[HN Gopher] Ways to teach kids to code (2016)
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Ways to teach kids to code (2016)
Author : osbre
Score : 66 points
Date : 2023-08-04 18:57 UTC (4 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (medium.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (medium.com)
| tromp wrote:
| I'd like to add Robozzle as a suggestion, a robot (turtle like)
| programming puzzle game, available on both Android and iOS. While
| simple in operation, the puzzles quickly become very challenging.
| Stepping through the program execution, with the ability to set
| breakpoints on the playing grid, feels a little bit like
| debugging.
| MKais wrote:
| Is it still useful to teach kids how to code? I'm genuinely
| asking. I am the father of two 12-year-olds and I'm teaching them
| how to code, but I wonder if it will really be useful in the long
| run, in a world where there is ChatGPT, AI code assistants, and,
| most importantly, everything else that will emerge in the coming
| decade (i.e. english to code and whatnot)
| nonethewiser wrote:
| Well all of those things already exist. What kind of things are
| your 12 year ilds able to do with them? Could they work as a
| software engineer now?
| mirekrusin wrote:
| Is it useful to teach kids adding numbers? Computers can do it
| millions of times faster/larger numbers for decades.
| lordnacho wrote:
| Coding is the 21st century version of what literacy was in the
| 19th century.
|
| Not everyone back then knew how to read and write, but enough
| people did to substantially change society. If you could read
| and write there was work that only you could do in the new
| economy. At the same time, being literate did not mean you were
| the new Shakespeare, you were probably using it for something
| mundane like sending letters on behalf of a business.
|
| Likewise with coding. There will be loads of jobs that only a
| code literate person can do. It's also quite possible that you
| don't write any large or important piece of software, your
| whole life's work might be a bunch of python scripts that glue
| together other people's contributions.
|
| Knowing how to code is also similar to literacy in another
| sense. The literate will be the first people to access new
| ideas. Want to read Das Kapital? Gotta know how to read. Want
| to know how an AI assistant works? Gotta know how to code.
| lhorie wrote:
| That's a strange way to frame it. Every skill is useful in some
| context. As a parent, I think a more productive way to think
| about it is to ask whether teaching kids anything is in line
| with your values. For me, I'd prefer if my kids were well
| rounded from being exposed to many different things, so they
| can make informed decisions later in life. That means they have
| lego mindstorms, but if they say they like tennis or they spend
| time drawing sidescroller games and not twirling to nutcracker
| ballet videos, then so be it. For some parents, laser focusing
| on something might be considered preferable.
| grokblah wrote:
| They forgot Scratch!
|
| https://scratch.mit.edu
| pkdpic wrote:
| I love these suggestions, especially the card game and making
| their own website.
|
| I had my first real dev job when my son was born and I gave how
| to teach him code / reading / math a lot of thought. I tried
| speak and spells, workbooks, little toy pretend computers that
| had math games etc.
|
| In the end just giving him a raspberry pi with ubuntu, a big kids
| keyboard and no mouse seems to have been all he ever needs /
| wants. It boots directly into the Unix shell, I aliased a little
| speak and spell script I tossed together and some shortcuts to
| music on youtube. And he doesn't even really need those.
|
| He learned the basics much faster than I expected. Opening python
| for math, prepending "say" to words to have them read out loud
| (took some tooling in ubuntu...), control + C, control + W etc
| all seem to make general sense. And the slowness of the pi seems
| to help.
|
| Anyway he started reading before turning three and seems to be
| doing well enough with math and basic variable assignment for
| whatever that's worth. Helping him make a website and getting him
| using git seems like a fun next step.
|
| Now if only I could get him to care about anything more than his
| hotwheels collection...
| rozularen wrote:
| how is he doing right now?
| querez wrote:
| > Now if only I could get him to care about anything more than
| his hotwheels collection...
|
| he's a kid, es supposed to care more about that than anything
| else.
| tmpz22 wrote:
| Hey now if the kid hasn't elevated themselves through 3 FANNG
| roles by the age of 8 how could they ever make a meaningful
| impact on the world of ad-tech?
| dr_kiszonka wrote:
| A solid list, bookmarked. For me, the main challenge is getting
| kids interested in coding and not discouraging them as they
| learn. (I have a tendency to correct them too frequently.)
| moritonal wrote:
| I feel like it's missing the entire catalog of Zachtronics.
| chaosprint wrote:
| how about making music with synth-style language?
|
| https://glicol.org/
|
| the ablenton learningmusic is also a good resource:
|
| https://learningmusic.ableton.com/
| dang wrote:
| We changed the url from
| https://web.archive.org/web/20220810201855/https://transmiss....
| Please don't use archive.org links unless the original source is
| truly unavailable elsewhere.
|
| https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=false&qu...
