[HN Gopher] MRSK vs. Fly.io
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MRSK vs. Fly.io
Author : tortilla
Score : 128 points
Date : 2023-03-22 16:56 UTC (6 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (fly.io)
(TXT) w3m dump (fly.io)
| ofrzeta wrote:
| I'd really like something like platform.sh as open source. I'd be
| willing to contribute as well :)
| hankmh wrote:
| Have you checked out Dokku [0] or others like it?
|
| If so, what do you perceive as the gaps between Dokku and
| Platform.sh? I ask as an employee of a PaaS (not Platform.sh).
| So I'm curious for discovery and learning.
|
| [0] https://dokku.com/
| ofrzeta wrote:
| I tried it once and concluded it wasn't good enough but I
| don't remember the specific gaps. Now that I browse the docs
| it actually looks quite powerful, so I guess I will have to
| take another look.
|
| Other contenders are CapRover and Coolify that I just
| recently got to know here.
|
| I guess it would make more sense to contribute to one of
| these projects than start a new project.
|
| What PaaS are you working at?
| hankmh wrote:
| I work at Aptible. We've been around for about 10 years,
| have about 300 customers, all companies that prioritize
| reliability, scalability, and security. Many are late stage
| startups/recently minted unicorns....but nobody has really
| heard of us.
|
| If you want I can hook you up with an extended trial,
| beyond what's offered on the website. I'd love your
| feedback. We aren't open source, though we have considered
| it. Maybe your feedback can help push us over the edge. My
| email is henry AT aptible.com.
|
| Same offer goes to anyone here. Feedback would be really
| valuable to me personally.
| chrisweekly wrote:
| "vs." (versus) is misleading; TLDR Fly.io likes and claims
| alignment with MRSK, which is 37signals/DHH's new mechanism for
| managing dockerized apps with a strong "get off the cloud, run it
| locally" story.
| dcre wrote:
| Second half is a comparison!
| stingraycharles wrote:
| Yeah they're completely and totally different things. Fly.io is
| actually hosting servers / services, while MRSK is basically a
| bunch of scripts to deploy things using Docker containers.
|
| It's like comparing AWS with Chef. Maybe there's some overlap
| in philosophy, but that's about it. Maybe fly.io is just using
| it as a way to do a bit of marketing.
| [deleted]
| sergiotapia wrote:
| Seems like Fly is trying to borrow some thunder here haha
| 1ba9115454 wrote:
| I'm surprised 37signals built MSRK as an alternative to
| Kubernetes.
|
| They stated 2 reasons.
|
| Deployments to K8s are slow.
|
| K8s is hard to setup on bare metal.
| Thaxll wrote:
| Such a terrible idea, let's build something that everyone else
| has a solution for, we're on our own with our custom solutions
| that no one else know or use.
|
| We'll see how many years it will take them to come back to
| Kubernetes or equivalent.
|
| And the argument k8s is too complicated so build our own looks
| really bad from an engineering perspective.
|
| When you look at the issues:
| https://github.com/mrsked/mrsk/issues/44 you can some see
| trivial shortcoming that has been solved for years by other
| solutions.
| throwaway110535 wrote:
| Same could've been said for Rails...
| mbreese wrote:
| Honestly, the same could have been said about K8s when it
| was started too.
|
| There's nothing wrong with multiple projects in a space.
| It's a big market with different niches.
| firemelt wrote:
| As an engineer reading this makes me feel ashamed
| davedx wrote:
| Kubernetes is terrible, I hate it with a passion, and welcome
| any alternatives that reduce the complexity (as it the stated
| vision of MRSK)
| growse wrote:
| Which bit, the APIs or the implementation?
| datadeft wrote:
| And use IP addresses like it was 1999 again. Your IP
| addresses belong to exactly one location, the DNS server's
| config. Using a non-type safe configuration language is also
| meh. I am not sure why most people are unaware of Dhall...
| nine_k wrote:
| Dhall lacks a killer app that would use it. (Write one!)
| datadeft wrote:
| After they argued that k8s is better than AWS.
|
| -\\_(tsu)_/-
| pc86 wrote:
| Just because something is hard to use and slow doesn't mean
| it's worse than AWS.
| lobstrosity420 wrote:
| How would you say that both statements can't be true at the
| same time?
| datadeft wrote:
| Sure they can.
|
| I was just watching the video DHH put online about this new
| project and it was quite good seeing copy pasting IP
| addresses to YAML files still excites some people or think
| that this is somehow on par with a serverless offering to
| any cloud company.
| akvadrako wrote:
| Deploys with k8s are faster than most of the competition. When
| your process is optimized you can expect to go from code change
| to updated UI in about 5 seconds.
| maxmcd wrote:
| I believe 37Signals is replacing their Capistrano-based deploy
| for Basecamp with MSRK. It seems they're keeping their k8s
| deploy setup for Hey. (Just what I'm inferring from the first
| two paragraphs here: https://world.hey.com/dhh/introducing-
| mrsk-9330a267)
| mdasen wrote:
| The third paragraph ends: "With MRSK, we can deploy a new
| version of HEY in as little as 20 seconds."
