[HN Gopher] GoDaddy Security Breach
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       GoDaddy Security Breach
        
       Author : sumstock
       Score  : 265 points
       Date   : 2021-11-22 14:22 UTC (8 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (www.sec.gov)
 (TXT) w3m dump (www.sec.gov)
        
       | game_the0ry wrote:
       | I saw a couple of comments saying to not use godaddy - why is
       | that? I am a godaddy customer and have not been dissatisfied so
       | far (excluding this data breach).
       | 
       | I also see namecheap being recommended a lot. Are they the go-to
       | for domain name registration?
        
         | Kye wrote:
         | At one point GoDaddy used a lot of dark patterns in their
         | checkout and cancellation flows. Amazon's worst is relatively
         | tame. I don't know if they cleaned up their act, but that's
         | likely the source.
         | 
         | Cloudflare offers domain registration now (not just transfers),
         | and it's at cost, so I don't see a reason to not use it unless
         | you need to set your own nameservers. That's a paid add-on with
         | Cloudflare's registrar service.
        
         | phaedryx wrote:
         | Here's a list of reasons to avoid GoDaddy:
         | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GoDaddy#Controversies
         | 
         | Also, I left because I thought their upsells and harassment
         | were annoying.
        
           | ryanlol wrote:
           | Most of these don't really look too bad for godaddy, the
           | first thing on your list paints them in a very positive
           | light.
        
             | dspillett wrote:
             | I wouldn't say most, but some do not look bad for them.
             | Some do look very bad for them IMO though, and some of
             | those are why I've not used them for many years (some of
             | them happened after I moved my things elsewhere).
             | 
             | The point of that list is to enumerate significant
             | controversies involving GoDaddy, not just those where they
             | look particularly bad.
        
         | tristor wrote:
         | I used to work with a lot of former GoDaddy employees, based on
         | what I was told they treat their employees horribly internally
         | and are very much focused on nickle and diming their customers
         | as much as possible without any desire to provide more than the
         | bare minimum of service to prevent them from being sued for
         | breach of contract.
         | 
         | They are not a company I would ever do business with on the
         | basis of that alone.
        
         | [deleted]
        
         | riekus wrote:
         | GoDaddy has a done a lot of shady shit in the past at least. I
         | got a couple of own incidents with them. One where I paid the
         | fee for domain brokerage/negotiation with the owner where they
         | took the money and never responded again.
        
         | cpach wrote:
         | GoDaddy has been in the news over the past twenty years for
         | questionable business practices.
         | 
         | I prefer Dynadot (US company). I've also heard good things
         | about Gandi (French company). You can also transfer (but not
         | register) domains to Cloudflare.
        
           | jgrahamc wrote:
           | You can register domains with Cloudflare also:
           | https://blog.cloudflare.com/registrar-for-everyone/
        
             | rstupek wrote:
             | Do you know if/when cloud flare will offer registration/
             | renewal through an api?
        
           | ryanlol wrote:
           | Gandi will suspend your domains for no reason and hold them
           | hostage until you provide photographic ID proof, stay away.
        
             | mikro2nd wrote:
             | Really? I've been dealing with Gandi for something like 20
             | years and have never before now heard of anything like
             | this, nor experienced it.
             | 
             | Some evidence, please.
        
               | denton-scratch wrote:
               | I also rate Gandi. I'm also surprised to hear of
               | shenanigans.
               | 
               | But the GP's story is about identity verification; I
               | don't see that as a particularly egregious "shenanigan".
        
