[HN Gopher] Citroen 2cv pages
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Citroen 2cv pages
Author : dayve
Score : 69 points
Date : 2022-07-31 18:50 UTC (4 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.citrobe.org)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.citrobe.org)
| Normille wrote:
| Ah. Memories. I actually learned to drive in a 2CV. Brilliant wee
| motors. I'd love to have one again. Just to play around in.
| Gordonjcp wrote:
| I once beat a colleague of mine driving is Porsche 911 Turbo in
| an impromptu street race in a deserted semi-demolished housing
| scheme somewhere in central Scotland, in an elderly Citroen
| Dyane.
|
| Yup. With its 602cc engine, it absolutely wiped the floor with
| the 911. Totally unfair fight, fully 30 seconds faster per mile.
|
| I probably shouldn't have goaded him into the bits that still had
| speed bumps, eh?
| nwatson wrote:
| Those 2CV are very light. My family were passengers in a drive
| from Santiago to Valparaiso (Chile) in someone's American
| station-wagon when a 2CV tried to cross in front of us. We hit
| them and a passenger from that other vehicle got pinned under the
| top-of-door frame when the 2CV toppled over. My one-armed dad
| managed to tilt the vehicle off them so they could be pulled out.
| She didn't seem extremely hurt.
| bufordtwain wrote:
| The 2CV is an interesting car to drive. It has very little power
| and the gear stick pokes out of the dashboard. It's a comfortable
| ride and you can peel back the cloth roof cover on a sunny day.
| Unfortunately it's not great at protecting the occupants in the
| event of a crash. Its doors are really thin and there are no air
| bags. Its design is very simple. Here is a video of a 2CV being
| dismantled and reassembled in 5 minutes by a few people:
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mo1Z5072xr4
| jacquesm wrote:
| That's a funny video, but I suspect a lot of the parts were
| already disconnected, I've rebuilt the gearbox on one and
| getting the engine out took a lot longer than that!
| wafriedemann wrote:
| Very cool. Would be even better if they included pricing.
| jacquesm wrote:
| 2CV: 4500 dutch guilders, Dyane 4800, AMI 6250, GS 8000,
| D-Special 12000, DS 17000.
|
| For French Francs multiply by three or so, German Marks divide
| by 1.10.
|
| I was in a crash in a 2CV, it was my first car and after that
| never got into another one. The damage was incredible given the
| kind of accident it was.
| Svip wrote:
| I've been a big fan of Citroens for a long time, but I cannot
| quite get the 2CV. I get it's cute, but I think the Dyane is
| actually cuter. I can see how it lives up to Andre Citroen's
| 1930s vision, but what has always truly captured me is the
| engineering in the hydropneumatic suspension.
|
| Fortunately, my first car was (and is) a Citroen DS 23. I
| have not tried Citroen's new suspension (seems to be limited
| so far to the kind of car, I don't particularly care for),
| partly because I've grown disgruntled with Citroen since
| about the time PSA (or whatever they are called now) started
| the DS brand, but I really ought to.
| jacquesm wrote:
| The 2CV makes perfect sense if you look at why it was
| designed: 'an umbrella with wheels'.
|
| The Dyane is much better as a car but it was also a bit
| more expensive and people really loved the 2CV for its
| lines and thought the Dyane to be too blockish.
|
| My second car was a DS (a DS 21 to be precise), I loved it
| and ended up touring the former east bloc with it (and
| ended up living in Poland because of it).
| Svip wrote:
| Was your DS 21 pre- or post-1968? Basically, did it have
| the red or the green fluid? I once drove mine from
| Denmark to Provence and back again, it was an experience,
| and not without problems (it started to leak around
| Paris). I am not sure I would make that big of a trip in
| it again (although, some part of me hopes I will). Since
| those days, I've mostly made the big trips in my '98
| Xantia.
| jacquesm wrote:
| Green. It was one of the latest made (1974).
