[HN Gopher] The Voyage of Life
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The Voyage of Life
Author : benbreen
Score : 157 points
Date : 2022-11-26 05:49 UTC (17 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (en.wikipedia.org)
(TXT) w3m dump (en.wikipedia.org)
| SCUSKU wrote:
| Thanks for posting this OP. I can particularly relate to the
| Manhood painting right now. I have found many difficulties amid
| the layoffs. It is a great reminder that others have suffered and
| struggled just like me, and that this is all part of the human
| experience.
|
| If you'll excuse religion in this secular space, I believe the
| best thing I can do to help maintain good mental health is to
| simply accept that many things are out of my control, and that I
| must submit myself to the divine, and accept that whatever
| happens is what has been chosen for me. Which is not to abdicate
| self-determination, only to accept that I can't control
| everything.
| billjings wrote:
| No decent, intellectually curious person should deny religious
| perspectives in topics like this. Religious writing is
| literally the prior art here, and still where one can find the
| richest live discourse.
| sneak wrote:
| I think perhaps it is offensive to claim that decent and
| intellectual people cannot reject religious fairy tales. This
| sort of grandfathering in of the legitimacy of the belief in
| the supernatural is... illogical, to use a charitable term.
| tsol wrote:
| >reject religious fairy tales
|
| I find the bad faith arguments exhausting. If you won't
| even acknowledge that not all religions are like
| Christianity and involve a God, then I has l can have this
| conversation in the comments section of YouTube.
|
| As an aside, I'm a Muslim. It's a sad development that the
| liberal atheists that used to be my biggest allies, but as
| of late Ive received more criticism from liberals than
| conservatives. That stuff is regularly on the front page of
| reddit now
| mistermann wrote:
| Most everyone believes in the supernatural in one way or
| another, it is fundamental to human consciousness and
| culture.
|
| Take for example this: "religious fairy tales" - now,
| perhaps your categorization of what is and is not a
| religious fairy tale is logically & epistemically perfect,
| but it is certainly not true of all people who say or
| believe such things, something I know from extensive
| experience conversing with atheists, scientific
| materialists, etc. I've also noticed that people have a
| tendency to judge the cognitive errors committed by those
| within their ingroup more charitably than those who are in
| their outgroups - not a particularly rational behavior, and
| plausibly a decent way to form incorrect beliefs, yet few
| have any interest in the phenomenon, especially sometimes.
| TheCache wrote:
| I don't think "grandfathering in" beliefs is the
| supernatural is what is being said here. Rather, it is
| commenting that one should not ignore centuries of
| religious perspectives in art and literature. One does not
| have to be religious to appreciate some of the writings
| about the human soul and the human condition that have come
| from religious thinkers.
| Swizec wrote:
| The fairy tales of religion are a narrative device for the
| very valid philosophical teachings. The idea that you can't
| control everything is core to many secular life
| philosophies.
|
| Stoics say things happen, but you can control your
| reactions. Comedians say shit happens, but you can laugh
| about it. Religious folk say events occur, but it's god's
| plan. Buddhists say reality doesn't care about you, but you
| can accept that it is what it is. Even poker players say
| that you gotta play the cards you have, not the cards you
| wish you had.
|
| All the same. Don't let the framing distract you from the
| insight.
| billjings wrote:
| It's fine and defensible to reject the religious
| perspective, but to refuse to admit religious perspectives
| to the discourse at all is to take pride in ignorance.
|
| In the Christian faith alone, there are over two thousand
| years worth of literature to contend with, much of it
| concerned with evergreen concerns like how to be a decent
| person or what our relationship to be to money and
| possessions should be. That literature is being added to
| every week: fresh sermons, both populist and abstruse, are
| written and delivered every week.
|
| Rejection of the keystone of that writing is something I
| disagree with, but not on any rational basis. Many who do
| so, however, also admit into their own hearts and minds a
| false caricature of the religious intellectual tradition.
| And that is well worth knocking down.
| jasonwatkinspdx wrote:
| I received as much education concerning Christianity as I
| desire in the first two decades of my life. There is no
| fruit of that tree that will result in learning for me at
| this point and much of it that is pure poison.
|
| The bigotry of our evangelical childhood is a big part of
| why my brother killed himself as a successful adult and
| father.
|
| I don't need patronizing characterization of my rejection
| as willful ignorance. I am not ignorant, merely decided.