               | ohyeshedid wrote:
               | Can't speak to that specific complaint, but Gandi has had
               | other issues in the past.[0]
               | 
               | [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22001822
        
         | freedomben wrote:
         | I bought domains through them many years ago and transferring
         | them out was an absolute and utter (intentional on GoDaddy's
         | part) nightmare.
         | 
         | Even today, I have one domain that I inherited that has been
         | nearly impossible to transfer out, even after talking to
         | support personnel. They keep blaming the receiving registrar
         | even though all the evidence points to GoDaddy's system). I
         | don't know if it's malice or incompetence, but it's kind of
         | hard to tell the difference at this point and give then very
         | real malice in their past, I'm disinclined to give them too
         | much benefit of the doubt.
         | 
         | Lastly I can't prove it, but about 10 years ago or so I'm
         | pretty sure they bought a domain name that I had been searching
         | using their search tool but was on the fence about buying. When
         | I finally did decide to buy it, it had been registered but was
         | "available" to buy through GoDaddy at a nice markup. I saw
         | online (at the time) several other anecdotes of the same thing.
         | 
         | For those wondering what I use now: hover.com has been great to
         | me for many years. I do have an increasing number on Cloudflare
         | as well.
        
       | 1cvmask wrote:
       | No surprise at all that this happened. They had not turned on
       | multi-factor authentication and hackers got in through a static
       | password. Over 80% of data breaches are through static passwords.
       | 
       | From the official GoDaddy statement:
       | 
       | Using a compromised password, an unauthorized third party
       | accessed the provisioning system in our legacy code base for
       | Managed WordPress.
       | 
       | -
       | 
       | This could have been an easily avoidable data breach.
        
         | polote wrote:
         | > This could have been an easily avoidable data breach.
         | 
         | Like Twitter has done it
         | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_Twitter_account_hijacking ?
         | 
         | It is super easy to give lessons after the fact
        
         | paulpauper wrote:
         | A static password is fine if you have a good strength and rate
         | limiting or other ways to prevent brute forcing
        
           | vimda wrote:
           | It's really not... Password reuse, other breaches, there's
           | many ways a password can be leaked that isn't bruteforcing.
           | Considering how low the barrier to entry to 2fa is, there
           | really is no excuse these days
        
         | bilekas wrote:
         | But they said :
         | 
         | > We, GoDaddy leadership and employees, take our responsibility
         | to protect our customers' data very seriously
         | 
         | So that makes it okay right ?
        
           | gizdan wrote:
           | Totally makes it okay! I assume that's _after_ the data is
           | stolen and sold.
        
             | Zancarius wrote:
             | See, the trick is to sell customer data _before_ the bad
             | guys get it!
        
           | kreeben wrote:
           | No. You should only work with partners who take that
           | responsibility extremely seriously. "Very" is an order of
           | magnitude too low.
        
             | cpach wrote:
             | I'm pretty sure 'bilekas was being sarcastic :)
        
               | RankingMember wrote:
               | kreeben was continuing the joke
        
         | mooreds wrote:
         | > Over 80% of data breaches are through static passwords.
         | 
         | Static passwords are bad, for sure. But do you have a source
         | for this?
        
           | alexis2b wrote:
           | Over 80% of statistics posted in comments are made on the
           | spot.
        
             | mellavora wrote:
             | no, the correct figure is 78%
        
               | 1cvmask wrote:
               | The figure that I used was one from the Verizon Data
               | Breach report in 2017 of 81%.
               | 
               | Page 5 in the executive summary:
               | 
               | https://www.verizon.com/business/resources/reports/2017_d
               | bir...
        
           | 1cvmask wrote:
           | See page 5 of the Verizon report and the number is 81%:
           | 
           | https://www.verizon.com/business/resources/reports/2017_dbir.
           | ..
        
             | mooreds wrote:
             | Awesome, thanks for sharing that link from 2017.
             | 
             | For everyone not going to go to the PDF, the text is "81%
             | of hacking-related breaches leveraged either stolen and/or
             | weak passwords."
             | 
             | So I'm not sure that you can say that all data breaches are
             | related to static passwords, but it sure a big number and a
             | problem.
             | 
             | I looked at the 2020 Verizon report, but unfortunately they
             | changed their methodology or reporting so I didn't see a
             | figure for that year for "hacking-related breaches".
        
