[HN Gopher] Why the Arrest of a Lebanese Doctor Should Terrify E...
___________________________________________________________________
Why the Arrest of a Lebanese Doctor Should Terrify Every Visitor to
the UAE
Author : Michelangelo11
Score : 142 points
Date : 2022-04-18 21:01 UTC (2 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (insidearabia.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (insidearabia.com)
| kjellWho wrote:
| I wonder how someone who publicly joked about supporting ISIS or
| Al-Qaeda and hoping they strike the new WTC would be greeted if
| they arrived to the US.
| [deleted]
| Krasnol wrote:
| To be fair, the US is hardly a good example for a
| civilised/normal Western country.
| mattcwilson wrote:
| What would be a better one?
| mardifoufs wrote:
| If we were to rank "civilized" by restrictions on speech, as
| you seem to be doing here, the US would be so far ahead that
| it's not even a comparison. Like of all things to go "America
| bad, europe good" on, free speech is absolutely not it.
|
| (Yes, the excuse is that Europe has a different definition of
| free speech but the UAE would probably say the same. And even
| then I don't see how the US would be uncivilized according to
| the european definition of free speech lol)
| asadlionpk wrote:
| Try talking about Palestine in US?
| mardifoufs wrote:
| Are you implying you'd get arrested? I remember attending
| a Palestine/BDS protest in NYC a few years ago and
| nothing happening to me even as a canadian (muslim arab)
| visitor.
|
| I agree though that the restrictions on supporting BDS in
| some parts of the US are completely absurd. And I always
| find it funny that conservatives turn a completely blind
| eye to those laws (especially since it's in Texas! Pretty
| ironic). Yet the same laws often also apply in europe,
| and they are usually a lot stricter so my original point
| stands.
|
| >Hervieu pointed to a recent ruling by the Court of
| Cassation, France's court of final appeal, which upheld
| the criminal convictions of 12 BDS activists who burst
| into a supermarket in 2009 wearing "Boycott Israel"
| shirts and handing out fliers that read, "Buying Israeli
| products means legitimising crimes in Gaza."
|
| >The legislation means that what BDS activists regarded
| as political statements denouncing Israel's violations of
| international law could be - and indeed were - treated by
| French courts as an "incitement" to hatred.
|
| https://www.france24.com/en/20160120-france-boycott-
| israel-b...
| schoen wrote:
| Hmmm? The nearest Palestinian flag that I can think of on
| display in my neighborhood is just a few blocks from my
| house.
|
| Do you mean that the U.S. treats Palestinian activists
| poorly for visa purposes?
| zeruch wrote:
| There is a significant difference between snarky jabs at a
| regime and open support of groups who have in the past (and
| seek to again in the future) commit violent international
| terrorism.
|
| If you openly support those kinds of groups, you absolutely
| SHOULD be stopped and interviewed/interrogated at the border.
| The 'humor' part has to be evaluated (e.g. if someone is always
| cracking weird jokes vs someone who suddenly pulls a Trumpian
| rant-one liner and tries to pass if off as ha-ha when it's
| really just the quiet part out loud).
| mardifoufs wrote:
| I don't know about the US but in some parts of Europe I'd agree
| the result would be similar to what happened here:
|
| >In 2013, a French mother was sentenced for "glorifying a
| crime" after she allowed her son, named Jihad, to go to school
| wearing a shirt that said "I am a bomb."
| mdni007 wrote:
| I wonder if the outcome would have been any different if the
| shirt said "I am the bomb."
| jmyeet wrote:
| Seeing the headline my first immediate first guess was "oh he
| insulted the royal family". The first sentence confirms it. There
| are a number of places in the world that are like this. Qatar and
| Thailand spring immediately to mind.
|
| It can even go beyond the ruling family. There was a US
| helicopter pilot (IIRC) who wrote something disparaging about his
| Qatari employer on Facebook while in the United States who was
| arrested upon his return to Qatar for it.
|
| You have to be aware of the laws of whatever country you're going
| to and respect them. Ignore them at your own peril. You don't
| really get to complain it. Your choices are either to go and
| follow and law and not go. Ignorance is no excuse.
|
| I'd actually be way more wary of taking a job in some of these
| countries. To leave Qatar, for eample, you need an exit visa.
| Basically, your employer has to consent. This system is ripe for
| abuse and has been abused many times. Employers use it to
| withhold wages in exchange for giving their permission.
