[HN Gopher] Twitch CEO Emmett Shear is resigning
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Twitch CEO Emmett Shear is resigning
Author : ExMachina73
Score : 190 points
Date : 2023-03-16 16:15 UTC (6 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.theverge.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.theverge.com)
| widowlark wrote:
| I wonder if Clancy has what it takes to keep the platform alive -
| It seems to be floundering at the moment
| leesec wrote:
| Twitch's revenue is up 5x from 2015 and 2x from 2019, and
| generally has been on an uptick since COVID, so I doubt this is
| anything to do with the companies stability. I think he genuinely
| was just ready to step down and be with his family/do something
| else
| AccountAccount1 wrote:
| Honestly, it's not that surprising... from an outsider, Twitch
| has been incredibly mismanaged in the way that they treat their
| content creators. And now that Youtube is robust enough to allow
| streaming (also with the features that streaming has) it's
| catching up to them.
|
| The most curious is the alienation of creators which were raking
| up like 60k viewers per stream by the threat of banning. If you
| have ever seen one of these streams, the creators are so limited
| in what they can do.
|
| Another shock was this new Kick platform which is managed by a
| creator itself, and apparently is doing quite well on the surface
| (wondering how their balance sheet looks) but I think this is
| what Twitch needs: a creator at the wheel.
| PurpleRamen wrote:
| > And now that Youtube is robust enough to allow streaming
| (also with the features that streaming has) it's catching up to
| them.
|
| Do you have some up-to-date numbers for this? Because YouTube
| has streaming since 2016, and they never caught up to twitch.
| Not in the pandemia, when Twitch was growing like crazy. And
| also not when they bought some big Streamers from Twitch. IIRC,
| at some point they were even worse than Facebook Gaming for
| some while. Though, I haven't seen the numbers for 2023 yet.
|
| > Another shock was this new Kick platform which is managed by
| a creator itself, and apparently is doing quite well on the
| surface
|
| Kick seems to be 99% bots. I wouldn't call that doing well.
| wsatb wrote:
| It seems all YouTube has really done is offer massive contracts
| to Twitch streamers to poach them. It's still a terrible
| streaming platform. Unless you already have a well established
| audience, you're not going anywhere there.
|
| As for Kick, that is not a legitimate business. One, they've
| ripped off the entire UI from Twitch. Two, the anything goes
| attitude is not going to fly if they ever get real advertisers.
| Asikaim wrote:
| They didn't just "rip off the entire UI". Couple of years ago
| the entire sourcecode of Twitch leaked along with user data,
| SDKs, security tools etc. They used all that to create Kick
| after Twitch banned slots.
|
| Last time I checked, Kick still mostly used Twitch logos and
| their policy documents were still talking about Twitch, since
| they didn't even bother looking at them.
| Avicebron wrote:
| I think that part of what limits what creators can do on twitch
| comes down to what the advertisers are willing to put up with,
| it's likely more that advertisers are leaning on twitch who are
| then leaning on creators, vs just twitch leaning on creators.
|
| As for kick, they seem to be actively ignoring/rejecting these
| limitations (potentially because they at least partly
| externally funded by stake (online gambling platform) and kick
| was a response to most gambling being banned on twitch). I'm
| not sure how long they can maintain this if they want to stay
| profitable/attract people to their platform.
| sebzim4500 wrote:
| These online gambling platforms have no shortage of money,
| they were paying out 7 figure amounts to content creators for
| one stream in some cases. It's possible they can run the
| whole site through their marketing budget.
| unity1001 wrote:
| > what creators can do on twitch comes down to what the
| advertisers are willing to put up with
|
| Eh. Then those advertisers will have to create the content
| from now on...
| corobo wrote:
| They are. Brands are starting to stream directly. Game
| companies especially.
|
| If not streaming directly, they're in channels where the
| streamer is playing their game. They'll give out DLC codes
| so that the streamer plays the game longer and the game
| studio makes a mint off the back of the viewers. Content
| created.
|
| A 20 quid DLC key gifted to the streamer will buy you an
| hour long gameplay ad easily, usually way longer.
|
| There's so many streamers out there they just sort by view
| count and cherry pick the brand safe ones. They don't need
| to change their criteria.
| echelon wrote:
| I'm tired of advertisers being averse to content most
| people find unobjectionable.
|
| Advertisers need to get comfortable with nudity, swearing,
| and the whole range of non-abusive human behavior. They're
| almost as bad as the credit card companies with linking
| morality to commerce.
|
| YouTube is slowly starting to relax, so I'm hoping the
| shift is happening.
|
| It's okay if the person appearing next to the Big Mac says
| "fuck".
| wlesieutre wrote:
| Isn't youtube also incredibly mismanaged in the way that they
| treat their content creators?
|
| For example, making up new rules about swearing too close to
| the intro of videos being grounds for demonetization, and
| retroactively applying it to everyone's back catalog from
| before the rule existed?
| stametseater wrote:
| Youtube was much better before it was monetized. With
| monetization came the same pressure on content that had
| already been present on commercial television; advertisers.
| Advertisers are the reason television content sucks, they are
| the ones who demand that the content be formulaic milquetoast
| crap, and television sucking was the reason Youtube got huge
| in the first place. Now youtube is becoming the new
| television.
|
| Retroactive application of new standards? That's new _ish_ to
| youtube but standard for television. Old TV episodes that don
| 't meet present advertiser standards don't get reruns.
|
| Thankfully there are still some video creators on youtube who
| don't care about money and are doing it for other reasons
| (passion, hobby, etc.) But youtube has lost most of their
| incentive to promote that sort of unmonetized content, so
| it's becoming harder to find.
| sanktanglia wrote:
| I worked at twitch for almost 5 years and they had no idea what
| they were doing at all. Emmett was eternally condescending to
| staff and continuously listened to whoever was playing politics
| best. His replacement dan was equally checked out and they had
| no good tech or content ideas. Tech was a joke, spending 50-80%
| of some teams time on checking off items in huge spreadsheets
| to be compliant with new systems and processes that were
| regularly replaced by new requirements and often required
| rewriting services that were not in use/working just fine in
| new languages and frameworks to check new boxes and then the
| cycle repeated itself.
| duxup wrote:
| Is ANY platform in a position to treat creators well?
|
| I hear nothing but complaints from everywhere. I wonder if it
| is possible to treat creators well...?
|
| Are creators even worth much on average considering the volume
| of people willing to just grind out content continuously
| without much regard to ... themselves?
|
| It seems to be an endless search for more subscribers, more
| views, more patrons of some type, more questionable sponsors.
|
| The the youtube, twitch, etc video creators ecosystem seems
| perpetually messed up, and creators seem to keep at it,
| sometimes seem to be flogging themselves.
| sebzim4500 wrote:
| Youtube treats creators pretty well, from what I can tell.
|
| It's just that 'influencers' like nothing more than to
| complain.
|
| Admittedly, Twitch is a clusterfuck though.
| whatisthiseven wrote:
| That's weird, as my understanding of the YT creator
| community is constant strife, ever changing rules,
| arbitrary bans, strikes on their account for vaguely
| matching copyrighted work, and most recently _swearing too
| much, or too early, in a video_.
|
| YT is not friendly to creators, for the same reason Twitch
| is not friendly to creators: advertisers hate what people
| want to watch.
|
| Even Patreon, where people pay rather than watch ads,
| repeatedly runs into issues with creators because of pay
| schedules, amounts, percent cuts, platform features, and
| more.
|
| If its someone else's platform, creators don't win.
| izzydata wrote:
| How? Youtube will take automatic action against peoples
| channels and then there will be no way to interact with a
| real human to resolve the situation. The whole system seems
| like a random black box that does not care for its users.
| yamtaddle wrote:
| A channel I like is having to test various patterns of
| swearing and swear-bleeping to try to narrow down what
| exactly suddenly changed that wrecked their monetization,
| which had been fine for years and years. They can't just
| ask YouTube what they need to do to be OK again. It's
| really dumb.
|
| Also, creators on a platform that grew its original
| userbase through piracy and media re-mixes with little or
| no content-policing now have to be extremely careful
| about even very clear-cut fair-use of commercial media,
| or risk losing one of their copyright strikes (as in,
| three strikes and you're out--that is, we kill your
| business). It makes their videos worse--so, it's also bad
| for viewers--and causes them stress.
| stametseater wrote:
| > _Also, creators on a platform that grew its original
| userbase through piracy and media re-mixes with little or
| no content-policing now have to be extremely careful
| about even very clear-cut fair-use of commercial media_
|
| Monetization is a big part of this problem. It is
| possible for something to be fair use and commercialized,
| but once you've commercialized it you're fighting an
| uphill battle to claim fair use.
| [deleted]
| [deleted]
| ryandrake wrote:
| > A channel I like is having to test various patterns of
| swearing and swear-bleeping to try to narrow down what
| exactly suddenly changed that wrecked their monetization
|
| This seems like such a stupid, pointless effort. Instead
| of pentesting to find exactly where the line is so you
| can toe it perfectly, why not... just stay far away from
| the line and stop swearing. Wouldn't that be much less
| effort and less risk?
| yamtaddle wrote:
| Might lose them audience & differentiation, depending on
| what's getting people to show up. Any change in tone or
| content would carry that risk (or, might improve it--hard
| to say until you try)
| sebzim4500 wrote:
| If it makes the videos worse then probably not worth it
| [deleted]
| bluefirebrand wrote:
| Maybe I missed it, but Wordpress seemed to handle creators
| really well.
|
| I've been saying for a while that the next big thing in
| streaming is Wordpress but for Streamers.
