggy or not refreshed
| despite getting sufficient sleep, I would recommend that you
| talk to your physician. You might still find our app helpful
| (so give it a try and cancel if it doesn't work - we also have
| a 30-day moneyback guarantee), but just want to point out that
| our target audience is people with chronic insomnia.
| fburnaby wrote:
| I have no expertise, but this is my sleep. It turns out I have
| sleep apnea. I can "sleep" for 8 hours, but it does very little
| good. With apnea, you wake up as much as a few times an hour,
| getting very little REM. It took me years to consider apnea
| because I'm thin and somewhat fit. But all sorts can have it.
| seancoleman wrote:
| I'm sure you're aware of https://www.sleepio.com (I followed
| their program a few years back). They use the same (similar?) CBT
| approach and I do think it helped but was far from a silver
| bullet.
|
| Does Stellar Sleep delve into sleep hygiene? Are "edge cases"
| considered e.g. some people report no difference with cutting
| caffeine (as mentioned) but others cut caffeine and instantly
| their insomnia is cured and their lives change.
| edreichua wrote:
| Yes, we're aware of sleepio. Unfortunately, sleepio is only
| available via their partnership with major employers, so most
| people in the US will not be able to access their program.
|
| Both Stellar Sleep and Sleepio are based on behavioral
| psychology. Sleepio is a weekly program (I believe you spend an
| hour each week). From our experience and also through user
| interviews, we found that it's easier for patients to follow a
| daily program (we offer daily bite-sized modules so you don't
| have to spend more than 5 - 10 minutes a day).
|
| Also good point! We do delve into sleep hygiene - that being
| said, our target audience is people with chronic insomnia
| (insomnia 3+ nights per week for 3 months or longer). While
| common advice such as "avoid caffeine after 4pm", "limit
| alcohol in the evening to no more than 2 drinks before 7pm" or
| "minimize the use of blue-light emitting devices an hour before
| sleep" are helpful, there is little evidence that sleep hygiene
| alone is sufficient to treat chronic insomnia.
| georgewangsf wrote:
| I'd also add that the big "open secret" in the sleep research
| community is that yes, CBT for insomnia is a great starting
| point, but it needs to be followed up with further
| psychology-based care. Sleepio is a great starting point and
| Stellar Sleep also delivers CBT for insomnia-based
| programming initially. The difference is that we then
| transition into continued psychology-based programming which
| sustains the results of the initial CBT for insomnia work.
| debarshri wrote:
| How do I sign up for this and pay? This is exactly what I need at
| this point in my life.
| georgewangsf wrote:
| To sign up, please go to our homepage and complete our sleep
| quiz. We require you to complete a quiz in order to develop a
| program that is personalized to our specific sleep needs.
|
| You can see our pricing information here:
| https://stellarsleep.com/faqs
| satvikpendem wrote:
| If you have insomnia, get checked for sleep apnea. I used to
| sleep more than the recommended 8 hours until I discovered that I
| was actually running on fumes and adrenalin most of the day and
| couldn't sleep at night until early in the morning whereupon I
| overslept. Now, I can fall sleep at a sane hour and sleep the
| recommended amount of time.
| georgewangsf wrote:
| Totally agree with this. Doing a sleep study and getting a CPAP
| machine, makes a big difference for those with obstructive
| sleep apnea.
| ryanwaggoner wrote:
| You give an "average rating" of 4.8 with "500+ five star
| reviews", but Apple says 4.5 with 173 total ratings, and Android
| says 4.3 with 205 total ratings. Which sure makes it look like
| your average is not 4.8, nor have you received 500+ ratings at
| all, let alone 500+ five star ratings.
| georgewangsf wrote:
| Ryan, I believe the discrepancy here boils down to 2 things.
| (1) We have a lot of users outside of the US and the stats
| you're looking at are only for the US App Store/Play Store, and
| (2) We've had several product updates including a re-branding
| which "resets" ratings. The ratings you see are the ratings for
| the current version of the app.
| lukko wrote:
| Well done for launching! I'm just very conscious of over-claiming
| and pseudoscience in this space...
|
| Is this classed as a medical device / SaMD? Does it require FDA /
| MHRA approval or CE marking? Why is there information on your
| website about Fatal Familial Insomnia when it is vanishingly rare
| and has only been reported a few dozen times worldwide? Are those
| self-reported improvements in sleep and can you measure more
| objectively with polysomnography?
|
| In the UK there's an app called Sleepio which is NICE-approved
| and prescribed to patients - is your app similar? One last
| question - how did you come up with the pricing ($63 per month)?
| RomanPushkin wrote:
| > tried everything from cutting coffee, blocking blue light, to
| taking melatonin and antihistamine, but couldn't find anything
| that worked
|
| Suggestion from a friend: 1/4 to 1/3 of a liberty cap before
| going to bed.
|
| From another friend: "the sleep cycle normalized after 2 weeks
| sleeping in Maui with open window and swimming in the ocean every
| day. Now I don't need to take melatonin and magnesium"
| tailspin2019 wrote:
| Edit: removed my initial reactionary negative feedback - it was
| already said by other comments.
