[HN Gopher] Zappos CEO's final months describe drug-addicted psy...
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Zappos CEO's final months describe drug-addicted psychosis in court
documents
Author : randycupertino
Score : 111 points
Date : 2021-10-28 17:37 UTC (5 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.8newsnow.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.8newsnow.com)
| joncrane wrote:
| Wow. I didn't realize he had died. In early 2018, I came || this
| close to working for Zappos as a Cloud Architect to get them
| moved onto AWS. Presumably because Amazon had owned them for
| several years by then. I wonder what it was like working for
| Zappos at that time.
| NotSashaShulgin wrote:
| Dissociatives (e.g., ketamine, nitrous oxide, xenon,
| phencyclidine, dextromethorphan in cough syrup) are too
| addictive, too pleasurable, and reliably produce long-lasting
| delusional states (e.g., as observed in John C. Lilly and Marcia
| Moore and Tony Hsieh).
|
| It is disturbing to read Marcia Moore's "Journeys Into the Bright
| World" (http://pdf.textfiles.com/books/journeysbrightworld.pdf)
| where she recounts that John C. Lilly warned her to stop using
| ketamine. She died in the woods not long afterward, hypothermia
| after injecting ketamine, trying to hide her addiction from her
| family. John C. Lilly himself went clean after decades of
| delusion, but never fully recovered, mentally.
|
| For a frank summary of the dangers, see D. M. Turner's "The
| Essential Psychedelic Guide". Before he died in his bathtub
| (after injecting ketamine), he wrote the following
| (https://www.ketamine.co.uk/dmturner/index.html):
| "A major concern regarding safe use of Ketamine is its very high
| potential for psychological addiction. A fairly large percentage
| of those who try Ketamine will consume it non-stop until their
| supply is exhausted. I've seen this in friends I've known for
| many years who are regular psychedelic users and have never
| before had problems controlling their drug consumption. And I've
| seen the lives of several people who developed an addiction to
| Ketamine take downward turns." "After about two years
| of once-per-week Ketamine use I even found that I had developed
| an addiction. Although it was less severe than what I've
| described above, it took considerable effort to break the cycle
| of repeatedly using it, even though I was aware of detrimental
| effects that it was causing. Since that time I've used Ketamine
| only occasionally, but find that I must continually exercise a
| high degree of will power to prevent myself from falling into a
| pattern of regular use. Amongst those I know who use Ketamine,
| I've seen very few who can use it in a balanced manner if they
| have access to it."
|
| So, all the dissociative psychedelics (NMDA receptor antagonists)
| seem to be bad. They should be avoided.
|
| On the other hand, there are other classes of psychedelics that
| are unambiguously good: tryptamines (e.g., psilocybin) and
| phenethylamines (e.g., mescaline). These drugs produce
| informative, useful, introspective, challenging mental states and
| are NOT prone to abuse. These are the valuable psychedelics.
| dang wrote:
| What happened to Lilly? I was always curious about that.
|
| (Side note while I have you: if your real name isn't
| SashaShulgin can you please email hn@ycombinator.com with a
| different username we can rename you to? It's distracting to
| use a username like that if it's communicating the wrong
| thing.)
| NotSashaShulgin wrote:
| Sasha and Ann Shulgin famously believed that dissociatives
| have no safe role in psychedelic therapy: "We
| are strongly prejudiced against psychedelic drugs which cause
| such mind-body separation, as we are against any drug which
| causes separation from feelings and emotions. However, we
| acknowledge that the ketamine state can be highly instructive
| for researchers trying to understand the functions of the
| human mind."
|
| Alexander (Sasha) Shulgin passed away in 2014. He is a
| historical figure. His lab will eventually be an official
| historical landmark.
|
| Is it really so confusing that I use his nickname as a handle
| online?
|
| John C. Lilly died of heart failure at age 86 in Los Angeles
| on September 30, 2001. His remains were cremated.
| dang wrote:
| I thought he might have had a kid named Sasha and that it
| might be you. So yeah, I'd say it's confusing - you have to
| distinguish your own point of view (no doubt entirely clear
| on the point) from the rest of us who are looking at this
| with a lot less information and widely varying assumptions.
| Not everyone knows that he has died, for example.
