[HN Gopher] The Nintendo Switch has now outsold the Wii
___________________________________________________________________
The Nintendo Switch has now outsold the Wii
Author : Tomte
Score : 454 points
Date : 2022-02-03 08:15 UTC (2 days ago)
(HTM) web link (www.theverge.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.theverge.com)
| guelo wrote:
| I guess people really do like barely reworked 20 year old games
| for $75
| bambataa wrote:
| I'm a bit put out at paying PS50 for Skyward Sword. I did get
| 50 hours of gameplay out of it, but it felt steep for how
| little effort they'd put into the port (it would have been
| great to have no loading as you fly between locations)
| mcphage wrote:
| Yep, they do. I've been replaying Paper Mario via the Switch,
| and that game is as fun as it was the day it came out. Just
| fantastic.
| 12ian34 wrote:
| for me, a Switch was worth it for Breath of the Wild alone
| edgyquant wrote:
| What games fit this description?
| poisonarena wrote:
| well its not $75 but come on....
|
| https://www.nintendo.com/games/detail/advance-
| wars-1-plus-2-... Advance Wars is $60 dollars
|
| https://www.nintendo.com/games/detail/space-invaders-
| invinci... Space Invaders is $60 !!!
|
| Diablo 2 is 60 bux.. I just browsed for a min
| kawsper wrote:
| I bought a PS Vita just to play Risk of Rain on the go, I've
| considered buying a Switch to play Risk of Rain 2, but I've torn
| waiting for a hardware refresh or just getting the OLED-version.
| MBCook wrote:
| Knowing Nintendo it will be at least a year, maybe longer,
| before a theoretical Switch 2.
|
| The original is still selling great. And they wouldn't want
| people who bought the OLED to feel ripped off.
|
| Unless you're willing to wait quite a while I'd go for it.
| awakeasleep wrote:
| Tough to play risk of rain with thumbsticks
| [deleted]
| teleforce wrote:
| Nintendo targeted markets are mainly kids, retro and casual
| gamers. Due to pandemic the take up by casual gamers has been
| increasing rapidly and I'm not surprised if the majority of
| Switch recent sales are bought by this group. Add to the fact
| that Nintendo always has killer casual gaming accessories for
| examples Wii board for Wii and Wii U, and Ring Fit for Switch is
| the testament to their commitment to this group[1]. I hope they
| will re-introduce Wii board for the Switch, and a new Wii board
| and Ring Fit combo will be a blast for inside the house/indoor
| physical fitness and exercises.
|
| [1]Why I'm using Nintendo Ring Fit to achieve my New Year's
| resolution:
|
| https://www.techradar.com/news/why-im-using-nintendo-ring-fi...
| shp0ngle wrote:
| It's a bit surprising, sure.
|
| It's basically a tablet - in 2022, an underpowered one. It was
| underpowered as a console 6 years ago. It has very few third
| party games (ok, you can play Skyrim and Witcher 3, but most of
| the games just are not there).
|
| But it's still so fun. And the first party games are all amazing.
| Even when stuff like Mario Kart and Super Mario 3D World is a
| port from even older generation.
| duxup wrote:
| > It has very few third party games
|
| The library of games on the switch is enormous...
| anaganisk wrote:
| If your interests don't involve any of the top latest AAA
| games
| duxup wrote:
| I wonder how much gaming time actually involves AAA games?
|
| Just looking at those games I think is a very narrow view.
| anaganisk wrote:
| I disagree with you, they're top games because they have
| lots of players playing them. Not because they're made by
| a big studio. For ex: COD, Battlefield, NFS, Forza, GTA
| 5, RDR2, MSFS, Valorant, CS GO. These attract a lot of
| players and people spend a lot of time ranking up in
| those games and also money. PC gamers love to call
| themselves master race and ridicule console players as
| peasants. Also PS and Xbox also have lot of exclusives
| that attract a lot of players. For me Switch games feel
| like something I would play when Im bored, not really an
| immersive kind of experience.
| duxup wrote:
| You're disagreeing with my question?
|
| I don't doubt people play these games, but I wonder how
| much compared to gaming overall?
|
| At this point we have the article about switch sales
| without those games...
| anaganisk wrote:
| Im sorry I misunderstood your question as a statement.
| Coming to it, this article mere compares the switch sales
| to Wii, but despite its availability PS5 surpassed switch
| sales. But to know the magnitude of the metric I think
| this would help you https://steamcharts.com/ Thats just
| from steam.
| shp0ngle wrote:
| not as big as other consoles.
| iamjake648 wrote:
| I don't think you're right about that. Source?
| anaganisk wrote:
| Type top 50 games on google, and just compare how many
| are available on Switch.
| vlunkr wrote:
| I think it depends on your interests. Lots of new AAA games
| can't run on the switch, but most indies do.
| dynamite-ready wrote:
| As much as I like the console, I hate the hardware issue with the
| joycons. It feels almost pernicious. It really has put me off
| playing the thing.
| pupppet wrote:
| I despise the Switch joycons, and not just for the drift
| issues.
|
| "Is my controller in single horizontal mode or paired vertical
| mode?", "I want to be player 1", "stop hitting buttons!", "The
| pairing failed."
|
| When the kids play together it's always a shit show. Contrast
| this with the PS4, we pick up the controllers and play. I've
| never had to even think about the controllers with the
| PlayStation, they just work.
| tspike wrote:
| I finally caved and picked up a couple of Pro controllers. No
| looking back.
| [deleted]
| duxup wrote:
| You can send them in to be repaired for free.
| cdubzzz wrote:
| I've done that with two different ones already. And bought a
| brand new one recently that now has problems. It's pretty
| ridiculous.
| jjice wrote:
| Which is good, but they've been selling broken hardware for 5
| years now. They'll fix them for you, but they'll sell you
| them in a state where they'll need to be fixed. I love
| Nintendo games. Grew up with them, and still play them
| (playing the new Pokemon at the moment), but man do I hate
| the corporation. Their development teams are incredible and
| the big ones never miss, but the corporate has so many knocks
| against them, from YouTube demonetization to the still broken
| joy cons.
|
| I can't think of another first party wireless controller
| (since they became standard in 2005-2006ish) that has ever
| had issues this bad.
| duxup wrote:
| I went through three Xbox 360s.
|
| I can handle sending in some controllers while I can still
| play.
| spike021 wrote:
| Yeah, I went through 4 or 5 PS3's. Fortunately my PS4
| stood the test of time, and we'll see how my PS5 does.
|
| As much as I enjoyed gaming during the PS3 era, it really
| had some almost impossible to ignore challenges.
| skhr0680 wrote:
| > As much as I enjoyed gaming during the PS3 era, it
| really had some almost impossible to ignore challenges.
|
| The switch to non-leaded solder means any electronics
| from the mid-2000s are prone to failing.I'm pretty sure
| my oven is glad that it will never have to have a
| graphics card or PS3 mobo in it ever again
| culopatin wrote:
| How many times?
| bqmjjx0kac wrote:
| I swear my joycons miss something like 1% of my button presses.
| joyconhelper wrote:
| for me too - I finally figured out they just have a very weak
| connection to the Switch. basically needs a clear line-of-
| sight to the console. Try putting your joycons behind your
| back and you'll see what I mean! Hope this helps
| bqmjjx0kac wrote:
| That was my conclusion as well! Sadly, I can't get much
| closer to the Switch due to living room geometry. I've also
| noticed the Switch has a very weak Wifi radio.
| treesknees wrote:
| It does support 3rd party USB Ethernet adapters plugged
| into the dock.
| city41 wrote:
| I just use the pro controller. Other than its lousy dpad it's a
| solid controller. Granted I always play docked.
| ZacharyPitts wrote:
| One of my pro controllers also now has drift. It's pretty
| disappointing compared to other console controllers ...
| crtasm wrote:
| I got a https://www.8bitdo.com/wireless-usb-adapter/ and
| play with a PS3 controller.
| AceJohnny2 wrote:
| Their hardware quality is definitely sub-par. I got the Pro
| Controller because the joycons are The Worst [1], and it's
| definitely the worst quality controller compared to Xbox and
| PS4. For example, its D-Pad will occasionally mis-press up or
| down when pressing right or left, which is failing the basic
| purpose of a D-Pad.
|
| That said, the concept of the Switch remains fantastic, and I
| take it with me whenever I travel. I'm definitely in line for
| getting the Steam Deck.
|
| [1] especially as someone with big hands https://www.penny-
| arcade.com/comic/2001/08/29/you-know-what-...
| [deleted]
| 999900000999 wrote:
| They brought back Advance Wars.
|
| That's what introduced me to strategy games, nothing comes close.
|
| Wargrove and Tiny Metal are both close, but ultimately less
| charming.
| lvass wrote:
| Nintendo has been my sole choice for a very long time now, since
| I'm almost exclusively interested in local multiplayer. Switch's
| popularity has been nice, smaller studios in particular have
| really stepped up their game, in contrast to Wii's long list of
| shovelware.
| endisneigh wrote:
| With cloud gaming Nintendo might have delayed the giants that are
| Microsoft and Sony long enough to finally make the gaming
| hardware power debate moot.
| pm90 wrote:
| Would love to see AAA games streaming from a cloud and playable
| on Nintendo devices.
|
| Maybe something like, if you're playing on portable mode, since
| the screen is so much smaller, the on board processor is good
| enough but when plugged in it seamlessly switches to a cloud
| instance.
|
| Or just have more firepower in the dock, that would work too.
| jamesgeck0 wrote:
| This is happening on a per-title basis. Assassin's Creed:
| Odyssey is streaming in Japan. The Kingdom Hearts collection
| is also streaming.
| ecliptik wrote:
| I compared the Control "cloud" demo on Switch and a disc copy
| on the PS4.
|
| The Switch version looked superior, where the PS4 version had
| obvious texture downgrading and popin. I still played it on
| PS4 though because the input lag was less and I preferred to
| have a physical copy.
| duxup wrote:
| I thought the dock and such was silly.
|
| Now I don't think I'll ever buy a non portable dedicated console
| again.
| WaxProlix wrote:
| The Wii U and Virtual Boy aside, how do they do it? Even the
| 3DS people came around on. Really wild how much weird shit
| ('innovation'?) this company can get away with.
| jackson1442 wrote:
| It's unlike anything else- with Xbox and PlayStation you can
| get mostly the same experience on the "opposite" console, or
| even on a PC. All of nintendo's consoles have followed a
| similar thread where it adds something that you just don't
| have on other consoles.
|
| Nintendo exclusives don't hurt, either. But Xbox and PS have
| exclusives, too.
| ajmurmann wrote:
| It's interesting that for a lot of more hardcore gamers
| these innovations are often seem as a deterrent.
| monocasa wrote:
| Realizing that specs are orthogonal to enjoyment, and putting
| out good games you can't get anywhere else.
| fallat wrote:
| This. Nintendo understands FUN. That's what it comes down
| to.
| ecliptik wrote:
| Game Maker's s Toolkit had a great take on this,
|
| Nintendo - Putting Play First
|
| https://youtu.be/2u6HTG8LuXQ
| Jensson wrote:
| Every single other big developer seems to focus on high
| end graphics and extensive scripted stories, not sure how
| Nintendo managed to keep the focus on FUN instead.
| Graphics and stories are much easier to produce than FUN,
| Nintendo somehow managed to avoid that. I wonder if this
| is the culture barrier? Making a game people want to buy
| without a story or graphics is really hard, but Nintendo
| chooses that hard path anyway. Very different from the
| Hollywood games we see from USA where most of the money
| is spent on motion capture, graphics, effects,
| storytelling etc.
| klodolph wrote:
| 3DS was pretty long in the tooth when Switch came out.
| nirvdrum wrote:
| I was really hoping for some sort of backwards
| compatibility. Nintendo had been doing that with their
| handheld for the past couple of generations. The dual
| screen would have had to have dealt with, naturally. But
| the 3DS has an amazing library.
|
| I have both systems now, and enjoy my Switch, but I still
| prefer the 3DS. I hope whatever the Switch successor is
| goes back to adding a backwards compatibility mode.
| klodolph wrote:
| Considering the Switch hardware is just _incredibly
| boring_ -- ARM, capacitive touchscreen, standard gamepad
| -- I'm hoping it will have good backwards compatibility
| for a while yet. Just like the DS and GameCube.
| ComputerGuru wrote:
| It's not even new - I know at least the GBC was intended to
| be hooked up and played on the TV from the very start.
| kipchak wrote:
| I have to imagine the changes have to have been somewhat more
| driven by developers coming up with fun gameplay ideas while
| messing with new hardware. Super Mario 64 DS for example
| includes a collection of minigames with varying gameplay
| mechanics that explore different ways to use the dual screens
| along with the pack-in metroid demo, the Wii U had Nintendo
| Land, and the 3ds faceraiders, Mii Plaza and some AR demos,
| which all seem like polished proof of concepts for how to
| take advantage of the new hardware.
