[HN Gopher] I need to stop being boring
___________________________________________________________________
I need to stop being boring
Author : patrickz
Score : 259 points
Date : 2022-04-06 06:39 UTC (16 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (patzhong.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (patzhong.com)
| thatguyagain wrote:
| IMO, traveling and "going offline" for a while is the best way to
| get inspired life. It's a luxury tho.
| karmakaze wrote:
| The article makes a number of keen observations. I don't like how
| it gets summed up as "stop being boring", as if 'being boring' is
| a thing rather than the lack of something.
|
| I went through a period of not having an interest I was
| passionate about. This normally happens but it was for a longer
| than usual period. I eventually recognized it and made small
| efforts to find new interests. The pandemic both forced the
| situation as well as make space to try out new stuff. One of
| those long-standing things was to play video games which I
| enjoyed so much growing up and now can never seem to prioritize.
| Sure it doesn't necessarily have real-world value, but it's
| something I could enjoy as a minor pastime as I did Go (board
| game) when I was on a binge.
|
| The part that seems hard as an older adult is that we have less
| patience for being bad at something at the start when the going
| is slow. We have to find a way of enjoying the process rather
| than the results.
| donatj wrote:
| > I lost my creativity and the sense of wonder I used to have in
| childhood. I am no longer curious because I am settled for the
| world as it is. I accept things the way they are instead of
| imagining how they could be.
|
| God that strikes close to home.
|
| I have genuinely pondered how 10-15 years ago when I didn't know
| what I was doing, I had a million project ideas and just went for
| them with no real plan. Some of them panned out, most of them
| didn't. Many I still maintain today came out of that raw energy.
| These days when I do (rarely) come up with a project, I know off
| the bat how I am going to build it. I've been blinded to
| possibility by my own experience.
| sillysaurusx wrote:
| Embrace it. One advantage of being old is that my younger self
| was completely incapable of planning. Then sing along with
| https://youtu.be/GibiNy4d4gc while watching all the youngsters
| make the same mistakes.
| ordiel wrote:
| This is gold. thanks!
| moreira wrote:
| > I've been blinded to possibility by my own experience.
|
| I think about that a lot when it comes to design especially.
| The ideas that come to me are constrained by own experience and
| knowledge of what's simple or complicated to implement. I will
| naturally steer clear from anything that is convoluted to
| implement.
|
| Meanwhile a proper designer will come up with incredible ideas
| without worrying about "is it hard to code this up", they're
| not constrained by that at all.
| twelve40 wrote:
| but we've all been on overdesigned projects that grow
| convoluted to the point where they are impossible to maintain
| or improve without a massive rewrite.
| pojzon wrote:
| This also hits home for me, but in my case - I just became
| aware I have no influence on most of things around me that do
| not fit into my perfect "working well" world.
|
| Fix that bug in production that other team struggles with for a
| year ? Nope, you should be working on something else, they will
| they care of that (/not).
|
| Try to bring up to speed some team members to have full DevOps
| ? Nope, ppl not interested in that, prefer to do bare minimum.
|
| Too many things you have no control of. Gets pretty
| discouraging very fast.
| SubiculumCode wrote:
| Take walks through the city, always a new path. Seeing what the
| world IS is the best way to build in you a desire to re-envision
| it.
| ed-209 wrote:
| The idea that someone should (or could) avoid this, or conclude
| that it had something to do with being boring is strange to me.
| When you have "writer's block", you step away and stop trying to
| force it. When one creative outlet is exhausted, you find another
| one and bring your experience with you. To be perpetually
| fascinated by something that (mostly) does not change is not
| desirable and might be indicative of brain damage.
| nomdep wrote:
| " but no one was really using the app. Including myself."
|
| That's the problem! If you are the target user but don't want to
| use it, the product doesn't work as is, maybe the idea doesn't
| work at all, or the focus isn't right.
| codingdave wrote:
| I'm not making the connections in the article - business success
| isn't about whether or not you are boring. Neither is happiness.
| They even said they were happy. Just not motivated. But living a
| simple and happy life is not a bad thing. Being boring is
| different than being bored. Enjoying boring hobbies is still
| enjoying your world. I don't need to entertain others to live a
| fulfilling life.
|
| So if the author has problems they want to fix with their work or
| life, by all means fix them. But "being boring" is not a problem
| in and of itself.
| boh wrote:
| There's something obviously wrong in assuming some blanket
| "creativity" will satisfy whatever needs you may have, but
| popular cultural heuristics makes it seem right. Just as
| "innovation" is the solution for every problem, somehow divorcing
| yourself from your natural inclinations and increasing your risk
| is the right way to go. What is it the writer wants exactly? Some
| unknown nirvana of personal expression where you get to escape
| "the world as it is" and submerge into a childish "sense of
| wonder"?
|
| Accepting reality is often expressed as settling into some
| depressing malaise, while "imagining" something "better" is the
| more proactive, positive choice by default. I will make a bet
| that whatever spurt of creative "not boring" thing the writer
| does next will distract for some time and then they will be right
| back where they started from.
|
| The world needs more people capable of dealing with "the world as
| it is" and make the boring choice of taking responsibility for
| it. It's doing the long, boring, thankless tasks that this
| requires, instead of flailing around in the shallow depths of
| narcissistic self-actualization, that grants purpose and meaning
| to what you do. Don't let culture bully you into it's incoherent
| projections of success and relevance. Being committed,consistent,
| focused and responsible is boring. Be boring.
| burntwater wrote:
| I'm boring. I know I'm boring, and I'm bored as a result of being
| boring. I suspect a good part of it is bog standard depression.
| Tied into that is the difficulty of learning new things; I have a
| lot of things I WANT to learn, but when I get home at the end of
| the day I just don't have the mental energy.
|
| I recently moved across the country and currently have precisely
| nothing happening outside of work; no friends, no family, no
| romantic partners or dates. I got so bored, I finally setup my
| dusty, unused piano keyboard, installed a piano learning app on
| my iPad, and started working through the basics.
|
| It's like a fire was lit in my brain. Or an explosion, or
| something. I haven't felt that energized in ages. I've been
| practicing every day since, sometimes for upwards of 2 hours
| straight (my grade school music teachers would be shocked to hear
| that). I quickly realized the limitations of the first keyboard
| (a Roland Go:Keys) and went searching for a "real" digital piano.
| The first time I laid hands on the keyboard I ended up purchasing
| (a Korg) I felt an immediate sense of calm and happiness.
|
| I have a couple theories for why I've reacted this way, when I've
| struggled with so many other things I want to learn: - Music uses
| an entirely different part of the brain from my technical day
| job. - There is _immediate_ progress. - Likely related, but I
| took a couple years of lessons in grade school. I 'm likely
| feeling the reawakening of long dormant brain connections. Which
| strengthens the above two points.
|
| It has only been a week, honestly only time will tell how long
| this lasts, but maybe it's jump started I needed to move on to
| other things I want to learn and be less boring.
| flakiness wrote:
| Yeah, the physical sensation of playing piano/keyboards is
| energizing. I guess that's same (or sometimes even more) for
| other musical instruments. In a sense, it's like physical
| excursive.
|
| It'd be great if programming gives us similar sensation, but
| it's purely intellectual, at least to me. I understand it's the
| point, but still.
| deathgripsss wrote:
| I'm confused how to sign up for space4, is it closed? There seems
| to be nowhere to sign up.
| superasn wrote:
| I don't think you're boring but I do think your brain is feeling
| cheated for putting in all this work over and over and not
| getting the dopamine rewards for it afterwards (which in most
| cases is often praise or money).
|
| I think you need some small wins to keep your motivation going. I
| read this quote here on hacker news which was very eye opening
| for me at the time(1). This idealogy of using small wins while
| you're chasing a big win has helped me a lot when things aren't
| going your way. I'm a indie hacker too would be happy to tell you
| some strategies I've developed for creating small wins (though
| most of them are very specific to my product / industry so I
| can't say how useful it would be to you)
|
| (1) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5630618
| XorNot wrote:
| Messing around with OpenID connect for a web service template
| has proven to be a mistake for me in this regard.
|
| A template has no immediate utility, and OAuth2 and OpenID are
| nightmare protocols where dreams go to die.
| superasn wrote:
| Sorry are you replying to somebody else?
| shubb wrote:
| Thankyou for this comment. It helped me understand why a long
| running very much not indie project is making me feel quite so
| fed up. The next step will be to try to use it to fix it.
| pjerem wrote:
| Kurzgesagt made a video about dissatisfaction :
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WPPPFqsECz0
|
| I don't know if it will help the author but that touched me. So I
| share it.
|
| And I'll add that Kurzgesagt is an amazing YT channel.
| jimt1234 wrote:
| My two cents:
|
| 1. Turn off social media. Or at least avoid all the fake, self-
| promoting garbage.
|
| 2. Accept that you're probably not gonna cure cancer or solve
| cold fusion. Nothing wrong with that.
|
| 3. Get a hobby that has NOTHING to do with computers. I like
| wood-working - building patio furniture, stuff like that.
|
| 4. Contrary to #3, get a Raspberry Pi. I've worked on many
| completely useless, yet totally fun, Pi projects.
| brittonrt wrote:
| After doing programming and being involved in startups for well
| over a decade, I decided I don't actually like coding nor
| startups anymore. I still have a company I run with my partners,
| and I still treat it like my 'job', but there's no passion there.
| Instead, I've discovered writing novels, music, and other artsy-
| fartsy stuff as my new passion of the last few years (it had
| always been a hobby, but I'm taking it much more seriously... not
| because it'll ever make money, but because I enjoy doing it!)
|
| So my long-winded point is, I don't think there's anything wrong
| with this. Only you know what your interests are, but don't be
| afraid to follow them wherever they lead. If you aren't bored,
| you aren't boring.
| shaftoe444 wrote:
| Reconnecting with artsy-fartsy stuff I did when I was 16/17 has
| been fantastic.
| patrickz wrote:
| "If you aren't bored, you aren't boring." I really love this
| advice. Thank you.
| asah wrote:
| People who aren't bored but who are boring. They come to
| dinner and yammer on about gossip and celebrities and
| whatnot. Lousy storytellers.
|
| People who are bored but not boring. They work in technical
| fields where I'm not educated in their domain. They're
| retired but had very colorful lives in the past. They're
| wonderful storytellers and joke tellers and even punsters.
| They know the latest culture, technology, restaurants, shows
| etc. They post on HN.
|
| Unrelated, Being Boring is an amazing song by the Pet So
| Boys. https://genius.com/Pet-shop-boys-being-boring-lyrics
| amelius wrote:
| People who read HN during a dinner for two aren't bored, but
| they are boring.