|
| Re Lilly - sorry for not being clearer - what I'm curious
| about is that you seemed to imply that at a certain point
| he was adversely affected by his own use of dissociatives,
| that it had some profound effect on him, and that he never
| fully recovered from it. I was curious to hear more about
| what happened there. I'm not super familiar with his work
| but I read a bit and found it to be a mixture of
| penetratingly lucid and completely unintelligible (mostly
| the latter).
| SashaShulgin wrote:
| Ok, rename me to NotSashaShulgin if you must.
|
| John C. Lilly's later books are a beautiful example of
| ketamine delusions and loss of contact with reality.
|
| Quoting Wikipedia: In 1974, Lilly's
| research using various psychoactive drugs led him to
| believe in the existence of a certain hierarchical group
| of cosmic entities, the lowest of which he later dubbed
| Earth Coincidence Control Office (E.C.C.O.) in an
| autobiography published jointly with his wife Antonietta
| (often called Toni). Lilly states that "[t]here exists a
| Cosmic Coincidence Control Center (CCCC) with a Galactic
| substation called Galactic Coincidence Control (GCC).
| Within GCC is the Solar System Control Unit (SSCU),
| within which is the Earth Coincidence Control Office
| (ECCO)."
|
| https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_C._Lilly
| dimal wrote:
| I think your generalizations are very wrong. Ketamine may be
| bad when abused, but when used correctly for depression, it can
| be extremely effective and good. It changed my life greatly,
| for the better. And I wouldn't say that psilocybin is
| unequivocally good either. The worst trip I ever had was on
| mushrooms. It was extremely traumatic in a way that had lasting
| effects. It changed my life greatly, for the worse.
| Natsu wrote:
| So, I'll agree with that but with a caveat, because I have a
| loved one who was part of a licensed esketamine (s-ketamine)
| trial. It certainly can pretty much just "turn off" some
| depression and I've seen it do that (even somehow avoiding
| problems from accidentally forgetting to take the other meds
| soon after).
|
| But it can also cause powerful and disturbing psychosis. In
| our case, I woke up at knife point to someone driven to tears
| by a psychosis telling them to kill me. I managed to de-
| escalate that without any harm done, but suffice it to say,
| caution is strongly advised with such things.
| diegoperini wrote:
| > NOT prone to abuse
|
| Citation needed.
| nawgz wrote:
| I picked psilocybin for you.
|
| "Psilocybin is not considered to be addictive nor does it
| cause compulsive use" - [0]
|
| [0]: https://drugpolicy.org/drug-facts/are-psilocybin-
| mushrooms-a...
| SashaShulgin wrote:
| For those too lazy to follow the link:
| "Psilocybin is not considered to be addictive nor does it
| cause compulsive use. One reason is that the intense
| experience, which can be physically and mentally
| challenging, may cause people using psilocybin to limit
| their frequency of use." "Another reason is that
| the human body quickly builds tolerance to psilocybin, such
| that people require much higher doses after only a few days
| of repeated use, making it extremely difficult to have any
| effect after more than four days of repeated usage."
| aaaaaaaaaaab wrote:
| I know people who got fucked up for years due to a single
| shroom or LSD trip. Some of them got sorted out eventually,
| others didn't.
| pacoWebConsult wrote:
| Anecdotally, After my one and only use of Psilocybin
| where I cried for about 5 hours straight, I did not feel
| the desire to do it again.
| otikthecessna wrote:
| For me it was all fun, until i got a paranoia that this
| mental state will never end. Well it ended - but this
| couple of hours have been the worst.
| andrewl wrote:
| You can still be damaged by a drug even if you are not
| addicted to it.
| nawgz wrote:
| Yes, but that has nothing to do with drug abuse. That has
| to do with the fact that it's drugs.
| colinmhayes wrote:
| > unambiguously good: tryptamines (e.g., psilocybin) and
| phenethylamines (e.g., mescaline).
|
| My friends uncle died jumping off a building on acid. Not one
| of the psychedelics you named, but having done all three I
| certainly think such a drastic action is possible on mushrooms
| or mescaline. Whether this means they aren't unambiguously good
| is up for debate I guess.
| jacquesm wrote:
| Stupid tourists on mushrooms have killed themselves in
| Amsterdam more than once by defenestration.
| twofornone wrote:
| >On the other hand, there are other classes of psychedelics
| that are unambiguously good: tryptamines (e.g., psilocybin) and
| phenethylamines (e.g., mescaline).
