[HN Gopher] Swedish Radio created fake pharmacy, reveals how Fac...
       ___________________________________________________________________
        
       Swedish Radio created fake pharmacy, reveals how Facebook stored
       sensitive data
        
       Author : herman82
       Score  : 373 points
       Date   : 2022-06-30 08:31 UTC (14 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (sverigesradio.se)
 (TXT) w3m dump (sverigesradio.se)
        
       | mdrzn wrote:
       | "When Facebook replies to the reporters, they do not answer their
       | questions. But in an email they emphasize that advertisers have a
       | responsibility to not pass on sensitive information."
       | 
       | Facebook Support is the biggest joke ever, even if you are a
       | paying user of FB Ads. They can't or won't answer any question at
       | all, and always reply with "We'll contact you soon to let you
       | know if there's any updates".
        
       | noptd wrote:
       | >After four days, 25 000 fake visits from customers had been
       | registered with Facebook. But they had neither shut down nor
       | warned the owners of the made-up pharmacy - Swedish Radio News'
       | reporters. When the reporters log into their account, they see
       | that Facebook has stored the type of sensitive information that
       | they say their filter is built to delete again and again.
       | 
       | >The question that the reporters then asked themselves was
       | whether or not Facebook even has a filter that works in the
       | Swedish language. One of the pharmacies that Swedish Radio
       | reported on say that they cannot find any warnings from Facebook
       | on data transfers that have taken place. The other has not wanted
       | to answer the question. According to state investigators in the
       | USA last year, Facebook only filtered in English.
       | 
       | Wow, seems like this will have major implications under GDPR as
       | well.
        
         | TazeTSchnitzel wrote:
         | The things Facebook wants to block sound like content that is
         | specially protected under the GDPR:
         | 
         | > Article 9
         | 
         | > Processing of special categories of personal data
         | 
         | > 1. Processing of personal data revealing racial or ethnic
         | origin, political opinions, religious or philosophical beliefs,
         | or trade union membership, and the processing of genetic data,
         | biometric data for the purpose of uniquely identifying a
         | natural person, data concerning health or data concerning a
         | natural person's sex life or sexual orientation shall be
         | prohibited.
         | 
         | > 2. Paragraph 1 shall not apply if one of the following
         | applies: [...]
         | 
         | (https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-
         | content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX%3A...)
        
       | carvking wrote:
       | Well done - we need more of testing how big companies handle your
       | data in practice.
        
       | alkonaut wrote:
       | I don't understand: where are users entering sensitive
       | information, and how is that related to facebook? If I click an
       | ad on facebook and land on some website where I can fill in
       | sensitive information, surely that's beyond facebooks' control?
       | 
       | Were people entering information somehow IN the ad, while still
       | on facebook's page?
        
         | jollybean wrote:
         | Neither do I, once again, frustratingly bad reporting.
         | 
         | My guess is that the 'ad' is has a 'sign up' where people can
         | input information, which can be sensitive, that is capture for
         | the advertiser. I could be anything i.e. contests, emails,
         | whatever. The advertiser can get the data in a spreadsheet
         | later.
         | 
         | If the company doing the ad is 'fake' then you have a CA like
         | scandal possibly, where the fake company can sell that
         | harvested data, some of it sensitive.
         | 
         | I think there are legit concerns here, but I mean, the
         | companies could just as easily direct them to their own url and
         | ask users to 'sign up', which would likely be beyond Facebooks
         | purview to control.
        
         | Ma8ee wrote:
         | No, people went to an online pharmacy, unrelated to Facebook.
         | That pharmacy sent the information to Facebook, including
         | information about what kind of medication that was purchased.
         | Of course, the main fault was with the pharmacy, but that is
         | another, related, story. The main point here is that Facebook
         | had promised to filter and not store sensitive information, but
         | that filter apparently didn't work, possibly because that
         | filter didn't handle information in Swedish.
         | 
         | So, even if you never ever had been even close to Facebook,
         | Facebook could have the information that you just ordered some
         | Emergency Contraceptives.
        
           | alkonaut wrote:
           | I understand. It feels almost like magic that a script could
           | figure out that kind of thing from any site? I guess it's
           | mostly just blindly uploading things from forms?
           | 
           | This is a massive GDPR breach of the site in question though.
           | I really don't fault Facebook much. Anyone who ever includes
           | any FB script is reaponsible for exactly what it does.
        
