[HN Gopher] Fake shutters make me angry
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Fake shutters make me angry
Author : quantumb
Score : 48 points
Date : 2021-10-22 20:43 UTC (2 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (thecraftsmanblog.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (thecraftsmanblog.com)
| analyte123 wrote:
| These "fake shutters" are just window trim, and there's nothing
| wrong with that. This type of misguided plea for authenticity
| would be valid if somebody put mis-sized or fake shutters on an
| actual period house, but most of these houses are modern. They
| weren't designed to have real shutters, they don't need real
| shutters to thermally perform, and the material and type of real
| shutters that you put on houses that actually need hurricane
| protection now is, surprisingly, not always the same as it was
| 100 years ago. This is like complaining about "fake columns" on a
| neoclassical facade. Or the non-structural "fake brick" on any
| modern building.
| peanut_worm wrote:
| > This is like complaining about "fake columns" on a
| neoclassical facade. Or the non-structural "fake brick" on any
| modern building.
|
| Those seem like valid things to complain about.
| chana_masala wrote:
| There's nothing wrong with your view or the author's, however
| it seems like you're talking past each other because neither of
| you are each other's target demographic.
|
| This is like complaining about how bad JavaScript is as a
| language on a thread about React, or something. It's nearly
| irrelevant
| JohnFen wrote:
| > This is like complaining about "fake columns" on a
| neoclassical facade. Or the non-structural "fake brick" on any
| modern building.
|
| It is. But I'm more on the author's side than not on this. I
| mean, fake shutters don't make me angry -- but I do notice them
| because they look so stupid. I feel similarly about most fake
| columns. Not so much about fake brick.
|
| I think I react that way because they're so obviously fake --
| that's what makes them stupid. If they were decorative but
| plausible, I'd react differently. I suspect that's why I don't
| mind the fake brick -- most fake brick looks realistic.
| jessaustin wrote:
| Fake brick may be fine; I haven't done an extensive survey.
| The fake rock sold for use on exteriors, however, is awful.
| If you're closer than twenty feet, the wood glue they use to
| paste it to the paneling is the most visible feature. Nothing
| that looks like mortar is used. Closer up, the "rocks"
| themselves start to look like those sold for aquariums. I
| suspect that the architects who spec these never visit their
| mistakes.
| kstrauser wrote:
| I agree. Know what I hate way more than fake shutters? Giant
| flat exterior walls, usually on the site of the house, with a
| couple of small, undecorated windows. To me, they look like a
| kid drew a house and then remembered to draw a couple of holes
| on it.
| linksnapzz wrote:
| House-shaped box. Windows are expensive, see. It's especially
| annoying when the home is in a northerly latitude, and the
| S/SE facing side has no windows.
| mc32 wrote:
| One of the worst offenders are the low-rise apartment
| buildings painted in beige or other "semi-arid" palette that
| are built with a street level soft storey and have square
| holes in the walls for windows but are otherwise unadorned.
| The kinds that northridge often toppled.
|
| They suck.
| function_seven wrote:
| I have no problem with non-functional facsimiles of things.
| Like, I'd rather have a stick-framed house with brick veneer
| than an actual brick house. (Easier to modify, better seismic,
| better insulation, etc.) Brick _looks_ nice, and that 's all
| I'm wanting out of it.
|
| Same with my old patio. Instead of paying lots of money for
| large-format tiles, I had someone skim coat some colored
| concrete on top, using pin-striping tape to give the illusion
| of grout lines. (Tape is pulled up after concrete cures a bit,
| so there's actual grooves) Came out looking fantastic, and was
| much cheaper. But the guy who did it still had to pay attention
| to the details, like not having patterns magically cross the
| grout lines. Real tile would never do that, so my fake tile
| better not, either.
|
| My issue with these shutters isn't that they're not "real", but
| that their attempt to mimic fails and basically sticks out as
| shoddy work.
|
| Go ahead and fake it, but please put some effort into the
| illusion. Otherwise why bother with louvers that slant wrong,
| and shutters that have no hope of matching the adjacent
| window's proportion?
| NikolaNovak wrote:
| I appreciate your point of view, and I find it somewhat
| persuasive.
|
| But my personal aesthetic compass swings back and still chafes
| at the "non-functional" functional part. More than any other
| analogy, it reminds me of fake scoops or vents on some sport
| cars or sport image cars, which are actually completely non-
| permeable and definitely don't lead anywhere or do anything.
| They're aesthetic trim yes, but they're also a... Dunno,
| pretense? It reveals a slightly "wannabe" attitude.
