[HN Gopher] Harvard Legacy Admissions Targeted After Supreme Cou...
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Harvard Legacy Admissions Targeted After Supreme Court Ruling
Author : xqcgrek2
Score : 20 points
Date : 2023-07-03 19:24 UTC (3 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.bloomberg.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.bloomberg.com)
| pxmpxm wrote:
| I kind of enjoy the irony of this policy being supported by
| virtually everyone, other than the ostensibly-progressive Harvard
| admissions committee.
|
| Someone here has already made the argument that the entire
| affirmative action set up at Harvard was just a way to hide the
| rich and well-connected from any meritocratic scrutiny.
| raincom wrote:
| If Harvard, Yale, Princeton, and Stanford removes quotas for ALDC
| (Athletes, Legacies, wealthy Donors, Children of staff and
| faculty), these universities cease being elite. That's good for
| America. However, it is bad for the administrators of these
| schools, uber wealthy, the elite servant class of this uber
| wealthy. What happens, if McKinsey, Bain, and BCG recruits more
| from UC Berkeley, Rutgers University, Vanderbilt? What happens if
| more of future judges and justices are graduates of LSU Law,
| UTAustin Law, McGeorge School of Law? Basically, the elites can't
| congregate around three or four schools. The power gets
| distributed, as the kids of the elite attend many schools across
| the country.
| scrubs wrote:
| This is way overdue
| ivraatiems wrote:
| Good.
|
| I am affirmative action-curious, in that I do not necessarily
| have the knee-jerk "this shouldn't have ever been allowed"
| reaction that many on HN do. I think the case for affirmative
| action is stronger than many would allow. That said, I am willing
| to take the SCOTUS decision for what it is, because AA was an
| extremely unpopular policy with admittedly terrible echoes of
| past injustices built into it.
|
| Legacy admissions, on the other hand, are pure trash, and I think
| absolutely everyone except the beneficiaries of those policies
| ought to agree on that. I truly can't think of a good argument in
| favor of them other than "universities like money."
| seydor wrote:
| If rich kids can't socialize at school where will things move to?
| Is there a rich people tinder or something?
| uxp100 wrote:
| Relatedly, if Harvard isn't a good place for smart and not rich
| kids to socialize with rich kids, why would people want to go
| there? The point of Harvard is that you can become pals with a
| senator's son. There are other schools if pure academic
| achievement is your primary interest. I don't think some of the
| students discussing this topic realize why they want to go to
| Harvard, which is partly because of the legacies. Of course,
| this is a pretty cynical take, but I didn't really understand
| the schools I was applying for at all when I was at that age.
| alephnerd wrote:
| Harvard without Legacy Admissions will still retain the
| Harvard brand.
|
| For example, UCs don't offer a legacy bump, yet Berkeley and
| UCLA still retain a major brand presence in the Tech and
| Finance industry both within North America and Asia.
|
| In fields such as Natural Sciences, Social Sciences, Law, and
| Business Harvard does hire very strong faculty AND gives them
| a significant amount of funding and autonomy to continue
| their own research pursuits.
|
| Also, in my own friend group and as someone who attended one
| of these Ivies+Ivy Adjacent Programs, just getting into
| either a T20 school overall or a T10 school in your field is
| more than enough to gain the prestige cachet needed for your
| field.
|
| The alumni networks in these 20-30 public and private
| universities are strong enough that you'd be able to do well
| globally. While legacy does play a role in the undergrad
| experience, it's not like CMU, UT Austin, UVA, UW, or UCLA
| don't have students from elite backgrounds even though they
| might not have the street cred of "HAVHAD".
| vosper wrote:
| > The point of Harvard is that you can become pals with a
| senator's son
|
| That's half the point. The other half is to say that you went
| to Harvard.
| alephnerd wrote:
| You can do this at relatively less selective Public Schools
| as well. One of my friends who attended UIUC was roommates
| with the son of the CEO of a Fortune 100 Tech Company, and
| close friends with the son of the CTO of another unrelated
| Tech Fortune 100.
|
| Another one of my buddies at UCSF ended up rooming with the
| daughter of owner of one of the major DNC SuperPACs.
|
| Public schools absolutely have strong alumni networks as
| well despite not necessarily having legacy admissions.
| koheripbal wrote:
| .... Which is important because it flags you as someone
| connected to rich people
| goodbyesf wrote:
| If legacy admissions are banned, then harvard and yale admissions
| office will develope an 'understanding' where each school takes
| in the other's legacy candidates.
|
| Don't forget that many of the heads of admissions scream
| equality, diversity and fairness but want special treatment for
| their own children.
| scrubs wrote:
| A question and point on resolving racism without giving up on
| meritocracy:
|
| - I tend to think scotus believes racism is/was real but the best
| way to fix it is for congress to vote into law an actual remedy.
| Instead congress whines then fund raises off it. That control
| vacuum does not mean scotus has to fill the void. I'm pretty sure
| this what Roberts thinks anyway.
|
| - on remedy: based on a young adult's background mainly by
| looking at parent's income and their educational attainment, and
| school quality k-12, under served kids that appear to have
| potential could be subsized to take a kind of finishing school
| with the idea of getting them backfilled education wise so they
| could take and pass MIT like AP exams in math, science, English.
| It'd be like a really high end HS to get them current. Kids who
| don't follow through are evicted, and are required to payback
| costs. This way they can compete reasonably well for open seats
| and colleges of their choice. We might call this the National
| High School Program perhaps mainly online. Congress can create
| and fund this. Seats are filled in time order of approved
| applicant only.
|
| - remedy includes reducing or eliminating grants to private
| universities sitting on tons of money or have too many
| administrative costs. US education is too damn expensive. There
| has to be a way for the system to penalize stupid cost.
|
| - a federal run super high school gives parents and kids a
| choice: state education or fed. Or state then fed later to fix
| shortcomings. This would also eliminate the fed/state/local
| control quagmire since US education is locally controlled. The
| fed could instead focus solely on its own school system letting
| parents/kids choose.
|
| - in summary: congress has to get off their butts. Scotus would
| have to uphold congress' law. And if the national HS was
| demanding, nobody would be focused on race, which is the way we
| want it. It puts the focus on good kids who did good work which
| is also the way we want it.
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