[HN Gopher] As Gen X and Boomers Age, They Confront Living Alone
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As Gen X and Boomers Age, They Confront Living Alone
Author : wallflower
Score : 43 points
Date : 2022-11-27 18:41 UTC (4 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.nytimes.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.nytimes.com)
| WBrentWilliams wrote:
| I look at this issue and see a market failure. Maybe it is not
| corporately profitable to provide the pile of services that a
| population aging in place need (welfare checks, transportation,
| food, housing...) but it should be possible to build the
| infrastructure to create the raft out of parts of a solution.
| Maybe a mix of formal (paid-for) and informal (volunteer, value-
| add) services. I see this as a necessity for people that do not
| at the moment face this "cliff". After all, spouses die, children
| leave and/or live far away. Any person in a stable situation at
| the moment could easily find themselves in need of these
| services.
| mahathu wrote:
| > That shift presents issues on housing, health care and personal
| finance.
|
| I wonder why it leaves out the adverse effects on mental health
| of living alone, which are arguably the worst of the bunch.
| toomuchtodo wrote:
| From the piece:
|
| > But while many people in their 50s and 60s thrive living
| solo, research is unequivocal that people aging alone
| experience worse physical and mental health outcomes and
| shorter life spans.
| EasyTiger_ wrote:
| Why does US media seem to get a stiffy out of others' despair?
| aliqot wrote:
| Devils advocate for the sake of debate: We're breaking a lot of
| relationship norms in the recent generations, why shouldn't being
| married in a nuclear arrangement be one of those?
| jasmer wrote:
| That norm is definitely mostly broken. While I suppose we
| should always question old norms, we probably should apply at
| least as much scrutiny to new ideals as well. Despite some
| gains here and there (and some of it irretrievably important),
| I don't think we've really figured it out on the social front
| at all, and we're losing almost as much as we are gaining.
| [deleted]
| hn_throwaway_99 wrote:
| But you aren't really advocating for anything. "Breaking a lot
| of norms recently" isn't really an argument, unless you have
| some specific argument for _why_ lots of elderly people living
| alone is a good thing.
| [deleted]
| shortcake27 wrote:
| It's very common for the older generation to persist in toxic
| relationships, because a) "till death do us part" and b)
| anyone who didn't want a nuclear family was "not normal".
| Modern generations are realising they don't need to live a
| life they don't enjoy, which leads to more isolation. I would
| rather live alone than live in a bad relationship. Not saying
| this is the sole cause, but it would definitely be a factor.
| RosanaAnaDana wrote:
| We need a version of hackernews that dismisses paywalled/
| adwalled/ crap walled content.
| johnea wrote:
| The new york times is easily read by disabling all javascript
| and cookies...
| johnea wrote:
| Which is really the way you should surf the intertubes
| anyway.
|
| Do you just enjoy being a (lonely) data harvesting resource?
| RosanaAnaDana wrote:
| I think the broader point is to prevent them from getting in
| front of eyeballs in the first place. If a view of hackernews
| is available where paywalled content can't make it to the
| top, this puts the onus on people promoting paywalls to
| change their behavior.
| pessimizer wrote:
| > this puts the onus on people promoting paywalls to change
| their behavior.
|
| The amount of onus this delivers has to be calculated using
| infinitesimals. Especially compared to the amount of money
| delivered by paying subscribers.
| mellosouls wrote:
| It would also be nice if the original submitter (especially
| frequent ones, who should know better, tho this isn't aimed at
| anybody in particular including the op) make the effort to post
| a non-paywalled link at the same time in the first comment
| rather than the "hit-and-run" approach of many of them. Or if
| it's a common news story then post from another site instead.
| slang800 wrote:
| I'd be happy with a browser extension that replaces all the
| paywalled links on HN with archive links.
| dash2 wrote:
| I'll try out an extreme point of view here. Modern culture has
| failed, we need to replace it. One third of 50 year olds living
| alone is as good a symptom as any. You could mention the birth
| rate also. The two are obviously connected.
|
| Am I right? Is that too nuts? I just don't see how this ends
| well. We have effectively socialized old age care, and now we are
| expecting future generations, an ever-shrinking group, to pay for
| the pensions of people they have never met.
| copperx wrote:
| I wouldn't go as far, but certainly, the death of the multi-
| generational household has brought tragic consequences.
| api wrote:
| I have a multi generational household right now with my
| father staying in our finished basement. It's working out
| very well, but we also have a fairly big house in the
| Midwest. I'm not sure it could work for us in a small place.
| It'd be hard for my wife and I to have a relationship or any
| intimacy.
