[HN Gopher] Eating microwave popcorn increases the level of PFAS...
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Eating microwave popcorn increases the level of PFAS in body (2022)
Author : SomaticPirate
Score : 339 points
Date : 2023-06-22 23:56 UTC (23 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.uclahealth.org)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.uclahealth.org)
| QuadrupleA wrote:
| Stovetop is super easy - saucepan, some kernels, some oil, put
| the lid on. Low to medium heat til popping stops. Add some salt.
|
| Also incredibly cheap.
| civilitty wrote:
| I use clarified butter instead of oil so that the popcorn soaks
| it in immediately after popping.
|
| Every time I take a bite, it's like a buttery explosion.
|
| I recommend taking it off heat for 30 seconds after adding all
| the kernels so they all heat up to an even temperature and
| roast a little in the butter. Use a screen to cover the pot
| rather than a lid so that steam can escape and your popcorn
| stays crunchy.
| pengaru wrote:
| I've been using chicken fat collected from roasting chickens,
| simmered down and stored in a Ball jar (aka schmaltz)
|
| It tolerates the high heat of popcorn popping quite well and
| tastes great with a hint of chicken. Usually has notes of the
| seasoning too... which in my case is mostly black pepper.
|
| +1 on the screen hack, that's definitely a pro-tip.
| cnity wrote:
| This sounds delicious. I bet it combines well with
| sweetness too. I've found that when I do stovetop popcorn I
| can get sugar to caramelise around the popcorn to produce a
| crunchy shell. This with a little chicken hint inside would
| go down well I reckon.
| Lacerda69 wrote:
| Best method. You can also easily caramelize sugar, just pour it
| in and stir until its molten yum
| riffraff wrote:
| > people who ate microwave popcorn every day over the course of a
| year had levels of PFAS that were up to 63% higher than average.
|
| You're probably fine if you have microwave popcorn once a
| fortnight, tho as other said you can use a pan or pot just fine.
| redox99 wrote:
| Eating microwave popcorn every single day seems kind of insane
| lol
| dools wrote:
| Until you realise that it's probably kids coming home from
| school and microwaving popcorn while both of their parents
| are at work still.
| dawidpotocki wrote:
| Until you realise that someone has to buy the popcorn, i.e.
| the parents.
| autoexec wrote:
| I've gone through periods where I'd bring it into work for
| lunches. Fast, cheap, and filling. Every single day does seem
| a bit extreme though.
| mrguyorama wrote:
| I did it because I was doing stuff that caused me to get "the
| munchies" every night and a 440 calorie bag of popcorn was
| better for my health than an entire family sized bag of chips
| every night.
| [deleted]
| tabiv wrote:
| Recently my wife and I searched for a drinking water filter that
| would remove PFAS. We found one!
|
| https://www.clearlyfiltered.com/pages/performance-data-for-t...
| prismatix wrote:
| Also see AquaGear https://www.drinkaquagear.com/ for a slightly
| cheaper option ($70 vs $90).
| Eumenes wrote:
| Nice, now I need to find a whole house filter system
| objektif wrote:
| This looks good but the under sink system is a bit expensive.
| Does anyone know a good, affordable, easy to install under sink
| filter?
| f5ve wrote:
| It removes flouride as well, for better or worse -- one of very
| few available filters which do. (Some think flouride is good
| and some think it's bad.)
|
| I have it, and purely ergonomically, it's the best filter I've
| ever used. It's also quite expensive with expensive filters
| that need replacing frequently.
| light_hue_1 wrote:
| This isn't a some think it's good and some think it's bad
| kind of thing. Just like with climate change there's no
| legitimate other side.
|
| Fluoride in your water supply is key to reducing tooth decay.
| Every medical association every scrap of evidence that we
| have says it's useful and important. It cuts tooth decay by
| 25% or so at all ages. You're doing yourself and your family
| a massive disservice by not adding it back in, never mind
| causing yourself a lot of pain and losing a lot of money in
| the long term.
|
| https://www.cdc.gov/fluoridation/index.html
|
| I think it's ironic that people don't listen to doctors when
| they suggest simple proven methods that have a worldwide
| consensus behind them and unlimited evidence. But then are
| willing to let those same doctors drill into their skulls
| when they're in pain. Don't be that person :)
| nwienert wrote:
| How familiar are you with fluorides systemic effects on the
| endocrine system? As well as other systemic effects?
| OldManRyan wrote:
| Seems like it needs to be replaced every 4-5 months which is
| longer than my Brita which needs to be replaced every 3
| months
| hospitalJail wrote:
| If you brush your teeth with toothpaste, it shouldn't matter.
| light_hue_1 wrote:
| That's simply untrue. Even with brushing with toothpaste is
| still eliminates an extra 25% of tooth decay. That's a lot
| of extra teeth!
|
| It keeps fluoride in your saliva. Which toothpaste cannot
| do.
| aaomidi wrote:
| > It keeps fluoride in your saliva. Which toothpaste
| cannot do.
|
| Which is why you're not supposed to rinse the toothpaste
| you used to brush your teeth.
| hospitalJail wrote:
| >It keeps fluoride in your saliva.
|
| I know this is posed as a positive, but I have a feeling
| in 1000 years we are going to be laughed at like the
| Romans for putting lead in their wine.
|
| Anyway, my dentist told me to leave the fluoride on my
| teeth for a few minutes. Wonder if that is more dangerous
| due to the concentration.
| robert_no_robot wrote:
| I believe that people who eat microwave popcorn have higher PFAS
| levels as the study suggests.
|
| I'm a bit skeptical about microwave popcorn increases PFAS as the
| study doesn't really answer this question. People eating
| microwave popcorn might be different from those who don't eat it
| and the real source could be something else.
|
| But I'm only a bit skeptical as it sounds plausible that the
| manufacturers probably use PFAS-contaminated surfaces in the
| production.
| Octokiddie wrote:
| > A study published in 2019 analyzed a decade of data about the
| eating habits of 10,000 people, which was collected by the
| Centers for Disease Control and Prevention between 2003 and 2014.
| Blood samples from the study participants were also collected.
| The researchers found that people who ate microwave popcorn every
| day over the course of a year had levels of PFAS that were up to
| 63% higher than average.
|
| 1. Is it too much to ask for a link to the original research in
| an article like this?
|
| 2. Given that every human alive has detectable levels of PFAS in
| blood, 63% elevation after eating every single day of the year
| doesn't seem like a lot.
|
| 3. Those advocating popping in pans/pots might want to consider
| what that pan/pot is coated with.
| mchanson wrote:
| Most people stove top pop in a 8 or 10 qt pot. These are
| typically for making pasta, boiling potatoes, soups, or stews.
| Usually bare metal or enameled cast iron. No PFAs.
| philshem wrote:
| Let's not forget about the butter flavoring, aka Diacetyl:
|
| https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/topics/flavorings/exposure.html#:~....
|
| > In a plant where workers with uncontrolled exposures to butter-
| flavoring chemicals in microwave popcorn production had rapidly
| developed severe, irreversible lung disease, increased
| ventilation and isolation of flavor sources in mixing, holding
| tanks, and microwave popping decreased the risk for most workers.
|
| https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3115208/
|
| > Man Wins $7 Million In Suit Claiming Microwave Popcorn Caused
| Lung Disease
|
| https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2012/09/20/161489994/ma...
| poulsbohemian wrote:
| I'm kinda curious - why microwave popcorn when an air popper or
| stove top is so stinkin' easy? Makes great popcorn and you can
| control the flavorings
| lm28469 wrote:
| There are people buying pre sliced apples and pre peeled
| clementines out there
| throw9away6 wrote:
| Most people don't realize you can just pop in a pot they think
| you need special tools
| esafak wrote:
| An air popper _is_ a special tool, but it 's easier to use
| than a pot, uses no oil, and takes up less space than an
| equivalent pot since the popcorn can be diverted into a bowl
| as it pops. Recommended!
| 01100011 wrote:
| Microwave is more efficient.
| daneel_w wrote:
| The Swedish brand of "micropop" I buy every now and then has a
| label on the box stating that the bag is made without
| perfluorated substances. I have no means of testing it, but I
| believe them.
| InvaderFizz wrote:
| Best popcorn you can make is cheap and easy cleanup.
|
| Take one large pot (the kind that holds like 10qts).
|
| Cover the bottom with kernels.
|
| Add a bit of oil, basically just enough to swirl and have
| everything covered in an oil sheen, not enough to have them
| submerged.
|
| Cover, put on high (I use gas). I like to suspend a paper towel
| between the lid and the rest of the pot, absorbs excess oil and
| water.
|
| Once popping slows, turn off the stove. Dump popcorn into large
| mixing bowl.
|
| Toss 1/8 cup butter in the hot pot, melt the butter with residual
| heat.
|
| Pour popcorn back in and toss to get the popcorn evenly lightly
| buttered, transfer back to the mixing bowl.
|
| Salt(I prefer a salt grinder) and toss, add a bit of grated
| Parmesan and toss.
|
| There should be less than 10 unpopped kernels, no burned popcorn
| at all.
|
| Cleanup is a wipe down of the large pot with the moisture capture
| paper towel.
| quickthrower2 wrote:
| I use an airpopper, cost maybe $6. Can in theory be used for
| coffee roasting too!
| mklarmann wrote:
| I love popcorn. And this might be arrogant. As I might come
| around like the extremist (that I am). But I am reading here
| between the lines, that even with popcorn, there is a lot that
| could be done better for the environment: - gas is not
| renewable. I hope we can get away from that - once popping
| starts you turn of the stove, does this mean you have fairly
| solid pans that keep the heat long? I don't think that is
| sustainable either - You put butter in the popcorn? Well that
| is also not sustainable either. - Then you add Parmesan, well
| that makes it even worse. - You use a paper towel, that you
| toss away
|
| Why do we just happen to glance over those issues so easily?
| JohnFen wrote:
| > does this mean you have fairly solid pans that keep the
| heat long? I don't think that is sustainable either
|
| How is that not sustainable? It means that you can turn the
| heat off earlier and coast on the stored heat.
|
| I don't cook on gas, so that's not a concern for me. But no
| butter?? That's the same as saying "no popcorn".
| zavertnik wrote:
| I love movie theater popcorn so I often try to get that exact
| experience at home. The biggest leap in quality for me is using
| a tall pot and a colander on top, it achieves the same goal as
| your paper towel between the lid-- getting that excess moisture
| out of the pot really makes all the difference!
| sumtechguy wrote:
| If you want movie theater popcorn you make it the same way
| they do with the same ingredients.
|
| Stir popcorn maker something like this
| https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00004RC6R
|
| flavacol salt (optional if you use flour salt)
| https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004W8LT10 or flour salt
| https://www.amazon.com/Morton-Popcorn-Salt-Green-
| French/dp/B... or both 1/2-1 tea spoons at most.
|
| 'butter' oil https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000UZLQG2 1/4
| cup after cooking (warm it in a microwave)
|
| The butter oil is a bit of a pain as there is so much of it
| and you can not really buy in small quantities, and it will
| go rancid before you use it all. It is meant for movie
| theaters to use. I have not found any supermarket versions
| that are correct. Usually they are kinda gross.
|
| You can use a coconut oil for cooking with. Most theaters do
| not do this at all. The butter oil is closest to the same as
| movie theater as that is what they use during cooking and
| topping at the end. I personally use the coconut oil when
| cooking as it imparts a nice texture and flavor to the
| popcorn. 1-2 tsps for cooking with for either. Then top with
| the butter oil.
