[HN Gopher] OP-1 field
___________________________________________________________________
OP-1 field
Author : bpierre
Score : 263 points
Date : 2022-05-12 08:38 UTC (14 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (teenage.engineering)
(TXT) w3m dump (teenage.engineering)
| psychomugs wrote:
| It would be amazing, and not too unlike TE, if they released some
| of these features as updates to the original OP-1. I'm
| particularly interested in the new tape recording styles.
| YoyoyoPCP wrote:
| The OP-1 has been the single most inspiring tool I've had in a
| decade. Every other sampler I've bought has always failed to
| reliably draw me in.
|
| There is no putting a price on creativity. Sure, the competition
| can compete on specs and price, but they never seem to get me to
| want to turn them on like the OP-1.
|
| Just my opinion of course. But it is already a classic at this
| point and is deserving of respect.
| tmountain wrote:
| I owned and sold an OP-1. It is a beautiful piece of hardware and
| its analog controls and mashable buttons provide a more tactile
| experience than an iPad does.
|
| That said, the sounds it ships with really leave something to be
| desired. My subjective opinion is that anyone who's played with a
| best in class software synth (i.e., equator2) is going to find
| themselves feeling pretty limited by the blippy tones that you
| get out of the box.
|
| Sure, you can load up the sampler with tons of cool tones and
| op1.fun is a wonderful resource, but it's a lot of work to go
| curate a bunch of sounds to compensate for a lackluster palette.
|
| I can already hear people saying that I'm missing the point and
| that the constraints are designed to inspire creativity, etc. I
| respect that point of view, but at the end of the day, my
| creative time is at a premium, and I'd like to use that time to
| create stuff that I'm proud to show friends and family.
|
| Most of the stuff I produced with the OP-1 sounded like video
| game music or music for a kid's cartoon (i.e., Adventure Time).
| If that's your thing, then awesome! If not, I'd consider the core
| tonal possibilities before you make a big investment.
| chaosprint wrote:
| I am wondering if you can recall that whether one can create
| complex rhythm like this on OP-1?
|
| https://glicol-tidal.netlify.app
|
| The BPM can be changed in real-time and not limited to 4, 8,
| 16, 32 grids of sequences.
| andkon wrote:
| This was like five years ago that I had one, but as far as I
| remember, OP-1 isn't grid-based (though maybe some of the
| instruments are?). It's basically like a four track tape
| mixer. You can loop bar-by-bar, and then copy from bar to
| bar. And you can stretch time in the same way that you would
| with a reel-to-reel tape deck. But as far as I remember it
| won't transpose / warp the sounds along with the change in
| BPM.
| freerobby wrote:
| Agree about the built-in sounds, but I solved that pretty
| quickly by adding things like mellotron samples to it.
| tarentel wrote:
| As someone who produces electronic music I kind of dig the
| limitations of the op-1. At a 2k price point though with those
| limitations in mind I can't justify the price. Even at ~1300 or
| whatever the old model is going for I can't justify the price.
| For cheaper you can get both a digitakt and a digitone, which I
| own the latter, and they sound 1000 times better than the op-1
| although each respectively do quite a lot less. I was actually
| pretty excited to see this until I saw the price. I have spent
| a lot of money on electronic music gear, way more than 2000,
| and I'm a bit baffled about who this is for exactly.
| zimpenfish wrote:
| > Even at ~1300 or whatever the old model is going for [...]
| you can get both a digitakt and a digitone
|
| You could probably get an iPad, a USB midi dongle, a midi
| keyboard, and a whole suite of software for that, too.
| weatherlight wrote:
| but then you are using software....on an iPad :/
|
| (Which is totally valid if that what you want from your
| musical instruments)
|
| People buy gear because they like a workflow and the UX/UI
| tactile choices a particular designer/ brand decided to
| highlight.
|
| I love Elektron devices and I enjoy patching away on
| Eurorack. I'm pretty sure there's VSTS out there that will
| do 99.9% of the sound design I do with that gear, but then
| i'd be using an iPad or a laptop to do that... and that
| just completely kills the mood :/
|
| People should (with in their means) obtain they musical
| instruments that allow them to create music :)
| dmcginty wrote:
| And for the $2000 MSRP of the OP-1 Field you could buy a
| brand new 13" MacBook Pro, an Ableton Live Standard 11
| license, a Scarlett Solo audio interface, an M-Audio
| Keystation 49 USB MIDI controller, and still have some
| money left over.
| filoleg wrote:
| That's like telling someone that for the price of a new
| BMW S1000RR motorcycle, they can instead buy a really
| good Honda Civic, because a Honda Civic can carry more
| passengers, you can sleep in it, it is more reliable,
| safer, cheaper to service, holds resale value better,
| more versatile when it comes to different weather
| conditions, etc. You are missing the point that those in
| the market for BMW S1000RR are often aware of all those
| factual advantages that a Honda Civic has, they just
| prioritize different factors in their choices than you
| might. Someone who is looking to buy a motorcycle isn't
| gonna suddenly be swayed by looking into all the factual
| advantages a Honda Civic can provide over a motorcycle.
|
| Despite both items serving fundamentally the same base
| purpose (getting from point A to point B for
| cars/motorcycles; making music for OP-1/your list), and
| one of them is cheaper overall and on paper has a lot of
| factual advantages, they might simply prioritize
| different things and both be extremely good at different
| things they prioritize. I, personally, love the workflow
| of the original OP-1 way more than almost the exact list
| you produced (because it used to be pretty much my setup,
| except I used a different midi controller).
| evo_9 wrote:
| Yeah I agree, it's not really a great choice as your 'main
| synth'. I think it's really meant to be a self-contained
| portable 'music sketchpad'. I owned 2 at one point thinking
| maybe that was the issue, I like to double up my gear (for
| example I like to use two TB-303 layered); when that didn't
| work out the way I hoped on the OP1s I sold them and both were
| bought separately by traveling musicians that wanted something
| to noodle with/ sketch with while on tour buses, or killing
| time at the hotel.
|
| So I think it's a funny product that has a lot of 'nerd appeal'
| but at its heart it's a pretty powerful devices, maybe often
| miss-used.
|
| Also - having played with both 'hardware' and VST's I do prefer
| VSTs because of the ease of use; aka you can reload a track in
| seconds in Live versus spending 30+ repatching your gear,
| swooping out gear, etc (and then it's still not quite the same,
| but that's part of the magic of 'real hardware' I suppose).
|
| But at the end of the day the music I created with VST's versus
| real hardware wasn't different at all sonically so I am 100% in
| the camp of VSTs are awesome.
|
| That said, you need to be careful selecting a VST.They go
| 'stale' and become a liability, so for example if I open up
| projects from 5+ years back, almost none of them work now. So
| going forward, I'm going to be more careful, and probably buy
| VST's only from companies I expect to be around for the long
| haul.
| tmountain wrote:
| You're making a good point about VST compatibility over time.
| One way to at least ensure a track remains playable is to
| bounce your midi tracks to separate audio tracks (waveform).
| Clearly, you lose the flexibility that comes with
| manipulating the original score, but you're guaranteed to be
| able to playback, eq, and mix the original performance. Not
| ideal, but better than nothing.
| evo_9 wrote:
| True, I've done that too, but you're right it's obviously a
| limited way to go about it.
|
| It's funny, I kinda feel like this is what the OP1 was
| trying to be, or maybe what I wanted it to be, but this
| actually delivers on that promise. I want one:
| https://polyend.com/play/
| nkingsy wrote:
| Korg Module is the best noodler out there and it's 20 bucks.
| I've tried a few portable hardware sequencers, but module on
| my phone fits the bill so much better.
|
| Just finished a verse and got halfway through a chorus on a
| 30 minute ferry ride and I didn't even have to remember to
| bring anything but my phone.
| weinzierl wrote:
| Have you tried the Korg Kaossilator? It's 20 bucks upfront
| and so far I didn't want to spend that without being able
| to try it. The description sounds cool though.
| malthaus wrote:
| I'm convinced TE is just a show case for pricing consultants
| krnlpnc wrote:
| I was so excited to see the announcement! Finally some new OP-1
| stock will drive the prices back down to the original ~$700 mark.
| Nope!
|
| On what planet is this actually worth $2000?
|
| I'm really disappointed to see TE become this lifestyle company
| and continue jacking up their prices.