|
| I've done plenty of really long trips with it (many
| thousands of km), but I did replace all of the accessible
| high pressure LHM tubing at some point to get rid of the
| periodical 'Arret!' light on the dash because the system
| lost pressure. I can also tell you from experience that
| trying to drive a DS without pressure is both an art and
| a body building exercise at once.
|
| Xantia is a great compromise between 'modern' and 'old
| fashioned', a bit plasticy but the one I had I drove into
| the ground over many 100's of thousands of km. The final
| nail in that particular coffin was to lose the headgasket
| somewhere between Munich and NL and just continuing the
| trip, it even got decent fuel economy but it wouldn't
| start up after being shut down and once we looked into
| the engine it was declared a miracle that it made it all
| the way back. Great car, all around and given the
| distances covered ultra reliable.
|
| The real problem in the DS model is the semi-automatic
| gearbox which is super finicky regarding hydraulics
| levels (you'll notice a ticking sound when it is trying
| to engage and can't quite make it due to a lack of fluid,
| you can temporarily fix that under the hood by forcibly
| actuating it but driving it like that is really not
| recommended. Nor is driving it when one of your drive
| shafts breaks and you block up that side of the drive
| train. Nice low engine revs though, we jokingly called it
| 'economy mode'.
|
| I also had an ID-19, a simpler but altogether far more
| robust car.
| TedDoesntTalk wrote:
| The 2CV always seemed like a death trap to me. It could not
| get approved in the USA for import; I'm guessing because of
| safety regulations...although no Citroen cars were available
| in the US at all.
| Svip wrote:
| Citroen sold cars in the US till around 1975, when the US
| introduced regulations that essentially prohibited the
| hydropneumatic suspension. Citroen even had US spec
| versions of the DS and the SM for the US market.
|
| I am not sure whether the 2CV was ever sold in the USA, but
| it has definitely been imported. I think in the US, the
| limit is 25 years before you can import a foreign car. I've
| encountered plenty of 2CVs and Meharis in North America.
| jacquesm wrote:
| I've seen a DS in Canada, but only once. (Toronto)
| Svip wrote:
| Speaking of Toronto, I once had the pleasure of being
| driven around the city in a Mehari.
| jacquesm wrote:
| I hope it was in summer :)
| jacquesm wrote:
| In US traffic an accident between your average 60's US
| built car and a 2CV would amount to a death sentence for
| the occupants of the 2CV.
| masklinn wrote:
| Afaik it could be sold in the US just fine (this is a car
| created in 1948, safety regulations were not really a
| thing).
|
| The issue is that it could not be _sold_ : it was
| particularly low-powered even for french cars of the time,
| the original model barely reached 40 mph (out of a 9 hp
| engine), and the later fastest models topped out around 70.
|
| The 2CV had literally been designed to cross freshly
| ploughed fields and drive on unpaved roads, it just was not
| suitable for the interstate-expanding American market.
| jacquesm wrote:
| I had one of the faster models but even those could not
| reliably overtake a truck, chances are that when you
| tried to come out ahead of the lee of the truck you'd be
| blown back. More than once I had to sheepishly fall back
| all 60 feet to go back behind and let others pass.
| adhesive_wombat wrote:
| Not car-specific but I do miss the days of huge paper catalogues.
| The multi-volume RS ones were great, but the real joy was
| something arcane like an optics, RF or connector company.
|
| I was convinced to throw away my relatively small and likely
| valueless but prized collection to well-intentioned
| "decluttering" when I moved to my own house. The thing is, they
| actually did spark joy, as Marie Kondo would say.
|
| Also data books. Sure, electronic formats are objectively better
| in nearly every sense from weight, dead tree count and Ctrl-F-
| ability, but nothing says you know what you're about better than
| a well-thumbed Philips data book.
| Gordonjcp wrote:
| I have a couple of volumes of RS data sheets sitting on the
| shelf in my shed, that I cannot bear to throw out. Yours if you
| want 'em.