| linuxftw wrote:
| We don't need to make everything kid friendly. There were no fun
| algebra games, you just did the work. You didn't even understand
| why the work was useful, you just had to do it.
|
| When kids have the mental faculties advanced enough to learn
| computer programming, you teach them just like you teach algebra.
| mirekrusin wrote:
| Seeing my kid what he does/knows about numbers after watching
| numberblocks and playing with printouts of those little guys
| he's asking for - before knowing how to read - I can't disagree
| more.
|
| The best secret of life is that you need to fall in love with
| practicing what you want to achieve.
|
| There is no better way than through play.
| rajamaka wrote:
| There are many different paths to the same goal. Some kids are
| maybe better off just picking up C documentation and going
| straight for it. Some are better starting with some web based
| gamified psuedo language.
| linuxftw wrote:
| No. If you have to infantilize something for them, they're
| not capable of learning it.
| muti wrote:
| Kids learn to read with children's books, not by reading
| Ulysses
| linuxftw wrote:
| That's an age appropriate activity. They don't make a
| children's calculus book.
| HenryBemis wrote:
| I politely disagree. I have used hundreds/thousands of
| times in my life the "ELI5" method to explain anything and
| everything from IT security to budgeting, and it helps
| people understand. It will bore some of the audience in a
| call, but it will get the job done.
| jes5199 wrote:
| iPad apps LightBot and CodeSpark both introduce algorithmic
| concepts and are fairly fun
| seeknotfind wrote:
| I learned to code solving mazes! :)
|
| I would also add to this list: controlling room light colors or
| modifying websites you visit.
|
| For people new to code, seeing results immediately is very
| important. All the theory, printlns, etc, it can be hard to see
| how it's useful.
| BasedAnon wrote:
| my favorite is to put a linux install without internet in front
| of them and a book on python
| mbork_pl wrote:
| A few weeks ago I learned about Hedy (https://hedy.org/). Looks
| pretty interesting (despite the fact that I'm not a big Python
| fan).
|
| It is a programming language and a web-based environment which
| "grows with the user". In the beginning, you can only ask for a
| user input, print it out (optionally prepending some string) and
| do very simple turtle graphics (with only right angles). Then new
| concepts are introduced gradually (variables, lists, loops,
| conditionals etc.). In the end you have a functional subset of
| Python.
|
| Also, there are quite a few premade exercises/miniprojects to
| explore.
|
| Note: I'm neither the author or a contributor of Hedy, I've just
| learned about it and found it interesting.
| avgDev wrote:
| I don't see it mentioned and I am bit surprised, but teaching
| kids how to breakdown "common" tasks into instructions. No
| programming language needed. Then, introducing edge cases.
|
| I remember a programmer making a video about their child writing
| instructions to "make p&j" sandwich. Did you check if you have
| PB? What happens if you don't? Did you put the bread down first?
| Or are you applying PB to the counter.
| seabass-labrax wrote:
| That's the imperative programming case. Declarative programming
| is about defining each part of the final result.
|
| What's a peanut butter and jelly and sandwich (the result)?
| It's a slice of bread atop a layer of peanut butter atop a
| layer of jelly atop a slice of bread. Recursively define each
| part, for instance defining a layer of jelly in terms of
| manipulated blobs of jelly. Reverse the order of the
| definitions if using an early-binding language.
| (setq p&j-sandwich '(bread-slice peanut-butter-layer jelly-
| layer bread-slice)) ;; TODO work out why jelly layer
| isn't transferred to sandwich in one piece (setq bread-
| slice (with-tool bread-knife (slice bread-loaf))) (setq
| jelly-layer (with-tool table-knife (spread jelly-blob)))
| ...
|
| Disclaimer: I've never eaten nor made a P&J sandwich; please
| consider this code experimental...
| croisillon wrote:
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cDA3_5982h8
| wizofaus wrote:
| As someone who does this regularly as a code club volunteer I'm
| not sure I see much useful advice there. Honestly the biggest
| challenge is accepting that within a group of kids the same age
| there'll be enormous variation in ability and motivation to pick
| up learning how to code. And what I have no real insight into is
| whether it even makes any difference in the long run (i.e. how
| many of the kids that do the whole course go on to make
| programming a significant part of their lives, or even if they
| don't, have it genuinely help them in some way). Still, I know I
| only got where I am today because my Dad sat down with me at age
| 9 or 10 and introduced me to programming - something obviously
| not all parents can do - so hopefully at least a few of these
| kids will get the same benefit.
| throwaway75849 wrote:
| Are you able to convey some more general or high-level
| understanding, such as: "A procedure has a starting point,
| steps in sequence, possible repeated steps, and an end point."
| For example, one could start with trying to describe/document
| how to move physically in a room to get from one place to
| another. Then suggest, e.g. as a bridge, most computers can
| only work with a written descriptions of a procedure.
| [deleted]
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