|
| The flavacol and butter oil are the key ingredients.
|
| For the popcorn I just buy orville redenbacher popcorn. They
| have a decent process of removing the duds before they get
| into the container. You can buy generic just expect a few
| duds.
| atentaten wrote:
| The secret to movie popcorn flavor is coconut oil and the
| flavored salt.
| koolba wrote:
| Coconut oil is ok but it does have a distinct taste.
|
| My favorite is to use beef tallow.
| zavertnik wrote:
| I've had similar luck with peanut oil too!
| datavirtue wrote:
| I have stopped using paper towels after discovering those
| "flour sack" towels at Menards. I bought a lot of them so there
| is always a stack in the kitchen. They are a joy to use and
| easily replace paper towels for 99% of their functions. We
| still keep paper towels but the roll lasts forever now.
| gpvos wrote:
| 10 quarts = 11.3 l
|
| I had no idea that a quart is about a litre.
| newqer wrote:
| Me: Hey babe, your're almost a litre!
|
| Her: Why?
|
| Me: Because you're a qt!
| JohnFen wrote:
| I'm ashamed to admit that I didn't get this joke until I
| reread it a few times. Probably because my entire life,
| I've internally pronounced "qt" as "quart". It took a bit
| before I realized the joke was shooting for "cutie".
| 369548684892826 wrote:
| The other one that threw me is how am I supposed to measure
| 1/8th cup of butter?
| drdrey wrote:
| In the US, butter is sold in sticks with 1/8 cup markings
| on the wrapper
| ClumsyPilot wrote:
| Ehy would you measure butter in cups, you dont drink it
| randallsquared wrote:
| Cups is a measure of volume. They could just as easily
| print cc markings, but I don't think they do.
| throwaway173738 wrote:
| Most American cookbooks use volume measures for baking
| because most of us don't own scales. It sometimes leads
| to wildly inconsistent results when an ingredient is
| compacted too much.
| interestica wrote:
| Yeah even the cup measurement itself varies. It's
| sometimes 250mL and sometimes 236mL and sometimes 227mL.
| JohnFen wrote:
| 1/8th of a cup is 2 tablespoons.
|
| But I prefer to measure butter (and most other things --
| especially sticky/messy/powdery things) by weight because
| it's easier. 1 cup of butter weighs about 227 grams, so 1/8
| cup is about 27 grams.
| randallsquared wrote:
| Uh, I think something went wrong with your conversion. 10
| quarts is about 9.5 liters.
| lkbm wrote:
| You're using US quarts; they're using Imperial quarts[0].
| (But I expect the recipe was also using US quarts, so still
| a useful adjustment to note.)
|
| [0] https://www.google.com/search?q=10+imperial+quarts+in+l
| iters
| tashoecraft wrote:
| My only recommendation/advice is to use a thick bottom wok or
| pot. A wok allows the already popped popcorn to move away from
| the heat source.
|
| Thick bottom pots also reduce burning. Use a vented lid so
| steam can escape which prevents soggy popcorn.
| Rebelgecko wrote:
| IMO flavacol is essential. Oil type matters too, coconut oil
| gives more of a movie theater style flavor (OTOH maybe not as
| healthy as other options...)
| sgtnoodle wrote:
| Coconut oil is relatively healthy as far as consuming oil
| goes, isn't it?
| JohnFen wrote:
| Coconut and palm oils are the least healthy of all the
| vegetable oils. In terms of saturated fat, they're almost
| as bad as beef fat.
| rrrrrrrrrrrryan wrote:
| You're probably thinking of the MCTs in coconut oil, which
| do seem to offer some health benefits, but coconut oil is
| also monstrously high in saturated fats (90% vs 14% for
| olive oil), and tons of studies show that saturated fat is
| relatively awful for the human body.
| throw9away6 wrote:
| Dry popcorn for 2 min on convection in the oven at 350
| maxbond wrote:
| You can get pretty varied with the seasoning too. Parmesan is
| my favorite, but I like Italian herbs, nutritional yeast,
| garlic powder. You can throw a bunch of stuff on there
| together.
| zonkerdonker wrote:
| Tabasco is incredible on popcorn, give it a shot. I like to
| mix it in with the melted butter before tossing it all
| waffleiron wrote:
| If you enjoy tabasco, you'll love chili oil. Grab some Lao
| Gan Ma, oil in early, flakes and some salt at the end.
| joshu wrote:
| for something absurdly decadent, try adding these:
|
| * truffle zest (a powder, smells good, not much taste)
| https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01FDFL2RQ
|
| * truffle sauce (it's bits of truffle and other mushrooms in
| oil) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00V3M9VLI
|
| * truffle salt (it's a very fine salt and very good for
| popcorn) https://www.amazon.com/Italian-Black-Truffle-Sea-
| Salt/dp/B00...
|
| (or just do the truffle salt alone)
|
| i like this combo because it's not as chemical smelling as
| the "white truffle oil" or whatever they sell that doesn't
| contain any truffle at all.
| toastal wrote:
| Sprayed with cooking spray, then dusted with flavored gelatin
| power & quickly popped in the oven, you will get something
| that resembles those flavored popcorns with a sucker-like
| candy shell.
| aksss wrote:
| What flavors do you prefer (for gelatin powda?)
| toastal wrote:
| Whatever your favorite is, but I'd probably reach for
| cherry.
| worthless-trash wrote:
| If you like the garlic powder, try chicken salt on popcorn.
| selimthegrim wrote:
| Or just garlic salt?
| JohnFen wrote:
| TIL that "chicken salt" is a thing that exists! Thanks!
| Fezzik wrote:
| Popcorn is a magnificent flavor-vehicle! My personal favorite
| is to melt salt, ginger, and sugar in butter and toss the
| popcorn in that tasty mixture. Or just douse the popped-
| kernels in sriracha.
| dsego wrote:
| No butter or parmesan, just salt is perfect.
| griffinkelly wrote:
| I recommend jalapeno popcorn. If you enjoy a spicy snack its
| great. Only difference is when you're heating up the oil, add
| some pickled jalapenos and cook them until they're crunchy--the
| oil will absorb the spiciness.
|
| Also, try using coconut oil instead of canola oil to cook the
| popcorn--its pricier, but its a great taste. I think it removes
| the need to add butter afterwards.
| oktwtf wrote:
| Knowing full well that you enjoy the popped corn enough to
| develop such a method. The one thing that took my basically
| verbatim instructions to the next level, was to add some
| "Butter Salt" in with the oil so the kernels are coated as they
| pop. It'll give it that movie theatre yellow colour. It's
| potent so not too much.
|
| Also I usually toss in 3 kernels to the oil. When they pop you
| add the 1/3 cup as the oil is preheated and ready to get to
| work.
| guerrilla wrote:
| > Cover, put on high (I use gas). I like to suspend a paper
| towel between the lid and the rest of the pot, absorbs excess
| oil and water.
|
| This is what I've been missing...
| newqer wrote:
| Exactly this! But not with salt, but caramelized sugar. Maybe
| also pinch of salt just for the kick.
|
| Can't be worse than the PFAS infused kind right?
| bharrison wrote:
| My household follows this method, though we find high heat,
| while extremely efficient, frequently results in chewy output.
|
| In my experiments heating the pan and oil to a medium-high
| temperature, just before smoking, with 3-4 test kernels
| preloaded allows them to generate an alert by their popping,
| signalling the optimal time for addition of the rest of the
| kernel package.
| interestica wrote:
| Chewy is from moisture. Vent the pot better.
| phil21 wrote:
| I'm somewhat of a fanatic on popcorn style... Take with a grain
| of salt.
|
| > Take one large pot (the kind that holds like 10qts).
|
| Ideally a dutch oven or similar heavy bottom that distributes
| heat well. This makes the process nearly foolproof on any heat
| source.
|
| > Add a bit of oil, basically just enough to swirl and have
| everything covered in an oil sheen, not enough to have them
| submerged.
|
| If you are looking for "movie theatre" popcorn the "secret" is
| using (extra virgin) coconut oil along with flavacol _dissolved
| in the heated oil_ with the kernels popped in it. I use 2-3tbps
| of coconut oil and 2tsp of flavacol for 3 /4 cup worth of
| kernels.
|
| Flavacol should not be used as a topping imo, but as part of
| the popping substrate.
|
| > Cover
|
| This is tricky. Covering traps moisture released during
| popping, and moisture results in soggy (or at least not crisp!)
| popcorn. You do need some sort of cover though for obvious
| reasons.
|
| I found a pot+metal strainer combo that fits perfectly
| together, where the strainer has about as many holes in it as
| you could get away with without creating oil splash mess. This
| lets as much steam as possible out immediately upon popping
| with as little kernel contact as possible. A more easy to come
| by lid is using a mesh oil cover meant for deep frying.
|
| The commercial poppers accomplish this by having a very small
| popping pan, which kernels get "pushed out" of fairly quickly
| after they pop into a well vented holding tub.
|
| > Toss 1/8 cup butter in the hot pot, melt the butter with
| residual heat.
|
| Disagree on butter on popcorn, but it's a personal preference.
| I find butter makes popcorn soggy due to water content - and
| the flavacol+coconut oil is typically what most US theatre
| chains use vs. real butter, so it's what I "expect" the flavor
| to be. That said, I sometimes do melt up some butter to switch
| things up.
|
| > Salt(I prefer a salt grinder)
|
| I prefer pre-made popcorn salt in a wide metal popcorn salt
| shaker to really get a nice even spread.
|
| > transfer back to the mixing bowl.
|
| One trick: If you are making a lot of popcorn "to go" (e.g. for
| a party later) the best way I've found to keep it fresh is
| inside doubled-up paper grocery shopping bags. This helps soak
| up residual moisture, and the difference is noticeable after a
| few hours.
| SapporoChris wrote:
| I remember my family doing this when I was a child. You can
| return to the television and listen for the popping to slow if
| you wish. Returning to the kitchen and finding the lid wasn't
| placed on pot is tragic comedy. Sweep and mop, the floor will
| be oily. I think it only happened once.
| JohnFen wrote:
| I do this all the time. I never liked microwave popcorn because
| all of it has a strange odor and taste to me.
|
| > I like to suspend a paper towel between the lid and the rest
| of the pot, absorbs excess oil and water.
|
| Brilliant! I never thought of this, and I'm going to start
| doing doing it. Thank you!
| askvictor wrote:
| Out of interest, why do you prefer a salt grinder? I've never
| understood why these exist. Pepper grinders, absolutely - the
| aromatics are released on grinding. By not so with salt.
| Curious if I'm missing something.
| interestica wrote:
| Grinder means finer salt. Finer salt sticks to things better
| (you can get a baby powder consistency).
|
| And the way the salt "tastes" is different because the powder
| dissolves on your tongue differently/quicker.
|
| Salt "dust" is a really interesting way of adding salt to
| food -- and you actually end up adding less than larger
| grains
| professoretc wrote:
| I use salt flour for popcorn; it's essentially salt that is
| milled as fine as flour. There was a study (which I can't
| find now) which found that our perception of saltiness is
| based less on amount and more on surface area coverage.
| halfnormalform wrote:
| It's sometimes just called "popcorn salt" and it's
| exactly as you describe. (And it can also be made at home
| from regular table salt with a food processor or mortar &
| pestle.)
| oktwtf wrote:
| I take a trip to the bulk-barn often enough to get
| "Butter Salt" it's powdered and yellow. I suspect it's
| what goes into the packages for the movie theatre.