       | sebow wrote:
       | >This looks interesting, godaddy breach reported by sec, let me
       | click:
       | 
       | >Wordpress
       | 
       | >Oh... nevermind
        
       | bilekas wrote:
       | > For active customers, sFTP and database usernames and passwords
       | were exposed. We reset both passwords.
       | 
       | > For a subset of active customers, the SSL private key was
       | exposed. We are in the process of issuing and installing new
       | certificates for those customers.
       | 
       | Wow.. That's quite severe.. From September 6th to November 17th..
       | I wonder will they do a full impact summary after they figure it
       | out internally.
        
         | [deleted]
        
         | busterarm wrote:
         | I've met Demetrius and he's a smart, capable security
         | professional who has already done a lot to bring GoDaddy up to
         | shape. This is a an unfortunate miss for them after years of
         | hard work to rectify these kinds of issues.
        
           | denton-scratch wrote:
           | Unfortunately, 20 years of treating customers like dirt can't
           | be washed-away by hiring one capable security professional.
           | For dirt customers like me, the best way of judging a service
           | provider is past form.
           | 
           | I don't buy from companies with a bad history. It's not some
           | kind of behaviour-modification strategy; it's just self-
           | preservation.
        
         | lvice wrote:
         | I hope they are talking about hashed passwords. There is no
         | reason why in 2021 passwords can be recovered in clear text,
         | even in a legacy code base...
        
           | maccolgan wrote:
           | It's about the database and SFTP usernames and passwords, how
           | can you hash them?
        
       | joecool1029 wrote:
       | Can we not editorialize the titles?
       | 
       | This is the title: GoDaddy Announces Security Incident Affecting
       | Managed WordPress Service
       | 
       | Saying this is a breach sounds more generalized and makes
       | exponentially more people click the bait to see if their domain
       | accounts were hit (they weren't).
        
         | slownews45 wrote:
         | Agreed. Headlines have just gotten terrible.
        
       | nathanaldensr wrote:
       | > Chief Information Security Officer
       | 
       | > Our WordPress password was leaked or exposed--likely due to
       | utter imcompetence--and no 2FA was in use.
       | 
       | Man, when can _I_ become a Chief Information Security Officer? I
       | could do a better job in my sleep.
        
         | vmception wrote:
         | > I could do a better job in my sleep.
         | 
         | when you're ready, you won't have to
        
       | imroot wrote:
       | There was a fair amount of fallout from this with other services
       | as well -- customers who were hosted on GoDaddy but had their
       | accounts compromised had other services spun up with their domain
       | and their credentials.
       | 
       | I know that the company I work for was hit at least once by this,
       | until we implemented stronger KYC checks.
        
       | ed25519FUUU wrote:
       | At least they didn't try and blame their incompetence on
       | "sophisticated foreign hackers, possibly Russian"
        
       | jodrellblank wrote:
       | I had a domain with them for years, a couple months ago they
       | ditched their entire IMAP/POP3/SMTP email platform and moved all
       | customers to a trial of Microsoft Office365.
       | 
       | I guess that was another part of their 'legacy platform'?
       | 
       | I transferred the domain to Gandi which offers a couple of email
       | addresses with each domain, something I kept putting off
       | expecting GoDaddy to make it difficult, but it was fine.
       | 
       | But I do wonder how competent a registrar/web/email tech company
       | is if they can't run email services, and now apparently can't run
       | websites securely either? I spent a while mulling Fastmail and
       | Rollernet and Mxroute vs paying for Office365 and thinking about
       | how impossible it is to know if a company has the tech skills to
       | back their product offering - and then if they actually do use
       | them - or are just marketing.
        
         | [deleted]
        
         | hateful wrote:
         | This was my excuse to move to Fastmail - I was "forwarding"
         | (actually POP3ing) my email into Gmail from GoDaddy. Now it's
         | all in Fastmail. It was also losing the catch-all address that
         | was unacceptable at the time.
        