|
| I would just echo what others have said about the long onboarding
| survey and paywall.
|
| Hope you can continue iterating and you listen to the feedback,
| both good and bad! Good luck!
| bubbleRefuge wrote:
| I think I've had chronic insomnia for about 20 years now. I sleep
| 5 or 6 hours on good nights. Sometimes less. Don't have trouble
| falling asleep. The prob is waking and tossing and turning. Agree
| that the problem is probably psychological combined with aging.
| Since i cant forsake work, computer and cell phone screens for a
| year on a beach in mexico(which I think would fix the problem)
| I'll try the app.
| greatNespresso wrote:
| I don't know if this is voluntary but, personal opinion, not
| seeing the pricing upfront makes me not willing to start a 20min
| questionnaire. How do you monetize / plan to monetize this?
| greatNespresso wrote:
| Ok read the other comments and it looks like the pricing page
| comes after you filled the questionnaire.
| georgewangsf wrote:
| Thanks for the comment! You can also find our pricing
| information here: https://stellarsleep.com/faqs
|
| Given all the feedback, we're thinking it might be useful for
| us to create a separate page just for pricing as well.
| greatNespresso wrote:
| Thank you for replying! Will give a look to the pricing.
| Your app looks cool otherwise and I may be interested as
| well so that's why I wanted to share my feedback :) Good
| luck people!
| greatNespresso wrote:
| Side note, the question "Can I pay with FSA / HSA" does not
| unfold on mobile.
| georgewangsf wrote:
| Thanks for the heads up! We'll look into this. For now,
| you can go here for FSA/HSA payment instructions: https:/
| /support.stellarsleep.com/portal/en/kb/articles/stell...
| siva7 wrote:
| I still have no clue what a typical day using your app will look
| like. Yes, you are providing a "How it works" section but it
| still leaves me clueless about How it really works and no, i'm
| not gonna sign up to find it out.
| edreichua wrote:
| Happy to provide more information here.
|
| We start by understanding a person's immediate sleep-related
| challenges and providing them with practical strategies for
| dealing with them. Then, we drill down on the underlying
| psychological drivers of a person's chronic insomnia and create
| a personalized program to resolve those drivers one by one.
|
| Every day, you will go through a set of modules (5 - 10 minutes
| each day) that teaches you the psychology skills you need to
| get better sleep. The modules presented will be based on what
| we think will be most effective for you, given your sleep
| patterns.
|
| Our modules are often video based (short animated videos
| featuring our mascot - Merlin the owl) and audio based, and we
| have interactive modules, text based modules etc. Topics in the
| first phase of the program include how to deal with a racing
| mind, cognitive restructuring, techniques for general
| relaxation, stimulus control and sleep restriction therapy.
|
| You'll also be recording your sleep each day, and this will
| help us:
|
| + Further personalize your program
|
| + Recommend a sleep restriction window for the following week.
|
| Hope this answer your question!
| andrebotelho wrote:
| Big fan of you guys. The app really helped with stabilizing my
| sleep pattern.
| georgewangsf wrote:
| Thanks Andre!
| BenGuz wrote:
| Cool idea - can you say more up front about how this works? I
| went through the (long) survey just to get a paywall with no
| information on what to expect.
|
| Also, do you plan to offer a version of this for teenagers? I
| noticed the youngest age range is 20.
| polonbike wrote:
| Same here. It does mention a daily email with advice and
| strategies, but I also feel like the paywall should appear
| after one week, not before any possibility to try what you are
| offering
| edreichua wrote:
| Thanks for the feedback! We're definitely interested in
| exploring a freemium model. Currently, what we offer is a
| 7-day trial, with the option of canceling anytime within the
| app itself. We also have a 30-day moneyback guarantee, so if
| you decide at any point within 30 days that the program is
| not for you, you can get a full refund, no questions asked.
| edreichua wrote:
| Yes of course. After you fill up the survey, we will be able to
| recommend a personalized program for you that's tailored to
| your sleep habits.
|
| The way it works is everyday, you will spend 5 - 10 minutes
| completing modules related to sleep/ psychology. These modules
| can be video or text based and is based on cognitive behavioral
| therapy for insomnia (CBT-I), which is the first-line treatment
| recommended by the American Academy of Sleep Medicine.
|
| You also record your sleep on the app, so we can further
| personalize your program and also apply an algorithm to analyze
| your sleep patterns and adjust your bedtime automatically to
| improve your overall sleep quality.
|
| You can learn more on https://stellarsleep.com/science.
|
| Our app is recommended for 18yo and above. Hope this answers
| your question!
| hmcq6 wrote:
| So for $63 a month customers can expect the app to:
|
| - send them a daily quiz and youtube video
|
| - suggest a bedtime
|
| Is that an accurate summary?
| GGO wrote:
| [flagged]
| smallerfish wrote:
| From a pricing perspective, I think your incentives are
| misaligned with your users', which is a problem.
|
| On a monthly model, you want users to keep renewing. However,
| users want their insomnia to be cured quickly.
