[HN Gopher] Simplicity and Survival
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       Simplicity and Survival
        
       Author : bobnamob
       Score  : 28 points
       Date   : 2022-09-03 07:41 UTC (1 days ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (borretti.me)
 (TXT) w3m dump (borretti.me)
        
       | chubot wrote:
       | There are some true observations here, but the real problem is
       | that simple languages are often not very productive / useful, and
       | languages become more complex when people use them (demanding
       | features)
       | 
       | Otherwise SML would be fine, and there's no need for OCaml
       | 
       | Otherwise Scheme would be fine, and there's no need for Common
       | Lisp
       | 
       | Otherwise C would be fine, and there's no need for C++ or Rust
       | (or Austral or whatever)
       | 
       | ----
       | 
       | I think a better way of framing it is how much useful
       | functionality you can put in a language while still feeling
       | "simple", or at least familiar.
       | 
       | There is only limited syntactic space, and features tend to
       | interact with combinatorial explosions, so more features
       | definitely weigh down a language.
       | 
       | ----
       | 
       | Another strategy is the "simple core" language, leaving most
       | stuff to libraries. But you have to only look at JS to see how
       | that complexity pops up elsewhere often in greater form (in the
       | package manager)
       | 
       | Likewise look at C++ 20 coroutines or just STL in general ...
       | there is a limited amount in the core, and a bunch of hooks for
       | the user, but it is awfully complex as a whole.
        
         | [deleted]
        
       | koeng wrote:
       | This is one reason I really like lua - it is a simple enough
       | language that it can stand the test of time, while being easy
       | enough to learn by anyone, and still being stupid fast with
       | luajit. A great little language, especially when combined with
       | teal.
        
       | tromp wrote:
       | This makes me feel good about the survival odds of binary lambda
       | calculus [1]
       | 
       | [1] https://www.ioccc.org/2012/tromp/hint.html
        
       | neojebfkekeej wrote:
       | How does PHP / Ruby fare?
        
         | legulere wrote:
         | PHP has Facebook invested in heavily.
        
       | zh3 wrote:
       | I guess C would be hard-lower-left on the final table; makes me
       | think what are the candidates for upper-right.
        
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       (page generated 2022-09-04 23:01 UTC)