| disambiguation wrote:
| > not because it'll ever make money
|
| So .. what do you do about money? are you in a FIRE situation?
| nabnob wrote:
| Something that helped me dramatically in this area was picking up
| a new hobby, purely for fun, with no expectations about getting
| "good" at it or winning any praise or accolades - for me, this
| was dance. It's taught me how to be creative and where creative
| energy actually comes from, and i've been able to take this skill
| and apply it to other hobbies, like music, where my approach used
| to be more technical. Extrinsic motivation and having
| expectations seem to kill creativity.
| brthsim wrote:
| apalmer wrote:
| Honestly seems the issue is something is preventing you from
| objectively observing and documenting your issue. This is the
| first step.
|
| For instance, you have decided the issue is 'being boring' when
| what you describe is 'being bored'.
|
| Another is you are making the successful roll out of the app the
| end goal, when there is no indication that 'being boring/bored'
| has anything to do with success of the app.
|
| As an outsider going by the description of how you provided
| without taking the solution you provide for granted it seems...
|
| You are bored/dissatisfied with your life, and you are
| bored/dissatisfied with the project you are working on, but (I
| think because you are trying to 'focus' and fight distraction)
| you don't want to admit this as the solution would be to change
| tack as its basically giving in to your lack of focus
| russellbeattie wrote:
| If you're bored or feeling boring, an easy solution is do
| something that can get you killed.
|
| I bought a motorcycle last year and I'm not nearly as boring any
| more. Surprisingly so, if you consider all I did was buy a
| vehicle and learn to use it. It seems to be a general litmus
| test: Find a risky hobby and you're mind will be focused and
| dialed in to what you're doing and others will respect your
| effort and skill. Scuba, surfing, flying, poker, etc.
| fleddr wrote:
| I don't know about the boring part, but I certainly have thoughts
| on "what went wrong". I'd say pretty much everything. And I don't
| say that to be mean.
|
| If you're trying to solve people's lack of focus, you first need
| a solid understanding of what the root cause of that problem is.
| It could include deep psychological issues that I won't go in to,
| but root causes that are plain to see and very common are
| distractions outside one's control (work email, meetings, chat,
| etc) and distractions due to a lack of self discipline (personal
| usage of smartphone).
|
| That still is a simplistic picture, but let's use it. Now your
| app, which is a website, aims to solve this. The first thought
| here is that an app means even more screen time, but fine.
|
| Your website allows one to set a timer in which the user does a
| focused task. This doesn't solve the problem. The distractions
| outside one's control keep coming in nor does this magically fix
| a lack of self-discipline.
|
| Even if you do believe such a timer helps, because it does
| something at a subconscious level, how is it any different from
| using a standard timer app natively available on any device?
|
| The second idea is to play white noise background sounds as it
| puts one in a focused state. Fine, but why wouldn't I just hit
| play on one of the hundreds of "focus" playlists found on Spotify
| or elsewhere?
|
| The third idea, one task at a time, is reasonable. But not
| valuable on its own, as it still enforces nothing. Plus, people
| already have task management systems, they don't need one more.
|
| The fourth idea is puzzling, a support network. So I'm finally in
| a focused state, and then these like-minded people are going to
| support me: "well done, mate, proud of you". How is that not the
| opposite of being focused?
|
| Bottom line, you charge money for something that doesn't solve
| the problem, or is already solved in far more advanced ways, at
| no charge. For example, both iOS and Android have advanced
| settings for silent mode, suppressing notifications and time used
| on "problematic" apps.
|
| Finally, execution is also sub par, as your fellow Indie hackers
| agreed on.
|
| I truly say with the best intentions that this is a bad idea. And
| it sucks to work on bad ideas that go nowhere. But you shouldn't
| feel too bad about that because creating a new idea that
| monetizes and is sticky is close to impossible, the bar is that
| high. Most people hardly every install apps and when they do,
| almost all of them are never opened again.
|
| Do not consider yourself a failure because failure is the norm in
| such a competitive space.
|
| "I need to pick a fight and stop trying to please everybody."
|
| Yes, fine. But contemplate more about which fight to pick. You're
| self aware about it, which is good:
|
| "Am I doing the wrong thing again?", I wondered."
|
| If you suck at separating good ideas from bad ones, which is
| common, you need better and earlier feedback.
| mattjaynes wrote:
| "Only boring people get bored" was maybe the best advice I ever
| got.
|
| I was a teenager and was getting a ride home from a friend of the
| family.
|
| He asked "How's life going"
|
| And I was in the midst of answering "It's bor.."
|
| But he cut me off and said "Don't say 'it's boring'. ONLY BORING
| PEOPLE GET BORED."
|
| It was like a splash of cold water in my face, and I always
| remembered that.
|
| Whenever I start feeling bored now, I remind myself of that quote
| and start mentally exploring ways to shake things up and break
| out of the rut. If my mind isn't feeling that creative, then I
| start looking at what others are doing in my situation and often
| I'll find some thread of their creativity that I can use to get
| myself started.
|
| The more you fear being labeled as "boring", the more motivated
| you'll be to avoid those doldrums.
| pmoriarty wrote:
| If you are boring to yourself, you are boring to others.
|
| Learn to enjoy your own company and how to keep yourself from
| being bored even when you're alone.
|
| Then find others who enjoy doing the things you enjoy, and you
| can have fun together.
| swozey wrote:
| I love my own company but not everyone else does
| pmoriarty wrote:
| It doesn't have to be everyone.
|
| Find those who are on the same wavelength and who like you
| for who you are.
| makach wrote:
| Well, appears you are successful because the web site doesn't
| load. Also, boring is good. Boring is predictable. Don't forget
| the Chinese curse; "May you live in interesting times"
| (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/May_you_live_in_interesting_ti...)
| redleggedfrog wrote:
| Oh man, no worries, I'm boring too! It's great! I do things like
| take 20 year old XML exports and build a modern data transfer
| services around them. Doing these kinds of things I make a lot of
| money being boring. No pretensions, work 8 to 5, I'm not my work,
| and I go home to my wife and we have loads of fun cooking,
| playing boardgames, riding our ebikes, camping, now even having
| friends over again. Boring rocks!
|
| Maybe the problem is all work and no play?
| persedes wrote:
| "Mediocrity is like a stain that doesn't wash out" - H Murakami
|
| My favorite anti-inspirational quote I keep coming back to.
| rr808 wrote:
| I'm afraid most tech people need to get out more. The job is
| hard, side projects are fun and you need to leetcode in your
| spare time to get a job. However its very easy to be boring.
| People benefit from making non-tech friends, play sports, travel,
| read novels, learn about spirituality, make music, build
| furniture but I dont see a lot of that happening. I'm a corporate
| cog and its my biggest regret.
| verisimi wrote:
| I agree - tech people need to get out more.
|
| I am sorting people into virtuals and physicals nowadays.
|
| All my interest is on the physical side of life.
|
| Physical is where I want to be, and I am sort of.. but still
| I'm too heavy on the virtual.
| galoisscobi wrote:
| These excerpts from the The Bed of Procrustes by Nassim Taleb
| resonated with me and I think it applies here.
|
| "You will be civilized on the day you can spend a long period
| doing nothing, learning nothing, and improving nothing, without
| feeling the slightest amount of guilt."
|
| "They are born, then put in a box; they go home to live in a
| box; they study by ticking boxes; they go to what is called
| "work" in a box, where they sit in their cubicle box; they
| drive to the grocery store in a box to buy food in a box; they
| go to the gym in a box to sit in a box; they talk about
| thinking "outside the box"; and when they die they are put in a
| box. All boxes, Euclidian, geometrically smooth boxes."
|
| Make it easy to start, just try doing nothing for a while, it's
| uncomfortable at first but the reset comes soon enough and is
| quite rewarding.
|
| The bed of procrustes as a whole is also quite thought
| provoking and I would recommend checking it out.
| ct0 wrote:
| For some, being a corporate cog has allowed them to do more.
| Since the added security of cog life usually provides a cushion
| especially in the tech sector.
| pddpro wrote:
| That making friends bit is proving to be a bit difficult for me
| at the moment.
| mmanfrin wrote:
| Same. It's shocking how visibly my social circle shrinks as
| my ability to make new friendships also diminishes. I don't
| know if it's a part of getting in to my mid-30s (and all my
| friends now making families, moving away) or the pandemic, or
| both, but I find myself increasingly with no one to talk to.
| Minor49er wrote:
| What's getting in your way?
| skulk wrote:
| As a 20-something year old, trying to make friends with
| people that you don't know is an incredibly frustrating
| experience because there's a good chance that the group
| you're trying to join were friends since childhood. No
| matter who you meet at this age, it seems that there is
| always a group they're a part of that you need to get
| acceptance with before you can call it a "friendship".
|
| This isn't to say it's straight up impossible to make
| individual friends or join a friend group, but attempting
| to make friends but being treated in a lukewarm way by
| their clique goes a LONG way to reinforce avoidant
| behavior, even without an explicit rejection. Sitting in my
| room and learning math is far more enjoyable than that, so
| that's what I'll end up doing.
|
| Once I move away from the place all of my childhood friends
| are, I have no idea what's going to happen.
| JKCalhoun wrote:
| Get out and do boring things. Your mind will fill up the dead-
| space with creative ideas.
|
| Go on walks.
|
| Hike.
|
| Go on long road trips.
| jermaustin1 wrote:
| walking, hiking, and road tripping are my favorite things to
| do (walk daily, "hike" (just long walk since I live in flat
| Houston) weekly, and roadtrip monthly). And the entire time,
| I sit in silence just THINKING.
|
| Sometimes I record my thoughts out loud. But for the most
| time, I just use it as a way to keep my mind churning.
| Sometimes I come up with new side projects, or a design for a
| new piece of furniture, or just wonder on certain things
| (friends/family, state of the world, the guy that coughed on
| me at the restaurant).
| nicbou wrote:
| Cycling and motorcycling also feel like that, if you'd
| rather see more landscapes faster.
|
| I consider saddle time "taking my brain to the park" so it
| runs around for a bit and tires itself out.
| betenoire wrote:
| I would imagine it's a little more dangerous to space out
| and get lost in your thoughts though :)
| jdavis703 wrote:
| If you're getting lost in thoughts unrelated to operating
| a motorcycle you need to take a break. That's a sign
| you're about to make a mistake. I think the OP's point is
| your mind gets in to a flow of watching the road, feeling
| the bike, observing the landscape, etc.
| betenoire wrote:
| That was my point. The gp was taking about processing
| thoughts
| JKCalhoun wrote:
| It is, but you seek out the less traffic'd roads when on
| a motorcycle. (I ride too.)