| coldtea wrote:
| > _Grinder means finer salt._
|
| I've never seen on-the-spot ground salt smaller than the
| stuff you can buy already grounded. Except if you buy
| flakes, but then why do so if you want finer salt?
| interestica wrote:
| I've never seen salt powder or "dust" for sale. Grinder
| has been the only useful way.
| jerf wrote:
| It's just culinary cargo cult. You grind pepper and other
| such things because the flavor survives well in the
| peppercorn but degrades relatively rapidly in air, so
| waiting until the last minute to grind it results in
| better flavor. Oxidized pepper is easy to notice the
| difference in flavor profile and much lower complexity.
| Especially the pepper shakers that have been sitting at
| the restaurant table probably yea verily these many
| years, mostly unused.
|
| Therefore, grinding things at the last minute makes them
| taste better, goes the simplification.
|
| Therefore, grinding salt must make it taste better.
|
| But salt is not like the aromatic flavors in a
| peppercorn. Salt is _geologically_ stable. NaCl itself
| does not need a last minute grind to retain its salty
| flavors. NaCl is not a chemically complex flavor.
|
| I qualified that as NaCl specifically because it is
| faintly possible some of the fancy salts could have their
| fancy flavors come out better if they are ground, but I'm
| yet to even notice a difference when any of these are
| used in food in any manner so I can't judge. Those
| flavors must be awfully darned stable as it is if they're
| still hanging around in a 99+% NaCl environment. I'd want
| to see a specific chemical that can survive that but will
| suddenly wilt if exposed to oxygen. (We're sure not
| talking about traditional benzene-ring aromatics at that
| point!) If there is a difference it is hovering at the
| very bottom of human detectability.
|
| Salt grinders are annoying. They're hard to use because
| you're trying to grind a _rock_ , a soft rock sure but
| still a _rock_. It 's wasted effort, and it occurs to me
| to wonder if they even do anything to speak of; now I
| want to find one and compare the before and after of the
| chunk size; I find myself suspicious that many of them
| are just theatrics and the salt basically passes through
| unscathed because "cheap plastic" and "grinding a rock"
| are not compatible with each other. Even if it does do
| some real grinding it's still a waste though because it
| was never necessary, you could just have bought it at the
| right grain size.
| giraffe_lady wrote:
| The reason you'd use a salt grinder is when you
| specifically want an inconsistent spread of grain sizes
| in one single application. Like salt flakes on ganache or
| caramel, or there's a beloved french butter with large
| crystals mixed into it.
|
| Usually you'd just use two sizes of salt. I don't own a
| salt grinder, can't remember ever seeing one in a
| professional kitchen, don't recommend people buy them.
| But it _does_ produce a particular effect that you could
| prefer for some applications.
|
| And in fact I suspect popcorn might be one of the places
| where it would shine. An even background of salt dust
| with bursts of intense saltiness from larger grains
| sounds good here. I'm not going to buy a salt grinder to
| test it but it's not an absurd idea.
| interestica wrote:
| > It's just culinary cargo cult.
|
| I think you're misunderstanding the use. It's a different
| goal from grinding spices. It's functional. And I've
| never seen powdered salt selling anywhere in Canada.
| (Except for expensive artisan stuff). So, the best way to
| achieve it is with a grinder+rock salt. I've been using a
| simple Amazon grinder and it's easy to use.
|
| Powdered salt tastes different not because of a differing
| chemical composition, but because of its different
| physical nature + your tongue.
| uoaei wrote:
| The shapes of the granules in table vs ground sea salt
| are different.
| airza wrote:
| Grinding the salt more finely makes it stick to the popcorn a
| bit better.
| vladvasiliu wrote:
| In my neck of the woods, unground salt is much, much cheaper
| than ground. Ground salt can basically be only found coming
| in a plastic dispenser. It could be argued that throwing all
| these plastic containers away isn't great for the
| environment.
|
| I only realize that I've never thought of comparing, but I've
| got the habit of using unground salt when cooking. My
| grandmother used to do this for some reason, so I picked it
| up.
|
| Unground salt is also useful for cleaning things, like
| cooking pans.
|
| It's therefore easier to only buy salt in one big pack that
| lasts forever.
| bboygravity wrote:
| Portuguese kitching uses a lot of coarse salt.
|
| A 1 kilo bag is like 0,23 EUR
| kuschku wrote:
| 500g of fine table salt is 9C/, so the price doesn't
| really matter tbh.
| carlmr wrote:
| Also can't make good brownies without big salt crystals.
| Or pretzels.
| ClumsyPilot wrote:
| In london at Canary Wharf there is a 'German' pub that
| serves pretzels without salt on them! I tried explaining
| that they are all crinimals but they were just really
| confused!
| JohnFen wrote:
| > In my neck of the woods, unground salt is much, much
| cheaper than ground.
|
| In my neck of the woods, unground salt is the most
| expensive kind, because the only place you can find it is
| in upscale gourmet stores.
| Lendal wrote:
| The shapes of the crystals affects the taste. If the salt is
| going to be dissolved, such as in pasta water, then grain-
| shape doesn't matter. Use the cheapest salt. But if the salt
| is going onto the surface of a food, such as in popcorn or a
| steak, then fresh-ground salt gives a more salty flavor per
| gram used. The salt grains that come already ground have a
| smooth texture like the smooth pebbles in a creek. Fresh-
| grinding gives the crystals a jagged, irregular shape. This
| enhances the effect when they hit your taste buds.
| PhilipRoman wrote:
| Not an expert on this, but after buying both types of salt
| from the same manufacturer and comparing them, the pre-ground
| one has a different texture and is less pleasant to eat;
| almost like it was mixed with dust.
| wouldbecouldbe wrote:
| Just that they use chemicals to keep the salt seperate.
| renw0rp wrote:
| I've asked my mother the exact same question a couple of
| weeks ago. She said, that as salt is hygroscopic "table salt"
| comes with anti-cacking agents. Salt which comes as larger
| crystals doesn't need them.
| pohl wrote:
| That's not enough to justify the grinder. Buy a box of
| Diamond Crystal Kosher salt. It has the perfect texture for
| keeping in a salter on the counter so it's easy to grab a
| pinch.
| hnal943 wrote:
| kosher salt is way too coarse for popcorn, so I don't
| think it eliminates the need for the grinder
| pohl wrote:
| You can control the coarseness by rubbing it between your
| fingers as you apply it. You may have seen video of chefs
| doing this.
| gruez wrote:
| What's wrong with the anti-caking agents?
| autoexec wrote:
| I guess it'd depend on what the agent was, but either
| way, it means some amount of the salt you're pouring over
| your food isn't salt. Eliminate the non-salt from your
| salt and you never have to worry about what might be
| wrong with it or how much non-salt you're paying for.
| That's the reason I've switched to shredding my own
| parmesan cheese instead of just shaking it out of a can
| since the cans in some cases contain ~10% cellulose.
| gumby wrote:
| Table salt is just sea salt (the stuff mined from
| underground just comes from an ocean that dried up a few
| million years ago) and is full of other compounds beyond
| NaCl.
| tashoecraft wrote:
| Table salt often contains iodine which will alter the
| flavor.
|
| The reason to grind your own salt is to get it at the
| right size.
| BirAdam wrote:
| You need iodine.
| datavirtue wrote:
| From salt? Don't I get iodine from my food?
| Scoundreller wrote:
| Usually not enough elemental iodine unless you eat a lot
| of sea life.
| AstralStorm wrote:
| None of which is sodium or potassium ferrocyanide, the
| chief anticaking agent. Otherwise it wouldn't
| crystallize.
| teh_klev wrote:
| Sure, but anti-caking agents are an adulteration of the
| original product you mined out of the ground.
| ambicapter wrote:
| I just bought salt and the ingredient list (sadly) is:
| sea salt, tricalcium phosphate (free-flowing agent),
| dextrose, potassium iodide.
| autoexec wrote:
| Why the hell are they adding corn sugar to salt?
|
| EDIT: I looked it up. It's supposed to stabilize the
| iodide. The reason they use corn sugar is that it's
| cheap. Thankfully there are brands that don't include
| additives in their salt. I'll have to keep an eye out for
| them. I already get plenty of iodide in my diet.
| henrydark wrote:
| I wouldn't trust anyone that is against cake
| malablaster wrote:
| Especially not an agent.
| itzworm wrote:
| Well it's not salt for one.
| Scoundreller wrote:
| I mean, calcium silicate _is_ a salt. As is sodium
| ferrocyanate.
|
| You want your anti-caking agent to absorb a lot of
| moisture and a salt is the way to do it.
| hutzlibu wrote:
| They are toxic.
|
| https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_ferrocyanide
|
| The amount is small enough, that it is supposed to do no
| harm, but I just prefer my salt without cyanide.
| wumms wrote:
| Me too - though the LD50s (rat, oral) of both are quite
| close:
|
| NaCl: 3.000 mg*kg-1 [0]
|
| Na4[Fe(CN)6]: 1600-3200 mg*kg-1 [1]
|
| [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_chloride
|
| [1] (german, as the english version has no LD50) https://
| de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natriumhexacyanidoferrat(II)
| xkcd-sucks wrote:
| With ferrocyanide in particular ([Fe(CN)6]4-), the reason
| cyanide (CN-) is such bad news is also the reason it's
| safe complexed to iron: Iron-Cyanide coordination is very
| strongly favored by thermodynamics and kinetics, so it
| likes to stick to iron, sticks very quickly, and un-
| sticks itself very slowly. When cyanide is not already
| coordinated to iron, it coordinates to the iron in
| hemoglobin (+ COX enzymes in mitochondria, and other less
| immediately important enzymes) and makes them not work,
| basically forever. But when CN- is already stuck
| coordinated to free iron, it doesn't really fall off
| enough to stick itself to enzymes in any meaningful
| amount. It would be more of a problem if CN- accumulated,
| but it's metabolized and excreted quickly enough to not
| be a big deal. The LD50 values basically reflect this.
| NovemberWhiskey wrote:
| > _They are toxic._
|
| If you ate enough salt to reach a toxic dose of sodium
| ferrocyanide, you'd already be dead from hypernatremia
| though?
|
| The dose makes the poison.
| hutzlibu wrote:
| "The dose makes the poison."
|
| Yes it does and it all adds up. So why would I add more
| things, that are poisenous even at small doses, when I
| can easily avoid it?
| coldtea wrote:
| > _Yes it does and it all adds up_
|
| Only for substances that accumulate, which is not the
| case here...
|
| Now if your salt has PFAS sure
| NovemberWhiskey wrote:
| > _Yes it does and it all adds up._
|
| No, it doesn't, because sodium ferrocyanide is poorly
| absorbed in the first place and not bioaccumulative in
| humans. I suppose you also don't each spinach or almonds
| either?
| hutzlibu wrote:
| "spinach" nope and of almonds not too many either.
|
| But my point is, sodium ferrocyanide intake is not
| beneficial, (unlike ordinary sodium). Even if it might do
| no harm, why should I risk even little harm?
|
| And with adding up, well there is a whole libary of other
| toxic or potentially toxic additives in the normal food
| you can buy. I prefer to minimize the potential bad
| intake, that's all.
| oniony wrote:
| Also watch out for the arsenic in rice.
|
| Some people don't each rice for this reason, but I just
| eat around it.
| verall wrote:
| It adds to the richness IMO.
| amelius wrote:
| I guess you will still get it in most restaurants.
| hutzlibu wrote:
| As well as in any processed food I am buying, yes I am
| aware of that. But when I have the choice, I prefer the
| non toxic salt (and it is still mindblowing to me, how it
| became normal to add cyanide to salt in the first place).