             | amelius wrote:
             | > I really don't fault Facebook much. Anyone who ever
             | includes any FB script is responsible for exactly what it
             | does.
             | 
             | Many people don't understand the implications of using FB
             | scripts, whereas FB does.
        
               | alkonaut wrote:
               | Sure. There is perhaps a moral/ethical responsibility.
               | But there are laws against sharing sensitive info and I
               | don't think "I didn't know FB scripts did that" helps.
               | FB's entire business is gobbling up user data. And
               | pharmacies business is to know who they share sensitive
               | data with. I don't think it's too much to ask to require
               | siteowners to understand what the scripts they use are
               | actually doing, at least if they deal with sensitive
               | data.
               | 
               | For example, I don't think pharmacies should do any kind
               | of advertising on FB, or do any kind of campaign
               | tracking/conversion measuring etc on the same site they
               | accept user data. As will all GDPR violations, if just a
               | few large pharmacies were fined out of existence, I bet
               | the rest would quickly fall in line.
        
               | amelius wrote:
               | I think owning information that you should not possess
               | could in theory be just as punishable as sharing the
               | information in the first place. Especially if done on a
               | massive scale.
               | 
               | This already holds for csam imagery.
        
               | Ma8ee wrote:
               | While I agree that the main fault was with the
               | pharmacies, they should certainly not send any patient
               | information to anyone, I think you can at least partly
               | blame Facebook since they had promised to filter out
               | anything sensitive.
        
               | alkonaut wrote:
               | That sounds impossible even for one language. A better
               | description I might trust wouldn't include "filter out".
               | Filter out!? Like activities that aren't "filtered out"
               | would somehow be blanket acceptable?
               | 
               | Wouldn't it be easier to just use an FB api to send _one_
               | ping when a transaction completes, e.g with a campaign
               | ID? Why would fb ever be uploading what's stored in a
               | form field that they don't know what it means? It makes
               | no sense?
        
               | ev1 wrote:
               | Many analytics and tracking pkgs will capture every
               | single form field and upload them as a standard default,
               | and only mask out things that match cc regexes etc
               | 
               | Yes it's immensely stupid
        
             | TrickyRick wrote:
             | If you visit a pharmacy website to buy prescription meds
             | you have to enter PII. If you then also visit various pages
             | on that site for various meds for various diseases it can
             | quite easily be correlated that you have said diseases. The
             | fact that Facebook was involved can be completely unknown
             | to you as a user, you don't even have to have a Facebook
             | account.
        
               | alkonaut wrote:
               | > If you visit a pharmacy website to buy prescription
               | meds you have to enter PII.
               | 
               | Yes. And they are responsible for where that information
               | ends up, regardless of how and where they advertise. So
               | basically, anyone running any website at all should be
               | really careful to not add any third party (e.g. Facebook)
               | scripts to their page. I'd rather run a business not
               | knowing whether my ad campaigns work at all, than run one
               | where I don't know if I'm liable for breaking laws.
        
               | amelius wrote:
               | Analogy: if you have a photo sharing website, like
               | Flickr, then from those photos (and the combination of
               | different photos) Flickr can in theory derive a lot of
               | sensitive information; does that make it somehow stupid
               | or irresponsible to post photos to Flickr? I'd say that
               | depends completely on how we expect Flickr to behave.
               | 
               | It's like visiting a physical pharmacy. In theory,
               | somebody could be spying on the people who enter and
               | leave the place, keeping a giant database with frequency,
               | faces, etc. The question whether it is stupid to enter a
               | pharmacy in person should be answered with: "No, we have
               | laws that protect us against malevolent actors".
        
               | ev1 wrote:
               | > It's like visiting a physical pharmacy. In theory,
               | somebody could be spying on the people who enter and
               | leave the place
               | 
               | People do this in the US with Planned Parenthood clinics
               | and parking 4K cameras outside/across the street and
               | license plate recorders/scanners.
        
         | TazeTSchnitzel wrote:
         | They weren't on Facebook's website at all. They were using an
         | online pharmacy's website, and Facebook gets sent information
         | about this because the site embeds Facebook's tracking scripts.
         | This is one of the insidious things about adtech: they track
         | you all over the internet, not just on the adtech companies'
         | own sites.
        
