[HN Gopher] DIY triple-screen laptop based on the framework
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DIY triple-screen laptop based on the framework
Author : nicoburns
Score : 177 points
Date : 2023-01-31 12:21 UTC (10 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.youtube.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.youtube.com)
| okasaki wrote:
| How about a framework tablet?
| bastardoperator wrote:
| Super cool, I just ended up buying three monitors.
| MayeulC wrote:
| To my understanding (I've never dug deep into the spec), Display
| Port is packet-based, and every DP interface should support
| tunnelling data for other outputs (DP MST for Multi Stream
| Transport). Does eDP support this? I think a "splitter" could be
| made to connect two more displays using the same 30-pin eDP
| connector, but I'd like someone more knowledgeable to confirm
| this. Some high-resolution panels used to stitch together
| multiple MST panels, so this sounds likely. Additionally, a
| diagram in [1] seems to confirm this.
|
| Of course, the video gets away with very little soldering and
| using only off-the-shelf hardware, which is impressive in itself.
| I couldn't find any such "eDP splitters" or MST hubs, and you'd
| still need the iPad screen controllers.
|
| [1]: https://www.embedded.com/edp-a-better-embedded-display-
| ecosy...
| neilv wrote:
| The ThinkPad W700ds also went with portrait orientation for the
| side display (15 years ago).
|
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6glQCMpqH7M&t=3m40s
|
| It's sorta my dream laptop for asserting dominance in coworking
| cafes.
| esskay wrote:
| Not sure its a laptop at this point. All attempts to a multi-
| screened laptop seem to fail spectacularly and end up far too
| heavy for the brackets, causing it to flop down.
| jasonlotito wrote:
| This is directly addressed multiple times in the video. At the
| start and at the end. I find it amazing you watched the video
| and then decided to post this odd comment.
| esskay wrote:
| I'm aware, it was a general observation based on the
| misleading title.
| SiempreViernes wrote:
| This looks like a cool desktop computer; not sure why he labels a
| computer explicitly designed to _not_ be usable in your lap a
| "laptop".
| vHMtsdf wrote:
| My "laptop" only gets used on desks and my "desktop" sits under
| my table. Go figure..
|
| He calls it a laptop since Framework calls its computers
| "laptops" and the whole setup is battery powered.
| yccs27 wrote:
| This build also folds down and has an integrated keyboard
| like a normal laptop.
| lopis wrote:
| That's why in other languages it's called "notebook computer"
| or "portable computer". "Laptop" never really made sense. No
| one ever used laptops on the lap.
| atdrummond wrote:
| He does address this exact concern in the video. He explains
| that laptops make ergonomic trade offs he isn't amenable to it,
| so the whole point was to build a NON laptop.
| unwind wrote:
| Well. sure, but obviously still keeping the name "laptop" in
| the video title is, as always on the good old 'Tube,
| clickbait.
|
| It's not, uh, intellectually honest to say "here's how to
| build a triple-screen laptop!" and then follow that up with
| "oh, btw, don't use laptops, desktop computers are better for
| you, see?".
|
| All that said, I did enjoy the build and it's really cool to
| see both Framework parts being used as well as of course 3d
| printing. Nice.
| whazor wrote:
| The current YT title "Triple-Screen Laptop DONE RIGHT" is
| still defendable, as it means doing the whole concept of
| 'Triple-Screen Laptop' in a way it is useful. I think the
| biggest issue is the current title on Hacker News: "DIY
| triple-screen laptop based on the framework", as it is
| clearly not a laptop.
| graphe wrote:
| Do you remember what laptops were like? The title of
| "laptop" itself was a lie. You could not put a burning hot
| 12lb electronic on your lap and it was proven to lower
| fertility in men. Only recently has this changed.
| newaccount74 wrote:
| I kinda miss the hot Macbook on my lap, was very cozy on
| the couch on cold winter days.
|
| The new Macbooks feel dead cold.