         | PopAlongKid wrote:
         | > they ditched their entire IMAP/POP3/SMTP email platform and
         | moved all customers to a trial of Microsoft Office365
         | 
         | For browser access to your mailbox, yes they did move to
         | Office365 (free, not a trial), but POP3 and SMTP still work
         | just fine, no change required.
         | 
         | I have been using GoDaddy for many years for a handful of
         | domains, including my own business, and have had no problems
         | using their interface and avoiding paying for add-on products.
        
       | rvz wrote:
       | * Up to 1.2 million active and inactive Managed WordPress
       | customers had their email address and customer number exposed.
       | The exposure of email addresses presents risk of phishing
       | attacks.             * The original WordPress Admin password that
       | was set at the time of provisioning was exposed. If those
       | credentials were still in use, we reset those passwords.
       | * For active customers, sFTP and database usernames and passwords
       | were exposed. We reset both passwords.             * For a subset
       | of active customers, the SSL private key was exposed. We are in
       | the process of issuing and installing new certificates for those
       | customers.
       | 
       | Oh dear. No mention of 2FA mechanisms here. So does that mean
       | GoDaddy's security is not good enough or is in fact very poor?
       | 
       | No different to Epik's security breach I guess, but not the worst
       | security breach I've seen in a long time when compared with
       | Twitch [0].
       | 
       | [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28771465
        
       | cpach wrote:
       | IMO: Friends don't let friends use GoDaddy.
        
         | unstatusthequo wrote:
         | Or Network Solutions... which, dare I say, is even worse.
        
           | Turing_Machine wrote:
           | Pretty much all of them are bad/evil in some way, but some
           | are worse than others.
        
             | _nickwhite wrote:
             | Us greybeards have been around long enough to experience
             | several of these bad/evil domain registrars. One common
             | path I see has been:
             | 
             | Network Solutions -> GoDaddy -> Namecheap -> Google Domains
             | OR CloudFlare Domains
             | 
             | Seriously, if anyone is still using Netsol or Godaddy,
             | there are much better alternatives, and it's very easy to
             | make the transition- I've helped a good handful of friends.
        
               | junon wrote:
               | I use Gandi these days.
        
               | good8675309 wrote:
               | I use NameCheap. I would never use a company like Google
               | where I can't at least call and talk to someone. Also,
               | there are stories like this where someone gets their
               | Google account locked for some random reason and all of
               | the sudden your domain is now locked as well:
               | https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4825445
        
               | xmprt wrote:
               | Thoughts on Hover vs Namecheap? I've been using Hover for
               | a while now and they haven't given me any issues but I
               | wonder if there's something better out there that I just
               | haven't looked into.
        
               | Turing_Machine wrote:
               | I've never used Google as a domain registrar. They're
               | evil enough for other reasons that I wouldn't feel
               | comfortable doing that.
        
       | rockbruno wrote:
       | GoDaddy has the weirdest tech stack/tech support combination I
       | have ever seen. I once had an issue where I was unable to update
       | my credit card information, so I contacted their support. Their
       | support process is basically having you give them full access to
       | your account and then having the support person navigate your
       | account like a regular user to see what problem you're facing.
       | So, because I had a problem with the payment flow, she literally
       | asked for my credit card information so she could see which error
       | I was seeing. I was cool headed enough to explain why that was a
       | ridiculous request but hanged up after that. No wonder they got
       | hacked.
        
         | elliekelly wrote:
         | I'm almost afraid to ask but... how long ago did this happen?
        
         | croutonwagon wrote:
         | Godaddy has some bad practices.
         | 
         | They used to randomly call us, and then ask US to verify our
         | accounts, passcodes in order for them to tell us a domain was
         | close to expiration.
         | 
         | Not an email. An unsolicited phone call where I have to
         | validate my information.
         | 
         | I told them that was phishing 101 tactic and a bad practice to
         | train users on. And if a call is standard, a user may
         | reasonably assume an email may be too.
         | 
         | Ultimately they just removed my from their call list.
         | 
         | It was one of the most asinine things I've seen. It reminds me
         | I need to move my companies domains to hover.
        