| nathanvanfleet wrote:
| I feel like I have also seen this in the espresso community.
| Companies sprung up that are address a boutique audience that
| ultimately seems to be best-in-class but also charge some
| astronomical prices.
| cxcorp wrote:
| The hi-fi audiophile world is certainly an expensive one.
| spoonjim wrote:
| TE is following the Apple playbook to a T: fanatical obsession
| with appearance/image/brand positioning PLUS absolutely
| excellent engineering PLUS extreme price markups. The result is
| a product that has a bananas price tag but also has no real
| substitutes.
| 999900000999 wrote:
| An iPad Mini + a Bluetooth midi keyboard will do anything this
| can do better and easier.
|
| You pay for the brand and to say on Twitter that you use
| hardware
| 323 wrote:
| > see TE become this lifestyle company
|
| TE always was a lifestyle company. All their products,
| including their gaming device, are about looking cool. Which is
| why device thinness is extremely important and the first thing
| they talk about. Just like Apple.
|
| You don't buy a TE device to actually make music, you buy it to
| impress people about how creative you are, how you are not a
| pleb consumerist.
| yunwal wrote:
| I feel like looking cool is definitely a factor, but the OP-1
| is also about being portable and fitting into your lifestyle.
| Photographers will tell you that "the best camera is the one
| you have with you", and the OP-1 is like the phone camera of
| music. It's like a step up from singing into a voice memo.
| You can use it to capture ideas reasonably accurately
| whenever you feel inspired, and refine them later at an
| actual workstation.
|
| Obviously not everyone will think this is worth $2000, and
| there's definitely an element of status symbol there, but
| I've genuinely enjoyed owning one.
| 323 wrote:
| But the distribution is important.
|
| The fact that there are some cyclists which actually need a
| $20k bike doesn't mean that the majority of $20k bike
| buyers are not doing it just for status (the famed dentist
| cyclists).
| gaws wrote:
| stephc_int13 wrote:
| The problem with TE is that they are building top quality toys,
| not tools.
|
| Maybe those toys can be used as tools in some niche context, but
| as a non-musician I wouldn't know.
|
| I'd love to see them selling a more general purpose pocket
| computer, with the same high quality design and even the hefty
| price tag.
|
| A pocket computer made for hackers (the tinkering kind)
| geoffeg wrote:
| I wouldn't go so far as to call the OP-1 a toy. The interface
| is definitely limiting but it's also whimsical. I use mine as a
| kind of stress relief tool. It's small, self-contained design
| means I can put my laptop away and focus on playing around and
| creating music.
| amazing_stories wrote:
| As someone who has written a lot of music using Pocket
| Operators I disagree. They have been part of my songwriting
| tool chain for years and have pretty much worked their way into
| every recording I've made since I bought them. They are the
| perfect accompaniment when sitting down with a guitar to write
| music either acting as a metronome, a groove to jam over, or a
| complete drum/bass/synth backup with an arrangement (16
| patterns and 128 measures is enough to write a good song).
| Also, Pocket Operators are cheap as hell, most under $100.
| agentwiggles wrote:
| What's your favorite PO? (or even a couple favorites)
|
| I loved playing with the one I have (I can't remember which
| it is off the top of my head). But it never became a major
| part of my music noodling workflow and now is collecting dust
| somewhere.
|
| I do remember at some point that a friend got a different one
| and I was struck with jealousy over all the cool stuff it
| could do that mine didn't. Maybe it's time to check out a
| different one. Any recommendations?
| asimovfan wrote:
| po-33 is the best one. the sampler. so powerful and so
| cheap.
| sneak wrote:
| It's called the Playdate.
|
| https://play.date/dev/
| hypertele-Xii wrote:
| _General purpose_ pocket computer, he said.
| sneak wrote:
| The demand was "more general purpose", though. The Playdate
| has an SDK and apps. The OP1 does not. I think it applies.
| :)
| stephc_int13 wrote:
| Yeah, this completely the opposite.
|
| Two buttons, no peripherals, clearly a toy.
| _def wrote:
| In a creative context/process I think it is a good thing if you
| can toy around with a device/instrument in a playful way. I'd
| definitely love if they would make their devices hackable
| though, that would unlock so much potential and the community
| is there.
| blueblob wrote:
| As someone not in the field of audio engineering, I had no idea
| what this product is. The website focused on describing all the
| features without giving a simple 1-2 line description of what the
| product even is.
| luckydata wrote:
| it's the kind of thing that if you don't know it's not for you.
| very hipster product for weird electronic musicians, more of a
| fashion statement than anything else really.
| bravura wrote:
| The people complaining about the price tag: I get it.
|
| But the OP-1 is literally the only piece of music gear you can
| bring on an airplane and write a whole song.
|
| Why has no one else figured that out? With all these groove boxes
| etc, why has no other music gear taken the step of being portable
| and all-in-one.
|
| Show me another way to write a song in an airplane, and you can
| have my money.
| 16 wrote:
| https://dirtywave.com/
| [deleted]
| ds0 wrote:
| What's lovely about this post is that it follows the rule of
| bold claims producing interesting counters. Here's my hat in
| the ring: I have had a really good time with the Elektron
| Model: Samples. It's among the cheapest grooveboxes and comes
| with all the effects, parameter locks, and preloaded samples
| you need to do some great things.
| papandada wrote:
| I know it's not the same class, or what you mean, but gosh darn
| have I enjoyed making music with the $10 caustic android app.
| krnlpnc wrote:
| > OP-1 is literally the only piece of music gear you can bring
| on an airplane and write a whole song.
|
| Laptops exist too. And also who is writing whole songs on the
| OP-1? A song needs to be bounced, mastered and uploaded which
| is gonna require another device.
| sneak wrote:
| A $999 Macbook Air costs half as much and has all of the same
| production capabilities and then some.
| throw_m239339 wrote:
| > But the OP-1 is literally the only piece of music gear you
| can bring on an airplane and write a whole song.
|
| This is just false, the Korg Electribe 2/ Sampler, the AKAI MPC
| 500, the Roland SP404, the Roland MC101, the Novation Circuit
| and many other devices allow the creation of whole songs and
| can easily be brought into a plane because they run on internal
| battery.
|
| > Why has no one else figured that out? With all these groove
| boxes etc, why has no other music gear taken the step of being
| portable and all-in-one.
|
| These devices I listed might not do everything the OP-1 does,
| but the OP-1 doesn't do everything these devices do either. The
| OP-1 is hardly an all-in-one music device and certainly not the
| first portable groovebox that runs off battery power.
|
| A Electribe 2/Sampler costs $300, not $2000.
|
| > Show me another way to write a song in an airplane, and you
| can have my money.
|
| Answer my comment and I'll share with you my email for payment
| details. Put your money where your mouth is.
| capableweb wrote:
| > Why has no one else figured that out?
|
| It is literally not the only piece of music gear you can bring
| on a airplane and write a whole song...
|
| Just a recent example, the Syntakt is very capable for writing
| full songs. So is other gear in the Elektron lineup, namely
| Digitakt.
|
| Otherwise you also have (cheaper) gear like the Novation
| Circuit Tracks that can also do the same.
|
| I mean, a cursory search for "portable grooveboxes" should have
| revealed a ton of results for you, that are able to do the same
| job as the OP-1 but for even as low as 1/4 of the price (the
| Circuit Tracks)
| blub wrote:
| The Syntakt is not battery powered. I guess one could buy a
| beefy battery pack and adapter cable, but... what's the
| point?
|
| The Tracks is nice, but the synth engines are not fully
| accessible in the hw interface. At least the params are
| labeled now, trying to change sounds on my original was quite
| frustrating.
| capableweb wrote:
| True that the Syntakt is not battery powered, when needed I
| run it on a battery bank (allowed to bring on the airplane)
| + PD cable. The point is being able to use the same gear I
| use in the studio but for jams where electricity available
| is not great, or being able to bring it wherever I go, as I
| consider the device itself portable, especially considering
| its larger cousins (like the A4, AR or even Octatrack).
|
| Yeah, not being able to 100% customize the synths on the
| Tracks is bothering me as well. Luckily, my workflow is
| usually two parts that I do separate. One for sound design
| (with the Tracks hooked up to the computer) and one for
| everything else. For that, it does just fine, although the
| UX could be better for editing the synths.