| jasonlotito wrote:
| I would argue that the name laptop is the idea of a
| portable computer setup. If the suggestion is that a laptop
| is something that is designed to work in your lap, I would
| argue that laptops aren't designed to work in your lap. If
| the argument is the form factor (folding, keyboard, screen,
| mouse), then sure, fine. You can call iPads laptops.
| hellotomyrars wrote:
| Obviously he can build want he wants to the specifications he
| wants and even call it what he wants but if the purpose was
| to not build a laptop because he doesn't like the form factor
| of a laptop why call it a laptop? It just doesn't make sense.
| yccs27 wrote:
| I can understand it insofar that my first association with
| the word "laptop" is the portable computer with integrated
| keyboard that mostly sits on my desk. This build isn't too
| far from that.
| hellotomyrars wrote:
| I suppose I can understand it from the perspective, and
| that is probably the majority of the time a laptop is in
| use, but I also associate a laptop with a self contained
| unit that has all the required input devices and requires
| no additional setup to be usable. Flip it open on a bed,
| anywhere, in a second, including your lap.
|
| I have a ton of general purpose computers that can be set
| up on a desk but are otherwise wildly impractical some
| place like an airplane, or in any kind of moving vehicle.
|
| It is kind of why I still am married to having a
| traditional laptop instead of just using my iPad with a
| keyboard case for example. It just gets more fiddly. I'd
| take my steam deck with me to somewhere I'd be able to
| set up with for non-gaming use but I'd never try to use
| it as a regular computer on a plane or even in a coffee
| shop killing time between appointments or whatever.
|
| We don't do portables/luggable as terminology anymore but
| that is where it breaks for me.
|
| I appreciate you offering that perspective though.
| mbreese wrote:
| I thought it wasn't an effort to make a NON laptop, but
| rather to try to redefine what a laptop should be. Instead of
| having small computers that we can use while it is sitting on
| our laps, we should have a portable computer that is more
| comfortable to use.
|
| Take the part of the laptop that's good (the portability) and
| adapt it to be something that is even better.
|
| We can quibble with if this is a "true" laptop later...
| phowat wrote:
| If I were forced to work in a hot desk arrangement, I'd much
| prefer this to a laptop. I can't stand working on a laptop for
| long periods of time.
| amelius wrote:
| Most laptops are better labeled "lap-heaters" anyway.
| Timshel wrote:
| I can't find any-other term to describe a battery powered
| transportable computer with any SEO relevance. Can you ?
| snozolli wrote:
| This guy also showed how to make an "artificial sun" that's
| proven very helpful to me in Oregon winters:
|
| https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6bqBsHSwPgw
| xbmcuser wrote:
| I like how he uses framework parts to build this. His builds at
| the end always look better than you expect
| xtracto wrote:
| Reminds me a lot of Ben Heck portable projects. I loved reading
| his site back in the day when he made a portable Xbox and
| portable Playstation.
| Steltek wrote:
| Actually, that frightens me. I know of another powerful,
| tested, and DIY friendly compact computer: the Raspberry Pi.
| The Pi got integrated into so many full fledged commercial
| products that it's lost its availability for hackers.
|
| If the Framework mainboard becomes a Super-Pi, will Framework
| owners be able to get the spare parts that they were counting
| on?
| killingtime74 wrote:
| You've stacked quite a few what-ifs on top of each other
| aliqot wrote:
| Pi became unavailable because of their business model, not
| because it got popular and bought out.
| shagie wrote:
| There were a number of challenges that they had. A recent
| update from Dec 12, 2022:
|
| https://www.raspberrypi.com/news/supply-chain-update-its-
| goo...
|
| > Although we are sitting on substantial order backlogs
| from commercial customers, we expect to gradually increase
| the fraction of our output which we dedicate to single-unit
| sales next year until we're back in our pre-pandemic
| situation. The chip allocations we've received for next
| year mean that by the end of the third quarter, the channel
| will have recovered to its equilibrium stocking level, with
| hundreds of thousands of units available at any given time.