| smallerfish wrote:
| I mean, table salt in general carries pollutants from its
| source, e.g. https://www.nationalgeographic.com/environme
| nt/article/micro...
| hutzlibu wrote:
| Yup, there are cheap salts with their own toxins and even
| expensive Himalaya salt can probably contain bad stuff.
| But at least here in germany, there are (non government)
| organisations that test food for their poisons and you
| can buy their test results, also for salt, in the shape
| of a magazine.
|
| And even they can be wrong, sure, but I can still avoid
| poison where possible, so if I see no reason to
| voluntarily add cyanide on top of all the other shit for
| no good reason, I simply won't.
| Rediscover wrote:
| Same boat (non-toxic salt). I've mostly switched to MSG
| (except for paella), and much prefer it.
| Etrnl_President wrote:
| Starch is a common anti-caking agent. Too much of it will
| make you fat.
| AstralStorm wrote:
| Not in salt though, there it would cause more problems by
| making sticky mess.
| Scoundreller wrote:
| Sir, this a discussion about _popcorn_.
| InvaderFizz wrote:
| I prefer course grained and no anti caking agents or iodine
| added.
|
| It's nothing special, some no-name Himalayan pink salt in a
| plastic grinder.
| AstralStorm wrote:
| Well, iodine is required for life so you better get some
| elsewhere, like from a supplement. It's not present in
| sufficient amounts in water or plants these days...
| jibe wrote:
| Lack of iodine in the diet was an issue 100 years ago,
| but not so much now.
|
| _According to the National Institutes of Health's Office
| of Dietary Supplements, tests have shown that the
| population in the United States is "iodine sufficient."
| Most Americans who eat a varied diet get enough iodine
| even if they don't use iodized salt. They are at little
| risk of iodine deficiency*
|
| https://www.nytimes.com/2017/07/21/well/eat/should-we-be-
| buy..._
| thrashh wrote:
| That article is not trustworthy.
|
| It links Americans being iodine sufficient to getting
| varied diet but that's not a conclusion made by the
| source from what I can see.
|
| The article also says bread is a good source of iodine
| when the source says it's a very poor source of iodine.
|
| So I think the article is making stuff up, linking a
| source but hoping no one will actually read it, and
| probably written by someone trying to get iodine
| supplements removed.
|
| Normally I'd expect to see this kind of writing from some
| blog but not the NYT.
| Scoundreller wrote:
| It's worth it for anyone to read the article. Plenty of
| circumstances that could lead to deficiency.
|
| I think the "varied diet" usually means Americans get
| enough through non-home use iodized salt (like
| processed/restaurant foods). As the article says, seafood
| (plant or not) and dairy are good iodine sources, if you
| consume them.
| AstralStorm wrote:
| Seafood yes, dairy only because the cow's feed is
| supplemented. Free range grass fed cows will have low
| iodine content in milk.
| ceejayoz wrote:
| You're swapping caking agents and iodine for... a hefty
| list. (In both cases, less than really makes a difference
| to human health.)
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Himalayan_salt
|
| > Some salts mined in Pakistan are not suitable for food or
| industrial use without purification due to impurities...
| Although a study of pink salts commercially available in
| Australia showed Himalayan salt to contain higher levels of
| a range of elements, including calcium, iron, magnesium,
| manganese, potassium, aluminum, barium, silicon, and
| sulfur, and reduced levels of sodium, compared to table
| salt, the authors concluded that "exceedingly high intake"
| (a level in excess of the recommended daily salt intake by
| almost 600%) would be required for the differences to be
| clinically significant, levels at which any potential
| nutritional benefit would be outweighed by the risks of
| elevated sodium consumption such an intake would entail.
| InvaderFizz wrote:
| Oh, I'm not doing the pink salt because of the health
| benefits. I'm doing it because I like the flavor and how
| it interacts with my food better.
|
| I've never really like iodized table salt, the pink salt
| tastes "right" to me.
| ceejayoz wrote:
| Taste, I can get behind; fleur de sel is my go-to.
| op00to wrote:
| My conjecture: salt grinders create more irregular shapes
| than provided by commercially made table salt. Irregular
| shapes mean more surface area, which means faster absorption
| into the body, which means tastier food.
|
| Totally without evidence.
| zo1 wrote:
| I'm a big fan of tomatoes, and one of my favorite dishes is
| sliced tomatoes, salted, and eaten with cheese.
|
| For some reason, normal salt just sticks on the top of the
| tomato despite it being wet and I can "taste" the salt not
| just saltiness. However, with crunched salt crystals, they
| basically dissolve and disappear into the moisture of the
| tomato. This just tastes better too.
|
| Don't ask me why or how it all happens, it's just what I've
| found using my taste buds.
| oh_sigh wrote:
| Probably the anti-caking agents in the normal salt absorb
| some of the wetness and have it stay clumped up instead
| of diffusing through the tomato liquid
| op00to wrote:
| Why would anti-caking agents clump up? Isn't their
| purpose to not clump up?
| moogly wrote:
| Just buy Flavacol
| Scoundreller wrote:
| Yeah, I bought a pound (or a kilo?) and it will last me the
| rest of my life.
| hosteur wrote:
| For pop corn you need fine grained salt. A grinder lets you
| control that. It is only about the grain sizes. Nothing about
| freshness with salt. With pepper it is about freshly releases
| aromatics.
| GrooveSAN wrote:
| I've never found a salt grinder able to sustain the salt
| corrosion in the long run. Sooner or later, salt is
| aggregating and turning even the more resistant parts into
| rust.
|
| I was recently planning to get back to a regular
| pestle/mortar setup after yet another costly failure. Did
| you manage to find a way to work this around?
| czechdeveloper wrote:
| I use ceramic grinder. No corrosion possible.
| vladvasiliu wrote:
| > I've never found a salt grinder able to sustain the
| salt corrosion in the long run
|
| There are ceramic grinders now. I'd expect those to not
| rust, but I don't know how long they stay sharp.
| erikpukinskis wrote:
| You can make ceramics harder than the hardest steel so
| staying sharp shouldn't be a problem.
| carlmr wrote:
| I've had ceramic salt grinders for years now. Anecdotally
| you're right, never thought about replacing them.
| sgtnoodle wrote:
| What timescale are you talking about? I have a William
| Sonoma salt grinder, as well as one that my friend made
| for me. They're both about 5 years old. As far as I know
| there's no significant deterioration on either one. The
| grinding surfaces are ceramic.
| GrooveSAN wrote:
| Had usually some issues with (metallic) screws or other
| minor pieces after 1-2 years. Will take a look at ceramic
| grinders in the future.
| phito wrote:
| I've had a fully plastic one for about 5 years
| karakot wrote:
| Delivering microplastics right into the food since 19xx.
| heeen2 wrote:
| we use a cheap ikea grinder, it has ceramic burrs and has
| undergone countless refills and dishwasher cycles.
| epcoa wrote:
| It's easy enough in the US to just buy fine grained salt.
| sgtnoodle wrote:
| A coffee grinder will quickly make a lot of really fine
| salt. I do that when I need to heat treat 3D printed
| parts to improve their material strength. You pack the
| part into fine salt, bake it at the original extrusion
| temperature, then slowly let it cool down. The plastic
| liquefies, and the packed salt holds its shape.
| Azrael3000 wrote:
| Nice method, what infill do you need for that to work?
| 100% or is less possible?
| sgtnoodle wrote:
| You do need 100%, otherwise you'll end up with a void at
| the top once the plastic melts. You could experiment with
| intentionally designing in a "sprue" of extra material to
| melt and control where the void is, but I haven't tried
| it yet.
|
| I've successfully used this method on a sun gear for a
| planetary gear box designed for a low speed, high torque
| application. Due to mechanical constraints, the gear only
| had about 1.2mm of wall thickness at a 5mm radius, and it
| was prone to shearing off. Remelting it in salt solved
| the shearing, without having to redesign anything else.
| redox99 wrote:
| That'll probably really fuck up a coffee grinder, so make
| sure you don't use it for coffee.
| ClumsyPilot wrote:
| why would it fuck up a coffee grinder?
| maffikins wrote:
| Salt corrodes stuff
| Scoundreller wrote:
| And salt is a lot harder than a coffee bean. Blade is
| probably a really weak/soft metal. Might be harder than
| salt on the Mohs scale, but that just buys you time.
|
| Blade also gets kicked around more going around the salt
| instead of grinding through, more bending = shorter
| lifespan.
| epcoa wrote:
| I would assume they are talking about a blade "coffee"
| grinder, which is ironically terrible for coffee.
| galangalalgol wrote:
| If you want a really fine grind in a hurry you can use
| one and get ok results. You have to let it rest every 30s
| or so to cool down or it heats the grounds too much. I
| liked to shake it while grinding too. It isn't quite
| Turkish grind and there are a few large pieces that won't
| get full extraction, but if you want really fast
| extraction (or fast intentional over extraction) it
| works.
| sgtnoodle wrote:
| Yeah, a blade coffee grinder. For sure don't run salt
| through your expensive burr grinder!
| erikpukinskis wrote:
| A good blender works too.
| soperj wrote:
| pre-ground salt often contains sugar (as an ingredient, it's
| on the package).
| 2muchcoffeeman wrote:
| What? They sell salt with added sugar in the US!?!?
| lost_tourist wrote:
| It must be a special kind because Morton's the most
| popular brand of table in the USA has salt and calcium
| silicate, no sugar at all, 0.
| soperj wrote:
| Here's Morton's with dextrose.
| https://nourishingattempts.wordpress.com/2012/10/12/why-
| is-t...
| JohnFen wrote:
| I bet there's salt somewhere that has added sugar, but I
| have never personally seen it in my life.
| wholinator2 wrote:
| Yeah, no. I have no idea what that person is referencing.
| I've had all the available salts around me and I've
| literally never seen sugar in salt. That would be insane.
| They do use an anti caking agent sometimes though, but
| that's more like sand
| soperj wrote:
| [flagged]
| soperj wrote:
| [flagged]
| Gordonjcp wrote:
| [flagged]
| soperj wrote:
| [flagged]
| carlmr wrote:
| I've never seen this, this would lead to some sticky salt.
|
| Usually you see anti-caking agents and Iodide added.
| soperj wrote:
| https://www.achievergirl.com/wp-
| content/uploads/2016/07/suga...
| carlmr wrote:
| Nice, interesting explanation
| https://windsorsalt.com/faq/
| soperj wrote:
| I just like the number of people who replied to this
| telling me I'm full of it when a simple google image
| search returns hundreds of results.
| unmole wrote:
| Yeah, no. I'm really going need to see some evidence for
| this.
| soperj wrote:
| [flagged]
| jakogut wrote:
| I also don't use salt grinders, preferring coarse salt like
| Kosher or coarse sea salt on most dishes. However, to play
| Devil's advocate, a grinder is adjustable between fine and
| coarse.
| jcims wrote:
| This comment reminded me that for the past few years I've
| been using a hand crank coffee grinder for my pepper and i
| don't think I'll ever go back. It's perfect.
| hilbert42 wrote:
| _" Cover, put on high (I use gas)."_
|
| Microwave is also fine, I just use a Pyrex bowl put in kernels
| and cover with a non-metal plate. The plate is necessary or
| they end up everywhere except the bowl.
| arghwhat wrote:
| Trick: Use a wok, leaves nothing unpopped and can use less oil.
|
| Also, more of the world needs this in their lives:
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3fG8rNHUspU
|
| (not bdg - well yes also bdg - but in this case the _pep_ corn)
| bhandziuk wrote:
| I like to use as much peanut oil as possible. like 1/3 cup.