| jansan wrote:
| Did the 2CV have a nickname in other countries? Here in Germany
| it was called "the duck" ("die Ente"). Oooh, that suspension,
| great memories :)
| jacquesm wrote:
| Same here in NL 'de eend'. There's a whole raft of wordplay
| jokes on that name.
|
| As for the suspension, it's the only car that you can scrape
| the mirrors with while it's still on all four wheels ;)
| m2fkxy wrote:
| in French, "la Deudeuche" [de-duhsh], for a very roughly
| approximated anglicised pronunciation ([do.doS] is the proper
| IPA, but I feel like it wouldn't resonate with everyone... at
| least I would have no idea).
|
| short for "deux chevaux", i.e. ... 2CV.
| forinti wrote:
| I heard a joke in Uruguay that they were called "pedo" (fart)
| because only the owner could like it.
| throwaway744678 wrote:
| In french, it is pronounced "2 chevaux", as in "2 horses"
| (horsepower), abbreviated "deuche", or "dodoche"
| shrx wrote:
| In Slovenia it's called "spacek" - a diminutive masculine form
| of "spaka", i.e. "monstrosity".
| haunter wrote:
| The GSA had a beautiful dashboard
| https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FL0xd9wXMAAdIm8.jpg
| rz2k wrote:
| That instrument control looks inspired by a Curta[1] mechanical
| calculator.
|
| [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curta
| userbinator wrote:
| Definitely has the "futuristic 80s" look. I think that style
| lasted into the mid 90s and then started becoming more subdued.
| jacquesm wrote:
| Yes, it pre-saged the dashboard of the later CX (the DS
| replacement).
| drewzero1 wrote:
| That's glorious! The 70s and 80s were a wonderful and weird
| time for automotive design. I see echoes of it in the interior
| of my early 90s Saturn.
| https://img.hmn.com/900x0/stories/2016/11/1991-Saturn-SL2-In...
| ur-whale wrote:
| Oooh, so star-trek-y. Very nice.
| woobar wrote:
| Ford catalogues from the same time -
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32298524
| YVoyiatzis wrote:
| Ten or so years ago, being a Citroen enthusiast since I was a
| kid, but never got around to owning one, I came across a Citroen
| farm in New Hampshire--about a hundred miles from where I was at
| the time, in Massachusetts.
|
| He ended up convincing me to refrain from purchasing the D50 I
| had my eye on--it was selling for less than three grand at the
| time, not in mint condition, but with a weathered patina that
| suited its faded buttery canary yellow just right. The Northeast,
| he said, given its often extreme weather conditions in winter,
| uses too much salt to weather driving conditions. I had to be
| prepared to replacing its chassis in just a couple of years
| thenceforth, were I to expose it to Boston's driving conditions.
|
| I wanted that little car to be my every-day commuter here in
| Boston, it would not have proven feasible to garage it over the
| winter, so I had to let it go.
|
| In retrospect, having driven in Boston all these years after the
| fact, not ending up that little car proved a prudentchoice. Cudos
| to the gentleman Citroen farmer for his sage advice.
| jacquesm wrote:
| What is a D50? I know quite a few Citroen models but not that
| one and google isn't helping.
| amelius wrote:
| They should really make a modern retro version of the 2CV, like
| they did with the MINI and VW Beatle. It's such an iconic car.
| sbarre wrote:
| Wonder if they could make an electric version of the wagon? It
| could be great as a short-haul utility/delivery vehicle...
| iancmceachern wrote:
| Totally, it was so clever and revolutionary in many ways. I put
| it on the same pedestal as you say with the Mini and Beetle.
| ur-whale wrote:
| The Mehari [1] (red car on front page) was an amazing car (4
| wheel drive), that was used by the French military for a while
| and later became very emblematic of the St-Tropez area of France
| in the 60's and vacationing there.
|
| [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citro%C3%ABn_M%C3%A9hari
| jonasdegendt wrote:
| I just saw a yellow one today! The way they're cambered makes
| them look so cool.
