[HN Gopher] Mimetic Traps
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       Mimetic Traps
        
       Author : herbertl
       Score  : 47 points
       Date   : 2022-08-29 04:34 UTC (1 days ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (www.briantimar.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (www.briantimar.com)
        
       | thenerdhead wrote:
       | Your current job/profession/career can be seen as an investment
       | to your dreams.
       | 
       | You can find meaning in just about anything if you try hard
       | enough.
       | 
       | Getting on twitter is the opposite of avoiding the mimetic trap
       | though.
        
       | JasonFruit wrote:
       | I agree with a lot of this article, but much of the suggested
       | action at the end strikes me as flawed.
       | 
       | > Don't force yourself to do anything you hate. If you get too
       | good at this, you won't be able to figure out when to quit.
       | 
       | I'd moderate this a bit. Maybe, "If you are forcing yourself to
       | do what you hate, step back and think: is the goal worth the slog
       | to me?"
       | 
       | > Be suspicious of roles that compensate you with status or non-
       | financial rewards.
       | 
       | This is the worst, to me. Purely financial motivation is one of
       | the surest ways to be trapped in a role you hate. Make sure what
       | you do offers you personal and social rewards that you value.
       | 
       | > Join Twitter -- there's no better way to reduce tunnel vision.
       | 
       | Twitter is the most awful social-pressure tool ever created.
       | Please, I beg of you, do not join Twitter!
        
         | zdragnar wrote:
         | >> Be suspicious of roles that compensate you with status or
         | non-financial rewards.
         | 
         | > This is the worst, to me. Purely financial motivation is one
         | of the surest ways to be trapped in a role you hate. Make sure
         | what you do offers you personal and social rewards that you
         | value.
         | 
         | Money is fungible for a great many things in life- the risk you
         | take working for other things (ideals, status, etc) is that, if
         | you become disillusioned, you're left with nothing.
         | 
         | This has happened to friends of mine in social work. They
         | believed they could make a difference, went through all the
         | hoops, kept up with the continuing education and licensing
         | requirements (not covered by the state, obviously) and after
         | years completely disillusioned from the bureaucracy and human
         | nature.
        
           | [deleted]
        
         | Lacerda69 wrote:
         | I agreed with all his points but the Twitter one.
         | 
         | Alternatively I would propose to work a job in a wildly
         | different field for a few months, for example waiting tables,
         | in a grocery or at a recycling company. Your horizon will be
         | exploded by the people you meet and work with.
        
         | munificent wrote:
         | I came here to post the same comment about financial
         | compensation.
         | 
         | Focusing on money is just another mimetic trap (though one with
         | very nice side effects). There are a _lot_ of dudes in our
         | demographic hitting their thirties and realizing in despair
         | that they are financially comfortable and yet their life feels
         | utterly empty and meaningless.
         | 
         | The best metric I know to avoid this trap is that the things I
         | spend my time on should scratch at least one of:
         | 
         | 1. Be relaxing, enjoyable, or personally rewarding. It should
         | help me recharge and unwind to prepare for the rest of this
         | list.
         | 
         | 2. Gain or improve a useful skill that I can then apply to the
         | last item on this list.
         | 
         | 3. Benefit other people.
         | 
         | In other words, be healthy so that I can be effective so that I
         | can be helpful. When I stay centered on this (without obsessing
         | about it), I'm generally happy with how I spend my time.
         | 
         |  _> Twitter is the most awful social-pressure tool ever
         | created._
         | 
         | Twitter, perhaps to a larger degree than any other social
         | network, is whatever you make it into. Yes, if you follow a
         | bunch of hustle-culture drones (or people who retweet that),
         | your feed will make you miserable. Follow different people and
         | you'll get a totally different Twitter. My feed is generally
         | nourishing, supportive, and rewarding, though it takes fairly
         | frequent gardening to keep it such.
        
           | joshlemer wrote:
           | I focus on money now, in early/mid career, so that in the
           | future I'll have total freedom to do whatever I want.
        