| Make a nice heavy popcorn. Delicious!
| skipkey wrote:
| If you have time, or have pre-made it, using clarified butter
| results in a better final product. I keep some in the fridge
| all the time. Ghee would probably work similarly, but I have
| never tried it.
| xctr94 wrote:
| Unless there's a comment more pedantic than mine disproving
| this, ghee IS clarified butter.
| soligern wrote:
| That's way too much work. Buy big bag of organic Amish baby
| corn. Buy a silicone popcorn maker. Toss a handful of popcorn
| in with some olive oil. Microwave for 3.5 minutes or until you
| hear only 2 pops a second. Sprinkle with salt. Done. Also a $20
| bag will probably make more than a hundred bowls.
| morsch wrote:
| It's really no different. Take a pot, toss in a handful of
| popcorn with some oil. Turn on stove for a couple of minutes
| until pops subside. Sprinkle with salt. Done.
|
| I never bothered with the butter etc, though maybe I should.
| soligern wrote:
| Can you just let it sit on the flame or do you have to move
| it around?
| randallsquared wrote:
| I use this method with a flat bottom pot (peanut oil and
| salt only), and I find that if I don't shake it from time
| to time, it will sometimes burn a bit before all kernels
| have popped. So, about halfway done, I shake and/or
| vertically bump the pot to let kernels settle back to the
| bottom.
|
| As the popping slows, I take the lid off entirely
| (there's enough popcorn at that point to keep new popping
| from splatter or jumping out), and add salt, and then
| rotate the bulk of the popped corn with a bump to one
| side, salt again, bump-rotate, etc, getting the salt on
| it evenly without letting it cool too much. I like
| popcorn that's just-popped hot.
|
| Two other notes:
|
| I only use peanut oil, because at fast popping
| temperatures, some oils smoke. The popcorn does not taste
| like peanuts, if you'd worry about that.
|
| I use more oil than most commenters, such that the single
| layer of kernels (3/4 cup in my pot) are nearly submerged
| at the start. Cleanup is more involved than a wipe of the
| pot, but the popcorn is a lot tastier and I don't need
| any butter or parm.
| 2muchcoffeeman wrote:
| I have experimented with various techniques: huge pot, wok,
| air popper, silicone bowls.
|
| The silicone bowls are by far the best. Big consistent,
| crisp pops. Minimal waste, you can even repop the unopposed
| kernels. But easy to burn if you are not careful.
|
| Air poppers are by far the worst. The pop corn always came
| out like styrofoam. I'd bite into the popcorn and it would
| just flatten.
|
| I don't believe the comments about getting minimal un-
| popped kernels using a pot, by just swirling around a bit
| of oil. Sounds like baloney to me. Results are good but
| waste is relatively high in a flat bottomed pot.
|
| The best vessel for stove top is a metal container with a
| curved bottom - wok, large metal bowl. Add popcorn and oil
| as normal. Heat for about a minute. Turn the heat off. Stir
| the kernels for 30s to a minute to let the heat even out.
| Turn the heat back on and cover. As they pop shake the
| container to help the kernels settle to the bottom. The
| same technique can be used in a normal pot, but the heat
| distribution is not as good.
| mtlmtlmtlmtl wrote:
| Oil helps distribute heat more evenly. Makes sense to me
| that this might make the popping more consistent.
| 2muchcoffeeman wrote:
| The only time you don't add oil is with an air popper. It
| does not guarantee results by itself.
| exmadscientist wrote:
| > I don't believe the comments about getting minimal un-
| popped kernels using a pot, by just swirling around a bit
| of oil. Sounds like baloney to me.
|
| It works, though!
|
| I use an ordinary 3qt pot (Cuisinart MCP193-18N, if it
| matters; this _is_ a tri-ply pot). Choose enough kernels
| to make a single layer on the bottom of the pot (that 's
| about 1/2 cup for this one, if I'm remembering
| correctly... I'm usually on autopilot doing this though)
| and set aside. Add enough oil to the pot to basically
| half cover the single layer, or a bit more. Add five
| kernels to the pot and start the heat at medium-high to
| high. Add the rest of the kernels when 3/5 of the test
| kernels have popped. Cover with lid. You're done when the
| pot is full (and it will be!). Pour the popcorn into a
| separate bowl to season and serve.
|
| Works every time, with very little waste kernels.
| 2muchcoffeeman wrote:
| Maybe it's my pot.
|
| I took or adapted my stove top method from Alton Brown.
| And it works on every wok so far.
| smallerfish wrote:
| According to https://www.healthline.com/health/body-
| modification/is-silic..., silicone utensils are unsafe to
| cook with above 220C, which I guess you're not going to
| reach popping popcorn. The list of potential conditions
| from silicone exposure aren't great. I couldn't find any
| studies at a quick search.
| JohnFen wrote:
| > I don't believe the comments about getting minimal un-
| popped kernels using a pot, by just swirling around a bit
| of oil. Sounds like baloney to me.
|
| I guess you don't have to believe it, but I rarely get
| more than two or three unpopped kernels that way,
| personally.
| xk_id wrote:
| I was just about to post about the silicone popcorn makers.
| They're amazingly practical, I'm super happy with mine, and
| I'm pretty sure it can't get any easier than that. Some risk
| of burning your popcorn tho as the window between "most
| kernels popped" and "burnt" is relatively short, so until you
| figure out the correct timings for your microwave's power,
| watch your fire alarms.
| coke12 wrote:
| You can do this with brown paper lunch bags. Put some
| popcorn in a bag, fold the top so that it doesn't open when
| it expands, and hit the popcorn button.
| DaanDL wrote:
| Most likely all of these alternatives contain PFAS as
| well, except for putting them in the good 'ol kettle on
| the stove. Source:
| https://www.tribuneindia.com/news/science-
| technology/paper-b...
| sgerenser wrote:
| That article appears to be talking about the type of bags
| and wrappers you get from fast food joints. I don't think
| a standard "brown paper bag" contains PFAS.
| Arn_Thor wrote:
| I think that only applies to variations of "non stick" or
| grease repellant paper bags, which is often used by fast
| food joints to avoid the food sticking to the paper.
| Hatrix wrote:
| My silicone popcorn maker works great in a regular
| household size microwave. Not so good in a small microwave
| like you get in a cheap hotel or RV.
| Blackthorn wrote:
| It does get easier: air popper. No burning to worry about,
| works perfectly every time.
| SethMurphy wrote:
| Air poppers are great for efficiency and convenience, but
| I find the consistency a bit chewy for my taste.
| Efficiency and convenience usually wins though, which is
| also why microwave popcorn is such a hit.
| JohnFen wrote:
| Yeah, I don't care for air-popped popcorn for that
| reason, too. But I prefer air-popped over microwave.
| xk_id wrote:
| I have a vague memory of using an air popper and as far
| as i remember it wasn't allowed to add oil. With the
| silicone ones you add oil and salt at the beginning and
| can ensure a uniform distribution
| Blackthorn wrote:
| Yep, no oil for an air popper. You get the popcorn and
| that's it. If you want to add fats, you do it afterward.
| bilalq wrote:
| I would avoid normal butter. I use ghee instead. The problem
| with butter is that it has water content that can cause the
| popcorn to get soggy. Ghee avoids that.
| leesalminen wrote:
| > Cover, put on high (I use gas). I like to suspend a paper
| towel between the lid and the rest of the pot, absorbs excess
| oil and water.
|
| Cool tip, thanks. I use basically the same steps except fort
| this one. Living in a high humidity environment (it's rarely
| below 70%), any step to reduce excess moisture helps improve
| the crunchiness of the popcorn.
| petre wrote:
| There are Chinese popcorn cannons that require less work. Here
| is a video of a family of two operating such a popcorn booth in
| China:
|
| https://youtu.be/DZQNjZ1xNgE
|
| We have much to learn from their culture.
| abrookewood wrote:
| Wow, that is literally a cannon ... crazy.
| bschwindHN wrote:
| I'm normally good at picking up on sarcasm on the internet,
| this is just an advanced joke, right?
| [deleted]
| resolutebat wrote:
| Looks like they're using the cannon to make both puffed rice
| (the first "shot") and popcorn (the second one). Same
| principle, of course.
| alvarezbjm-hn wrote:
| They were working with rice, after firing that batch they
| load the cannon with flint corn (pop corn)
|
| Corn explosion is louder than rice one.
| GrooveSAN wrote:
| > I like to suspend a paper towel between the lid and the rest
| of the pot, absorbs excess oil and water.
|
| Interesting. I like to keep that excess oil/water, as that
| extra moisture on the surface of the popcorns later helps the
| sugar/salt stick to it - without the need for additional
| butter/grease.
| sgtnoodle wrote:
| That's why I take out a dozen or so unpopped kernels before
| popping the rest. It's easier to throw them right in the trash,
| rather than have to pick them out of the rest of the popped
| corn.
| m_mueller wrote:
| wait, how can you differentiate the unpopped from the yet to
| pop? (tbh. so far I'm just a premade popcorn buyer, so
| ELI5...)
| smallerfish wrote:
| Ignore the snark from the sibling comments.
|
| You have to study the grain. Most kernels have a left to
| right grain, and they will pop between 140-150C, because
| the cell structure of the skin is weak in several places. A
| relatively rare genetic mutation leads to around 1-2% of
| kernels having a right to left grain, and because of this
| orientation the skin is actually more robust in the typical
| popping spots, meaning that temperatures as high as 450C
| are required to pop these! That's why they typically will
| remain unpopped when cooking popcorn in this legacy manner.
|
| To detect the right-to-left kernels, you can actually use a
| UV flashlight - you will see that they have a softer glow
| compared to the bright left to right kernels.
|
| Hope that helps!
| fullspectrumdev wrote:
| This is probably the most interesting thing I've read all
| day. Now where did I leave the UV torch...
| _aavaa_ wrote:
| I want to believe, but I don't have a UV light handy to
| verify this.
| nerdchum wrote:
| I dont know if this is true or if this is a brilliant and
| creative troll.
| Jolter wrote:
| _whoosh_
| Hnrobert42 wrote:
| It's a joke.
| toxicFork wrote:
| When you pick the kernels for the sacrifice they have to
| accept their fate and the others have to accept the
| tribute. It's just their tradition.
| xnzakg wrote:
| Apparently, the reason why some kernels don't pop is
| because they have too little moisture due to the hull not
| being perfect and the moisture escaping[1][2]. So it seems
| like it should be possible to somehow go through all the
| kernels and remove most of the unpoppable ones? Maybe make
| something that weighs each kernel and removes ones outside
| a range?
|
| 1: https://americasfavoritepopcorn.com/blogs/all-blogs/why-
| do-s... 2: https://popcornity.com/why-some-popcorn-kernels-
| dont-pop/
| SethMurphy wrote:
| This is funny. This is also not the type of comments that I
| expect to see on HN. I come here out of curiosity, not for
| humor or entertainment.
| ves wrote:
| These days, I've been separating the poop from the food
| before I eat it.
| Kichererbsen wrote:
| this is genius! the true life hack is always in the
| comments...
| jcims wrote:
| Plus who wants to eat unlucky popcorn?
| linsomniac wrote:
| I'm a "heat kernels to just below popping and then pop" fan,
| since trying this method a decade ago. The goal is to get all
| the kernels to pop in a relatively short window, so nothing
| sits there to burn.
