[HN Gopher] The Jami conferencing system
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       The Jami conferencing system
        
       Author : zaik
       Score  : 79 points
       Date   : 2021-12-03 09:57 UTC (13 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (jami.net)
 (TXT) w3m dump (jami.net)
        
       | smallerfish wrote:
       | Jami's SIP integration is pretty good - I use it with voip.ms.
       | They have an unfortunate relationship with Ubuntu, and only
       | really take bug reports against snap or PPA builds. Does the job
       | well enough though that I ditched my yealink.
        
       | throw0101a wrote:
       | When the pandemic started I remember Jitsi being talked about a
       | bit as well (as an alternative to Zoom, which had all sorts of
       | controversial issues when it suddenly became 'big'):
       | 
       | * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jitsi
       | 
       | Some discussions that I found with a quick search:
       | 
       | * https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22669968
       | 
       | * https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22477785
        
       | heyoni wrote:
       | Am I reading that correctly or is it saying you can unmute people
       | on the call? That should never be able to happen. A moderator
       | should be able to mute people but never unmute them.
        
         | benji-york wrote:
         | I'm torn on this one. It is especially an issue when people
         | join via phone they may not even know how to unmute themselves
         | if e.g., the moderator had to mute them because of some
         | background noise.
        
         | amarok1412 wrote:
         | There is two level of muted. local mute and moderator mute. If
         | somebody is muted locally it can't be unmuted
        
           | heyoni wrote:
           | That's clever but maybe too clever? I guess it could work for
           | users who dialed in if maybe there was voice feedback to say
           | "you are muted" or "you are unmuted". I'm not sure I have a
           | great solution for it but it sounds like it could lead to
           | users thinking they're muted and continuing on in a private
           | conversation.
        
             | amarok1412 wrote:
             | there is a label shown and a red icon on the participant
             | with the mic crossed
        
               | heyoni wrote:
               | Sure, but if I see that and start a conversation with my
               | wife or I don't know, turn on the news and someone
               | unmutes me, and I'm walking around the house with
               | headphones on then I wouldn't see that.
        
               | bandali wrote:
               | The moderator and local mute/unmute are separate. If you
               | mute yourself locally, no one else can unmute you.
               | Similarly, if a moderator mutes you, you locally unmuting
               | yourself wouldn't override that either.
        
           | a2tech wrote:
           | Thats a great feature and something I've wished for
           | constantly as someone who often moderates zoom meetings
        
       | Nextgrid wrote:
       | I just had a look at Jami now and I have to say they did a lot of
       | things right when it comes to user experience which you don't
       | typically see in open-source (and especially not in most GNU
       | projects).
       | 
       | Going to their main website clearly gives you a "download" call
       | to action with your current platform's logo implying it's
       | available for your platform, and below the fold offers links to a
       | broad selection of other platforms. It also happily supports
       | mainstream proprietary platforms instead of insisting you should
       | use Linux.
       | 
       | There is a focus on user-facing features and functionality,
       | instead of focusing all on how free/libre or decentralized it is
       | or some minor technical detail. These are good, but unless your
       | software actually solves the user's problem, freedom or
       | technicalities don't matter because they simply won't use it. I
       | feel that a lot of decentralized social projects fall into this
       | trap.
       | 
       | The website and UI of the clients (at least MacOS & iOS one -
       | haven't tried the others) is also good enough. There could be
       | some minor improvements to be made here and there (and obviously
       | design is subjective), but overall it's a friendly, inviting
       | design and color scheme.
       | 
       | I have to give them props for this, it's unfortunately not common
       | in FOSS projects, but if there's a place I definitely didn't
       | expect this it would be GNU.
        
       | messo wrote:
       | Jami has improved alot the last few years, and now I do also use
       | it for my business SIP account. I will test out the new
       | conferencing features with family soon, Zoom and Skype has never
       | worked well for us.
        
         | unixhero wrote:
         | MS Teams is the best way. Worth the dollars.
        
           | number6 wrote:
           | Yes, it works well enough; but it's sometimes a pain, but not
           | enough to move away
        
           | hulitu wrote:
           | Teams is a usability disaster. I have to restart it a couple
           | of times a day because it will not show the people list when
           | i press the chat button. Aparently i shall not use a laptop
           | screen to access Teams.
        
             | unixhero wrote:
             | Nah. It isn't. We use it with 5000 users. Stable stuff.
             | Productive.
             | 
             | EDIT: Not trolling. I just care about having functionality
             | that works, not necessarily speed.
        