             | munificent wrote:
             | Then the odds are good that you are already falling into
             | the mimetic trap I'm describing.
        
               | balfirevic wrote:
               | The article describes mimetic trap as "it hurts to leave,
               | and there's nowhere to go".
               | 
               | Being able to retire at the middle of the career sounds
               | like the opposite of that.
        
               | JasonFruit wrote:
               | Will you, or will the urge to make more take over? I
               | don't know you, so I can't assume, but I've heard a lot
               | more people talk about retiring at 40 than do it when
               | they could.
        
         | smlacy wrote:
         | Joining/using Twitter is in direct conflict with the first goal
         | of "Don't force yourself to do anything you hate"
        
         | dnissley wrote:
         | I've found twitter to be a kind of mimetic testing ground where
         | you can put your mastery of certain mimetic forces to the test.
         | Not sure what the ultimate test is, I think it might be to quit
         | completely, but without skipping the test of becoming a user --
         | there's a lot to be learned in going through that wringer.
        
       | dkural wrote:
       | This also speaks to a certain lack of inspiration/creativity. A
       | lot of people who end up in graduate school are great at
       | following a prescribed academic path and getting good grades etc.
       | but when confronted with the prospect of original research might
       | find themselves lacking. A lot of top scientists, like the great
       | artists, writers etc. can't help themselves but think about or
       | work on their field. Grothendieck disappeared to live in a
       | cottage, but still produced thousands of page of handwritten
       | notes of highly original mathematics.
        
       | woliveirajr wrote:
       | [2019], the twitter list is gone...
        
       | xhevahir wrote:
       | Is there any explanation for the frequent Rene Girard references
       | on HN besides the influence of Peter Thiel? It's odd. I'm not all
       | that familiar with his work but in most circles you're probably
       | more likely to see names like Charles Taylor, Alasdair MacIntyre,
       | et al.
        
         | boucher wrote:
         | There's a good (and short) book about the history of Silicon
         | Valley cultural and philosophical influences that I found quite
         | interesting:
         | 
         | https://us.macmillan.com/books/9780374721237/whattechcallsth...
        
       | mjburgess wrote:
       | The book "actionable gamification" talks about different sources
       | of "core motivation". The author gives 8 typical sources, of
       | which "social reinforcement" iirc, is one. (I found them all
       | quite poorly named).
       | 
       | In any case, they provide a lens on building productive and
       | rewarding systems. One observation is that these "extrinsic"
       | motivators, alone, leave people unhappy (but engaged, until they
       | arent).
       | 
       | What we appear to have here is a "social proof addiction trap",
       | in the manner in which gambling is a "curiosity addiction trap".
        
       | convolvatron wrote:
        
       | DFHippie wrote:
       | The competitiveness and status striving are what drove me out of
       | academia. I wanted to be there because I liked playing with
       | ideas. It was the people who were driven there by their
       | competitive impulse that poisoned it for me. That and the zero-
       | sum nature of the game: the overproduction of candidates for a
       | fixed number of positions, which forced everyone into the same
       | mindset, where you'd be lucky if in the end you landed with a job
       | in some place you'd rather not be mostly doing stuff other than
       | what you wanted to do in the first place.
        
       | jongjong wrote:
       | I think I may have the opposite problem. I have contrarian
       | tendencies. I have a strong natural desire to argue against group
       | consensus. When I see too many people agreeing about something to
       | the point that they're not really thinking anymore, I have to
       | take the opposite side. I also generally dislike the kinds of
       | people who always jump on the latest social bandwagon and support
       | the current thing. I can't stand people who can't think for
       | themselves and yet are aggressive when it comes to spreading
       | whatever ideas authority figures have managed to implant into
       | their minds.
       | 
       | It makes no sense to me why someone would spend so much energy
       | and invest so much of their ego into an idea which not only they
       | didn't come up with but which they haven't even bothered to
       | analyze from first principles.
       | 
       | It disturbs me that people can be at once so malleable to the
       | will of authority figures and yet so rigid and stubbornly
       | resistant to basic reasoning.
        
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