[HN Gopher] I Used Linux-Based PinePhone Daily for a Year. Here'...
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I Used Linux-Based PinePhone Daily for a Year. Here's What I
Learned
Author : kk6mrp
Score : 46 points
Date : 2022-02-05 18:26 UTC (4 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (news.itsfoss.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (news.itsfoss.com)
| james-redwood wrote:
| The PinePhone in its current iteration is unfortunately unusable.
| It's a shame because while I do wholeheartedly believe in the
| mission of the project it's simply just not quite there yet.
| Nevertheless, a much better alternative in the meantime is to do
| what Edward Snowden did:
| https://twitter.com/snowden/status/1175430722733129729?lang=....
| bonyt wrote:
| https://web.archive.org/web/20220205183707/https://news.itsf...
| jmakov wrote:
| Sorry.
|
| This snapshot cannot be displayed due to an internal error.
| egberts1 wrote:
| That link works for me on my Firefox iOS iPhone.
| pjmlp wrote:
| The bar for all these attempts is to at least be as good as the
| Nokia N900, which still doesn't seem to be happening.
|
| We don't need endless combinations of "Desktop Linux" on the
| phone.
| holri wrote:
| I am still surprised how far ahead the N900 was. It is still my
| daily driver because there is simply no comparable alternative.
| pigeons wrote:
| I don't get coverage on the bands it supports in areas I
| frequent.
| pengaru wrote:
| Why isn't the N9/Harmattan where the bar is?
| tpxl wrote:
| The bar is Nokia 3510. I want reliable calls and SMSs and a UI
| that doesn't take 10 seconds to open the call app. Sadly what I
| got with the pinephone was 15 different DEs that are laggy as
| hell and last I checked receiving calls/texts still wasn't
| bulletproof.
| rubatuga wrote:
| The power and the downfall of open source software.
| MayeulC wrote:
| Try to use a Nokia N900 today, and check if that's really the
| bar (I have one in my drawer).
|
| I think the bar is higher, and the experience is already better
| than that on a few mobile devices.
|
| If talking about the UI, Plasma mobile is a bit experimental,
| but gets stuff done with bells and whistles, phosh is a bit
| barebones but better performant. If you want the Maemo UI, try
| Nemo mobile. When installing postmarketos on a device, you get
| quite a few to pick from.
|
| If you talk about performance, there are plenty of devices to
| pick with better performance than the Pinephone (including the
| Pinephone Pro soon, and the Librem 5). It was meant as a cheap
| dev platform, and it has largely succeeded at that.
|
| Now, telephony support is where it hurts. Supporting modems can
| get quite complex, so progress is slow. The Pinephone was
| deliberately engineered as to be doable.
|
| Part of the Linux appeal is choice. Choose what you don't need,
| but we'll likely end up with different needs.
|
| One way to bridge the gap is to get Android apps running. We're
| getting there thanks to waydroid.
| pjmlp wrote:
| It is definitely the bar, because many of the Linux based
| phone attempts aren't even able to match it.
| seba_dos1 wrote:
| I think the only use cases where my Librem 5 doesn't yet
| reach my Nokia N900 (not counting obvious form factor and
| spec differences) are related to the cameras.
| MichaelRazum wrote:
| For me this would be the killer application for a phone. Lets say
| iphone 13 like hardware. Linux based system. Where you could
|
| 1. Use it as phone
|
| 2. Plug it to a dock and use it as normal linux desktop pc
|
| Just wondering why it is still years out of reach...
| juanci_to wrote:
| Samsung DeX?
|
| https://nexdock.com/samsung-dex-laptop/
| egberts1 wrote:
| hug-0-death'd
| habibur wrote:
| Rather, what I have done :
|
| Buy an android phone. A good one. Whichever you like.
|
| Install F-droid from website.
|
| Install Termux from F-droid.
|
| You get a full Debian linux running inside your phone as an app.
| No need to even root your phone.
|
| You can now :
|
| Access, parse your address book, sms, call records everything
| from command line.
|
| Access sensors on your phone from command line -- like GPS,
| compass or camera.
|
| Access SD card and other files. rsync, scp, wget and others.
|
| SSH into your server.
|
| Edit some Java files, compile and install it as an app from your
| phone.
|
| Install other packages that you need using apt-get or pkg. Like
| python, ruby, php, gcc.
|
| And many more.
| mindslight wrote:
| You shouldn't SSH into your server, because the terrible mobile
| security model means you're vulnerable to both Google and the
| cell network by doing so. A modern phone should be one of your
| least trusted devices.