|
| Method: - Prepare: Measure out 1/3 cup of
| popcorn and have a serving bowl ready. - Add high temp
| oil to the pot. I use 1-2tbs of coconut oil. - Place in
| stock pot along with 3 kernels over medium high heat. -
| Cover with a kitchen towel (to let out some steam during
| popping, don't want a soggy popcorn). - Once the kernels
| pop, immediately dump in the rest of the kernels (I usually do
| 1/3 cup, whatever the instructions recommend). -
| Immediately take off the heat and shake gently to the count of
| 30. The kids love participating in the count. - Put back
| on the heat and shake a little to make sure the kernels are
| evenly distributed. - Once the popping slows, immediately
| take it off the heat and dump into a serving bowl. This
| prevents burning.
|
| This method works great, rave reviews from the family.
| jrmg wrote:
| With this method, the popping is reasonably quick, and the
| temperature fairly consistent, so, despite the advice
| seemingly everywhere in the internet, high temp oil isn't
| actually necessary. Be careful and you can use olive oil
| (though that tastes a bit weird) or even butter.
| greedo wrote:
| I use clarified butter since it has a higher melting point,
| and it even flavors the popcorn.
| leobg wrote:
| Higher smoke point
| mauvehaus wrote:
| Old Bay seasoning on popcorn is fantastic. I usually don't
| butter if I'm putting it on, though I'm sure that would be
| delicious too.
| JohnFen wrote:
| Old Bay is great, yes! I also like nutritional yeast on
| popcorn.
|
| But plain old butter is still my favorite.
| systems_glitch wrote:
| Our recipe:
|
| * 3 tablespoons bacon grease * 1/2 cup popcorn kernels
|
| Put the bacon grease in a large pot and add three kernels of
| popcorn. Heat it on half heat (5 on a gas burner, anyway) until
| the three kernels all pop -- this will usually be the point at
| which smoke from the grease is accumulating in the pot (if you
| have a large lid you can watch). Once the three pop, dump the
| rest in. Scoot the pot vigorously back and forth on the stove
| to shake the unpopped kernels to the bottom. Turn off the heat
| when the popping stops.
|
| Pour in a bowl and salt to taste. No butter required. As above,
| you get almost no unpopped kernels this way!
|
| We use "rainbow popcorn," which is multi-color and we think
| tastes better. It doesn't pop as big as the regular yellow
| kind.
|
| I'll have to try the paper towel trick, especially with the
| smaller pot I sometimes use.
| aSockPuppeteer wrote:
| Kettle corn * 1/4 cup coconut oil * 1/4 cup white sugar * 1/2
| cup unpopped popcorn kernels
|
| Heat oil first. Use the 3 kernel method to make sure oil is hot
| enough then add sugar and rest of kernels. Use a large
| lightweight pot with lid to shake every few seconds or you get
| uneven coated or crispy burnt pieces.
|
| I tried different oils and sugar mixes but coconut with white
| sugar seems the best.
|
| I read there are ways to use an air fryer also but haven't
| tried yet.
| havnagiggle wrote:
| Add some sugar to the oil and skip the butter. So goooood!
| AHOHA wrote:
| I just buy corn and pop them naturally with popcorn machine, I
| don't add anything, and it's good and healthy!
| davidgatti wrote:
| I think the problem is with the popcorn and not the waves ^_^
| simmerup wrote:
| I'd suspect the packaging more than the food
| technick wrote:
| Well crap....
| throwaway892238 wrote:
| Make oil-free microwave popcorn by buying a collapsible silicone
| bowl, filling it with kernels, and nuking it for 3 minutes. Low
| calorie snack, no mess, no cleanup. I find salt sticks to it best
| afterward by sprinkling with a little water.
| MrDunham wrote:
| The low calorie part is questionable. Popcorn has (off I
| remember right) quite a lot more calories than you'd expect.
|
| Source: I started getting fat of popcorn every day and am
| typically considered skinny/fit. Then I read the label and got
| sad.
| hombre_fatal wrote:
| Popcorn is 30cal per cup which is low calorie. Since you
| mention reading a label, the thing you're getting fat from
| isn't the popcorn but the fat added to it.
|
| The comment you reply to specifically mentions oil-less
| popcorn which is a low calorie stack and a good source of
| fiber once you get used to not lathering it in butter or
| olive oil.
| Fezzik wrote:
| Unadorned popped kernels are relatively low calorie, I think
| - 3 cups is less than 100 calories. Popcorn is also a decent
| source of roughage.
| xk_id wrote:
| No, the kernels are very low calorie. It all comes down to
| how much fats you use (if any).
| smelendez wrote:
| Fast food also. Not shocking since it's all served in grease-
| blocking packaging.
|
| It's always depressing to eat inside a fast food restaurant,
| where they wrap all of your food in chemically treated packaging
| you almost immediately discard since it's presumably cheaper and
| simpler than having washable dishes.
| NoZebra120vClip wrote:
| Take heart, because all the dishes and silverware in an upscale
| restaurant are likewise coated in contact poison. The reason
| being is that kitchens don't have the patience to air-dry their
| dishes, so they use chemical drying agents. These drying agents
| are toxic and they tend to leave a residue everywhere. So enjoy
| your fast food and know that you are in good company, no matter
| the number of Michelin stars.
| nabogh wrote:
| I'm sympathetic to this point of view but unless we're
| linking these so called toxins with a worse outcome how can
| we know they're actually causing harm? In all likelihood
| we'll die of a heart attack before any amount of toxins give
| us super cancer or whatever.
| jondwillis wrote:
| Having just started my dishwasher with a rinse aid, I checked
| on some of the ingredients. All of them slightly toxic w/
| little potential to bioaccumulate.
|
| Do you know what chemicals or products restaurants tend to
| use?
| selimthegrim wrote:
| The commercial dishwasher rinse aids are much much worse
|
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33822149
| Nition wrote:
| My dishwasher manual suggested using white vinegar as a
| rinse aid alternative. I thought it might make the dishes
| smell like vinegar but it's been fine.
| throwaway173738 wrote:
| I use white vinegar to deodorize my clothes and can
| confirm that it evaporates when dried.
| Rapzid wrote:
| All things are poison, and nothing is without poison; the
| dosage alone makes it so a thing is not a poison.
| seydor wrote:
| why would you eat popcorn after the age when you become conscious
| of food anyway
| fallat wrote:
| this guy doesnt popcorn.
| resolutebat wrote:
| One more reason not to eat microwave popcorn: at least here in
| Australia, the prepackaged oil is invariably bottom-of-the-barrel
| palm oil, and there's _lots_ of it in there.
|
| https://www.reddit.com/r/mildlyinteresting/comments/13r7r3k/...
| SethMurphy wrote:
| Try the stovetop method with preferred oil and then drizzle honey
| before heating. Higher risk of burning, more shaking is needed.
| When popped, lightly salt. Make sure to rinse the pot with water
| while still hot to not allow sticky burnt sugars to get
| solidified for an easier cleanup.
| wkat4242 wrote:
| Ok this is a bit worrying indeed. I have to say I hardly ever eat
| that stuff, just because it's not even that nice. And it's full
| of hard fat.
| firecall wrote:
| > My kids eat microwaved popcorn almost every night. Should I be
| worried?
|
| Every night?!
|
| Well yes...
| handedness wrote:
| https://web.archive.org/web/20230622235711/https://www.uclah...
| mensetmanusman wrote:
| Prozac, Lipitor, and Flonase are also PFAS used in the body.
| camhart wrote:
| Microwave popcorn (in the bag) is garbage. I found I much prefer
| using a silicone popper [1], and then adding my own butter/salt
| to it. Tastes just like when I use an air popper. Since that
| approach doesn't use the popcorn bag, would it then be free from
| PFAS?
|
| [1] https://www.amazon.com/Proper-Popper-Microwave-
| Collapsible-D...
| [deleted]
| eduction wrote:
| I also use a silicone microwave popper. Seems cleaner and less
| wasteful than the paper bag technique.
| handedness wrote:
| That's quite the URL.
|
| Cooking in silicone is something I would probably also avoid,
| especially if one can't be certain of its composition:
| https://www.beuc.eu/sites/default/files/publications/BEUC-X-...
| [deleted]
| sp332 wrote:
| It's an affiliate link. (tag=hyprod-20) You can use
| https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07Z5SPRWM/ instead.
| camhart wrote:
| It's not an affiliate link... I just copied the URL my
| browser gave me.
| londons_explore wrote:
| Did OP make an affiliate link just to earn a few bucks from
| HN'ers?
|
| If so, I suspect there are better uses for their time...
| PaywallBuster wrote:
| He could get commission from any sales in the next 30
| days
|
| not just this 11$ product
| fbdab103 wrote:
| 30 days?! That seems shockingly generous for Amazon. What
| happens when someone has a handful of overlapping
| affiliate clicks? Do the referrers all split the pool or
| most-recent wins?
| londons_explore wrote:
| last click wins.
| guraf wrote:
| From the other stuff in the url I'm pretty sure OP just
| copied the link from an ad to Amazon, not created their
| own affiliate link (which would be crass but par for the
| course in the techbro hustle we live in I guess)
| MicropenisMike wrote:
| I was curious so I googled the text "hyprod-20"
|
| It let to a forum from 5 years ago with someone accusing
| someone else of doing the same thing!
|
| In the end, it seems like it's something google appends
| to their search
|
| Fun little read for you:
|
| https://www.forestriverforums.com/forums/f218/50a-trailer
| -30...
| cosmodisk wrote:
| Or simply use large saucepan. Pour some oil to cover its base,
| wait until the oil gets high temperature, pour corn. Then,
| shake it every now and then. We used to make tons of them when
| we were kids and even now I make it occasionally, when we do
| movie nights at home
| camhart wrote:
| I've found I burn the popcorn often with this. Maybe just a
| lack of experience (we always had an air popper growing up).
| You can also use small amounts of butter (or I guess oil if
| you wanted) with the silicone popper or air popper. Having
| enough oil to cover the base seems like a lot more oil? I
| could be wrong, just guessing.
| cosmodisk wrote:
| There's an element of practice too. Ideally, you want a
| very thin layer of oil to cover the base, or maybe even
| less. It doesn't need to be a lot. Also an average saucepan
| would produce quite a lot popcorn
|
| To prevent burning, shaking and occasionally lifting off
| the hob is required. Also not adding too much corn helps a
| lot. The maximum a saucepan can take is when the entire
| base is covered with them.
| MrDunham wrote:
| I've found 50% oil by volume to kernels works great.
|
| Eg 1/3 cup kernels, fill same cup halfway (1/6 cup), add
| flavacol to the oil in the measuring cup & stir, mix with
| kernels in a saucepan over heat. Love life
| hombre_fatal wrote:
| 1/6 cup is 320 calories of oil. Definitely not the most
| calorie-thrifty way to make it.
| ibiza wrote:
| I use this method as well. To add some specifics, I use a
| 4 qt saucepan to produce enough for two people. I use
| enough oil to liberally cover the bottom (glug glug).
| This is not diet food, excess oil tends to remain in the
| pot anyway, and I believe most of the heat transfer is
| oil to corn as opposed to from the pot itself, so you
| need ample hot oil for a good batch.
|
| To judge when the oil is hot enough for the corn, I add 3
| kernels to the initial pot + oil. Once those 3 kernels
| pop, add enough corn to cover the base of the pan, swirl
| the hot oil w/ the new kernels, replace cover, but leave
| slightly ajar to allow steam to escape, and then yeah, a
| couple more swirls & you should have a perfect batch in
| about a minute or so.