|
| Something relatively easy for small streamers to set up and
| manage on their own, cheap enough to start small and scale up
| as it starts to make money, with the ability to handle large-
| scale streams if necessary.
|
| I don't know how you would handle provisioning the servers
| and such. Maybe it's not easy enough to automate. But I think
| this sort of thing would take a huge bite out of centralized
| streaming sites.
| starkparker wrote:
| > Something relatively easy for small streamers to set up
| and manage on their own, cheap enough to start small and
| scale up as it starts to make money, with the ability to
| handle large-scale streams if necessary.
|
| Self-hosted social networks and microblogs are all over the
| place and have been for decades, and Twitter is falling
| apart, but the audience is still on Twitter. Self-hosting
| streams has never been easier, but even if it were one-
| click it invariably costs money out of pocket for the
| bandwidth to self-host a stream, and Twitch does not.
| WordPress is trivial to host for nearly nothing; streaming,
| not so much.
|
| The appeal of Twitch isn't livestreaming, it's the culture
| and existing social network of users and streamers who are
| already there, and the ease of starting up. The
| architecture or centralization of the next big thing in the
| space won't matter, it's whether both the creators,
| audience, and money will all show up at roughly the same
| time.
| Arainach wrote:
| Could you give an example of someone who was making
| significant money (preferably by YT/Twitch standards but
| any example is good) on WordPress?
| bena wrote:
| This is a red herring.
|
| I don't think WordPress pays anyone anything.
|
| They built a platform and the will also provide hosting.
| You can download WordPress from wordpress.org and just
| run it. Or you can go to wordpress.com and buy a whole
| hosting plan where wordpress.com manages the software for
| you.
|
| But WordPress doesn't give fuck number one about what you
| do with it. So you are free to monetize it in any fashion
| you want. They'll even help you with that. WordPress
| doesn't have to worry about if any of the people on their
| site are making money because they still get paid.
|
| Twitch and YouTube are free for creators. You don't have
| to pay to stream on Twitch or to post videos to YouTube.
| All the cost of hosting and serving is borne by the
| service. Which is why they were doing ads in the first
| place. But with creators now needing actual production,
| they realized they were pouring in serious money into
| their channels, but getting none of that sweet ad money.
|
| So shit got complicated. It's free to post and free to
| watch. But that doesn't make it free to host or produce.
| Which is why you have YouTube showing you ads and the
| video itself being sponsored by AG1, Dollar Shave Club,
| and Mystery Box of the Month Club.
|
| I think ultimately, these places are going to need to
| charge for hosting. And yes, that's going to kill a lot
| of channels. But ok. You can afford overpriced, under-
| engineered rainbow glowy keyboards, you can instead put
| that towards a $30/month hosting fee.
| keiferski wrote:
| A sizable portion of _the entire internet_ is running
| WordPress. That's billions of dollars a year.
| luckylion wrote:
| They're running the Software, but they're not on
| wordpress.com.
|
| If we're talking about Software, then wow, Microsoft is
| really treating those game streamers well, because they
| can use it to play games which they stream.
| dylan604 wrote:
| It's funny to me the "restrictions" being placed on content
| creators like it's a new thing. It's only new in that more
| people are being made aware of how there have always been
| rules applied to what could or could not be "aired". Yes,
| there were government rules enforced by the FCC and the
| infamous stories of getting things past the censors, but
| there were always deference paid to the corporate sponsors
| and advertisers. This isn't unique to internet streamers.
|
| If you started out without any consideration of this, then
| you're just a babe in the woods type of situation, but if you
| thought you could do this and "disrupt", then you're just
| living in a delusion. You want to make money from
| advertisers, then you're going to play by their rules.
| dmonitor wrote:
| From what I've heard from big streamers (Ludwig Ahgren and his
| gang specifically), he was incredibly out of touch with Twitch
| culture. Basically zero awareness of what was happening on his
| platform.
| jklinger410 wrote:
| > And now that Youtube is robust enough to allow streaming
| (also with the features that streaming has) it's catching up to
| them.
|
| YouTube does not want you to be able to search Live content
| because they want to sell you YouTube Red or YouTube TV. I
| can't possibly agree that they are anywhere close to Twitch.
|
| Unless you are already following a creator, or see their
| published content on the platform, you wouldn't even know live
| streaming existed on the platform.
| jasonwatkinspdx wrote:
| Way to gloss over those streamers you're mentioning were
| streaming gambling.
|
| Kick is a front for Stake the bitcoin casino, not a legitimate
| streaming site. It exists purely because Trainwrecks wanted to
| keep making money streaming bitcoin slots. It's been an utter
| shit show with people streaming porn, sex, the super bowl,
| incredible amounts of racism... Twitch absolutely is not going
| that direction with good reason.
| jsheard wrote:
| Indeed, browsing Kick right now shows gambling is the biggest
| category _by far_ with 42k viewers.
|
| Chat streams are second with 6k viewers, and the most viewed
| (non-gambling) game has a mere 1.6k viewers.
|
| I can't imagine why anyone would stream games on there unless
| they're banned from Twitch.
| capableweb wrote:
| Not knowing, understanding or having any experience of the
| "streaming" community of the internet. What is the
| purpose/fun with watching someone not just gamble as in
| playing poker or whatever for money, but slots
| specifically? Feels like watching someone rolling a dice by
| themselves, but with fancier graphics.
| episteme wrote:
| People get a second hand buzz when they see people win
| and the streamer will react in a way that gets people
| excited. This naturally leads to playing slots yourself
| and feeling like you are part of a community. It's
| incredibly lucrative for gambling sites.
| jsheard wrote:
| My favourite example of this was seeing a popular
| gambling streamer who had a permanent overlay reading "DO
| NOT GAMBLE, YOU WILL LOSE", but still raked in
| sponsorships from gambling sites regardless. Maybe the
| overlay helped him sleep at night but the sites know that
| wasn't actually going to deter anyone.
|
| Then there's the shadier casinos that provide fake
| balances to streamers so they're never at risk of going
| bust, and can keep perpetually hitting the big jackpots
| that entice the audience...
| Lev1a wrote:
| I imagine the answer to that would be one word:
|
| Schadenfreude
| [deleted]
| HDThoreaun wrote:
| No money no mission. If advertisers leave the ecosystem it all
| falls apart which is why the content controls are so strict.
| spyke112 wrote:
| Make it a monthly payment like Netflix? Streaming is
| streaming if you ask me.
| sleepybrett wrote:
| You can subscribe to individual creators on twitch. This
| removes advertising from that streamers stream only.
| spyke112 wrote:
| Really should be a monthly subscription, that will get
| shared by all creators based on minutes of view time, or
| some other metric. Then maybe gate it behind some
| artificial limit, so that only serious creators will get
| a cut. I mean Spotify can share profits between every
| single artist, why cant twitch do the same? It would
| benefit both the consumer, higher likelihood of
| subscribing, and also the creators. They could also keep
| running ads on a free tier. It's not exactly rocket
| science.
| corobo wrote:
| They already have this, although it only pays the
| streamer for ads the viewer would have seen rather than
| split across view time.
|
| https://www.twitch.tv/turbo
| [deleted]
| karmasimida wrote:
| Is twitch still a thing? I don't think they have any significant
| upgrades for several years now...
| slater wrote:
| Maybe now they can pump the brakes on their unwinnable game of
| whack-a-mole against adblockers, too?
| jeffwask wrote:
| Amazon has really done a number on what was a fun and useful
| platform for viewers and creators. It was totally "enshittened".
| prox wrote:
| It still is fun, but the constant "our creators and viewers are
| the enemy of capitalization" is not a great tactic short or
| long term.
| jeffwask wrote:
| I agree I still enjoy catching streams I just wish Mixer or
| one of the other platforms had fought longer to create real
| competition.
|
| You hit the nail on the head tho "our creators and viewers
| are the enemy of capitalization".
|
| I think one of the problems with our current fiscal model of
| "year over year growth or die" is that some products have a
| ceiling before the only way to squeeze more is to hurt the
| overall experience for users.
| jeffwask wrote:
| If YouTube would only give half a fuck about improving the
| UI/UX and searchability of their streaming offerings.
| quectophoton wrote:
| As one example, I can't even login to Twitch since a few months
| ago because "my browser is not supported". (EDIT to add: Tried
| with Firefox and Chromium, from both v3.17 and edge Alpine
| Linux repositories.)
|
| I don't know what kind of fingerprinting are they doing, but
| it's definitely not just user agent nor IP address nor browser
| version. I suspect they somehow detect that I'm using Alpine
| Linux (it's my main OS) and don't like it, because this doesn't
| happen on different distros.
|
| I think this started happening shortly after they got a massive
| amount of new accounts being created.
|
| Like, my account has existed for years, has MFA enabled, and
| has given them money frequently. But I can't login from my main
| device. Alright.
| mcmcmc wrote:
| You didn't mention what browser you're using, seems like a
| key detail for "browser is not supported"
| quectophoton wrote:
| Neither Firefox nor Chromium work for me, from neither
| stable (v3.17) or edge Alpine Linux repositories. And back
| then when this started happening, I also could not login
| with Firefox from FreeBSD.
|
| But I can login with Firefox from my Steam Deck without any
| problems.
|
| I know musl libc has weird compatibility issues (e.g.
| Nvidia, Widevine, etc), but as far as I can see I have no
| other issues with the website; I can play streams, and I
| can see chat messages and stuff. It's only the login form
| that for some reason responds with an error when I try to
| login.
| jeffwask wrote:
| > I think this started happening shortly after they got a
| massive amount of new accounts being created.
|
| Smells suspiciously like a hack to combat botnets.