| Personally, I would never work in such a place.
| mieubrisse wrote:
| Yep this. Feels like folks in this thread expect the
| $general_western_ethos to apply everywhere, and then are
| outraged when it doesn't. That's not to say we can't disagree
| with the country's laws, but if you visit the country then it's
| their land, their laws. Anything else would be crazy on account
| of the inverse: someone from another country could do something
| very illegal in the US and insist it's fine on account of being
| allowed in their home country (marriage laws come to mind).
| Barrin92 wrote:
| >Another joke Dr. Kharrat tweeted urged the Iran-backed Houthi
| rebels in Yemen to attack Dubai's Burj Khalifa, as reported by
| French newspaper L'Orient Le Jour.
|
| I'm gonna be honest how can anyone actually think tweeting that
| is a good idea.
| [deleted]
| asadlionpk wrote:
| Agreed. Wouldn't US or France do the same if someone publicly
| suggested similar violence for WTC or Eiffel?
| bpodgursky wrote:
| No (in the US).
|
| You'd have your visa revoked and be deported in a heartbeat,
| but you would not be charged or disappeared.
| cycomanic wrote:
| No mind you the US disappeared people for much less, be it
| in Guantanamo or some of the black ops prison they had all
| over the place in "collaborating countries" after 9/11.
|
| There is a difference in scale and directness to this in
| UAE though.
| throwawayffffas wrote:
| I am pretty sure in case they thought you were actually
| connected to actual terrorists you would be with a bag over
| your head and on your way to god knows where before you
| could say extraordinary rendition.
|
| The fact is countries detain people all the time for a
| variety of reasons. I am not saying it's right, it just is.
|
| In general it's a bad plan to put yourself in the hands of
| your opponents, especially if they are not very big on
| human rights and the rule of law.
|
| Hostage diplomacy is very much a thing[1]. In general
| though I would think for most westerners it would be rather
| safe to visit the UAE, I think it's fairly aligned to the
| west and unlikely to detain people just to make a fuss.
|
| [1] https://tnsr.org/2021/11/caught-between-giants-hostage-
| diplo...
| asadlionpk wrote:
| deported to guantanamo?
| kjs3 wrote:
| By all means provide us with the name of any individual
| who was sent to Gitmo for a tweet.
| livinginfear wrote:
| No. France did nothing when thousands of people celebrated
| Notre Dame burning. Throughout the Trump presidency making
| threats against the president was pretty much the bread and
| butter of Twitter.
| rat9988 wrote:
| This is utterly wrong.
| mardifoufs wrote:
| They did arrest some people who cheered for the beheading
| of the high-school teacher though IIRC. France has pretty
| harsh (and often used) laws regulating speech, and they are
| ambiguous enough that they can be used pretty broadly.
|
| Just an example:
|
| >Thousands of people are convicted every year for "contempt
| of public officials", a vaguely defined criminal offence
| that law enforcement and judicial authorities have applied
| in massive numbers to silence peaceful dissent.
|
| https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2020/11/france-is-
| not...
| sonicggg wrote:
| Yeah, France is probably not a good example. They never had
| much backbone there. In 10 years, Paris may as well be
| under Sharia law.
| [deleted]
| someotherperson wrote:
| From https://today.lorientlejour.com/article/1295901/lebanese-
| doc...
|
| > "The talk about this tweet is fake news," a source close to
| the gynecologist and an MP of the Free Patriotic Movement, to
| which Kharrat is allegedly close, told L'Orient-Le Jour on
| condition of anonymity.
|
| > He claimed that this tweet appeared after Kharrat's arrest,
| saying that it was not published on the doctor's personal
| account, but on that of an UAE national
|
| It appears that the original tweet was faked.
| 323 wrote:
| There are soooo many UAE arrest stories. All the following are
| non-muslim non-citizen people, so they can't claim any kind of
| citizen or religious jurisdiction:
|
| - A woman had a glass of wine while flying to UAE on UAE own
| airline!!!!
|
| https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/aug/11/woman-arrest...
|
| - A guy accidentally touches the hip of another guy in a club
|
| https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/oct/22/briton-jailed-...
|
| - A non-married couple kissing in a restaurant
|
| https://abcnews.go.com/International/TheLaw/kissing-couple-f...
|
| And on and on and on.
|
| Typically, if you are the citizen of a powerful country (US, UK,
| EU, ...) they will let you off with a fine.