           | _joel wrote:
           | Thank god for Firefox containers and ublock origin et al.
        
         | Moru wrote:
         | One way would be to place the facebook pixel on the site so if
         | you buy sensitive meds from the drugstore, facebook knows what
         | you bought and can sell that information to your insurance
         | company.
         | 
         | Not sure if they shut down the facebook pixel yet but I'm sure
         | there is something similar around instead if they did.
        
           | jollybean wrote:
           | I don't think that's it. FB doesn't 'sell' data, rather, they
           | allow advertisers to 'target' people. The targetting
           | dimensions are right there for everyone to see, I'm doubtful
           | that you're going to find the ability to target people on
           | 'recently purchase meds'. I think this is a case of companies
           | asking users to provide information on in-app sign ups.
        
       | janandonly wrote:
       | If you, as a dweller on the interwebs, do not block all things
       | related to FAANG yet, then you are to blame [1], [2], [3].
       | 
       | Also, as a country or nation state, if you do not curtail and
       | prosecute these thieves of private data, then you show you don't
       | care enough about your populace.
       | 
       | [1] I recommend using a combo of https://nextdns.io/
       | 
       | [2] Ublock Origin: https://ublockorigin.com/
       | 
       | [3] and No-script: https://noscript.net/
        
         | Moru wrote:
         | I do this since about forever in different ways. It's getting
         | harder and harder to buy things online thanks to layer on top
         | of layer of javascripts called from so many domains it's not
         | even funny any more. On the other hand I buy less and less
         | things I don't need...
        
         | elwell wrote:
         | > all things related to FAANG
         | 
         | So I can't use a MacBook or iPhone? I can't watch Netflix?
        
         | tirpen wrote:
         | > If you, as a dweller on the interwebs, do not block all
         | things related to FAANG yet, then you are to blame.
         | 
         | Quite _literally_ victim blaming.
         | 
         | No. The companies are to blame.
         | 
         | The internet _shouldn 't_ be a bloody minefield that is
         | impossible to navigate without a PhD in network security.
        
       | adamsb6 wrote:
       | I don't understand how these records were sent, and how it was
       | confirmed they weren't deleted.
       | 
       | It can't be tracking info, Facebook doesn't give access to such
       | things outside the company, so the authors wouldn't have been
       | able to confirm the records sent were still available. Also,
       | technically the pharmacy wouldn't be sending those records, the
       | fake user's browser would be sending them.
       | 
       | If I had to guess, the fake pharmacy created "Custom Audiences"
       | -- lists of identifying info, like email addresses, that Facebook
       | can use to serve an ad to a specific person-- and labeled them as
       | people that had purchased some specific drug. You can name these
       | whatever you want, and can read their contents.
       | 
       | API docs here: https://developers.facebook.com/docs/marketing-
       | api/reference...
       | 
       | There's no complex tagging system, it looks like name and
       | description are the only places where you could say this is a
       | list of people that bought a specific drug.
        
       | amelius wrote:
       | It is beyond my comprehension why government-installed privacy
       | watchdogs don't do this sort of thing on a regular basis.
       | 
       | Their modus operandi seems to be: wait for public outcry, then
       | perhaps slap some wrists.
        
         | carvking wrote:
         | No incentive - pat on the back in public, shaming in private.
         | 
         | Politicians like big business.
        
         | rolobio wrote:
         | Probably because the governments like being able to
         | purchase/subpoena private information about their constituents
         | from FB? It is an amazing surveillance tool from the
         | government's perspective.
        
         | Nextgrid wrote:
         | GDPR enforcement is significantly lacking. I'm starting to
         | think that nobody really wants the GDPR to be enforced
         | properly, and politically it makes sense - the social media
         | industry (which relies on widespread privacy violations) now
         | controls much of humanity's social fabric which politicians use
         | to help their election - biting the hand that "feeds" could
         | very well be suicide for one's political career.
        