| WaxProlix wrote:
| And fostering a culture at the upper echelons of management
| that enables, encourages, and embraces that mentality -
| that's the magic. Decades of fun goofy shit, and it hasn't
| yet been eaten by the business turds.
| bitwize wrote:
| Nintendo also has a culture of sharing institutional
| knowledge regarding game design. Shigeru Miyamoto is not
| very involved in the day to day of Mario and Zelda
| development anymore. Other designers and producers who
| have worked with and learned from him have taken the
| reins of those franchises and taken them to new heights.
|
| Contrast that with, say, Sega, who never found their
| footing with the Sonic franchise ever since the late 90s.
| Sonic games were developed by whatever developers
| happened to be available -- sometimes American or mixed
| Japanese-American teams; and the design ideas from the
| first few games that made them so great were lost once
| new hardware generations came along that couldn't use the
| original engine code. Sonic went a whole console
| generation (fifth generation, Saturn era) without a new
| full game in the main series, and the games featuring him
| after that have been a real mixed bag. (No, Adventure 2
| is a mess. The controls are some of the most slippery
| imprecise shit in the 6th generation.)
| wyre wrote:
| Pokemon, Legend of Zelda, and Smash Bros all sell consoles
| and their innovation is child-targeted so they innovate in
| weird ways cuz kids don't care really about processor speed
| or graphics cores.
| xyzzy_plugh wrote:
| I think you wildly underestimate who purchases these
| consoles. There is certainly an element of catering to a
| younger audience, but young adults are the real money
| maker.
|
| In my experience, at Pokemon release events in Japan and in
| the United States, the majority of attendees lining up are
| adults, most under 30.
| lukas099 wrote:
| Those 30 year olds likely fell in love with those
| franchises when they were kids. i suspect Nintendo know
| this and see catering to kids as an investment.
| cgriswald wrote:
| What you're describing is Nintendo reaping the rewards of
| having previously targeted kids. If you play a modern
| Pokemon game with a non-nostalgic eye (as it is easy for
| me to do, since I am too old to have grown up with them)
| you can see that however fun these games can be for an
| adult, they are definitely made to appeal to children.
| ajmurmann wrote:
| This is definitely true. I had a SNES, but skipped the
| N64 and also for some reason never played Pokemon as a
| kid. It's still reflected in what Nintendo games I like.
| Zelda a Link to the Past was my favorite game. So I loved
| A Link Between Worlds. However, I really struggled
| getting into any of the 3D Zeldas because of lack of
| Ocarina of Time nostalgia. Same with 3D Mario games. I
| bought Pokemon for 3DS during a lot g layover on my first
| trip to Japan. I thought this would be the perfect
| drosetup to get into the series but without nostalgia
| it's too easy, to repetitive and I honestly saw no reason
| to get more than a handful of Pokemon.
|
| Planting the seed early and reaping rewards for the
| entire life is definitely what works for them.
| bambataa wrote:
| I loved Pokemon as a kid, but that was because I had the
| time to do the levelling up grind. Couldn't imagine doing
| it now.
| dorchadas wrote:
| Sword and Shield at least have the Wild Zone where you
| can get 'xp candies' that make the grind a _lot_ more
| bearable.
| ajmurmann wrote:
| Funny enough, I like the Shin Megami Tensei series which
| in essence is a dark and challenging Pokemon. I find the
| mindless grinding while listening to a podcast quite
| relaxing.
| boomboomsubban wrote:
| Aren't release events usually a midnight thing? I think
| they may skew far heavier to the adult market than the
| actual game audience.
| AussieWog93 wrote:
| >The Wii U and Virtual Boy aside, how do they do it?
|
| Nintendo's top-tier exclusives, and a constant focus on end-
| to-end user experience.
|
| The PS4/Xbone (and even, to an extent, the 360/PS3) have so
| much jank when it comes to playing a game on them.
|
| My experience with The Last of Us Part II basically consisted
| of inserting the game, waiting nearly 25 minutes for it to
| install, going through that entire process again, twice,
| because there was a smudge on the disc, then waiting another
| 20 mins to download a 10GB patch, only to load up the game
| and sit through hours upon hours of boring-as-fuck intro
| content before I saw a single zombie.
|
| With Super Mario Odyssey, I put the game in, downloaded some
| optional 50MB patch in about 20 seconds, then started jumping
| around collecting coins and throwing my hat at everything.
|
| They just "get it" in ways that Sony and Microsoft don't (or
| at least, haven't "got" since the original PS2/Xbox era).
| maccard wrote:
| > They just "get it" in ways that Sony and Microsoft don't
| (or at least, haven't "got" since the original PS2/Xbox
| era).
|
| I fundamentally disagree. There are some great games for
| the switch out there but they are absolutely hampered by
| Nintendo's outright refusal to provide modern features.
| Animal crossing was a lovely game except for the fact that
| it didn't support more than one island meaning either me or
| my girlfriend had to skip it. the "visit your friends
| island" experience is reminiscent of the late 90s in online
| gaming. Their support for peripherals has lead to this [0]
| being considered a reasonable solution to voice chat.
|
| That's before you get into the whole ninetendo switch
| online + expansion pack.
|
| [0] https://www.gamesradar.com/reactions-to-nintendo-
| switchs-ter...
| AussieWog93 wrote:
| Oh, of course.
|
| Nintendo don't "get" online gaming in the way that the
| other two seem to. The ROM hack of Melee made by one guy
| famously has better online than Smash Ultimate does.
|
| They are the only company still serving up the classic
| experience, though.
| maccard wrote:
| >They are the only company still serving up the classic
| experience, though.
|
| Heh, I actually disagree again here, but not quite as
| strongly. PlayStation have absolutely hit it out of the
| park on "classic experience" over the past few years.
| their remakes/remasters have been absolutely stellar
| (Tony hawk's Pro skater/spyro/crash bandicoot) and really
| hold up well in modern terms. Their single player games
| in the last few years (god of war, uncharted, sekiro) are
| nothing short of outstanding. They may not all be your
| cup of tea but I think it's fair you can say that about
| some of the Nintendo family of games too.
|
| Xbox has a few home runs in the same category. The Ori
| games are absolutely incredible, and having recently come
| away from Metroid Dread _very_ disappointed (really poor
| story pacing, overly predictable plot, and horrific
| instadeath mechanics) I would choose ori and the blind
| forest/will of the wisps over the more recent Metroid
| games.
| AussieWog93 wrote:
| I'm not talking about the games themselves, I'm talking
| about the experience of using the console (I also thought
| Dread was a bit of a letdown, and don't get me started on
| the difference between 3D All Stars and the Crash/Spyro
| remaster).
|
| It's just that on the Switch, in almost all cases you
| just put the cartridge in the console you're in-game
| within seconds.
|
| For Xbone/PS4 (and I'm assuming this is worse on the new
| consoles), there's a whole arduous process to go through
| before you can play the game. As someone who no longer
| has the time/energy to pour into gaming like I used to,
| this hour long wait before playing a game just makes the
| whole experience not worth it.
| WickyNilliams wrote:
| It's hard to understate how much "time to play" makes the
| switch enjoyable. I can return to a game I was playing,
| exactly where I was, in about 3 seconds. Even if I've not
| touched the switch in days or weeks! The system level
| pause/resume makes it so I can quickly jump into a game
| whenever I have time, even if it's just 10 minutes.
|
| Contrast that to my ps4 experience and it is a world
| away. Takes at least a minute to get to home screen, then
| there's usually gigabytes of updates to download.
| Sometimes it might be _hours_ before I can start the game
| I wanted to play.
|
| I'm not sure if the latest generation of xbox/ps have
| solved this. Combimed with the supply issues of the new
| generation consoles, I've not been too keen on getting
| one because my switch has sufficed
| maccard wrote:
| The situation is better but not perfect (i would argue
| switch has some major issues on that front mostly related
| to slow in game load times). Ps5 games in my experience
| are turn on console to in game in under a minute. The OS
| standby is much better and quick resume features in games
| are excellent (Online games aside)
| maccard wrote:
| its actually better on newer consoles. (ps5 in particular
| is much better than xbox). The consoles themselves are
| quick to wake up, and if you're playing single player
| games there's no need to update.
|
| > in almost all cases you just put the cartridge in the
| console you're in-game within seconds.
|
| This is true for some games on switch, however my
| experience is that many games suffer from extremely long
| loading times even compared to PS4/Xbox one. The ps5s
| loading times for games are orders of magnitude quicker;
| power on to in game in Spiderman miles Morales is less
| than 30 seconds. I've spent more time than that staring
| at single loading screens in Smash Bros, Metroid Dread
| and breath of the wild.
|
| > this hour long wait before playing a game just makes
| the whole experience not worth it.
|
| The hour long wait does happen occasionally, but it's not
| like you actually need to do anything during that time.
| You can do that and come back that night, and a month
| later the game will still be playable without updating.
| crtasm wrote:
| Why attribute Sekiro to Playstation? Sony don't own
| FromSoftware and it was also released on xbox+pc.
| bitwize wrote:
| It's called Lateral Thinking with Withered Technology. It was
| Gunpei Yokoi's credo. Other console makers start off with,
| okay, we are going to design a system around the latest and
| best technology and really wow people with our graphics.
| Nintendo starts off with, what can we build using old
| technology that we can pick up for a song and second-source
| easily if need be? So it becomes a question of, how do you
| combine these old technologies in new ways that would have a
| fun gameplay story in them? When you do LTwWT, you really
| have to focus on gameplay and fun, because you don't have
| much to fall back on. And then on the software side the
| question becomes, what kinds of games can we write for this
| system that a) play to the system's strengths; b) look,
| sound, and feel great, even with the hardware's more limited
| capabilities?
|
| Developing for a Nintendo system is not for everybody. It's
| like being a Mac developer only more so: you have to write
| software that integrates smoothly with the hardware and
| contributes to the grand narrative of the vendor.
| anyfoo wrote:
| Yeah, it goes so far that I don't quite understand those that
| say that they use their Switch exclusively docked, or
| exclusively handheld. I definitely use both, and love the
| Switch for it (not just for that).
|
| Even the motion controls add value: In games like DOOM, it's
| pretty cool to effectively have the portable Switch display as
| a "window" into the virtual world, and move the Switch around
| for aiming. I'm usually not a fan of motion controls, but that
| "aiming with the window" thing feels natural, and like
| something I might do anyway even if it didn't have an effect
| (like leaning your body into curves when playing a racing
| game).
| fishtacos wrote:
| Oddly enough, my experience was the opposite. After enjoying
| the Switch for 3+ years (purchased late 2018), the same price
| point bought me an XBOX Series S earlier this year (Series X
| were/(are?) hard to find and this was an impromptu purchase.
| Not entirely happy about that tradeoff).
|
| Suffice to say, been having a blast catching up with old
| favorites and new games. The backward compatibility
| enhancements (higher FPS and upres'ing) really put into
| perspective just how little gaming has progressed
| generationally, which makes these games that much more
| enjoyable.
|
| The Switch is an amazing device (own two - one modded and one
| non). While the availability of games increases daily, its
| performance will always remain the weak point.
|
| That^ and its horrible controllers. The XBX controller is
| sublime.
| Accacin wrote:
| I've always had the opinion that Nintendo consoles were best
| when paired with something else. For me, I have a powerful
| gaming PC for all my gaming needs, and the switch is for
| portable/Nintendo titles.
|
| I usually game at 3440x1440 @ 120hz and I don't find it
| jarring playing the Switch. I love it for what it is :)
| ratorx wrote:
| I agree with the PC + Switch combo. I generally buy
| Nintendo first party + (puzzle, platformer, strategy) games
| on the switch and leave (open world, shooter) games for my
| PC, basically games that I likely wouldn't play in portable
| mode.
|
| Before, I had just a PC, and I found myself never playing
| the graphically simpler games (if I'm sitting at my PC, I
| might as well be playing an intensive game), but now I can
| play the mechanically simpler games in bed with the switch!
| Jensson wrote:
| > While the availability of games increases daily, its
| performance will always remain the weak point.
|
| Honestly I don't care that much about performance any longer,
| graphics were mostly good enough 10 years ago. Modern
| graphics looks better when you put them side by side, but the
| graphics 10 years ago was good enough that you easily get
| used to it. The current switch has problems running 10 year
| old high end graphics, yeah that is a problem, but the switch
| is 5 year old hardware, if they made a new switch with modern
| hardware it should be able to run all those games smoothly.
| jerf wrote:
| I think increasingly the dominant factor in a game's
| graphics is the style, not the power of the engine. Give me
| Mario Odyssey-level graphics and good color and texture
| artists over a bland grey shooterfest with 100x the
| graphics power used any day.
|
| Not that everything modern falls into the latter category.
| Some are both 100x the graphics power and also beautiful.
| But I would submit, not more beautiful in proportion to the
| additional effort put in. We're well into diminishing
| returns on the graphics front at this point. Great games
| can run on the Nintendo Switch. Heck, great games can run
| on the XBox 360.