| mediocregopher wrote:
| > "hike" (just long walk since I live in flat Houston)
|
| I've been calling it "urban hiking" and everyone thinks I'm
| joking. But why drive all the way to the wilderness to do a
| hike, when I can just walk out the door?
| jermaustin1 wrote:
| I love this. I will now call it "urban hiking," as well.
| It was still more fitting when I lived in NYC to call it
| hiking since there is at least hills and grass and trees.
| dspillett wrote:
| _> I lost my creativity and the sense of wonder I used to have in
| childhood. I am no longer curious because I am settled for the
| world as it is. I accept things the way they are instead of
| imagining how they could be._
|
| Or you have become bored of your previous interests because you
| have spent a lot of time with them. Try something new, it might
| not work out but in taking a break you may find your interest in
| older interests to be rekindled after the time away.
|
| I used to be a "try everything" developer / sys-admin / blah /
| blah. Having made a career out of that over the last couple of
| decades, these days I don't have the same interest I once did.
| I'm leaving the big re-architecting projects to others who are
| far more enthusiastic and sticking to support/tinkering that pays
| the bills these days, and outside of work I've got other hobbies
| with most of the time I used to spend learning or playing with
| new techie stuff instead spent running around the countryside and
| taking part in HEMA stuff. I am starting to get the urge to get
| back up to speed on some techie things beyond what I need in
| order to keep being useful in the day job, though that is
| happening slowly. In the meantime I'm enjoying this current
| balance and set of interests, maybe it'll stick around long term.
|
| Of course this may not be a suitable attitude for someone for
| whom being particularly eager & creative is required for the
| purposes of continuing to pay the bills, and some people just
| aren't happy with a _job_ , they must have a _passion_ , or feel
| that not doing much more than getting by now will overly limit
| their options later, so YMMV.
| psim1 wrote:
| I sympathize with the author. At the same time, reading a post
| like this reminds me how out of touch we in the SV/tech realm
| are. "Boring" here is quite relative, and folks living more
| average lives would find this kind of attitude to be crazy.
| Boring? You're healthy, get out sometimes, have hobbies, have
| written software, have written more than one-line drivel on the
| web... this is boring? I would call it an attitude or feeling
| borne out of tech privilege.
| shisisms wrote:
| Broadly the core of western psychotherapy, the rediscovery of
| self; free of psychic oppression/external forces.
|
| Two wonderfully relevant quotes from Adam Philips, that the
| author may gain from:
|
| > "For the child's curiosity (''this child who can be deranged by
| hope and anticipation -- by ice cream,'' as Phillips puts it) is
| the grail for which the adult yearns. When all hope of recovering
| it, or at least glimpsing it glowing in the distance, vanishes,
| there is only a terrible emptiness. ''Ecstasy of opportunity''
| gives way to a corrosive loss of interest in life."
|
| > "As always, Phillips prefers not to be too direct. (...)
| Phillips' own writings are prime examples of what we can achieve
| if we put aside, at least for a moment, the overly sensible --
| and set out to discover what really moves us."
| mattgreenrocks wrote:
| I am convinced there is a collective post-covid emotional
| hangover hitting. I think we can't simply pretend to hold it all
| together while so much of life changes.
|
| Also, author would do well to get out of their head and do
| something radically different that doesn't involve computers.
| IceDane wrote:
| While I understand the urge to improve one's life, I really feel
| like we have in general sort of gone off the rails in our quest
| for a better life.
|
| What we have instead is now some kind of social-media-fueled,
| angst-driven obsession about self-optimization. Everyone is
| constantly obsessed with themselves and their own performance in
| every aspect of life.
|
| Are you efficient enough? Are you productive enough? Are you
| eating healthy enough? Are you fun enough? etc
|
| As if this wasn't enough, we can't really decide which way we
| want to go. Because you can't be _too_ efficient or productive,
| either, since you should obviously also be relaxing and
| unstressing enough. And spending enough time with your family.
| But also writing that blog, creating side projects, and so on.
|
| In the end this just creates an endless cycle of sadness and
| frustration because you're not a machine. You can't fulfill all
| the unrealistic goals you've set for yourself because you're not
| a robot.
|
| I've given up on trying to pursue these unrealistic goals and
| trying to constantly self-optimize. It doesn't mean I'm just
| content to wallow in my own filth or that I give up on life. It
| just means I'm not gonna write a blog post about myself where I
| call myself boring because I'm not able to magically conjure up a
| viral side project. It means I'm not gonna compare myself to
| countless youtubers or instagrammers who paint the prettiest
| pictures of themselves they can.
| jimt1234 wrote:
| This! So much this! ^^^
| cardanome wrote:
| Being creative is not a good thing for business success. It is
| better to take a well-known thing and put a little bit of your
| own spin to it or simply to combine two popular things.
|
| If you create anything truly revolutionary it will be an uphill
| battle. You wont be able to communicate what you product does in
| just a few words. Worse it will require potential customers to
| actual make a mental shift. You will have lost their attention
| before you can even get to the benefits. This is why the first
| one to develop something new will rarely see success, only those
| later that copy it when the ground work has already been laid.
| teekert wrote:
| I'd say, time for something you'd normally label as radical. If
| you walk the footsteps of a stranger, you'll learn the things you
| never knew, you never knew.
|
| Just talking to myself here ;)
| [deleted]
| sAbakumoff wrote:
| >> Most of all, I need to stop being boring.
|
| nope, you don't. You need to just accept the fact that you are
| boring AF and live with it.
| eurasiantiger wrote:
| I think your launch failed for the following reasons:
|
| - horrible mobile experience
|
| - people who are looking for a solution that lets them focus are
| not inclined to read through the wall of text on the site
|
| - the try-before-you-buy features are lost at a glance and focus
| easily shifts to the $2.98 part
|
| Why not build the site so that it immediately brings up a simple,
| self-explanatory UI, especially on mobile? Let the users discover
| the features and the limitations.
|
| If it's not usable that way then iterate until it is. Hide the
| wall of text into some about page.
|
| You will find your lost creativity by ingesting a very small
| amount of psilocybin mushrooms.
| last_one_in wrote:
| Drop stuff that doesn't work. I started programming as a kid. 40
| years ago. I wrote a game with a friend while we were at school.
| It made us a tiny amount of money for 3 years work. I dropped out
| of programming (several times now). I travelled, close to home,
| and working in return for food and accomadation (with a scheme
| called WWOOF). I've done farm work, forestry, woodworking,
| butchery, construction, blacksmithing. At the moment I'm trying
| to make a living turning wool from friend's sheep into yarn and
| hats. Honestly. I accidentally came up with a game and put it
| online last week cos I thought the idea was funny and
| interesting, like Randall Monroe's "What If?" (which I was
| listening to on audiobook before I got the idea). Chances are I
| just blew a hundred pounds on hosting and domains but maybe, just
| maybe, it'll bring some money in somehow. otherwise I'll just
| keep on crocheting. Or some other thing. Don't be one thing. Do
| shit that you love. Last year I tried making and selling homemade
| excavator toys (here's an early prototype:
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J5gQZs8edzs&ab_channel=James...).
| Fuck about. Just don't sit at a desk trying to build the next big
| thing cos there are thousands of others doing the same. Find
| what's unique and special about you, even if it's something
| small. And run with it. Are you boring? What's the craziest story
| you can tell about yourself?
| state_less wrote:
| Yesterday, I went across the Florida Straits overnight and was
| headed directly for an electrical storm near West Palm. This
| beauty was shooting bolts into the water and spidering across
| the sky. We diverted to Ft Lauderdale to avoid going right for
| it.
|
| When you go to sea, you're all in. I always was, but sometimes
| I forget and the sea helps me remember.
| last_one_in wrote:
| That, man, right there. Those are the moments you remember. I
| had jobs where I sat at a desk for a year and nothing
| remarkable stands out. Then there are small memories which
| are just epic. For me it's moments like that which make my
| life feel complete.
| MrWiffles wrote:
| First things first: the following is not in any way intended to
| demean/attack/"throw shade" at you or anyone else in the
| slightest. Not whatsoever! So please forgive me if it comes
| across in that way despite my best attempts to the contrary.
|
| That said...
|
| The above, while fantastic for the person who lived that way,
| "smells" (for lack of a better word) like it comes from someone
| who hasn't been forced into a rough life. Bouncing around like
| that is easy when you don't have to worry about whether or not
| you'll be homeless in the next week because you were illegally
| fired from your job and the government doesn't care because
| it's not an easy open-and-shut case where they can automate
| litigation six years from now (because their caseload is
| literally that high).
|
| You can't really do that kind of stuff when you have one - or
| both - parents dying from cancer and they both need full time,
| in-home care that, being unemployed, you can't afford to
| provide them. Especially when for whatever reason, they have no
| retirement savings, pension, 401k, absolutely nothing, and no
| health insurance either.
|
| So please understand that while I'm honestly happy you've been
| able to do that, a lot of people just flat aren't for many
| reasons, the above being mere examples. You might think they're
| made-up, fictional or convoluted, but they're not: they're my
| life experience from 2017-2021. I lived those things, and
| worse, all at the same time.
|
| > A brief note for context: you mentioned "pounds" so I'm
| assuming you're in the UK, which has a famously fantastic
| healthcare system. I'm in the US, where ours is...well, we all
| know what shit smells like, don't we? And herein lies a real
| life example of how government investment in people - aka
| "socialism" to some degree - is not a threat to an economy or
| capital investment, but in fact _enables_ economic growth.
| /rant
|
| Point is, for some people, that grind is the only thing keeping
| us alive. There _is_ no safety net. There _is_ no plan b. You
| either go nose-to-the-grindstone, or you go live under a bridge
| and eat scraps out out of the dumpster. There 's no in between
| for some of us.
|
| Again, not in any way intended to "throw shade" at you
| whatsoever. I'm just raising awareness that for some people,
| this advice, while technically valid and something I really
| wish was actionable for everyone, is in many cases just flat
| out impossible. You try it, you wind up homeless, a pariah, and
| unable to re-enter the industry because who's going to hire
| somebody without any relevant work experience in the last 3
| years? Next!
|
| That said...
|
| > I've done farm work, [...] blacksmithing [...]
|
| I've always wanted to try some kind of blacksmithing! I'M SO
| JEALOUS!
| last_one_in wrote:
| Great feedback. Not offended at all. And you write
| wonderfully, with compassion and passion.
|
| Yes, you're right. Life throws some terrible things but a lot
| of those things will occur regardless of whether you're at a
| desk or out on adventures. I have had some hard times.
