[HN Gopher] For whom do the Covid "fact checkers" work?
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       For whom do the Covid "fact checkers" work?
        
       Author : missinfo
       Score  : 22 points
       Date   : 2021-11-07 19:43 UTC (3 hours ago)
        
 (HTM) web link (brownstone.org)
 (TXT) w3m dump (brownstone.org)
        
       | nyxaiur wrote:
       | Yeah, after the 6th spelling mistake in the first three
       | paragraphs and checking the writers credentials further than the
       | nice looking bio at the bottom I would flag it if I could.
        
         | zeruch wrote:
         | Even if I didnt know already that Brownstone is more akin to
         | Clownstone (really, its founder is someone Ayn Rand might have
         | an onanistic seizure for, with all the self-righteous
         | dweebishness that implies) and I'm pretty sure editing is one
         | of the last things that it cares about, as long as its anti-
         | mask, anti-vax, anti governments of any kind schtick is
         | maintained.
        
       | ergocoder wrote:
       | I have no idea what to believe anymore.
       | 
       | Vaccine prevents covid (e.g. death and major injury). Somehow
       | vaccinated people are scared of unvaccinated or vaccinated-but-
       | unmasked people. Huh?
       | 
       | Then, all schools in US are open to kids who cannot even be
       | vaccinated (this is since a few months back).
       | 
       | If you point that out, people will counter back with covid
       | doesn't impact kids. Well, okay?
       | 
       | We try too hard to use unvaccinated as a scapegoat of the bad
       | crisis management.
       | 
       | Do you remember how Fauci undermined all masks in the beginning?
       | I do.
       | 
       | Fauci still try to pin it on unvaccinated when schools are still
       | open..
        
         | KyeRussell wrote:
         | Honestly it just sounds like you've bought into the politics of
         | it all. This is (mostly) a scientific issue, and inherent in
         | that is the fact that the body of knowledge changes as a result
         | of new observations.
         | 
         | > If you point that out, people will counter back with covid
         | doesn't impact kids. Well, okay?
         | 
         | Who is "people"?
         | 
         | Are you using a consistent source?
         | 
         | If your point is that people have different understandings of
         | appropriate COVID responses, then I guess I agree, but I don't
         | think that that's the point that you're trying to make.
         | 
         | More to the point, I can't see how any government response
         | could combat the fact that in 2021 everyone is an expert and
         | disinformation is rife. This is a pre-existing condition.
        
           | ergocoder wrote:
           | Majority of people agree with school opening. Therefore,
           | covid is seen as not a big deal.
           | 
           | Because if covid is a huge deal, we wouldn't trade dead kids
           | with educating kids. Being alive would almost always come
           | first
        
         | Spivak wrote:
         | I think you're talking about the opinions of two different
         | groups which is why they conflict.
         | 
         | I'm fully vaxxed plus a booster and I don't really want to be
         | around unmasked unvaxxed people if I can help it. Like the
         | vaccine isn't magic, the effectiveness drops over time and more
         | exposures compounds the risk. There's zero gain to be around a
         | high risk group, especially when it's so easy to avoid right
         | now. And I still wear a mask and encourage others to as well
         | (not that it matters because there are still mandates) because
         | I don't want to accidentally be an asymptotic carrier to
         | someone, especially someone unvaccinated -- I have friends and
         | family with weak immune systems and kids. Wearing a mask costs
         | me nothing, especially now that it's cold and keeps my face
         | warm, and might do some good.
         | 
         | I also think it is monumentally stupid that schools around here
         | opened. Sure yeah, pack kids in poorly ventilated rooms for 8
         | hours a day, nothing bad will happen there.
        
         | schwartzworld wrote:
         | > Somehow vaccinated people are scared of unvaccinated or
         | vaccinated-but-unmasked people
         | 
         | I can't speak for everyone, but even with a vaccine I can still
         | transmit covid to my young children. I'll breathe easier once
         | they are vaccinated too.
         | 
         | > Then, all schools in US are open to kids who cannot even be
         | vaccinated
         | 
         | There are other factors besides COVID. Quarantine was not good
         | for our kids, and we made the decision to send them back too
         | school when we saw how much they were suffering due to lack of
         | socialization.
         | 
         | Additionally, working with kids at home was next to impossible.
         | We are taking a calculated risk sending them back because the
         | bills, unfortunately, do not pay themselves. It was not an easy
         | decision.
        
           | ergocoder wrote:
           | We are comparing that with kids dying from covid or having
           | long covid, right?
           | 
           | I suppose dead kids is cheaper than working with kids at
           | home.
           | 
           | That is an absurd decision.
        