|
| They didn't say that they're replacing their k8s setup for
| Hey explicitly, but they go on to say the reason they wrote
| MRSK is that they like the advantages of containers while
| getting lower complexity and being able to use their bare
| metal hardware. It seems like they want to go in that
| direction.
| davedx wrote:
| He said it in the YouTube video he made. They explicitly
| estimate they're going to save 7M/year moving Hey to MRSK
| FridgeSeal wrote:
| Azure, AWS (and I therefore assume GCP) now have K8s
| products where can BYO own compute, and they'll manage
| everything else. Best of both worlds, no?
| bkazez wrote:
| I recently migrated a small Rails project (16,000 monthly users)
| from Heroku to Helm/Kubernetes, after having tried Fly.io and
| everything else. It was easy, and I like the peace of mind of
| zero-downtime deploys and non-beta infrastructure. Cost is
| comparable to Heroku.
|
| My writeup, in case it helps others:
| https://www.vmii.org/blog/2023/03/12/kubernetes/
| number6 wrote:
| Thanks for your writeup I am thinking of moving our Django Apps
| to kubernetes
| rozenmd wrote:
| I wish there was something like MRSK for deploying generic
| Dockerfiles onto VMs from scratch, without the mess of Kubernetes
| or needing to use Rails.
|
| Like, provision Hetzner -> pass the IP address to the tool + a
| Dockerfile -> your image Just Works on the server and restarts if
| it crashes.
| jordemort wrote:
| I think this is what MRSK is? There's no Kubernetes. It even
| installs Docker for you.
| andrewmutz wrote:
| I don't think you need to use rails to use MRSK
| nwienert wrote:
| Docker Swarm is very underrated, more for multiple apps but you
| can of course just have one.
| jahsome wrote:
| I may be ignorant but doesn't that scenario you described
| encapsulate how MRSK functions?
|
| From the MRSK readme[1]: Connect to the
| servers over SSH (using root by default, authenticated by your
| ssh key) Install Docker on any server that might be
| missing it (using apt-get) Log into the registry both
| locally and remotely Build the image using the standard
| Dockerfile in the root of the application. Push the
| image to the registry. Pull the image from the registry
| onto the servers. Ensure Traefik is running and
| accepting traffic on port 80. Ensure your app responds
| with 200 OK to GET /up. Start a new container with the
| version of the app that matches the current git version hash.
| Stop the old container running the previous version of the app.
| Prune unused images and stopped containers to ensure servers
| don't fill up.
|
| ---
|
| 1. https://github.com/mrsked/mrsk#readme
| ofrzeta wrote:
| Wow, the MRSK homepage is truly Web 1.0: https://mrsk.dev/
| paxys wrote:
| I don't care about the lack of design frills on a webpage (in
| most cases it is preferable), but having to make sense of a
| wall of text stretching from edge to edge of a 4K screen is
| where I draw the line. Adding one line of CSS to set more
| readable column widths should be the bare minimum.
| jrockway wrote:
| Why should the designer pick how wide you want the text? You
| are the one who knows what you like, and you can resize the
| browser window.
| quest88 wrote:
| Why should the designer design. Brilliant.
| steve1977 wrote:
| I haven't seen a website load so fast in a while.
| kungfufrog wrote:
| Couldn't something like this be a few hundred lines of Ansible?
| Not trying to be intentionally negative but I don't really get
| the use case as I feel this is a pretty well established process
| by existing tools for server automation and provisioning.
| intelVISA wrote:
| Yeah not sure I see the value prop here it's just run of the
| mill Docker glue?
| nine_k wrote:
| Ansible is Python, and MRSK is Ruby. Each appeals to their own
| ecosystem; switching between the two is a noticeable cognitive
| load.
|
| Also, it _could_ be implemented using Ansible, but it _has
| been_ implemented in MRSK. A serious difference if you plan to
| count on someone to keep it updated and supported.
| dzonga wrote:
| something to note DHH is a beast. MSRK seems most of MSRK was
| written by him alone -
| https://github.com/mrsked/mrsk/commits/main?after=83dc82661b...
|
| his output is crazy. that's why he gets the big bucks
| [deleted]
| tiffanyh wrote:
| I think what's more shocking is they were still using
| Capistrano for the past ~17 years.
|
| https://world.hey.com/dhh/introducing-mrsk-9330a267
| nathants wrote:
| (movie trailer voice)
|
| in a world where backend is a single binary and frontend is a
| single html file...
|
| who needs containers or complicated devops?
| pictur wrote:
| Marketing is truly an art. Although there are thousands of
| projects on this subject, the man can share wonderfully as if he
| has discovered something new. I appreciate.
| chuankl wrote:
| I am new to these kinds of lightweight low-complexity
| deployment systems. Can you point me to a few other good
| projects? Thanks!
| endisneigh wrote:
| Docker swarm, nomad
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(page generated 2023-03-22 23:00 UTC)