|
| The problem with the mobile ecosystem isn't so much what you
| can run on your phone, but rather what you can't stop running
| on your phone. And that perfectly good devices are relegated to
| the trash bin due to the upgrade treadmill. A Linux-first phone
| stands a chance at fixing these issues, whereas starting with
| an OS developed by a surveillance company does not.
| gumby wrote:
| You suggest a MITM attack against ssh by the carrier? Seems
| unlikely to me.
|
| Not sure about the threat by Google if you're using f-droid.
| Though there is always dmr's compiler attack I'm not sure ssh
| would be the right vector. A keyboard attack might be more
| useful.
| mindslight wrote:
| Not MITM, but rather the application processor _trusting_
| the baseband processor, which is running who-knows-what
| network-facing code. Qualcomm claims to have recently
| implemented memory separation, but without actual public
| documentation and scrutiny of internals why would one
| believe them?
|
| Installing F-droid does not remove Google's presence in
| other software. On a vanilla Android phone, that is all of
| the Google (Play) services and who knows what centralized-
| expedient hacks have been put into the OS itself.
| Sirened wrote:
| Boy oh boy do I have bad news for you about every other
| computer you're using today. The ccNUMA model they teach in
| school is well and truly dead even on desktops. There is no
| modern computer that just has the CPU in charge of memory. I
| don't think there are any general purposes devices you or I
| can purchase that have actual memory segmentation (either
| true separation or via SMMUs/IOMMUs. On a modern desktop, you
| have dozens of random cores sitting on the memory bus that
| have full access to physical memory, and there's nothing you
| can do about it because those cores run their own proprietary
| (often baked in) software.
|
| A Linux-first phone does absolutely _nothing_ to fix this.
| Even if you 're running your own operating system that you
| wrote yourself, your GPU or hell even the power management
| controller might reach around and steal all of your stuff.
| The issue lies in the way we build computers and the rapid
| proliferation of cores without any serious thought as to how
| we're supposed to manage and secure the enormous fleet of
| heterogeneous hardware that lives on a modern SoC.
| mindslight wrote:
| First, my main desktop is a librebooted KGPE-D16.
|
| Second, it matters if those possibly-hostile cores have
| network access. Technically they could subvert the software
| on the main CPUs to communicate with command/control, but
| that seems like raising the bar to such an attack. Whereas
| with the standard mobile architecture, I can totally see
| some phone manufacturer getting the "bright idea" to have
| the baseband processor collect statistics on the
| application processor's software for market research.
|
| But I agree with your general point.
|
| Still, I think moving in the direction of Linux phones
| gives us a starting point to do something about this
| insecurity - proving the market allows there to be devices
| that truly separate out the cell modem.
| peakaboo wrote:
| Okay but why? Isn't the point of the pine phone to not have
| Google services watching your life?
| rycomb wrote:
| The "it's vs its" fight's dilation is overdue: I knew that it was
| going to become a grammar mistake spreading throughout, reaching
| almost every pseudo-professional writer...
|
| I guessed that anybody criticizing the trend towards the
| unnecessary apostrophe would be: either considered a grammar
| nazi; or their own writing being extraordinarily examined for
| mistakes (as a punishment for their criticism).
|
| As a non-native speaker, my language credentials may be slim, but
| I can't really stand the -quite widespread- extra apostrophe when
| it's a possessive "its". The reversal, though, doesnt bother me
| that much. I guess that it's about character conservation.
| mindslight wrote:
| As a former embedded developer, I'm surprised nobody has come up
| with a basic purpose-built UI that skips all of the bloat (a
| phone doesn't need a WM), and just reliably performs basic
| functionality like voice calls and textual messages. Are the
| performance problems further down the stack (eg graphics driver),
| or are developers just too wed to the maladapted idea of running
| full web browsers on a phone, or what?
|
| With the 4G partial shutdown I'd be in the market for a Pinephone
| but I just don't have time to do extra tinkering right now. I'll
| probably just limp along with my current pocket device and
| attempt to go VOIP-only.
| seba_dos1 wrote:
| Everyone keeps talking about "building a basic purpose-built
| UI" for many many years now, but that's pretty much a weekend
| project that could be easily built on top of already existing
| abstractions that somehow doesn't seem to gain dev traction.
| Zhone and Paroli already existed in the past, but most people
| gravitated towards more capable options. It's like people
| actually want their smartphones to be somewhat smart. Or maybe
| there are as many sets of things considered "basic" as there
| are people. Pick your explanation.
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(page generated 2022-02-05 23:01 UTC)