[HN Gopher] Animated Drawings
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       Animated Drawings
        
       Author : newswasboring
       Score  : 115 points
       Date   : 2021-12-21 08:55 UTC (14 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (sketch.metademolab.com)
 (TXT) w3m dump (sketch.metademolab.com)
        
       | wtf77 wrote:
       | Cannot adjust the points by draggin them in firefox and safari.
       | Am I the only one?
        
         | gppk wrote:
         | No, only works in Chrome
        
           | zufallsheld wrote:
           | Works for me in Firefox mobile.
        
       | p2hari wrote:
       | wow, simply awesome. I had a drawing on a book with lines, but
       | still managed to get it working.
        
       | thunderbong wrote:
       | What a fantastic idea! Wonderful!
        
       | avian wrote:
       | Previous thread on HN (40 comments):
       | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29580619
        
       | hsnice16 wrote:
       | Great work done!
        
       | blagie wrote:
       | It'd be nice if there were clear ToS about what rights the child
       | has to derivative works automatically created from their drawing.
       | 
       | Can a child draw something and use this to animate it for a
       | Youtube video?
        
         | avian wrote:
         | I don't see how Facebook could claim copyright over the created
         | animations and restrict what you could do with them. The
         | language of the terms of service even acknowledges that ("
         | _you_ grant Facebook ... license to reproduce ... derivative
         | works).
         | 
         | The basic element of copyright is some level of creative input.
         | Mass, automated transformative processes without human input
         | traditionally don't count as creative (e.g. compiling source
         | code with a compiler usually doesn't mean that compiler authors
         | get copyright over the binary as a derived work).
         | 
         | AI is recently being presented as kind of a gray area where if
         | you remove the inputs far enough from the outputs with huge,
         | incomprehensible machine learning models the outputs count as
         | original works, even when provenance is sometimes clear in the
         | end (e.g. see the whole debate about GitHub Copilot
         | regurgitating well-known pieces of code). I suspect that's
         | mostly the big tech companies lobbying and pushing for this re-
         | interpretation of copyright.
        
           | blagie wrote:
           | I'm aware of that. Most kids and parents won't be.
           | 
           | This is a case which is legally complex. The result here
           | combines Meta's work with the child's work. A lot of the
           | legal test might hinge on things such as the extent to which
           | the gaits (jumping, dancing, etc.) are creative works created
           | by Meta versus automated transformations. I suspect a court
           | decision would hinge on the judge, and perhaps what the judge
           | ate that morning.
           | 
           | But, for the sake of argument, let's assume you're right, and
           | remixing outputs is 100% legal.
           | 
           | Families won't know that. For families to know that, they'd
           | need a legal analysis from a lawyer. Families won't pay for
           | that so their kid can make a Youtube video.
           | 
           | If you're making the world's ultimate video skit, do you want
           | to make it without knowing what you're allowed to do with it?
           | 
           | The problem with legal complexity is simply that people don't
           | do things.
           | 
           | A nice license, being explicit about what you can and can't
           | do resolves that.
           | 
           | License text is also a social contract. A compiler maker
           | might not have copyright over the output, but if they don't
           | want me using their tool for something, I might respect that
           | out of politeness. Or I might choose to pick a fight if I
           | think they're being unreasonable and it will help others. It
           | depends on the context. Signalling intentions is helpful as
           | well.
        
             | dls2016 wrote:
             | There are thousands of tools out there for automating
             | tedious parts of animation or drawing or video editing or
             | audio production...
             | 
             | Where is the complexity?
             | 
             | For instance ReCycle was a tool written in the 90s for
             | chopping up a sampled beat (waveform) to allow easy re-
             | arranging. (Now the company makes Reason.)
        
               | blagie wrote:
               | I'll oversimplify video production to make the point, but
               | let's say I'm making a video where a Bob runs up to
               | Alice, makes a snide comment, Alice makes a clever
               | comeback, and Bob slinks away in shame. There are a few
               | creative parts to this:
               | 
               | 1) Writing the script.
               | 
               | 2) Designing the visual look of Bob and Alice.
               | 
               | 3) Designing the animation (e.g. animating the body
               | language of "slinking").
               | 
               | Those are all creative contributions. A tool like this
               | one converts an image into bones, which I don't think has
               | a creative element. It also has a bunch of pre-baked
               | animations of those bones, which are neat, and do have a
               | creative element.
               | 
               | Is that enough? I don't know.
               | 
               | Let's take this to an extreme. In the early '00s, there
               | was a popular video (an early meme) of a pair of stick
               | figures having a rather fancy fight. Most of the work was
               | in the rather comedic body language. If I replaced those
               | stick figures with something my child drew, it'd still be
               | /mostly/ the original work. Simply replacing a stick
               | figure with a child's drawing doesn't change the
               | underlying work. Even if I took a little clip, say a
               | neat-looking jump turning kick, I couldn't take that
               | without permission.
               | 
               | There's a line somewhere in there, and I'm not quite sure
               | where it is. I don't think anyone really knows until
               | there's case law.
        
               | dls2016 wrote:
               | And, to me, creating bones of a character seems a lot
               | like extracting individual hits of a beat. Both allow you
               | to easily re-arrange the original creation. (Let's assume
               | that you own the copyright to the underlying recording in
               | the ReCycle situation, so as to avoid a discussion of the
               | legal implications of sampling music.)
               | 
               | I'm sure if I dug into a professional animation
               | application, I could find a dozen more analogous tools.
               | 
               | I don't see where the legal complexity is. Not that I'm a
               | lawyer, but I can't think of a single case where a tool
               | to automate artistic tedium resulted in some transfer of
               | copyright.
        
               | blagie wrote:
               | > And, to me, creating bones of a character seems a lot
               | like extracting individual hits of a beat.
               | 
               | I agree.
               | 
               | > (Let's assume that you own the copyright to the
               | underlying recording in the ReCycle situation, so as to
               | avoid a discussion of the legal implications of sampling
               | music.)
               | 
               | And this assumption isn't valid, and it's precisely where
               | the complexity comes in. The tool doesn't just create
               | bones. It has a bunch of rather nice gaits which
               | presumably a human artist designed to be nice to look at:
               | 
               | - 8 dancing movements
               | 
               | - 8 funny movements
               | 
               | - 7 jumping movements
               | 
               | - 9 walking movements
               | 
               | I think those are analogous to the samples you're using
               | in your example. If the sample is a generic recording of
               | a piano, that's one thing. If it's Justin Bieber saying
               | "Stay," that's another thing.
        
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       (page generated 2021-12-21 23:02 UTC)