       | weakfish wrote:
       | https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/brownstone-institute-bias/
        
         | defaultprimate wrote:
         | The juxtaposition of this comment on this post is hilarious
        
         | sdoering wrote:
         | > Overall, we rate the Brownstone Institute Right Biased based
         | on editorial positions that favor a conservative-libertarian
         | perspective. We also rate them Mixed for factual reporting due
         | to a failed fact check and the promotion of misinformation
         | regarding Covid-19.
         | 
         | Just to spare others the click.
        
       | quitit wrote:
       | For the author: The solution is to ask for their sources - not to
       | speculate that it's all a sham (while conveniently also not
       | providing any data to back up such a claim.)
       | 
       | Meanwhile a single search pulls _a possible source_ for the 80%
       | figure:
       | 
       | https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/science/science-br...
       | 
       | But talking about that source is inconvenient to the author
       | because it provides ample support over a range of real world and
       | laboratory studies (with both types demonstrating the 80% figure)
       | 
       | But even without looking deeply into this - what motive would the
       | CDC have for making everyone run around in little fabric masks
       | versus the very well known disinformation efforts.
       | 
       | At this stage of the pandemic: the science is abundantly clear -
       | masks work.
        
         | xkbarkar wrote:
         | Right. Did you even read the "source" you provided? Anyone who
         | uses the 2 infected hairdressers as proof masks work has lost
         | all credibility. Its the kind of scientism that thrives on
         | social media.
         | 
         | You do realize that half of the supposedly covid free clientel
         | declined a pcr test? They just said they felt fine.
         | 
         | I would not have gotten a passing grade in high scool if I had
         | turned that paper in as proof of masking.
         | 
         | Since 2020 any crap, no matter how idiotic, as long as it
         | supports masking, is passed off as science.
         | 
         | Some days reddit clearly leaks into HN.
        
           | atoav wrote:
           | Sorry but masks are not a very disputes issue anymore. I mean
           | it is a airborne virus, how other than filtering air you
           | breath in and out would you practically target it?
           | 
           | Weirdly enough nobody seems to doubt HEPA filters work. Maybe
           | because they are more convenient and don't demand that you
           | wear a piece of cloth in your face?
        
         | pangolinplayer wrote:
         | It's a sham
        
         | throwntoday wrote:
         | It doesn't matter what the truth is at this point because the
         | majority of scientist have demonstrated they are massive
         | cowards and won't speak out against patently false information
         | in the mainstream for fear of becoming pariahs.
        
           | atoav wrote:
           | I have experienced the polar opposite (non US citizen)
        
         | stefantalpalaru wrote:
         | > (while conveniently also not providing any data to back up
         | such a claim.)
         | 
         | "The intervention increased proper mask-wearing from 13.3% in
         | control villages (N=806,547 observations) to 42.3% in treatment
         | villages (N=797,715 observations) (adjusted percentage point
         | difference = 0.29 \\[0.27, 0.31\\]). This tripling of mask
         | usage was sustained during the intervention period and two
         | weeks after. \\[...\\] The proportion of individuals with
         | COVID-like symptoms was __7.62%__ (N=13,273) in the
         | intervention arm and __8.62%__ (N=13,893) in the control arm."
         | - ["The Impact of Community Masking on COVID-19: A Cluster-
         | Randomized Trial in Bangladesh" (2021)](https://www.poverty-
         | action.org/sites/default/files/publicati...)
         | 
         | "SARS-CoV-2-naive vaccinees had a 13.06-fold (95% CI, 8.08 to
         | 21.11) increased risk for breakthrough infection with the Delta
         | variant compared to those previously infected, when the first
         | event (infection or vaccination) occurred during January and
         | February of 2021." - ["Comparing SARS-CoV-2 natural immunity to
         | vaccine-induced immunity: reinfections versus breakthrough
         | infections" (2021)](https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/202
         | 1.08.24.21262415v...)
        
       | joelbondurant wrote:
       | The USA Fact-Check Algorithm from the Science Ministry is the
       | canonical arbiter of truth.
        
       | charbonneau2 wrote:
       | > The data in support of this is massive, and quite certain.
       | 
       |  _Continues without providing data._
        
         | ziml77 wrote:
         | Because it's just a blog site for people frustrated by the
         | lockdowns with a fancy sounding name.
        
           | zeruch wrote:
           | It's a bit worse than that. Its the Brownstone "Institute",
           | basically a front for 'anarcho-capitalist' (read: wannabe
           | Peter Thiel on steroids and bitcoin) Jeffrey Tucker.
           | 
           | It's buffoonish, but easy to spot.
        
       | calmworm wrote:
       | Why is this on HN? Meh.
        
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       (page generated 2021-11-07 23:01 UTC)