       | dang wrote:
       | There's a summary here, which seems to be reporting on the OP:
       | https://www.wordfence.com/blog/2021/11/godaddy-breach-plaint....
       | 
       | (Via https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29311286, but no
       | comments there)
        
       | CodinM wrote:
       | Story Time A few years ago I woke up before going to work and
       | noticed I have a few emails for automatic renewal for some
       | domains I didn't remember buying on GoDaddy - which I wasn't
       | using anymore for anything important.
       | 
       | Upon investigating I found out a turkish person was using my
       | account for some scams with crypto alongside a few real-world
       | websites he built for business in Ankara. I went to the police,
       | gave them all the evidence (just so I'm safe legally from the
       | scams he was running in my name, with stolen credit cards that
       | were using my address - but in Ankara not my location), and
       | GoDaddy failed to answer to the local authorities, after 1 year
       | the investigation was shutdown because of lack of cooperation
       | from GoDaddy's side.
        
       | IYasha wrote:
       | Good place to ask for alternatives, I suppose. Are there any?
       | 
       | Is NameSilo any better? I can't just go for OpenNIC domain
       | because I have to have email accessible to other servers. :(
        
         | chrisco255 wrote:
         | I been using iwantmyname.com for years. It's simple to search,
         | simple to add integrations, and always been reliable on domain
         | renewals for me. It's New Zealand based I believe.
        
         | andrewguenther wrote:
         | There's tons. Google domains, name.com, almost anyone but
         | GoDaddy
        
       | ushakov wrote:
       | <removed>
        
         | uncletammy wrote:
         | Simply calling a thing you don't like "a scam" is lazy and
         | unproductive. If you have an argument to make against Godaddy
         | (there are plenty to be made), please do so.
        
       | Turing_Machine wrote:
       | Seriously, any flavor of WordPress is just a breach waiting to
       | happen. It's not a question of "if", it's a question of "when".
       | 
       | I understand that it's easy to use from a writer's point of view
       | (after you get it installed, or if someone else is installing it
       | for you), and that there are all kinds of third-party plugins and
       | support available, but man, that codebase is a gigantic steaming
       | pile of technical debt.
        
         | tyingq wrote:
         | It is much better than it used to be. They seem to have finally
         | gotten automatic updates of the core and plugins working
         | reasonably. But, yes, there's some pretty ugly stuff in there.
         | Like things that appear to be proper parameterized SQL queries,
         | but are not if you look behind the curtain:
         | https://github.com/WordPress/WordPress/blob/807cba060e30a670...
        
       | iamricks wrote:
       | We once had a domain stolen because somebody called GoDaddy and
       | was able to get the 2FA code removed with a phone call and they
       | had some leaked email credentials for the account.
       | 
       | We had to call GoDaddy and cancel the domain transfer, they would
       | give us no information on how it happened.
        
         | bhartzer wrote:
         | I can tell you that unfortunately that's not an isolated case.
         | We recover stolen domain names, and it happens quite often
         | (that someone gets into a GoDaddy account and is able to remove
         | 2FA).
        
       | marcc wrote:
       | Why are we reading this on the SEC site and not the GoDaddy site?
       | I did a quick search and can't find a disclosure on their site.
       | If it's there, it's not easy to find.
       | 
       | Security incidents are going to happen. This particular incident
       | looks to be avoidable (static passwords!). What we should judge
       | the company on is their response and transparency. GoDaddy
       | disclosed, but a new customer on the site wouldn't find this.
       | They also used phrases like "affects our Legacy WordPress
       | Platform" probably to attempt to shift a little blame from the
       | current team or minimize the fall out.
       | 
       | When you have a security incident, be transparent, own it, and
       | deal with it. We can tell when you are trying to sweep it under
       | the rug and hide, and that's bad. This is an opportunity for an
       | org to show that they put customers first and shine.
        
