[HN Gopher] Nearly two-thirds of Gen Z think they'll become cryp...
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Nearly two-thirds of Gen Z think they'll become crypto millionaires
Author : oblib
Score : 65 points
Date : 2021-11-25 18:18 UTC (4 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (fortune.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (fortune.com)
| notcoolbezos wrote:
| hell no, i think i'll be a crypto billionaire
|
| edit: added crypto
| sergiomattei wrote:
| Anecdotal evidence, but most Gen Z folks I know (I'm Gen Z)
| either don't know how to use crypto or think it's a scam similar
| to Forex.
|
| I'm wondering about the audience they surveyed.
| thebean11 wrote:
| Confused by your forex comment..do gen z folks know what that
| is? It's not a scam..
| sergiomattei wrote:
| There's a whole scam artist community around it.
| didon15 wrote:
| Just as there is with the us stock market and penny stocks.
| bradleyjg wrote:
| Within a rounding error, retail forex trading is a scam.
| rsynnott wrote:
| Forex _trading_, as promoted to normal people, is often very,
| very scammy. Obviously foreign exchange, in itself, isn't.
| hardlianotion wrote:
| As practiced by the majority of established banks in the UK,
| it is.
| rchaud wrote:
| Some probably also thought they'd be Youtube stars or Spotify
| gods. But they won't. And they're slowly learning that.
|
| Investing of any kind is a winner-take-all game. Crypto
| especially so. Those who already had money to come in early will
| make the bulk of the future gains.
|
| All that the young people they really have is the community
| around crypto, and perhaps the ability to mutually lament their
| lot in life.
| jackhalford wrote:
| > Some probably also thought they'd be Youtube stars or Spotify
| gods. But they won't. And they're slowly learning that.
|
| Isn't this a line out of Fight Club?
|
| edit: found it [1], I like this quote.
|
| 1: https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/33533-we-ve-all-been-
| raised...
| rchaud wrote:
| Indeed it is. Plus ca change...
| focusgroup0 wrote:
| assuming we keep getting stimmy checks, it's likely we'll all
| soon be millionaires
| poulsbohemian wrote:
| The other third thinks they will get rich as influencers...
|
| Seriously, it's hard being a parent of this generation and trying
| to get them to understand how much of what they are consuming is
| an illusion.
| monocasa wrote:
| I think a lot of gen z see the traditional route as just as
| much of an illusion, and at least crypto and influencers are
| exciting.
| tlear wrote:
| With how the inflation is going they might be right
| jrm4 wrote:
| No, seriously, this. I'll say this, I don't know what's going
| to happen. No clue at all. But it feels like NOT putting
| SOMETHING in, at least enough to stave off future ROMO would be
| stupid.
| bhouston wrote:
| If you hold assets of most type you are protected against
| inflation, it doesn't have to be crypto.
|
| But avoid long-term bonds and cash -- those get destroy in
| times of inflation.
| hereme888 wrote:
| Sad to see your comment greyed out. What you said makes
| sense.
|
| All major banks and lots of hedge funds are investing in it
| for a reason. Softbank invested $92MM in a crypto video game
| (The Sand).... These people aren't stupid investors.
| jakemauer wrote:
| Are we talking about the same smart investors at Softbank
| that invested heavily in WeWork?
| nradov wrote:
| Well they might eventually be right! If the US dollar collapses
| in a couple decades due to continued irresponsible levels of
| fiscal stimulus then _everyone_ will be a millionaire. Of course
| at that point it will take a million dollars to buy a loaf of
| bread.
| llimos wrote:
| This is an absolutely brilliant comment and one I am definitely
| keeping in my back pocket for future debates on the subject!
| wesleywt wrote:
| Exactly the type of nonsense HN loves to read.
| wcoenen wrote:
| The title seems to be a misquote, or at least a misleading
| interpretation from the survey results. Note how in the actual
| source[1] it's not specifically about Gen Z. It also says they
| believe they "could", not "will" become millionaires from crypto.
| It says nothing about the probability. "Could" I win the lottery
| tomorrow? Sure, yes. But I won't.
|
| > _31% of U.S. Adults believe they can become millionaires off
| crypto investments, driven heavily by young adults. 59% of Gen Z
| and 46% of Millennials believe they could become millionaires
| from crypto investments._
|
| [1] https://engine-insights.com/blog/the-pulse-of-the-
| american-c...
| taurath wrote:
| At any given social gathering among even non tech people I know,
| there's always a side conversation happening about crypto. It's
| the same people who go spend too much at casinos, or are only
| talking about the next business venture. It's a bit of an
| obsession.