| anthk wrote:
| > Give me Mario Odyssey-level graphics and good color and
| texture artists over a bland grey shooterfest with 100x
| the graphics power used any day.
|
| Kinda like PC's back in the day with Max Payne 1 against
| Unreal 2 engine games. MP looked far more realistic due
| to a vastly better artwork on textures.
| KennyBlanken wrote:
| Honestly, you probably haven't seen top-notch modern game
| graphics.
|
| I remember being wowed a couple years ago by each
| successive release of Mass Effect that I worked my way
| through. ME:Andromeda may have been a bit of a dumpster
| fire, but the graphics were pretty as hell.
|
| Then I played Control, and it blew my socks off.
|
| The recent Alien game was also stunning.
| kyriakos wrote:
| Control was the first game I played on series x after
| upgrading from a 360 which was collecting dust. Also have
| a quite decent pc with entry level gpu but control on
| series x blew my mind. In all honesty xsx graphics
| fidelity can't be compared to my sons Nintendo switch
| when you play the games on TV, I assume the same goes for
| ps5.
|
| Games did improve a lot and maybe all someone needs is to
| stay off gaming for a bit to notice the difference
| because the changes are less ground breaking and more
| gradual.
|
| If you look at Nintendo first party titles they are not
| even trying to compete in graphics. Nintendo is just
| always spot on when trying to make games for the age
| group they target.
| shados wrote:
| Or it could be the opposite. I have a high-end gaming PC.
| I have a Switch. They feel pretty much interchangeable to
| me when it comes to graphics. The difference is nights
| and day...and I don't care one bit.
|
| Frame rate is another story and definitely an issue with
| the Switch, mostly BECAUSE they try to push the graphics
| too far. Mario Odyssey runs at 60fps. It's not as good as
| what my PC and monitor can display, but it's...okay. Too
| many games can't keep 30fps because they just had to put
| more shadows and polygons for no good reason. Still, for
| the most part I have just as much fun with it as I do
| with PC games. I have both just for variety. I use an
| Nvidia Shield TV when I want to play the PC games on the
| couch.
|
| Looking forward to the Steam Deck though. Being able to
| play Monster Hunter Rise's PC version in a form factor
| similar to the Switch will be quite nice.
| Xplune13 wrote:
| > They feel pretty much interchangeable to me when it
| comes to graphics.
|
| > The difference is nights and day...and I don't care one
| bit.
|
| You used these 2 sentences back to back.
|
| Tbh it's just you not caring about graphics whole lot,
| but can see the difference. To say that they're
| interchangeable is kinda hilarious because they're
| objectively better on PC, consoles than on Switch. You,
| yourself said so and the whole point in this thread was
| that of "how graphics definitely improved over the last
| 10 years" and not a subjective opinion of you not caring
| (which is fine but invalid in this conversation). Also,
| one can easily notice graphical differences between games
| that are released now and 10 years ago.
| fishtacos wrote:
| 30 fps v. 60 fps is a large enough difference to affect
| gameplay enjoyment. The resolution and texture clarity is
| not nearly as important as fluidity and responsiveness in
| controls.
|
| There are a handful of Switch games that reach 60 fps, so
| it has a ton of promise, but a 2.0 release would certainly
| be great.
| philliphaydon wrote:
| > 30 fps v. 60 fps is a large enough difference to affect
| gameplay enjoyment.
|
| That's very dependent on the game.
|
| Playing a racing game at 30fps is horrible. Playing Mario
| games 30fps. Is fine.
| fishtacos wrote:
| SNES platformers ran at 60 fps in almost every game, and
| definitely every Mario game, SM64 was the sole exception.
| SMO was also 60 fps.
|
| There is no category of games that would not improve in
| playability from 30 to 60 fps.
|
| Not trying to be argumentative here. As mentioned
| upthread, I own 2 Switch consoles and the difference
| between 30 and 60 fps when running the same or similar
| games are stark. Perhaps i'm more sensitive than others.
| skhr0680 wrote:
| SMW had a lot of slowdown on real hardware
| philliphaydon wrote:
| It's just slower moving games it's less noticeable.
|
| I have 2 switches and I really can't pick up Xbox or PS
| anymore. Except my dying wait for elden ring.
|
| But yeah. I think minimum 60fps but depending on the game
| 30 is fine especially if it's super fun.
| farmerbb wrote:
| Super Mario Sunshine on the GameCube also ran at 30fps.
| glandium wrote:
| My favorite racing game ever is Wipeout 2097 on the
| PlayStation. Needless to say, it didn't run at more than
| 30fps (in fact, since I was in France, it was probably
| even 25fps). Gran Turismo on the PlayStation 2 was also
| fine at 25/30fps.
| gfxgirl wrote:
| People say that and yet most of the PS1 and PS2 games
| were 30fps or lower. One of the top games on the PS2,
| GTA3 (and Vice City, and San Andreas) were all 30fps or
| less. N64 games as well.
|
| Basically if the game is fun, no one cares. If the game
| is not fun then they look for random excuses as to why.
|
| Note: I'm not saying they wouldn't be better at 60.
| Rather Im saying they were multi-million unit sellers and
| made lots of people happy playing them and yet they were
| 30. So being 60 is not a requirement for being good.
| Xplune13 wrote:
| > Modern graphics looks better when you put them side by
| side, but the graphics 10 years ago was good enough that
| you easily get used to it.
|
| Can you get used to it? Yes. Eg. Skyrim is still
| atmospheric, but graphically it is nowhere near what
| today's games offer. I'd say that one don't even have to
| look at games that are 10 years old and modern games side
| by side to see the difference. Someone getting used to
| older graphics is that person adjusting themselves to what
| they're presented, and not an objective observation and
| games today objectively look better even when they aren't
| compared side by side in my opinion.
| Hamuko wrote:
| > _The XBX controller is sublime._
|
| Except if you use it on the PC. My Xbox Series controller
| keeps randomly dropping connection and it reports two
| different battery levels to Windows 10 ("50%" and
| "Critical"), which are both wrong, so you'll have to replace
| the batteries without being prompted unless you want it to
| die at random during a game. This is a widely-known issue,
| but Microsoft has done nothing to fix it: https://github.com/
| NiyaShy/XB1ControllerBatteryIndicator/iss...
| KennyBlanken wrote:
| > really put into perspective just how little gaming has
| progressed generationally,
|
| Maybe on console, friend. Not on PC.
|
| > The XBX controller is sublime.
|
| As long as it's not the Xbox Elite, which fails like
| clockwork.
| fishtacos wrote:
| As a mainly #pcmasterrace fiend here, I disagree. The XBX,
| even at its low end, is an amazingly performant little (x)
| box. PC gaming has not advanced anywhere to a generational
| gap, unfortunately.
|
| As for the controller - no one should be paying 150 USD for
| what amounts to a couple of plastic addons on an already
| overpriced controller. Compared to the Switch's
| controllers, they are sublime. Compared to PS4/5's, they
| are superior but relatively comparable.
| eyelidlessness wrote:
| > pcmasterrace
|
| nazi things aren't cutesy
| fishtacos wrote:
| Jebus...
| eyelidlessness wrote:
| Yeah what a buzzkill I am not playing along with people
| using the genocide of millions of people for fun and
| games.
| vhgyu75e6u wrote:
| Except that nobody thinks of nazis when reading
| pcmasterace, but you need to step out of your way and
| call out how you feel offended by a term that has no
| relation. Given that you are offended by it, why don't
| you go back even further a call out slavery and racism in
| colonial times?
| KennyBlanken wrote:
| I was referring to the significant jump in visual quality
| in games on PC in the last 5-6 years, not even including
| RTX (but especially with it.)
| bdowling wrote:
| Strongly disagree on the controllers. No other controller
| allows me to sit in the middle of my couch and stretch my
| arms out to both sides and still play a game.
| skhr0680 wrote:
| Peoples complaints about the joy cons are because of their
| physical build quality, not the actual design
| boopmaster wrote:
| Uhm, actually... I get horrible hand cramps with the
| switch and lite models. Bulky grip add-ons are a must for
| me.
| Accacin wrote:
| Understood, but it's just the way it is, right? I get
| horrible wrist pain when I use a regular keyboard so
| 'had' to buy an Advantage2. That doesn't mean regular
| keyboards are badly designed for the majority of people.
| jbay808 wrote:
| Definitely! The handcuffs are finally off!
| fomine3 wrote:
| Split keyboard and mouse on PC!
| [deleted]
| discordance wrote:
| Have been trying out Xcloud gaming lately and it works
| surprisingly well. Although I won't be able to play on a
| train or plane, it will definitely fill my travel/hotel
| gaming use case.
| fastball wrote:
| If you travel at all and want to plug your switch into the TV
| still (say your hotel room TV), I 100% recommend the Covert
| Dock[1] by Genki. A total game-changer for me. Really allows me
| to use the Switch to its fullest wherever I am.
|
| [1] https://www.genkithings.com/products/covert-dock
| simonh wrote:
| To rally in defence of the Wii, I'm a PC gamer through and
| through. I could never get on with consoles, particularly for
| first person shooters, although I had good times playing some
| casual games on friend's machines back in the day.
|
| The Wii was fantastic though, I loved playing shooters on it, and
| the fun factor of things like tennis, golf and such made it a
| regular feature of family evenings.
|
| That's over with the Switch. We occasionally play Mario Kart
| together but that's it. My eldest got addicted to CotW, Stardew
| Valley and Animal Crossing but now she's into LoL on her laptop
| the Switch is dead to her as well.
|
| I'm not saying it's a bad console or machine, far from it, it's
| fantastic. But it's a fantastic console, whereas the Wii was
| something special. I wonder how many people bought Switch due to
| a halo effect from Wii. We certainly did. If they brought out Wii
| game controllers and games for it I'd be all over it.
| copperwater69 wrote:
| I bought it for metroid prime 4 and it still isn't out
| silveira wrote:
| Just got my second Switch today.
| fartcannon wrote:
| Nintendo has finally sued too many smart people, and shut down
| too many fan projects. I can no longer support their bad
| behaviour so I can't support the Switch. I know they've been bad
| actors in that space for a long time but I guess I've just gotten
| old enough to see past my nostalgia.
|
| Also the quality of the switch is below my expectations. My NES
| controller still works, but my joycons are dead.
| qwertywert_ wrote:
| > joycons are dead Did you try cleaning out the connector?
| heavyset_go wrote:
| > _Nintendo has finally sued too many smart people, and shut
| down too many fan projects. I can no longer support their bad
| behaviour so I can 't support the Switch. I know they've been
| bad actors in that space for a long time but I guess I've just
| gotten old enough to see past my nostalgia._
|
| For reference, Nintendo stalked Neimod and compiled a dossier
| on him[1][2], tried to get him to incriminate himself
| online[2], and then dangled a job opportunity in front of him
| in exchange for information about his 3DS exploits[3].
|
| From here[4]:
|
| > _Nintendo had run background checks on the hacker, knew where
| he lived, where he worked, and where he graduated from. To make
| the story even more creepy, the gaming company was allegedly
| spying on the man, knew everything about his typical day, his
| usual activities, friendships, times he left his residence,
| restaurants he liked to visit, and more._
|
| [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25580861
|
| [2]
| https://twitter.com/forestillusion/status/134123063191354163...
|
| [3] https://twitter.com/orcastraw/status/1341178144708059136
|
| [4] https://www.technadu.com/nintendo-spying-3ds-hacker-
| neimod-t...
| markus_zhang wrote:
| It's surprising that no one in the community takes
| retaliation, in one form or another. If you don't have the
| ability to harm others you are sheep in the jungle.
| 1_player wrote:
| This reenforces my decision to jailbreak my Switch Lite. It's
| been sitting unused for 2 years, I don't like it, gives me
| cramps, and the store prices are ridiculous when used to the
| convenience and sales offered by Steam. And I have to pay for
| the Nintendo Online subscription to install a NES and SNES
| emulator. Yeah, no.
|
| Any good Switch jailbreak resources? I'm comfortable doing
| it, I don't know what's the latest and most effective hack
| these days.
| Narushia wrote:
| https://nh-server.github.io/switch-guide/ is the
| recommended guide for Switch. However, there's currently no
| way to run a custom firmware on the Switch Lite.
| looperhacks wrote:
| For the lite, you will have to install a modchip. These are
| currently hard to find or very expensive. But if you still
| want to do it, there are many tutorials online. A few
| keywords you can use are "Mariko" (Codename for newer
| switch models like the lite), "CFW" (custom firmware) and
| atmosphere (the most popular CFW)
| judge2020 wrote:
| Is it known how they got this info? Typically this would've
| required hiring some private investigator for a few weeks to
| follow them and gather intelligence, but now it seems they
| could have simply ran his name to get all this information
| from a background check agency (in my experience these
| background checks are typically very detailed including
| employment and income information).
