[HN Gopher] Zendesk pretends to be open source?
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Zendesk pretends to be open source?
Author : tailspin2019
Score : 111 points
Date : 2022-01-14 22:00 UTC (1 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.zendesk.co.uk)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.zendesk.co.uk)
| firloop wrote:
| > Zendesk is an open API ticket system which means third-party
| developers can build new integrations on our platform
|
| Clever segue from "open source", to open.
| gregd wrote:
| Um providing an API endpoint to a closed, proprietary system,
| does not make one open source.
| franciscop wrote:
| Yes, they are pretending to be open source for SEO purposes and
| that is not okay. They do get the definition of OSS right:
|
| > "Open source support ticket systems are unique in that anyone
| is free to inspect, modify, and enhance the underlying code
| that's used to build the ticketing system."
|
| But then somehow they include Zendesk in the "Top 10 open source
| helpdesk ticketing systems". Can I see the code used to build
| Zendesk? Obviously not. Now suddenly the definition of Zendesk is
| this, which is different from the Open Source definition they
| themselves quoted:
|
| > Zendesk is an open API ticket system which means third-party
| developers can build new integrations on our platform. Unlike
| other open source ticketing systems, Zendesk software offers all
| the advantages of open source ticketing without your team having
| to build a system from scratch. Zendesk's open API ticketing
| system software gives your team all the tools they need to build
| as much--or as little--as they want.
|
| Open API !== Open Source ticket system
|
| PS, archived:
|
| https://web.archive.org/save/https://www.zendesk.co.uk/help-...
| tailspin2019 wrote:
| From this page:
|
| > Top 10 open source helpdesk ticketing systems
|
| > 1. Zendesk
|
| > 2. etc
|
| Followed by:
|
| > Zendesk is an open API ticket system which means third-party
| developers can build new integrations on our platform. Unlike
| other open source ticketing systems, Zendesk software offers all
| the advantages of open source ticketing without your team having
| to build a system from scratch.
|
| And at the top:
|
| > Best Open Source Ticketing System
|
| > Open source help desk for a smarter, more agile customer
| service operation.
|
| > Start free trial
|
| EDIT: Here's some _actual_ open source help desk software. Anyone
| got any further recommendations?
|
| https://github.com/awesome-selfhosted/awesome-selfhosted#tic...
| capableweb wrote:
| Zendesk seems to have their own definition of what "open source"
| means, contrary to everyone else:
|
| > An open source ticketing system is software that service teams
| use to document customer issues. The system helps these teams
| correctly route, resolve, and track all their customers' problems
| and requests.
|
| But then go on to state:
|
| > Open source support ticket systems are unique in that anyone is
| free to inspect, modify, and enhance the underlying code that's
| used to build the ticketing system. [including a link to
| https://opensource.com/resources/what-open-source]
|
| I'm interested to see where I can "inspect, modify, and enhance
| the underlying code" for Zendesk? I've used it sometimes in the
| past, but never seen any of the underlying code for it.
|
| Edit: seems to contradict themselves a couple of more times in
| the article too. Here is another passage under "Cons of an open
| source help desk ticketing system":
|
| > With a help desk like Zendesk's, all it takes is a plan upgrade
| to access a whole bevy of new features. But with fully open
| source systems, modifying the code can take multiple days--or
| weeks if your developers are busy.
|
| Seems they are saying here that Zendesk is not a "fully open
| source system", judging by that?
|
| More:
|
| > [...] if you have a strong development team ready to go, an
| open source ticket system could be for you.
|
| > On the other hand, if you have a lean team, or if you want a
| full feature set that's ready to go, Zendesk is your best option.
| mataug wrote:
| I'm sure its "open source" to employees at Zendesk
| ericlamb89 wrote:
| My team uses zendesk and they don't hate it, but this is enough
| to make me consider the other options on their "top 10" list.
| xerxes901 wrote:
| Heh, yeah this doesn't look like it makes a lot of sense... I'll
| go shake a few trees internally and point this out.
| monodot wrote:
| They're not the only company to do this. "InVideo" (a totally not
| open source SaaS product) also does the same.
| merrvk wrote:
| When the marketing team has a bit too much free-reign
| MangoCoffee wrote:
| the decision makers probably doesn't even know what open source
| really mean.
|
| they read it on cio magazine and ZenDesk have "open source"
| api.
| howdydoo wrote:
| When a company lies in their advertising, typically you can take
| them to court and get relief.
|
| If a car dealer advertises "free floormat with purchase", and
| they don't give you a floormat, you sue them. If it makes it all
| the way to the courtroom, it's an open-and-shut case.
|
| Based on this advertising, I bet someone with the right lawyer
| could compel ZenDesk to release their source. In fact I hope this
| happens, then maybe companies will think twice before making
| false claims like this
| chrisseaton wrote:
| > Based on this advertising, I bet someone with the right
| lawyer could compel ZenDesk to release their source.
|
| That's not even remotely how the law works.
| hda2 wrote:
| It should be, and I'd argue how it used to be.