|
| I'm a recovering alcoholic. I burned out big style at about
| 29 and quit drinking about a year later. There've been some
| rough times. I don't have a super rich family but they are
| supportive. I've relied on friends for couches. I've lived in
| tents and hammocks in the woods. Never exactly homeless but
| just lacking a home. The scheme, WWOOF, I worked on meant I
| could live for very little money.
|
| Your healthcare point is excellent. I've lived in the UK and
| Canada, both of which have similar healthcare systems. The US
| system is just unbelievable (literally) to Europeans.
|
| I ran out of money (down to my last 300 quid) and returned to
| IT about 8 years ago. I started right back at the bottom and
| worked my way up. I lasted 5 years and burnt out again.
|
| I guess I went too far in the "go crazy and run off live in
| the woods!!!" direction. I guess my main point (if I had one
| after rambling this much) is don't let your soul die at a
| desk.
|
| > I've always wanted to try some kind of blacksmithing! I'M
| SO JEALOUS!
|
| Do it. If you have a backyard then you can throw together a
| simple charcoal forge with an air blower. My youtube channel
| has an ancient video of making tongs. One of the best things
| to learn, making your own tools. Just remember: "Got it hot
| and hit it". That's all the advice you need. And PPE. Eye and
| ear protection. Always.
|
| Otherwise find a local blacksmith and do a weekend. You will
| not regret it.
| unkulunkulu wrote:
| I really started on a path to improvement a couple years back,
| before that I thought that everything else including state of the
| world was to blame and I was perfect.
|
| But thanks to a dusty place...
|
| I was looking for things to improve and have formulated close to
| a dosen "shoulds" during this time.
|
| I cannot say that this was really helpful, because, you know, how
| could I know what I should? My knowledge got me here. The shoulds
| arise from the mind, but how accurate are they? No way to know
| for me!
|
| Now I come to conclusion that I "should" only accept myself, and
| look for meaningful experience and people, everything else will
| happen. Sometimes I'm boring! Sometimes I'm stupid! Sometimes I'm
| irresposible!
|
| I feel where you are, friend, you will do this!
| yolo69420 wrote:
| Attention span and related topics are well studied in psychology,
| with new research appearing almost weekly - much more than
| becoming not boring, what would really help is if the author
| would spend their time on google scholar diving through the
| existing literature on the topic, then do a thorough examination
| of the existing state of the art in the market, and see if there
| is actually any way to meaningfully improve on the state of the
| art.
|
| In other words, figuring out if a potential product could have
| actual value.
|
| Instead they seemed to have reversed the process, already
| concluded that writing this app is a good idea, and relied
| instead of the nebulous and irrational guidance of purely
| artistic ideas and asking friends for new perspectives.
|
| The same irrational thought process and overreliance on emotions
| probably combines with their superficial understanding of pop
| psychology to lead them to conclude that they fall in the
| 'boring' category of that (honestly) completely arbitrary
| dichotomy.
| severak_cz wrote:
| You are not boring, you are bored.
| apalmer wrote:
| I think this statement is on point based on the article. Its
| important to differentiate even if the two things are related,
| you cant solve a problem until you can state and understand it.
| kome wrote:
| to be honest, bored people are usually boring.
| m3kw9 wrote:
| Isn't this wonderful? This is why the competition is tough,
| assuming you want to make it with building new apps. There is so
| much obstacles and this is just one of them you've listed(a
| detrimental mental state). But if you can fix it one by one, that
| will cut you through the top.
| klik99 wrote:
| I remember in my early 30s complaining to a friend about how I
| thought I was becoming boring. He reminded me that I complained
| of the same thing when I was in my early 20s.
|
| Despite it not /feeling/ good, it's probably a good feeling to
| have, one that'll push you to new places.
| nonrandomstring wrote:
| > So what went wrong? My gut feeling is that I am boring.
|
| A lot of pain seems to come from a poor vocabulary about
| feelings. What is boring? It's a weak and flattened word like the
| feelings it's used about.
|
| Do you mean avolition, acedia, irascibility, dissatisfaction,
| insensibility, repression, discouragement, ambivalence, anxiety?
| The Psychology of the Emotions by Neal Burton is a fair place to
| continue the introspective journey you've started [1].
|
| > I lost my creativity and the sense of wonder I used to have in
| childhood. I am no longer curious because I am settled for the
| world as it is. I accept things the way they are instead of
| imagining how they could be.
|
| Comfortably Numb. There's a dose of it going around. Don't worry
| it's an acute condition. All progress depends upon the
| unreasonable man. You need to stop being reasonable. Take a good
| look at the world, and notice there's still plenty to be really,
| healthily _angry_ about, and so much to be joyously _in love_
| with. Just don 't give in to ambivalence or settle for the
| illusion of comfort and safety life seems to be showing you. Take
| a risk on it.
|
| [1] https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/hide-and-
| seek/201601...
| hoseja wrote:
| And then you learn about survivorship bias.
| Sinidir wrote:
| Bingo!
| chii wrote:
| > All progress depends upon the unreasonable man. You need to
| stop being reasonable
|
| and yet there's an unreasonable man invading another country
| right now.
|
| I dont think progress depends on the unreasonable man. It
| depends on the reasonable man who would put in the sweat and
| blood, but might be inspired or paid by the unreasonable man.
| rhn_mk1 wrote:
| That's a mutual dependence then. It's still dependent on the
| unreasonable man.
|
| I look at this in terms of variance: there are few ways to be
| reasonable, but many to be unreasonable. Many of the
| unreasonable ones lead nowhere, but a few lead to progress.
| That's similar to the concept of antifragility.
| arvinsim wrote:
| >It depends on the reasonable man who would put in the sweat
| and blood, but might be inspired or paid by the unreasonable
| man.
|
| It's just the same thing as parent poster said, just with
| extra steps.
| shrikant wrote:
| Ah yes, but no true unreasonable man puts sugar on his
| porridge.
|
| (Ironically, the reference for this is an article titled "No
| true Scotsman starts a war" https://web.archive.org/web/20190
| 105005853/http://www.atimes...)
| willcipriano wrote:
| Reasonable men just follow orders.
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superior_orders
| d1sxeyes wrote:
| There's an important difference between:
|
| > All progress depends upon the unreasonable man
|
| and
|
| > All actions by unreasonable men are progress
|
| If all wibbles are wobbles it is not necessarily true that
| all wobbles are wibbles.
| nonrandomstring wrote:
| > an unreasonable man invading another country right now.
|
| I'd be more cautious equating reason with peace.
|
| Wars are as often the conclusion of pure reason. Strategic
| advantage plus opportunity, plus a little too much game-
| theory can be the perfect ingredients for belligerence.
| ramblerman wrote:
| Both things can be true
|
| > progress depends on the unreasonable man
|
| and
|
| > unreasonable men start wars
|
| But honestly it feels like such a useless nitpick. OP is
| talking about a useful mind-hack to increase your personal
| productivity and meaning, and you are applying it to how we
| should assess the morality of global leaders.
| renarl wrote:
| I had a similar problem with emotions: specifically, limited
| emotional vocabulary and the inability to distinguish what I'm
| feeling. To help myself, I partnered with an emotion coach and
| created an app to expand my emotional vocabulary and come into
| contact with what I'm feeling.
| https://apps.apple.com/app/emote/id1609038427
| MrWiffles wrote:
| For anyone wondering what this person means when he says:
|
| > All progress depends upon the unreasonable man.
|
| Let me share with you one of my all time favorite quotes, from
| George Bernard Shaw[1]:
|
| >"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the
| unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to
| himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable
| man."
|
| While Shaw himself was a controversial figure even in his own
| time (roughly a century ago), and would be abhorred by today's
| standards for many reasons, this particular item, standing
| alone, remains a particular gem of wisdom.
|
| For a historical example we're all quite familiar with in this
| industry, think "Steve Jobs". He adapted the world to his
| vision through innovation and commerce, forcing the creation of
| entire industries - at least twice over! - as a result. Thanks
| to him being "unreasonable", the personal computer market
| emerged which spawned our entire industry. Then with the
| release of the iPhone, the smartphone market came into
| existence along with Android and for a time, Windows Phone
| (RIP).
|
| I strongly disagree with several of Shaw's points of view, but
| this particular gem has always been a favorite of mine in spite
| of that. I find it particularly inspiring.
|
| [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Bernard_Shaw
| idleproc wrote:
| I would like to point out that this quote comes from Shaw's
| play 'Man and Superman'. Specifically, from an appendix to
| the play 'Maxims for Revolutionists'[1], written by the
| character John Tanner.
|
| Have a read through some of the other maxims and make your
| own mind up as to the author's viewpoint.
|
| [1] https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Man_and_Superman/Maxims_fo
| r_R...
| shaftoe444 wrote:
| Archive for others getting a database error:
| https://web.archive.org/web/20220406064123/https://patzhong....
| napolux wrote:
| 2022 and we still have to see WordPress Database Errors.
| lloydatkinson wrote:
| 2022 and developers still use Wordpress for what could be a
| static blog site
| 65 wrote:
| And pay for Wordpress sites too! I have a static Next.js
| site hosted on S3 and I don't pay anything to host it.
| codingdave wrote:
| 2022 and we have so many options for free/cheap tiers on so
| many platforms which provide so many ways for people to share
| content and express themselves to the world. With just one
| pain point that a spike in traffic can overwhelm your
| database limits. Seems like wonderful problem for us all to
| have.
| patrickz wrote:
| Yes you are totally right. I just make a 2G SWAP, now the
| site is back, haha. I thought the site was under attack...
| @@
| antirez wrote:
| Life is too short, normally. But it is too long to focus on a
| single thing for a lifetime.
| exodust wrote:
| Having a negative goal isn't recommended according to something I
| read somewhere.
|
| You're meant to frame personal objectives in positive terms.
| Instead of "stop eating junk food", "start eating healthier
| food". Instead of "stop being lazy", "exercise every day".
|
| Instead of "stop being boring", the objective might be to read
| more books, or a million other things that result in interesting
| people.
|
| Also his app is built on the premise that we get distracted
| easily and can't focus. The success of the app therefore relies
| on the failure of others. Perhaps a better project is one where
| the app doesn't start with "you suck, now sign up and you won't
| suck as much". I'm possibly being unfair. I'm just thinking of
| ways this dude can make less boring apps.
| andrewstuart wrote:
| Sounds like burnout and depression at the same time. He's
| probably right - maybe a change of scene from writing software
| for a while.
| MrPowers wrote:
| > I lost my creativity and the sense of wonder I used to have in
| childhood. I am no longer curious because I am settled for the
| world as it is. I accept things the way they are instead of
| imagining how they could be.
|
| The best way to expand your perspective of the world is move to a
| new country with a different culture, learn a new language, and
| make local friends.