| lelandfe wrote:
| The leaked slides include these bullet points:
|
| - "Surveillance didn't reveal any friends or visitors
| entering or leaving the residence"
|
| - "Only additional activity included a trip to the bank and
| a restaurant (alone)"
| rndgermandude wrote:
| [2] has a Nintendo document with a bullet point starting
| with "Surveillance didn't reveal...". The other stuff
| mentioned in this section also required surveillance, not
| just a background check.
|
| They stalked the guy as part of their operation they named
| "Belgian Waffle".
| shawabawa3 wrote:
| They also illegally refuse refunds in the EU for games you've
| bought but never downloaded or launched
| vlunkr wrote:
| I don't understand people getting upset about fan projects
| being shut down. What do you expect to happen? You can create
| an earthbound-like game without calling it earthbound.
| feanaro wrote:
| I personally expect it to be left to exist.
| [deleted]
| KronisLV wrote:
| Agreed, if we lived in a different world than our current
| one, it would be nice and i wouldn't bat an eyelid at
| seeing that.
|
| Want to play the old Star Wars Battlefront 2 with fan made
| leader servers? Go ahead, there's a project out there for
| the hundreds to thousands of nostalgic people.
|
| Want to play Battlefield Bad Company 2 in a similar manner
| with fan made projects to support the game after the
| company behind it has given up? You're more than welcome.
|
| Want to play fan made mods/expansions for KOTOR2 or maybe
| the Jedi Outcast games, or maybe Battlefield 1942 or
| Battlefield 2? Sure!
|
| Perhaps play a newly created fan game for the Duke Nukem
| series, which really took a nosedive a few years back? Go
| ahead, enjoy that person's art.
|
| Of course, one can argue that it would become way more
| problematic if the developers of any such project tried
| charging money for them, though as long as they're freely
| available and any donations are entirely optional, i don't
| see any problems.
|
| And yet, in our current world, things are not that simple -
| whenever there's a threat of cease & desist for any project
| like that. Games like STALKER have a rich modding scene
| that keeps the games alive years after the developers
| finished them and introduce everything from new mods to
| total conversations, something that might as well not be
| possible with a different company behind the game, which
| would pursue legal action.
| feanaro wrote:
| > And yet, in our current world, things are not that
| simple - whenever there's a threat of cease & desist for
| any project like that.
|
| That is exactly the point, though. It's only complicated
| due to artificial problems created by misguided people
| and overreaching companies like Nintendo. I deeply wish
| that we could collectively just become a bit more relaxed
| about things and stop trying to control everything.
| morbia wrote:
| I'm not sure that that's realistic though. What about if
| the fan project contained inappropriate/sexual content?
| What if it's a buggy mess that people start to associate
| with your brand?
|
| This discussion reminds me of the fan made power rangers
| short video with Katee Sackoff in that got removed from
| pretty much everywhere. As an adult who watched power
| rangers as a child I loved it. However, power rangers is
| ultimately a children's TV show, having violent R-rated
| content flies totally against the image the company is
| trying to portray.
|
| Nintendo certainly take it to an extreme but I totally get
| why.
| coldpie wrote:
| > What about if the fan project contained
| inappropriate/sexual content? What if it's a buggy mess
| that people start to associate with your brand?
|
| Tough shit. Japan has a huge fan-made media community[1]
| and the original creators still somehow manage to exist
| in the same market. I really dislike the modern idea that
| because you created something, you get exclusive control
| of every component of it for the rest of eternity. I
| think it's really harmful to try to lock down our shared
| culture in that way.
|
| [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doujinshi
| feanaro wrote:
| > What about if the fan project contained
| inappropriate/sexual content?
|
| I don't want to be flippant, but so what? Problems with
| this are entirely artificial and a product of the mind.
|
| > What if it's a buggy mess that people start to
| associate with your brand?
|
| It's always possible to think of excuses to exercise
| stifling control over other people and their creativity.
| The degree to which this is a real problem is debatable.
|
| In the end, I consider brands less important than people,
| freedom and creativity. Perhaps it's worthwhile trying to
| rethink the world in this manner?
| morbia wrote:
| I think you misunderstood my point. I wasn't trying to
| say R-rated/sexual fan projects are a 'real problem' in
| some social/moral sense, I personally hate the 'somebody
| think of the children' argument more than most. I was
| making the point that Nintendo can come up with whatever
| reason they damn well please to shut down projects that
| use their IP. If they're confortable with some fan mod
| with some Mario/Luigi sex scenes, great. If they aren't,
| you have absolutely no leg to stand on when they send you
| a cease and desist.
|
| So given that Nintendo has some quality standards on
| their trademarks and IP, be that whether it's suitable
| for children or whatever other reason they come up with,
| expecting Nintendo to check every popular fan project is
| unrealistic.
|
| edit: Just to add:-
|
| > In the end, I consider brands less important than
| people, freedom and creativity. Perhaps it's worthwhile
| trying to rethink the world in this manner?
|
| My world view is totally irrelevant to this discussion. I
| was arguing from the perspective of Nintendo that it
| makes absolutely no sense for them to leave fan projects
| to do whatever they want. I could not care less about
| protecting Nintendo's IP or any other corporation's IP,
| but they clearly do.
| feanaro wrote:
| Sorry, I think you might've misunderstood me too. I
| didn't mean to lecture you on your viewpoint -- that was
| more of a call for a reconsideration for everyone. The
| world, if you will.
|
| Thus my comments were directed at you specifically, but
| were more of a general commentary that, yes, Nintendo
| clearly _does_ have a legal leg to stand on. But in my
| opinion, no, they shouldn 't. And perhaps it's time for
| society to think through the problem once again instead
| of deferring to the learnt pattern of thinking IP is
| always right.
| [deleted]
| yucky wrote:
| >My NES controller still works, but my joycons are dead.
|
| Do you have to blow in your switch to get the games to work?
| mdm_ wrote:
| >Nintendo has finally sued too many smart people, and shut down
| too many fan projects.
|
| I've always wondered, with Nintendo's history of being rather
| litigious and forcing fans to take down gameplay videos, etc,
| how have they not sued Roblox out of existence yet? Practically
| every game I see my kids play on Roblox makes heavy use of
| unlicensed Nintendo IP: models/images of Mario, Yoshi, Pikachu,
| well known music and sound effects from various Nintendo games,
| and so on. Robolox is not some obscure app, AFAIK it has over
| 150 million users and rakes in money from these games that are
| making extensive use of Nintendo's IP. IANAL but this seems
| like a slam dunk, what gives?
| bdowling wrote:
| > IANAL but this seems like a slam dunk, what gives?
|
| Roblox is protected by the DMCA from liability for copyright
| infringement based on user submitted content. All that
| Nintendo can do is file DMCA claims and then wait. Nintendo
| could not sue unless Roblox fails to take down the material.
|
| Suing the users who submitted the material would be a waste
| of time in most cases, because most users don't have any
| money to pay damages.
| slightwinder wrote:
| Can they even sue roblox? They are only the platform, the
| content after all comes from the creators. And the question
| is whether this amounts as fair use. Fanart and stuff is not
| getting sued either for reasons.
|
| But then again, people can make money with Roblox, so i'm
| curious whether Nintendo does sue people who make Money with
| their content on Roblox.
| BigJono wrote:
| Because lawyers don't pick fights to lose them. Arguing to
| what extent a platform has to moderate content, in a foreign
| court, against a warchest in the billions, is a much
| different ballgame to just binning a beloved fan game
| community once in a while to send a message.
| runevault wrote:
| Isn't all that stuff fan made?
| skinnymuch wrote:
| Why did you buy a Switch?
| tasubotadas wrote:
| I am now really looking forward to see Steam Deck launch
| 0-_-0 wrote:
| apparently switch emulators run well on it :)
| n3dm wrote:
| >I can't support the switch >Bought a switch
|
| Bro, what?
| 1_player wrote:
| People change their mind.
| Toutouxc wrote:
| Both joysticks on my Lite (the one where you can't just buy new
| JoyCons) developed severe drift after three and five months after
| purchase. After replacing the second one I realized I hate the
| thing for multiple reasons (low FPS in AAA ports, expensive
| games, bad ergonomy) and tossed it into a drawer.
|
| I wouldn't recommend the Switch to anyone, especially because
| Nintendo is very well aware of the stick drift and they keep
| using that same part.
| ratorx wrote:
| I wouldn't really recommend the Switch (even non-Lite) for AAA
| games. The tradeoffs for portability don't work with the
| graphical intensity of AAA.
|
| The Switch is great as a second console for playing more casual
| games (especially paired with a PC for everything demanding),
| but if you want to have a single console (and also play AAA),
| then it's not good.
| redisman wrote:
| It's a pretty good system but some of the ports are really
| poor. I played Outer Worlds on it and it was just unacceptably
| bad quality. I get that the hardware can't run it but then
| don't sell it. Looking forward to switching up to the Steam
| deck and selling my lite
| cardosof wrote:
| I've just bought one to play with my wife! What single or 2player
| games does HN recommend?
| moralestapia wrote:
| Cadence of Hyrule!
| the_dege wrote:
| Untitled goose game
| schipplock wrote:
| A communication error has occured :). I wish they would fix their
| online offering. I'm not a serious gamer, but my collegues get
| kicked out during a Mario Kart online session all the time.
| jcadam wrote:
| Too bad. The Wii U is my all time favorite console.
| odiroot wrote:
| Same here. Still appreciate mine. I have no need for a portable
| console, so for me Wii U was end of the line.
| dathinab wrote:
| Time to release a more powerful version.
|
| In between there was a bit of worry as NVIDIA had there ARM+GPU
| chips refocused on only Robot/Cart/Etc. ML, but they seem to be
| going back to shipping consumer focused ARM+GPU ships so I guess
| the necessary requirements for a backward compatible updated more
| powerful switch are finally about to be meet again.
| ajmurmann wrote:
| Rumor has it that the OLED Switch was supposed to be something
| like a Switch Pro. However, chip shortage hitting again.
| Metroid Dread supposedly would have been the big game to take
| advantage of it. Thus the occasional frame rate drops on the
| current Switch.
| Gigachad wrote:
| I feel like the fact Nintendo didn't release a new console
| recently is part of their success. Supply issues have plagued
| the Xbox and PlayStation so by the time most people get their
| hands on it, it's already not winning any graphics
| competitions. But Nintendo has proven time and time again that
| having the fastest hardware doesn't matter. Providing a unique
| experience at a high quality does. Which can be done on
| relatively weak hardware.
|
| No doubt they will release a new one eventually, but I wouldn't
| imagine there is a huge rush.
| dathinab wrote:
| There might be a bit more of an rush then it seems, as for
| many causal players the Steam Deck (and alternatives to it)
| are quite a viable alternative for playing many of the games
| on the Switch which are not exclusives.
|
| In the end we will need to see how the Steam Deck plays out.
|
| But for 2022 the power of the Switch is just very very low.
| It was still acceptable when the switch came out but by now
| it's starting to hurt.
|
| This won't matter for targeting children.
|
| But children don't buy consoles their parents do.
|
| And a lot of young adults and adults did buy it too without
| it involving children.
|
| So if they take to long, they may permanently lose marked
| share due to the Switch less being an option for
| (successfully) Indy games in the future.
|
| Due to switching the Games I causally play I'm now kinda
| regretting not to have per-ordered a Steam Deck. The Switch
| has the games I wanna play and they run, but not always fully
| fluent.
| detcader wrote:
| There's also over a billion more people in the world now... does
| that matter? Maybe not, but I always wonder when raw counts are
| compared across decades
| bastawhiz wrote:
| Has the number of people who are able to meaningfully afford a
| Nintendo console increased?
| keewee7 wrote:
| Absolutely. Eastern Europe and China are a lot more wealthy
| today than they were in 2006.
| ajmurmann wrote:
| Hasn't the middle class in China for example grown
| dramatically?
| savant_penguin wrote:
| Many years in they added the audio Bluetooth option
|
| The switch has longer support than many phones
| [deleted]
| bogwog wrote:
| That really should have been available at launch.
|
| > The switch has longer support than many phones
|
| That's not a very high bar :P
| Gigachad wrote:
| That was basically the only major update the console ever got.
| russellbeattie wrote:
| Nintendo is my favorite tech company because of their willingness
| to make massive, fearless bets on revolutionary new products. How
| they are able to constantly and consistently innovate at such a
| high level, decade after decade, is absolutely amazing to me.
|
| Even their flops are amazing! I will always remember the first
| week after the Wii U launched in 2012 during Thanksgiving break.
| My 10yo son had a bunch of friends over and we played
| Nintendoland all week - four Wiimotes and the tablet. So much fun
| and such great memories.
|
| Actually, this post has just inspired me to read up on Nintendo.
| There must be a decent business book or two about them. Any
| recommendations? The video game industry is the odd duck out in
| the tech world in my opinion - their production and sales cycles
| alone are so long (how many years did BotW take to make?), but I
| bet there'd still be a lot to learn from a product design
| perspective.
| bondant wrote:
| Not sure this is the exact kind of books you are looking for
| but here are some recommendations:
|
| -For a whole picture of the Nintendo business since the
| beginning (1889), I would recommend the books "L'Histoire de
| Nintendo" from Florent Gorges. The books are in french but
| there are English translations of the first two.