|
| I don't know that I would necessarily classify hallucinogenic
| psychedelics as unambiguously good. I suspect the potential
| negative effects are understudied and under reported. Beyond
| hallucinogen persisting perception disorder (admittedly rare),
| medium-long term induced psychosis (also probably rare), while
| users frequently report positive effects both short and long
| term, there are potentially profound psychological/neurological
| alterations occurring post use which may not be obviously
| detrimental. What further complicates the issue is that,
| because of the strong dependence on existing psychological
| state (set and setting), its quite possible that a user's
| culture becomes a significant confounding factor and that some
| groups of people may in fact be worse off after using some or
| all such psychedelics.
|
| Personally, a year or two post experience I noticed that
| certain emotions are more apparent to my perception which
| honestly I would have preferred to continue ignoring.
|
| I still suspect that for the vast majority of people
| hallucinogens can be positive but let's not make the mistake of
| preemptively asserting that they are harmless.
| samat wrote:
| Would you please elaborate on emotions which are more
| apparent then before? In email s@samat.me if not in public.
| axtheter wrote:
| I'm not going to argue with you in general about the dangers of
| ketamine et al, I have seen it myself. But personally (this is
| anecdata) I have never had the compulsion to use it like so
| many others for some reason. Quasi-autism, a very strong
| internal governor limiting any compulsions <other than
| work...>, my NON-use of it as a substitute for cocaine like the
| majority of people... Drugs are only the tools for trying to
| manage whatever internal psychological processes are driving
| you to take them and if those processes are too 'strong',
| people go down the path you speak of. It is not the tool's
| fault, etc.
|
| I was using K as a temporary vacation from reality aka k-hole.
| Lovely wonderful experiences and I innately knew it was helping
| with the depression. The most important factor was the
| set/setting/almost ritualistic use. And I don't do it anymore,
| never did it so much like so many other people.... and no
| compulsion to either. I have been sitting on some MXE for a
| decade now as well... I am an outlier??
|
| Ritual is an element that is sorely lacking in the majority of
| westerner's use of psychedelics - it does comes with the
| ayahuasca package "just because that is what you're supposed to
| do" aka drugs tourism. But the other stuff... This element of
| ritual is what I think you're overlooking. Ritual also would
| have prevented DM Turner from taking ketamine before taking a
| bath which is a very really bad idea; he was really blatantly
| ignoring the risk factors for whatever reason.
|
| This reminds me of a psychologist, Mexican I think, who in the
| 70s IIRC was using datura and other such things in his work
| helping patients. He's a bit obscure and I haven't found much
| info (I will hunt down my notes if people insist). So my
| opinion is that dissociatives have their use, but you really
| need to know what you are doing which most people do not.
| Personally, I think salvia is very useful... but I am sort of
| autistic and there is an Internet theory I came across that
| only the autistically inclined really take to salvia;
| neurotypicals can't handle the weirdness at some deep level. I
| have no proof of this but from what I've read and personally
| know, of course...
|
| As an aside, I met Ann and Sasha a number of times 20 odd years
| ago. So I personally find it a bit irksome you're using such a
| handle. You've agreed to change it which I commend you for...
| For the newbies who know the name, but not that he's dead, it
| would be confusing. But you are relaying correct and valuable
| information, so that is good - except for the wide ranging
| generalizations ... ;)
| mdoms wrote:
| This Jennifer "Mimi" Pham seems like a real piece of work. Real
| scumbag behaviour.
| rexreed wrote:
| There's a whole lot of fakers and takers in these communities.
| Lots of people who want to ride on coattails and take what they
| can but have very little to give.
|
| As they say "it's lonely at the top" so people like to be part
| of those inner circles and take advantage of those who can.
| dzonga wrote:
| if you want a thrill, without doing drugs please engage in these
| hobbies: motorcycles, planes, freediving / cliffdiving and well
| ultra triathlons etc. rich people like larry ellison take up
| sailing and buy used fighter jets. the important thing is to
| realize you need a thrill in your life, something dangerous that
| makes you kiss death every once in a while, while not dying or
| frying your brain!!!
| isoskeles wrote:
| What a tragic end to this man's life. The "personal alarm clock"
| gets me more than a lot of the other behaviors, as it would be
| quite alienating and disrespectful to have a friend make such an
| absurd offer to you.