       | andrelaszlo wrote:
       | Also by SR, in the last couple of weeks:
       | 
       | - The Swedish healthcare company Kry has built a service for
       | digital patient calls that has leaked doctors 'and patients'
       | contact information to Facebook.
       | https://sverigesradio.se/artikel/health-service-marketed-as-...
       | 
       | - The state-owned pharmacy chain Apoteket has sent detailed
       | information about its online customers and their purchases to
       | Facebook, Swedish Radio News can reveal.
       | https://sverigesradio.se/artikel/pharmacy-passed-information...
       | 
       | Why the f** is everyone sending our data to FB by default? It's
       | not enough to uninstall FB; you can't even go buy prescription
       | medicine without them knowing, apparently.
        
         | astrange wrote:
         | Maybe they assumed Swedish people don't care about hiding
         | personal information, since tax returns are public?
         | 
         | Or they're busy fighting each other over tvattstuga
         | reservations?
        
         | type0 wrote:
         | This is anecdata, but apparently Faecesbook is like a religion
         | in Sweden so I'm not surprised.
        
         | WesolyKubeczek wrote:
         | On your smartphone, every other app will have Facebook SDK,
         | whether for login or tracking or anything else at all.
        
           | coldcode wrote:
           | When I start as a mobile lead at
           | GiantNonTechCorpYouWouldKnow, I was looking at one of the two
           | apps I would be leading part of, just to get familiar I
           | looked at all network connections it made and found it called
           | Facebook. I asked product team why we pinged FB given the app
           | it just for our business; they had no idea we even did that,
           | and it was immediately ordered the FB SDK be removed from the
           | app. I never did discover why it was there in the first
           | place.
        
           | pdimitar wrote:
           | Hence: Pi-Hole at home, and a on-device VPN that blocks 98%
           | of all that crap.
           | 
           | I am sure they can still get some info and that some requests
           | slip through but I wish them luck building a coherent picture
           | of me by a few scraps of random info.
        
           | Zenst wrote:
           | Indeed, certainly makes application proxy filtering more of a
           | must than a luxury for the wider consumer market in todays
           | times. Though not sure (beyond rolling your own) what
           | offerings are out there for consumers as focus seems to be
           | VPN proxies.
        
             | Nextgrid wrote:
             | On iOS, "Lockdown Privacy" is a potential option.
        
           | Nextgrid wrote:
           | Yep, so much for the GDPR. Despite this, I'm sure someone is
           | going to throw the "enforcementtracker.com" link to "prove"
           | that enforcement is sufficient.
        
           | scns wrote:
           | On Android you can block trackers per app with
           | TrackerControl.
           | 
           | https://trackercontrol.org/
        
             | pmontra wrote:
             | I've been using Blockada for many years. I think it does
             | the same thing with trackers, ads, etc.
        
           | ChrisMarshallNY wrote:
           | Not on the ones I write, but I know that I'm an outlier.
           | 
           | From what I have heard, the FB SDK has a bunch of nice UI
           | candy, so folks may have used it, just so they can get the
           | nice splitscreen, etc. (UISplitViewController is a nightmare.
           | I suspect that SwiftUI may have some improvements to offer).
        
         | bjoli wrote:
         | was it SR or SVT that found the 1177/medicall calls on some
         | kind of unsecured network storage? For those.outside of sweden,
         | those are calls either with a doctor or with a nurse where you
         | will divulge information that should be protected.
         | 
         | That story was like a Trainwreck of unbelievable proportions.
         | One bad decision after the other.
         | 
         | Edit: apparentlt it was Computer Sweden:
         | https://www.svt.se/nyheter/inrikes/2-7-miljoner-inspelade-sa...
         | 
         | 2.7 million calls. 170000 hours.
        
           | Hikikomori wrote:
           | Best part about this was their CEO trying to play it down, he
           | put his feet in his mouth several times. He said that the
           | recorded calls could not be accessed by regular people, you
           | needed some special keyboard commando movement to get in the
           | back door.
        
             | rekoil wrote:
             | Special keyboard commando movement: point a browser to a
             | certain DNS.
             | 
             | Only hackers can do this.
        
               | LinAGKar wrote:
               | But did they need to decode the HTML source code?
        
               | 3np wrote:
               | No, this was publicized by a respectable publication, not
               | some criminal fly-by hacker operation. So no room for the
               | CEO to press charges.
        
           | medstrom wrote:
           | I knew I shouldn't have provided my personal identification
           | number on those phone calls.
        
             | sasvari wrote:
             | Your personal number is easy to look up online for
             | everybody in any case, jfyi. Not that this is a good thing,
             | though.
        
