[HN Gopher] Ask HN: About to turn 30. Any advice on how to deal ...
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Ask HN: About to turn 30. Any advice on how to deal with the
depression?
I feel immense regret for a lot of things that I didn't do in my
20s. Always an academic person, I intentionally sacrificed many
things to make progress in academia, and yet, it didn't always
work. Didn't go to parties; didn't date seriously; didn't enjoy
most of my time; and didn't follow all my interests. I've been a
long time HN reader and I believe in the wisdom of the HN
community. As someone who's still in academia (grad school), what
do you think I should do? I feel like I owe myself a lot, and even
though I'm in a relationship now, I can't stop thinking about the
opportunities that I missed with girls when I was younger. I also
think about dropping out of the PhD program and transitioning to
the industry, maybe because I feel like I'll never be appreciated
in academia and maybe because I feel like I need a new beginning.
Author : behnamoh
Score : 8 points
Date : 2022-01-23 21:56 UTC (1 hours ago)
| willcate wrote:
| You are still quite young, and you have plenty of time to correct
| those aspects of your life in which you feel deficient.
|
| -- 61 yr-old guy
| JSeymourATL wrote:
| Remarkable research by Benjamin Hardy on the impact our
| environment has on the body/mind/spirit.
|
| Rotate your environments-getting out of your rut by literally
| changing your physical surroundings throughout the day or week.
|
| > https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/35604684-willpower-do...
| arez wrote:
| Marry, and you will regret it; don't marry, you will also regret
| it; marry or don't marry, you will regret it either way. Laugh at
| the world's foolishness, you will regret it; weep over it, you
| will regret that too; laugh at the world's foolishness or weep
| over it, you will regret both. Believe a woman, you will regret
| it; believe her not, you will also regret it... Hang yourself,
| you will regret it; do not hang yourself, and you will regret
| that too; hang yourself or don't hang yourself, you'll regret it
| either way; whether you hang yourself or do not hang yourself,
| you will regret both -- Kirkegaard
| AnimalMuppet wrote:
| First, don't feel like you traded serious relationships for
| academia. A lot of younger relationships don't work because the
| people aren't grown up enough. (For me, I had to become less of
| an arrogant jerk. That took a bit of time.) So don't kick
| yourself, looking back and saying "I could have dated..." You
| could have, and you might have enjoyed it, but put your mental
| energy into chasing the relationship you're in now.
|
| In fact, don't look back much. You want to learn from past
| mistakes, sure. But if you've had a car accident, and as you
| drive off you're staring in the rear-view mirror at the accident,
| you're going to have another one, because your attention is on
| the accident, not on your driving. Learn from the past, but put
| most of your attention on what you're doing now.
|
| You sound unfulfilled in academia. It often is unfulfilling. But
| so is working in industry. Fulfillment isn't going to come from
| either of those places; both are ultimately empty. But
| fulfillment _might_ come from your relationship. Don 't sacrifice
| that for either a degree or a job. (Personally, I'd say that even
| a relationship isn't ultimately enough; real fulfillment comes
| from knowing God.)
|
| But you didn't actually say that you were unfulfilled, you said
| that you'd never be _appreciated_. Do you need to be? You are
| unlikely to be, either in academia or in industry. (Again,
| though, you might be in your relationship.)
|
| Oh, and in your title you said "depression". You're in grad
| school. It's _amazing_ how high a percentage of grad students
| suffer from depression - like, 60+%. The depression isn 't
| necessarily telling you that there's something wrong with you, or
| that you don't belong in academia. It's telling you that there's
| something fundamentally wrong with grad school. (Which, if you
| can't change it, may be telling you that academia isn't where you
| should be.)
|
| No real conclusions, just some thoughts that you may or may not
| find useful...
| mettamage wrote:
| Hey, I feel vaguely similar, although on a much milder basis. I
| go from starry eyed to quite a bit of regret and contempt. I am
| not happy with that, and I am working on it, at the same time it
| is what it is. I used to be simply starry eyed.
