[HN Gopher] Open Source Outdoor Air Quality Monitor
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Open Source Outdoor Air Quality Monitor
Author : ahaucnx
Score : 99 points
Date : 2023-07-29 17:59 UTC (5 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.airgradient.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.airgradient.com)
| traceroute66 wrote:
| Time for the usual reminder that there is a search function on
| the bottom of every single YC page.
|
| Air gradient has been extensively discussed here multiple times
| already.
| frognumber wrote:
| I don't mind the repost. It's doing good work. It's good to be
| reminded of it, and it's a slightly different thing each time.
| I'll buy it when it's ready for prime time.
|
| The founder reads this.
|
| Founder: What's held me back from buying this is a lack of
| github links and instructions. EVERY place you say "open
| source" should link to the repo. The repo should have CLEAR
| instructions for how to hack this.
|
| There's a lot of copy like "We provide detailed instructions
| and videos" but NO hyperlink to said detailed instructions or
| videos. Any place you mention specs should link to ACTUAL
| specs. What's your BOM? What microcontroller are you using? Do
| I rewrite the firmware in Python? Rust? MakeCode? Etc.
|
| Those are the tires I want to kick. If my child can program
| this in MakeCode and it's designed for tinkering, it's a no-
| brainer. If it's on github, and easy to set up to work from my
| desktop, it's reasonable. If it involves setting up docker
| containers and proprietary environments for hacking C code,
| it's not as obvious a buy. If I can't figure out how to get
| started in 30 seconds, I assume it's the last one. I have a lot
| of projects around the house I wish I'd done, and I'm not
| buying more until a few of those finish.
|
| Also, I will never pay for your service. The whole point of
| open everything is I control my data.
|
| The other piece I'd like is a dirt-cheap set of temperature /
| humidity tools. I bought an 8-channel weather station, so I can
| monitor temperature indoors and in each room. I'd love to
| switch to something more open.
|
| Again, a lot of this comes down to how easy it is to get
| started. If I can make dashboards in 5 minutes with numpy /
| plotly / pylab / etc., I'm delighted. If I can't, but it's not
| bad, I'm grumpier. etc.
|
| So in conclusion, I'd do user studies and think-aloud protocols
| with customers.
| kayson wrote:
| The guy who runs air gradient posts his articles here pretty
| frequently. Not sure at what point, if any, it breaks the
| rules. It definitely feels a little spammy to me though.
| hutzlibu wrote:
| I think there is no rule limiting new links. If it gets voted
| up, it makes it. And reposting existing links is ok every 6
| months or so (I think).
| declan_roberts wrote:
| I don't understand, is this a problem?
|
| There's nothing new under the sun.
| philshem wrote:
| > ...there is a search function on the bottom of every single
| YC page
|
| Weird, in all seriousness, I never noticed.
| triyambakam wrote:
| I appreciate when things come up again. Obviously enough people
| either haven't heard of it or want to talk about it again for
| it to be upgoated to the front page.
| traceroute66 wrote:
| > I appreciate when things come up again
|
| My own position on this is that there is difference.
|
| If, like today's post, we're talking about what in forum-
| slang would be a "bump" post, then as far as I'm concerned it
| has near-zero value. Its basically just attention seeking if
| we're being honest.
|
| Meanwhile if it's re-posting a link but in the context of a
| significant change, for example a new version with major new
| features, then obviously it's a different kettle of fish
| altogether. That's obviously perfectly fine.
| ahaucnx wrote:
| This page about the monitor is brand new and contains quite
| a lot of information that has never been published/posted
| before, e.g. the exact specs of the monitor and
| explanations about the enclosure design.
| xvfLJfx9 wrote:
| If the device worked with ZigBee, I would get it immediately.
| However, it seems to support only WiFi, which means if someone
| gains physical access to the AirQuality monitor (which isn't
| exactly difficult since it is placed outside), they can
| potentially extract the WiFi password and gain full access to my
| network.
| ahaucnx wrote:
| Yes that's a good point.
|
| It probably makes sense to put it on a separate WiFi network
| (or a guest network) if access to the monitor is possible for
| unauthorized persons.
| seanp2k2 wrote:
| Definitely recommend a separate 2.4ghz N-mode only wifi with
| separate passphrase and client isolation on a different vlan
| with routing only out to the internet for all IoT stuff.
| hpb42 wrote:
| I'm curious, why N-mode only? What is the issue with a/b/g?
| epaulson wrote:
| The EPA had some money from the recovery funding and then the
| inflation reduction act to do more air quality monitoring
| stations - the EPA gave out 132 awards around the country, my
| city got one and we're putting up 68 sensors around town (one in
| each census tract) - the program and the awardees are here, if
| you're interested in seeing if your city got one:
|
| https://www.epa.gov/arp/arp-enhanced-air-quality-monitoring-...