| lvl102 wrote:
| It's called Macbook with Logic Pro.
|
| You can send your money directly to Apple.
| arvinsim wrote:
| You can even do it on an iPad!
| lvl102 wrote:
| That's actually better because you have a virtual key bed.
| I've heard that Apple will release Logic for iOS later this
| year.
| romwell wrote:
| >But the OP-1 is literally the only piece of music gear you can
| bring on an airplane and write a whole song. Show me another
| way to write a song in an airplane, and you can have my money.
|
| Assuming you mean _without using a phone, computer, or a
| tablet_ :
|
| Yamaha Reface DX ($400) + Korg SOS Recorder ($100) + TE PO-12
| Rhythm ($60), and you not only have a portable studio, but a
| performer's rig.
|
| I'm powering mine from a powerbank via a USB-to-12V adapter, it
| lasts forever on a charge.
|
| I can busk with Reface DX alone (it's built-in speakers are
| loud enough for a quiet street). Throw in a mini-amp, and it's
| a band.
|
| And it comes with an optional keytar strap too, so I cann sling
| it around my shoulder.
|
| _And_ it 's the best FM synthesizer ever made. Worth it for
| the E-Piano patch and Final Countdown-like leads alone, but the
| real magic comes in realtime manipulation of sound (something
| you couldn't do with the clunky controls of DX-7).
|
| Yeah, I don't know if it fits your "all-in-one" defitinion, but
| surely OP-1 doesn't fit _mine_ : it's missing a proper keyboard
| (my main rig is Yamaha MX-88, and I still say that Reface DX's
| keyboard is _great_ ).
|
| And with some creative application of electrical tape, the drum
| machine / field recorder just become upgrades for the Reface
| DX, giving yout the ultimate unit.
| import wrote:
| You can bring MPC live 2 on an airplane. It's way more capable
| thing if you compare with the OP1.
| jwr wrote:
| > But the OP-1 is literally the only piece of music gear you
| can bring on an airplane and write a whole song.
|
| An iPad running Korg Gadget is much, much more capable, though
| arguably not as hip and cool.
| blub wrote:
| There are a ton of replies with counter-examples, but all of
| those are not exactly like the OP-1: a fun, easy to use,
| ultraportable, immediate music creation sketchpad.
|
| Many other grooveboxes are quite painful to use. Here I'd
| include the Korg Electribe which is terrible at inputting
| musical notes. Or the several trackers which look more like
| scientific calculators than musical instruments. My MPC live
| can run circles around most grooveboxes, the OP-1 included, but
| that's because it's a computer: quite a bit heavier, takes time
| to boot, requires you to manage projects and adjust many
| parameters.
|
| The Model Cycles doesn't have a battery. Can be powered by a
| portable one, but that makes it just a little bit awkward.
| Elektron did launch a handle battery but it tended to catch
| fire in rare circumstances :-) Elektron boxes are in general
| considered difficult to use, even if the results can be
| impressive.
|
| The Novation Circuit doesn't allow full editing of the synth
| parameters. The synth parts are more like preset editors.
| Expect having to manage them from a computer.
|
| The Deluge has a cumbersome buying process, where one has to
| basically buy from the manufacturer (NZ I think). I actually
| can't but it from my/any local store. In reviews I've read that
| the interface is not that user-friendly/immediate.
|
| Then there'a the multi-device set-ups consisting of Volcas,
| Rolands, etc. These can be nice, but it requires wiring them up
| every time! If I had to wire together 3 devices before I could
| make music, I'd rather do something else personally.
|
| And so on and so forth. The new OP-1 is overpriced though.
| Maybe at 1500EUR this would make some sense, but at this price
| point most people would rather deal with the disadvantages of
| other devices or device combos.
| prmoustache wrote:
| Who cares how trackers look. That doesn't mean you can't have
| fun producing music with them.
|
| I own a Model:Samples, the battery is just velcro attached to
| it. This is not awkward, it serves as a tilt stand which is
| actually nice.
|
| The Deluge buying process involve adding to cart, pay. How
| different is it from anything else really?
|
| We are talking about boarding a plane? How boot time of the
| MPC Live/One or a daw on a laptop is relevant?
| seclorum_wien wrote:
| The Deluge is simply an amazing device, and I can confirm
| it is definitely not difficult to purchase.
|
| Also, quite a great company support experience too.
| weatherlight wrote:
| Polyend tracker, any MPC any Elektron groove box, The Roland
| MC-X0X series, Native Instruments Maschine +, Synthstorm
| Deluge, etc.
|
| yep... There's quiet a few :)
| aa-jv wrote:
| I guess you're not yet familiar with the Synthstrom Deluge:
|
| https://synthstrom.com
|
| Far better than the OP-1, by miles ..
|
| See also the 1010music BlackBox:
|
| https://1010music.com/product/blackbox
|
| Easily set up on an airplane seat-table for production.
| agentultra wrote:
| The Deluge is huge (size-wise) compared to the OP-1 and
| doesn't run off batteries, have wifi/bluetooth connectivity,
| sample editing, etc, etc.
|
| It's a nice groovebox but I don't think it really compares.
|
| $2k is a steep price but there's a lot going on here that's
| not immediately obvious to a lot of folks.
| 613style wrote:
| The Deluge does have a built-in rechargable battery and
| basic sample slicing. The new 4.0 firmware added wavetable
| synthesis, euclidean sequencing, MPE/polyphonic aftertouch,
| and tons of other stuff. Their venn diagrams overlap a lot
| but each one has _many_ features the other doesn't.
| Honestly it's a pretty insane device for half the price and
| would be my pick too.
| likeclockwork wrote:
| No, it really isn't. The OP-1 is tiny and Deluge only has
| twice the surface area. Deluge also has an internal
| battery.
|
| I can't even imagine how WiFi or Bluetooth would be useful
| or desirable.
|
| You can do quite a bit with audio on Deluge, as well. Run
| audio clips of unlimited length. Assign audio samples to
| kits.
|
| Sequence as many tracks as you want for as long as you
| want.
|
| Deluge has far fewer limitations than OP-1.
| JoeyJoJoJr wrote:
| Yep, Deluge is the one and only desert island groovebox IMO.
| creativeembassy wrote:
| I ended up getting a Dirtywave M8, but the Deluge was a
| VERY close second. If I ever get tired of the M8, I still
| have my eye on a Deluge.
| aa-jv wrote:
| The latest OS update added a new synthesis method
| (wavetable) too, which is really fun and exciting for those
| of us with a huge wavetable archive to harvest.
|
| Definitely a killer workstation.
| i_am_proteus wrote:
| >Show me another way to write a song in an airplane, and you
| can have my money.
|
| Pencil and staff paper.
|
| My email address is in my profile if you would genuinely like
| to send me your money.
| luluganeta wrote:
| The Polyend tracker makes for a complete portable music-making
| tool as well.
|
| https://polyend.com/tracker/
|
| I'm sure there's others, but it's true that the OP-1 offers an
| impressive feature set for portable production.
| bodge5000 wrote:
| Depends on how you define "a whole song", but I'd say theres
| plenty of other options. In fact I'd go so far as to say the
| polyend tracker is even better than the op-1 for that purpose.
| Even better than that, a standard laptop with a standard DAW.
| Or even an ipad for that matter, which has a great selection of
| its own software.
|
| There are many things the OP-1 does that nothing else can do
| quite the same, but I wouldnt say thats one of them.
| dkdbejwi383 wrote:
| > But the OP-1 is literally the only piece of music gear you
| can bring on an airplane and write a whole song
|
| I could take a pen and some paper and write a whole song. Or
| take my laptop and write, record & mix a whole song. Or an
| iPad. Or the MPC as others have said, the Synthstrom Deluge...
| It's a fun toy, but not unique in that regard.
| lynndotpy wrote:
| Another example: Sunvox, runs on about everything. Extremely
| versatile for something that originally targeted Windows CE and
| Palm Pilot.
|
| I don't make much music, but I've been having a blast tinkering
| with it.
| enneff wrote:
| > But the OP-1 is literally the only piece of music gear you
| can bring on an airplane and write a whole song.
|
| Apart from the several other great options mentioned in other
| replies, there's also the Dirtywave M8. It, and the other
| tracker-style devices like the Polyend, actually make it much
| easier to write proper songs than the OP-1's finnicky and
| unforgiving tape-based recording interface. (I own all these
| devices and have used them extensively.)