|
| While I am no therapist, I know a thing or two about sacrifice,
| perhaps less than you, but enough to perhaps have a fun (or
| interesting/stimulating) chat about it.
|
| If you're up for a Google Meet, feel free to email me (see my
| profile).
| thakoppno wrote:
| Go outside more. Exercise to exhaustion. Stop feeding negative
| thought patterns. Have fun.
| deanmoriarty wrote:
| In one year you could revolutionize your life, if you really
| wanted it. Based on your comment this could be a reasonable 12
| months plan:
|
| - Get out of academia
|
| - Get a 6 figure paying job in the industry
|
| - Get out of your current relationship
|
| - Rent a one bedroom apartment in a major city close to work and
| go on binge dating until the feeling of regret will be gone
|
| It is likely that after taking all these steps you'd not be
| feeling depressed anymore, and life would have brought you in
| some interesting places.
|
| I shared similar emotions in regards to dating in my mid 20s
| (specifically my girlfriend at the time had significantly more
| dating experience than me and that made me feel utterly
| inferior), so I did exactly that. I broke up with her, moved from
| the suburbs to a major city, and after casually dating ~50 women
| over the course of the following 4 years, I finally settled with
| my current partner and couldn't be happier, we've been together 5
| years and going strong. On top of that I have fun memories of my
| previous dating phase, which did a lot to boost my self
| confidence and tame any "missed out" feelings.
| coldtea wrote:
| > _I feel like I owe myself a lot, and even though I 'm in a
| relationship now, I can't stop thinking about the opportunities
| that I missed with girls when I was younger._
|
| If you love the someone you're with, you don't care about other
| opportunities. What would be the point? Some special organs that
| another person doesn't have? Keeping score of how many times
| you've got laid?
|
| On the other hand, if you don't love someone, then it doesn't
| really matter if you get other opportunities - they're just empty
| fun for an hour or so but feeling empty afterwards.
|
| Sure, it's cool to be a "player" for a little while in your late
| teens/early 20s, but it gets boring soon, just as the fun with
| alcohol and partying and many other things. Most of the people
| you know that 'did' go to parties and such, are dead bored of
| them at this age.
|
| Also, is all this a real desire - things you really want to do
| today, or merely a response to a fear of having missed out? These
| two cases are not the same.
|
| Lastly, you're just about to turn 30. You are still young, and
| can do anything you like to turn your life around. Heck, even
| someone at 40 or 50 could...
|
| As for "transitioning to the industry" it's probably not a bad
| idea. Modern academia sucks, and unless you've made it somehow,
| it can be even more work and less pay than the industry. Heck,
| people make money even as nomads working remotely (and I'm not
| talking nomads making money by selling the nomad lifestyle: I
| mean people really working remotely from some city in Thailand
| and co, without vlogging about it). Plus, the modern industry (if
| we're talking IT) is hiring...
| grammarnazzzi wrote:
| > If you love the someone you're with, you don't care about
| other opportunities. What would be the point? Some special
| organs that another person doesn't have?
|
| To gain the experience necessary to know when your significant
| other is behaving in ways that are exceptional. Everything is
| normal until then
|
| This is how you develop the emotional intellegence to both
| appeciate them long-term and the wherewithal to deal with
| abuse.
| coldtea wrote:
| You can get that from having and studying regular
| relationships with people, you don't need to f... them too...
| grammarnazzzi wrote:
| Learn from it. Otherwise you're going to experience these same
| regrets when you're about to turn 40, 50, 60, 70, ...
|
| Figure out your goals/principles/mission today. Then make that
| happen now.
|
| There's never going to be a right time to do anything other than
| now. Because you're never going to be any younger.
| caffeine wrote:
| > I also think about dropping out of the PhD program and
| transitioning to the industry
|
| Yes, do this. It's a good start towards being happier. Academia
| is largely thankless BS and if you don't already love it then you
| probably won't ever.