|
| If you are the citizen of a less powerful country, like this
| Lebanon doctor, you go to jail.
| mytailorisrich wrote:
| A small correction: L'Orient-Le Jour is a French-language
| Lebanese newspaper, not a French newspaper.
| brightball wrote:
| Related: https://darknetdiaries.com/episode/47/
| trhway wrote:
| Time to make an app which would analyze your social media
| presence and for any country would show what laws you have
| violated and what punishment is waiting you where. Premium
| version will be showing that "cost" before you're to post
| something.
| mytailorisrich wrote:
| More fundamentally, why do people feel the need to Tweet or
| share content publicly on social media?
| quantified wrote:
| Or even share their opinions on other people's posts in a
| news aggregation site? ;-)
| Imnimo wrote:
| This is equally an app that allows those countries to search
| people's social media presence to find reasons to arrest them!
| :P
| l33t2328 wrote:
| That seems really hard. How would you identify a joke/insult vs
| a neutral post vs praise?
| asadlionpk wrote:
| a bit of sentiment analysis and banned keywords.
| toomuchtodo wrote:
| The solution is not an app, but to avoid travel to these
| countries in their entirety.
| sundvor wrote:
| What if you book a flight say between Australia and Europe.
| After swapping planes in Hong Kong, on the way to Germany
| there's an in flight emergency and the plane lands in Dubai.
|
| And you had been previously critical of the regime.
|
| Now what?
| toomuchtodo wrote:
| I admit that problem space expands if you are an exuberant
| social media user who travels frequently and transits a
| variety of jurisdictions and airspace. Realistically,
| you're screwed if you said the wrong thing on social and
| someplace you're traveling through wants to grab you (and
| your country of citizenship doesn't want to expend the
| effort to repatriate you from the hands of an authoritarian
| regime).
|
| My personal risk tolerance is that which I don't transit
| the Middle East, ever, when traveling internationally, and
| I have no social media usage or presence.
| sundvor wrote:
| Yep, that's my understanding as well. So, the wise thing
| to do is likely to shut up - or at least be very, very
| careful about certain topics.
|
| There almost ought to be training in schools on
| responsible use of the Internet, where topics such as
| these are covered.
| devoutsalsa wrote:
| I hate to break it to you, but if a country want to lock you
| up, they will find a way to do it. I'm an American & I'm more
| afraid of being railroaded by the USA justice system than any
| of the 32 other countries I've visited, including several
| countries in the Middle East.
| josephcsible wrote:
| I think GP's point is that the UAE's government can't lock
| you up while you're in the USA.
| curiousgal wrote:
| But the USA can lock you up anywhere in the world :p
| [deleted]
| FabHK wrote:
| So, if you had a beer before you were 21, you should never
| travel to the USA?
| quantified wrote:
| I'm sure a leaderboard would emerge in it. Have you left any
| laws un-broken? Am I looking at fewer lashes than any of my
| friends?
| wangii wrote:
| 2 top news about UAE in a row, is another mideast war coming?
| oaiey wrote:
| There is huge danger when criminal prosecution is automated. A
| machine has no sense of proportion or tolerance. That is why we
| allow police officers, prosecuters and judges to drop cases or
| just cite people.
|
| Not exactly sure how this doctor got arrested but if they
| automatically scan feeds on arrival and then process them by
| strict adherence to law, that is bad.
| wara23arish wrote:
| "The Houthis promise to bomb Burj Khalifa. My God, please let
| this information be true,"
|
| Is the tweet in question. It is worth noting that we're not sure
| yet that the tweet is true.
|
| But lets assume it is:
|
| Do people really think that this tweet should be enough to
| detain/arrest him? People in the US and in Lebanon (most of the
| world too) make countless of posts vilifying and wishing
| politicians dead.
|
| The guy is a Christian doctor from Lebanon visiting for
| tourism/work. He has no impact or connections on houthis.
|
| I also promise there's countless of Lebanese people with similar
| or worse tweets visiting UAE.
|
| Putting my conspiracy hat on:
|
| Elections are coming up in Lebanon, arresting this doctor will
| make major news in Lebanon.
|
| This will illicit two types of reaction there, people will be
| cheering this person's arrest or will be cheering for a more
| hardline stance and distancing against UAE.
|
| There are parties that claim to have good connections to UAE
| royalty (more like serfs) who will use this to say that this
| wouldn't happen under their rule.