|
| But if you are really serious about writing music on a plane
| just use a laptop and a modern DAW.
| Tomte wrote:
| > But the OP-1 is literally the only piece of music gear you
| can bring on an airplane and write a whole song.
|
| I have zero music talent or experience, so let me ask: Would
| there be something missing with a quality soft synth on iPad
| with GarageBand?
|
| The hardware buttons, sure, but is it possible to write a
| "serious" song with such a setup (iPad, paid synth app)?
| comboy wrote:
| Yes. There are channels recreating popular songs in
| garageband on iphone (with no additional paid plugins).
|
| Physical knobs and buttons feel good, OP-1 also forces you to
| commit to specific audio and puts some limitations on yuu
| which may help with creativity.
|
| You can create something amazing using just your phone. But
| to get skill to be able to do that, you likely need toys that
| keep you inspired and make you want to play all day.
| tom-thistime wrote:
| The iPad will work alone, and if you're just starting out
| it's fine. But it's best to add a tiny MIDI keyboard to the
| iPad. For extreme compactness, the Korg Nanokey 2 works well
| for me. It has nontraditional "button" keys, but so does the
| OP-1.
|
| The iPad's touch screen is usable, but its velocity
| sensitivity isn't nearly as good as a hardware keyboard.
| severak_cz wrote:
| Cheaper way is to use Caustic 3 on old Android phone while
| commuting by bus. Been there, done that! :-D
|
| Of course - it's all in software solution but it's pretty
| powerful actually. But it's more like a DAW or tracker style of
| things.
| motogpjimbo wrote:
| There are many other options available - the groovebox market
| is booming right now. Even if you don't consider traditional
| grooveboxes like the Digitakt suitable for creating an actual
| "song", options like the Polyend Tracker are available and the
| modern MPC devices are basically a DAW-in-a-box now, complete
| with software synths.
|
| The OP-1 is cool as hell, but realistically it's a PS500
| musical toy marked up to PS2,000 simply because hipsters
| latched onto the design and marketing of it.
| ugjka wrote:
| Nah, it is not hipsters, they are just doing what Apple is
| doing.
| capableweb wrote:
| Not everyone who likes Teenage Engineering / OP-1 is a
| hipster, that's true. But I think Teenage Engineering /
| OP-1 is the only music making company/music equipment I
| frequently see designer friends post on Instagram/Twitter
| about even if those same friends never made music of their
| own.
| squarefoot wrote:
| > Show me another way to write a song in an airplane, and you
| can have my money.
|
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E54uAhMBA1A
|
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Q_d-rfzZPM
|
| Note that the 1st video is from 2010.
| karmakaze wrote:
| I like others think I want an OP-1 even though I don't know
| exactly what it does. Reminds me of a great ad for an
| electronic measurement bench product with the headline "I want
| it. What does it do?"
|
| I have been looking at the Roland TR-6S or T-8 to go with a
| portable DJ kit like the Reloop Ready.
| idea55 wrote:
| Proper first world drama here; not only must one be able to
| make music on a plane, one must do it with a $2,000 toy!
|
| Why, anything else just can't be done! It's uncivilized!
| [deleted]
| NikolaNovak wrote:
| >> the OP-1 is literally the only piece of music gear you can
| bring on an airplane and write a whole song.
|
| Apart from...
|
| * Laptop with your favourite DAW
|
| * iPad with GarageBand or Android Tablet with Caustic
|
| * I would put Novation Circuit in similar category though
| depends on your definition of whole song
|
| * Synthstorm Deluge
|
| * Digitakt Elektron?
|
| * Some of the Roland grooveboxes and systems
|
| * Some of the Akai APC/MPC or Native Instruments Machine? Not
| fully familiar with either but I thought e.g. Akai Live lets
| you do a full production
|
| * Bunch of other stuff I'm sure I'm forgetting
|
| I feel we are actually in a bonanza and cornucopia of portable
| music creation devices! And that's a good thing :). Heck even
| the Yamaha Reface is super portable, battery powered, real
| keyboard, lots of sounds, and you can hook it up to phone or a
| simple recorder/looper to make good stuff on the go. OP1 might
| be the smallest by some metrics, that may or may not be seen as
| a good thing.
| hypertele-Xii wrote:
| * Korg Electribe
| buescher wrote:
| Yamaha QY70. I remember reading something 20 years ago, maybe
| more, about artists using it to compose while traveling.
| Probably Bjork.
|
| http://www.synthmania.com/qy70.htm
| ciroduran wrote:
| Let's add the Nintendo Switch. I can get the KORG Gadget for
| 30PS and make some sweet tunes. Sure, to get the tunes out
| into something I can export sound from I'd need to get the
| KORG Gadget for iOS or Android, and from there to Ableton
| Live. But I've tried out the KORG Gadget on Switch and it's
| really fun to use.
| nzoschke wrote:
| Another vote for KORG Gadget. I've been more successful
| making music with the iPad app than anything else.
|
| The app is simple and constrained and makes it easy to
| write down sketches.
| biztos wrote:
| * Volca if $SONG < 256
|
| * Kastle while $SONG == $DRONE
|
| * Model::Samples while $SONG in @SAMPLES &&
| isNotOnFire($BATTERY)
|
| * !$BUDGET && PO-33
| lodovic wrote:
| I'm having a hard time imagining boarding an airplane for a 6hr
| flight, whipping out the TE and headphones and then spending
| the entire flight composing a quality song. Really, who does
| that? There is just too much noise from the plane and I'd feel
| like seeking attention.
| beepbooptheory wrote:
| You just need a pencil and paper to write a song on an
| airplane! Also, why would you want to do that? Can't think of a
| less inspiring environment.
| marban wrote:
| Given that the feature list reads almost like new product and the
| OG is already pretty complex, I'm most definitely happier with
| mine now than before.
| capableweb wrote:
| Yeah, "new product" indeed, especially considering these
| "features" from that huge "feature" list:
|
| - NEW COLOR SCHEME
|
| - DUAL VELCRO(r) BACK FASTENERS
|
| - ERGONOMIC POWER SWITCH
|
| - ULTRA-FIDELITY HEADPHONE OUTPUT
|
| - NEW CUSTOM USB CABLE
|
| - NEW FONT
|
| - NEW METRONOME SOUND
|
| - NEW PACKAGING
|
| - QR CODE GUIDE LINK
|
| I'm not gonna lie, I'm generally a teenage engineering fan
| (besides the price that is), but some of those features sounds
| like part of a comedy/sarcastic copy of the actual launch
| website.
| marban wrote:
| Yeah, new packaging might pull me over
| Spunkie wrote:
| They also relist the same feature multiple times in slightly
| different ways ...
|
| - INTERNAL FM ANTENNA FOR BOTH RX AND TX
|
| - BUILT-IN FM RADIO TRANSMISSION
|
| - OB-4 COMPATIBLE USING FM TX OR WIRE
| Shadonototra wrote:
| i have no idea what this is, but what a beautifully designed
| thing, it makes me want to use it, just to feel it lol
| [deleted]
| leach wrote:
| I've always wanted to buy the OP-1 because it's such a cool
| little device. I'm not very talented when it comes to making
| music though so the steep price tag has always kept me away.
| Maybe one day i'll buy one
| [deleted]
| chaosprint wrote:
| Perhaps you can try this to make music in the browser:
|
| https://learningmusic.ableton.com
|
| Or my work:
|
| https://glicol.org
| KingOfCoders wrote:
| $2000 - Teenage engineering worked hard to become an identy
| product and now can charge for it. If you sell identity, no price
| is too high. Do I want one? Yes. Do I buy one? No the identity
| tax is too high for me.
|
| (though I like my Teenage Engineering PO-20, but a Novation
| Circuit works for my dabbling with sequencing).
| chaosprint wrote:
| It looks nice and I may consider buying one for research purpose.
| But I know the price tag can be quite high for many. Maybe that's
| partially the reason that I believe free and open-source software
| is a form or music democratisation. I would like to invite those
| who are interested in this idea to try my live coding project in
| the browser:
|
| https://glicol.org
|
| I have been taking this project to different workshops and there
| will be more. The most unforgettable experience so far is that in
| one place the host can only provide old laptops that can hardly
| run Chrome smoothly. It really makes me think a lot afterwards.