|
| -For product design I like the "Reverse Design" books from
| Patrick Holleman. As the title imply it's not from the creator
| of the analyzed game but I think the books contains good
| analyzed of how different gameplay elements works together.
| WickyNilliams wrote:
| It's not really a serious history book by any means, but I have
| a copy Before Mario which covers all their products and company
| history prior to gaming. It's really interesting to see.
| https://omakebooks.com/en/livres-jeux-video/48-before-mario-...
| dlbucci wrote:
| And well deserved, too! I was pretty much done with console
| gaming after the Wii. That was the most excited I ever was for a
| console (since I was 13), but after the launch, I never played it
| nearly as much as my GameCube.
|
| I played about 5 games on my Wii U, and didn't even plan on
| getting a Switch, but my oh my could I have not been more wrong!
| I think the portability and the power to run pretty much any
| modern game (albeit with worse graphics) was a true winning
| combo.
|
| Also, I was just thinking today how it's crazy that Nintendo has
| been the dominant portable console maker basically since the
| Gameboy in 1989. There were some competitors, but nothing ever
| took the throne, just 33 years of being the King. Really
| impressive!
| Alex3917 wrote:
| I mostly lost interest in AAA games when I was 14 or so, but
| the Switch has been great for going back and playing some of
| the games that came out around then that I never got a chance
| to play. The idea of closing out of all my work stuff and
| rebooting into another operating system is just a complete non-
| starter, but the Switch is perfect just to grab whenever I'm
| backing up my hard drive, upgrading my OS, the Internet is
| down, etc.
| bluedino wrote:
| I was around the same age. A bunch of things all factor into
| that, that 14-16 age
| Alex3917 wrote:
| Yeah for me it was just the beginning of high school. It
| was pretty obvious that if I kept playing Ultima Online or
| whatever for 10 hours a day then it was going to destroy my
| life, so I gave it up before freshman year started.
|
| Every couple years I'll get into a game and spend a few
| weeks playing it, e.g. with Breath of the Wild a couple
| year ago, but I purposely don't let myself play games that
| just go on indefinitely like WoW. Whereas that's not an
| issue with indie games that only last five or ten hours.
|
| And similarly, it's been fun going back and playing
| Baldur's Gate, which I never got to play when it came out.
| selfhifive wrote:
| I'm always impressed with how much risk they take from
| generation to generation.
|
| N64, Gamecube, Wii, Wii U, and Switch.
|
| GB, GBA, DS, 3DS, and Switch.
|
| All of them feel like a generational leap instead of the
| incremental improvement model of other companies.
| laumars wrote:
| Interestingly the Wii is more or less the same hardware as
| the GC but with upgraded specs. In fact the Wii even has GC
| ports on it (for GC controllers and memory cards) and plays
| GC discs. Additionally the Wiimote was originally designed to
| be an add on for the GC before Nintendo decided to release it
| as the primary controller for their next console.
| k__ wrote:
| This.
|
| But the Wii failed pretty hard in terms of games.
|
| After the 5th mini games collection it became pretty boring...
| smoe wrote:
| I bought the Switch in part because of portability, but almost
| never ended up using this way. I used to game a lot as a child
| and teenager but almost stopped entirely once my job involved
| sitting in front of a screen all day. But I still like playing
| some games I can pick up to kill half an hour here and there,
| completely casual. The game selection, is perfect for this. Or
| a couple rounds of couch co-op. I have zero interest to play
| hyper competitive games with random people over the internet.
| The Switch really brought back the fond memories I had when
| first being exposed to gaming, when I kept going to my
| neighbors home to play Super Nintendo games against each other
| dorchadas wrote:
| I do love the portability of my Switch, but eve more I do
| love how casual it is. And how a lot of their games, while
| they can be played multiplayer, are focused on single player
| stuff. They've great single player titles, and that keeps me
| coming back to Nintendo regularly (especially their mobile
| stuff, I'm pretty sure I've owned at least one iteration of
| everything since the Gameboy Pocket).
| theshrike79 wrote:
| I literally didn't even notice the WiiU release :) I heard the
| rumours and forgot about it. The next time I saw anything WiiU
| related it had already been in stores for a while.
|
| I don't know a single person who got one even near the release.
| _Everyone_ had a Wii though.
| celticninja wrote:
| Atari lynx was possibly the best handheld game system, followed
| by the game gear, but their cost meant it most out to the more
| affordable Gameboy.
|
| I think though, what won it was not the hardware but the
| software. The switch is a great handheld console and a good
| console in dock mode. But Breath of the Wild was worth the cost
| of the console alone. I liken it to GTA IV or GTA V, but for my
| kids. It is a beautiful open world that really knocks out of
| the park every aspect, music, graphics, gameplay, puzzles. It
| is a beautiful game and I believe it is a major reason the
| switch is so successful, or at least it's launch period was.
|
| I also think that the portability is a huge factor, I know many
| households where they have a PS5 or and XBOX and a switch. Few
| people will buy all consoles but the switch being portable
| means it has the extra edge when deciding on a second system.
| saghm wrote:
| Breath of the Wild released on the Wii U as well, as did the
| pre-deluxe version of Mario Kart 8 and what was at the time
| arguably the best Super Smash Bros game yet (some people
| prefer Melee, but Brawl was notoriously not great, and
| Ultimate obviously had not come out in the Wii U's heyday).
| I'm not sure good first-party games alone can completely
| carry a console; people need to be hooked in first before
| they start considering the platform, and the Switch had the
| most intriguing hook there's been so far.
| mpyne wrote:
| Honestly the Wii U had an amazing library of games.
| Nintendo squeezed a bunch of extra juice out of Switch
| using nothing more than straight ports of Wii U games onto
| the more popular Switch.
|
| But like you say, the Wii U hardware just didn't fly off
| the shelves like Nintendo had hoped. Though there is a big
| difference between Nintendoland as a launch title and
| Breath of the Wild.
| astura wrote:
| The Wii U had some really fantastic games.
|
| It really suffered, however, from having such wonky
| hardware and bad marketing. I own a Wii U, I own all the
| games you mentioned on it (other than BotW because I don't
| usually buy games at launch - I bought BotW on switch
| though) and I, personally, still found the hardware
| confusing.
|
| It's really great that almost all Nintendo published games
| have had switch releases, because more people can
| experience them.
|
| Nintendo has sold more than twice as many copies of the
| latest animal crossing game than they did Wii U consoles.
| Which is just crazy to think about.
| riffraff wrote:
| I owned a Lynx and it was incredible to have something with
| colors when the competition was the original B/W Gameboy.
|
| But I was the only one I ever met to own that, which meant I
| could never trade games or share the excitement. The lower
| cost Gameboy had "network effects", and so ended up being a
| much better buy for a random kid.
| laumars wrote:
| It wasn't just the cost. The difference in battery life was
| night and day. The reason I bought a GB back as a teen
| despite better consoles being around was precisely because
| I wanted something that would last for several hours on the
| long drive to Grandmas house. Neither the Lynx nor the Game
| Gear had that longevity.
|
| Tbh I think the full colour portable systems were just
| released a few years too early.
| Aeolun wrote:
| > I also think that the portability is a huge factor
|
| At least out here, I'll often go to the park and see little
| clusters of 10 year olds, either all wrapped around one
| Switch, or all playing together on their respective Switch.
| I've never seen that before, even with Gameboys.
|
| I don't know exactly why, but they did _something_ right.
| TehShrike wrote:
| I had a Game Gear, and that battery life was pretty rough.
| The Switch definitely wins in that regard
| JohnJamesRambo wrote:
| The Sonic game was rough. You could barely see what was
| going on and coming up next on the little screen.
| laumars wrote:
| Yeah, that screen refresh was harsh. Plays much better on
| TFT modded game gears though
| satysin wrote:
| The funny thing is the Game Gear and Switch battery life
| are actually very similar at 3-5 hours.
|
| It varies a little with the Switch as with lighter games
| and low screen brightness you can get 6 or so hours but
| playing something like Zelda BOTW you get around 3 hours
| max before needing to recharge.
|
| I find it interesting we're still in that 3-4 hour battery
| life space thirties years later. I guess it makes sense as
| most people will want/need a small break after 3 hours with
| a handheld so gives you some time to charge it so I expect
| Nintendo aim for that 3 hour minimum.
| chrisweekly wrote:
| My Switch went unused for a couple months, and now the
| battery is completely dead. :(
| chrisweekly wrote:
| ... it won't power on even when plugged in, and
| apparently replacing the battery is my only recourse.
| This feels like it should be a solved problem, some kind
| of tiny spare / buffer to prevent a drained battery from
| effectively bricking the device.
| InvaderFizz wrote:
| This is usually a solved problem, but crops up
| occasionally. What is happening is the charge level is
| dropping below a level that the charge controller
| recognizes the battery at, so it won't even attempt to
| charge.
|
| This can sometimes be rectified by just dumping 5v into
| the battery for about 30 seconds, bringing its voltage up
| high enough for the controller to do its job.
|
| The Switch seems to have exceptionally dumb power state
| situations it can find itself in. That is not just
| limited to the Switch, but apparently the power adapter
| has its own issues and needs to be unplugged for at least
| 30 seconds to be reset if it too enters into a faulty
| state.
|
| You can attempt the right voodoo incantations with your
| switch:
|
| 1. Don't use the dock for any of this process.
|
| 2. Unplug the PSU from the wall for 1 minute or more.
|
| 3. Hard reset the switch by holding the power button for
| 12 seconds.
|
| 4. Plug the PSU into the switch and let it sit over
| night.
|
| 5. Repeat step 3.
|
| If that doesn't work and nothing else is damaged, you get
| to take out about 20 screws to get to the battery and
| either replace it, or jump start it to revive it.
| PhineasRex wrote:
| I had a Game Gear growing up and 3 hours is way more
| battery life than I ever got out of that thing. 1 hour is
| more in-line with my experience.
| fullstop wrote:
| > The funny thing is the Game Gear and Switch battery
| life are actually very similar at 3-5 hours.
|
| The switch has much better battery life than that in the
| models released after the initial launch. You're spot on
| with the release model, though.
| satysin wrote:
| Indeed the newer Switch OLED model does have better
| battery life albeit still around the max 5 hour mark for
| most games apparently edging up to 7 hours for less
| demanding games (according to a brief search anyway).
| mashc5 wrote:
| The switch got a refresh in 2019 (two years before the
| OLED model was released) that almost doubled battery life
| [0].
|
| [0] https://www.techradar.com/news/the-updated-nintendo-
| switch-b...
| Izkata wrote:
| > I think though, what won it was not the hardware but the
| software.
|
| Not even just new stuff: I had Grandia II on the Dreamcast as
| a kid, and thought I'd never play it again. Then I found out
| it was ported to the Switch, and that was the tipping point
| that got me to buy it a few years ago.
| laumars wrote:
| I much preferred the GB to the GG. The former took 3
| batteries and lasted months. The latter took something like 6
| batteries and only lasted 3 hours. While the GG was
| undoubtedly a better machine hardware wise, that counted for
| nothing when your batteries ran out mid road tip.
| Foobar8568 wrote:
| The Atari lynx was burning through battery like nothing, was
| it 4 or 8AA for like 1 or 2 hours of gameplay?
| gfxgirl wrote:
| Not just it's portability. I've seen kids in coffeeshops.
| Their mom is reading a magazine and the kids have put the
| Switch on a table using its stand and then use the
| controllers to play 2+ player games. No other handheld I know
| of has ever done that.
| telesilla wrote:
| I've done the same waiting for the dryer to finish in the
| laundromat while traveling! Mariocart for two is a great
| travel companion.
| el_oni wrote:
| Before i started work i would sit in the car while my
| partner was getting treatment and play switch. When she
| came back to the car between appointments we could play
| mario kart. Such a good system
| dustymcp wrote:
| This is why se bought it for family gatherings or the likes
| where kids gets bored, we just bring the switch and the
| kids can 4 player with the other kids in Mario kart
| type_enthusiast wrote:
| Absolutely agree on Breath of the Wild. I think every
| successful console has The Game that really differentiates it
| (speaking as someone who never had a console growing up, just
| Sierra games).
|
| Having got a Switch for my son - Breath of the Wild is that
| game for Switch, but is also possibly the best game made so
| far. If you haven't played it, don't argue - just play it.
| shotta wrote:
| For me the Switch was solely a Zelda rectangle. I didn't
| explore beyond that game at all for over a year. The store
| seems bad for discovery, but the online community is
| awesome. I've discovered new (to me) genres of game that I
| love and have gone back to older consoles to find similar
| games. The switch reset me back into gaming. If that makes
| any sense!
| imiric wrote:
| If you have a powerful PC, playing the Wii U version of
| BoTW at high resolutions and frame rates with Cemu is an
| absolute joy. I haven't gone back to playing the Switch
| version since the experience is so much inferior.