| fullshark wrote:
| Feels like twitch, although a massive success by any reasonable
| standard, has not really lived up to its potential. Weird niche
| platform really, and it's the internet's goto service for live
| feeds.
| skilled wrote:
| I've been a Twitch user since its first year. I have a select few
| streamers I watch, and I spend more time on the platform when
| there are new releases for games I personally like. But, I have
| been very in-tune with Twitch culture and I know how disorganized
| it is when it comes to "big" streamers.
|
| However, my issue (and also disappointment) with Twitch right now
| is:
|
| - Softcore porn allowed on the platform. Literally, girls doing
| ass up squats in front of the camera for a $3 donation. You
| cannot avoid this because its part of the platforms "culture" and
| even your favorite streamers will one day end up watching a clip
| or something on their stream. This also breeds incels and very
| toxic chatters.
|
| - Ads. Twitch is fighting against ad-blockers. Fine by me, I can
| bare ads, but what I cannot do is bear 5 ads in a row every 30
| minutes. This has gotten a lot worse lately. It is annoying and
| disruptive to the user experience, and thankfully there are
| streamers who disable them altogether as they can sustain
| themselves through subscriptions and donations from chatters.
|
| Is there hope Twitch will fix this? I doubt it. I see them as
| weak and irresponsible bunch that are only interested in money
| and don't care about mixing things up in the community.
| beebmam wrote:
| Given that you have an issue with ads, how do you respond to
| the fact you can pay $5/month to subscribe to a specific
| streamer to avoid all ads? Would you prefer if there was a
| platform-level subscription level which allows you to avoid all
| platform-driven ads across all channels, similar to YouTube
| Premium, for example?
| gered wrote:
| Isn't that what "Twitch Turbo" is?
| idconvict wrote:
| They already have a platform-level subscription. It's Twitch
| Turbo and costs ~$10/month. Removes all ads on the site. I
| don't think creators get any portion of it like with YouTube
| Premium though.
| Lev1a wrote:
| IIRC I heard years ago that Turbo "pays" the streamer for
| the non-watched ads which have been removed for the Turbo
| user, i.e. fractions of a cent, i.e. nothing. All it does
| is paying Twitch for doing fuck-all.
| WJW wrote:
| Rebroadcasting live video to potentially hundreds of
| thousands of people at once is hardly "fuck-all", that
| shit costs a lot of money to do well.
| HWR_14 wrote:
| So Turbo pays the streamer the same amount per stream as
| the non-Turbo ad supported account? That sounds good and
| fair. I don't know why you would expect otherwise.
|
| Heck, Turbo users probably watch more videos and so are
| better customers even at the same rate.
| [deleted]
| runevault wrote:
| I thought they removed turbo for everyone outside Canada,
| or did they bring it back at some point?
| nozzlegear wrote:
| I'm in the US and have been subscribed to Turbo for over
| a year now, even though I rarely watch Twitch. I just
| keep my subscription so I don't have to be bothered with
| ads when I want to turn on a Twitch stream on my Apple
| TV.
| skilled wrote:
| There is Twitch Turbo, which as far as I know does not
| benefit creators, or does so on a very nominal level. I
| subscribe to individual streamers that I wish to see continue
| streaming. I do not care about supporting Twitch, so yes -
| your argument is valid that money can solve my issue, but
| then I have to choose between supporting a creator or
| supporting Twitch.
|
| I play ARPG games specifically, so I follow a lot of creators
| for those specific games, and when new releases hit - I will
| most definitely be trying to keep up with the latest
| strategies and insights. And I will get that information
| either way, but does that mean I also have to miss
| interesting moments because I am not willing to support
| Twitch directly?
|
| All I'm saying is that ads have gotten a lot worse lately and
| it is extremely noticeable.
| NaN1352 wrote:
| I never understood this model. Can you imagine how much it
| would cost to support all my favorite streamers? I don't even
| follow many. But let's say even just 5 and now we're looking
| at 25$ / month.
|
| Obviously I must be out of the loop if this currently
| works... but I don't get it.
|
| Turbo is nice, but should be just a little cheaper. YT
| Premium Lite is 7 euros.
|
| The ads are insufferable. Hate how they really want to shove
| it down your throat even when you back out of a stream and
| pick another.
|
| Worse it's badly implemented. Countless times I'm watching
| the same ads multiple times within 10-15 mins.
|
| Only saving grace on AppleTV if you back out you can wait it
| out while the stream is still highlighted, with the sound
| off, then enter the stream again.
| thinkingemote wrote:
| I can recommend the unwanted twitch extension which allows a
| user to hide selected channels, entire games and tags.
| https://github.com/kwaschny/unwanted-twitch
| AlexandrB wrote:
| They did eventually ban gambling streams, so who knows. The
| trouble, I think, is defining what qualifies as "software
| porn". Do you start policing what streamers are wearing? Are
| some activities, like squatting, disallowed? And any definition
| will probably court controversy, especially because it will
| overwhelmingly affect female streamers.
| cubefox wrote:
| They could add a general ban of "intentional sexual
| behavior", which is vague enough to apply common sense and
| affect just the people who were meant to be affected. Similar
| to how a judge can use common sense to interpret vague terms
| in the law.
| ilyt wrote:
| My main problem is that frankly youtube streaming is
| technically better, I hoped twitch catches up but I still can't
| just pause a stream and "catch up" like on YT, watching archive
| of currently playing channel (say esport event) is also royal
| PITA.
|
| On YT I can tune hour late, then just jump back to match that
| happened, watch it, skip the intermissions and catch up, on
| twitch that's much more complicated.
|
| > - Softcore porn allowed on the platform. Literally, girls
| doing ass up squats in front of the camera for a $3 donation.
| You cannot avoid this because its part of the platforms
| "culture" and even your favorite streamers will one day end up
| watching a clip or something on their stream. This also breeds
| incels and very toxic chatters.
|
| I dunno, I never got suggested one of those during at least
| last few years. If I scroll for like 3 screens I get some
| vtubers but that's about it. I think ability to filter out by
| stream tags would entirely solve the problem
|
| > - Ads. Twitch is fighting against ad-blockers. Fine by me, I
| can bare ads, but what I cannot do is bear 5 ads in a row every
| 30 minutes. This has gotten a lot worse lately. It is annoying
| and disruptive to the user experience, and thankfully there are
| streamers who disable them altogether as they can sustain
| themselves through subscriptions and donations from chatters.
|
| On top of that they often play in absolutely wrong moments.
| Like getting ad immediately after clicking a new stream, before
| you even know whether you want to watch them or not.
| atsjie wrote:
| The comments and community feeling in Youtube streaming
| sucks. Ludwig who made the switch a year ago from Twitch to
| Youtube said that was his biggest nuisance with Youtube, and
| I agree. I stopped watching him because of it since there's
| more fun to be had on Twitch.
|
| Twitch is more like a bunch of monkeys which is fun and
| builds hype. Youtube is too serious and the chat is too slow
| for the streamer to properly interact with.
| enlyth wrote:
| Something about Twitch chat is magical, even though it is
| commonly just walls of copypasta, it feels like
| participating in a real, authentic audience. Often times it
| is more entertaining that the stream itself, just like on
| HN you would rush to the comments before even reading TFA
| to see what other people are saying.
|
| I can't quite pinpoint why YouTube doesn't have the same
| feeling though.
| wil421 wrote:
| It feels like teen chat rooms on AOL with more flair.
| Except I don't remember the hordes ganging up on and
| harassing people on AOL.
| WJW wrote:
| There was plenty of ganging up on AOL too, if you were
| even a little bit outside what "mainstream AOL" people
| thought was acceptable.
| wil421 wrote:
| You could just leave the chat or sign off. Hard to do
| when some people are all about doxing and swatting
| nowadays.
| hbn wrote:
| Well for one thing Twitch has the advantage of being
| primarily gaming-focused, whereas YouTube is at its core
| a generic video host with no particular focus.
|
| But YouTube has also completely destroyed their entire
| concept of having a "YouTube community" over the years.
| There might be something of various creator communities
| in various niches, but the heavy censorship, mess of a
| comments section that does everything in its power to
| halt any form of conversation, leaving only spam and
| idiots in most comment sections, etc. left it with
| nothing of a community, or any real creator/consumer
| dynamic.
|
| YouTube no longer has private nor direct messages, so if
| people want to communicate they have to do it on another
| platform. It's also just a bit of a mess with the
| transition from the original idea of "everyone has an
| anonymous handle" to "every must have their Google+
| profile linked and use their real name" to "Google+ is
| dead and now some people have silly handles and some
| people are real people." The whole thing adds up to make
| for a place with no coherent community.
| starkparker wrote:
| YouTube's UI doesn't facilitate it. YT chat is for
| textual chat, but clunky and staid, which is a very
| Google thing to implement.
|
| Twitch chat is for emoting, especially in ways that
| please the streamer. Trying to actually chat with someone
| on an active Twitch channel is futile.
| mrguyorama wrote:
| Twitch will never stop the softcore porn because it's a huge
| source of revenue and they DGAF that they are serving softcore
| porn to teens. Honestly I don't care that teens watch cammers
| or porn, but it's toxic to the platform to have it share the
| same site, and that also allows payment to be shared and
| basically makes it way easier for kids to pay cammers, which is
| super weird IMO. I also really dislike the encouragement of
| parasocial relationships on the platform. It's a huge problem
| in camming in general but twitch makes parasocial relationships
| a competitive sport through some really messed up crowd
| psychology.