| At that point, we will have spent a little over two years
| in a low-stock position: a measure of the severity and
| persistence of the shortages.
| esskay wrote:
| They've not been too truthful with the community over
| their supply chain issues. At the peak they were still
| making north of 100k units a month. It's just that over
| 95% of those were being sold in bulk to direct B2B
| customers whilst they made record profits.
|
| It's been a rough few months to be a pi community member.
| The 'its totally a supply problem, out of our control'
| attitude of the company, and then the uncivil outburst of
| the co-founders wife on the official Pi social accounts
| didn't do them any favours. That one was made worse by
| well known and respected former employees chiming in and
| mentioning that it was how the company was internally
| probably didn't help.
| NoGravitas wrote:
| Was the uncivil outburst in question the attacks on
| people concerned about them hiring a surveillance cop as
| their "maker in residence", or was there another uncivil
| outburst I should know about?
| wkat4242 wrote:
| Yeah they've burned up a lot of goodwill by prioritizing
| integrators so heavily. Not just work there community but
| in Broadcom apparently, according to other comments.
|
| On the other hand expressif is eating their low end, the
| pico was too expensive too late. Perhaps they will make a
| bigger board too. They're much better at integrating with
| the community than Broadcom, they hired community members
| like sprite_tm.
| chriswait wrote:
| I was curious what you were referring to here, and found
| this case study which was interesting:
| https://eiara.nz/posts/2022/Dec/09/a-case-study-on-
| raspberry...
| actionfromafar wrote:
| Explain more, please. I'm sure this is obvious to many, but
| I can only guess. Too much dependency on a single vendor?
| (Broadcom?)
| mbreese wrote:
| If it helps to validate the system, then it can only make the
| company and Framework ecosystem stronger. Supply chain issues
| are they types of problems that Framework would love to have.
| You can solve those... lack of demand is another issue
| entirely.
| nrp wrote:
| We don't foresee any issues continuing to make parts and
| modules available, even with increased demand from module re-
| use projects and products.
|
| In fact, we explicitly encourage this kind of re-use, because
| it benefits everyone. It's a great way to absorb a Mainboard
| that is being upgraded out of a Framework Laptop for example,
| increasing its value for re-sale and avoiding it turning into
| e-waste.
| felixg3 wrote:
| This is wonderful. Thank you for creating Framework and
| making it accessible outside of the United States so early
| on!
| bradwood wrote:
| Here here!
|
| I have 2 Frameworks in my UK household as we speak. And
| when the wife's old Macbook Air gives up the ghost, there
| will be 3.
| monocasa wrote:
| The rumor is that the pi is having issues because Broadcom
| (who actually owns the IP in their chips) is pissed that they
| built a for profit company on top of IP Broadcom donated
| intending to be going to a nonprofit. Rumor is that's also
| why there's no progress on an RPi5, as that would require
| coordination with Broadcom. That would also explain why the
| Pico had no problems being stocked, as it contains no
| Broadcom IP blocks.
|
| I think Framework is probably fine for the foreseeable
| future.
| walterbell wrote:
| If RPi5 has challenges with Broadcom IP licensing, isn't
| that an opportunity to create a new SBC product line
| without Broadcom IP, as many FooPi clones have done?
| monocasa wrote:
| So much about the full RPi is the Broadcom hardware
| blocks though. If software didn't really care about
| those, the FooPi clones would have taken off. Turns out a
| lot of software targeting RPi actually twiddles those
| hardware blocks directly.
| walterbell wrote:
| In that case, Broadcom should be happy that their loss-
| leading IP has created a gigantic market with unfulfilled
| demand. They can negotiate a volume agreement with two
| tiers of product: one for hobbyists, one for commercial
| integrators.
|
| Review existing RPi commercial use cases to identify
| features for product segmentation enhancement. Price RPi
| commercial IP the same as other commercial users of
| Broadcom IP.