|
| Another extremely frequent conversation is over the impossibility
| of owning a home on not-tech salaries. I think they're related.
| People don't think they can really reach goals related to life
| stability unless they win some sort of lottery. To me this is
| really worrying, not because it's wrong but because for many it's
| right. A slightly higher than median salary used to mean one is
| in the middle class. A whole generation doesn't believe they have
| any opportunities.
| pdog wrote:
| _> People don't think they can really reach goals related to
| life stability unless they win some sort of lottery._
|
| People think this because it's true. The median U.S. income is
| no longer enough to cover a year of basic expenses, or achieve
| reasonable goals, even if you work for the entire year[1].
|
| [1]: https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2020/02/24/this-
| char...
| ClumsyPilot wrote:
| "His concern about what he calls "market fundamentalism"
| derives from the way those markets are failing American
| families."
|
| Free-market extremists provably ruined more lives than all
| terrorists combined
| mschuster91 wrote:
| > A whole generation doesn't believe they have any
| opportunities.
|
| Even those _in_ tech believe we don 't have any meaningful
| opportunities. Real talk: most of what we do day in day out for
| our employers is _shit_ built upon bullshit built upon a house
| of cards, and it will come crashing down sooner than later. The
| European Union is finally flexing its muscles, other countries
| are beginning to follow suit against the digital corporations,
| even the US Congress is asking questions from both parties now.
| And where will we all be when the venture capital dries up,
| when entire business models are outright banned or made
| virtually impossible because of privacy regulations? Or when
| those we work for (especially in the automotive or other
| carbon-sensitive industries) have to cut down costs or close
| shop?
|
| If you work at Facebook or Google (and to a lesser extent
| Microsoft and Apple), everything you do follows exactly one
| motive: make as much profit for the shareholders as possible by
| advertising people stuff they don't need. Most of what everyone
| else is doing is either directly related to advertising, to
| creating a new product that is only marginally better than the
| previous version or to extracting money out of someone else for
| services they don't need.
|
| Bullshit jobs? We are in a _bullshit economy_ , and the circle
| of capitalism forces us to ever-increasing economic growth -
| it's obvious that the path we are on as a species is pointing
| straight to our downfall, be it by climate change, by a
| resource-resetting war or by exhaustion of vital natural
| resources.
|
| Disagree? Ask yourself when was the last time you created
| something at work that provides a net benefit to society's
| survival.
| dwaltrip wrote:
| This is a sexy half-truth.
| kitsunesoba wrote:
| > Disagree? Ask yourself when was the last time you created
| something at work that provides a net benefit to society's
| survival.
|
| I think you have a point, but at the same time I'm not sure
| it's possible for everybody or even most people to have jobs
| that are crucial to society. Once you hit certain technology
| level and population thresholds, a lot of jobs become all
| about optimization and margins -- even those that have more
| of a concrete role in society. It's unavoidable unless we
| drop back to pre-1900s technology and/or population levels.
| mschuster91 wrote:
| > It's unavoidable unless we drop back to pre-1900s
| technology and/or population levels.
|
| No. What we need to do is to not define our worth as humans
| by the work we do. Only then we can truly automate our
| crucial needs (i.e. food production, transportation) as far
| as possible without fearing massive social unrest by
| millions of people "without employment". A single train
| conductor replaces a hundred truck drivers. Many
| governmental services could be done by the citizens
| themselves based on automated processes. Most teachers
| (especially the ones who spend all their day droning in
| front of a blackboard) could be replaced by videos.
|
| The only thing where we will definitely need humans in the
| future is research, care work and construction/trades.
| Everything else? Look at the Star Trek economy.
| inglor_cz wrote:
| The rich Gulf sheikdoms are a place where the citizens do
| not really need to work and do not define their worth by
| their work.
|
| They still struggle with various social pathologies -
| alcohol, drugs, domestic violence, religious extremism.
|
| I think some people cannot handle a life that is too
| easy. Arguably, even modern Westerners from richer
| backgrounds tend to plunge into surrogate struggles or
| take up very distant causes.
| mschuster91 wrote:
| > They still struggle with various social pathologies -
| alcohol, drugs, domestic violence, religious extremism.
|
| The domestic violence / religious extremism is a result
| of the Western nations favoring radical Islam
| interpretations as a base for the regimes they bought
| their oil from. A kingdom/dictatorship where the ruling
| class has their assets (i.e. their oil money) in Western
| nations is more stable for oil supply than a democracy.