| anonu wrote:
| Dictatorships over time become police states. In Lebanon there
| is a healthy history of political satire, thanks in part to the
| fact that there is no real government. The doctors mistake was
| thinking that any sort of "freedom" of speech he had in Lebanon
| would be protected. Unfortunately not the case.
| tradethedelta wrote:
| If you live the sword, you'll die by the sword. So yes you should
| be terrified of the UAE but you shouldn't have any illusions
| about what this country is about.
|
| Unfortunately, Lebanon is a complete basket case of a country. So
| many well educated Lebanese are forced to find work in Gulf
| countries with repressive regimes. They pay well to buy your
| silence.
| foobarian wrote:
| As if anyone traveling to a place like that is not already
| terrified.
| paulpauper wrote:
| been to uae many times. was never scared.
|
| Taleb has been hyping this story for weeks.
|
| The fact it gets so much media coverage suggests its rarity.
| The odds of being detained in uae for social media posts is
| very low. The UAE gets tons of tourism. Your odds of being
| roughed up by police in America are higher.
| Sirened wrote:
| Depends on who you are I guess. If you're gay or trans,
| you're in for a very bad time. While they probably won't
| actually punish you (besides roughing you up and throwing you
| in jail for a bit) if you're a foreigner from a large,
| western country, you're still not exactly "fine".
| yardstick wrote:
| A gay couple I know frequently enjoy visiting Dubai. I
| think so long as you keep the PDA in your hotel rooms you
| are fine.
| [deleted]
| reaperducer wrote:
| _If you 're gay or trans, you're in for a very bad time._
|
| Does the UAE have some kind of gay-detector at the airport
| you have to walk through when you arrive in the country?
|
| How about you just keep it in your pants for the week or
| two while you're there. How hard is that?
| munk-a wrote:
| Imagine for a moment that in the UAE it's illegal to not
| keep your right hand on your left shoulder - sure you can
| make it work and conform, but you're compromising a lot
| of your natural behavior to fit in for no good reason.
| That cost might be worth it to some people but it's
| definitely a cost and it's an unreasonable one.
|
| You'll need to be conscious of how you walk with your
| partner, you'll need to carefully consider how it'll look
| if you go out for a fancy dinner together and invent a
| cover story to cloak your actions, you'll probably be
| charged a gay-tax by being forced to rent separate hotel
| rooms or at least a room with double beds in it.
|
| I find the description of "just keep it in your pants" to
| be offensively reductive.
| zizee wrote:
| The article is about someone who was arrested for social
| media posts made years before arriving in the country.
| "Keeping it in your pants for the week or two while you
| are there" does not cut it.
| amanaplanacanal wrote:
| Most people were just fine in nazi Germany too.
| dwater wrote:
| It was the location of the movie "Sex and the City 2". The UAE
| has put a huge effort into internationally branding themselves
| as a luxury tourism destination. I imagine there are loads of
| visitors who have no idea what the laws or legal system are
| like.
| walrus01 wrote:
| google "UAE Sonapur" for some documented examples of the
| near-slavery condition that some of the imported workers from
| Pakistan, India, Bangladesh live in.
|
| https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=uae+son.
| ..
|
| https://gulfnews.com/uae/sonapur-welcome-to-the-dark-
| side-1....
| dylan604 wrote:
| I wonder how many of the people that can afford these trips
| care about any of that?
| mytailorisrich wrote:
| From Europe, Dubai is a very common and rather cheap
| destination these days. Return flights from London are
| under PS300.
| rosndo wrote:
| "near-slavery" is not slavery, neither is it worse than the
| places many of these workers come from.
| cycomanic wrote:
| You mean being treated like a slave, beaten sometimes
| raped, have their password taken away etc. is not so bad
| because, hey they still get paid, so not real slavery?
| (and no that is not the same same conditions as in the
| Philippines, Pakistan or Bangladesh)
| Aspos wrote:
| What do you think the alternatives should be? Should Indian
| and Pakistani companies pay more to Indian and Pakistani
| workers they bring to Dubai? Should they leave them in
| India and let them work in even worse conditions? Who do
| you think should dictate how much more Indian companies
| should pay Indian laborers which btw already are getting
| way more than they can get at home?
|
| Many people crying about "slavery in Dubai" don't fully
| understand what slavery is and how Dubai works. What I am
| suggesting here, is that, perhaps, this notion is just a
| second-hand opinion you should consider changing your mind
| about. If you are open to it, that is.
