[HN Gopher] The Return of New York Harbor's Oysters
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       The Return of New York Harbor's Oysters
        
       Author : dnetesn
       Score  : 90 points
       Date   : 2022-04-22 11:58 UTC (2 days ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (nautil.us)
 (TXT) w3m dump (nautil.us)
        
       | yelnatz wrote:
       | I wanted pictures of the oysters but instead I got pictures of a
       | guy staring at my soul.
        
         | bombcar wrote:
         | I wonder what they look like underwater after they've had time
         | to settle.
        
           | drewcoo wrote:
           | I bet he has the same stare.
        
         | lr wrote:
         | https://www.billionoysterproject.org/reefs
        
         | jonahbenton wrote:
         | Here's Big
         | 
         | https://static01.nyt.com/images/2021/11/29/nyregion/00ny-oys...
        
       | bogomipz wrote:
       | This is a good recent article that has much more history of
       | oysters in NYC, the causes of their demise as well as recent
       | restoration efforts(including the Billion Oyster Project.)
       | 
       | https://untappedcities.com/2021/02/03/history-new-york-city-...
        
       | DoreenMichele wrote:
       | _Tell me why oysters are a keystone species.
       | 
       | Oysters are just like the trees in a forest. You don't think of
       | them that way, but it's the same with coral reef systems--without
       | the coral, there's no coral reef. There's no biodiversity.
       | Oysters used to be the landscape of New York Harbor, which
       | stretched over hundreds of thousands of acres in a three-
       | dimensional habitat. They provided food for all these different
       | animals. There are over 100 species of fish that historically
       | either lived in, found their mates in, or laid their eggs in New
       | York Harbor oyster reefs.
       | 
       | Fundamentally, all of our environmental problems are people
       | problems, so if you ignore the people around the ecosystem and
       | try to restore New York Harbor, it won't have a lasting impact._
       | 
       | I like this guy's thinking.
        
         | newsclues wrote:
         | How do you solve people problems without eugenics?
        
           | bobthepanda wrote:
           | It's described in TFA, or at least the part relevant to the
           | oysters:
           | 
           | > Every time it rains, hundreds of millions of gallons of
           | untreated household wastewater pours right out into the
           | harbor. And that shouldn't be a thing.
           | 
           | The problem is that New York has an ancient combined
           | stormwater+sewage system that is designed for the rainstorms
           | of long ago, so regular flooding events overwhelm sewage and
           | require these overflows in the harbor lest the pipes back up
           | into houses and the street. Modern cities get around this by
           | both reducing the amount of nonporous surfaces (and thus
           | diverting less water into the system), or by separating
           | stormwater drainage so that an overflow isn't mixed with
           | sewage.
        
             | newsclues wrote:
             | Yes, so some view it as economically cheaper for many
             | humans to cease living, rather than to upgrade the
             | infrastructure.
        
               | pixl97 wrote:
               | My answer to them is
               | 
               | "You first"
        
               | qiskit wrote:
               | What a gentleman.
        
               | newsclues wrote:
               | The problem is that they get power and enforce their
               | views on others.
        
               | bobthepanda wrote:
               | who is actually in power and actually enforcing
               | involuntary population control in a democracy?
               | 
               | it's definitely a very fringe opinion.
        
         | [deleted]
        
         | ethbr0 wrote:
         | I thought the part before your second excerpt was insightful as
         | well.
         | 
         | > _We're trying to restore a billion oysters to New York Harbor
         | and to engage a million people in that work by 2035. By setting
         | these goals, we're basically saying that we must stop thinking
         | of habitat restoration and improving public education as two
         | separate issues. The best way to improve outcomes for both is
         | to combine them and train students to restore the environment.
         | [...]_
         | 
         | Environmental impact is all about scaling: either because your
         | process is self-multiplying or because part of your process is
         | training >1 people who will carry on and contribute to the
         | work.
         | 
         | You can be the best, most productive oyster farmer in the
         | world, but there's always going to be a cap to what you can do
         | alone. Physical processes need physical muscle.
        
       | rr808 wrote:
       | I remember last time this came up a bunch of reefs were eaten by
       | some kind of worm or parasite. I can't see now, does anyone know
       | about this?
        