| There are so many people excluded from music making due to the
| price tag.
|
| On the one hand, it's exciting to see the exploration
| aestheticism, design and interaction. But on the other hand, we
| should really consider the democratisation of music tech.
| closedloop129 wrote:
| To make it more democratic, could you add a gui that records
| interactions as glicol source code?
|
| That way it would be possible to immediately start making music
| without having to learn the language first.
| chaosprint wrote:
| I do want to make hardware one day.
| capableweb wrote:
| Talking about making it easier to write music and then linking
| to a programming language for making music feels a bit weird.
| Yes, hardware is a barrier for sure, but a even larger barrier
| would be to put it behind a complicated programming language.
|
| If we really want to "democratize music tech" (whatever that
| means), then I think things like the Korg Volcas are much
| closer to achieving that. Cheaper than most computer hardware,
| very intuitive even for people who never touched a synth
| before, and hardware that is relatively easy to grok, even the
| insides of it. Easy to take apart as well.
|
| The only thing missing from the Volcas would be a completely
| open source design both for the hardware and the firmware. That
| would get us much closer than a programming language for music
| could ever.
| chaosprint wrote:
| Good point! Programming language can be harder to learn. I
| totally agree with it. With a hardware, you can easily make
| some sound. But on the other hand, languages are free and we
| can make the docs and videos so that the learning curve can
| be less steep. I would be amazed if one without any previous
| experience can master, say Mother-32, even with manuals and
| tutorials.
|
| Also, the way I design Glicol (graph-oritend live coding
| language) is actually against normal programming paradigms
| such as FP or OOP. I always let my students to hear and see
| how an audio node works. I would call it as an instrument-
| design perspective. This may also lower the learning bar.
|
| And to compare programming languages with hardware tools, I
| can also mention the logic loop. For example, you can easily
| duplicate 100 oscillators in live coding but generally
| impossible to achieve with hardware synth.
| bambax wrote:
| I disagree. I think there is room for both. I own two Volcas,
| and don't use them much unfortunately.
|
| The problem with hardware is it's extremely difficult, or
| downright impossible, to save state.
|
| On a physical modular synth, the only way to remember what
| you did is to write it down or (maybe) take pictures. On a
| virtual modular synth all you have to do is Save As.
|
| I'm sure OP-1 can save its patches, but that doesn't address
| the problem of the whole chain, or backups.
| capableweb wrote:
| Eh, that's not at all true. Being able to recall state is
| something that has been solved for a long time, but not all
| synths have that functionality, I'll give you that.
|
| As two examples of synths I own that can do this:
|
| - Moog Sirin supports Program Change MIDI messages, so I
| save the state of the current settings via MIDI on my
| Octatrack, and can recall that same state whenever I want
| without touching the hardware of the Sirin
|
| - Novation Summit allows you to save patches with your own
| name + putting it in a category. Recalling the same patch
| is a matter of turning the knob until you arrive there.
|
| Not sure how you arrived to the conclusion that saving
| state is "extremely difficult, or downright impossible".
| bambax wrote:
| > _Not sure how you arrived to the conclusion that saving
| state is "extremely difficult, or downright impossible"._
|
| I was thinking about modular synths mostly, and patching
| cables (also: Volca Modular).
|
| Yes, individual synths can save/export settings, but if
| you want to save a whole combination with different
| machines it's a big headache; whereas in a DAW it's so
| trivial you don't even think about it.
|
| But ok, we are sliding into the "hardware vs software"
| debate, which won't be solved here or there, or ever.
| capableweb wrote:
| > I was thinking about modular synths mostly, and
| patching cables (also: Volca Modular).
|
| Ah yeah, I don't use modular synths myself (and that
| reason is one of them, patching cables manually seems
| like a hassle).
|
| > Yes, individual synths can save/export settings, but if
| you want to save a whole combination with different
| machines it's a big headache; whereas in a DAW it's so
| trivial you don't even think about it.
|
| As mentioned earlier, Program Change MIDI messages solve
| this. I have about 10 hardware devices I use for music
| making, and all of them responds to Program Change
| messages. Everything is driven by the Octatrack, so
| changing the project/pattern on the Octatrack makes every
| device in my studio load the right patch instantly. Once
| you've setup the audio/MIDI routing with your hardware,
| it's actually pretty easy to use.
|
| > But ok, we are sliding into the "hardware vs software"
| debate, which won't be solved here or there, or ever.
|
| Agree :) For some, hardware is better, for others
| software is better. Truth is probably somewhere in-
| between and/or both depending on context.
| varispeed wrote:
| Why do you need to save state? If you don't, it helps you
| finish the project and move onto the next one. And if you
| do it every day, then you could likely dial in any settings
| from your own memory quicker that it would have taken to
| menu dive and load from disk.
| bambax wrote:
| I need to save state because I don't finish projects in
| one sitting, and I don't have enough room (or money) to
| have different instances of the same machine lying around
| forever.
|
| MIDI controllers are great (and I even built a couple
| myself) to let one interact physically with an
| instrument. But I'm not sure I get the appeal of physical
| synths.
|
| To each their own though. I'm not trying to convince
| anyone. I'm just saying the key to more music is not
| necessarily more physical objects; more software is also
| great.
| bambax wrote:
| > _https://glicol.org_
|
| This looks absolutely fantastic! Thanks for sharing.
|
| Live coding in a VST (like this project
| https://www.osar.fr/protoplug/) would be the next thing?
|
| > _remember to play with line 14_
|
| On my screen, line numbers are almost invisible (.CodeMirror-
| linenumber #e0e2e5).
| chaosprint wrote:
| Live coding in VST is already possible:
| https://youtu.be/tmmBhBmIEW0
|
| Glicol is also an audio library, so you can write VST plugin
| with Glicol: https://github.com/chaosprint/dattorro-vst-rs
| bambax wrote:
| Wow. Absolutely amazing.
|
| About writing VSTs, does it require JUCE, etc.?
| chaosprint wrote:
| No, it uses EGUI in Rust for the GUI, and Glicol synth as
| the audio engine. The link of that repo is actually a
| GitHub template so one can easily customise it to any
| audio effect.
| tmountain wrote:
| You might like this too.
|
| http://ernestmicklei.com/melrose/introduction_melrose/
|
| Really cool project that lets you drive your DAW
| programmatically.
| riwsky wrote:
| Bon Iver, 2015 interview:
|
| > the thing I'm working with the most is the OP-1. It's a
| sampler-based synthesizer, and I honestly think it's the most
| important instrument that's come into my life since I first
| picked up a guitar when I was 12 years old. I'm not exaggerating
| at all. I never leave the house without it. I don't travel with
| the guitar anymore. I travel with just my OP-1. It's been a big
| deal living with this thing. I love making music with it. I love
| traveling with it. I like using it as a writing extension. It's a
| really special technology, essentially what a guitar is to me.
|
| https://grantland.com/hollywood-prospectus/lost-in-the-world...
| neoCrimeLabs wrote:
| The newly announced Polyend Play and Teenage Engineering OP-1
| Field are great examples of very different UX and very different
| workflows to solve a similar problem - making music without a
| computer, creatively, ideally with a flow state.
|
| It's very interesting just looking at how they do it.
|
| Dunno if I will get either one, or both. Either way, I do
| appreciate the direction they are going in. :-)
| 22c wrote:
| Link should be https://teenage.engineering/products/op-1
| anentropic wrote:
| The design is beautiful, but it's not really clear from this page
| what it is.
| validuser wrote:
| It's a groovebox - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Groovebox
| dkdbejwi383 wrote:
| It's quite obvious to me that it's a keyboard instrument from
| the first picture alone. The copy gives plenty of information
| on the synthesis and sampling capabilities.
| anentropic wrote:
| Yeah I can see it has a keyboard, presumably some kind of
| synthesiser.
|
| It also appears to have some recording facility, but not
| clear how to get audio into it - can't tell what ports it
| has. Is the recording feature just for sequencing internal
| sample and synth sounds?
|
| Or... they highlight the new version now has a 2.4ghz antenna
| - do you stream audio in/out over bluetooth?
|
| A little explanation of basically what it can do or how they
| imagine it being used would go a long way
| filoleg wrote:
| > not clear how to get audio into it
|
| In terms of wired connectors, it has USB-C, line in and out
| sockets, and a 4-pole audio jack for headset or mic
| support. OP-1 also has its own mic built into the body as
| well.