| inglor_cz wrote:
| In Western nations, people in that situation may join
| some weird cults instead.
| kitsunesoba wrote:
| I am fully supportive of moving the economy to a "Star
| Trek" model, and think that from a technical perspective
| that doing so will be achievable within the next 1-2
| decades.
|
| It would require both political will and lack of
| obstruction from large employers and entities invested in
| residential real estate however, and I don't see that
| happening in the US for the foreseeable future short of a
| near-total turnover of the current elected body of
| politicians, rooting out any who would rather be in the
| pockets of lobbyists than represent the people.
| withinboredom wrote:
| Since moving to the EU, I can count the number of times
| someone has actually cared what I do for a living. It
| took a few years for me not to care too. I think one of
| my friends works in a machine shop and another at a bike
| shop, but I really have no idea. We hang out, play games
| together, complain about people at our jobs, and all the
| normal stuff. Yet, not once have we actually talked about
| what we do for a living.
|
| In the US, the question of what I did for a living was
| one of the first questions in any conversation, as if my
| answer was who I was and defined my worth in their eyes.
| I don't miss it.
| blablabla123 wrote:
| Same, and I often wonder if people want to start some kind of
| scam. I mean the reality is probably that investing in crypto
| is much riskier, has probably a much lower expected yield than
| say trading with (covered) derivatives. But I also think it has
| to do with some kind of FOMO. Everybody knows someone who knows
| someone that got a ridiculously high return on investment
| because they bought the stuff 10 years ago. On the other hand
| it's possible to buy very well-understood derivates today with
| equal chances on public companies.
|
| > It's the same people who go spend too much at casinos
|
| YMMV but my experience is actually the opposite. I.e. rather
| the gambling types actually buy derivates and everybody else
| considers buying crypto or has already done so.
| bhouston wrote:
| > I mean the reality is probably that investing in crypto is
| much riskier, has probably a much lower expected yield than
| say trading with (covered) derivatives.
|
| For now it isn't, because it has been going up and to the
| right for quite some time. But the music can stop at some
| point...
| tata71 wrote:
| Yeah, GP's circle seems at least mildly privileged..
| Overtonwindow wrote:
| Didn't they say this about generation X and Amway?
| Hydraulix989 wrote:
| What kinds of returns and from what initial investment?
|
| If you got into crypto in the time leading up to 2013, 2017, and
| 2020, you could have 10x'd your bag easily.
|
| I suspect having a technical understanding helped appreciate the
| value of Ethereum, Filecoin, Avalanche, etc. before everyone
| else, while simultaneously knowing to avoid Tron, Litecoin,
| Cardano, etc. which lack technical merit. (Although even properly
| timing the latter would have generated lucrative returns...)
|
| And then having enough sophistication as an investor to liquidate
| your holdings at peak hysteria when the layperson was asking
| about crypto.
| jollybean wrote:
| "Initial investment"
|
| It's not an 'investment', it's just playing 'trading cards'
| with invented numbers, based on nothing.
|
| "having a technical understanding "
|
| No, having a 'technical understanding' just enables the
| obfuscation of the Giant Scam even more.
|
| "having enough sophistication as an investor "
|
| If you think it's 'sophistication' then you're in the 'fish'
| category being fed to sharks. Markets crash when the
| leads/powerful decide to make their moves (which includes the
| central bank actions, regulatory apparatus).
|
| The magic numbers may continue to trade for a long time but
| it's still a scam.
| odonnellryan wrote:
| I saw someone here or on Reddit discussing how BTC is
| guaranteed to 3x at least each year for the next 1-2 decades.
|
| I mean... Putting $100 into crypto today and being set for
| life really sounds nice but I highly doubt any market could
| support that kind of growth....
| bellyfullofbac wrote:
| Can I replace "technical understanding" /"sophistication" with
| "luck" here?
|
| I'd ask why you think the "good" coins are good and the bad
| ones are bad, but I feel like that would just lead to cherry-
| picked data...
| Hydraulix989 wrote:
| Ethereum was the first cryptocurrency that does decentralized
| general purpose computation aka smart contracts.
|
| Filecoin decentralizes storage.
|
| Avalanche has the first Byzantine consensus mechanism (within
| a reasonable bound, read the paper) that does not rely on
| proof of work aka energy wasting.
|
| If these neither excite you nor stand out from forks of other
| coins (Litecoin is Bitcoin with a different hashing function,
| Tron is just marketing, Cardano is centralized), then yes,
| you are right, you are at a casino.