|
| "Mommy give me twenty bucks for twitch bits so I can pay XQC"
| and then becoming a hot tub stream simp is so much easier than
| "Mommy give me your credit card so I can create an account on
| this cam girl site"
| salemh wrote:
| I wish more in tech would stop pretending pornography is
| something benign. This isn't the case, though I personally
| thought the same just a few years ago. There is data, and
| victims available to see it is not.
|
| Understanding a Context of Risk: Pornography and Child Sexual
| Abuse https://osf.io/kf4uv/download/?format=pdf _One of the
| most troubling patterns emerging in the research relates to
| the increasing number of younger children (under the ages of
| 12-14) involved in perpetrating child sexual assault.
| Clinical and legal studies are reporting greater numbers of
| preteen children demonstrating interpersonal problematic
| sexual behaviors that intrude on the physical space and
| security of other children (Friedrich et al., 2006; Swisher
| et al., 2008)._
|
| <>
|
| _Most relevant to the purpose of this paper is the role of
| exposure to sexually explicit media as one of the explanatory
| variables in child sexual abuse. A meta-analysis of 22
| studies demonstrates that exposure to pornography,
| particularly violent pornography, is significantly associated
| with increased rates of sexual aggression in the general
| population (Wright et al., 2016). Given that the average age
| of first exposure to pornography is age 11 (Wolak et al.,
| 2006), it is important to begin to consider what role, if
| any, pornography may play in child sexual abuse, particular
| if perpetrated by children. Several studies have included
| sexually explicit media as a contributing factor for child-
| perpetrated sexual abuse._
|
| The Association Between Exposure to Violent Pornography and
| Teen Dating Violence in Grade 10 High School Students
| https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6751001/
| _Exposure to pornography in general has been linked with
| adolescent dating violence and sexual aggression, but less is
| known about exposure to violent pornography specifically. The
| current study examined the association of violent pornography
| exposure with different forms of teen dating violence (TDV)
| using baseline survey data from a sample of Grade 10 high
| school students who reported being in a dating relationship
| in the past year (n = 1694)_
|
| A Meta-Analysis of Pornography Consumption and Actual Acts of
| Sexual Aggression in General Population Studies
| https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/jcom.12201
| _Is pornography consumption correlated with committing actual
| acts of sexual aggression? 22 studies from 7 different
| countries were analyzed. Consumption was associated with
| sexual aggression in the United States and internationally,
| among males and females, and in cross-sectional and
| longitudinal studies. Associations were stronger for verbal
| than physical sexual aggression, although both were
| significant. The general pattern of results suggested that
| violent content may be an exacerbating factor._
| kunalgupta wrote:
| This all sounds great for the softcore porn market though
| bawolff wrote:
| > I also really dislike the encouragement of parasocial
| relationships on the platform
|
| Isn't that the entire value proposition of twitch?
| tannhauser23 wrote:
| I've talked to my friends about this (we all have young
| children) and they had no idea softcore porn is prevalent on
| twitch. Not to mention actual adult stars regularly
| streaming.
|
| And before anybody replies "and whats wrong with that" blah
| blah, parents still think of twitch as a place where kids can
| watch minecraft.
|
| Twitch is playing with fire here.
| DoctorOW wrote:
| I won't say "What's wrong with that" but I will point out
| that Twitch has in place safe modes for "Mature" streams
| that isn't much of a gate keeper, but neither is the little
| M that pops up in the corner of mature TV programs. The
| site also doesn't seem to do anything to intentionally
| market directly to children. Not that it doesn't attract
| kids, but so does TV. I don't think it's unfair to expect
| parents to keep an eye on what their kids watch.
| op00to wrote:
| Not saying it's not there, but I've never seen anything
| like soft core porn on twitch. What's wrong with me that
| the algorithm thinks I don't like naked people?
| ru552 wrote:
| Parents are devoid of all responsibility then?
|
| I don't have a stance on the Twitch/softporn thing, but
| "think of the kids" is used too often for evil these days.
| ChickenNugger wrote:
| I think it's more that twitch sells itself as a gaming
| platform but it's honestly closer to chaturbate than a
| gaming site.
|
| Sure you _can_ see gaming there, but it 's not what
| dominates and is pushed by the platform.
| red-iron-pine wrote:
| Strongly disagree. There are lots, LOTS, of game streams.
| Definitely outnumbering the chaturbate angle.
|
| But how many people want to log in to watch someone with
| a face for radio and a voice for silent movies narrate
| some random game?
|
| By comparison, the chaturbate crowd is far fewer in
| number but has an outsized impact.
| ChickenNugger wrote:
| Lots of game streams with no one watching them, sure.
| Meanwhile "Just Chatting" is by far the largest category.
| And the biggest channel on right now is a pretty young
| woman in pajamas.
| op00to wrote:
| I blame my parents for allowing me to corrupt myself by
| watching the spice channel through the scrambler
| squiggles.
| [deleted]
| tannhauser23 wrote:
| Of course we do! That's why we're talking to each other
| about it. Twitch risks a backlash from parents if adult
| content comes more prevalent on the site.
| SpaceManNabs wrote:
| Twitch walked so that onlyfans could run.
|
| not even a joke. a lot of OF performers use their twitch as a
| marketting arm.
| i_love_cookies wrote:
| [dead]
| isk517 wrote:
| The big issue with ads is that only 'partners' are allowed to
| turn off pre-roll ads, and in order to become a partner you
| need meet certain requirements all based around getting people
| to watch your channel, which is difficult because most people
| (me include) will not sit through ads in order to watch some
| small streamer for a minute or two to see if they are
| interesting. Twitch seems to actively work against small
| streamers trying to grow their brand.
| jklinger410 wrote:
| > but what I cannot do is bear 5 ads in a row every 30 minutes
|
| This is basically how Television used to operate. I think it
| was more like, 4 ads every 15 minutes. So way more actually.
| corobo wrote:
| Yeah and we ditched TV for YouTube and Twitch!
|
| It's definitely about time for a new long form media
| company.. maybe one that doesn't sell itself to Microsoft
| daniel_reetz wrote:
| They had carte blanche and they literally made a worse
| version of the television model. The staff don't get paid for
| their work, and we have to watch more ads that watch us.
| dejawu wrote:
| The most infuriating thing about Twitch ads is that it insists
| on running a _thirty-second_ pre-roll ad. This is a platform
| where the focus is on liveness and immediacy, where you 're
| very likely to open a stream because what's happening right
| this moment is interesting (e.g. a speedrunner on world-record
| pace), and then that same platform forces you to miss out on
| that live moment.
|
| Literally any other form of advertising would fit Twitch better
| than pre-roll ads. Even a shorter pre-roll ad would be better
| (and probably lead to better retention). Gating people for a
| whole half-minute from a live event like that implies, at least
| to me, a company that doesn't understand their own platform.
| blsapologist42 wrote:
| I just close it immediately when there is a preroll.
| phatfish wrote:
| I'm sure it's been mentioned somewhere already, but the
| "plixltris/TwitchAdSolutions" repo on Github has a working
| blocker that switches the steam to an ad-free 480p version
| for in-stream ads. I think it can block the pre-roll ones
| somehow or reduce them because i hardly see any. Personally I
| use the Ublock script they have.
|
| And PurpleTV is a modified Android Twitch app that is just
| like Youtube (Re)Vanced. Obviously use with caution, with an
| account you don't have any personal info linked to, because
| unlike YouTube you are forced to log in to the Twitch App.
| Pretty sure the Gitlab "twitchmod/orange-tv" repo is the
| official source.
| atsjie wrote:
| To countercomment:
|
| - Softcore porn (I would not call it porn at all, search online
| for softcore porn and you get something completely different).
| You don't have to watch it and I never see it in my feeds, you
| have to actively search for it to find it. So I'm wondering how
| you notice it for it to be a problem? Yes; I'm calling you out.
|
| - Ads: youtube has a LOT more ads, and a lot of twitch
| streamers don't do the ad program. So here too I'm not as
| convinced it's a problem, I definitely don't see many ads and
| usually if there are any the streamer is aware and takes a
| break or something so you don't miss much.
| skilled wrote:
| - It is literally everywhere you look on the site. Do you
| think the worst of them just open their stream in their
| bikini and do it that way? The smart ones and the ones
| willing to do thong squats on screen will also do things like
| cooking streams, yoga sessions, playing random games (5%
| playing, 95% baiting chatters). Please don't try and argue
| with me on this because clearly I understand it better than
| you.
|
| - Read what I wrote again. I don't have an issue with ads on
| Twitch, I have an issue with them enforcing more ads as of
| late, 4-5 ads in a row every 30 minutes on a live streaming
| platform is dumb and there has to be a better solution.
| cyberlurker wrote:
| Anecdotally, I see it recommended a lot in my feed and I
| don't search for it. I know not to go to "Just chatting"
| basically.
|
| But this doesn't prevent the other problem where streamers
| will watch those others on their stream.
|
| I'm not that bothered about it but I think it might be a
| problem that it's a part of twitch culture.
| [deleted]
| ipaddr wrote:
| 5 ads every 1/2 hour? Stay away from tv you see 5 ads every 10
| minutes.
| olyjohn wrote:
| Have you seen YouTube ads lately? When I stream a video to
| the "app" on my TV, I get 1 minute 30 seconds of ads at the
| beginning. Then about 1:20 into the video, I get 2 more 30
| second ads. Then at 3:00 into the video, 2 more ads come on.
| Sometimes there are more ads than content. Ads come on
| literally less than 5 minute intervals, and the part that
| really drives me nuts is that it's always the same 2 ads over
| and over. There are even ads that are 5 minutes long. So far
| at least, I haven't seen a 5 minute ad that I can't skip.