               | actionfromafar wrote:
               | I took at is if they didn't give their number, there
               | would be no connecting the call to an individual. (Unless
               | you recognize the voice.)
        
               | sasvari wrote:
               | ah, yes. that's a different angle of course.
        
         | mekkkkkk wrote:
         | The reason is almost always to be able to do conversion
         | tracking. I.e. to follow the trail from a specific ad campaign
         | to a completed purchase in order to evaluate the campaign
         | performance. There are of course ways to do this while
         | preserving anonymity of the individual customers, but it's way
         | too easy to mess up and/or give in to the allure of providing
         | too much detail in the quest to further evaluate user behavior.
         | 
         | The tools are built to make it as easy as possible to provide
         | as much data as possible about the users. Whether it's
         | nefarious is debatable, but FB should definitely have some
         | checks and balances on what they allow to be stored on their
         | own platform.
        
           | vanderZwan wrote:
           | > _Whether it 's nefarious is debatable_
           | 
           | Ok, I'll bite: try to debate how it _isn 't_ nefarious,
           | because I sincerely cannot think of an argument.
        
             | FrenchDevRemote wrote:
             | I'll bite too.
             | 
             | If you don't have superbowl ads money, or already have a
             | huge following, data and A/B testing is probably the only
             | way to be profitable while doing e-commerce on your own
             | website
             | 
             | Those are tools designed to market products, not handle
             | super sensitive data, it's kind of like using hotjar to
             | record sessions on your (super confidential) website to
             | find pain points and bugs, only to whine that hotjar stores
             | data about your users actions, that's the entire reason why
             | you're a customer.
             | 
             | I really don't get the fuss.
             | 
             | I don't even get the point of advertising pharmacies, you
             | don't need medicines to be advertised to you, it's even
             | crazier that a part of the price of your meds would be
             | "facebook ads budget"
             | 
             | And tbh I have more trust in the reliability of the
             | infrastructure behind FB ads than in the spaghetti PHP code
             | written in 2005 by a contractor for those pharmacies, or in
             | the windows XP/vista computers that their employees use.
             | 
             | If I had to bet on who's getting hacked, I wouldn't bet on
             | Facebook.
        
               | pdimitar wrote:
               | Who is talking about FB being hacked? It's about them
               | reusing all this info for many other purposes. _That_ is
               | nefarious.
               | 
               | Plus you'll find that many will vehemently disagree with
               | you kind of accepting as a given that data should be
               | handed to FB _carte blanche_. It 's a dishonest to start
               | with such an extremely debatable starting point.
               | 
               | I say why don't we give them jack (nil) and start the
               | discussion _then_.
        
               | UweSchmidt wrote:
               | Those tools should probably be designed to handle super
               | sensitive data, if they are handling super sensitive
               | data.
               | 
               | And, user behaviour on a website can very well be
               | confidential, for example they could easily track the
               | cognitive decline of users over time as mouse movement
               | gets more erratic and reactions slow down - super
               | sensitive information if you ask me. The reason a person
               | is a customer is because they might buy a thing, not to
               | be analyzed.
        
               | car_analogy wrote:
               | > If you don't have superbowl ads money, or already have
               | a huge following, data and A/B testing is probably the
               | only way to be profitable while doing e-commerce on your
               | own website
               | 
               | Then how did we manage to sell medicine or call doctors
               | before this wonderful era of Facebook integration? Would
               | without this Swedes simply go without healthcare?
        
               | FrenchDevRemote wrote:
               | I also said "I don't even get the point of advertising
               | pharmacies, you don't need medicines to be advertised to
               | you, it's even crazier that a part of the price of your
               | meds would be "facebook ads budget""
               | 
               | They're just using the wrong tool for the wrong job for
               | the wrong reasons, but it's not facebook fault in that
               | case
        
               | lostlogin wrote:
               | Another angle to this is the legality of direct to
               | consumer drug advertising. I had though this was only
               | legal in the US and New Zealand. The wiki doesn't say
               | it's allowed in Sweden, so I'm not sure how they are
               | getting away with it.
               | 
               | Or is the advertising not for prescription drugs?
               | 
               | https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Direct-to-
               | consumer_advertisi...
        