| jazzyjackson wrote:
| I remember when it was invented, debating with friends the
| virtues of turing complete ethereum vs non turing complete
| bitcoin script - its still not clear to me why you'd want
| to do general purpose computation on the world's slowest
| most expensive computer.
|
| edit while i still can: no wifi, less space than a nomad.
| MathYouF wrote:
| The main problem computation on the world's slowest most
| expensive computer solves is lack of trust in doing it on
| any other computer. The increased cost and decreased
| speed is worth it in some use cases for the increased
| insurance against the pre-determined computation not
| being run correctly or at all (making a payout based on
| certain data, usually outcomes of events, like for
| insurance or gambling).
| SideburnsOfDoom wrote:
| > The main problem computation on the world's slowest
| most expensive computer solves is lack of trust in doing
| it on any other computer
|
| This is an invented problem. "lack of trust" is an
| meaningless abstract; there is no specific concrete
| benefit to "solving" it.
| odonnellryan wrote:
| Most of the cool business uses/potentials of Blockchain
| do not require decentralization and are definitely made
| more complex by it.
| throwaway1777 wrote:
| But the best technology doesn't always win.
| thoughtstheseus wrote:
| Agreed. The crypto market will win eventually, the tech
| is better. Today though, there're more bubbles in the
| crypto market than a roll of bubble wrap. I'm just hoping
| the government doesn't bail out the losers.
| UncleMeat wrote:
| Monero has always been my go-to example of this. It truly
| does achieve something that other coins do not, but it
| doesn't see meteoric rise like things like Shib or whatever.
| exolymph wrote:
| Teenagers are dumb, news at 11.
| sschueller wrote:
| This is the same gen-z that follow those youtubers and tiktok
| stars pumping and dumping crypto coins?
|
| It's appalling what is going on with these blatantly illegal pump
| and dumps as well as rug pulls right in front on the FTC.
| seibelj wrote:
| If you could earn anything with a simple savings account, or
| safe assets like bonds, then the obsession with finding the
| Next Big Thing in finance wouldn't be anywhere near as popular.
| But there are no options - it's finding something to gamble on,
| or lose your wealth to inflation. No one wants to have their
| life savings inflated away.
| UncleMeat wrote:
| But there are different kinds of gambling. VTI will almost
| certainly crush inflation over a period of decades. The weird
| token that my brother-in-law is buying doesn't have the same
| risk profile as that.
| gkuan wrote:
| US I-series savings bonds are yielding 7.1% (and is tax
| advantaged) which seems to be better than the staking yields
| of the more reputable PoS coins.
| jeppesen-io wrote:
| I don't know where they get this nonsense. Anyone who actually
| talks or works with gen z would know this. Not that it matters,
| but I'm in my late 30s. These type of articles about the
| dumb/bad/ignorant the next generation are growing very tiring
| jollybean wrote:
| About 1/3 of them want to pursue careers in Social Media as
| 'influences' as well.
|
| Gen Z will be 'crypto millionaires' but those millions will be
| worthless.
|
| I think finally we can say 'The Kids Are Not Alright' without
| being entirely old cranks, or rather, there is a kind of a
| problem that didn't exist before now that we are in 'the age of
| surplus' at least for middle->upper tier kids.
|
| When I hear Crypto talk, all I hear are sad addicted gamblers
| talking about 'The Slot That's Tilted to Win' which is only
| marginally better than classical investors just speculating, but
| at the very least, investing and allocation of capital are
| materially important things.
|
| The saddest thing of all is that an entire generation thinks that
| wealth comes out of thin air, and that they somehow deserve to be
| rich because of some luck entirely disconnected with the
| collective participation, work and input of a lot of people.
| 'Inequality' is a problem no doubt, and a lot of the 'rich'
| didn't do much to earn it either, but that's a separate question.
| azmodeus wrote:
| Don't write off gen z, write off their parents and educators
| who haven't shown them another way.
|
| We have created a harsh economic climate, surely we are more
| responsible than the next generation.
|
| Tech has built a brand of meteoric magic, it's not surprising
| snake oil can be sold in such an environment.
| withinboredom wrote:
| Their parents hit their early adulthood with the advent of
| the internet. I don't think anyone knew wtf was going on.
| sergiomattei wrote:
| > The saddest thing of all is that an entire generation thinks
| that wealth comes out of thin air
|
| Citation needed
| jollybean wrote:
| The citation is in the title: believing that people are going
| to get rich by holding/trading magic numbers, which is not a
| value creating activity, is believing that they're going to
| get rich by creating value out of thin air.
| milliams wrote:
| "will" != "can"
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