|
| Other cultures deal with this though. I'm sure it can be
| done. There's ways to build privacy into a small place. Did
| it in college. But it would require some changes to how we
| expect to use the space, something more like a dorm with
| common areas than a traditional house.
| whynotminot wrote:
| > We have effectively socialized old age care, and now we are
| expecting future generations, an ever-shrinking group, to pay
| for the pensions of people they have never met.
|
| In some form or fashion, this is how things have always worked.
| The young take care of the old. It's not really a problem, so
| long as you have enough young folks around.
|
| I think your first paragraph is right--modern culture is
| failing at giving humans the connection they need. That's the
| real problem we need to figure out. Taking care of old people
| is just always going to be A Thing We Have To Do until we all
| get issued a robot or whatever.
| aliqot wrote:
| We're also perpetuating values like fierce independence. This
| has an effect as everyone is focused on me-me-me rather than
| finding a mate. To this style of rhetoric, finding a mate is
| succumbing to the status quo, and surrendering to common
| relationship ideals.
| thechao wrote:
| Isn't this a self-correcting phenomenon in the long-run?
| api wrote:
| Modern culture makes it easier than ever for people to reach
| each other but it also makes it easy for people to isolate
| and live alone.
|
| Quite a few people seem to choose the latter even though it
| usually makes people less happy and less fulfilled.
|
| Or... does it? I know more than one person who lives alone
| because they got too tired of drama.
|
| I don't live alone but have a pretty good relationship with
| my SO. If I had a bad one and could not repair it, living
| alone may be preferable.
| la64710 wrote:
| You have to make a small distinction between groups that are
| alone and unhappy AND groups that are alone to be happy.
|
| To each his own I say.
| dash2 wrote:
| Sure. Are most people single in their 50s by choice, as in
| they would prefer that to being in a relationship with
| children? I doubt it. Even if they are, if they're relying on
| being supported by the next generation, that is still leaning
| on outsiders, and the outcome may be quite disappointing.
| la64710 wrote:
| Nothing happens without reason and some of those reasons
| maybe due to choices made earlier in life. Take
| responsibility for those choices , and most importantly if
| someone is feeling lonely please consider to wholeheartedly
| getting involved in volunteering and helping others. It is
| not a replacement for a relationship but it opens doors to
| human connections. Life is impermanent , we come alone and
| go alone , whatever time you find in this planet try
| whatever ways you can connect to others.
| pessimizer wrote:
| You don't really. You just have to make the assumptions that
| 1) the proportion between the two groups isn't radically
| increasing recently in favor of people who want to be alone,
| and 2) that when a higher proportion of people who are alone
| report being sad about that and sadder and sicker in general
| as compared to people who are not, they're not trying to
| trick you.
| newaccount2021 wrote:
| throwaway128128 wrote:
| Denmark's got a great solution: https://journal.theaou.org/news-
| and-reviews/the-popularity-o...
|
| Too bad such a thing would be deemed "socialist" in the US.
| shagie wrote:
| Gift link: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/11/27/us/living-alone-
| aging.htm...
| slang800 wrote:
| https://archive.ph/SxVta
| [deleted]
| johnea wrote:
| _trackno5 wrote:
| heh, it sounds funny when you put it that way, but some people
| legitimately have a hard time socialising and forming deep
| connections with others.
|
| Doubt it's a new thing, but maybe it gets exacerbated nowadays
| with everyone being online all the time.
| jleyank wrote:
| Must be an extrovert. It's easy to be lonely in a crowd and in
| fact the crowd having strong interactions can drive it home.
| Different strokes, eh. Be empathetic with those unlike
| yourself.
| slang800 wrote:
| It's hard to be sympathetic when these boomers choose to be
| alone, not marry, and not have kids. What did they think was
| going to happen when they got old?
| woofyman wrote:
| Spouses die. Children move away.
| [deleted]
| wwweston wrote:
| Not nearly as pathetic as assuming that the 8 billion are (a)
| essentially fungible from a relationship standpoint (b) equally
| eager to engage in a relationship with anyone who likes (c)
| within reasonable proximity and that's just a start of the
| assumptions you probably didn't even do enough thinking to know
| that you thoughtlessly made.
|
| On the plus side, coming in hot with a low-value comment
| frosted with general contempt for an entire class of people
| _does_ narrow down where in the 8 billion people someone might
| look for rewarding companionship by at least a value of one, or
| provide you with the opportunity to bask in the kind of
| disagreeable engagement and connection you seem to have
| indicated you prefer, so I guess that 's kindof nice.
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