|
| (My city is using QuantAQ sensors, which weren't cheap)
| stevep001 wrote:
| I'd be a buyer if you had an indoor unit with a radon sensor.
| ahaucnx wrote:
| We have looked into adding a radon sensor but it is very
| difficult to get an off-the-shelf radon module in the market
| that is reasonably priced.
|
| If any of you can recommend a module I would be very interested
| to hear.
| JumpCrisscross wrote:
| Repackaging these sensors might be a better play than an OTS
| procurement model. Lots of people are making pretty packages
| for commodity sensors. Few are developing new sensor
| packages.
| cyberax wrote:
| Why would you want a radon sensor in a product that does
| constant monitoring?
|
| Radon concentration is not a transient state, and you need to
| measure it for a fairly long time to get a good idea of the
| true concentration.
| jhot wrote:
| One of the Plantowers in my purple air has died and the power
| supply is flaking out as well. Think I'll grab one of these as a
| replacement.
| majkinetor wrote:
| Can I get the data as CSV or similar for custom presentation,
| backup and analysis?
| ahaucnx wrote:
| If you use our data platform, you can easily export an csv file
| with all the data in our database. But since it is open source
| you can also easily adjust the firmware and send the data to
| another server.
| stickac wrote:
| Open-source is mentioned 10x on the website, but there is no link
| to the actual source.
| ahaucnx wrote:
| It is linked on the technical documentation [1].
|
| [1] https://www.airgradient.com/open-
| airgradient/instructions/di...
| [deleted]
| ianlevesque wrote:
| I bought one recently (it's great) and found the source here
| https://github.com/airgradienthq/arduino
| mkskm wrote:
| Here's another one on Adafruit (more time intensive but includes
| a VOC sensor) https://learn.adafruit.com/air-quality-sensor-silo-
| house
| zerof1l wrote:
| I don't see any benefit in this product having two identical
| sensors side by side. Based on the datasheet, the reading between
| sensors is quite consistent, meaning that there's no improvement
| in accuracy. What would be better is to have two different
| sensors, one of which actually counts PM 10.0.
|
| A little-known fact about these air quality sensors is that they
| don't actually measure three different particle sizes, they
| typically measure the smallest one and then return some
| statistically determined value for the larger ones.
|
| [1]
| https://www.digikey.jp/htmldatasheets/production/2903006/0/0...
| ahaucnx wrote:
| There are two main advantages of having two sensors:
|
| a) Data quality: You can detect if one sensor fails as the two
| readings will start to deviate and then replace the faulty one
|
| b) Extend the life of the monitor: The PM sensors with the
| laser and optics have a limited life. By having two inside, you
| can alternate the measurement and put them in sleep mode
| inbetween. Thus extending the life of the monitor.
| cyberax wrote:
| Just a note: can you stagger the sensor time a bit unevenly?
|
| Instead of 50%/50% time split, can you do something like
| 40%/60%? This reduces the risk of both sensors failing at
| once because they have approximately the same duty time.
| jeffnappi wrote:
| Considering it is open source, you could do this :)
| [deleted]
| declan_roberts wrote:
| I've been running the open source "stop light" design for awhile.
| It works great but the internet is very flaky on the esp board.
| Not entirely sure why, but easy to disable internet and just use
| the colors.
|
| It helped me identify patterns, such as CO2 settling in my large
| living room.
|
| Knowing that the CO2 levels are healthy throughout the day really
| helps me feel better about living in a new sealed home.
| xnzakg wrote:
| How well does the USB-C cable (and the rest of the PCB!) hold up
| outdoors? Especially in areas with salt, like near a coast or a
| place where salt is used on the roads in winter? From what I
| understood the sensor isn't sealed?
| ahaucnx wrote:
| At the moment it is not sealed. We are currently looking into
| conformal coating options and will probably have this available
| in one of the next batches (we are currenly checking what
| coating our PCB assembler can do).
| ahaucnx wrote:
| I'm the founder of AirGradient and last year we have decided to
| focus our company on open hardware air quality monitors that we
| produce professionally.
|
| Our outdoor monitor Open Air has been designed from the start as
| an open hardware project with a beautiful plastic injected
| enclosure to demonstrate that open source hardware can look and
| perform on the same level like traditional products.
|
| We do also work intensively with research institutions around the
| world to test the monitor and ensure that the monitors are as
| accurate as possible [1].
|
| Happy to answer any question that might come up.