| dkdbejwi383 wrote:
| I think both of your questions are answered on the page.
| Maybe not in the direct manner in which you have asked, but
| my understanding is that recording is possible with the
| mixer accessory mentioned towards the bottom, and the
| antennas are for the Bluetooth MIDI feature heavily
| emphasised towards the top.
|
| Maybe they do need a FAQ with a basic Q&A format, though.
| e.g.
|
| Why does it have antennas?
|
| How do I record?
|
| What do the knobs do?
|
| How many instruments are included?
|
| How do I transfer recordings to my computer or phone?
|
| etc.
| krnlpnc wrote:
| From 2011:
|
| Finally. After more than two years of development the OP-1 is now
| ready for production. Due to initial limited supply we now accept
| reservations. Manufacturing, assembly and shipping will be eight
| weeks.
|
| $799
|
| https://web.archive.org/web/20110201230202/http://namm.teena...
| tibbon wrote:
| As a studio enthusiast and electronic musician, I always felt
| this was a reasonable price for the OP-1. I have a _lot_ of
| synths here, ranging from the high end Moog Voyager to various
| Pocket Operators by Teenage Engineering.
|
| $2000 however is just too much for this. The Polyend Tracker
| sells for $500 used in comparison, and while its drastically
| different - is vaguely competitive to the OP-1.
| tarentel wrote:
| Polyend also just announced another groovebox that is vaguely
| competitive to the op-1 for $800. Looks a bit like a slimmed
| down deluge, which for half the price of the new OP-1, I
| would highly recommend to anyone who wants a portable music
| station or groovebox in general. I've had it for about 5
| years now and they are still actively working on it which is
| a nice bonus.
| tweetle_beetle wrote:
| Wasn't it originally manufactured in Europe to boot? Seem to
| remember a major price rise coming when they had moved
| production to Asia. There were many people selling their used
| European models for more than they had paid because it was
| still cheaper than the new RRP.
|
| I guess TE took advantage of demand for an established product
| and use it to subsidise their other lines and new development,
| which I can't see them selling much volume on for the most part
| (maybe Pocket Operators?).
| baisq wrote:
| Someone put "image-rendering: optimizespeed;" in the css and all
| the images look blocky.
| bowsamic wrote:
| It's part of their aesthetic
| capableweb wrote:
| -\\_(tsu)_/-
| baisq wrote:
| That's not how any of this works.
| [deleted]
| aosaigh wrote:
| Who is this for? Is it for music professionals who can actually
| record music (or ideas) on the go? Or is it for wealthy
| enthusiasts who have cash to throw around at a fun piece of kit?
|
| It's a beautiful piece of hardware from a design-first company
| and from all the reviews of the original it seems to be an
| excellent and unique music making machine, but at the price I'm
| just not sure who it's aimed at.
|
| I'm not a musician but I've played the piano for a lot of my
| life. I'd love to experiment with making music and the original
| OP-1 looked like a lot of fun. I'd kept my eye on it and was
| thinking of pulling the trigger. At $1k+ though it was a total
| stretch for a non-professional. The new OP-1 at $2k+ is just
| ludicrous.
| comboy wrote:
| It's not ludicrous. It's rational decision on their part. OP-1
| is still available, expensive and sells well.
|
| If you want to experiment you have everything you want on your
| laptop. There are many alternative cheaper solutions. It is
| somewhat unique and well thought-out. The fact that you were
| considering it at $1k just proves their point.
| enneff wrote:
| It's a great bit of fun that can produce interesting and
| surprising sounds. For a lot of musicians a fun piece of gear
| can be a source of inspiration, which can be very valuable. So
| yeah, it's a toy, but you can make real music with toys.
| zasdffaa wrote:
| The cow. Why?
| thih9 wrote:
| There are some nice improvements, but also:
|
| > ERGONOMIC POWER SWITCH
|
| > NEW METRONOME SOUND
|
| > NEW PACKAGING
|
| > INCREASED TOMBOLA SIMULATION ACCURACY
|
| It's nice to have a company that doesn't take themselves too
| seriously. How are people paying 2k for that though, I do not
| know.
| possibleworlds wrote:
| Off topic, but does anyone have stereo OD11s? I'm seriously
| interested in these as an alternative to spending too much money
| on a two channel system that beams at a single sweet spot.
| polyterative wrote:
| great design
| 0atman wrote:
| I clicked through to the store thinking "Come on TE, what
| pricepoint have you set this time", and it's $2,000. Two grand. I
| chuckled, and closed the tab.
| cushychicken wrote:
| If any business on this site has taken to heart the advice to
| charge more, it's Teenage Engineering.
|
| Doesn't really seem to be hurting them, now, does it?
| iamricks wrote:
| If you can't be the cheapest be the most expensive
| motogpjimbo wrote:
| For the same money it would be possible to buy the full version
| of a DAW of your choice, Kontakt, Arturia V-Collection and a PC
| to run them all on. I'm sure the OP-1 is fun, but I doubt it's
| PS2,000 worth of fun.
| capableweb wrote:
| And the debate of hardware vs software continues!
|
| It's true that if you just compare the costs, it might be
| cheaper to go the software route. But I mainly make music to
| go away from the computer, as I spend a lot of my days
| programming on one already. And the ability of pulling me
| away from the computer you can't put a price on :)
|
| Plus, fiddling with real knobs that affect the sound in real-
| time, having a keyboard with a heavy feel, being able to turn
| on the hardware and instantly be able to use it (no fucking
| around with forced updates) and the ability to mod your own
| hardware with just a solder-iron is just like really really
| fun.
| motogpjimbo wrote:
| In hardware terms, it's the same price as a Yamaha Montage.
| The OP-1 isn't good value for money no matter how you look
| at it.
| goldenkey wrote:
| Utility decreases as one acquires more money. For someone
| with a lot of money the OP-1 might be worth it.
|
| But yes, on an objective scale, the OP-1 is not
| competitive.
| capableweb wrote:
| Sorry, didn't want to give the impression that the OP-1
| (original or this one) is good money spent, because that
| I don't think. The price of this (+ the rest of their
| products) are wildly over-priced. I was more talking
| about the whole software VS hardware side of things.
|
| If I had $2000 to throw around, I'd buy a Syntakt +
| Digitone/Digitakt instead and get a setup that could do
| whatever I want + more.
| motogpjimbo wrote:
| No, I was just pointing out that its functionality
| doesn't really justify the price tag when you compare it
| with what's also available elsewhere. PS2,000 would also
| buy you a Korg Minilogue XD, a Korg Opsix, a Korg
| Wavestate AND some form of groovebox or hardware
| sequencer to tie them all together, if you like small
| form factor gear.
| capableweb wrote:
| > No, I was just pointing out that its functionality
| doesn't really justify the price tag when you compare it
| with what's also available elsewhere
|
| Yeah, I agree with that, which I thought my previous
| comment made clear, maybe I wasn't clear enough.
| [deleted]
| skinpop wrote:
| I hate working with DAWS and plugins. I went all in on
| modular a few years ago and wish I had done so a decade
| earlier.
| monatron wrote:
| I remember buying the first OP-1 when it came out for something
| around $700 and even then thought "wow, this is a stretch".
| Since then they _raised_ the price of the original north of
| $1k. Don't get me wrong, TE makes incredible stuff and the OP-1
| is no exception, but the price point just doesn't make sense
| unless you have serious money to burn. I had the same reaction
| to you after seeing the price for the mk2. At least, like a lot
| of synths, they hold their value?
| agloeregrets wrote:
| > but the price point just doesn't make sense unless you have
| serious money to burn.
|
| Meanwhile, the OP-1 was used on like 40% of all modern pop
| music production process.
|
| I think the market is massively successful artists and they
| know they will pay.
| wyre wrote:
| Absolutely not. Ableton Live is used much more and I would
| be suprised if their market share was 40%.
| sramsay wrote:
| Absolutely no way.
| JoeyJoJoJr wrote:
| 40%? That seems like a lot. Where did that number come
| from?
| objclxt wrote:
| > Meanwhile, the OP-1 was used on like 40% of all modern
| pop music production process.
|
| I'd love to see a citation for that. Lots of artists use it
| for demos, and it's a good live tool, but if you look at
| modern pop it's being produced with soft synths or
| Sequentials, Rolands, Korgs, etc.