| howdydoo wrote:
| A random outsider couldn't do it obviously. But imagine if
| you had standing to sue, i.e. you signed up and paid for
| ZenDesk based on this advertising, and then later realized
| they were lying.
| kube-system wrote:
| In that case, the plaintiff would sue for the damage caused
| by the lie, which would include the amount paid for the
| software.
|
| The only case in which you might get the source code as a
| result is if you _paid_ for the source code. Which is the
| complete opposite claim of what is being made on this page.
| howdydoo wrote:
| Yeah, you're probably right. But a guy can dream, can't
| he?
|
| https://archive.is/0Oihx
| chrisseaton wrote:
| Talk me through how that gets to a court order to release
| source code. What legislation or precedents are there for
| that? If there aren't any, how would a judge arrive at that
| decision?
| t0mas88 wrote:
| Not at all. You can make them stop saying they're open source
| and you can get a refund + maybe some damages if you claim to
| have bought their product based on this false ad, but that's
| all. In no way are you ever going to convince a judge to order
| Zendesk to give you their code.
| mrits wrote:
| Reminds me how Comodo said they open sourced their EDR but in
| reality it is just some code thrown around commercial libraries
| and github comments about no one able to get it to compile.
| Moto7451 wrote:
| Based on the URL structure and the content I will venture a guess
| that this is SEO keyword driven content. They likely have a list
| of top keywords they're looking to rank well on and this is one
| such keyword.
| tailspin2019 wrote:
| Yep. But IMHO the content of the page seems pretty deliberately
| written to be misleading.
|
| I spent a good 10 minutes trying to understand what I was
| reading here.
| manquer wrote:
| I think SEO content is just code word is for misleading
| deliberately, it is either misleading the search engines or
| the users or both.
| riantogo wrote:
| Somewhat related, last time when I posted about my forums
| platform[1] that I'm trying to get off the ground, someone here
| asked if it is open source so they can contribute. Now, I would
| love for it to be open source and have the community enhance the
| features (or even clone it for themselves), but I don't know how
| to set up an open source project. I'm guessing it is more than
| just zipping up the source files and making it available for
| download. Any pointers on how best to go about doing it? Any best
| practices?
|
| [1] https://discoflip.com
| lkschubert8 wrote:
| Do you use any version control management system like git, svn,
| or fossil? If not, your first step would likely setting up your
| project with one of them (most likely git) and then just
| pushing it to a service like github.
| E39M5S62 wrote:
| Put your software in a VCS of some kind. Add an appropriate
| license from https://spdx.org/licenses/ . Make the source
| available on the internet.
|
| Most people do this all via GitHub, GitLab, etc.
| songzme wrote:
| you could start by creating a repository on github and gitlab,
| they have resources to help you track your source code with git
| and push your code to your repository. Then now you code is
| available for everyone to see.
|
| Next, you want to create a readme file so someone new to your
| project could read it and understand how the code works. You
| can also start creating issues of features / bugs you plan to
| do.
| rplnt wrote:
| Is this post another SEO attempt to make them rank higher in OSS
| ticketing systems?
| jasonhansel wrote:
| This is the sort of article you expect to find on a "best
| reviews" website full of Amazon affiliate links.
|
| edit: As intended, when you Google "best open source helpdesk
| 2021," Google now just shows the following excerpt:
|
| > Top 10 open source helpdesk ticketing systems
|
| > * Zendesk.
|
| > * FreeScout.
|
| > * osTicket.
|
| > [...]
| ocdtrekkie wrote:
| And _this_ after the edit is the main purpose here. Tricking
| Knowledge Graph into regurgitating bad info, and then claiming
| that their site never states Zendesk is open source, and Google
| just misunderstood.
| jasonhansel wrote:
| Time to write an article "Top 5 Best SEO Strategies 2022"
| with the following list:
|
| 1. Lie to people
|
| 2. Get Google to lie for you
|
| 3. Maintain plausible deniability
|
| 4. Hope nobody notices
|
| 5. Offer token apologies if you get caught
| xnx wrote:
| Thanks for pointing this out. I just used the Feedback link in
| that Google search result page to specify that Zendesk is not
| open source. If enough people do this, it will completely
| negate (or even penalize?) Zendesk's misleading marketing
| attempt.
| jrm4 wrote:
| So cliche, but nonetheless true:
|
| Stallman was right.
| n0n0n4t0r wrote:
| And they didn't even include iTop! I guess the revamp of the 3.0
| afraid them this much!
|
| Disclaimer: I contributed to iTop, but I seriously consider it as
| a better solution than Zendesk, especially since it is more
| customizable and has an integrated cmdb.
| harunurhan wrote:
| I bumped into this just yesterday, it's sad that the page ranks
| very high for "open source ticketing" :(
| tentacleuno wrote:
| I'm not really surprised. Personally, I tend to avoid these
| 'comparisons' from websites that are somehow biased in promoting
| their own solutions, e.g. I wouldn't go to a website selling a
| text editor to find out the best text editors.
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(page generated 2022-01-14 23:00 UTC)