         | blablabla123 wrote:
         | That's at least the 2nd funny thing happening with GoDaddy. I
         | stopped using them years ago.
        
         | neom wrote:
         | The URL contains "gddyblogpostnov222021" - and at the bottom
         | the FLS mentioned blog post, so I guess the SEC didn't adhere
         | to their press embargo on the blog post? ;)
        
         | hellbannedguy wrote:
         | Godaddy has always been a slimy registrar.
         | 
         | Amyone who has registered with them knows this.
         | 
         | Go with Goole for $13. You will never hear from them. You won't
         | have to worry about drug fueled marking bs, or unethical
         | behavior.
        
           | bagels wrote:
           | Google?
        
             | verdverm wrote:
             | https://domains.google.com
             | 
             | Also a long time happy customer.
        
           | cycomanic wrote:
           | I realise that you are talking about behavior as a registrar,
           | but it's somewhat ironic that you mention google and no
           | unethical behavior in the same sentence.
        
             | hackmiester wrote:
             | I absolutely hate Google, but if it was between them and
             | GoDaddy, I think I'd pick Google.
             | 
             | If I had any choice, though, it'd be Gandi or Namecheap.
        
           | zinekeller wrote:
           | Google Domains has indeed been a very professional and no-BS
           | operation. Shame though that their other businesses are...
           | not in a good spotlight.
           | 
           | Edit: Whoops, CRR operates certain gTLDs, Google LLC operates
           | the buy-a-domain registrar.
        
           | RHSeeger wrote:
           | And if you ever have a problem with them, you _still_ won't
           | hear from them.
        
         | secondaryacct wrote:
         | Sorry but they are contacting every impacted customers and
         | changing their secrets.
         | 
         | You work in a company too, what matters ? That the random
         | raging virgins on HN bask in your failure, or that every
         | impacted client knows something happened ?
        
           | [deleted]
        
         | elliekelly wrote:
         | Management doesn't put customers first. They put themselves
         | (management) first closely followed by investors. The SEC
         | recently indicated they'd be focusing enforcement on
         | cybersecurity incident disclosures. Particularly on timely
         | disclosures (not waiting 6 months from discovery to disclosure,
         | for example).
         | 
         | That might be the only reason we're even reading about this at
         | all.
        
         | skeeter2020 wrote:
         | >> Why are we reading this on the SEC site and not the GoDaddy
         | site?
         | 
         | This is typically by design and public relations 101. If you
         | don't link "bad" content to your domain it's easier to make it
         | disappear in the future. It's why a company purchases "our-
         | data-breach.net" to handle a public incident instead of just a
         | sub domain or deeply linked page. No long-lived anti-SEO
        
       | legrande wrote:
       | From my experience with GoDaddy, the amount of dark patterns
       | using the service was astonishing. It made me move to better
       | hosting providers. They always try to up-sell you stuff, and tack
       | on all these additional features that you have to opt out of when
       | buying something. You have to be real careful on there in-case
       | you buy something you didn't want. Also their UI is really messy
       | and things are buried in multiple deep links and menus. One out
       | of five, do not recommend. It's no wonder they suffered a breach.
        
         | Dave_TRS wrote:
         | The dark patterns are so ridiculous I almost get a little
         | enjoyment out of it like playing a game. When you sign up for a
         | domain name it's a mini mission to get past the 5 separate
         | screens of upselling and clicking the small Skip link and not
         | the big green Continue button. If you're not paying close
         | attention you get to your cart and there's extra crap in there,
         | and you have to restart the level.
        
         | unclebucknasty wrote:
         | After using them for simple domain name registration, I can't
         | imagine using them for something more complex, like hosting.
         | 
         | The UI is so bad that just figuring out how the contact info
         | they collect in multiple places is used is near-impossible.
        
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       (page generated 2021-11-22 23:01 UTC)