|
| Get yourself healthy, paid, entertained, etc. first - before you
| start running around trying to change the world and do meaningful
| stuff.
|
| You won't be of much use to anyone else until you've got yourself
| squared away.
| thanatos519 wrote:
| I think you should do LSD.
|
| "It is never too late to be what you might have been." -- George
| Eliot
| throwawaynay wrote:
| Came here to say this. Or another psychedelic like ketamine or
| shrooms.
|
| Tripping once or twice every 1-3 months had a huge impact on my
| wellbeing, it completely changed my perspective on a lot of
| stuff and made me better in a lot of ways.
|
| I was doing LSD pretty regularly before the pandemic and it was
| honestly the best period of my life, then I'll admit it really
| went downhill after the lockdowns.
|
| But it can really help assuming that a global catastrophe
| doesn't get in the way (again).
| bagacrap wrote:
| how did the pandemic interfere with your lad routine
| rdtwo wrote:
| Quit academia, it's a black hole that will consume you and never
| reward you. Industry pays better and gives you more options. You
| are wasting 100s of thousand in opportunity costs by staying. You
| probably won't discover anything great and even if you do you
| won't get anything for it. Use your talent to make money use your
| money to live life.
| schoudha wrote:
| You're 30, you have your whole life ahead of you and you greatest
| achievements are likely going to come from work you haven't even
| thought of yet.
|
| Identify what you truly enjoy, people you like to be with and set
| goals you want to aspire to. Make sure you spend your next 10
| years focused on those things.
| antman wrote:
| You are setting your expectations on marketed social norms which
| are pretty much meaningless. Who cares if you didn't go to
| parties? Being mature earlier is a bliss not a curse. Anyway
| check these out and good luck:
|
| https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLG1WzYaHQeh6LV3eFcdxR...
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mdKM8n7mwq0&list=PLG1WzYaHQe...
| leoh wrote:
| > You are setting your expectations on marketed social norms
| which are pretty much meaningless.
|
| Maybe OP is trying to say they had a need for freedom and joy,
| which I do not doubt OP did not experience. Are those needs
| merely marketed social norms?
| syntheweave wrote:
| It's a norms vs needs distinction.
|
| When you're a baby you don't even know that you have to sleep
| to not feel tired, or eat to not feel hungry. You learn
| pretty quickly but at first you're just always upset that you
| feel these things and cry about it, so your parents(if they
| are any good) will try to normalize bedtimes and mealtimes to
| speed along the concept.
|
| It's not exactly different for the twenty-something going on
| thirty, just so much more complex that the presented norms
| never really fit anyone. Things like what ideas are worth
| studying, what to look for in a relationship, what the "good
| life" is - those are quite subtle concepts.
| coldtea wrote:
| Yes, even "freedom and joy" are marketed social norms.
| Especially in the form mentioned by the OP, and in the modern
| environment, where the imperative is to "have fun" and be
| like the people in aspirational ads.
| mkl95 wrote:
| > I also think about dropping out of the PhD program and
| transitioning to the industry, maybe because I feel like I'll
| never be appreciated in academia and maybe because I feel like I
| need a new beginning.
|
| In my years in the industry, I have worked with several people
| who had finished their PhDs. Their PhD was only useful for one of
| them in one occasion, when our employer needed someone with a PhD
| to receive some state grant. Other than that, we solve the same
| problems with similar degrees of success. The only difference is
| that they are significantly older.
| gtsop wrote:
| Answering the question in the title is hard for me, but I can
| give you a side tip on this:
|
| > I feel immense regret for a lot of things that I didn't do in
| my 20s.
|
| First, it is natural to feel this way. It means you appreciate
| yourself and your time. Now, the past is past. No matter how much
| you think about what you did or didn't do, nothing will change
| your "lost time". The only thing you can change is your future,
| try to make better decissions using the wisdom you have gained.