| rosndo wrote:
| Yep, it's sort of hilarious to see us rich Westerners
| criticizing work conditions in Dubai while our countries
| simply make it impossible for these same people to get
| visas to work in the West.
|
| UAE is doing more to improve the lives of these people
| than the West ever has, even if it doesn't look all that
| pretty. It's very unfortunate that photos of denied visa
| applications will never evoke the same response.
| lotsofpulp wrote:
| Mind boggling that someone could equate slavery via
| confiscation of passports to denying people immigration
| visas.
| rosndo wrote:
| If someone confiscates your passport in Dubai you can
| have it back within 24 hours by just calling MOHRE at
| 80060.
|
| It is illegal to do this, enforcement is pretty
| aggressive.
|
| As to denial of visas? At least the UAE offers these
| people a chance at a better life, Western countries give
| them nothing. A slight QOL improvement is much better
| than none.
| munk-a wrote:
| If it's illegal to confiscate passports in Dubai why is
| it so widespread and commonplace? Is it like smoking MJ
| in most states - it's "illegal" but unless cops want a
| reason to arrest you they'll just ignore you and keep on
| driving?
| rosndo wrote:
| It's not nearly as widespread in 2022 as you might like
| to think.
|
| To get a low-skilled work visa in Dubai you have to sit
| through an hour long lecture explaining these rights,
| including what to do if your employer takes your
| passport.
|
| You are advised to not give your passport to your
| employer except to have your visa stamped, and then
| immediately demand it back.
|
| This country is modernizing very rapidly, things that
| were true 5 years ago are often not true anymore.
| munk-a wrote:
| My understanding of the situation on the ground might be
| a bit out of date then, a lot of my information about
| Dubai comes from pre-pandemic.
| rdtwo wrote:
| They trick the workers and then enslave then. Often then
| employer withholds and does not pay wages. It's not an
| opportunity to have a better life if they don't actually
| get paid
| munk-a wrote:
| An affluent country like Dubai could afford to treat
| these workers a lot better locally than they may be
| treated in their homelands.
|
| I reject the premise that we live in a world of
| unregulated capitalism where free-markets force us all to
| engage in a race to the bottom when it comes to working
| conditions, and the modern world also rejects that with a
| plethora of examples: how can US workers who demand
| trivial things like sane working hours and health care
| possibly compete with people overseas who can do the same
| work while being paid peanuts - it's because we as a
| society can demand that. The people of the UAE could
| similarly demand that labourers be paid better and
| receive better treatment - it's not an unavoidable
| economic outcome that near slavery exists, it's a choice.
| viraptor wrote:
| We can definitely say people should not work like slaves
| in Dubai and that it would be great if the conditions
| were better in their original countries.
|
| I'm drawing the line at the confiscated passports, threat
| of jail and terrible living conditions - if you can't
| safely leave your work, you're a slave. It doesn't matter
| what the alternative at your home is.
| lovich wrote:
| The slavery calls are less about the low wages and more
| about things like workers having their passports
| confiscated or being abused/killed by their employers.
|
| But what do I know? Maybe because I'm in America I can't
| call being forced to work and unable to leave slavery
| cause it's a second hand opinion. -\\_(tsu)_/-
| FabHK wrote:
| I agree that many workers go to the UAE (and Saudi Arabia
| and other places) because they can get a much better deal
| there than they could get at home.
|
| However, it is also true that too many of those migrant
| workers are then treated atrociously, with little legal
| recourse, and with a casual chauvinism and racism that
| far exceeds what is often labeled "racism" in progressive
| societies.
|
| And that is particularly grating given that those oil-
| rich countries could afford not only fancy buildings and
| museums, but also decent labour standards.
|
| > Should Indian and Pakistani companies pay more to
| Indian and Pakistani workers they bring to Dubai?
|
| Yes indeed.
|
| > Who do you think should dictate how much more Indian
| companies should pay [...]?
|
| As usual, the government of the country they operate in.
| In this case, the UAE governments. It would probably mean
| somewhat more expensive buildings for the UAE, and
| somewhat less profits for said Indian and Pakistani
| companies.
| apohn wrote:
| I know you're going to get downvoted to hell, but I'm
| going to give you an upvote.