| ipaddr wrote:
| Don't get me started on youtube ads. Youtube will punish
| you for logging in with more ads. They punish you for
| watching popular content. I can accept 5 ads totaling 2
| minutes every half hour
| plorg wrote:
| This is what turned me off to YT Music. When they migrated
| users from Play Music I tried it once, it took 10 clicks
| (including the dismissal of two interstitial modal ads) to
| get to a song that I own, and I still had to wait through a
| minute of ads to listen to it. I can't remove the app from
| my phone, but I haven't opened it in the 2-1/2 years since.
| skilled wrote:
| Well, I haven't watched TV for over 20 years now, so I
| wouldn't know.
|
| Anyway, the issue is that it is a _live_ streaming platform.
|
| In comparison to last 5 years, in the last year I can recall
| at least 5 times where I missed significant moments because
| the platform automatically ran ads.
| [deleted]
| ilyt wrote:
| I did for like 15+ years now ? It's terrible medium
| ipaddr wrote:
| The ads can be interesting they tell me about the culture
| of the local tv channel city. There are many behind the
| scene messages and things you pick up on. Understanding who
| is advertising can tell you who the show is written for or
| why they made certain choices and that can change as a show
| evolves.
|
| You get cultural references more memorable than the shows
| they prop up. Where's the beef still rings strong, wwwhat's
| up is a universal greeting.
|
| Advertising can bring feelings of connectiveness to people.
| A familiar verizon song at Christmas makes life a little
| bit less sad for a solider in the battle field or a parent
| who is spending Christmas alone.
|
| Advertising in many ways is more dynamic, interesting and
| long lasting compared to the shows they put on. Watching
| shows without them hollows out the experience.
| potatolicious wrote:
| > Stay away from tv you see 5 ads every 10 minutes.
|
| Funnily that's exactly what everyone is doing[1].
|
| [1] https://www.fiercevideo.com/video/linear-video-
| subscriber-lo...
| Covzire wrote:
| The UX for Twitch is downright awful right now. Browsing
| through multiple streamers almost always results in an ad being
| played for every streamer you check out, it's so bizarre, they
| actively punish you for trying out new streamers unless they're
| very small who don't have ads yet.
|
| The workaround is to 'pre-browse' by opening multiple streamers
| in new tabs, muting their tabs and then checking them out a
| minute or two later, but that's quite a PITA.
|
| Twitch could disappear today and I don't think I'd care, I
| couldn't say the same thing five or ten years ago.
| ChickenNugger wrote:
| Alternate Player for Twitch.tv:
| https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/alternate-player-f...
|
| It can't skip ads completely, but it will prevent showing them.
| lol-dot-jpeg wrote:
| FWIW this coincides with a pretty important Amazon-internal
| announcement about return to office details. That, plus new kid?
| Yeah, I'd quit my job too.
| 0000000000100 wrote:
| If there was one thing I wish Twitch would change, it's the entry
| ads to streams. I can't tell you how many times I've closed the
| tab while browsing for something to watch because I get an
| unskipable 30 second ad before I even get to see if there's
| something worth watching.
|
| For reference, Twitch has invested very heavily in anti
| adblockers and it's pretty difficult to sidestep the ads these
| days without paying $5/month for a subscription.
|
| Compare this to streaming on YouTube, which has a (much) worse
| UI, but tolerates ad blockers and lets you watch the parts of the
| steam you missed. I'm not optimistic that Twitch will be able to
| survive if YouTube manages to get their shit together and make a
| half decent UI.
| prox wrote:
| They don't tell you this on the whole, but there is an adfree
| turbo subscription: https://www.twitch.tv/turbo
| Lev1a wrote:
| Which does nothing [1] for the streamers you actually watch,
| only for Twitch itself.
|
| "Paying" the streamer for the ad(s) being not shown due to
| Turbo, i.e. fractions of a cent. If you're mainly watching
| 1-2 streamers subscribing directly to them does more for them
| for almost the same money. The streamer is still only getting
| 50% of the sub fee but at least that's ~ $2.50 rather than a
| few cents per month for many hours of watched content.
| anthonypasq wrote:
| If you think UI is whats holding Youtube back you dont
| understand anything about the space.
| jonlucc wrote:
| I know this isn't going to be the most popular solution, but I
| find that Twitch Turbo isn't much discussed. I think it's $8
| and eliminates ads from all channels. It may make more sense
| financially for some viewers, but it doesn't support any
| streamers.
| jsheard wrote:
| The worst part is they put more effort into stopping adblockers
| than they do into actually selling ads, so the ads they force
| you to watch are endlessly repeated from a tiny pool. It's just
| Squarespace ad after Squarespace ad after Squarespace ad,
| punctuated by filler ads for other Amazon properties like
| Audible because they haven't sold enough real ads to fill the
| space.
| Liquix wrote:
| FWIW there is a GitHub repo [0] which keeps track of
| currently-working ways to block Twich ads. If you don't need
| chat, ff2mpv [1] can be used to send streams directly to MPV
| by right clicking on them in the browser. This bypasses the
| entire proprietary Twitch frontend and displays a silent
| purple screen during ad breaks.
|
| [0] https://github.com/pixeltris/TwitchAdSolutions
|
| [1] https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/ff2mpv/
| com2kid wrote:
| I stopped using it when my Prime subscription no longer removed
| ads.
|
| I was a very regular user, 2-4 hours a day, then boom, forced
| ads, and I never went back.
| Venn1 wrote:
| I've been streaming our Linux gaming show on Twitch since the
| Justin.tv days. Not much has changed from my POV.
|
| Granted, I treat Twitch as a CDN that occasionally cuts me a
| cheque.
| tempsy wrote:
| What I don't understand about Twitch is how it became a bizarro
| cesspool of leftist extremism, incel culture, and softcore porn
| for tweens.
|
| At some point you must ask yourself if you're the CEO or work
| there how it is you came to be in a position to spend your day
| working on something that has become as dystopian as Twitch has
| become.
| sleepybrett wrote:
| lost me at 'leftist extremism' imma need some examples.
| corbulo wrote:
| Hasan isn't an extremist?
| notbuyingit wrote:
| Sure, let's explore that. What are Hasan's extremist views?
| And keep in mind that I'm gonna cite Aden, Sneako,
| Trainwrecks, Mizkif and more in response.
| corbulo wrote:
| I don't care who you cite. I'm not playing some dumb 'my
| team' game lol
|
| He used to work for The Young Turks, hosts streams with
| AOC and Ilhan Omar, is quoted as saying, "On Crenshaw,
| Piker said, "What the fuck is wrong with this dude?
| Didn't he go to war and like literally lose his eye
| because some mujahideen, a brave fucking soldier fucked
| his eye hole with their dick?"
|
| And
|
| "In the same stream, Piker criticized American foreign
| policy and made controversial comments relating to the
| September 11 attacks, including "America deserved 9/11,
| dude.""
|
| This is literally just skimming his wiki. Do you know
| anything about the guy? He's a gigantic PoS. The fact
| that Twitch doesn't permaban him is insane, they've
| banned many other people for far less.
| jkeat wrote:
| yeah extremely reasonable
| wnevets wrote:
| They probably banned him for saying certain words, shall we
| guess which words?
| tempsy wrote:
| Twitch was at the center of the Hogwarts Legacy game
| controversy because people were mad that certain streamers
| were playing a game because something something JK Rowling is
| an "anti trans TERF."
|
| And if you ever looked through videos of TwitchCon you would
| not question what I'm saying at all. This is the event that
| still required everyone to wear a mask late 2022 only after
| Twitch was guilted into it.
| [deleted]
| wnevets wrote:
| > This is the event that still required everyone to wear a
| mask late 2022 only after Twitch was guilted into it.
|
| Not spreading a deadly virus at a convention filled with
| strangers from all over the world is now considered
| "leftist extremism". The last 8 or so years really have
| done a number on people.
| vinicky wrote:
| The funniest part of that was how it entirely backfired,
| their trantrums just got more people interested in the game
| and pissed off at these activists.
|
| We're also seeing more people rallying behind JK Rowling
| these days too, perhaps after seeing through the lies and
| realising that, actually, she bravely put herself out there
| to stand up for women's rights, knowing this would make her
| a lightning rod for the abusers and harassers of the pro-
| gender movement.
| jedberg wrote:
| > This is the event that still required everyone to wear a
| mask late 2022 only after Twitch was guilted into it.
|
| Oh no, they bowed to people whose livelihoods depend on
| staying healthy and realized that masks actually do help
| when everyone wears them.
| bacchusracine wrote:
| >masks actually do help when everyone wears them.
|
| Could I get a citation for this please? Just about every
| source I've seen has since admitted that masks did
| absolutely nothing for the purposes for which they were
| advised to be used.
| hellomyguys wrote:
| When you dig into those studies, they aren't that great
| either fwiw.
| misssocrates wrote:
| How so? There's no evidence for that with respect to
| respiratory viruses.
|
| > Wearing masks in the community probably makes little or
| no difference to the outcome of influenza-like illness
| (ILI)/COVID-19 like illness compared to not wearing masks
| (risk ratio (RR) 0.95, 95% confidence interval (CI) 0.84
| to 1.09; 9 trials, 276,917 participants; moderate-
| certainty evidence. Wearing masks in the community
| probably makes little or no difference to the outcome of
| laboratory-confirmed influenza/SARS-CoV-2 compared to not
| wearing masks (RR 1.01, 95% CI 0.72 to 1.42; 6 trials,
| 13,919 participants; moderate-certainty evidence).
|
| https://www.cochranelibrary.com/cdsr/doi/10.1002/14651858
| .CD...
| notbuyingit wrote:
| And googling the key line there reveals a full page of
| Google results with articles explaining how both the
| initial assumptions and methodology was flawed. It was
| surprising even to me how easy it was to find rebuttals.