| jacquesm wrote:
| They're still very much wanted and go for a large multiple of
| their original new price. They are also probably one of the
| lightest and most dangerous four wheeled production cars ever
| manufactured.
| TedDoesntTalk wrote:
| It reminds me of Volkswagen "Thing".
| jacquesm wrote:
| Compared to the beetle it's a tent on wheels. The beetle is
| quite strong for a car designed in those days.
| userbinator wrote:
| Compared to a 2CV, I agree; but it was definitely less
| substantial than the average American sedan back then.
| jacquesm wrote:
| Yes, that's true whatever came out of Detroit in those
| days would classify as an armored vehicle now. The steel
| on those things was a time and a half as thick as your
| typical EU economy car. That showed up in the kerb weight
| as well.
| TedDoesntTalk wrote:
| The Thing is not the Beetle. Different cars.
| forinti wrote:
| The Pallas DS was such a beautiful car, they should resurrect it
| as an eletric car.
| jacquesm wrote:
| There is a group in the UK converting them (sacrilege!):
|
| https://www.electrogenic.co.uk/cars/electric-citroen-ds
| gorgoiler wrote:
| The 2CV was the first and last car my mother owned that had a had
| a hand crank start. I think we only bought it because of the
| Tintin related marketing material. The carburettor controls were
| front and centre, presumably for live adjusting the fuel richness
| as you ascended a Pyrenean cirque. I saw the famous twin engined
| version in Berlin a few years ago for a mere six figure euro
| price tag.
| janlukacs wrote:
| How I miss the "old" internet. These fan made websites used to
| show up in google serps ages ago. I've never ran into these
| personal websites in the past 3+ years, no matter how deep I
| search.
| olivermarks wrote:
| My Francophile artist dad, who was a terrible driver, had a sky
| blue deux chevaux. He used to drop me off at school sometimes in
| the morning (UK midlands).
|
| For urban driving he typically drove in 2nd or 3rd gear at around
| 23 mph which was very slow in a straight line and terrifying
| around corners and roundabouts. I used to see ashen faced drivers
| out of the passenger window trying to understand why his engine
| was screaming and the car was lurching at such an extreme angle
| around the roundabout lanes. He would typically have a car full
| of stuff which would be rolling around on the floor and it wasn't
| unusual be hit on the head with an easel or painting under
| extreme braking evasions. Great cars, spent a lot of time in 2CVs
| in France too, such character...
| petercooper wrote:
| This has just reminded me that as a kid I used to nag my parents
| to visit car dealerships and collect car brochures. My parents
| were too risk averse to buy anything like a Citroen, but they
| were clearly the most forward thinking company. I remember the
| Citroen XM being the most futuristic car I'd ever read about, but
| now the cheapest hatchback has far more advanced technology!
| jacquesm wrote:
| The cheapest hatchback still doesn't have that suspension
| though.
| Svip wrote:
| Even in the 1990s, a Xantia would be a cheap way to buy a
| luxury suspension. Still amazes me that my '74 DS and my '98
| Xantia can use the same hydraulic fluid. Even the pressure
| spheres are interchangeable, although not advisable.
| jacquesm wrote:
| The Xantia probably has the best of the hydraulic
| suspension systems that were ever on the market (including
| MB, which is a ridiculously fragile system). The XM is more
| comfy but the Xantia is far more reliable mostly because it
| is a somewhat simpler system (cheaper car, so less
| complexity = more profit but incidentally also more
| reliability).
|
| The very worst was the SM, which overcomplicated just about
| everything. If you open the hood on one you'll have at
| least six "WHY?"'s going through your head at once, the
| kicker being the rotating shaft over the top of the engine
| to drive a pump on the other side of the block.
| classified wrote:
| The presentation style of those catalogs is just wonderful. And
| hose hippie colors! Today's presentation styles are mind-
| numbingly dull in comparison.
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