| stevenwoo wrote:
| You may be using too high a heat. I've found the highest
| setting on my stovetop makes it a pretty high probability
| some popped kernels will burn (or many if I make a mistake)
| but a lower setting is sufficient to pop almost every
| kernel and reduce the risk of burning with techniques
| people describe in other posts. The air popper I tried
| tended to leave quite a few unpopped kernels with the same
| corn kernels I use on the stove top.
| boppo1 wrote:
| Do you cover it to prevent mess?
| cosmodisk wrote:
| I know someone who didn't. Let's just say it wasn't pretty
| in the kitchen afterwards:)
| 01100011 wrote:
| Yep. Got a silicone popper and love it. Much more efficient
| than stovetop, too.
|
| Decide if you like white or yellow corn, find a good brand, and
| buy it cheap, in-bulk, for a cheap and nutritious snack. You'll
| notice significant variation in unpopped kernels between
| brands.
|
| I spray my kernels lightly with avocado oil and sprinkle
| popcorn salt(finer than normal to improve adhesion) before
| popping. I eat at least one large bowl a day now.
| colordrops wrote:
| Does the silicone leech anything? Seems like a metal popper on
| the stove would be best.
| 01100011 wrote:
| Microwave doesn't heat up your house as much and is probably
| faster.
| colordrops wrote:
| Depends on your priorities. There is some recent evidence
| that silicone leaches chemicals into food, but if that's
| not important to you, then sure, microwave it.
| 01100011 wrote:
| Microwave it in a paper bag or a glass bowl if you like.
| Rapzid wrote:
| Yeah, I got a hot pop(exact same thing) and it's been a game
| changer. Kernels are so cheap.
| leetrout wrote:
| Something I learned a few weeks ago:
|
| Put 1/3 cup kernels in a large brown paper lunch bag and fold the
| top down several times. Microwave as normal, bag standing up,
| listening for pops to slow down. Air pops in the bag with no
| issues.
|
| Salt (and ghee) after you dump it in the bowl.
|
| I have stopped using my whirlypopper.
| hackernudes wrote:
| You can even staple the bag closed. But now I'm a whirlypop
| convert. Coconut oil and flavacol popcorn salt. Yum.
| worthless-trash wrote:
| I thought you were not meant to put metal into a microwave ?
| Larrikin wrote:
| It depends on the shape and size. Smooth metal spoon in the
| microwave will be fine, a fork in the microwave will get
| electrical arcs and possibly destroy your microwave.
|
| Personally I'd just use some kind of metal-free chip clamp
| instead of actual staples, just to be safe.
| ziml77 wrote:
| It's not even very obvious what won't arc. FreshDirect
| sells pre-cooked turkey burgers. They come in a metal
| container with the edges bent over in a way to allow a
| plastic lid to snap on. Their official cooking
| instructions stay to just remove the lid and put the
| container in the microwave. It was surprising, but it
| doesn't have any arcing issues.
| bschwindHN wrote:
| > Coconut oil and flavacol popcorn salt
|
| I used to work at a movie theater, this is the way.
| atentaten wrote:
| Yep. This brings the movie theater flavor to your home.
| leetrout wrote:
| Indeed. That is the way.
|
| I measure a heaping tablespoon of solidified ghee and melt it
| and add 1 tsp flavacol and toss the popped corn with it to
| get a similar flavor.
| adrianmonk wrote:
| I do this too. I also use a food scale to weigh out the popcorn
| within about a gram. I figured out the number of seconds
| required, so I no longer have to listen.
|
| The process is surprisingly reproducible. I get very few
| unpopped kernels, usually around 5 of them.
| rubslopes wrote:
| Would you mind sharing your formula and also your microwave's
| wattage?
| adrianmonk wrote:
| 1200W Panasonic inverter microwave.
|
| 66g of popcorn (that's two servings, according to the
| label).
|
| 2 minutes and 8 seconds.
|
| After cooking, add oil/butter and popcorn salt, then toss.
| Popcorn salt likes to fall to the bottom, so after tossing,
| I put on the popper lid, carefully flip it upside down, and
| shake.
|
| Also, I use a silicone popper, not a paper bag. (Above, I
| meant to reply to a different comment.)
|
| I'm eating some right now, turns out. When I'm done, I'll
| edit this comment with a count of unpopped kernels. :-)
|
| ---
|
| EDIT: 2 unpopped kernels!
| autoexec wrote:
| I'll give this try, although after reading about the problem
| with PFAS and microwave popcorn a few months ago I switched to
| Jiffy pop and it's pretty fun.
| elevaet wrote:
| I came here to describe this method as well. Verified and PFAS
| free!
| vel0city wrote:
| Other than cleaning and excess calories, what's wrong with the
| whirlypopper?
| gnicholas wrote:
| Noise, and takes up space?
| leetrout wrote:
| The microwaved popcorn is much crisper. Really surprised me.
| Not that the whirlypopper is a lot of work but the microwave
| is even quicker since there is little mess.
| vel0city wrote:
| Cool, I was wondering if there were any similar health
| concerns I wasn't thinking of with the comment. Not that
| eating popcorn is exactly a healthy choice. I've been
| looking into alternative popcorn popping ideas and friends
| have given great reviews (and great samples over the years
| :) ) of the whirlypop so I've been considering that along
| with an airpopper.
|
| I'll give that paper bag trick a try sometime, thanks!
| mock-possum wrote:
| Actually might be healthier because it's not fried in hot
| oil, only flavoured with warm oil at the end.
| Ekaros wrote:
| Are we sure that paper bags sold and used like this are PFAS
| free?
| tjr wrote:
| Yes, I've been using the paper bag method for a while. Tastes
| better than prepackaged microwave popcorn too!
| sideproject wrote:
| An oncologist in my family anecdotally told me how her patients
| are getting younger and younger - speculates (with research) that
| lots of food chemicals might be contributing.
|
| Since the beginning of this year, our family has been much more
| conscious of the ingredients in the food labels. Lots of
| additives with many different numbers. We've been trying to get
| back to more natural things with less numbers. We bought
| breadmaker and started making our own bread (fun and messy).
| Bought a second hand ice cream maker (fun, tedious, but yum).
| Never knew how simple popcorn making was! Lots of colours of
| vegetables, home-grown spring onions. Our grocery bills on
| vegetables and fruits went up sharply. But it went down on
| crackers, chocolates and other things sharply.
|
| I don't feel anything - but it helps me to think that I'm eating
| less numbers.
| atentaten wrote:
| Any brand recommendations on the ice cream maker and
| breadmaker?
| CaptainZapp wrote:
| Don't eat anything your great-grandmother wouldn't recognize as
| food.
|
| Michael Pollan
| mrguyorama wrote:
| My great grandmother was a housewife in the 50s so that would
| include things like a "salad" made of mayo and nuts on a
| banana or a jello dish full of tuna.
| toxicFork wrote:
| I thought at first that the existing patients are getting
| better and looking younger thanks to the chemicals, rather than
| the new patients being younger than the previous ones.
| Rnonymous wrote:
| Ironically the pans in breadmakers are always(afaik) non-stick,
| based on the same PFAS chemicals.
|
| Not that im saying you should avoid using a bread maker, but it
| doesn't avoid all chemicals...
| AstralStorm wrote:
| Less ironically the nonstick surfaces do not leach much of
| those after an initial bake cycle, unless you scrape them.
| Much less than, say, a plastic bottle.
|
| But if you're really bothered by this, you can actually get a
| non-stick ceramic coated insert instead. Or do it the classic
| way with steel or glass and fat, just like cake.
|
| Or get bread that's not packed in plastic heh.
| Rnonymous wrote:
| I was thinking that the PFAS probably make their way into
| the bread not during the bake cycle, but during the dough
| kneading/mixing cycles.
|
| In my head I imagine the dough sticking to the surface and
| removing a monolayer of PFAS and integrating it in the
| dough.
| sergioisidoro wrote:
| The numbers are not bad, and in many cases they might even be
| totally natural (eg. e330 citric acid, the acid present on
| citrus fruits).
|
| I worry more about what's not in the labels (like pesticides
| used, antibiotics in meats, packaging etc). Your approach seems
| to be directionally correct tho, if you source your ingredients
| right.
| sofixa wrote:
| That's why I'm so happy Yuka exists. It's an app that scans
| barcodes of foodstuffs or cosmetics, and gives you an easy
| and clear scoring of the stuff inside them based on how good
| are they for you and for the planet (e.g. too much sugar,
| lots of protein, high impact on the environment, local or
| not, additives, etc.).
|
| Of course it doesn't work on stuff without barcodes like
| vegetables and fruit, meat bought fresh, etc. but still it's
| extremely helpful and useful.
| AstralStorm wrote:
| I believe a lot of this is leached from packaging, not even
| put directly in the food. How about we stop using plastic
| foil, foil laminated paper and plastic trays for everything?
| Glass was fine, plain paper was fine, waxed paper was fine,
| even non-laminated cans are fine.
| Trencin wrote:
| I feel this is somewhat misleading. One does not have to use
| these microwave popcorn bags, I have cooked popcorn in a
| microwave using a normal glass bowl, albeit covered with a plate.
| No oil required.
| [deleted]
| gnicholas wrote:
| Once I learned you can just microwave plain kernels in a paper
| bag, I threw out all of our microwave popcorn. Even low-salt/low-
| fat is much saltier and richer than I prefer. Now with this PFAS
| news, it's yet another reason to ditch the prepackaged popcorn.
| quickthrower2 wrote:
| Also price difference is nuts. Kernels are as cheap as oats
| almost.
| hackernoteng wrote:
| they are cheap but I find they dont last that long - the
| freshness goes away unless you find a way to store them very
| airtight.
| esafak wrote:
| How do you seal the bag during popping, with twine?
| gnicholas wrote:
| Fold it down a couple times?
| Ekaros wrote:
| Are you entirely sure that the paper bag used was PFAS free?
| DoingIsLearning wrote:
| Reminder that PFAS is so pervasive that researchers can't design
| studies with a proper control group. i.e. they virtually cannot
| find anyone in the world without PFAS in their blood.
|
| Dupont/3M did (and continue to do) a level of harm on par with
| CFCs and leaded gasoline, with complete regulatory impunity.
|
| At some point the ICC needs to extend the crimes against
| humanity/nature to something like crimes against Human Health.
| [deleted]
| mdp2021 wrote:
| > _Dupont /3M did (and continue to do) a level of harm_
|
| 3M is on The Economist today with relevance to this matter:
|
| > _3M, an American conglomerate, agreed to pay cities and
| utilities $12.5bn to settle thousands of lawsuits that had
| alleged chemicals emitted by the firm 's products had polluted
| drinking-water supplies_
| DoingIsLearning wrote:
| It would be billions more to:
|
| 1. Clean up PFAS from riverbeds and groundwater sediment.
|
| 2. Add PFAS cleaning stages in all water treatment systems
| across the globe.
|
| At 12.5B, they are just paying up the people that can prove
| they now have cancer because of ridiculous exposure levels.
|
| At 12.5B this is just the cost of doing business for Chem
| industry.
| thfuran wrote:
| >At 12.5B, they are just paying up the people that can
| prove they now have cancer because of ridiculous exposure
| levels.
|
| Probably not even that.
| MrBodangles wrote:
| Nice. I'm guessing that'll barely cover a years worth of
| filtration (which they won't ever spend it on anyway). What
| about the next 100 years? Let them profit because oligarchy?