|
| Many people who have enough leisure time to spend on HN
| and Reddit just don't understand the conditions many
| people grow up in. Not just India and Pakistan, but
| Philippines, Indonesia, and all the countries where you
| see economic migrants to any gulf country. Imagine
| growing up in unbelievable poverty with no educational
| opportunities or support, and with the external and
| internal pressure to financially support your siblings,
| parents, family and so they can survive and not just
| repeat the cycle you were born into.
|
| It's an insane situation, and the only solution humans
| seem to have come up with is to encourage people with
| money buy stuff that's made by people who cannot afford
| that same stuff. In one country it's tall buildings, in
| another it's phones and t-shirts.
| munk-a wrote:
| I mean - that's sort of the ultra-capitalist creed right?
| It's impossible for us to solve poverty in any manner
| other than exporting work to make cheap t-shirts and
| since slavery is close to the same level of suffering it
| must be alright?
|
| Global wealth inequality issues are certainly not easy to
| solve, but we don't just need to shrug and say "I guess
| that's the way the world needs to work" - there is an
| extreme amount of excess in western countries, we've got
| _several_ people who have literally nothing better to do
| with their money than launch private rockets into space
| for PR so I don 't think it's fair to say "it's near-
| slavery or t-shirts".
|
| As the wealthiest nation on earth and the never-sated
| consumer that drives most of the world's economy America
| is in a position where it can demand better working
| conditions, it can say t-shirts at walmart can't
| reasonably cost 5$... but it is choosing not to do so.
| And, with all that said, the UAE in it's (hopefully now
| in the past) passport seizing days was still far worse.
| steve_coral wrote:
| I mean, in Sex and the City 2 the ladies get deported from
| the country due to a public display of affection. If you
| actually watched the movie you'd realize its a damning
| cinematic critique with a witty script and stellar acting.
| dillondoyle wrote:
| I can't find it.. but i read an article last week that went
| through how these oppressive governments are using sports
| (and their money) to build up their image. Russia did it
| before their first invasion. China did it twice with the
| olympics.
|
| the use of sports and FIFA is an example of this.
|
| *qatar not uae, is the absolute worst place to hold a giant
| soccer tournament. They have to use special AC units inside
| giant stadiums (built on deaths of lots of migrant workers)
| because it's a hot desert. But they claim they are still
| 'green'
|
| Saudi using art is an example too. They paid a ton of money
| to use the name Louvre even though their museum has nothing
| to do with the institution. ironically he refused to loan his
| $450 million 'da vinci' to the real museum. Evidently sitting
| on a yacht hidden because good chance it's not by da vinci's
| hand.
|
| As a queer person who loves to travel (or did before covid)
| there are some countries i just refuse to visit, despite the
| awesome cultural heritage. I know that citizens don't always
| necessarily agree, but many do. And I just can't support the
| expansion of authoritarianism - and potentially risk my life.
| Mikeb85 wrote:
| > UAE is the absolute worst place to hold a giant soccer
| tournament. They have to use special AC units inside giant
| stadiums (built on deaths of lots of migrant workers)
|
| Ummm, Qatar isn't UAE...
| dillondoyle wrote:
| fixed!
| [deleted]
| throwaway1777 wrote:
| Qatar is hosting the World Cup not UAE. UAE does host some
| sporting events though, notably golf and f1.
| dillondoyle wrote:
| You're right sorry i'll change
| apohn wrote:
| >It was the location of the movie "Sex and the City 2".
|
| It wasn't filmed there. It was filmed in Morocco and they
| just said it took place in Abu Dhabi. The UAE government said
| they couldn't film there.
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_and_the_City_2#Filming
|
| It might seem like a random topic for me to know, but I lived
| in UAE for a portion of my life and the government is pretty
| mindful of having their name associated with some of the
| themes you'd typically see with that particular TV series. So
| I was quite surprised when they claimed it was Abu Dhabi, and
| not surprised that they actually filmed it elsewhere.
| dboreham wrote:
| I always assumed it was a paid product placement spot.
| Narishma wrote:
| Any vaguely middle-eastern-looking location you see in a
| movie or TV show was very likely shot in Morocco,
| especially in recent decades.