| 0-_-0 wrote:
| Botw at 4K and 75hz is amazing
| rosege wrote:
| I remember the glory days with a N64, GoldenEye and 3
| mates. That was definitely a peak gaming fun time for me
| back in the day.
| distantaidenn wrote:
| My fiance got me an OLED Switch and BOTW this past
| Christmas. When I first started BOTW, I was
| like...umm...what do I do in this game? Then I realized:
| ANYTHING I WANT. Already have over 150 hours in the game.
| You can literally just wander around and enjoy. Find new
| and clever ways to kill enemies -- or befriend them if
| that's your style. You can play the game the way you want
| and at your own pace.
|
| Yeah, the game has some flaws, but I'd say it's the most
| rewarding game experience I've had in my 30+ years of
| gaming. You know a game is good when you don't even want to
| finish it!
| tokamak-teapot wrote:
| Defeat Ganon. Load saved game. Keep exploring. It is
| amazing that I still keep coming back to it after
| 'finishing' so many times. Wanting to complete all the
| shrines not just so I have that satisfaction, but because
| they are fun and interesting and the journey is too.
|
| Then there is master mode, which is mainly just harder,
| but when you're getting good at fighting it ensures you
| are challenged to get /really/ good and not rely on power
| / armour / buffs, especially in the challenges where you
| start with nothing.
| [deleted]
| Xenoamorphous wrote:
| I think the most impressive hardware-wise was the Turbo
| Express. It was released in 1990, just a year after the Game
| Boy and Lynx and same year as the Game Gear.
|
| It had a 400x270 screen vs 160x144 in the Game Boy and Game
| Gear and 160x102 in the Lynx.
|
| It was basically a portable TurboGrafx and could run Street
| Fighter II (which was also released for the Game Boy but it
| was miles behind).
| chronogram wrote:
| It was released in Dec 1990 for $250, a few months later
| the price was raised to $300. The sound in it failed
| frequently, and the display had a high rate of pixel
| defects. It burned through 6 AA batteries in 3 hours. I
| don't know what the original price for the AC adapter was
| but it was big so probably not cheap either.
|
| The TurboExpress is a classic example of the "any idiot can
| build a bridge that stands, but it takes an engineer to
| build a bridge that barely stands" saying.
| [deleted]
| Xenoamorphous wrote:
| I don't know about reliability but battery life seems
| about the same or little worse than a Game Gear or Lynx,
| which also used 6 AA batteries.
|
| And price is an entirely different matter, but surely a
| factor in its commercial failure.
| fullstop wrote:
| > Atari lynx was possibly the best handheld game system,
| followed by the game gear, but their cost meant it most out
| to the more affordable Gameboy.
|
| It doesn't matter how powerful a handheld system is if the
| batteries only last an hour or two.
|
| In the era when the lynx and game gear were released, NiMH
| batteries were not mainstream yet, and NiCd were not as
| suitable for the application. I knew a few kids who had the
| Lynx and they realistically could not use it unless it was
| plugged into the wall.
| astura wrote:
| I got a Game Gear when I was a kid. It was a thrift store
| find, otherwise my parents would never spend that kind of
| money on a toy.
|
| I played it for literally a half hour before the batteries
| ran out. It didn't come with a power cord and batteries
| were very strictly rationed in my house growing up, so I
| was never able to play it again. I was heartbroken.
|
| Again, I got only a half hour of play out of a video game
| console. Parents sold it several months later when they
| realized how useless it was.
|
| I don't know how a product like that could even be released
| on the market - it's basically false advertisement. It's
| been nearly three decades and I'm still heartbroken by it.
| KennyBlanken wrote:
| > the power to run pretty much any modern game (albeit with
| worse graphics)
|
| To be specific: 720p and severely degraded effects, textures,
| models, anti-aliasing, etc - and you'll be lucky to get 60fps.
|
| The Switch has about as much horsepower as a ~6 year old mid-
| tier Android phone.
| styfle wrote:
| The nice thing is that most games don't _feel_ underpowered
| on Switch. Sure the graphics don't look as good but it's not
| laggy in the games I've tried.
|
| For example: Immortals Fenyx Rising is cross platform, but it
| feels smooth. I would rather play on Switch than other
| consoles so I can occasionally play while traveling. It's
| really nice to have the same game, same save point, with same
| controller on the TV or on the go.
| msh wrote:
| Nah. It got the power of a really high end 6 year old Android
| phone. And with the fan it can provide more power than the
| same soc in a phone form factor.
| hajile wrote:
| Theoretical power and actual power in phones are quite
| different. Phones throttle their chips down to nothing very
| quickly.
| Agentlien wrote:
| My job these last few years has mainly been focused on trying
| to get games running smoothly across all platforms and
| finding workarounds or optimizations for switch has been the
| biggest part of it. It's so incredibly weak in comparison to
| any other modern console. It's literally a mobile SoC from
| 2015.
|
| As a user, however, the switch is by far my favorite console.
| It might not look as flashy but I can play almost any game I
| want anywhere I want.
| firecall wrote:
| > Also, I was just thinking today how it's crazy that Nintendo
| has been the dominant portable console maker basically since
| the Gameboy in 1989
|
| Imagine how many they would have sold if the iPhone didnt
| exist!
| 14 wrote:
| I really enjoyed the PSP or PlayStation portable. It was the
| first thing I ever hacked and played games for free. Set me on
| a path. But I do love my switch greatly. It appeals to me with
| the kid friendly games. Watching my 5 year old develop his hand
| eye coordination makes my heart melt.
| bane wrote:
| Same boat. After the Wii I was done. If I wanted to put money
| into gaming it was going to be on PC. The Switch isn't the most
| powerful, or has the best library (Nintendo first party games
| notwithstanding), or the most portable, but it's "good enough"
| at everything in the way VHS and MP3s were/are. It also helps
| that it's relatively inexpensive to get into, and has a huge
| indie game scene. So while you may not get the best version of
| "Soldiers on a Battlefield 2022" or whatever, there are
| hundreds of semi-exclusives.
|
| Getting a console and a portable in one unit was also brilliant
| and something that neither Sony or Microsoft can do with their
| "most powerful hardware first". Nintendo cares about things
| that affect the gameplay experience, and Microsoft and Sony
| care more about how cool the software is. Orthogonal purposes
| but it lets Nintendo, a relatively small company, compete
| globally and effectively against two 9 million pound mega
| giants.
| noobermin wrote:
| To help the thread, this is the Nintendo way of "lateral
| thinking with withered technology.[0]" They for example
| choice lack of color for the Gameboy for the sake of battery
| life, that is, using cheap technology that can be replicated
| and mass produced well.
|
| [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gunpei_Yokoi#Lateral_Thinki
| ng_... From the venerable Gunpei Yokoi, who helped develop
| the original Metroid and the Gameboy
| Aeolun wrote:
| > If I wanted to put money into gaming it was going to be on
| PC.
|
| I think people that are otherwise PC gamers make for a great
| audience for Nintendo. They don't need any power, they
| already have that on the PC. What they want is to be able to
| carry the thing around and play anywhere they want.
| zitterbewegung wrote:
| Nintendo figured out when the xBox came out that if you
| weren't Sony and or Microsoft you would have a really hard
| time competing in the space so they tried just to focus on
| making consoles that had some kind of gimmick and optimizing
| on having fun and they had a clear domination over the mobile
| space.
|
| I would say that the Switch is their response to Apple as
| being off balance on the mobile space and they were easily
| defeated by just focusing on a fun and portable console that
| also can be plugged into a TV. Really the Switch has a NVIDIA
| Tegra 1 and the rest of the console is Nintendo's design.
| jmcgough wrote:
| Way before xbox, this has been their strategy since before
| they were making video games. Gunpei Yokoi, who came up
| with the idea (and practically nintendo's entire
| electronics division), called it "lateral thinking with
| withered technology" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gunpei_
| Yokoi#Lateral_Thinking_...).
| lelandfe wrote:
| Classic example of this:
|
| Sega Game Gear: full-color screen, $150, 4hr battery life
|
| Nintendo Game Boy: monochromatic screen, $90, 30hr
| battery life
| celticninja wrote:
| Yup the game gear was technically better but the cost
| difference meant the Gameboy was more ubiquitous and so
| that's what sold.
|
| Also for the switch, a lot of kids who had Gameboy's when
| they came out are now working and can afford a souped up
| handheld alongside their main console.
| jmcgough wrote:
| Honestly I think the games library is why gameboy outsold
| game gear, and why nintendo continues to dominate the
| mobile console market
| hajile wrote:
| The two feed on each other.
|
| Nintendo bootstraps this with with a cheap console and
| their great IP.
|
| Once the console starts to outsell because of this, other
| game designers focus primarily on that console which
| drives sales and the cycle repeats.
| mcphage wrote:
| Technically more powerful. Better... well, not with no
| battery life, it wasn't.
| pa7ch wrote:
| I think the switch just runs a modified freebsd for an OS
| too.
| bobthepanda wrote:
| I think my favorite summation is that Nintendo laughs about
| being second-rate all the way to the bank.
|
| To Apple's disadvantage, _only_ touch is a pretty terrible
| interface for a lot of video game genres, and also mobile
| pretty quickly became pay to win crapware.
| dorchadas wrote:
| > To Apple's disadvantage, only touch is a pretty
| terrible interface for a lot of video game genres, and
| also mobile pretty quickly became pay to win crapware.
|
| The latter is why I hate gaming on my iPhone. And battery
| life after a year or two as the apps update to handle the
| newest and best specs, leaving older phones behind. I do
| enjoy some of the ports, but I can also buy a lot of
| those on my Switch anymore, so there's no need.
| jayd16 wrote:
| >Getting a console and a portable in one unit was also
| brilliant and something that neither Sony or Microsoft can do
|
| Actually the PSP had video out. Really just a marketing
| thing.
| djrogers wrote:
| Did it have a dock and come with removable controllers like
| it was always intended to be used with a big screen? Nope,
| it did not.
|
| It's not 'just a marketing thing' when a product is
| designed in a completely different way, with different
| goals.
| jayd16 wrote:
| I mean, it was the controller in an era of wired
| controllers.
| philistine wrote:
| What if you needed to recharge your PSP battery while
| playing? It had video out, but it was never designed for
| a couch experience. It was the typical Sony _let 's do
| all the things at once_ mentality. No one bought it for
| that reason alone, but it, and all the other weird
| features of the PSP, probably helped it become the only
| viable portable competitor to Nintendo in 30 years.
| salamandersauce wrote:
| You plug it in? It's literally plugged into your TV
| already it's not a big deal to plug the AC adapter in the
| other side. The PSP Go had a dock for connecting to your
| TV and supported using a DS3 controller for TV play. Of
| course nobody bought a Go and nobody bought a dock for
| it. But they did kinda sorta get the concept.
| philistine wrote:
| Yeah but is the cable in the box long enough? What if the
| only plug in your living room on the other side?
|
| There's a reason the PSP was not perceived as couch
| adjacent, and the Vita didn't have video out.
| salamandersauce wrote:
| How would I plug in a Switch in that case? The Switch
| actually requires AC to use the bundled dock whereas you
| can use a PSP hooked up to the TV on battery power. The
| PSP video cables are not THAT long. If you can plug it
| into your TV and use it you can probably plug in the AC
| adapter. It's a weird complaint when the Switch also
| needs power and uses a more annoying wall wart design
| than the brick in the middle that a PSP uses. And again
| the PSP Go supports a dock and wireless controllers. The
| concept was clearly there just half-baked.
|
| The reason the PSP was not considered couch adjacent is
| that the first model didn't have the feature entirely, it
| was never bundled in the box and had limitations with
| regards to PSP games (they play in a window) and no
| seperate controller support until the Go. Since it was
| always optional it was easy to ignore.
|
| I didn't mention anything about the Vita either...Sony
| pivoted too hard towards the mobile market with touch
| features that prevented TV play. Early versions of the OS
| didn't even allow navigating with buttons. It was one of
| many mis-steps of the device and caused problems for the
| PSTV down the line.
| alpaca128 wrote:
| Too bad Sony then decided to get rid of the video output
| in the PS Vita even though it was possible (the dev kit
| had HDMI) and contrary to the PSP it actually made sense
| as at this point mobile hardware was so much better due
| to the smartphone industry. One of many small mistakes
| that made the Vita much less enjoyable overall.
| reissbaker wrote:
| The (affordable) technology of the time didn't allow for
| easy dock/undock experience like the Switch does. That
| doesn't mean it was "just a marketing difference," the
| product experience was worse and wasn't designed to
| easily be used as both a portable console and a dedicated
| living room device.