               | mekkkkkk wrote:
               | Advertising for prescription drugs is not allowed in
               | Sweden. Pharmacy ads are for non-prescription items like
               | sunscreen, deodorant, whatever. I'd guess that the
               | largest margins are on those items anyway, considering
               | the subsidizing/reimbursement system for prescriptions.
        
               | cinntaile wrote:
               | To expand upon this Aspirin, Advil, ... or paracetamol
               | based alternatives are non-prescription drugs (under a
               | certain mg dose), while antibiotics are prescription
               | drugs.
        
               | _nalply wrote:
               | > is probably the only way to be profitable while doing
               | e-commerce on your own website
               | 
               | This argument is like in sports: Woe me I can't win a
               | price everybody is doping!
        
               | ChoGGi wrote:
               | > If I had to bet on who's getting hacked, I wouldn't bet
               | on Facebook
               | 
               | The bigger the company, the bigger the payoff.
        
               | KingOfCoders wrote:
               | "PHP code written in 2005 by a contractor for those
               | pharmacies"
               | 
               | Real or pulled from thin air?
               | 
               | "If I had to bet on who's getting hacked, I wouldn't bet
               | on Facebook."
               | 
               | My getpawnd list includes: Adobe (billion $ company),
               | Dropbox (billion $ company) and Linkedin (billion^2 $
               | company) - twice!.
        
               | epicide wrote:
               | > And tbh I have more trust in the reliability of the
               | infrastructure behind FB ads than in the spaghetti PHP
               | code written in 2005 by a contractor for those
               | pharmacies, or in the windows XP/vista computers that
               | their employees use.
               | 
               | You are comparing _security_ in response to an issue
               | about _privacy_. Facebook 's security around data that
               | they shouldn't have in the first place is irrelevant.
               | 
               | Additionally, even a contractor today still _could not_
               | create feature parity with Facebook as they do not have
               | the network effect of Facebook. That 's assuming the
               | company/contractor would even try to build all of it
               | themselves.
        
               | vanderZwan wrote:
               | > _Those are tools designed to market products, not
               | handle super sensitive data, it 's kind of like using
               | hotjar to record sessions on your (super confidential)
               | website to find pain points and bugs, only to whine that
               | hotjar stores data about your users actions, that's the
               | entire reason why you're a customer._
               | 
               | In which case it is nefarious to advertise that they do
               | handle super sensitive data correctly. Which Facebook
               | does.
               | 
               | > _If I had to bet on who 's getting hacked, I wouldn't
               | bet on Facebook._
               | 
               | This is moving the goalposts.
        
               | aaaaaaaaata wrote:
               | Well, they have been, as well as bunch of others you
               | blindly trust.
        
             | mekkkkkk wrote:
             | You can argue that they trust developers to be responsible.
             | Having a user friendly and powerful SDK with tons of
             | possible data points isn't inherently a bad thing. All of
             | the features _could_ be used in a responsible fashion, and
             | FB thinks you 're smart enough to do so.
             | 
             | I'm not entirely convinced of this personally, but it seems
             | like a somewhat sound argument. I think that they know that
             | it will inevitably be misused, and that they have enough
             | incentive for allowing the misuse to continue.
        
               | vanderZwan wrote:
               | > _You can argue that they trust developers to be
               | responsible._
               | 
               | Anyone who argues this should not be let anywhere near
               | sensitive data.
        
           | juanani wrote:
        
           | atleta wrote:
           | The problem is not necessarily the (bad) intent. The problem
           | is amassing data without a clear and well defined purpose.
           | And "just in case we'll use it in the future" or "we might
           | need it" is not one. And collecting more than what you need
           | does meet the definition of without a well defined purpose in
           | this sense. I think this is also in line with the ideas
           | behind GDPR.
           | 
           | From the point where your data is stored it's there for good.
           | I think that's what they have proven, also, anecdotally, a
           | googler friend told me well over a decade ago that they don't
           | ever delete data. Which is not that surprising, since I, as a
           | nimble private person, don't do either. So your data is there
           | and it's there basically forever, you don't know what that
           | data is and how that will be used in the future. Either by
           | criminals who steal it or by the company changing policies or
           | even the law being changed.
           | 
           | So I would say that even without bad intents, which I'm ready
           | to believe not being there at the moment, collecting as much
           | as you can and trying to filter out whatever someone thought
           | of as being too sensitive is the exact wrong strategy. They
           | should actively filter out _everything_ except what they want
           | to store specifically and they should claim what that is.
           | 
           | Other than that, I think completely blocking FB (and other
           | big 3rd party) tracking is the way to go. It should be there
           | by default in all browsers. There reason it's not likely to
           | happen, is of course, that the most used browsers are all
           | subsidized by the very companies that live off of data
           | collection.
        