| fbanon wrote:
| LOL! Blatantly false.
| throw_m239339 wrote:
| > Meanwhile, the OP-1 was used on like 40% of all modern
| pop music production process.
|
| Citation needed, given how poorly its synthesizer engine
| sounds, I do not believe that the case one second. It's
| certainly hip among hobbyists though because praised by a
| bunch of youtube influencers...
|
| To me your comment sounds like something you just made up
| entirely.
| radiKal07 wrote:
| source?
| capableweb wrote:
| > At least, like a lot of synths, they hold their value?
|
| Like most synths, it seems so. Obviously not adjusted for the
| launch of the new "field" OP-1 yet, but locally (EU country)
| the OP-1 seems to go for about 700-1000 EUR second-hand. New
| one in stores here seems to still be 1100+ EUR (closest store
| to me lists it at ~1200 EUR new).
| xcambar wrote:
| TE does greatly, as a cult.
|
| Also, good products.
| bodge5000 wrote:
| > Also, good products
|
| Kind of. In my experience, design gets priority over things
| like usability and durability. My OP-Z is barely usable after
| a few years of owning it due to the (admittedly nice)
| material the chasis is made of. The buttons frequently double
| trig, the dials have popped out, and it's got a bit of a bend
| in it.
|
| I also get some mis-trig issues on the pocket operators,
| though for the price I don't mind them as much. The original
| OP-1 didnt seem to have these issues at least.
|
| That being said, I've never been able to fully replace my
| OP-Z with anything else on offer so yeh, they're innovative
| if nothing else.
| import wrote:
| I have mixed feelings about OP1. It's like a cave man jam toy but
| also something capable of creating accidental awesomeness. 2000$
| is questionable. I wonder what we will see in the sponsored
| YouTube videos.
| varispeed wrote:
| Product development of such calibre is expensive, especially
| given the volatility of the supply chains today. $2000 given
| what you get is a bargain. Mind you, it's not a product being
| manufactured at scale like mobile phones. The cost of
| development of the enclosure alone must have taken several
| mortgages ;-)
| mit20220401 wrote:
| have read some comments here:
|
| > "They have the best designers, i feel like in the US we have no
| taste, i knew this couldn't be an American company." -- @iamricks
|
| how about monome (https://monome.org/norns)?
|
| @chaosprint
|
| glicol is cool. another two interesting live coding languages are
| tidal (https://tidalcycles.org) and orca
| (https://100r.co/site/orca.html)
| capableweb wrote:
| HN is usually fine when it comes to the technical details about
| music making and new instruments. But if you want to read
| opinions from people who make music but not all of them are
| technical, here are some other threads to follow:
|
| - https://www.elektronauts.com/t/new-op1-field/172653
|
| - https://op-forums.com/t/new-op-1-field/21969
|
| - https://old.reddit.com/r/OP1users/comments/unwdo9/op1_just_g...
|
| Surprisingly, no thread at gearspace yet
| gitowiec wrote:
| Too expensive. But I'm glad there are people that can utilise it
| well! Eg. RedMeansRecording channel on YouTube!
| verilux68 wrote:
| How many of the people in this thread saying:
|
| The OP-1 is only for rich techies. Musicians don't use it.
|
| Are folks who enjoy making music & who have tried the OP-1?
| voigt wrote:
| I hope for 2k bugs it has at least an ,,undo"-button.
|
| The classic op1 doesn't have one. Would increase my productivity
| dramatically.
| capableweb wrote:
| Unlikely. People hailed the lack of undo (and the tape-
| recorder) as a feature because it makes you either commit to
| your mistakes, or having to re-record. Not for me, but that's
| what I've heard people say about it.
|
| And also, "undo" is mentioned nowhere, and since they add "new
| packaging" to their list of features, I think undo would be
| mentioned there if it had it. I've heard an equal amount of
| people praising the lack of undo, as berating the OP-1 for
| lacking one, so they surely would have added it if they wanted
| to.
| [deleted]
| elliotlarson wrote:
| Even for a Teenage Engineering product, I have sticker shock over
| this and their field mixer. They're nice products, but the
| premium is so high. I mean, I kind of get it. Their original OP-1
| remains the top selling synth after 10 years. And the product is
| much loved and used (at least on Youtube). But, for the price of
| an OP-1 Field you can get a couple of Elektron digi-boxes, with a
| bit of money left over. This is certainly more portable... but
| wow $2,000 is a bit steep. I mean, I still want it, of course.
| xdfgh1112 wrote:
| I was just about to sell my OP-1 too, there goes the resale
| price.
| bodge5000 wrote:
| And here comes my chance at finally getting an OP-1 ;)
| post_break wrote:
| Let me know what you're selling it for, I've always wanted one
| but never been able to afford it.
| marban wrote:
| I bought mine 3 months ago at sticker price. I hear you.
| cestith wrote:
| This is yet another Teenage Engineering bauble that as an
| interested amateur I love to look at and at 1/4 to 1/3 the price
| might consider buying. I'm glad their target market can justify
| their prices because their stuff is really nice. I'm just not
| part of it.
| fbanon wrote:
| I know a number of electronic musicians, and none of them has an
| OP-1, or anything from TE. The only person I know with an OP-1 is
| a designer at a startup I worked for, and he "didn't get around
| using it much _yet_ ".
|
| So yeah, the $2000 price point will work great for them, given
| their customer demographics :)
| paxys wrote:
| Heck I doubt anyone in the music production industry even knows
| what Teenage Engineering is. They make toys for rich techies,
| but that's it.
| Slow_Hand wrote:
| Record producer here. We certainly do. It's a well-known
| product that's not uncommon to see being used by people.
|
| I'd never decide to use one for my needs, but it is common
| enough to find among many music makers.
| alin23 wrote:
| Well there's this guy on YouTube who demos all kinds of synths
| and got a huge following from his OP-1 videos:
| https://youtu.be/7z4hoazra_g
|
| The video shows me that OP-1 is a pretty cool all-in-one
| package, but it probably needs honing a special skill to work
| with it as smoothly as that guy does.
| mrkwse wrote:
| Even with RMR though, he's pretty much moved away from the
| OP-1 videos, I can't recall the video where he explained why
| 100%, but I think he found it a bit creatively constraining.
| dbeley wrote:
| Yeah what he doesn't show is the difficulty of learning all
| the quirks and features of the OP-1.
|
| Professional musicians or even hobbyists prefer to buy
| several specialized devices that do one thing very well
| instead of having a very expensive device that can do a
| little bit of everything but with some limitations.
| j5r5myk wrote:
| I know a few professional musicians who have them and you can
| look up a host of famous musicians who are known to use them:
| Diplo, Bon Iver, Deadmau5, Yasutaka Nakata, even Ariana Grande
| has one. It seems to occupy a similar space to the Elektron
| products --- high end with a steep learning curve
| dreamcompiler wrote:
| This is an absolutely magical device that nevertheless makes me
| sad.
|
| When I was a kid I thought I'd be riding around in flying cars by
| now. The problem ended up surprising me: It's not that flying
| cars don't exist--they do. The problem is they cost a million
| dollars because every one is built by hand. So there's no way
| I'll ever own one.
|
| I'd also like to have a portable synth with great sound, long
| battery life, a multitude of handy features, and excellent
| design. But it's the same surprising problem as the flying cars:
| The technology to build it exists but it costs 10x what I'd be
| comfortable paying.
|
| I'd be okay paying 2x for the great design, but 10x just makes
| the thing a piece of wealth-signifying jewelry. Even if somebody
| gave me one, I'd never want anybody to know I had it.
| randomcarbloke wrote:
| I do want it but man is it expensive, $1999...
| thallavajhula wrote:
| I have no idea what this device even is, but it looks beautiful
| and I want to try it out.
| planb wrote:
| I have absolutely no use for the products made by teenage
| engineering, as I don't have a clue about audio production. But
| scolling thought their store, I still want to own these beatiful
| devices.
| iamricks wrote:
| paxys wrote:
| Weird thing to say considering all of their designs are
| clearly influenced by an American company (Apple).
| blairbeckwith wrote:
| As a non-designer, I don't have the skills or the
| vocabulary to say whether this is true or not, but at first
| glance Apple and Teenage Engineering seem to share little
| in common. Can anyone who knows better enlighten me?
