[HN Gopher] New nanoparticles can perform gene editing in the lungs
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       New nanoparticles can perform gene editing in the lungs
        
       Author : redm
       Score  : 45 points
       Date   : 2023-04-27 19:16 UTC (3 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (news.mit.edu)
 (TXT) w3m dump (news.mit.edu)
        
       | LinuxBender wrote:
       | Is there any risk that these particles or maliciously programmed
       | particles could go airborne or otherwise get into peoples lungs?
        
         | jutrewag wrote:
         | [dead]
        
         | asdfman123 wrote:
         | Well, assuming it can be delivered in masse in a large urban
         | environment, it's no worse than nerve gas or something along
         | those lines.
        
           | LinuxBender wrote:
           | Can nerve agents target specific genetic traits? I don't
           | recall that being a feature when I learned about them in the
           | military. IIRC nerve agents will destroy the nervous system
           | of just about all living things and remain a risk in the
           | environment until they have been broken down.
           | 
           | I use a simple nerve agent to get rid of flies. Permethrin is
           | a sodium channel blocker that causes an overload of the CNS.
           | Insects and very young mammals with under-developed livers
           | can not metabolize it. So I suppose that targets a class of
           | living things but I can not target specific breeds of flies
           | with it. If I could then Botflies would be target numero uno.
        
           | hinkley wrote:
           | Nerve agents disperse.
        
             | larkost wrote:
             | And these require a lipid shielding, so fats. That is not
             | going to last long in the air at all, making these probably
             | bad aerosol-sized weapons.
        
         | lr4444lr wrote:
         | Dude, get a copyright for the screenplay for that movie ASAP.
        
           | selcuka wrote:
           | I know you are joking, but you can't copyright ideas. If they
           | actually write the screenplay they can protect the full text,
           | but again, someone else may write a screenplay on the same
           | topic if the text is not stolen from the other one.
        
         | KRAKRISMOTT wrote:
         | Nitroglycerin can either alleviate heart cardiovascular disease
         | symptoms or it can go boom. What's your point? Almost every
         | technology is dual use if you put your mind to it.
        
           | LinuxBender wrote:
           | _What 's your point?_
           | 
           | What's the risk of lab leak? Is it impossible? Can these
           | particles go airborne? If someone used them maliciously would
           | anyone even figure it out? I think these are valid questions.
           | As just one example China have been working on biological
           | weapons [1] that can target people specific genetic
           | characteristics and they even brag about it _Col. Goo Ji Wei_
           | [2]. For all I know this could be another project to make
           | dual-purpose weapons that can target specific groups of
           | people. Another name for dual-purpose biological weapons is
           | _Precision Medicine_ [3]. Some of these weapons get funding
           | in the name of curing diseases as part of civil-military
           | fusion or dual-use biology.
           | 
           | I think most would agree that most countries would prefer not
           | to use nukes. On the other hand there have absoutely been
           | examples of nations committing ethnic cleansing. If China
           | have indeed put billions into this type of research then
           | everyone should probably also have a balance of power as well
           | but I guess I am hoping that balance of power is created in a
           | real legit lab with many real layers of protection and we
           | take it more seriously than nuclear weapons.
           | 
           | So I suppose my point could be summed up as, _Has everyone
           | involved on this project been working in a lab that has made
           | it near impossible for this to be abused and have all these
           | people gone through exhaustive background and psychological
           | testing and re-testing?_
           | 
           | [1] - https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-
           | report/health-c...
           | 
           | [2] - https://www.armyupress.army.mil/Journals/Military-
           | Review/Dir...
           | 
           | [3] - https://nonproliferation.org/wp-
           | content/uploads/2021/09/scie... [PDF][78 pages]
        
             | hammyhavoc wrote:
             | They are indeed valid questions, and the lack of actually
             | answering the question says that they didn't know the
             | answer but couldn't resist chiming in with a glib response.
        
           | gameman144 wrote:
           | It is very okay to question the risk-benefit analysis of
           | technologies while also understanding that they can be forces
           | for good and evil.
           | 
           | For instance, Hacker News often discusses issues of privacy,
           | asking whether new methods of finding bad actors could be
           | misused to persecute responsible actors. It is _totally fine_
           | to say  "Is this good thing worthwhile if it could also cause
           | this bad thing?"
        