|
| I recently moved to Brasil and am learning Portuguese. The
| language barrier is difficult. Learning how to communicate
| indirectly is hard. Understanding the different social norms
| requires you to question some of your core beliefs. I don't think
| you can learn any of the core lessons without learning the
| language.
|
| Travel will put you out of your comfort zone, but you should also
| start having a lot of fun... the type of fun you used to have
| with friends when you were younger. Not the buttoned up type of
| fun you have at a dinner party with acquaintances.
| JKCalhoun wrote:
| > Not the buttoned up type of fun you have at a dinner party
| with acquaintances.
|
| Before I quit FB years ago, I had whole feeds that were just
| groups of 30-somethings around some restaurant table or another
| holding wine glasses up for the waiter taking the photo. Like
| some Antonioni film....
| i5heu wrote:
| https://web.archive.org/web/*/https://patzhong.com/stop-bein...
| newbamboo wrote:
| Man needs meaning. There's not an app for that. Stop being boring
| and building a successful app are probably misplaced priorities.
| Work on spirituality and family, that's where "meaning" is for
| most people and so probably for you too.
| swframe2 wrote:
| I got stuck in a game. My 12 year-old offered to help. Within a
| few minutes he solved several problems that had blocked me for
| days.
|
| It reminds me of the intel tik/tok product cycle. Look inside for
| a while then look outside for a while.
| PragmaticPulp wrote:
| > I lost my creativity and the sense of wonder I used to have in
| childhood. I am no longer curious because I am settled for the
| world as it is. I accept things the way they are instead of
| imagining how they could be.
|
| I was starting to feel this way before I had kids, but having
| kids completely changed everything for the more interesting.
|
| It's funny because it's the exact opposite of what I was told
| would happen: The story goes that you have kids, lose yourself,
| and become a boring old parent. Instead, I'm never lacking for
| fun or creative ideas because I can pick up a creative and
| hilarious child and go do literally anything together and we'll
| have a good time. I'm meeting more new and interesting people
| than I have at any point since college simply by doing parent
| things and meeting other parents. I still have time to work on
| one specific side project, but I've learned to stop grinding
| through the side projects that I didn't really enjoy anyway.
| Becoming a parent is a great forcing function to get out and
| shake up your priorities.
|
| Obviously I'm not recommending becoming a parent as a solution to
| this problem. However, I wanted to note that the realities of
| becoming a parent are literally the opposite of what I was led to
| believe by peers and social media while growing up. Contrary to
| everything I was told, it's actually the childless people and
| couples I know who are entering these periods of "boring" where
| they struggle for interest or motivation or meaning, while us
| parents are off having an extremely non-boring and fun time with
| this new chapter.
| michaelgrafl wrote:
| I have three little children but I can't say I feel more or
| less boring since having the first one.
|
| What I can say, however, is that I'm absolutely thrilled when I
| watch my kids watch Home Alone while they go crazy with scream
| and laughter at Joe Pesci and Daniel Stern getting physically
| abused by an eight year old with booby traps that would be
| lethal in real life.
| gigaflop wrote:
| I'm on the fence about having kids, but this all is one of the
| things that makes me consider them. It's going to depend on the
| partner I end up with, but I feel like I might end up making
| spending time my kids into one of my 'hobbies'.
|
| I mean, they're right there, you already know them, and get to
| show them all sorts of new and fascinating things?
| lupire wrote:
| When you are four years old, you lose your memories of the
| first years of your life. When you have kids, you live them
| again.
| [deleted]
| v-erne wrote:
| Sure and then You forget them again. When I look at my 9 year
| old I cannot recall at all what she used to be at 4.
| Aeolun wrote:
| I have enough (well, not really, but that's water under the
| bridge now) video's of my now 3 year old being 1 year old.
| They help me remember.
| ChicagoBoy11 wrote:
| I think folks' mileage vary significantly on this, and partly
| due to a distinction I'd make between being bored and not
| having energy.
|
| I used to know a family that was as creative as folks would
| come (immediate family had renowned authors, world class
| academics, illustrator, etc.), and it was clear that the
| children played such a central role in continuing to foster a
| culture that was very creative and "alive." But, it was also
| true that both parents had WFH jobs (this was over a decade
| ago), extremely flexible schedules, and were very well off to
| do. In that context, having kids can be the forcing function
| you describe, especially if the parents in question are folks
| already predisposed to being curious and interesting people.
|
| However, I suspect most adults end up suffering from a lack of
| energy. The daily toil ends up sapping so much of themselves
| that the necessary energy expenditure to be more child-like
| isn't there, and you get your usual couch potatoes, nappers,
| seemingly disinterested zombies. For someone in that situation,
| adding kids to the equation ends up becoming just ONE MORE
| THING to completely drain them every day.
| verisimi wrote:
| > But, it was also true that both parents had WFH jobs (this
| was over a decade ago), extremely flexible schedules, and
| were very well off
|
| Well, exactly. Its easier to be creative if you don't have
| financial or time constraints.
| long_time_gone wrote:
| With all of the tools we've built to optimize our time,
| you'd think we would be more creative.
| rdtwo wrote:
| The opposite the optimization becomes rigid structure.
| One thing breaks and the entire pyramid of your life
| crumbles
| kevmo314 wrote:
| I have the totally opposite experience. Everyone I know who has
| kids is bored: they've given up on their side projects and
| resigned themselves to jobs they constantly complain about but
| can't leave because they need to support their family.
|
| So I'm not sure having kids really matters here. I think the
| mindset change is more important. It's easy to forget that the
| world has so many interesting things to pick up and do
| literally anything with, much like your child. My friends who
| have kids don't think that way.
| jokethrowaway wrote:
| It could be they didn't have enough money to have kids.
|
| Nowadays most families can't afford kids at the same standard
| of, let's say 40 years ago with the same amount of parents
| time.
|
| I think it's crucial to be at home for kids and at maximum
| one working parent working full time
| folkrav wrote:
| > Everyone I know who has kids is bored: they've given up on
| their side projects and resigned themselves to jobs they
| constantly complain about but can't leave because they need
| to support their family.
|
| Bored and giving up side-projects are two different things. I
| did give up side-projects after having my son, but it's far
| from being boring.
|
| As for the job thing... I guess you don't frequent that many
| people with kids? Or you just happend to know unhappy people?
| I've changed jobs 2 times (well, 3 if you consider COVID
| related job loss) since my son was born.
| rdtwo wrote:
| I'm bored, starting at my phone while my kid snacks or does
| activities... so yeah
| kevmo314 wrote:
| Definitely don't appreciate the conclusion that I just know
| unhappy people. As I mentioned, I don't think having kids
| has anything to do with it.
| folkrav wrote:
| I said you just happen to know unhappy people, not that
| you only know unhappy people.
| devnulll wrote:
| Parent here, of 3 pre-teen kids. My experience is that having
| kids has brought a joy of learning and exploration like
| little before. We constantly visit flight museums, train
| museums, and do unusual things like joining Facebook 4x4
| groups and go on weekend adventures. We've done local MTG
| events and similar. Last weekend we went to the local
| Japanese Garden (yea, spring!) and the kids dressed up in
| crazy clothes for some fun pictures.
|
| I can't sit still, so am always looking for new things to do.
| Having children do this with me bring joy to me, and to them.
| mattgreenrocks wrote:
| I am convinced everyone needs a certain amount of stress in
| their lives. Too little and you end up super-existential; too
| much and you end up feeling burnt out.
|
| It took me a long time to acclimate to having children. I
| probably had postpartum depression as a dad. Especially early
| on, kids are a big stressor, and having them should be a
| deliberate choice.
|
| It's also the most impactful work you will ever do, and once
| you see that for yourself, it's hard to see your career in
| exactly the same way.
| abecode wrote:
| C.f. Addison's disease, caused by a lack of cortisol, the
| stress hormone, and treating some conditions like back and
| knee pain with cortisone, the synthetic version of cortisol
| twofornone wrote:
| No man is a solipsist when he has shit on his shoe.
| 100011_100001 wrote:
| This is very true. Stressors allow you to grow. One of the
| weird things is seeing friends that never had kids be exactly
| the same 10-20 years later, doing the same things, talking
| about the same stuff. It always shows me how much I have
| grown and how much they haven't.
|
| I am in my 40s, and it's weird seeing my friends of 20 years
| remain static. The only ones that have changed are either
| people with children or a big catastrophe in their lives.
|
| To be precise, I don't think it's the stress, but dealing
| with taking care of someone other than yourself.
| SketchySeaBeast wrote:
| Is it growth or simply change? There's an implication with
| "growth" that somehow you've become greater or better in
| some way. Is that the case, or are you just more focused on
| being a parent because that's who you have changed into?
| 100011_100001 wrote:
| I agree with the other two responses.
|
| Dealing with your own kids you start to understand
| humanity better. You understand your parents more, one of
| the funny things that happens, is you catch yourself
| responding to things the same way your parents did.
| Sometimes that's good, other times that's bad. This leads
| to self-evaluation. You have to ask how did I feel when
| my parents did this? What did I hate about my parents
| parenting style, what did I like?
|
| If you don't have children, it's purely a theoretical
| question, the stakes are null. With your own children the
| stakes are the emotional, physical and intellectual
| health of your kids, it has to be taken seriously.
|
| On the flip side you realize that we are all just kids in
| adult bodies. I see my children do things and I see
| parallels in my own behavior, or in the behavior of
| others. So not only do you understand your parents
| better, you understand yourself and humanity better.
|
| Aside from getting a better understanding of human
| nature, you also have to start making decisions about
| your own needs vs the needs of others, in this case your
| children, and your co-parent. If your kid is throwing up
| at 2am, guess what, you can't just deal with it tomorrow.
| You start checking the weather to see does my kid need a
| coat, a rain coat, a t-shirt? As a side effect you start
| paying more attention externally. Questions like "how is
| my kid feeling right now?", or "why did they just do
| that?". Which means your empathy increases, and your
| emotional intelligence.
|
| All of this presumes the ability to self-reflect. Which
| is something a large number of people lack, including
| parents. Basically if you ever see bad parents you will
| notice the common thread is lack of self-reflection and
| awareness. It's holding on to your past self which
| ultimately hurts your children, and your personal growth.
| jokethrowaway wrote:
| You could argue you are better because you know more.
|
| I'm still a software engineer and into fitness. After
| having kids I also had some experience with parenting.
|
| By observing kids development you can also understand and
| experience how people grow into the adults you see
| everyday and I definitely think I understand psychology
| more.
|
| Being a parent is also a great journey of self discovery.
| You'll learn how you react to stress, you'll realise
| things about your own childhood, you may uncover a series
| of problems you may have.