| IE6 wrote:
| Whenever TE is mentioned here I always struggle with the
| parallel to apple. As a non-designer too Apple always
| embodies form over function minimalism and these TE
| products seem to be almost entirely function over form.
| rasz wrote:
| Last time I checked Dieter Rams never worked for Apple, so
| Braun it is.
| crispyambulance wrote:
| Great design and designers exist everywhere. There's nothing
| extrinsic to the companies in the US, Europe or Asia that
| makes any of them better at design. It's all about the
| internals of the companies themselves.
|
| I would say, however, that Teenage Engineering is "small"
| enough to take the kinds of risks that bigger companies just
| aren't able to do (even with much more money). Here's a fast
| company article (https://www.fastcompany.com/3016739/more-
| than-an-office-teen...) from 2015. They claim wide variety of
| backgrounds and keep their facilities modest. At the time
| they released the first incarnation of the OP-1, they had 30
| employees.
|
| Contrast that with KORG, who a few years ago created a "lab"
| in Berlin staffed with superstars with intention of creating
| ground-breaking music tech (https://youtu.be/Y0NY6iUqbEM).
| They clearly poured A LOT of money into that venture. Similar
| kind of hipster vibe, but what became of it? I don't know but
| it seems like Teenage Engineering is doing just fine.
| capableweb wrote:
| > Contrast that with KORG, who a few years ago created a
| "lab" in Berlin staffed with superstars with intention of
| creating ground-breaking music tech
| (https://youtu.be/Y0NY6iUqbEM). They clearly poured A LOT
| of money into that venture. Similar kind of hipster vibe,
| but what became of it? I don't know but it seems like
| Teenage Engineering is doing just fine.
|
| That seems to have been kicked off just short of two years
| ago. Building hardware, especially this kind of hardware,
| takes a long long time to even reach the prototype stage,
| even longer to get it out of production. I'm sure the OP-1
| Field we saw launched today has been in development since
| (or even before) the first OP-1 was launched, 10 years ago.
| janekm wrote:
| Not to mention that the last 2 years haven't been the
| easiest for electronics product development ;(
| s1mon wrote:
| TE also does general industrial design work for external
| clients. Their mechanical engineering capabilities seemed
| less fully developed.
|
| I like their ID work, but at some level it seems more like
| well-proportioned, carefully considered graphic design -
| rectilinear forms with radii and cylindrical knobs. I can't
| count the number of ID projects I've worked on where an OP-1
| was used as inspiration.
|
| [source: A company I worked for worked on a project which
| started with TE doing ID and ME. We took their prototype
| level ME further, but not sure where the project ended up.]
| invalidusernam3 wrote:
| What about Apple? I think most Apple products are incredibly
| beautiful
| MetaWhirledPeas wrote:
| Agreed. The OP-1 always reminded me of the IIgs keyboard.
|
| https://i0.wp.com/jdanatrent.com/wp-
| content/uploads/AppleIIG...
| smoldesu wrote:
| Funny how the "beautiful" of yesteryear looks like Yet
| Another Beige Box today.
| jhbadger wrote:
| I don't think the Apple "Snow White design language"
| products like the IIgs look like generic beige boxes
| (those were the uninspired IBM products which cared
| little about looks that were beige), but it is
| interesting how white has fallen out of favor as a
| computer color to be replaced by unpainted aluminum or
| black. The black craze was probably inspired by the NeXT
| cube which was the epitome of cool in the late 80s-early
| 90s.
| throw_m239339 wrote:
| Teenage engineering synth designs are blatantly copied
| from old Casio synths and calculators:
|
| TE:
|
| https://images.musicstore.de/images/1280/teenage-
| engineering...
|
| casio:
|
| https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DJKofVLVYAAdKoq.jpg
|
| TE:
|
| https://img.kytary.com/eshop_fr/velky_v2/na/6369949662008
| 700...
|
| casio
|
| https://cf.shopee.com.my/file/59a4ec33a7568b15f89ecd821e0
| bd8...
|
| But there something Ive-ish with the design as well,
| certainly.
| catlifeonmars wrote:
| "Blatant copy" seems like a stretch to me. They
| definitely seem like they could have been inspired by the
| Casio designs you linked.
| devin wrote:
| I don't see it, tbh.
| tomashubelbauer wrote:
| For something to be a blatant copy I'd expect when shown
| both samples of work, one could imagine how multiple
| people would have come up with the same end result based
| on the same inspiration, no innovation or invention of
| their own put into the process. When I look at the Casio
| products, sure, the general inspiration definitely could
| have come from those, but it's hard to see how one could
| honestly claim TE have not invested any innovation or
| invention of their own when coming up with their products
| even if inspired by Casio. "Blatant copy" is an
| incredible stretch.
| throw_m239339 wrote:
| > For something to be a blatant copy I'd expect when
| shown both samples of work, one could imagine how
| multiple people would have come up with the same end
| result based on the same inspiration, no innovation or
| invention of their own put into the process. When I look
| at the Casio products, sure, the general inspiration
| definitely could have come from those, but it's hard to
| see how one could honestly claim TE have not invested any
| innovation or invention of their own when coming up with
| their products even if inspired by Casio. "Blatant copy"
| is an incredible stretch.
|
| Some of these devices are popular and more than 30 year
| old. And these are not Teenage Engineering's...
|
| Of course TE copied Casiotone series and of course TE
| designers knows very well they exist.
|
| Old Casiotone synth designs are absolutely unique in the
| history of synth industry.
| Puts wrote:
| I mean there is no secret that Teenage Engineering is very
| inspired by the European early and mid 1900s design movement.
| I remember hearing an interview with Jesper Kouthoofd the
| lead Designer about how they approach product design in the
| same way as graphic design, just with more surfaces then a
| paper. Everything is based on a grid (Josef Muller-Brockmann
| and the International design movement), with focus on simple
| shapes and a few primary colors (Bauhaus). And just comparing
| the OB-4 speaker with the Braun T520 radio I think it's safe
| to say that Dieter Rams has also been a great inspiration.
|
| So for sure there is a lot of European design heritage going
| in to these products. But personally I think the main reason
| we don't see this kind of design coming from the US right now
| simply comes down to the fact that minimalism as a concept
| goes against typical North-American culture.
| filoleg wrote:
| > _Bosch T520_
|
| Just a tiny nitpick, did you mean Braun T520 by any
| chance?[0]
|
| 0. https://www.radiomuseum.org/r/braun_kofferempfaenger_t52
| 0.ht...
| Puts wrote:
| Sorry, you're right of course! :)
| danielvaughn wrote:
| same! I'm vaguely interested in the idea of programmatically
| creating music, but I don't think that's the TE products are
| for, but still...I want one.
| throw_m239339 wrote:
| httpsterio wrote:
| I beg to differ. I mean sure, the OP-1 isn't as versatile as
| a laptop with a good daw and a few plugins but hardware still
| has its' place in some producers' gear bag. For a standalone
| device it's extremely versatile and it does sound good.
| throw_m239339 wrote:
| > I beg to differ. I mean sure, the OP-1 isn't as versatile
| as a laptop with a good daw and a few plugins but hardware
| still has its' place in some producers' gear bag. For a
| standalone device it's extremely versatile and it does
| sound good.
|
| First, we're not talking about hardware in general but that
| TE device precisely and second "it sounds good" is really a
| matter of taste here, the synth engine is very limited and
| the first version didn't sound really good given its price.
| This is absolutely a hipster device, just like all TE
| products.
|
| https://teenage.engineering/products/ob-4 650EUR for a
| freaking radio?
|
| Don't make it about hardware vs software, this red herring
| has nothing to do with my comment.
| sdenton4 wrote:
| I've seen the op-1 I'm the stage kits of a bunch of my
| favorite artists. Nine inch nails, Zola Jesus, Dan Deacon
| come to mind...
| verilux68 wrote:
| What was your experience when you tried out the OP-1?
| xd1936 wrote:
| Same. I have two of their Pocket Operators[1] which I love, and
| an OB-4 radio[2], but I'm mostly an enthusiast of their work
| from afar. If you're casually interested in messing around with
| music, the POs are a lot of fun and relatively inexpensive!
|
| 1. https://teenage.engineering/products/po
|
| 2. https://teenage.engineering/products/ob-4
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