[HN Gopher] Initiative to connect all European capitals through ...
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Initiative to connect all European capitals through a high-speed
train network
Author : nixass
Score : 35 points
Date : 2023-06-23 18:30 UTC (4 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (eci.ec.europa.eu)
(TXT) w3m dump (eci.ec.europa.eu)
| goodbyesf wrote:
| Wouldn't it be better to connect major european economic and
| cultural centers? Also, I doubt they are going to connect to
| dublin or reykjavik. So not all.
| bojan wrote:
| In most countries of Europe, the capitals _are_ major economic
| and cultural centers of their respective countries.
|
| Actually I can't really think of a country where that's not the
| case - only countries with a very strong second city.
| malermeister wrote:
| More trains are great, but whai really needed is a unified, EU-
| wide booking system.
|
| Currently, each operator has their own site, with its own pricing
| structure and sometimes its own loyalty bonuses. Cross-border
| trains sometimes have dramatically different prices when you buy
| tickets in the origin vs destination country.
|
| But worst of all, you often can't buy _one_ ticket for complex
| routes across Europe, as you can with flights. Instead, you 're
| forced to piece it together yourself from individual tickets. The
| problem with this is that since you haven't bought a ticket from
| anyone _for the entire route_ , it's your own responsibility if a
| train is delayed and you miss your connection. Until we fix this,
| trains will never be a viable option for many trips.
| 908B64B197 wrote:
| > EU-wide booking system.
|
| Maybe they can achieve what we had in America back in the 60's
| with SABRE [0]
|
| [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabre_Corporation
| malermeister wrote:
| So there's actually Amadeus, which is the biggest provider in
| that category worldwide, based out of Madrid:
| https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amadeus_CRS
|
| However, train travel isn't really properly integrated as far
| as I can tell.
| Symbiote wrote:
| https://www.raileurope.com/ might provide some of this.
|
| (I haven't really needed it myself, the longest journeys I've
| made have only covered two countries at most.)
| madcaptenor wrote:
| I feel like this would be a lot better with a map of the proposed
| network, and some statistics on how much faster it would make
| common journeys.
| TacticalCoder wrote:
| Here's the explanation with a map (couldn't resist):
|
| https://youtu.be/Yyj5cv5FPWA
| bobthepanda wrote:
| It looks like a petition to figure it out, not a plan
| pestatije wrote:
| EU initiative...i guess they mean all EU capitals...i wish they
| would stop appropriating the whole continent for themselves
| bojan wrote:
| It says explicitly "all European capitals". London for example
| is already connected.
| veave wrote:
| Interesting how we are going backwards, from planes to trains.
| sempron64 wrote:
| It's not backwards, high speed rail was invented in the 60s
| with the shinkansen, about the same time as the modern
| airliner.
| dontlaugh wrote:
| Trains are far more energy efficient than planes, so we're
| going forwards. If we actually do get more better cheaper
| trains.
| erikpukinskis wrote:
| This seems like an impossible claim to me. Surely it depends
| on many factors, off the top of my head:
|
| - the occupancy of the trip
|
| - the distance
|
| - the number of stops
|
| - the form of "last mile" transportation required
|
| - the age and model of the vehicle
|
| - the specific fuel source
|
| I mean, I believe the statistic is true in aggregate. It's
| like saying "vegan food has lower carbon emissions" which is
| true in aggregate. But wild game is often astronomically
| lower emissions (not to mention lower cruelty) than typical
| vegan food.
|
| So these aggregate statistics are interesting points to
| ponder, but we don't live in aggregate. We eat specific foods
| and we travel specific routes.
|
| And at the individual level these statistics become... well
| not "mostly false" but certainly "frequently false".
|
| To me, the base statistic is a great starting point but the
| next questions we need to ask is: when are flights lower
| emission? When is hunting more humane? Etc. That's how we can
| really drive better individual decisions. "Just ride the
| train and eat vegan" won't get us to a globally sufficient
| decision framework.
| Shawnj2 wrote:
| High speed Trains in Europe generally win on most of these
| since they're usually electric trains with minimal stops
| between city centers.
| stuaxo wrote:
| I mean, an electric train that goes to the middle of the
| city or town you are going to and then a walk or a bus or
| taxi at the other end, it's no comparison really.
|
| If you don't have a car you choose where to live based on
| this, when I used to commute I always lived never more than
| 7 minutes walk from a station.
| pornel wrote:
| Back to the old days of having quick boarding without a crotch
| scan, having plenty of legroom, normal-size restrooms, and a
| restaurant car.
|
| And you travel from city center to city center, rather than
| middle-of-nowheres named after a city.
| emptysongglass wrote:
| In my experience across the US and the EU, most of the time
| they're late so there's a lot of idle waiting.
| veave wrote:
| Crotch scan doesn't happen in the EU, and the rest doesn't
| matter if you can get there much faster.
|
| >And you travel from city center to city center, rather than
| middle-of-nowheres named after a city.
|
| When you land you can rent a car... when you arrive on a
| train you are forced to either pay for a taxi or take pub...
| pu... public transportation
| Tade0 wrote:
| I for one appreciate bar cars.
|
| Also it's not always much faster. Italy's high speed
| network eventually won with their national airline. And no
| wonder - a trip going halfway across the peninsula takes
| roughly as much time, but is generally more pleasant.
| bettercallsalad wrote:
| I have travelled through Europe quite extensively. IMO cheap
| flights like Ryanair and Wizz beat train hands down - pricewise
| especially if you are carrying light luggage and also because
| most airports are now connected from city center by train in
| Europe (something which is a huge issue in US making you rely on
| your own transport or taxi.)
| TacticalCoder wrote:
| > I have travelled through Europe quite extensively. IMO cheap
| flights like Ryanair and Wizz beat train hands down
|
| Europe is fighting hard short haul flights, many of which are
| now just plain down illegal. Several countries, including
| France, have already banned short haul flights of less than
| 2h30.
|
| I see this "high speed trains" push as related to the attack by
| the EU on short haul flights.
|
| So no matter if we find that cheap flights do beat trains hands
| down or not, in a near future there may not be any choice: and
| the choice seems like it's going to be train.
| switch007 wrote:
| * * *
| deepthunder wrote:
| High Speed Rail is expensive. Wouldn't be better to put the money
| towards Regional local services instead?
| stuaxo wrote:
| By building dedicated lines you free up space on regional
| lines.
| kyriakos wrote:
| Valetta and Nicosia will be fun to connect
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