       | LB232323 wrote:
       | I'm not much for eating oysters, but these are the kind of
       | leaders we really need. People with the will and means to inspire
       | real, practical hope in our future.
       | 
       | These are the "first movers" who really matter, those with the
       | vision and confidence to make positive changes in their community
       | and surroundings. People with the hope and confidence to give us
       | hope and confidence in our future.
       | 
       | So while I may not be much of an oyster eater, I commend Mr.
       | Malinowski and his successful efforts to restore the waters of
       | our precious land. From the harbors of New York City to every
       | corner of this Earth, our land is worth saving. Our future is
       | worth protecting and our people deserve hope.
        
       | Amorymeltzer wrote:
       | A nice little blog from the NYPL about New York Oysters:
       | <https://www.nypl.org/blog/2011/06/01/history-half-shell-inte...>
        
       | pm90 wrote:
       | There's a nice Vox explainer for this:
       | https://youtu.be/UcN6RXT7qpw.
       | 
       | The part that's exciting for me is that these are variable (not
       | static) barriers. I love solutions like these that intelligently
       | use nature. eg in coastal areas in more tropical biomes, mangrove
       | forests are a good flood control mechanism and their destruction
       | has lead to excess flooding in a number of well documented cases
       | (like Mumbai).
        
       | dr_dshiv wrote:
       | Are there any domesticated sea plants or animals, akin to
       | (genetically) domesticated plants or animals on land?
        
         | jagger27 wrote:
         | Farmed salmon comes to mind.
        
         | micromacrofoot wrote:
         | ask sea world how that's worked out for them
        
         | r3trohack3r wrote:
         | Tangentially related:
         | https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_marine_mammal
        
         | msrenee wrote:
         | Not sea animals per se, but goldfish and Betta fish are
         | definitely domesticated.
        
       | philshem wrote:
       | Related New Yorker article from 2021
       | 
       | > How a landscape architect is enlisting nature to defend our
       | coastal cities against climate change--and doing it on the cheap.
       | 
       | https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2021/08/09/the-seas-are-r...
        
       | GeekyBear wrote:
       | Another nice idea is removing obsolete river dams to give fish
       | access to their former breeding grounds upstream.
       | 
       | >The removal of both dams, in conjunction with active stocking of
       | alewives into lakes and ponds upriver and in other parts of the
       | watershed, has helped the river herring population rebound
       | dramatically. The number of alewives returning to spawn jumped
       | from 78,000 in 1999 to 5.5 million last year.
       | 
       | And the downstream estuary has reaped rewards, too.
       | 
       | When those billions of juvenile river herring leave the
       | freshwater lakes and rivers, they head for the sea and may spend
       | between three and five years in the marine environment. There
       | they serve are a food source for everything from cod and haddock
       | to whales and seals.
       | 
       | "They are really a kind of keystone ecological species for the
       | Gulf of Maine," says Burrows.
       | 
       | https://therevelator.org/edwards-dam-removal/
        
       | ClosedPistachio wrote:
       | Related:
       | 
       | New York City Is Building a Wall of Oysters to Fend Off Floods
       | 
       | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29307258
       | 
       | Cleaning New York's filthy harbor with one billion oysters
       | 
       | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18957542
        
       | nattaylor wrote:
       | On the shores of Rhode Island, my family has participated in an
       | oyster gardening program run URI which involved the same wire
       | boxes and shells with larvae attached. However we kept them tied
       | to the dock, then they collected and distributed to the beds.
       | It's cool to see the research seems to have evolved and they can
       | just go straight to the beds now.
       | 
       | That being said, all the little kids in my extended family got
       | excited and educated about oysters from having them tied to the
       | dock, so there's something to be said for that too.
        
       | perihelions wrote:
       | Molluscs' sensitivity to pollution is also the basis of some
       | cities' water quality monitoring:
       | 
       | https://hackaday.com/2021/02/18/internet-of-clams/
        
         | 0des wrote:
         | Its mainly certain _types_ of pollutants. They are filters
         | after all so organic pollutants are fine while fuels and
         | surfactants are a bigger problem.
        
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       (page generated 2022-04-24 23:01 UTC)