|
| https://www.gavi.org/vaccineswork/yes-masks-reduce-risk-
| spre...
|
| https://www.nytimes.com/2023/03/10/opinion/masks-work-
| cochra...
|
| https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2023/02/16/cochra
| ne-...
|
| At least, unlike the other person in this thread, you
| didn't do the gaslighty thing of acting like 'we all
| know' masks don't work.
| timr wrote:
| Speaking as someone who actually has an advanced degree
| in science and understands how to read papers and
| interpret medical evidence ( _unlike_ Tufecki, who has
| literally zero scientific training or understanding of
| statistics) has read ~every paper on masks ever
| published, the "rebuttals" there are nonsense.
|
| The Cochrane review was not incorrect; it was not
| retracted. The "apology from Cochrane" was not about the
| paper itself, and they _didn 't_ say that the conclusions
| were wrong. The NY Times and the Washington Post and Gavi
| are just wrong, and they're lying. Full stop. By
| _literally_ the same standards of evidence they are using
| ( _" the lower bound of the confidence interval crosses
| 1.0, so we can't exclude the possibility of benefit"_),
| Ivermectin and HCQ "work" against Covid. So you either
| accept both claims, or you reject both.
|
| We have two political teams, each advancing separate-but-
| equal forms of pseudo-sciencey twaddle, and neither side
| is willing to admit that the actual data doesn't back
| their opinions:
|
| https://sensiblemed.substack.com/p/the-cochrane-mask-
| fiasco
| notbuyingit wrote:
| Gonna go with "wearing a mask to stop particulate spread"
| is not separate but equal from taking horse dewormer.
| (And it's not an exaggeration to characterize it as such
| when they're literally buying drugs from farm suplly
| stores and injecting amounts meant for livestock over the
| course of a few days.)
|
| Similarly, I don't know anyone who has died from wearing
| a mask.
|
| This is not even to mention the numerous other studies,
| experiments, and demsonstartsions of all sorts of
| respiratory protective gear that show effectiveness
| against particulates smaller even than COVID-19.
| Manuel_D wrote:
| As per your first link, rate of infection with masks was
| 90% the rate of infection without masks. I mean,
| technically it "works" even if reduces the rates of
| infection by 0.0000001%. But most people are not going to
| see much benefit in masking if it only reduces the rate
| marginally.
|
| The intensity of the push for masking was not at all
| matched by the effectiveness of masking. From most
| people's perspectives, if the rate of infection with
| masking is 90% the rate with no masking then masking
| doesn't work in layperson's terms.
| yamtaddle wrote:
| Hell, I kinda wish we'd kept it up everywhere. Not having
| anyone in my house get so much as the flu for about 2.5
| years was kinda awesome. I think we had a single mild
| cold go through our house, that entire time.
| [deleted]
| redox99 wrote:
| Leftist extremism: depends on your definition, but see AI
| generated Seinfeld banned because of a joke[1]
|
| Incel culture: I don't agree with this one, I don't think
| it's something widespread
|
| Softcore porn: The whole hot tub/asmr categories. Amouranth
| herself says she uses twitch as a billboard to get people to
| her onlyfans[2]
|
| [1] https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/feb/06/nothing-
| fore...
|
| [2] https://twitter.com/jappleby/status/1597327662644858880
| misssocrates wrote:
| Sounds like Reddit. Perhaps one could ask the same question of
| that and get to the same root cause?
| pvarangot wrote:
| Conservatives where saying Netflix was doing this when they
| released that weird show about girls that were dressed up
| very suggestively on their platform. We probably went through
| the same for broadcast TV, cable, video stores, etc, etc...
|
| The root cause I don't want to speculate short of getting
| banned from HN also for having opinions about when people
| should start having sex or be allowed to watch videos of
| adults having sex.
| aliasxneo wrote:
| I don't watch Twitch...but what??
| tempsy wrote:
| Which part are you confused by?
| colpabar wrote:
| I can't speak for the first two, but as for the softcore porn
| bit - there are a lot of very popular streamers who are just
| hot women that wear bathing suits or less and either do
| something mundane while looking hot or "exercise" or
| something that is also mostly just them looking hot. Maybe
| softcore porn is a bit much since there is no nudity, but
| it's close.
| nagyf wrote:
| To add to this: Some other hot women are using 3D*
| microphones and they do nothing but moan into the mic (like
| if they were having sex or similar), and making "licking
| noises" and other similar stuff.
|
| * Edit: no idea what are these called, but sometimes they
| moan and lick the left side, sometimes the right so you can
| hear it in your corresponding ear.
| jaywalk wrote:
| Stereo microphone is the term you're looking for.
| cinntaile wrote:
| ASMR (autonomous sensory meridian response)
|
| https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ASMR
| prox wrote:
| It's not even close to softcore porn. I can go to any beach
| and see the same thing, or a nudie sauna, and that is
| hardly sexual.
|
| Hot is probably the right word. Well done if they make
| money from that I guess.
| tempsy wrote:
| softcore porn is "softcore" because it doesn't involve
| nudity or explicit intercourse
|
| the fact wearing a bikini at the beach is not sexual does
| not mean streaming yourself wearing a bikini in a hot tub
| while making moaning noises is not softcore porn. the
| intention is what matters eg attract teenage simp boys.
| philwelch wrote:
| Traditionally I think the line with softcore was that it
| didn't directly show penetration or fluids.
| colpabar wrote:
| It seems like you're talking about something you've never
| seen. If you saw what I'm referring to outside of twitch,
| you'd immediately assume it was an onlyfans video or
| something. You can absolutely not see the same thing at a
| beach or a sauna, and if you did, the person would get
| kicked out.
|
| I'm not commenting on whether it's good or bad, I'm just
| stating something that anyone who has ever been on twitch
| is well aware of and would never argue. It's a thing.
| yamtaddle wrote:
| It's the difference between being at a beach with people
| in bathing suits and just doing normal beach stuff... and
| one of those people moving their beach towel and umbrella
| so that they're directly in front of you, while making
| hard eye contact, then proceeding to stretch
| suggestively, wink at you occasionally, moan from time to
| time, and "accidentally" drop things in front of you with
| _bizarre_ frequency so they just "have to" keep bending
| over in such a way that you get a great view.
|
| One's not sexual. The other one _super-duper obviously_
| is, to everyone involved, even if the bathing suit stays
| on.
| [deleted]
| kmnc wrote:
| One thing I have noticed with twitch is how stagnant viewership
| seems to be for most streamers. It seems like once you hit your
| peak in growth.... there is just nothing after that, no growth at
| all. Most streamers I watch have been on a slow decline in
| viewership and subs... Without "oilers" (people who gift a ton of
| subs or money) most streams would die completely. One main reason
| for this in my opinion is how terrible ads are on twitch. I watch
| a lot of GTA RP on twitch... and ads completely destroyed it from
| a viewer perspective. Steaming in general lends itself well to
| collaboration... but, when I want to check out a different stream
| and am met with 2 minutes of the most repetitive and annoying
| ads.. I quickly go back to my main streamer who I use my twitch
| prime on so I don't get ads.
|
| I got so fed up with twitch ads that I actually use twitch turbo
| now.. which isn't marketed at all for whatever reason. My viewing
| experience is so much better now, and I am checking out a larger
| variety of streamers.
|
| Ads on twitch are so horrendous that pretty much every streamer I
| watch apologize to their viewers about it.
|
| Twitch's second failure is that it is so incredibly out of touch
| with what viewers want to see. Twitch run events are abysmal, yet
| they give no help or support to the creators who are actually
| making good events or shows. The fact that twitch didn't become a
| big player in e-sports is such a massive failure. Look at what
| happened with Chess... it exploded and is still in a pretty good
| position all because some smart people decided to run some
| actually entertaining events. Twitch could of easily dominated
| the e-sports market by partnering and helping the smaller
| tournament orgs... yet now those orgs are failing and the
| e-sports scene is once again cratering to the ground. If it
| wasn't for the surprise success of Valorant.. e-sports would be
| dead right now.
| corbulo wrote:
| E sports is heavily investor dependent. Which means rates go up
| and itll dry up. I would be really surprised if any of it
| directly generated a profit. Its for game sales long term.
| hoseja wrote:
| NOT replaced by a brahmin? Weird.
| elicash wrote:
| Am I the only one who takes it at face value that somebody would
| quit being a CEO because of the birth of their first child? Even
| if the platform has all the issues folks are saying?
| Sebb767 wrote:
| Getting into a position like this (and keeping it!) requires an
| extreme amount of dedication and sacrifice. People who are
| willing to go to such lengths are unlikely to be the kind of
| person to give up all that for their child.
|
| Additionally, you rarely hear the actual reason for someone
| quitting from a position like this; there will nearly always be
| a nice cover story. Being honest this time around, especially
| given the actual problems the company has, seems unlikely.
|
| I'm not saying the child was no factor, but intuitively it
| seems quite unlikely that this is the full story.
| whatshisface wrote:
| They don't have to say why.
| ticviking wrote:
| But a firstborn is a good way for everybody involved to save
| face
| ericd wrote:
| I don't know why you'd say that, for a lot of people, the
| birth of their first child changes their priorities very
| fundamentally, especially if they have the luxury of being
| able to do so. Like, for example, if they had sold their
| company to Amazon for a _literal dump truck of money_. I just
| calculated it, it went for about 11 tons of $100 bills (the
| capacity of a large dump truck is about 14 tons, apparently,
| 7 for some smaller ones).