| max_ wrote:
| Whats sad is how everyone simply took advantage of him.
| cm2012 wrote:
| He pushed away people who tried to give him the honest truth
| crate_barre wrote:
| He wasn't in his right mind for that to be held against
| him.
| orangepurple wrote:
| Nitrous oxide abuse is really dangerous
|
| > Hi Everyone,
|
| > I have quite probably taken more Nitrous (at least in Whippit
| form) than anyone else alive. So I feel compelled to share with
| all of you - my experience.
|
| Read more: https://www.bluelight.org/xf/threads/nitrous-oxide-
| experienc...
| tudorw wrote:
| Glad you're still here to share your (mis)adventures, the
| streets here are littered with those little silver 'bullets', I
| thought we had a problem, now I'm just wondering where you
| live...
| orangepurple wrote:
| Not the OP; the original poster lives on Vancouver Island,
| British Columbia
| yevpats wrote:
| very sad though not new story about addiction and depression.
|
| Here is my comment 10 month ago after reading his book
| "Delivering Happiness":
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25326510#25326860 . Worth
| checking out the book in this context - a shadow-story about
| depression.
| Scoundreller wrote:
| For those in the EU that 8newsnow blocks:
|
| https://archive.md/ZEG3D
| sergiotapia wrote:
| I could have sworn the Zappos CEO died after being murdered by
| his personal assistant in New York. Who am I thinking of?
| [deleted]
| randycupertino wrote:
| I think you're thinking of someone else. The Zappos CEO died in
| a house fire in New London, CT.
| sokoloff wrote:
| Probably Fahim Saleh:
|
| https://abcnews.go.com/Business/police-arrest-assistant-tech...
| atombender wrote:
| Fahim Saleh:
|
| https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/14/nyregion/dismembered-body...
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fahim_Saleh
| NelsonMinar wrote:
| This picture is sad and disturbing. I also fear something like
| this could happen to a lot of people in the tech industry. Take
| care of your friends.
| Xenoamorphous wrote:
| > Our European visitors are important to us.
|
| > This site is currently unavailable to visitors from the
| European Economic Area while we work to ensure your data is
| protected in accordance with applicable EU laws.
|
| I wonder if sites will ever stop lying about this.
| sokoloff wrote:
| "Important to us, but not profitable to serve."
| jacquesm wrote:
| No, even profitable, it's just that they can't be bothered to
| disable their tracking.
| sokoloff wrote:
| If it was profitable enough to bother, I'm sure they'd do
| it.
| short12 wrote:
| If they are an American company with no presence in EU they
| can blatantly ignore the privacy laws
| gojomo wrote:
| I wonder if Europe will ever lift its Iron GDPR Curtain to
| allow its residents to access free-world websites!
| short12 wrote:
| You can just ignore it if you are not in the EU
| jacquesm wrote:
| Note that this curtain isn't put in place by the EU, nor that
| compliance with the GDPR is hard.
| CameronBanga wrote:
| Tony was probably the smartest person I have ever met. Such a sad
| and tragic story.
| dwohnitmok wrote:
| Anybody have a link to the court documents referenced in this
| news article, because I can't find it in the article itself? (As
| an aside I really would prefer news articles that are
| summarizations of other documents to please also provide the
| original document)
| pseudolus wrote:
| The case is docketed in Nevada State Court (District Court,
| County of Clark). A portal for various Nevada courts can be
| found at:
|
| https://www.clarkcountycourts.us/Portal/Home/WorkspaceMode?p...
|
| Searching is enabled at the bottom of the page. The index
| number of the case is: A-21-828090-B (the case caption is: Baby
| Monster LLC, Plaintiff(s) vs. PCVI LLC, Defendant(s)).
| Unfortunately, you have to register on the site and pay for a
| copy of the requested documents.
|
| The Daily Mail printed a story with more detail - some of the
| individuals named in the original post really come off as
| horrible - in which they've embedded some of the pleadings:
|
| https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10116643/Late-billi...
| dwohnitmok wrote:
| Awesome, thank you so much! Unfortunate that registration and
| payment is required for a government portal, but the Daily
| Mail's embedded images look to have a decent chunk of the
| arguments there.