       | [deleted]
        
       | tabtab wrote:
       | Fixing genetics bugs on a wider scale would be a medical game-
       | changer. A good many debilitating diseases could be cured.
        
         | brezelgoring wrote:
         | If live editing of cells is possible I would like to see
         | enhancements. Say, increase VO2 capacity in our blood or
         | something that processes lactic acid to make muscle recovery a
         | faster process. That'd be nice.
        
           | bastawhiz wrote:
           | Keep in mind that this isn't as simple as changing a YAML
           | file to say "vo2Capacity: 2" instead of "vo2Capactiy: 1".
           | Genes encode proteins, and those proteins perform functions
           | based on their shapes. "Increased VO2 capacity" means making
           | a gene that encodes a protein that has follow-on effects that
           | accomplish that goal, which we really have no consistently
           | good idea of how to do.
           | 
           | We can, for instance, add genes to plants to produce
           | substances that bugs don't like and we can eliminate genes
           | from animals that inhibit growth. It's not insurmountable to
           | edit genes to "do more" or "do less"--if the answer is making
           | more or making less of a protein we already know about. But
           | changing the design of something is a hard challenge that we
           | aren't good at. If increasing VO2 capacity was something that
           | could have evolved as a beneficial mutation by way of
           | increasing or decreasing the presence of a protein, it
           | probably would have happened. But the fact that it hasn't
           | either means increased VO2 capacity isn't great (eliminating
           | muscle growth inhibition, as it turns out, isn't great) or
           | requires more than just tweaking a protein amount.
           | 
           | Which is to say, gene editing is the ability to change the
           | code. It requires separate capabilities to know what to
           | change it to. This news is great for areas of research like
           | cancer treatment (imagine taking a puff from an inhaler to
           | cure your cancer, which is just ~2 gene mutations!) but much
           | less exciting for "enhancements".
        
             | leinadho wrote:
             | This was a helpful paragraph, cheers
        
             | kiba wrote:
             | High VO2 max is heavily correlated with abilities to do
             | things in old age, and thus survival. Considering that
             | fragility of the elderly is a threat to their survival and
             | quality of life, it is something worth researching.
        
       | Taniwha wrote:
       | Oh this is just going to push all the anti-vaxxer conspiracy
       | theorists' buttons
        
         | briantakita wrote:
         | Transparency & perception that the government, NGOs, &
         | corporations help rather than hurt people would help to create
         | public trust. The problem is that there is not much reason to
         | trust these authorities so measures to Manufacture Consent
         | decrease in effectiveness.
         | 
         | Hence conspiracy theories naturally arise due to the lack of
         | trust. Attempts to crack down on "misinformation" & "conspiracy
         | theories" only create more distrust, & the cycle
         | continues...until a critical mass of the population has
         | distrust authorities. History has many examples of what happens
         | afterwards
         | 
         | Another consequence of growing mistrust is that the authorities
         | lose potency on the Geopolitical stage.
        
         | brippalcharrid wrote:
         | If we had reason to expect that certain people would have
         | concerns about developments like this, then it might be best
         | for us to address any reasonable concerns that they might have
         | about these technologies (as much as that is possible at this
         | stage) rather than proactively attempting to discredit them
         | personally and marginalizing them, or else we risk providing
         | further justification for their concerns and convincing other
         | people that they have merit.
        
         | chrisco255 wrote:
         | > mRNA nanoparticles literally mutate genes
         | 
         | If you don't believe in conspiracy theories, how about chaos
         | theories?
        
       | anigbrowl wrote:
       | I wonder if this could assist with rebuilding damaged lung tissue
       | from people who have dealt with smoke inhalation from fires,
       | industrial work, drug abuse etc.
        
         | larkost wrote:
         | Maybe, if there is some specific protein that you want the
         | lungs to build that they are not already doing (or not in the
         | quantity needed). But mostly this is going to help out for
         | genetic diseases where it is either a protein that needs to be
         | encourages or suppressed in the cells.
        
       | gfodor wrote:
       | As someone with CF, I remember hearing about gene therapy as a
       | kid as far back as the late 80s. Thankfully, we didn't have to
       | wait for it for many CF patients to have their respiratory issues
       | much improved or even resolved with CFTR modulators.
        
         | tomcam wrote:
         | I had no clue. Are you one of the lucky ones?
        
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       (page generated 2023-04-27 23:00 UTC)