|
| What about flat pricing instead? 7 days free to get over the
| pricing friction, $150 to purchase a license to the customized
| program, possibly with a fairly weak warranty (minimum 10%
| improvement in sleep time in the first 6 months or your money
| back.)
|
| Now your incentives are the same - get them "fixed" as quickly as
| possible and off the platform (and obviously upselling them on
| affiliate/related stuff if happy.)
| georgewangsf wrote:
| Thank you for sharing your perspective on our pricing model. I
| genuinely appreciate that feedback.
|
| We actually started our beta launch with a one-off pricing
| model. We only moved to the monthly model because we discovered
| through feedback from our beta users that chronic insomnia is
| fundamentally different from occasional sleep problems or light
| sleeping issues. Instead, chronic insomnia often comes from
| deep-rooted psychological factors, like unresolved anxiety,
| chronic stress, or burnout. These underlying issues can't
| typically be addressed with short-term solutions or quick
| fixes.
|
| That's precisely why we believe a one-off program might not
| provide the continuous support and adaptability required to
| address such nuanced/varied problems. Our monthly model
| actually creates a strong incentive for us to provide a highly
| effective product. After all, no one is going to keep paying us
| if our product doesn't continue to help them. As a result, we
| continuously invest a ton of resources into developing new,
| top-notch clinical content, make it incredibly engaging via
| animated videos, and are always refining our offerings based on
| user feedback and the latest research.
| gr0wthhack3r wrote:
| (Disclaimer: I joined the Stellar Sleep team after they got
| into YC, partly because I also had insomnia for many years
| and went through a full $1000+ in-person CTB-I treatment
| regimen which helped quite a bit)
|
| To add to George's point, people w/ chronic insomnia (like
| myself) had gotten this stage of consistent poor sleep after
| many month or years of negative behavioral/psychological
| conditioning. To see permanent improvement, it'll also take
| many months of positive conditioning. And there will be
| occasional relapses (due to new triggers, etc). And this is
| the case even if you go through a very good in-person CTB-I
| program that costs thousands of dollars.
|
| Our pricing model (quarterly, and in the future, monthly) is
| tailored toward the changing needs of our users. The goal is
| to equip our patients with an arsenal of tools to manage
| their sleep problems depending on the root cause, and help
| them recover from relapses more quickly when they need it,
| with similar efficacy as seeing an in-person specialist at a
| fraction of the cost.
| slothtrop wrote:
| Add it to the pile. I think this is an important issue, but I
| don't understand why devs are compelled to create apps when the
| goal is just telegraphing information, and you only need to do
| that once. That's what books are for. I guess you'd have to count
| on there being a demographic that only wants to absorb
| information through apps.
|
| Much of the content is (and ought to be) freely available
| information anyway, at least for boilerplate CBT-i (see e.g.
| https://insomniasos.net/). Obfuscating what is the size of a
| buzzfeed article behind payments and apps to make a buck is
| absurd.
|
| Seeing a professional is one option, but ymmv. GPs don't seem to
| know much about this and reflexively prescribe pills because
| that's what people want and expect of them. Sleep specialists can
| be good, but the source material behind their approach can be
| limited and dated (like CBT-i itself). What I did is read a pile
| of research articles (maniacally at first), and books. It's not
| for everyone, but you'll find more useful information than in
| glorified advertisements in google searches.
| edreichua wrote:
| Thanks for the comment - I'm glad that you were able to find
| help online! Similar to you, I do consume a lot of content (and
| research articles) online, but to your point they are not for
| everyone. There's a lot of information online (some accurate,
| many not) that sometimes it's hard to tease out what's actually
| going to help especially for people who are sleep deprived.
| That's why we work with top sleep experts to create an app that
| users can trust, and we also conduct clinical studies with
| Harvard medical school/ Brigham's to validate our results.
|
| That said, we do offer more than just information. We allow
| users to track their sleep on our app so we can customize our
| program. Each user goes through a personalized track based on
| their sleep habits. We also automatically calculate your sleep
| restriction window for you. We also have relaxation content
| that you can listen to right before you go to bed, a worry/
| gratitude journal and a routine tracker.
| ffhhttt wrote:
| > There's a lot of information online (some accurate, many
| not)
|
| Books by (relatively) renowned/trustworthy experts are also a
| thing and they all cost less than your monthly subscription.
| georgewangsf wrote:
| Books are a fantastic resource in this space. We made this into
| a 5-10 minute a day mobile app for a few reasons:
|
| + A lot of people don't have the time or patience to invest
| several hours into reading a book. They'd prefer things broken
| down into actionable steps. In fact, we've done a lot of
| product testing to figure out how to improve program efficacy
| and we found out that the shorter and more "bite-sized" we made
| our modules, the more willing our users were to follow them,
| and the better their result.
|
| + The big "open secret" in the sleep research community is that
| yes, CBT for insomnia is a great starting point, but it needs
| to be followed up with further psychology-based care. Stellar
| Sleep delivers CBT for insomnia-based programming initially,
| then transitions into continued psychology-based programming
| which sustains the results of the initial CBT for insomnia
| work.
| a6man wrote:
| Incredible just how much of the USA has insomnia - do you have
| any plans to go global or raise awareness of the problem itself?
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