| 1024core wrote:
| If I were close to him, I would have had him kidnapped and put on
| a remote island, far away from all these leeches.
| narrator wrote:
| This Zappos article is like the whole catalog of rich people
| problems in a nutshell: drugs, parasitic relationships, arrests,
| and dumb accidents.
|
| I know some people who know people who made a lot of money in the
| 2000s dot com boom. One of them got a "guru" who he paid several
| thousands of dollars a day to. The "guru" fed him Ayahuasca and
| people who visited the rich guy at his house said he had removed
| all furniture from his house, was wearing robes and said he could
| control the winds with his thoughts.
|
| They often say that there's no one more hopeless than a rich
| junky. If they have a very large amount of money, they never hit
| rock bottom until they're dead.
| LurkingPenguin wrote:
| > This Zappos article is like the whole catalog of rich people
| problems in a nutshell: drugs, parasitic relationships,
| arrests, and dumb accidents.
|
| Not all "rich people" have these problems. You just don't tend
| to hear about the ones who live normal lives.
| 1cvmask wrote:
| I don't think he was referring to rich "normal" people. The
| types of problems you can only have if you have a lot of
| money. Most people can't afford to be on 2 week drug binges.
| And you probably need a job to pay for your drug habit and
| most of those jobs like being a forklift operator come with
| mandatory drug testing.
|
| But if you have 200 million to play with then that is a whole
| nother ball game.
| crate_barre wrote:
| Lol, do you how many homeless drug addicts there are? It
| doesn't take that much money to go off the rails and
| sustain a habit. Even if you're going broke and can't get
| the expensive stuff, there's always alcohol which can be
| had for as little as $1.50 for a 24oz.
| FormerBandmate wrote:
| Homeless junkies and criminal junkies don't act like
| Zappos guy did
| Scoundreller wrote:
| The point being made is that it's hard to get by and be deep
| in more one of those situations if you're poor.
| Kranar wrote:
| Poor people don't get deep into drugs, aren't involved in
| numerous parasitic relationships, don't get arrested or do
| dumb things? That's only something rich people get deeply
| involved in?
|
| Of course not, it's just no one cares when a poor person
| does it. The reason we care about when rich people do it is
| precisely because we don't expect someone who is rich and
| seems to have it all to get into these situations, and the
| reality is that for the most part, they don't.
| Scoundreller wrote:
| It can get a lot worse when you have the money to enable
| drug use, have money to be parasitized, have lawyers for
| any arrest to pay a meaningless fine, or house-arrest on
| your compound(s) instead of jail time, pay for any
| accidents and pay to do dumb(er) things.
|
| So yeah, rich people can get wayyyyy deeper in any and
| all of those than poor people.
|
| A rich person is just a better resourced poor person. I'd
| argue their quality of life isn't much different except
| one can buy their way out of any problem while the other
| has to suffer it directly.
| lapetitejort wrote:
| Bill Murray said try being rich before being rich and famous.
| I'm rethinking the rich part.
| nostrademons wrote:
| Rich is better than famous. Plenty of people are quietly rich
| and basically just go about their business and live their
| lives, secure in the knowledge that there's money in the bank
| if they need it.
|
| There's no such thing as quietly famous. Many of pitfalls of
| being rich & famous, like greedy enablers and a larger-than-
| life lifestyle, stem from the "famous" part.
| lapetitejort wrote:
| The key is to _slowly_ become rich. Tony Hsieh died at 46,
| around the time most pre-rich people haven 't even made it
| out of upper middle class. Amass wealth slowly and your
| poor grifting friends will slowly be replaced with rich
| friends whose grifts will at least have a chance of return.
| ipaddr wrote:
| You see many examples of quiet famous people from
| Letterman, Carson, Conan or most politicians or most actors
| like Nicole Kidman. The ones making the headlines are a
| small percentage.
| GDC7 wrote:
| > They often say that there's no one more hopeless than a rich
| junky. If they have a very large amount of money, they never
| hit rock bottom until they're dead.
|
| Why doesn't anyone make the argument of quality vs. quantity
| when discussing such examplers
|
| 5 years spent as a rich junkie must be worth a lifetime as a
| 9-5 cubicle worker
| agustif wrote:
| Tell that to your (non-existent) kids
| [deleted]
| Waterluvian wrote:
| "5 years spent as a rich junkie must be worth a lifetime as a
| 9-5 cubicle worker."