|
| As much as I loved to think of myself as someone thinking
| older than my age, I was definitely less mature before
| having kids.
| ALittleLight wrote:
| I lived for a while single and without kids. When I
| finally got married and became a father my feeling was
| that it was like I had been playing a video game and
| stayed far too long in the first level. It's fun there,
| and easy, but there's a whole lot more out there. It can
| be harder, scary, relentlessly demanding - but also
| deeply fulfilling and wonderful. (I'd write more but
| there's a crying baby I've got to go help)
| notch656a wrote:
| Weird, I felt the reverse. Staying the straight course
| married with kids is the first level where it's easy and
| many others are running the same program, and CPS or
| divorce loom if you actually seriously alter the routine
| or take serious dangerous risks. Society pretty much
| approves of the 'family' path. Being single was like hard
| mode where you could basically make your life as
| dangerous or as interesting as you like, and you didn't
| have to worry about risking the life of your wife or
| child. When I was a homeless single male, I could have
| been run over by a car in the street and no one would
| have given two shits, other than maybe to pickpocket my
| corpse.
| tolgerias wrote:
| As a parent of a 2yo myself I think it's a bit of both. I
| definitely changed a lot, am more focused on being a
| parent and also feel lees existential and depressed
| because I have a new and almost full time project which
| is raising my daughter to the best of my ability. But I
| also noticed some changes that I can describe as growth.
| I no longer have trouble getting up early, and I go to
| bed early as well if I need to do so the next day. This
| is basic responsibility that I didn't have before. I also
| help more around the house and take time to fix things
| that I would've just left and procrastinated on for
| months before (changing a bulb, improving my office,
| etc). I've got a promotion as well and am doing better at
| my job, even though I have less time overall. I think
| this is because I'm more focused than before, which is
| unexpected since I work from home. I have also become
| more motivated to work on personal projects. I've started
| homebrewing since my daughter was in the womb, got back
| into chess and even did some gardening. So a lot of
| positive change in my life. I cannot say if this would
| have happened regardless of my daughter but I am
| definitely in a much better place than I was before
| olyjohn wrote:
| I guess... What I see is people with or without kids who
| stay the same, and people with or without kids who change.
| I can't honestly tell that "having kids" is the factor, or
| maybe some people change while others stay the same. What
| exactly is wrong with either way?
| pkdpic wrote:
| I completely agree, having a kid is hard work but its put the
| universe into alignment for me more than I ever would have
| expected in terms of healthy priorities at work, balancing my
| ego-driven motivations out and in the direction and scope of my
| personal projects.
| gfxgirl wrote:
| Sounds like you have good kids. Congratulations. I know parents
| with good kids and I know way more parents with bad kids. The
| parents with good kids will generally claim they did a better
| job raising their kids. The parents with bad kids will
| generally claim the good parents just got lucky. Me, I can't
| tell. I certainly see most (not all) parents with bad kids
| doing things that IMO help make their kid bad. Of course there
| are so many influences on kids on top of the gene lottery so
| ???
|
| In any case, I've always hoped for your experience.
| Kluny wrote:
| Can you really describe kids or parents with any kind of
| meaning using a binary "good" and "bad"? Aren't most people
| great in situations that suit them and allow them to thrive
| and use their skills and talents, and bad in situations where
| they don't have the tools to be successful?
| pavlov wrote:
| I'm a parent of two children and most of the time I'm extremely
| bored and struggling for motivation.
|
| My older child is a pre-teen constantly screaming and raging
| about the tiniest things. It's a tremendous energy drain. But
| the children are certainly not the reason for my lurking
| depression: it was there before I had kids, and being a parent
| hasn't magically transformed my life with meaning. These things
| are roughly orthogonal in my anecdotal experience.
| k_sze wrote:
| Same struggle. Except my elder daughter isn't "screaming and
| raging about the tiniest things" (yet). She's just... a total
| mess at a few things (self-motivation, self-awareness,
| responsibility, tact), constantly getting chastized by my
| wife.
|
| I don't have fun with my kids. I have no more friend in real
| life (even before the pandemic). I can't even play computer
| games when I want to because my kids take too darn long to
| finish their homework and we live in a small home in Hong
| Kong. Even weekends are basically more studying and extra-
| curricular classes for my kids (ballet, phonics, mental math,
| painting). I've lost motivation to do much else. Nowadays I
| just burrow myself in reading fantasy novels when I have any
| time for myself, not even because I really enjoy them, but
| because I lack creativity and motivation to do much else.
| efitz wrote:
| Why do you keep doing things that don't make you happy?
|
| Why do you feel the need to do so many extra-curricular
| activities related to child education? Can't you take your
| kids to the park, show them stuff and talk to them about
| it? One of the cool things that most adults forget about
| childhood is that everything is new for kids. Even stuff
| that kids are used to; they have really only scratched the
| surface of- they haven't had the time or the life
| experience to deeply understand things, but they also
| haven't had the life experience to become jaded or cynical.
| Spending some time around them doing stuff that is not
| homework, can be fun, or at least interesting.
|
| Do you want to be unfulfilled?
|
| If you truly cannot find joy in anything, then you are
| likely suffering from depression, and you should go see a
| doctor. It won't get better by itself.
| k_sze wrote:
| > Why do you feel the need to do so many extra-curricular
| activities related to child education?
|
| Because this is Hong Kong, and if you want to get into a
| good high school, and then a good university later in
| life, this is what you do here, unless either A) your kid
| has really high IQ and would skip years or B) you are
| rich and don't mind just paying your way through
| international schools.
|
| My kids are not case A), and I'm not rich enough for B).
|
| Schools here ask you "what credentials do you have (other
| then regular education)?", "have you won any
| competition?", etc. I'm not even doing that much,
| compared to other really competitive families.
| qw3rty01 wrote:
| Just want to emphasize the last sentence of the parent
| post, some of what you were describing really sounds like
| either leading to, or full blown depression, and want to
| mirror the recommendation to get professional help even
| if it feels like it would be a waste of time or bother
| people around you
| cultofmetatron wrote:
| sounds like a dystopian nightmare. Makes me glad to live
| in a country where not getting into the best school
| doesn't automatically doom you to a lifetime of failure.
| jokethrowaway wrote:
| Good schools are overrated, don't let them ruin your life
| sibeliuss wrote:
| Exactly, probably better to teach ones kids how to be
| decent little people and then have faith that they'll
| figure it out.
| [deleted]
| YeGoblynQueenne wrote:
| Figure out that unless you've won the genetic lottery you
| don't need to apply?
|
| >> Because this is Hong Kong, and if you want to get into
| a good high school, and then a good university later in
| life, this is what you do here, unless either A) your kid
| has really high IQ and would skip years or B) you are
| rich and don't mind just paying your way through
| international schools.
|
| Sounds like the plot of GATTACA. Maybe people who don't
| live there should not hand out advice too easily?
| ideamotor wrote:
| Yep. I cannot advise. In Texas education is not
| considered enough. But this sounds ridiculously too far
| the other way. The book "The Myth of Merit" comes to
| mind.
| rackjack wrote:
| Easy to say this when you don't have 1 billion people
| also gunning for the opportunities you want (maybe less
| since they're in Hong Kong and not the mainland)
| jcpst wrote:
| The last paragraph hits home. Going to a therapist has
| done wonders for me.
| jcpst wrote:
| I'll try not to do the quote/respond thing too much, but a
| few things about this post concern me.
|
| > I don't have fun with my kids.
|
| I think that's a serious problem. Personally, I would
| prioritize that over all the studying and activities. They
| are kids. Fun is their job.
|
| > I can't even play computer games when I want to because
| my kids take too darn long to finish their homework
|
| Let them do their homework on their own, and you can play
| some games. It's not your homework, let them do it.
|
| Or just play games instead of the reading you don't enjoy.
|
| People, they'll be fine without all the activities. Go out
| and have some fun together.
| PragmaticPulp wrote:
| > But the children are certainly not the reason for my
| lurking depression: it was there before I had kids, and being
| a parent hasn't magically transformed my life with meaning.
|
| Sorry to hear about your struggles. I do fully agree that
| having kids won't alleviate things like major depression and
| hope I didn't give that impression.
| VHRanger wrote:
| Have you checked for ADHD in your pre-teen that has impulse
| control issues?
|
| It can be eye opening if the behavior has a neurological
| component, and it's always better to intervene early in these
| cases
| lyaa wrote:
| I was just about to comment about this because his
| description is textbook ADHD in girls.
| Melting_Harps wrote:
| > I'm a parent of two children and most of the time I'm
| extremely bored and struggling for motivation.
|
| >>My older child is a pre-teen constantly screaming and
| raging about the tiniest things. It's a tremendous energy
| drain. But the children are certainly not the reason for my
| lurking depression: it was there before I had kids, and being
| a parent hasn't magically transformed my life with meaning.
| These things are roughly orthogonal in my anecdotal
| experience.
|
| I think this anecdote needs to become more mainstream form of
| advice, people are so quick to suggest having kids as a cure-
| all for people's depression or other mental health issues
| like it's just going to make everything else disappear.
|
| Personally speaking I'm sorry to hear this, but this is also
| why I have put-off having kids--although its mainly for
| environmental issues, I can't see how people can in good-
| faith bring children into a World in which they will inherit
| such catastrophic climate change and a World where it's still
| possible that aging kleptocrats can shell and occupy a
| nuclear power plant, one of which was the location of the
| most dangerous environmental disasters of the 20th century
| and most people shrug it off and care more about Will Smith
| slapping Chris Rock!
|
| Still, I don't know what the source of your depression is,
| and this is kind of harsh, but you are a cautionary tale for
| people like me: I have bouts of crippling weltschmertz after
| a life of being an environmentalist activist with a
| background in tech as a founder that merged the two together.
| As you can imagine it's certainly not as lucrative as
| destroying the World, and that is the saddest thing.
|
| After 20 years at least I can go down knowing that while most
| of my existence have been a mix between Pyrrhic victories and
| burnout that I did more than I ever thought I would given the
| World I was forced to inherit.
|
| My angst, rage and anger was channeled into something
| positive, and it helps but it's a corrosive and toxic form of
| fuel that corrodes you from within; hopefully you will in
| time be able to use the same energy draining you to do
| something that helps alleviate your situation.
|
| The only time I don't feel the Weltschertz is when I'm
| building, the problem is that I can't anymore after
| destroying my body after 20 years of living this way and I'm
| having to heal all of these injuries: physical as well as
| mental.
| silicon2401 wrote:
| It's funny because the exact opposite is true for me, and is
| the reason I won't be having kids. I recovered my creativity
| and wonder for life through just living life how I want to,
| rather than based on what I thought was normal or typical. Part
| of that was rejecting the societal expectation of having kids.