| lelandfe wrote:
| Without detracting anything from your other statements (the
| comparison to MP3 is excellent), "notwithstanding" is doing a
| lot of work in the line, "Nintendo first party games
| notwithstanding." Nintendo's games are _the_ reason folks buy
| a Switch.[1] It 's pretty unbelievable the record they (and
| especially EPD) have:
|
| 1. Breath of the Wild was game of the year for most
| publications, is considered by some the greatest game of all
| time[2], and single-handedly sold the console for many people
| I know
|
| 2. Super Mario Odyssey is generally heralded as one of the
| best Mario games ever made and shipped 22 million copies
|
| 2. Super Smash Bros. Ultimate is the best selling fighting
| game of all time
|
| 3. Mario Kart 8 is the best selling racing game of all time,
| and the 7th highest selling video game of all time
|
| 4. Animal Crossing: New Horizons is the 13th highest selling
| video game of all time (2nd highest in Japan)
|
| [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-
| selling_Nintendo_... (and apropos of nothing, compare to
| PS4's: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-
| selling_PlayStati... - Switch's top 6 best sellers all moved
| more than PS4's #1)
|
| [2] https://www.ign.com/articles/the-best-100-video-games-of-
| all...
| nirvdrum wrote:
| A surprisingly large number of first party Switch titles
| were on the Wii U first and didn't drive sales. It's
| amazing how much marketing and even the product name help.
| I think Nintendo made the right call to delay BotW on Wii U
| for a dual platform release. In the end, I'm surprised they
| bothered with the older console at all, but it probably
| engendered good will amongst its die hard fans.
| ace2358 wrote:
| It did this one. I bought the WiiU and waited 4 years for
| breath of the wild. If they had moved it to be a switch
| only title I would have cried and bought a switch :p
|
| Ms did it with flight simulator. They said it would be on
| XBox One. But it never came :(
| cableshaft wrote:
| Not really surprised, the new flight simulator is super
| ambitious and requires crazy resources. I doubt the Xbox
| One could have done it justice.
| ace2358 wrote:
| I understand. But it was advertised as coming to the Xbox
| one. Then it quietly never happened. You can't even
| stream it as part of their Xbox cloud gaming service
| which is really annoying. It's especially hard to get a
| series X in AU. I'm not sure they've even been officially
| released here at some retailers.
| Aeolun wrote:
| > were on the Wii U first and didn't drive sales
|
| Have you _seen_ that thing? No matter how great the
| software. That ugly lump was never going to sell.
| nirvdrum wrote:
| I've got one and my family still has a blast playing it.
| Aesthetics are obviously personal. I won't say it's the
| nicest looking fixture in my living room, but I also
| think the PS5 looks ridiculous. Its name was probably
| Nintendo's biggest misstep.
|
| That said, my point was that the Switch's success isn't
| due to the library alone. Due to Nintendo's decision to
| port most of its Wii U exclusives to the Switch, we have
| the rare ability to compare the sales performance of the
| two.
| yucky wrote:
| The Wii U is both the most underrated console ever, and
| most poorly named console ever.
| nmfisher wrote:
| Every single Nintendo console I've owned has basically been
| a very expensive Zelda machine. In a hypothetical world
| where Sony/Microsoft/someone else acquired the rights to
| Zelda, I'd expect Switch sales to be at least 50% lower.
| The incredible strength of their first-party titles is why
| Nintendo can get away with underpowered hardware, shoddy
| controllers, crappy software and a big whopping Nintendo
| tax.
| iso1210 wrote:
| There's been over 100 million switches sold and 26
| million copies of Zelda. Even if every single person that
| bought Zelda would have not bought a Switch, that would
| still put over 75 million switches sold.
|
| Even the best selling game - Mariocart - is on fewer than
| half of the consoles.
| fullstop wrote:
| I don't know if this holds true for BOTW, but
| historically Zelda has not sold well in Japan despite its
| success in Western markets.
| iso1210 wrote:
| I don't do games much - I've got KSP and Civ 6 on my
| desktop, and we had a Wii, and now a Switch.
|
| The killer games on both Wii and especially Switch are
| the Lego ones.
|
| I've not heard of Zelda before.
| yucky wrote:
| >I've not heard of Zelda before.
|
| This is such a fascinating statement from anybody,
| regardless of how often you game.
| hackinthebochs wrote:
| Momentum has a lot to do with whether third parties
| invest in your console. The fact that BoTW pushed console
| sales early on gave third parties incentive to develop
| content for it, which then allowed the buy rate to be
| sustained past the boost BoTW gave it. So the fact that
| only a quarter of the consoles are bought with/for BoTW,
| its importance to the consoles success is much greater
| than the buy ratio would suggest.
| 2muchcoffeeman wrote:
| I always wonder why hardware matters. Look at the retro
| game market. I've spent more money lately re-buying old
| games than new ones. BOTW looks spectacular simply
| because of artistic choices. And I quickly racked up far
| more hours on my Switch than my XBOne simply because I
| could play on the TV, pull it out of the dock and play on
| the go and never had to turn it off. It just slept.
| Booting up a console is so archaic. And for what?
| Graphics that I tuned out eventually?
|
| Which is not to say good graphics are bad. But there's
| certainly diminishing returns. After a point it sure as
| hell isn't giving me more entertainment value running a
| space heater.
| pdimitar wrote:
| ...And not to detract from your point as well but I
| absolutely didn't buy the Switch for Nintendo games. The
| only one I actually like is Mario Kart 8 and even that I
| play like once every 3 months for a few hours.
|
| I bought the Switch for Diablo III and a good number of
| bullet hell / beat-em-up games. Bought plenty of those and
| I am thoroughly enjoying them.
|
| I recognize I am an outlier but the Switch is very capable
| of giving you a lot of enjoyment if you hand-curate your
| picks from the indie scene well.
|
| (As a personal opinion, the Mario franchise being milked to
| eternity is exhausting to watch sometimes.)
| morelisp wrote:
| An aside: are you using an arcade stick? I've been
| thinking of getting back into STGs after a 10ish year
| break and can't figure out which of the (pricy!) Switch
| sticks are any good.
| pdimitar wrote:
| No but I'm just about to order the HORI mini-stick. I
| have the Pro controller and it's definitely an
| improvement over the joycons but the arcade stick is
| something else entirely when playing games that don't
| require the right mini-stick on the controller.
| morelisp wrote:
| Yeah, I have a Pro controller for Monster Hunters, but
| DoDonPachi was hard enough when I was ten years younger
| and owned a decent (Xbox 360) stick. I don't think I
| stand a chance today on anything you have to hold while
| you play.
| pdimitar wrote:
| Hah, I just added DoDonPachi to my wishlist yesterday. :D
|
| And yep, exactly. I don't want to play everything with
| keyboard and a mouse but controllers are also pretty meh
| for many games. I just can't get comfortable using them.
| I mean I do but it always feels like... something
| important is missing.
|
| Hence, I am getting the HORI mini arcade stick and will
| play my bullet hells and beat-em-ups with it. A few
| 2.5-dimensional RPGs, too.
| duskwuff wrote:
| > (As a personal opinion, the Mario franchise being
| milked to eternity is exhausting to watch sometimes.)
|
| It's not a traditional game franchise, though -- there's
| no overarching Great Mario Plot that's being advanced
| through a series of games. It's more of a set of familiar
| characters and a barebones setting that Nintendo can
| apply to a wide variety of games, ranging from the
| traditional platformers to RPGs (Paper Mario), minigame
| collections (Mario Party), sports games (Mario Tennis),
| puzzles (Mario's Picross), dancing (DDR: Mario Mix),
| pinball machines...
| celticninja wrote:
| BOTW was a huge factor in the switch's early success IMO.
| Not just because it was a Nintendo exclusive but because it
| was such an amazing game. For me GTA IV AND GTA V are the
| pinnacles of their time for great games. BOTW was the
| equivalent but for a wider audience.
|
| Unfortunately for my kids it was one of the first games
| they really played, so they have been spoilt, very few
| games will ever get close to that, especially in a world of
| Fortnite.
| bane wrote:
| That's a really good point. In fact I did buy the Switch to
| play both BotW _and_ SMO. I keep forgetting that Nintendo
| first party titles are so dominant in sales vs. other large
| franchises. I keep thinking they 're just large on the one
| platform.
| cableshaft wrote:
| Yeah I own like 100 games on the Switch at this point
| (most first party, several good third party, and some
| cheaper retro or indie games), and those two games are
| still the best games to me on the Switch, by far. I kind
| of doubt they're going to be topped, even by their
| sequels.
|
| BOTW, SMO, Baba is You, Persona 5 Royal, Outer Wilds,
| Subnautica, The Witness, God of War (2018 version), Nier
| Automata, Slay the Spire are all masterpieces of design
| in the past 5 years, for my tastes.
| [deleted]
| andrepd wrote:
| I must be about your age and damn, I played _so much Wii_. I
| must have >200h on several games: both Mario Galaxy's (one of
| my favourite games), Wii Sports Resort, Smash, etc.
|
| On the contrary my Switch is almost exclusively a BotW machine
| x) bar a few indie games here and there. I must be getting old
| dartharva wrote:
| > the power to run pretty much any modern game (albeit with
| worse graphics)
|
| Huh? Any modern game?? I'm pretty sure just a small fraction of
| modern AAA titles is available on the Switch.
| jquery wrote:
| That used to be the case, but modern game engines like Unity
| make it easy to plop out an switch-capable version. The
| hardware is similar enough to a normal PC that it's a matter
| of just turning the graphics down (way, way down). It
| certainly wasn't a majority at the start but now more than
| half of new AAA releases have a Switch version.
|
| That said, buying a switch to play AAA games is not ideal. I
| find the graphics compromises too great, myself. Indie games
| (only certain genres like platforming), visual novels and
| Nintendo-first-party games are what I find the switch excels
| at.
| dleslie wrote:
| Among my children's friends, I don't know of _any_ who own a
| console that isn't a Switch. The PS5 is basically impossible to
| procure, and the XBox just doesn't seem to appeal to the child-
| age market.
|
| So I'm a little surprised that it has taken it this long to
| outsell the Wii; but then again, more children appear to play on
| a hand-me-down phone than play on a Switch.
| anyfoo wrote:
| Every time I'm tempted to get a PS5, I realize that what I
| probably actually want is a newer Switch with better graphics.
| fomine3 wrote:
| I thought that Switch should be already outsold Wii, because
| it's combined Wii+DS, and PS/Xbox aren't direct rival. Maybe
| due to birth rate declining in developed world?
| zxexz wrote:
| I dunno, if you look at [0], it seems to put the sales in
| perspective. I'm curious when these lifetime sales figures stop
| being updated? I'm assuming it's as long as the product is sold
| by the parent company. I'm amazed the DS did that well? Then
| again, I do remember everyone _except_ me seeming to have one
| when I was a teen :)
|
| Seems crazy it took Nintendo that long to come up with a
| 'worthy successor', in some ways.
|
| [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-
| selling_game_cons...
| wodenokoto wrote:
| I'm surprised by the PSP sales numbers. I don't think I've
| seen one outside of Japan.
| Izkata wrote:
| > I'm amazed the DS did that well?
|
| Features of the NDS that may have been forgotten, that all
| could have contributed to the popularity:
|
| * Two game slots, one for NDS games and one for GBA games,
| making it almost a straight upgrade (it dropped support for
| pre-GBA games) so you could have two games in your pocket
| instead of just one.
|
| * PictoChat, an ad-hoc network chatroom that wasn't just text
| but also drawing with the stylus. I remember bringing it to
| school and finding several others were also online, we
| chatted instead of paying attention to the assembly.
|
| * Download Play, for games that supported it you could do
| multiplayer on multiple systems with only one game cartridge.
|
| * For that matter, it was their first handheld with built-in
| wireless multiplayer.
|
| Also in terms of games, I think it was their first handheld
| that really appealed to the more casual/relaxed players: For
| example it was the first portable Animal Crossing and
| introduced Nintendogs.
| bspammer wrote:
| Download play was absolutely brilliant. I remember being on
| a school trip and playing Mario Kart on the bus with 7
| other people, with only one person having the game.
|
| It had to be good for sales too - I bought the game after
| that. The download play version of the game only let you
| play as a single character, and I wanted to be Bowser.
|
| It's sad that they don't do it any more, but I suppose the
| games are too large to transfer in a reasonable amount of
| time nowadays
| Tarsul wrote:
| Yes. The success of the DS is basically that it was a
| smartphone (wrt games) before smartphones (and without a
| phone ;)). The brain games (Brain Age, Big Brain Academy -
| 3 of those games are in the top20 best selling ds games[1])
| were a big reason why it was so succesful. Also tamagotchi
| with dogs/cats (nintendogs). But 150 million could only
| have been reached with a) longevity, b) weak competition
| (PSP, sold enough to be seen as a threat, but didn't hinder
| the DS) and great software support (once a hardware is
| successful the third party support basically reinforces
| itself due to good sales). Also, quite a few hardware
| revisions helped also (the first DS was clunky).
|
| [1]https://nintendo.fandom.com/wiki/List_of_best-
| selling_Ninten...
| wly_cdgr wrote:
| It's a terrific console so long as you stick to games that only
| use the D-pad :)
| pdimitar wrote:
| Just finished manually eye-balling every single on the Switch
| some hours ago today -- took me about 10 weeks on and off doing
| it casually when I was in the mood. Used an external website of
| course because Nintendo's is a disaster.