|
| This claim demands great evidence.
| manquer wrote:
| In theory if you value variety of experiences than 5 years
| as junkie _may_ be better outcome than the a desk job.
|
| Most people don't value variety all that much which is why
| 9-5 workers are lot more common than perpetual travellers
| etc.
| WJW wrote:
| Not saying that your "may" is invalid but in practice I
| don't think most junkies vary their experience all that
| much. Getting high/stoned/intoxicated/etc every day does
| not variety make.
| schnevets wrote:
| Romantics yearn for a life where the highs are higher and
| the lows are lower... until they hit that first low.
| GDC7 wrote:
| I don't think there is a measurement who'd satisfy the
| requirement of statistical evidence.
|
| Empirically it seems to me that people nowadays are more
| scared of death than they are euphoric about life.
|
| All sorts of problems happen when this condition presents
| itself in vast pockets of the population.
|
| The fact that nobody makes a quality vs. quantity analysis
| is further proof of this
| selimthegrim wrote:
| John McAfee is not here to testify but I think the last few
| years of his life are certainly evidence - whether for or
| against that proposition I'm not sure
| sb057 wrote:
| Of course, you're assuming that a quality life is measured by
| the amount of worldly pleasures experienced.
| akudha wrote:
| I have never tried any drugs/alcohol, but I'm curious about
| Ayahuasca. Don't know anyone personally who has been through
| the ceremony, but I've listened to a bunch of interviews, read
| a bunch of articles about it.
|
| It mostly _seems_ legit, but I have no clue. Anyone here tried
| it? What was the experience like?
| gojomo wrote:
| Googling [ayahuasca experience reports] should provide a
| better mix of writeups (including both rigorously-reported
| mainstream articles & deep-forum anecdotes) than any number
| of responses inline here could.
| vincentmarle wrote:
| If you've never tried any drugs/alcohol then I would strongly
| recommend not do it. I've tried plenty of drugs but ayahuesca
| is still something that I would have to think about before
| trying it.
| jacquesm wrote:
| I've seen enough intelligent and otherwise reasonable people
| go down that road and not come back that I would caution you
| to be very, very wary and to suspect that anybody that
| invites you to join them in their trips is a lobster looking
| to pull you down into the pot, not to lift you out of it.
| tudorw wrote:
| Ayahuasca, hmm, a drug you might choose to use for health
| reasons in the same way a car accident might re-align your
| back, it's extremely dangerous to use and anyone who tells
| you different is probably trying to sell something that
| cannot be bought.
| captainredbeard wrote:
| I know someone who, for all practical purposes, destroyed
| their life after an Ayahuasca trip. He was a VP at a major
| international company and is now a new age hippie.
| ipaddr wrote:
| It sounds like he found something and left the rat race.
| Was his life destroyed?
| InitialLastName wrote:
| Is he less happy now? A burden for anyone else?
| potatoman22 wrote:
| Try shrooms or acid before Ayahuasca. DMT is something not to
| be taken lightly
| weq wrote:
| lol at the money junkies trying to justify there high over the
| people who use substances to give them delusions of grandeur.
| jacquesm wrote:
| > One of them got a "guru" who he paid several thousands of
| dollars a day to. The "guru" fed him Ayahuasca and people who
| visited the rich guy at his house said he had removed all
| furniture from his house, was wearing robes and said he could
| control the winds with his thoughts.
|
| I think we have this acquaintance in common.
| teakettle42 wrote:
| > They often say that there's no one more hopeless than a rich
| junky. If they have a very large amount of money, they never
| hit rock bottom until they're dead.
|
| She's fortunately still alive, but when I divorced my ex-wife
| over her substance abuse, she walked away with ~$1M in cash.
|
| It took three years of partying, but she finally ran out of
| money, hit rock bottom, went to AA, and is actually looking for
| a job.
|
| It was sad to watch, and infuriating to be forced to be her
| enabler by the state after she'd already cost me so much. No-
| fault divorce is a broken system.
| twiddling wrote:
| "No-fault divorce is a broken system."
|
| Or was it a community property state?
| teakettle42 wrote:
| It's an "equitable distribution" state; property is divided
| without regard to marital misconduct or fault.