|
| Finally, if you fail to make the most out of your years to come,
| don't beat yourself. Failure is the basis for success. We all
| fail and we use the failures to succeed further down the road.
|
| Also, keep a few close friends near you and love them :)
| digisign wrote:
| The number thirty seems like a big deal at the time. In hindsight
| it was a minor speedbump not much different than any other
| birthday. Thirties can be one of the most enjoyable times in
| life, with an open mind.
| theodric wrote:
| 39.5 here: you're young. You might not believe it, but you
| actually are. Plenty of time to course-correct or even start
| over. Rather than finding coping mechanisms for the crippling
| depression of having arrived at an advanced age without
| accomplishment, go fix what you see as the problem(s) while
| you're still young enough to benefit maximally from the
| improvement.
| djenendik wrote:
| Don't beat yourself up. You can take a leave of absence or
| internship before completely dropping out. Take some time to try
| those things you think you missed out on. If after that, you may
| or may notfeel like returning to grad school. Some decisions take
| time and space to make.
| bagacrap wrote:
| dating got a lot more successful for me after I turned 30 so
| don't feel bad about missing out. Rather, start focusing on it
| now because you have some leveling up to do.
| ramoz wrote:
| I turn 30 in the summer. I feel immense regret for reasons I
| can't really explain. I've been in the military (I felt like I
| belonged in the military more than any other place in life), I've
| had great jobs, made a lot of money, own a condo, am as "set" as
| I possibly could be at current job, have the ability to jump to
| other jobs.
|
| Relationships haven't been great, but also never really a problem
| or something I've overly desired. I do value some really close
| friends I've made through dating.
|
| I don't feel free.
| ScottBurson wrote:
| Freedom comes from within. Sure, external forces can take it
| away. But even if you're not externally constrained, you can be
| internally so.
|
| The military, I've heard, tries to instill in you a sense of
| duty. Perhaps you need to let go of that. Handle your
| legitimate responsibilities, of course, but don't let other
| people dump duties on you -- including your parents and others
| in your past. Get in touch with what _you_ want in life.
| rdtwo wrote:
| If you live in the USA you probably never will be. Without a
| social safety net you are never free to explore and fail
| because it's a long way down and the fall will maim you if it
| doesn't kill.
| syntheweave wrote:
| Industry is not a bad idea. But most crucially, the thing you
| feel is an identity slipping away. Academia has priesthoods, and
| so does industry. When you fall out of the fold, it can be a hard
| crash. People who can't find a fit tend towards taking odd jobs
| or a van down by the river. That's the real thing driving
| discontent at 30 - "I'm not making it, maybe I'm all washed up."
| But you are most likely done with priesthoods. Your second act
| looks different from your first.
|
| Studying something of genuine interest is a crucial first step.
| It may be apparently trivial, in which case you call it "art". It
| may be of obvious import, and then it is "philosophy". The thing
| you study and the thing that brings in money may coincide, and
| that will make for a contented life for a time. But there will be
| little public indication that you might be succeeding at the
| personal journey. You must create your own rubrics and principles
| of operation.
| [deleted]
| olegious wrote:
| Some may say I "wasted" my 20s- changing majors, dropping out of
| school, going back, trying 3 different careers, multiple
| countries. When I turned 30, I was in deep debt (student loans +
| credit cards), a year or so into my 4th career and a few years
| into a marriage that I couldn't admit wasn't going to work out.
| Some of my friends were years into their careers, financially
| successful, some already had kids, I felt like I was woefully
| behind and would never catch up.
|
| Fast forward and by my late 30s I'm debt free, make more money
| that I ever imagined, in a wonderful 2nd marriage, my 4th career
| turned out to be perfect for me and everything is on track. A lot
| can change in a few years, if things are not working now, doesn't
| mean they won't work in the future. Explore, learn about yourself
| and others, take calculated risks and keep going.
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(page generated 2022-01-23 23:01 UTC)