               | heyoni wrote:
               | This is 100% trolling, right? Teams is so painfully slow
               | and inefficient compared to almost everything out there.
        
               | hulitu wrote:
               | Yes, very productive. My favourite is when i'm in a
               | meeting and somebody is sharing his screen. MS thought is
               | a good idea to throw a toolbar at the top of the screen
               | and some meeting participants icons (big) on the right.
               | This eats around 33% of screen space (i'm being generous
               | here). To be able to see something i need to go in the
               | menu and select full screen. This will make some space on
               | top. Now i need also to go in the menu and select focus
               | and now i have an image which is approx 85% of the
               | screen. The issue is that sometimes the lower part of
               | this image is cropped with no possibility to scroll
               | (scrollbars are so last centuury). Of course i can scale
               | the image till it fits the screen (ehich will scale also
               | the programm) but then it is not readable anymore. I
               | guess some things are just hard.
        
               | therealidiot wrote:
               | Well I use it daily and I can't even scroll up through
               | chat history without it getting totally janky. The search
               | basically doesn't work, I routinely have to restart it
               | and often text shortcuts (like Ctrl+A to select all) just
               | stop working completely.
               | 
               | It's not stable at all. Audio calls are generally okay,
               | but often screen sharing just doesn't seem to come
               | through either.
        
           | rexreed wrote:
           | Microsoft really screwed up not taking advantage of its Skype
           | acquisition and furthering the technology that Skype had a
           | large and early lead at. In my opinion, MS Teams is in many
           | ways comparably worse, not that Skype was ever a
           | technological darling. Regardless, on my Mac laptop, Teams is
           | incredibly slow, difficult to use, and has all sorts of
           | challenges with screen share. Might be my setup, but I simply
           | don't have those issues with other conferencing apps.
        
           | infl8ed wrote:
           | MS Teams has a free version now.
        
             | jsilence wrote:
             | Free as in free beer. There is a difference.
        
       | hardwaresofton wrote:
       | Anyone have some thoughts on Jami vs Jitsi? They're both pretty
       | robust software at this point but there's not enough information
       | out there on the edges of each relative to the other.
        
         | rhn_mk1 wrote:
         | Jami doesn't need a web browser, and doesn't need someone to
         | set up a server, AFAIK.
        
         | aorth wrote:
         | Jami has native GTK/QT clients in my distro's (Arch) official
         | repositories. Jitsi has an Electron desktop application that
         | exists in the community-maintained repository (AUR). I haven't
         | used either of them and my experience with Jitsi has been
         | solely limited to the browser client. I'm going to try them
         | now.
        
           | hardwaresofton wrote:
           | Same here -- I use Jitsi to have meetings with friends
           | sometimes (fun fact you can just go to
           | https://meet.jit.si/<any random string here>), and the web
           | app has gotten a _lot_ better over the years (it was never
           | "bad" IMO).
           | 
           | I am not sold on the necessity of GTK/QT clients over
           | Electron applications -- I think the development/packaging
           | ease of Electron is exactly why it's where it is today and
           | what works for users generally is not wins so I view it with
           | dispassion. Doesn't matter how much better GTK/QT is (they
           | can't be that good, devs are choosing to "shoot themselves in
           | the foot" with Electron just over there!). Also the nice
           | thing about web is that phones will at least have a chance
           | (even if overheating during the call).
           | 
           | I was more wondering about what it took to run -- Jitsi's
           | server requirements always seemed a bit too heavy weight --
           | it requires like 4 things to run. That said, I just took
           | another look at the documentation[0] and it's pretty well
           | written... Maybe it's time to roll my sleeves up.
           | 
           | [EDIT] Did not know Etherpad[1] (one of the things that jitsi
           | wants you to host along with it) has video capabilities...
           | 
           | We are really spoiled for good F/OSS software these days --
           | it's insane how much good software there is out there now.
           | 
           | [0]: https://jitsi.github.io/handbook/docs/devops-
           | guide/devops-gu...
           | 
           | [1]: https://github.com/ether/etherpad-lite
        
       | rexreed wrote:
       | I'm looking for some video of example conferences to see what the
       | quality and experience is like. Curiously hard to find something
       | on YouTube with people demoing their Jami video conferences.
        
       | dalmo3 wrote:
       | Jami is great. You can create users in seconds, have multiple
       | users active simultaneously in the same client, make them call
       | each other and have a big video conference with all your alter
       | egos. 10/10 if you don't have friends.
        
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       (page generated 2021-12-03 23:02 UTC)