| jjtheblunt wrote:
| > No-fault means what?
| specto wrote:
| I believe they are referring to half of all assets going to
| your spouse without a prenuptial agreement even if there
| was a good reason for divorce.
| to11mtm wrote:
| That's not the same as no-fault divorce though. That's
| typically a Community Property provision.
| pinewurst wrote:
| I'm strongly reminded of Howard Hughes, as mentally ill, drug-
| addicted prisoner of his "staff".
| hacksnewer wrote:
| You're not far off but the sad thing is that Hughes died 30
| years later. He died due to malnutrition and for years his
| various control centers had run operations separate enough from
| him that he had no clue what was going on sometimes, but he
| still was running much of his empire in that penthouse up to
| the early 70s.
|
| Hughes was a direct part of Watergate.
| s5300 wrote:
| Howard Hughes had severe allodynia in an age in which there was
| no real medical treatment for it
|
| Still, to this day, there is no amazing treatment for it.
| Especially because there are more than a few not well
| understood causes of it. Some medications work well for some,
| but not at all for others.
|
| Hughes was, by all accounts, essentially a prisoner of his
| unrelenting misfiring nervous system. I think he lived out his
| final years with it in a fairly reasonable way.
|
| Speaking as somebody with a moderate case of allodynia caused
| by a functional musculoskeletal condition, if my case was a bit
| worse, with no hope for treatment in sight, and I was loaded
| like he was - I too would likely spend my time in isolation and
| on a _lot_ of drugs, really anything that would relieve the
| sensory pain, no matter how cognitively impaired it may make
| me.
| Scoundreller wrote:
| For some of us:
|
| allodynia: "Allodynia is a type of neuropathic pain (nerve
| pain). People with allodynia are extremely sensitive to
| touch. Things that don't usually cause pain can be very
| painful. These may include cold temperatures, brushing hair
| or wearing a cotton t-shirt. Allodynia can result from
| several conditions."
|
| https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/symptoms/21570-allodyn.
| ..
| pinewurst wrote:
| From the biographies I've read, it sounded like OCD was at
| the center - not dismissing persistent pain originating in
| multiple airplane crashes...
| walrus01 wrote:
| There are also a number of credible reports that Hughes had
| severely screwed up his lower back, spine and tendons,
| ligaments and musculature in earlier airplane crashes. Never
| properly treated, and medicated over the years with
| increasing amounts of self-administered drugs of his choice.
| jacquesm wrote:
| There was at least one crash that he simply shouldn't have
| walked away from.
|
| https://www.latimes.com/visuals/photography/la-me-fw-
| archive...
| ebanana wrote:
| clearly struggling with extreme depression. like i get it, it is
| good to produce products and build a better life for us all. but
| there are unaddressed societal issues that cause this type of
| outcome
| nobrains wrote:
| ketamine seems lately to my very common in drug and addiction
| related cases, including deaths.
| Scoundreller wrote:
| > According to friends, Hsieh used "as many as 50 cartridges of
| nitrous oxide a day, often in public, or during 'meetings' with
| people
|
| I mean, it's a lot, but I'm surprised it's not higher. Each
| cartridge yields a minute, maybe two, of intoxication before a
| quick return to baseline.
|
| Probably less intoxication than hits of ketamine with its half
| life of 1-2 hours.
|
| But it may have been on top of other substance use. Nitrous use
| is just very overt.
|
| The chronic nitrous use will make it extremely difficult to
| maintain adequate vitamin B12 levels. Nitrous is very effective
| at deactivating it, and diet doesn't have a ton. B12 deficiency
| has lots of nasty neurological effects:
| https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitamin_B12_deficiency
|
| Even passive (same room) exposure to nitrous oxide leads to 25%
| reduced b12 levels.
|
| https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/17951609/
|
| Who the hell knows what else nitrous is oxidizing away over the
| long term.
|
| Cartridges often have a little machine oil impurity that will add
| up when consuming the amount that would be in 1L of whipped cream
| 50x a day. Hopefully he acquired the good ones.
| AlbertCory wrote:
| Before he died, there were stories about how he'd tried to
| single-handedly reinvent downtown Las Vegas (not the Strip). Does
| anyone know what happened to all that?
| MentallyRetired wrote:
| More than stories. He put $350m into it and it's still going.
| https://dtplv.com/
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