| If you wish to continue to follow those dialogs do so,
| but drop the superiority.
| billjings wrote:
| I'm sorry for the loss of your brother.
|
| We're already well off the rails of the original post
| here, but I do want to say that I share your anger at
| evangelicalism. Their fundamentalism has made the name of
| Christianity synonymous with hate and corruption in the
| US. So...you will find company in your anger with us,
| too.
| TheCache wrote:
| I traveled through and am still in a wholly unexpected series
| of changes recently and found James Hollis' book "Living
| Between Worlds" to be a fantastic study about living through
| the uncertainty and outside-of-our-control changes that often
| happen during the adulthood period alluded to in these
| paintings.
| rubicon33 wrote:
| I sometimes wonder if struggle is necessary for joy.
|
| What if we had no struggle, and everything we wanted we
| instantly had?
|
| Something tells me that life would be zapped of its meaning and
| pleasure.
|
| Suffering, even pain, are like the opposite side of the same
| coin. You can't have one without the other, so when facing
| struggles, try to view it as such; the necessary component in a
| fulfilling life.
| somesortofthing wrote:
| > Suffering, even pain, are like the opposite side of the
| same coin. You can't have one without the other, so when
| facing struggles, try to view it as such; the necessary
| component in a fulfilling life.
|
| This is true to some limited extent, but it seems wrong to
| think of the distinction between happiness is suffering as
| entirely or even mostly about contrast.
|
| For example, consider a person who has, through some
| combination of disability, misfortune, and the malice of
| others, never had any positive moments in their entire life.
| If you had the power to do so, would it be unnecessary to
| help them out of their situation? After all, they have no
| happy memories to contrast their situation against. If you
| can't guarantee that they won't return to their previous
| situation, a contrast-based view implies that you would
| actually be doing harm by putting their past and future
| suffering into perspective.
|
| When you have no say over what happens to you, contrasting a
| painful present with a pleasant past is a valuable coping
| mechanism, but it's also important to not justify
| suffering(especially the suffering of others) on such grounds
| in general terms.
|
| To be clear, I'm not accusing you of doing that, just talking
| about what I've heard from other people on the topic.
| mdturnerphys wrote:
| Since others have brought up religion already, I'll mention
| that your thoughts here are very similar to a passage in the
| Book of Mormon, 2 Nephi 2:11-12 (https://www.churchofjesuschr
| ist.org/study/scriptures/bofm/2-...).
| dfee wrote:
| Hacker News: where I come for tech and stay for culture.
|
| Enjoyed the read. Thank you for posting OP.
| brador wrote:
| The fact that something this important is represented on
| Wikipedia as a blurred gif of indeterminate length and not 4
| clickable thumbnails that change a main image makes me angry.
| svantana wrote:
| Did you know that wikipedia can be edited by anyone, even you
| or me? Also, the individual images are shown below.
| yunruse wrote:
| I think in a sense this adds its own sort of artistic value:
| life and time do not wait for us.
| davepeck wrote:
| These four paintings alone are sufficient reason to visit the
| National Gallery if you find yourself in DC.
| Dalewyn wrote:
| >the romantic beauty of youthful imaginings, when the mind
| elevates the mean and common into the magnificent, before
| experience teaches what is the Real.
|
| I'm at that stage of life right now, learning that many of the
| ideals fed into young minds like I once was were, in fact, just
| ideals and practically irrelevant to the road of life ahead. That
| the world of humanity is, in fact, not rainbows and unicorns but
| vicious and uncaring.
|
| The eloquence of his message strikes deep.
| rs_rs_rs_rs_rs wrote:
| Though do keep in mind the world of humanity is the LEAST
| vicious and uncaring from the worlds out there!
| mjklin wrote:
| Cole has a similar series about the rise and fall of the Roman
| Empire:
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Course_of_Empire_(painting...
| ekianjo wrote:
| Amazing paintings!
| fhkatari wrote:
| As a non-Christian, I highly recommend the writings of Franciscan
| priest Richard Rohr, and his metaphor of 'Two Halves of Lives'.
| The specific title of the book is 'Falling Upward'.
| nelblu wrote:
| This reminds me of the stages of life as described in Hinduism -
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C4%80%C5%9Brama_%28stage%29?w....
| Not quite the same but interesting to see how different
| mythologies have their own interpretation of life.
| [deleted]
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(page generated 2022-11-26 23:02 UTC)