| Now I have a blast pursuing my interests and looking forward to
| living the rest of my life this way, without having to make
| compromises in time or resources for children.
| TaupeRanger wrote:
| You can do all of those things with children, and then you
| won't be a burden on society when you're older, having no one
| left to care about you except the nursing home staff, and as
| a bonus you'll get to help continue the human race, which is
| always good.
| Xenixo wrote:
| rob74 wrote:
| My attitude to "being a burden on society" is: "I paid
| taxes all my working life, so if I get some of that money
| back, all the better!". Of course, not having to go to a
| nursing home is the even better alternative, but
| unfortunately nobody can rule that out.
| TaupeRanger wrote:
| I think a person deserves to get elderly care when
| needed...I was moreso talking about the fact that no one
| in the world will literally care about the childless
| person, because no one younger will be in their life. I
| think people who decide not to have kids often privilege
| their well being in their 30s-50s without thinking about
| how poor and lonely the last 30 years of their lives
| might be. It's just another angle to consider in this
| complex decision.
| yoyohello13 wrote:
| > no one in the world will literally care about the
| childless person.
|
| This is entirely dependent on the person. I think you're
| partially right that nobody will care about you (as much)
| as your kids (potentially) will.
|
| If you spend your life focusing on yourself, then yeah,
| nobody will probably care about you. If you spend your
| life devoted to serving others and making an impact in
| your community then plenty of people will care about you
| when you're old. I've known many older people who have
| done great things for the community and the community
| gathers together to help them in return.
|
| You affect other people caring about you through your
| actions.
| silicon2401 wrote:
| > you won't be a burden on society when you're older,
| having no one left to care about you except the nursing
| home staff,
|
| thanks for your concern, but I'm not concerned :)
|
| > help continue the human race, which is always good.
|
| I disagree, which is part of why I'm not having kids!
| TaupeRanger wrote:
| Of course you aren't concerned NOW...in 30 or 40 years
| you certainly will be. But then, you appear to be a
| nihilistic antinatalist, so there are clearly other
| issues at play here.
| unsupp0rted wrote:
| Isn't it unethical to have children so as to use them as a
| safety net later in life, after having conditioned them
| from birth to attach to you and care for you?
| Fricken wrote:
| No, that's how it has been through all history.
| unsupp0rted wrote:
| Historical and ethical are two separate things.
| willcipriano wrote:
| It's impossible to divorce the two, what we consider
| ethical is what we have done historically for the most
| part.
| witx wrote:
| Because having kids with the mindset of: "I'll be a burden
| to them instead of the nursing home staff / society" is a
| great reason to have kids ...
| TaupeRanger wrote:
| No, it's not and I never said it was. It is simply a fact
| about not having children.
| witx wrote:
| Yes you did:
|
| > You can do all of those things with children, and then
| you won't be a burden on society (...)
| rob74 wrote:
| Plus, beside the moral conundrum of not wanting to be a
| burden for your children, there's always the possibility
| that your children will simply not accept the burden and
| send you to a nursing home anyway...
| efsavage wrote:
| +1, being a parent hasn't made me (more) boring. Sure, I went
| to work for a large company instead of startups so I have a
| better/regular paycheck, and I may not play as many games or
| drink as many beers with friends or hack on as many side
| projects, but kids are really good at forcing you to prioritize
| the things in your life that are actually important and
| meaningful. So I still do all those things, just less so, but
| more mindfully.
|
| Also, now that my kid is getting older and is starting to have
| actual interests (e.g. he's really into smart home stuff), I'm
| able to enjoy and participate in those things more.
| rlawson wrote:
| Your reply made my day. I have two grown children and now an
| adopted 4 yr old girl. I realize as I get older (52) what a
| precious gift they are and make time to experience the world
| through their eyes (esp the 4 yr old who is a hoot). It's hard
| cause typically when you have kids in your 20/30s you are
| building a career and everything is a challenge with lots of
| stress. So as one old guy to younger parents I'd say 1. Don't
| beat yourself up, life is hard. 2. Go play with your kids and
| be a kid again.
| JKCalhoun wrote:
| Same. Children become vessels for my vicariousness. Everything
| is still new to them, and I get to see the world with new eyes
| again through them.
| gigaflop wrote:
| I feel like if I ever end up curious about a hobby or
| activity, that I could introduce it first to my hypothetical
| kids.
|
| I get to keep the kids busy, see if they have fun with
| something, and judge if it's something I'd personally enjoy.
| If we both end up liking it, then great! Something more to
| share with them.
| dominotw wrote:
| i think your experience is not a common one. Lots of things
| have to click in place for that to happen. A satisfying job,
| supportive spouse and a solid relationship with stakeholders
| like the in-laws ect.
|
| Most parents are just beat down managing two jobs, taking kids
| to all the classes, doing chores in the house, worrying about
| career ect.
| [deleted]
| levesque wrote:
| Tell that to my very burnt out parent friends! YMMV
| NateEag wrote:
| "Burnt-out" != "boring".
| [deleted]
| quirino wrote:
| The point of parent comment is that the consequences of
| having kids are not what they seem from the outside. Maybe
| your parent friends' experiences are vastly different from
| how you perceive them (or how they express them).
| 100011_100001 wrote:
| I have four children. I'm not going to claim that sometimes
| kids are not frustrating. However every time I see parents
| being burnt out I see one of two scenarios.
|
| Scenario 1: The over-achiever parent
|
| I see this frequently, a parent that wants to be a super
| parent. This manifests in a bunch of different ways, but
| usually it's enrolling their kids to 15 different activities
| essentially running all over the place being glorified taxis
| for their kids.
|
| Then their kids don't know how to function if there is
| nothing to do.
|
| Scenario 2: The I'm missing our parent
|
| Parents that either had kids too early, or not by choice.
| They feel like they missed out, so they lament about all the
| fun they didn't have. This is a weird form of resistance to
| reality. What usually happens is that they will get a
| divorce, to somehow escape their children. I am 40, so I see
| it with people my age, they divorce, see their kids 2-4 times
| a week and do crazy stuff to somehow recapture their youth.
|
| In my opinion it's about keeping a good balance. If you never
| make time for yourself that's a mistake. If you put the bar
| too high as a parent you are bound to miss. The simplest
| approach is to carve out some time to yourself, balancing
| things out with your significant other. Enrolling your kids
| in 1-2 activities out of school and recognizing that not
| every single minute of a day needs to be hyper-optimized.
| gfxgirl wrote:
| It can help to have family close. Growing up my parents
| often gave us to our grandparents for the weekend (one a
| month?). Both grandparents lived within 1hr. So, my parent
| were able to take some weekends for themselves. Also
| babysitters for a night out and they both had siblings with
| kids they could leave us with.
|
| I know plenty of people who don't have this kind of support
| group and/or are unwilling to use sitters in any form.
| lfowles wrote:
| Definitely. I'm incredibly burnt out after being a stay
| at home dad for the past year, with the pandemic cautions
| a lot of support structures disappeared or became
| unreliable (older family watching the baby, finding a
| reliable babysitter or daycare, etc). I essentially
| forgot about everything extraneous in my life so I
| wouldn't be frustrated that I didn't have time or energy
| to do it anymore. Without a doubt, I'm more boring than I
| used to be.
|
| Part of this is just having a kid under 5 apparently, but
| I can't imagine being able to survive with more than one,
| much less retain a creative pursuit.
| 100011_100001 wrote:
| The pandemic was brutal for parents. All four of my kids
| where doing remote learning. My significant other stays
| at home so she took care of that end of things. If I was
| a single parent it would have been impossible to maintain
| without outside assistance.
|
| ...and since I have a bunch of kids. It gets easier.
| People talk about terrible 2s, but I feel that 3 and 4
| are much harder. They are old enough to know what they
| want, but not old enough to get it. They can communicate
| but not 100% or with appropriate level of specificity.
| They also have the amazing ability to know how to push
| buttons, part of carving an identity for themselves.
|
| Each year though it gets easier. It's true for all four
| of mine, and they do have different speeds, they mature
| at different rates, but overall the trend is always less
| dependency, which as a single parent you need.
|
| I totally feel your pain though. So I hope you are doing
| OK.
|
| As an extra tip, totally unsolicited of course. Start
| doing chores, boring tasks with your kid. Even if they
| are little. It does a few good things.
|
| 1. You have to do the chores anyway, might as well do
| them when you can't relax (since the kid is going to
| ask/need things). This way when they go to sleep, you
| don't have a bunch of things to do, you can fully relax.
|
| 2. You are teaching them life skills. They learn by
| watching and doing. This will also allow you to bond over
| simple life stuff
|
| 3. As they get older, they can have their own chores and
| lighten your load and if nothing else appreciate what you
| do for them a tiny bit more
|
| You said your kid is under 5, so I'll give you some
| examples.
|
| Age 2: pickup toys (I pretend that the toy bin/bucket is
| a monster that's hungry for toys). Press buttons (for
| example to start the dishwasher). Throw things in the
| garbage (hungry garbage can)
|
| Age 3: they can start wiping things, taking their place
| to the kitchen counter, take items from one room to
| another. Dusting
|
| Age 4: can start help you cook safely, things like
| dumping a teaspoon of salt in the food, stirring
| (obviously no boiling stuff), mopping (rather badly, but
| they have a blast), sweeping (make sure you duck :),
| putting dirty laundry away, folding kitchen towels
|
| Age 5: I let them start cutting simple things like
| bananas, start making breakfast (cereal, toast then
| scrambled eggs). Pickup their room with some pointers.
| Assist in cleaning the bathroom and kitchen counters.
|
| Hope it helped.
| PragmaticPulp wrote:
| I said it was interesting, not-boring, and introducing me to
| more new people than I've met since college.
|
| I didn't say it was always easy, but that's fine by me
| because it's not actually soul-crushingly difficult (again,
| another misconception popular among young people without kids
| that turned out to be wrong).
|
| The older I get, the more I realize that my friends who
| optimize for minimal effort (no kids, reluctant to leave the
| house, picky about what they attend) are gradually sliding
| into very boring and unfulfilled existences.
| Elte wrote:
| I may be like one of your boring unfulfilled friends,
| except I have a single hobby that makes me feel a sense of
| purpose, whereas very few other things in my life ever
| really have. On a rational level, it seems to me that
| having kids will add a sense of purpose to my life, given
| how many people share this perspective. At the same time,
| thinking about the time and effort I will be forced to take
| away from the thing that keeps me sane fills me with dread.
| It's not like there's a way back.
| Volrath89 wrote:
| What hobby?
| PragmaticPulp wrote:
| > At the same time, thinking about the time and effort I
| will be forced to take away from the thing that keeps me
| sane fills me with dread. It's not like there's a way
| back.