| myshpa wrote:
| PFAS 'forever chemicals' cost society EUR16 trillion a year
|
| https://euobserver.com/green-economy/157075
| tornato7 wrote:
| This is absurd. The GDP of the entire world is on the order
| of ~$100T. How can this article claim that 15% of all GDP
| is spent/lost due to PFAS without going through absurd
| calculations like how long it would take to remove every
| bit of it from water supplies using current inefficient
| methods? (Obv I'm not paying for a euobserver subscription)
| myshpa wrote:
| This page contains the figures / calculations (first link
| in the euobserver's article).
|
| https://chemsec.org/reports/the-top-12-pfas-producers-in-
| the...
|
| The top 12 PFAS producers in the world and the staggering
| societal costs of PFAS pollution
|
| Only twelve companies account for a majority of the PFAS
| production in the world. PFAS production is hardly
| profitable, but the cost for society is massive.
| ClumsyPilot wrote:
| What about all the other cities in the world?
|
| If the true cost of this damage were paid, 3M would be driven
| to bancrupsy. Maybe then the next conpany would not be so
| gun-ho about dumping strange chemicals.
|
| This is your regular reminder that many of the wealthy are
| only so, because they never pay for the consequences of their
| actions.
| DriverDaily wrote:
| It's hard to blame it all on one class.
|
| Littering was a social norm when these chemicals were
| invented. Even today, most Americans eat meat from factory
| farms, drive gas powered cars, and throw most trash in a
| landfill. Problems that will have to eventually be fixed.
|
| If you're born into this kind of society are you going to
| handicap yourself by holding yourself to a stricter set of
| rules than everyone else? The 'yes' and 'no's to that
| question don't fall neatly into class lines.
| ClumsyPilot wrote:
| > throw most trash in a landfill.
|
| Is this some stranhe double-hypocracy?
|
| If 3M put their crap is a properly contained landfill,
| millions of people wouldn't be poisoned!
|
| 'Sins of the consumer' is a toxic ideology!
| DriverDaily wrote:
| If you want to be proactive about problems you need the
| political will to create and enforce rules. But nobody
| votes for rules that make people's lives worse now, but
| future generations lives better. You can't just blame
| rich people for that.
|
| The political will didn't exist for pfas back then, and
| it doesn't exist for things like water scarcity, or
| antibiotic resistance, or e-waste today.
| ClumsyPilot wrote:
| Knowingly poisoning people is a criminal offence, and
| always was. They knew their workers were dying from it,
| they had done studies that show it's toxic.
|
| No new laws are needed.
|
| This is not the case of finding loopholes in laws or
| pushing a problem off to the next generation, like
| climate change.
|
| This is a corporation profiting off someone's death and
| getting away with it.
| DriverDaily wrote:
| > No new laws are needed.
|
| So the laws worked just fine, they just need to be
| enforced better? That's exactly what a lack of political
| will looks like.
| DiabloD3 wrote:
| I agree.
|
| However, how do you go after people who have so much money they
| can literally buy their way out of any appropriate punishment?
| We need something stronger than the ICC.
| cnity wrote:
| There are solutions but they exist only outside of the
| judicial system...
| ClumsyPilot wrote:
| There is hope for refom, back in mediaval times judicial
| system had many creative punishments
| RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote:
| > Reminder that PFAS is so pervasive that researchers can't
| design studies with a proper control group. i.e. they virtually
| cannot find anyone in the world without PFAS in their blood.
|
| The very pervasiveness argues against PFAS being that bad for
| humans in real life. Despite pretty much everyone having PFAS
| in their blood, at a global level, health is probably better
| than ever and most health problems are from refined sugars and
| sedentary lifestyle than anything that can be attributed to
| PFAS.
| k8si wrote:
| Certain brands (e.g. SkinnyPop) advertise their bags as
| "chemical-free" (SkinnyPop claims their's is free of PFOAS). Can
| anyone help me understand/verify these kinds of claims?
| mgrund wrote:
| Some brands do use PFAS free bags and have for a while though.
| ksaj wrote:
| Is it the microwaves effect on the popcorn, or the fake butter
| that might cause "popcorn lung" if the fumes get inhaled, getting
| modified into PFAs by microwaving?
|
| If it's the first, I'd expect almost everything you nuke to be at
| least a risk of PFAs. If its the second, that's easier to deal
| with by avoiding fake popcorn butter.
| Bud wrote:
| [dead]
| nunesvn wrote:
| > They are also widely used in paper products meant to hold
| foods that are hot, gooey or greasy. That includes the wrappers
| that hold fast food, and, as you noted in your letter,
| microwave popcorn bags.
|
| It's on the paper.
| cmrx64 wrote:
| Diacetyl contains no fluorine, it's gotta be whatever lining
| they use on the paper.
| smelendez wrote:
| Yeah, the study says PFAS has been found in the packaging.
| MagicMoonlight wrote:
| Why has fertility halved we ask as we drink the plastic water.
|
| One day this will be the "why did they put lead in toys" of our
| period
| chrischen wrote:
| Is it possible to substitute the PFAS with a wax coating?
| Jolter wrote:
| Most waxes melt at about body temperature. You'd be eating
| waxed popcorn.
| myshpa wrote:
| Most waxes are made from fossil fuels anyway (because money).
| eadler wrote:
| The article does not cite or link to the study.
|
| > The researchers found that people who ate microwave popcorn
| every day over the course of a year had levels of PFAS that were
| up to 63% higher than average.
|
| As far as I could tell the relevant study [1] merely finds
| association rather than causation. This is often the best you can
| do in the nutrition field though. I have not yet read through the
| entire contents.
|
| [1] Herbert P. Susmann, Laurel A. Schaider, Kathryn M. Rodgers,
| and Ruthann A. Rudel. 2019. Dietary Habits Related to Food
| Packaging and Population Exposure to PFASs. Environmental Health
| Perspectives 127, 10 (October 2019).
| DOI:https://doi.org/10.1289/EHP4092
| Bud wrote:
| [dead]
| hombre_fatal wrote:
| Even double blinded randomized cross over trials only shows
| associations. That doesn't mean you can't make reasonable
| casual inferences after looking at the balance of evidence.
| Else we couldn't even infer that smoking causes cancer,
| something most people have to bite the bullet on when they
| denounce nutrition science.
| gretch wrote:
| ? You can show causation by having a test group and a control
| group.
|
| Just get N people. Have the control group eat pot cooked
| popcorn and have the experimental group eat microwave.
|
| You can't get causation by just observing, but once you are
| willing to make someone do something, then it's pretty easy
| to arrive at.
|
| I tried to verify the GP quote but actually couldn't find it
| in the study - but if it's true, people who eat microwave
| popcorn every day for a year is an extreme population in all
| sorts of ways. I don't eat anything every day for a year,
| much less popcorn.
| brightlancer wrote:
| The quote is in the original UCLA Health article, not the
| study.
|
| "Research suggests that people who regularly consume
| microwave popcorn have markedly higher levels of PFAS in
| their bodies. A study published in 2019 analyzed a decade
| of data about the eating habits of 10,000 people, which was
| collected by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention
| between 2003 and 2014. Blood samples from the study
| participants were also collected. The researchers found
| that people who ate microwave popcorn every day over the
| course of a year had levels of PFAS that were up to 63%
| higher than average."
| ClumsyPilot wrote:
| > Just get N people. Have the control group eat pot cooked
| popcorn and have the experimental group eat microwave
|
| You can only control what people eat if you lock them up in
| a prison or similar institution.
|
| These days locking up thousands of people and experimenting
| with their diet is not cool.
|
| The best nutritional / food studies come from prisons and
| similar institutions.
| red-iron-pine wrote:
| The Army.
|
| A lot of studies are done on high-level, competitive NCAA
| / college athletes. Both cuz they're, like, already at a
| university, but also NCAA has mandatory physicals, and
| high level athletics lends itself to controlled
| lifestyles.
|
| Both tend to rule out most health issues as well; in
| theory you can be diabetic and play NCAA Div 1 ball, but
| selection bias tends to weed them out, while the Army
| explicitly does so.
| alvarezbjm-hn wrote:
| Who is going to fund a study designed to find causation of
| high pfas blood levels?
|
| The corn producers, the microwave popcorn brands? If any of
| them ever does, be sure that the study will either find no
| proof of causation or not be published
| FooBarWidget wrote:
| The ministry of public health?
| jay_kyburz wrote:
| You also have to have the control group eat every other
| meal the same as the study.
|
| The first thing that comes to my mind if you are eating
| microwave popcorn every day, what other junk foods are you
| eating every day?
| [deleted]
| squokko wrote:
| Especially since someone who eats microwave popcorn EVERY DAY
| is someone who clearly treats their body like a garbage can
| pas wrote:
| it's cheap, even vegan probably (if not buttered), not full
| of sugar, etc. what's wrong with it? yes, every day seems
| suboptimal, but it's not trivial to have a varied balanced
| healthy diet, and folks need to eat every day (usually at
| least twice).
| esperent wrote:
| The reality of commercial microwave popcorn is the problem,
| not the "idea" of microwave popcorn, if that makes sense.
|
| What I mean is, if you make homemade microwave popcorn with
| good oils and a pinch of salt it's presumably fine. But the
| cheap packets you buy in the store, brand-name or not, are
| full of crap - rancid, cheap oils, additives and
| preservatives of all kinds, weird artificial flavors,
| almost certainly a ridiculous amount of salt and sugar, and
| now possibly packaging that's of such poor quality it
| leeches PFAs. It's not the corn that's the problem.
| fbdab103 wrote:
| >...that were up to 63% higher than average
|
| "Up to" can cover a lot of sins. Does that mean one person had
| 63% higher than normal and the median daily-popcorn eater was
| 10% higher?
| smallerdemon wrote:
| Truly, microwave popcorn is atrocious for all sorts of reasons.
|
| As top vote getting comment points out, regular popcorn is SO
| easy and SO much better. I have no idea why anyone wants to make
| microwave popcorn when the regular way is just as easy, taste
| better, and in now demonstrably healthier.
| T3RMINATED wrote:
| [dead]
| FiddlerClamp wrote:
| I use a reusable flexible plastic bowl and popcorn from a jar I
| pour into it - inside the microwave. Wonder if that's just as
| harmful.
| hackernoteng wrote:
| everyone at this point should know that you dont put plastic
| into a microwave
| Gordonjcp wrote:
| What's PFAS? <reads article> Oh, something with a scary-sounding
| name that Californians can be frightened of, like hydrogen
| hydroxide.
| im3w1l wrote:
| Is pfas intrinsic to microwave popcorn? I'm inclined to think
| that there is one or a few brands that is responsible.
| qwertox wrote:
| > My kids eat microwaved popcorn almost every night. Should I be
| worried?
|
| Wouldn't they risk getting obese?
| sakex wrote:
| Popcorn are very low calories and they're quite filling
| kevincox wrote:
| While popcorn itself is low calorie and filling most
| microwave popcorn includes loads of oil which is fairly
| energy dense.
| stevesimmons wrote:
| I'm surprised no one has posted The Muppets' Swedish Chef's
| instructions for making popcorn:
|
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7UmUX68KtE
| hackernoteng wrote:
| we use an old fashioned stove top metal popper with a hand crank
| to stir it. use a bit of organic coconut oil and organic popcorn
| kernels and salt. its very easy to do.
| lost_tourist wrote:
| Mixing plastic and high temps is a bad idea in general.
| AlbertCory wrote:
| +1 to all the old school recipes in here. Mine is slightly
| different, but no arguments. The dog gets excited because he
| knows he's getting some.
|
| Microwave popcorn is an abomination, suitable only for annoying
| your fellow office workers. Especially if you burn it.
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