|
| I don't know Emmett, but if he was totally set in terms of
| wealth, and if the main thing keeping him there was because
| it was satisfying work, well, then he could quite reasonably
| decide that doing something less demanding so that he could
| have the spare time and energy to be a very good father to
| his child might be more satisfying. That's certainly the
| decision I'd make.
| teachrdan wrote:
| > for a lot of people, the birth of their first child
| changes their priorities
|
| CEOs are not a lot of people. By definition they are
| extremely few in number, and those who become CEOs of top
| companies have a perhaps pathological drive to get there.
| For someone like that, an entirely predictable event --
| like the birth of a child -- is the last thing that would
| make them sacrifice the position they've worked so hard
| for.
|
| Now would I quit my job for $100 million? Absolutely! But
| maybe that just means I'm most people...
| ryandrake wrote:
| I honestly don't understand the mentality that drives
| someone to keep working after they've made, say, $100
| million. Maybe that's why we're all not that person. Even
| if you're the most single-minded, driven person ever,
| once you get that much wealth you've pretty much won the
| game. You did it, you're done. The show's over.
|
| It's like continuing to play your Civilization game for
| "Just... One... More... Turn..." after you defeated
| everyone and you're the only civ left.
| Sebb767 wrote:
| > I honestly don't understand the mentality that drives
| someone to keep working after they've made, say, $100
| million.
|
| Most people reading this site are in the 1% of the world
| and could easily retire to a lower cost of living area
| right now or after a few years of saving. They usually
| don't: Firstly, because the drive that gets you to earn
| that kind of money also keeps you going. If you're used
| to and can handle 80 hour weeks, going to 0 is likely to
| make you feel unfulfilled quite fast (which is also why I
| don't fully buy the child story). Secondly, you always
| judge yourself in regards your friend group, and usually
| quite badly. This might seem absurd to us, but they might
| be looking at their friends with private jets, yachts and
| paintings valued more than their total net worth and not
| feel like they are at the top.
|
| There are exception, of course, but I doubt you'll find
| many of them in the extreme environments at the top of
| the business hierarchy.
| ryandrake wrote:
| I don't think we're talking about the same group of
| people. A highly paid tech worker who makes, say $250K a
| year, and maybe has a little $800,000 retirement account?
| Sure, they could retire in Kazakhstan or something, but
| there's still something to work for (maybe they want to
| step up and retire in Thailand or heaven forbid the USA).
|
| But if you've banked $100 million, that's a totally
| different world. You have wealth that grows by itself
| passively, and you'll never be able to spend it. You can
| live wherever you want in the world and never have to
| work, and neither will your offspring for multiple
| generations. Any work you do at that point is firmly in
| the "Play the video game after you won" territory.
| tmpz22 wrote:
| I imagine the work gets less stressful when you have FU
| money. As a CEO you're delegating a lot of the day to day
| work, and as a subsidiary of Amazon they're probably
| giving a lot of the macro direction.
|
| So you get into the office (maybe) at 10am (maybe),
| reading some emails, firing off some responses, maybe
| taking a call or two. Then a ritzy lunch for an hour.
| Coming back to some more emails and meetings.
|
| Some days you will be putting out fires all day. But the
| more mature the company is the less you have to do that.
| After 15+ years the company should have a mature
| executive team that can handle all but the biggest fires
| by themselves.
| jonasdegendt wrote:
| Paul Graham wrote an article [0] on this that provided
| some insight into this for me. I still don't completely
| get it but that's probably because I'm not that kind of
| person either, or maybe we just haven't found the thing
| yet that is able to drive us on all cylinders with no
| brakes.
|
| [0] http://www.paulgraham.com/ace.html
| ericd wrote:
| If you read the article, or know the story of Justin.tv
| (one of the very earliest YC startups, from before YC was
| a big thing), you'll know that he's a cofounder, not
| someone who climbed up the ranks via ruthless political
| maneuvering to get there.
|
| It's not the "position" he worked so hard for, it was to
| build a company. Being CEO is a means to doing that, not
| the end goal. He did that, it is extremely successful, it
| will probably continue to be successful without him.
|
| He even says it in the article - that for a long time, he
| wasn't sure if he could leave and have it continue to
| function well. As someone who started, ran, and sold a
| (much, much smaller) company, I understand that
| viscerally. If you're somewhat tired of it, it can feel
| like you're trapped. But then you work on that, making
| sure that the things you do get well covered by someone
| else. And then, one day, there's nothing it needs you for
| anymore, and you're finally free.
| adamwk wrote:
| He's been at twitch since 2006. How many founders stay
| that long? Mark Zuckerberg I guess? I just don't think
| the numbers back up your premise that being a CEO of a
| top company requires a pathological drive to stay there
| until death
| garciasn wrote:
| Definitely not when it's "effective immediately".
| ericd wrote:
| The person who's stepping into his spot has been President
| for three years, and has been attaching his name to public
| communications/policy, this doesn't seem like a rushed
| replacement.
| Vespasian wrote:
| I don't disagree, but quitting from a position is certainly a
| sacrifice.
|
| I'm certain it happens once in a while when someone has a
| personal realization and decides to change their life's
| trajectory fundamentally. Maybe their own (role model)
| parents died and they discovered that time with your children
| cannot be substituted with gifts and money.
|
| Now in this case it's unlikely given Twitch problems but
| sometimes important humans are just humans.
| MichaelZuo wrote:
| It does seems plausible.
|
| Maybe there are those who can simultaneously raise a baby and
| be the successful CEO of a sizeable operating unit, but in
| practice usually one or the other is prioritized.
| hangonhn wrote:
| Both can be true, especially since they don't contradict each
| other. When it comes to human decisions, it's usually a
| multitude of reasons. It could be that Twitch is in trouble and
| he has a child and maybe a host of other factors. I too take
| what he said at face value while allowing other things people
| have said about the platform to be true too.
| PurpleRamen wrote:
| Platforms always have issues, that will never change. Despite
| that, Twitch is doing pretty well. Most of the complaints are
| saying that it could be better, not that it's bad. Though,
| there is the problem that Amazon is juicing the platform, and
| that's also something that won't change. And I would say Emmett
| Shear generally did improve the platform over the years. So he
| is going on a height.
| thenerdhead wrote:
| What's wrong with that? Working since 2006 watching some dude
| named Justin livestream his life to what it has become is quite
| an accomplishment that seems justified for an early retirement?
| elicash wrote:
| Why would you possibly think I'm against this?
| willio58 wrote:
| Nope, I totally agree. Most of the complaints I'm seeing are
| valid, but a lot of people see Twitch as a dying platform when
| in reality it's just getting bigger and bigger. There was a
| momentary huge spike in viewership during covid, but I believe
| viewership in total is still climbing.
| legohead wrote:
| Quitting because of family is the standard "everything is fine
| stockholders, don't freak out" message. Same message from Susan
| Wojcicki and countless other execs.
| jedberg wrote:
| I've known Emmett for many years and I 100% believe it. He was
| working because he enjoyed it. Now he has something else to
| enjoy more.
|
| Couldn't be happier for the guy!
| GenerocUsername wrote:
| As the father of an 11 month old, yeah, I don't see how many
| human could be a CEO and an involved parent.
|
| Now if twitch were a perfect turnkey operation the CEO could
| step away for a few weeks here and there... But also maybe
| that's just not realistic
| RandallBrown wrote:
| If I was worth ~100 million dollars, I would definitely quit my
| job to have fun with my family.
| SketchySeaBeast wrote:
| If I was worth ~100 million dollars, I would definitely quit
| my job.
| beebmam wrote:
| If I was worth ~100 million dollars, I would definitely
| quit my job AND my family
| fabiensanglard wrote:
| If I was worth ~100 million dollars....
| knodi123 wrote:
| All day long, I'd biddy biddy bum
| gooseyman wrote:
| Well I'd buy you a K-Car (a nice Reliant automobile)
| SketchySeaBeast wrote:
| Inflation has not been kind to the dreams of BNL.
| RandallBrown wrote:
| It still probably works, but you won't have much left
| over.
|
| https://www.reddit.com/r/theydidthemath/comments/7dyi7r/r
| equ...
| Google234 wrote:
| He's been so absent.
| madrox wrote:
| As a former Twitch staff, I wish Emmett luck. Twitch is faced
| with several challenges right now: increasing competition from
| all sides, perpetually disgruntled creators, and pressure from
| their parent company to hit aggressive revenue targets while
| shilling for Amazon Games. This is all nothing new, and Emmett
| has been navigating it for years. I'm ready to believe it just
| doesn't seem as important now as it did a year ago. Having a
| child will do that.
|
| I think Twitch could benefit from a breath of fresh air. I'm a
| little surprised it's Dan and not someone else from Amazon, but I
| think that speaks to the fact Emmett went on his own terms on not
| theirs. Dan knows what he's doing and he'll walk the line between
| doing what's good for Twitch and doing what's best for creators.
| noncoml wrote:
| Twitch CEO be like, we are just a gaming streaming platform. We
| don't like soft-porn and gambling but WE LOVE their revenue.
|
| Sorry, you cannot have your cake and eat it too. You have to make
| some hard decisions as a CEO.
| [deleted]
| dlevine wrote:
| I worked for Dan many years ago when he was an engineering
| director at Google. He's a sharp guy and has a lot of experience
| in the industry. I hope he does well at his new role.
| minimaxir wrote:
| What _has_ Twitch actually done new business-wise in the past 5-6
| years? Every typical user still uses the same StreamLabs widgets
| and alerts for years without many new ones, and most of the
| streaming workflow improvements are upstream in OBS itself.