|
| YMMV and don't let my experience be your only guide
|
| But I had the same exact feeling. After the first year or
| two (infant stage is tough, no denying it) I'm actually
| right back to my hobbies just as before.
|
| It takes more planning now to do the weekend hobby events
| that are out of town, but it's still plenty doable.
|
| I've also realized that the number of years that your
| kids are young and require a lot of attention is actually
| fairly small. I plan to live to at least 80 and the most
| attentive child-raising years are only a small fraction
| of that.
| gfxgirl wrote:
| I definitely have at least 3 friends with kids that
| manage to keep up with their hobbies. 5, 3, and 2 kids
| respectively. No idea how they do it but they certainly
| demonstrate it can be done.
| HFguy wrote:
| What is the hobby?
| willcipriano wrote:
| What they are really saying is "It was fun (going to the
| bar/playing video games/whatever) with you when we were
| young, but I'm not young anymore and have a family to spend
| time with, I wish you had one too so I could invite you to
| family oriented activities." but knowing that you won't
| understand they say they are too busy and tired.
| yoyohello13 wrote:
| You can invite people without kids to family oriented
| activities too. Maybe they would enjoy just hanging out
| with people.
| willcipriano wrote:
| It really depends on the friend I suppose, I wasn't in a
| place to do all that many family friendly things before
| having kids personally.
| deberon wrote:
| I still like to do all those things as a parent! But I AM
| too busy and tired to do it impromptu.
| jokethrowaway wrote:
| It can also just be an excuse and they don't want to hang
| out with you.
|
| The reason I started thinking about having a family is that
| I was done with partying.
|
| The idea of going out for drinks doesn't sound too
| appealing, but it's the popular thing to say
| whistlerbrk wrote:
| Think it depends on the age of the children, right? Do you
| parents have very young children? Things get better once they
| are 5-6
| v-erne wrote:
| Thats true, when both my children passed that bar (younger
| is just over 5 and older is 9) a lot of things got much
| better. But do not kid yourself (pun intended) if you are
| not sociopath You will feel that You need to care for them
| for the rest of your life and that always will be a
| blessing and burden at the same time. And the proportion
| may not be in your favour (my almost 40 years old brother
| is still living with my parents and havent had job for
| years).
| jasper_fitussi wrote:
| Yep, also the introverted ones, with introverted kids.
| osullip wrote:
| Tell that to people who won't/don't have kids
| hungryforcodes wrote:
| If there is one category of people who are extremely borinf its
| parents. I have no kids and the world opens up to me. I can
| travel where I want, date who I want, read what I like and
| engage in interesting discussions with people on the street
| that I've just randomly met.
|
| When I hang out with my parent friends they have one mono topic
| of conversation: their kids and related subjects.
| m4x wrote:
| Why can't parents travel, date new people, have ridiculously
| cool hobbies, read, and talk to random people on the street?
|
| As far as conversation topics go, my friends and I rarely
| spend more than a few minutes here and there discussing our
| kids. We all have much more interesting things to talk about
| and kids don't really come up.
|
| I guess you're extrapolating too much based on your own
| personal experience.
|
| I won't argue that there are no parents who bore you, but
| fundamentally that isn't due to being a parent.
| notch656a wrote:
| Before I had kids I used to travel and voluntarily fight in
| foreign warzones, go into dangerous ghettos in countries
| like Paraguay, and go deep into forest for weeks in
| freezing weather that either a young child can't reliably
| survive or that the mother would never allow. Any of these
| things would most definitely get child services called were
| I to actually share I brought I child in that activity.
|
| Those are the things that brought joy and interest to my
| life.
|
| Can you explain how I can do those things as a parent?
| Parenthood is the long stride on low gear. Before I may
| have been mugged or killed in a barrio or shot by ISIS but
| it was far more interesting.
|
| I think a lot of parents lie to themselves. You can always
| a borrow a or foster a kid if you want to do kid
| activities, but you can't just get rid of your own kid. On
| that alone your life becomes much less interesting, at
| least in my case. If the things you find interesting are
| child friendly, your mileage may vary.
|
| I do try to take the conversation away from children when
| talking to fellow parents but there's a percentage of which
| you can't derail because they have little to offer to talk
| about other than children.
| cultofmetatron wrote:
| > Why can't parents travel, date new people, have
| ridiculously cool hobbies, read, and talk to random people
| on the street?
|
| because all that stuff costs time and money.
|
| realistically, you'd need to make enough money to cover the
| kid's stuff and saving. if you have anything left after
| that, only then can you devote anything to travel or
| hobbies.
|
| I'm currently in the same boat as the guy above. what I
| make could comfortable support a family but I can instead
| help my girlfriend pay for college and hop between
| countries whenever I feel like it while pursuing learning
| electronics. I wouldn't be able to do these things if I was
| stuck paying rent on a house and covering food/ activities
| for a child.
| throwaway787544 wrote:
| You're probably just tired. You can pick up a new hobby, but that
| won't make you interested in code again (possibly the opposite).
| Just take a break and come back to code when you're inspired to
| do something with it.
| evandale wrote:
| This blog post seems like a page taken straight out of my
| journal. Bored with life, knowing I need a change, but not having
| any motivation to do anything about it. I find it hard to meet
| new people because I perceive myself as being boring so it's hard
| to put myself out there.
|
| I went jogging/walking yesterday to start out C25K. I got into
| cycling last year and I've always loved swimming so I was joking
| all summer that I could do a triathlon if I learned how to enjoy
| running.
|
| One thing that I might have discovered yesterday is it seems that
| if I love my equipment I also enjoy using it. I'm so proud of my
| bike and love it to death and it makes me so happy to pull it out
| and ride it around. I've been poking around running shoe stores
| to find a pair of shoes to run in the last few weeks and I
| absolutely fell in love with the pair I bought yesterday. I felt
| so happy putting them on yesterday to run in.
|
| I'm not sure what I can do to fall in love with coding again
| though. I built a brand new computer last year hoping that would
| make me want to code but it didn't really bring me the joy my
| shoes or bike brings me. I worry that I'm over programming but I
| have no idea what I could replace it with to earn a living.
| ganzuul wrote:
| Do you remember a long, long time ago seeing something gorgeous,
| like a colorful mineral gem, or the early morning sun on a
| verdant canopy, and something deep inside of you wanted to
| consume it? Perhaps you registered that it was not a source of
| sustenance for your body and still this strange notion persisted?
|
| This is an important faculty for your happiness and creativity.
| It does not care at all for your logic and reasoning, and
| thankfully so because our minds would otherwise quickly dispose
| of it as error and synesthesia.
|
| Now that you know that the sanity brought by your enormous
| intellectual achievements don't bring you happiness, perhaps it
| is time to explore this insanity that has patiently waited for
| your attention.
|
| Namaskar, seeker
| sercanov wrote:
| lsd could help
| hellothree23 wrote:
| I like the idea of Space4. LP is real copy heavy :( and you have
| "fair-tale" instead of "fairy tale"
| WaxedChewbacca wrote:
| I'm glad the author is introspecting, but I think this is a bit
| of a misdiagnosis, or maybe an incomplete prescription. First,
| being boring to others is nothing to worry about -- let them
| attend to their own likes and dislikes -- it's not your job to
| thrill anyone. But the author seems to be using boring to
| describe being limited by fears of various kinds. Well, that's
| right, it's not good to be bullied and caged by fear. But it's
| not enough to just say you should banish fear -- you need the
| stuff that will banish it. You do that via, for lack of a better
| term, spiritual cultivation, i.e., you learn to recognize the
| goodness in yourself and protect and nurture it consistently so
| that it can grow large and strong. Fear and many other unhelpful
| states of mind cannot exist in the presence of your goodness, if
| it's strong enough.
|
| Here's my favorite method of self-cultivation:
| https://library.dhammasukha.org/uploads/1/2/8/6/12865490/the...
|
| Do you think HN provides more benefit to its users by hiding this
| comment from everyone except the brave who enable showdead?
| Juliate wrote:
| Let the brave be brave then. That's 272 pages!
| WJW wrote:
| 272 pages is not actually a lot for a book.
| Juliate wrote:
| It highly depends on what is _in_ the book, and how it is
| laid out.
|
| Suggesting from the get-go to someone in some disarray,
| that reading an obscure, long book is a path to
| improvement, this is a bit... making the burden even
| heavier?
| WaxedChewbacca wrote:
| bigDinosaur wrote:
| The first two pages took up my whole screen, and for a second I
| thought I had achieved enlightenment. Alas, ink appears page 3.
| difu_disciple wrote:
| Cool people do cool things.
| buro9 wrote:
| > I lost my creativity and the sense of wonder I used to have in
| childhood. I am no longer curious because I am settled for the
| world as it is. I accept things the way they are instead of
| imagining how they could be.
|
| I agree with this, or rather... I think we need to live life full
| of hope and wonder. That when we do, we deeply experience things,
| and we get excited by things. Excitement itself is infectious, it
| brings other people along.
|
| Somewhere in there is an essence of an idea, that to build
| something that makes someone else excited such that they want to
| use it, we must be excited by it and full of hope for what it can
| be and wonder for what it is. To even present things to others,
| such as a thing we've been working on, we must feel that
| excitement and express it.
|
| I don't agree with the "I'm boring" sentiment, no-one is boring.
| But having hope and wonder can fuel excitement and that is a very
| good way to get others excited too.
| mettamage wrote:
| > I lost my creativity and the sense of wonder I used to have in
| childhood. I am no longer curious because I am settled for the
| world as it is. I accept things the way they are instead of
| imagining how they could be.
|
| This resonates.
| jkingsbery wrote:
| The best way for one to stop being boring is to not write a post
| about how one must stop being boring. The best way to stop being
| boring is to write a post about all the interesting and exciting
| things there are that have nothing (or very little) to do with
| one's self.
| shaftoe444 wrote:
| I had this same realisation about 6 weeks ago, I had fallen into
| a routine that was not bad but also never challenging or
| surprising. Since then I have been trying a bunch of new things
| to kick myself out of the rut.
|
| A simple idea is to take things you enjoy and do them with other
| people, for me this meant doing classes at the gym instead of
| working out at home, booking art classes rather than trying to
| learn from a book. In some cases this has been amazing (I found
| an olympic weightlifting class that is the most fun I've had in
| years), in some cases not so amazing but still glad I tried.
|
| Also I have started meditating (again within a teacher). For me
| the chief advantage of this is to start noticing your own
| patterns, and to be more deliberate in what you do. It has
| helped.
|
| ymmv
___________________________________________________________________
(page generated 2022-04-06 23:02 UTC)