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_foreign_films_shot_in
| _...
| phphphphp wrote:
| That's interesting: here in the UK, there's often major news
| stories about very punitive actions taken against tourists in
| Dubai for things like drinking in public or having sex on a
| beach. I'd guess a lot of people "know" that the system is
| strict but are naive enough to believe it won't apply to them
| for whatever reason.
| code_duck wrote:
| Yeah, I am basically horrified about everything about the
| idea of visiting the UAE, other than that they have
| interesting cities and nice beaches. I would never consider
| taking a vacation there.
| zizee wrote:
| Hopefully these news stories will help educate people about
| the risks involved with travel to certain countries.
| HL33tibCe7 wrote:
| Relatedly, the sheer number of YouTube adverts for Qatar I've
| had recently... the adverts have nice happy jingly music and
| cute little avatars exploring Qatar's filthy lucre ^H^H^H-uh
| I mean beautiful buildings, shopping centers, pools and the
| like. Basically trying to "adwash" their slavery.
| Scoundreller wrote:
| Keep in mind GOOG gets half that money. 100% if it's on my
| videos they departnered me from because I didn't meet their
| new goalpost of 1000 subs but then later decided it's still
| acceptable puts ads on. Asshats.
|
| https://support.google.com/youtube/answer/2475463?hl=en
| qiskit wrote:
| UAE is a fast growing international hub. Nobody is terrified.
| No more than people are terrified of traveling to germany
| because tourists get arrested for silly nonsense like a nazi
| salute or thailand because tourists get arrested insulting the
| royals or indonesia because tourists get arrested for drugs.
|
| Not saying I agree with anyone getting arrested for silly
| nonsense. But for 99% of the travelers, it doesn't matter.
| politelemon wrote:
| I was already terrified based on the number of stories
| regarding poppy seeds from bagels leading to imprisonment.
| lotsofpulp wrote:
| You should also be terrified by the fact that one of the
| royals, Issa bin Zayed Al Nahyan, is seen on video torturing
| a business partner, and suffered no repercussions after the
| video came out in 2009.
|
| https://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=7402099
|
| Of course, the torture victim and his brother who released
| the video were convicted by UAE courts.
| tacomonstrous wrote:
| My god this was a horrifying read.
| mieubrisse wrote:
| I lived in the UAE for 3 years, and think the reality is more
| complicated than the article's "every visitor to the UAE should
| be terrified" makes it out to be.
|
| Is the UAE a dictatorship? Absolutely - the newspaper is
| censored, and publicly challenging or speaking ill of the
| government is a Bad Idea that everyone knows not to do.
|
| Is it the autocratic dystopia that the article makes it out to
| be? Also no; I didn't have any problems during my time there, nor
| did any friends that I know of (including three gay friends). The
| UAE is basically caught between both traditional Muslim and
| Western democratic influences, and it's not strictly one or the
| other. As long as you're not challenging the government or doing
| anything Muslims would consider bad taste (e.g. public PDA),
| you're generally left alone.
|
| Which meant I was surprised to learn about the jailing on account
| of a joke about the name "Nahyan", until I saw, "Another joke Dr.
| Kharrat tweeted urged the Iran-backed Houthi rebels in Yemen to
| attack Dubai's Burj Khalifa".
|
| Iran and the UAE _really_ don't like each other, and the UAE
| maintains a strong security state at least in part because of it.
| Urging a Houthi attack on the Burj Khalifa would be taken very
| seriously, and I'd surmise 1) he ended up on a watchlist when he
| first made it and 2) the UAE is now using him as political
| pressure on Lebanon.
|
| To be clear, I'm not at all condoning the UAE's actions here as
| they don't align with my personal values. That said, I'm not
| surprised: the UAE takes perceived threats to the state very
| seriously and doesn't claim to allow free speech, so Kharrat was
| doing a (from an Emirati perspective) Very Bad Thing that most
| visitors to the UAE aren't likely to.
| klyrs wrote:
| Doesn't worry me a bit. I'd already be looking at 2 years in
| prison just for being gay. But then, there's a whole bunch of the
| world that I wouldn't travel to.
|
| https://www.forbes.com/sites/laurabegleybloom/2021/03/23/cri...
| fortran77 wrote:
| bitexploder wrote:
| Ehh, ya know, that is just a polarizing characterization.
| Most people just don't agree with what is happening to them.
| It does not mean most of those people that support their
| freedom and right from persecution would travel there or that
| it supports their views directly. Genocide isn't cool, ya
| know. Freedom limiting social systems aren't either, but that
| is a separate issue.
| user- wrote:
| Unless you're trying to be obtuse, it shouldn't be too hard
| for you to understand why.
|
| Just because a culture or people are not perfect doesn't
| justify their oppression.
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