|
| Out of ~6900 games in total (and about 600 more that are upcoming
| and/or unavailable to me in my country) I liked about 200,
| wouldn't mind buying other 50, so that's 250 games that I either
| like or don't hate. And I have about 40 in my collection, some of
| which I uninstalled.
|
| So realistically I can still buy 250 games out of 7500 in the
| next few years and get a lot of value for my money.
|
| That's 3.3% of all the games. I count that as a big win and I
| don't regret my investment in the Switch one bit. Even
| considering the OLED variant for the bigger and better display --
| though I have to say I was very disappointed that Nintendo didn't
| bump up its specs even a little bit.
| jrm4 wrote:
| The Wii continues to outplay the Switch in my house. It's great
| how solid the Switch's hardware is, but the games are a bit meh
| -- though I'll admit that's probably a product of the times and
| competition, might as well just repackage old games.
|
| But I can't imagine there will ever be a console as revolutionary
| (no pun intended for those who remember) as the Wii. To take such
| a huge gamble on motion gaming and have it work so well is so
| applause-worthy. To compare, imagine Zuckerberg announces a
| headset today, and it's actually good? See how wild that sounds?
| skinnymuch wrote:
| Oculus Quest is amazing to me. I found the Wii to be gimmicky.
|
| Just my personal opinion
| rubatuga wrote:
| Great pandemic purchase. Portability is overlooked until you need
| it for traveling, on-the-go, etc.
| Hamuko wrote:
| What? How are you travelling more during the pandemic?
| ChuckNorris89 wrote:
| Travelling doesn't just mean globe trottling, it could also
| mean just getting out of the house more often.
| tristor wrote:
| I'm happy to see this. The Switch is one of the most perfectly
| engineered consoles I've ever used. The UX design is fantastic,
| the controller design is fantastic, and it's just a lovely device
| to use both docked and handheld.
| KronisLV wrote:
| Just dropping by to express joy at this fact - Nintendo Switch is
| such a nice console! I got the Lite version and while the risk of
| eventual stick drift has been weighing heavily on my mind, it's
| amazing that it runs as well as it does in such a small form
| factor!
|
| It's perhaps like the PSP of our time, but even better - numerous
| games have been ported to it and optimized so that you can enjoy
| a lovely gaming experience wherever you are. To me, that shows
| that you don't always need a 400$ GPU in your gaming PC if you
| just want to experience a lovely story like Legend of Zelda:
| Breath of the Wild, or even just play something like Doom.
|
| Not only is the console adequately made, feels reasonably
| comfortable, has a good selection of games and a good UI, but it
| also indirectly fights back against Wirth's law
| (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wirth%27s_law) and proves that
| gameplay should sometimes be placed above graphics first and
| foremost and make artists think about the materials that they
| use, their texture resolutions, the LODs in their models, how
| efficient their shaders are, as well as how much resources the
| game code uses.
|
| I just wish that Switch development was a bit more open, for
| example, there are no publicly available releases with packaging
| functionality for game engines like Godot, but i guess that's
| just the status quo that we're stuck with.
|
| Regardless, i actually sold a PS4 that i won for getting the
| first place in a programming competition years ago (an
| acquaintance of mine wanted one and i had some dental fees, so
| figured that i might as well sell it to him for like 40% of MSRP
| since i basically got it for free), i probably wouldn't do that
| with my Switch. Not needing a dedicated monitor is also really
| nice!
|
| I wish that we'll see similarly performant games in the future
| and that we won't have the platform be sunset anytime soon, maybe
| instead get something like a Switch Pro or even have different
| graphics settings/modes in games, which would support the older
| releases and their thermal envelopes, while also letting the
| newer hardware also be successfully leveraged for that additional
| graphic fidelity, for those who care. Hey, i can dream~
| Subsentient wrote:
| Can you still install Linux on the new switches? If so, I might
| have an interest in one. If not, it's just more walled garden
| garbage.
| willis936 wrote:
| You can get a more powerful tablet for cheaper than a switch.
|
| The entire value of the switch is in its ability to play
| nintendo's software: something that can't be done on linux.
| anthk wrote:
| >The entire value of the switch is in its ability to play
| nintendo's software: something that can't be done on linux.
|
| Yuzu disagrees.
| willis936 wrote:
| You're suggesting emulating a switch on a switch?
|
| If you thought botw's frame rate was bad natively...
| benbristow wrote:
| They're suggesting emulating a Switch on Linux
| climb_stealth wrote:
| Does anyone know a solution against input lag? I have a pro
| controller, but even having it 20cm from the Switch it still has
| noticeable delays with inputs in games. It's my biggest gripe
| with the console. Plugging in the controller doesn't seem to fix
| it.
|
| Otherwise, pre-pandemic the Switch has been a godsend on 20 hour
| flights.
| itisit wrote:
| All device firmware updated? I haven't noticed any controller
| latency. Maybe display lag?
| climb_stealth wrote:
| Yup, everything up to date. I'm reasonable certain I have
| seen both docked and in handheld mode. Though the latest I
| remember is Super Mario in docked mode. Two people coop and
| there is a noticeable delay before inputs are applied.
|
| It's odd but no dealbreaker. I'm just always curious whether
| anyone else is experiencing it.
| jthrowsitaway wrote:
| Are you playing on the Switch's screen or a TV? Input lag on
| some TVs can be bad and they usually have a game mode to
| minimize this. I primarily use a pro controller and couldn't
| time certain wall jumps on Mario 64 until I put my TV into game
| mode. It was maddening for a while.
| climb_stealth wrote:
| I'm pretty sure I have seen it on both. As in both in docked
| and handheld mode. It's odd because I make sure the
| controllers are fully charged as well. It's not in all games
| either which makes me think it could be a games thing. But
| then I have seen it in Nintendo games which somewhat rules it
| out again.
|
| It's odd. Not a dealbreaker but very noticeable when it
| happens.
| pithon wrote:
| See data here: https://displaylag.com/display-database/
| numpad0 wrote:
| Never heard of that before so looked up. Sure enough there was
| a giant motion-to-photon latency table compiled by someone
| using gutted controllers and a camera, which in the end seems
| to all fall within 5.7-7.5 frames(95-125ms). This is almost ten
| times the typical input latency in a PC, and also roughly
| coincides with equatorial circumference of Earth(134 light-
| milliseconds). hmm.
|
| 1: https://w.atwiki.jp/smashsp_kensyou/pages/40.html
| acid__ wrote:
| They link some comparisons [0], including the PS4 controller
| which has a 13ms input delay. Switch controller really is 10x
| slower, oof.
|
| [0] https://imgur.com/6rVNjSU
| climb_stealth wrote:
| Oof, 125ms is pretty shocking.
| manomanowicz wrote:
| One fix for input lag I have seen is to have the console in
| flight mode and just enable bluetooth for the controller's
| connection. The switch needs to undocked to enable flight mode.
| The WiFi connection seems to be causing interference. If you
| need internet access, use an ethernet connection (older switch
| docks require USB to ethernet adapter, OLED docks have an
| ethernet port built in).
| climb_stealth wrote:
| Ooo, thanks for the tip! I'll try that next time. I don't
| ever really care about the wifi once in a game.
|
| I have the older version so it would have to be through an
| adapter. The OLED model sounds nice but I can't justify the
| price for an upgrade.
| toast0 wrote:
| > Plugging in the controller doesn't seem to fix it.
|
| There's an option in system settings to use wired
| communications; if you don't enable that, plugging it in just
| does charge and play. (OTOH, apparently if you use it in wired
| mode, amiibo scanning is disabled, if that's relevant to you)
| climb_stealth wrote:
| You are a legend! Thank you for mentioning it because I was
| not aware of it. I have enabled it now and will give it a try
| next time.
|
| I was wondering about because there is no indication whether
| wired mode is even used.
| christoph wrote:
| I really can't express how much joy the Switch has given me and
| my family. I loved it when I first got it all those years ago,
| but in the last year I've been replaying lots of games with my
| 4yr old.
|
| Mario Odyssey, Mario 3D world, Yoshi's crafted world, New Super
| Mario Bros., Pac-Man competition edition and recently we blasted
| through Unpacking over a rainy Sunday. We've easily logged
| hundreds of hours together in the last 6 months alone.
|
| Meanwhile the PS4 and Xbox have been sat gathering dust.
|
| There's a few reasons for this IMHO.
|
| 1. There's no bullshit on the Switch. It switches on instantly,
| it sleeps instantly. It rarely wants updates for anything. It's
| so easy to dock and undock for playing in the car on journeys.
| It's totally unobtrusive under the TV. It just fits into our
| family life seamlessly with zero frustrations. Even the
| grandparents enjoy playing it when they come over.
|
| 2. Nintendo games are totally family friendly. We all sit around
| playing together, passing the joypad between us or playing coop
| together. I never have any worries about the games we are playing
| being unsuitable for a 4yr old in anyway. There are no loot
| boxes, unsavoury material, etc. it's just pure fun and
| entertainment. I find my kid has a much greater understanding of
| cause, effect and 3d space than he would do if that time was
| spent tapping away on an iPad screen on some ad ridden, loot box
| infested shovelware. I'm actually amazed how quickly he has
| learnt using the camera stick, but it's probably because Nintendo
| finesse their products to the nth degree.
|
| 3. Nintendo finally opened it up to adult games, so if I do want
| to blast through gore on Doom or Wolfenstein late at night on my
| own, I can. When I do, I just find myself reaching for the Switch
| over the PlayStation or Xbox, which I know will try and demand
| all sorts of updates and downloads before I can play.
| jamesgeck0 wrote:
| Prior Nintendo consoles have some pretty adult stuff on them.
| MadWorld, No More Heroes, House of the Dead: Overkill, Manhunt
| 2, Bayonetta, etc. The Switch is just the first Nintendo
| console in a while that's had great third party support.
| echelon wrote:
| I've got complicated feelings for Nintendo.
|
| As a kid, I was a big outdoors person until I got my SNES as a
| Christmas gift. It set me on a path to becoming a night owl
| software engineer.
|
| I fell in love with Zelda, Donkey Kong Country, Mario RPG, and
| never worked harder to earn enough money to buy an N64. The web
| was just starting to take off, and it was at that point I started
| using the internet to look up cheat codes and make friends to
| talk about games with.
|
| Because of Nintendo I found out there was incredible depth to
| Japanese culture. I learned Japanese, discovered anime and manga.
| Dragon Ball, Cowboy Bebop, Miyazaki, Princess Mononoke,
| tokusatsu, that whole lot. I also learned to build websites to
| share cheat codes (strategywiki.org), and started to engineer
| chat, matchmaking (dsmeet.com), character designer tools, and
| more. I eventually wound up in Japan teaching English for a bit,
| working on code on the side.
|
| Eventually video games lost the magical spell and I preferred to
| spend my time with building and creation. But I don't think any
| of it would have happened, at least not quite the way it did,
| without Nintendo.
|
| But it hurts to see that Nintendo can be real jerks to their
| fans. They force take downs for indie games, ROM hacks, and even
| music. For a long time they vehemently tried to destroy the
| vibrant Smash Melee scene. Contrast this behavior with Sega,
| which actively leans into their fans' excitement and issues
| artistic license for their creations.
|
| Nintendo also doesn't get the broader picture. They consistently
| fail at online gaming and paint themselves into boxes.
|
| Switch was a success, but Wii U was not. Wii was a success, but
| Gamecube and Nintendo 64 undersold. I don't know what they're
| going to do against the juggernaut power of Microsoft and all of
| the studio consolidation. Or how they'll fare with Steam entering
| their lucrative market. They're going to need more successes in
| this crowded market. I hope they continue to innovate. They're
| the Studio Ghibli of the gaming world, and it'd be sad to see
| them go.
|
| I also hope they learn to treat fans better.
| wjamesg wrote:
| Getting back up to speed on this stuff...How are they not
| treating fans as well as they should?
| hi_im_miles wrote:
| Not the person you're responding to, but a recent example
| that caused outrage was Nintendo sending C&Ds to online Melee
| tournament organizers during the pandemic (using emulators
| with mods). I'm sure there's some way in which Nintendo is
| within their legal right to do this though, even if I think
| this behavior is a plague to art and technology.
| iLoveOncall wrote:
| I'd also be mad if Nintendo had turned me into a weeb.
| IX-103 wrote:
| The thing is, these "fans" are not their target demographic, so
| they really don't care.
|
| Nintendo tends to focus on people that play their games for
| fun, and less on people that turn it into a serious hobby or
| try to build it into their personal identity.
| hnthrowaway0315 wrote:
| >and less on people that turn it into a serious hobby or try
| to build it into their personal identity.
|
| Sadly this is almost true for all products out there, just a
| small percentage of exceptions. In software it's more
| tolerant and occasionally encouraged (ID Software's open
| source policy). We are on our own.
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