|
| I honestly pegged things like Twitch Plays Pokemon back in 2014
| would be the future of Twitch, and Twitch did allow _some_
| developer tools for interactivity between players and games, but
| very very few devs make use of it outside of an intentional
| gimmick because there 's a massive chicken-and-egg problem there
| that Twitch hasn't facilitated.
| arkitaip wrote:
| Most of the innovation is driven by the streamers and target
| viewers anyways. Just check out the events that people like
| Ibai are doing - bigger and more fun than anything Twitch has
| done.
| Avicebron wrote:
| Which is probably part of the charm of twitch and part of the
| reason it stays relevant and people often complain that
| Youtube's implementation is limited (mostly because of how
| the chat communities work).
|
| I find it difficult (outside of adding more dev tools and
| allowing for things like twitch plays pokemon as someone
| mentioned earlier in this thread) that a corporate
| implementation of a new "thing" will be as successful, partly
| because of the vicious backlash against whatever corporate
| sanitation measures would have to be implemented just to
| allow it on the platform.
|
| I think there's a fundamental disconnect in what is most fun
| and engaging about watching and commenting in chats on twitch
| and what twitch as a company would allow if they tried to
| invasively step in an manage the product.
|
| A good example of this was a few years ago, there was almost
| universally panned attempt to create some form of "moderation
| council" which turned out to be absurdly tone deaf and I
| haven't heard anything since.
| jazzyjackson wrote:
| Moving all the thirst traps to a "hot tubs" channel was pretty
| innovative.
|
| https://www.pcgamer.com/twitch-addresses-hot-tub-streaming-c...
| jeron wrote:
| real innovation would have been to spin it off as a separate
| streaming website that allows paywalled subscription and
| creating an OF competitor
| unethical_ban wrote:
| Horrible idea!
|
| By keeping softcore erotica nudge-nudge on their video game
| streaming site, they allow viewers to tell their parents
| and girlfriends that they're watching games and chat.
| Spinning it off would kill the market for that content
| without doing anything for the video game side of the
| house.
| mjr00 wrote:
| Sexual content on platforms is in such a weird place. It
| gets tons of views, but you can't have a platform that's
| _only_ adult content or it scares off advertisers. But if
| you have a successful platform that has adult content and
| you try to remove it, the platform becomes nearly
| worthless: see Yahoo and Tumblr. A mainstream brand like
| Visa has no issues advertising on Twitter, despite the
| massive amounts of adult content on Twitter. Yet you 'd
| never see a Visa advertisement on Pornhub.
|
| If you're running an ad-driven platform, you need to be in
| this weird Goldilocks zone where your platform _has_ sexual
| content but isn 't really _known_ for sexual content. That
| 's where Twitter, Twitch, Instagram and Reddit are, and
| it's why OnlyFans tried to push the "not just for porn"
| angle so hard for a while.
| ChickenNugger wrote:
| They deliberately don't want that.
|
| Twitch is the top of the "marketing funnel" to onlyfans for
| a plethora of onlyfans streamers:
| https://i.imgur.com/jeOq6ek.png
|
| OF spammers have also completely ruined NSFW reddit,
| because the simp mods do nothing about it.
| jazzyjackson wrote:
| Same with instagram. I actually find it kind of shocking
| how obvious sex work is on twitter and instagram, it's
| generally frowned upon to pay for sex in the progressive
| circles I'm used to, but I guess on the internet we all
| live in San Francisco.
| yamtaddle wrote:
| Eh--the draw of putting that content on Twitch is siphoning
| off part of a huge audience by sharing space on a popular
| non-porn platform. Separating the two would remove the
| reason people are streaming there instead of OF in the
| first place.
| cinntaile wrote:
| Amazon doesn't want to get into the adult industry.
| vkou wrote:
| It also doesn't not want to get into it, because it could
| have banned hot tub streams, but chose to quarantine them
| instead.
|
| As sibling posts explained - it wants to be in a one-
| foot-in-one-foot-out sort of position on the question.
| philwelch wrote:
| Maybe I'm missing something about "hot tub streams", but
| cute girls in bathing suits sitting in a hot tub doesn't
| quite meet my definition of "adult content". It might be
| unhealthy parasocial content for lonely boys, but it's
| not porn.
| Jensson wrote:
| They are porn ads, those girls makes their money on only
| fans and they stream to get guys to pay them for porn.
|
| You can see this for example, she isn't allowed to pay
| for normal ads since most networks doesn't allow porn
| ads, but streaming is a way for her to advertise:
|
| https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/amouranth-reveals-
| her-on...
| input_sh wrote:
| Okay but how is that a Twitch problem?
|
| From what I know they can't link their OnlyFans directly
| on Twitch (they need at least one intermediary website)
| nor even acknowledge its existence directly on stream.
| Supermancho wrote:
| I'm not sure how creating a more limited product (than OF),
| and reducing twitch viewership, would be innovative.
| nemothekid wrote:
| > _I honestly pegged things like Twitch Plays Pokemon back in
| 2014_
|
| Most of the comments on Twitch strike me as pretty weird. If I
| look at Twitch their problem is that, as a business, they never
| really broke out of their gaming niche. It's strange to suggest
| that Twitch should have catered _more_ to the audience that
| they had already captured. Not to say that there 's anything
| wrong with that, but for a company that took tons of VC and was
| acquired for a ton of money I don't think the answer to their
| "we need to make more money" problem is to cater even more to
| gamers. It's like trying to squeeze blood from a stone; we
| already see it in the way Twitch is squeezing more of the
| revenue share from large creators and refusing to entertain
| Google's huge content contracts.
|
| I don't see how Twitch continues to grow by just focusing
| gaming - especially when the esports side is going through it
| own struggles now and even teams are being forced diversify
| into content (e.g. 100Theives selling energy drinks).
|
| Twitch's "problem" to me is while it was a stroke of genius to
| break out gaming into it's own site out of Justin.tv, is that
| same audience has become openly hostile to any sort of non-
| gaming content. If you ask me the future of Twitch is with
| creators like KaiCenat who are able to bring different
| demographics to the platform with other types of content. Of
| course the Twitch superfans would hate to hear this; I don't
| envy them at all.
| wpm wrote:
| Gaming niche? "Just Chatting" is far and away the most
| popular category right now; ~100K more viewers than GTA V
| (most of which is GTA:O and RPing).
| nemothekid wrote:
| Not sure what point you are trying make.
|
| 1. The top 3 gaming categories eclipse Just Chatting; and
| there are hundreds of gaming categories on Twitch
|
| 2. Most Just Chatting creators are gaming creators. There
| are exceptions (KaiCenant, Hasanabi, various female
| streamers); but the site is still geared toward gaming.
| minimaxir wrote:
| > If I look at Twitch their problem is that, as a business,
| they never really broke out of their gaming niche.
|
| At the least, Twitch has a de facto monopoly in the gaming
| niche, to the point that the only way
| YouTube/Facebook/Microsoft could compete _at all_ was with
| exclusivity contracts, which didn 't even work as it didn't
| bring other streamers to the platform.
|
| Encouraging the development of highly interactive programs
| like TPP isn't gaming specific either.
| saghm wrote:
| The biggest things I can think of that might fit that window of
| time are the adding of "bits" (a more streamlined way of
| donating to streamers) and Twitch Prime subs (where Amazon
| Prime customers get one free sub per month to assign to a
| streamer of their choice). Arguably the latter might be more
| attributable to Amazon rather than Twitch itself.
| Peter-Muxy wrote:
| >I honestly pegged things like Twitch Plays Pokemon back in
| 2014 would be the future of Twitch, and Twitch did allow some
| developer tools for interactivity between players and games,
| but very very few devs make use of it outside of an intentional
| gimmick because there's a massive chicken-and-egg problem there
| that Twitch hasn't facilitated.
|
| I've believed the same thing since 2014 which is why I started
| Muxy in 2015. We build tools that let viewers and broadcasters
| interact with gameplay in real-time. It's been hard to make
| bigger strides as management at Twitch seems to turn over
| faster than we can build working relationships. We're finally
| seeing some real traction with publishers and studios over the
| last 18 months. You might know us from the Bits days when we
| launched the cheer cup in summer 2016.
| Eumenes wrote:
| Its softcore porn and weird anime/furry stuff for socially
| awkward teenagers
| waboremo wrote:
| Guaranteed ads, amazon affiliate links in bio, integrate amazon
| luna more, and change revenue splits.
| weego wrote:
| The guaranteed 30 second as on stream load was the final
| straw for me. I used to wander around the music streamers
| channel but ended up with as much as time viewed as the
| actual streams.
| HDThoreaun wrote:
| ad block works on twitch. Even the DNS only blockers that
| you can get for iOS.
| favaq wrote:
| >Every typical user still uses the same StreamLabs widgets and
| alerts for years without many new ones, and most of the
| streaming workflow improvements are upstream in OBS itself.
|
| So what, if it works well enough, which it seems like it does?
| Can't we just leave things be?
| minimaxir wrote:
| It _works_ , but could be a lot lot better and is not very
| user friendly, which would benefit Twitch's two-sided market.
|
| Unfortunately Twitch's current API is too locked-down/fussy
| to build a feasible alternative.
| Peter-Muxy wrote:
| It's more than that; there is no room to innovate here for a
| startup. We were #2 to Streamlabs with ~40% market share by
| minutes watched @ Muxy in 2016-2017. However, there was no
| way to monetize without dark patterning viewers to subscribe
| to our platform when donating, which others did, but we
| refused to do.
|
| We have so many cool unreleased widgets for bits and streams
| that have been dormant because it's not possible to monetize
| them. Twitch could fix this...
| favaq wrote:
| That's cool, "monetising" usually means making the
| experience of viewers worse, so good on Twitch
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