| nicoburns wrote:
| They should be. Unfortunately that doesn't mean they will
| be! Broadcom aren't exactly known for an open minded
| approach to IP.
| walterbell wrote:
| They still have time to avoid snatching defeat from the
| jaws of unplanned network-effect victory :)
| wkat4242 wrote:
| As a "community" member I have to say it was annoying when
| they started prioritizing the integrators during the parts
| shortage. It feels more like a generic dev board supplier
| now than an educational / maker focused product.
|
| The compute model in particular was a mistake IMO. I'm sure
| they do great business but their original focus is lost.
| nicoburns wrote:
| My hope is that eventually will get a Raspberry PI (or
| something similarly well supported at a software level)
| based on a RISC V processor that doesn't have these IP
| issues. I guess it might be difficult to do that for things
| like WiFi though.
| monocasa wrote:
| Same. I'm hoping that Pine64's STAR64 fills that space.
| https://wiki.pine64.org/wiki/STAR64
| MrGilbert wrote:
| If you don't know Matt's channel - give it a go. All the projects
| he does have a really, really high level of quality.
| scotty79 wrote:
| Also they are nearly always very original.
| kllrnohj wrote:
| By far my favorite thing about his builds is they are also very
| actually DIY. Like, basic hand tools are all that's required
| most of the time and actually affordable parts. So many
| youtuber "DIY's" are like "today I chucked this into my $10,000
| CNC and printed off this part in my $5,000 3D printer, then
| used this whole-room positional tracking system I had laying
| around to blah blah blah" or "making this awesome unique
| table/whatever with just some old wood found in the forrest!
| And $20,000 in woodworking gear and another $2,000 in resin
| from today's sponsor. But DIY! Just find an old dead tree!"
|
| No machine shop or specialized training or anything to
| replicate the Matt's builds.
| VectorLock wrote:
| Framework should sell a fully integrated portable like this. I
| bet this would be popular with Framework's target market.
| mixedCase wrote:
| They can't even afford to have mass production for 15/16 inch
| laptops, I don't believe such a niche target is within their
| realm of possibility.
| AnEro wrote:
| That's the coolest impractical laptop I've seen.
| bradwood wrote:
| Those spindly legs are like, "WHAT?!"
| AnEro wrote:
| Did not expect it at all, it's so out of place I love it
| Arrath wrote:
| Feels so retro like some piece of furniture I'd have seen
| at my grandparent's house.
| AnEro wrote:
| Thats it!!! I was wondering what vibe it gave, 100% retro
| futurist
| onli wrote:
| I'd say it is not that impractical. Sits somewhere between a
| laptop and an ITX build, self-contained but needing table. I
| thought that was the most impressive part.
| AnEro wrote:
| Great portable computer don't get me wrong. I'd make it
| impractical in different ways
| photonbucket wrote:
| This would be great for an office commuter, bring it with you
| between home/work, but don't actually use it as a laptop
| amelius wrote:
| Why not buy two computers? Your boss will probably pay for
| both.
| nicoburns wrote:
| It's quite a pain to keep two computers in sync. You don't
| want to end up blocked on a task because you forgot to push
| your changes.
|
| I'm also pretty sure that no company I have worked for would
| have paid for me to have two company computers.
| petodo wrote:
| That's not a laptop, but portable (desktop) all-in-one computer.
|
| Laptops should have keyboard and everything in one portable
| package, this is unusable without external keyboard and doesn't
| have built-in keyboard, thus it's NOT laptop.
|
| And I don't care what he says in video, title is clickbait.
| onli wrote:
| All-in-one computers usually don't have a battery, do they?
| petodo wrote:
| Well technically all motherboards have one...
| samaybhavsar wrote:
| I feel this technique could be really useful. As a developer, I
| am okay to carry a box instead of a laptop as this would enhance
| the productivity. I was actually thinking of buying the 14"
| screen from lenovo. This concept reminds me of Kavad which is a
| box with multiple fold used for story telling.
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