|
| [1] https://www.airgradient.com/research/
| cvwright wrote:
| This is random but I'd love to hear more about what's involved
| in designing an enclosure and getting it manufactured at scale.
| ahaucnx wrote:
| The tooling for the plastic enclosure was quite complex and
| time consuming. If there is interest I can write a blog post
| about it.
| smokelegend wrote:
| That would be a interesting topic!
|
| If you write it, people will read it!
|
| I am one of those many people who will read it.
|
| "Sharing is caring"
| wodenokoto wrote:
| I think the website is very unclear about what you get, other
| than part names. What can the pro do that the normal can't do?
| Can I connect the TVOC to the non-pro?
| ahaucnx wrote:
| The TVOC module is only for the PRO indoor kits. The BASIC
| kit does not have space for the TVOC module.
|
| The PRO comes with a nice plastic enclosure, has a larger
| display and due to its larger size measures temperature and
| humidity more accurately (since there is more space, the
| temperature sensor has more distance to active components
| that heat up).
| kingsloi wrote:
| Awesome work! Do you have any plans to add/track gas
| pollutants?
|
| I run a similar open source app specifically for my little
| community in Gary, IN https://millerbeach.community and run a
| RAMP monitor provided by a local company Sensit Technologies,
| and a PurpleAir II and have about ~4 years worth of data in 15
| min intervals. I've been meaning to swap out the PurpleAir with
| another, but I'll swap it out with this instead!
| ahaucnx wrote:
| We started testing electrochemical NO and NO2 sensors from
| Alpha Sense in our lab and are in the early stages to design
| a unit that would also measure these gases but we are many
| months away to have something in the market.
| declan_roberts wrote:
| I can't wait for this, especially with how often gas stoves
| are in the news lately.
| CommanderData wrote:
| I'm struggling to see the benefit of your product. Apart from
| the outdoor element. You can buy a 4 in 1 air monitor from
| Amazon for half the price (Co2, PM, Temp and Humidity) i.e.
| https://www.amazon.co.uk/Indoor-Air-Quality-Monitor-Multifun...
|
| There are others with 6 in 1 with app control for less.
|
| Aren't there other sensors that would be more useful providing
| better insights on pollutants and health you could provide at a
| premium that these cheaper monitors can't.
| ahaucnx wrote:
| We use high quality sensor modules like e.g. the SenseAir S8
| NDIR CO2 sensor that is made in Sweden and also Sensirion
| modules from Switzerland. These are much more expensive than
| less accurate sensor modules that you find in many other
| monitors.
| chsreekar wrote:
| Do you have an indoor version?
| ahaucnx wrote:
| Yes, we also have a popular open-hardware, open-source indoor
| air quality monitor that measures CO2, PM, Temperature and
| Humidity. You can also get an optional TVOC module that can
| measure chemicals and NOx.
|
| This version we currently only sell as a pre-soldered kit [1]
| but it is very easy to assemble (no need to solder anything)
| and you just need to plug a few modules together and close
| the enclosure with a few screws.
|
| [1] https://www.airgradient.com/kits/
| cyberax wrote:
| How good is the calibration for your temperature and humidity
| sensors?
|
| I'm absolutely miffed by the poor-quality sensors that are off
| by 10% humidity and 2-3C of temperature. I bought several
| sensors to try and find the best ones, and now like a man with
| two watches I'm never sure what the actual time is.
| ahaucnx wrote:
| Most of the times the sensor modules are actually pretty
| accurate but the heating up of the enclosure e.g. from heat
| radiated by the MCU creates the issues. In our indoor monitor
| it took us several months to get the airflow through the
| enclosure right so that the temperature and humidity sensors
| are very close to ambient.
| RobotToaster wrote:
| My Xiaomi one has exactly that problem.
| SJetKaran wrote:
| The indoor monitor looks really interesting! I bought a Aranet4
| recently, so don't think I'll invest in another Air Quality
| monitor soon, but I'm interested in checking this device for next
| buy.
| bozhark wrote:
| I'm excited, this is on the build list.
|
| All I need to add is moister meter and CO2 controller to be
| complete
| Brosper wrote:
| I strongly recommend to not always trust everything because it's
| open source. Air Quality as all different weather ingredients are
| measure and there is a big difference how you measure. I am not
| advocate of any "pro" solution. I just want you to know to check
| many sources.
| ahaucnx wrote:
| Yes, I totally agree. This is why we do extensive research to
| ensure the accurateness and reliability of the monitor against
| reference instruments. You can read more about it on our
| research page [1].
|
| [1] https://www.airgradient.com/research/
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(page generated 2023-07-29 23:00 UTC)