             | mekkkkkk wrote:
             | Well yeah, that is the broader issue for sure. As you say,
             | the change needs to come from regulation or consumer
             | pressure. The power that the data brokers can provide to
             | businesses is too great to ever reasonably expect them to
             | resist. If you are an online business and refuse to utilize
             | their services, you unfortunately are at a very significant
             | disadvantage against your competitors.
        
         | dalbasal wrote:
         | >> Why the f* is everyone sending our data to FB by default?
         | It's not enough to uninstall FB; you can't even go buy
         | prescription medicine without them knowing, apparently.
         | 
         | In a sense, because " _control the default_ " is a tactic
         | engrained deep in the DNA of many tech giants. Control the
         | default, and dominate the data. The default is the easy option
         | in live, practical contexts. You have to actively pursue an
         | alternative.
         | 
         | They're just in the same boat we're in. Data goes to data
         | companies by default... anytime anyone does anything with data.
         | If you use adwords, GA, FB advertising or whatnot... the
         | default, ideal even, is that these get all the data. That way
         | everything works best, and requires the least special effort
         | and expertise.
        
         | usrn wrote:
         | >Why the f* is everyone sending our data to FB by default?
         | 
         | Facebook's libraries do it, lazy people use them without
         | thinking. Using software carelessly is _extremely_ dangerous.
        
           | Nextgrid wrote:
           | Using _malicious software_ is also dangerous.
        
         | code_duck wrote:
         | After installing noscript I was amazed to see how many trackers
         | my bank account had on their online service. I would think they
         | could do their own analytics without potentially sending
         | banking history to Google, Facebook and Adobe, but apparently
         | not.
        
           | bbarnett wrote:
           | Your bank also wants to know what type of web sites you
           | visit, how you are tagged, so they know how much of a credit
           | risk you are.
           | 
           | Maybe you have an 18% greater risk of default, if you visit
           | sites about poker?
           | 
           | Only the big boys have tracking on all sites, so only they
           | can report back everyplace you visit.
           | 
           | Of course, it doesn't matter if you were just doing research
           | for a paper, you now pay higher interest rares.
           | 
           | Banks also are one of the few places where your ID is 100%
           | known upon login. So they are a perfect place to take loads
           | of tracking info, and:
           | 
           | - link it back to your real ID
           | 
           | - your credit report
           | 
           | - your physical address
           | 
           | - your birth date
           | 
           | - things like home ownership
           | 
           | - all bills you pay
           | 
           | - using debit or cc, where you shop
           | 
           | They have an immense business model, where they link online
           | tracking, to meatspace habits.
           | 
           | As well, since your bank often gives you points credit cards,
           | and stores cooperate for fee discounts, often individual
           | purchases are known.
        
             | Nextgrid wrote:
             | I'm sure the banks would love to do this, but I'm not sure
             | the trackers the GP mentioned actually share any of this
             | data _back to the site_. Facebook stalks everyone for their
             | own benefit but are usually pretty good about keeping that
             | data to themselves.
        
         | _the_inflator wrote:
         | This reminds me of mailing lists over 15 years ago that had at
         | least one gmail account owner CC'ed in. Good bye privacy for
         | the rest of us. ;)
        
       | williamcotton wrote:
       | We need some rather large class action settlements to scare all
       | of the lawyers at our companies into taking these issues
       | seriously!
        
       | [deleted]
        
       | someweirdperson wrote:
       | Sweden? That's the country where income taxes of every individual
       | are publically available. The inventors of tracking flights,
       | including private ones.
       | 
       | Are they concerned because medical, or because facebook?
        
         | bjoli wrote:
         | What on earth are you trying to say with that comment? That my
         | medicines being public information is comparable to taxable
         | income public information?
         | 
         | I don't thing I know anyone who would agree...
        
         | rhodo wrote:
         | The medications you're taking are a vastly different level of
         | private than your income or where a flight goes. I think that's
         | pretty obvious
        
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