|
| Though it's possible I'm reading too much into the whole thing
| - non functional spoilers / wings don't bother me nearly as
| much on cars. Maybe fake shutters just look cheesier?
|
| So I guess that fake brick feels like non functional spoilers.
| Fake shutters feel like non functional scoops.
| bombcar wrote:
| If you dress up for the opera, take a look at your clothes -
| almost every aspect will be some "fake aesthetic" that has
| become standard.
|
| I was hoping for more detailed reasoning beyond "it's fake
| and not a great imitation" - but so are many other vestigial
| fashion items. Ties don't work well as bibs anymore, after
| all.
| bryanrasmussen wrote:
| given the argument that good design is functional design
| fake anything that serves no functional purpose would, if
| that argument holds sway, be bad.
| UncleOxidant wrote:
| Now people are putting fake handles on their roll-up garage
| doors to make them look like a door that opens horizontally
| in the middle. I find it even worse than the fake shutters.
| philwelch wrote:
| The difference is that fake brick and fake columns can form
| visually convincing illusions. Fake shutters aren't a
| convincing illusion of real shutters, but they look enough like
| shutters that they aren't convincing as non-functional
| decoration, either.
|
| If you had fake shutters that were wide enough that I could
| imagine them being able to cover the window if they were able
| to close, I personally wouldn't be bothered by them.
| bombcar wrote:
| What about real but collapsible shutters? They often come
| from above but they scrunch down to a smaller space than
| actual shutters would.
| insaneirish wrote:
| It's a form of skeuomorphism and it's something that greatly
| irritates me as well. Unfortunately, it's only one of the many
| common design atrocities you see in most neighborhoods.
|
| Get Your House Right by Marianne Cusato
| (https://www.amazon.com/Get-Your-House-Right-Architectural/dp...)
| is a really good book that helps you appreciate some of the finer
| details of architecture in your own home.
| kingcharles wrote:
| What do we think the estimated ratio of fake shutters to real
| shutters is in the world?
|
| Is there any other thing in the world where the fakes happily
| outnumbered the reals?
| dragonwriter wrote:
| > Is there any other thing in the world where the fakes happily
| outnumbered the reals?
|
| Lots of things.
|
| Nonavian dinosaurs. Pockets on formalwear. Grassroots activist
| groups. Mona Lisas. Bombs smuggled into airports. At one time,
| Saddam Husseins (come to think of it, that's possibly true now
| for much the same reason as nonavian dinosaurs.) Pieces of the
| true cross. ...
| kingcharles wrote:
| LOL. Great list. Thank you. You're right about the fake bombs
| and Husseins. Mona Lisas is a contentious entry.
|
| I guess fake indignation generally outperforms the authentic
| version too.
| nwatson wrote:
| Fashion. Ties on men. "Shutters" on windows. I bet the author
| wears ties on occasion (hmmm, couldn't find a corroborating
| image).
| buggeryorkshire wrote:
| My partner bought me a tie for her sons wedding a couple of
| weeks ago. It must be at least 10 years since I wore one and I
| genuinely could not work out why we had to.
|
| In the 90s you needed one to get into a nightclub, never mind
| the day job. They've completely disappeared since thank God.
|
| As it was I forgot to bring it to the wedding so didn't wear it
| anyway. Next time will probably be at my funeral, when i'm dead
| in a casket and won't have a choice.
| a4isms wrote:
| Men's neckties began as bibs. Then ornamentation took over,
| until they lost their original function. Much like a bird of
| paradise evolving long tail feathers that attract mates, but
| no longer keep it warm or help it fly.
| philwelch wrote:
| I thought they began as scarves--or, more specifically, a
| fancy way to wear your scarf when you weren't using it to
| cover your neck.
|
| Which is the same backstory as collars (you're supposed to
| pop them to cover your neck!).
| buggeryorkshire wrote:
| I never knew that, thank you. Will use it the next time
| somebody insists I wear a tie.
|
| It was funny though - when I was a teenager I was a bit
| skint, like most. You needed to wear a suit and tie to get
| into most nightclubs at the time. Obviously a suit was a
| bit spendy, so you generally had 1 decent suit, so the only
| way to differentiate yourself each time was a new tie.
|
| Must have bought hundreds of the bloody things, only to
| discard them after 2 or 3 uses.
|
| Had a discussion about this a few weeks ago - is Tie Rack
| still a thing? They used to have shops everywhere in the
| UK, but maybe they're still around at airports or whatnot?
| Causality1 wrote:
| Fake shutters aren't any more or less stupid than a painting
| hanging on a wall. It's an aesthetic accoutrement that makes
| people happy. If you have a problem with that you need to fold up
| your lawn chair, go back inside, and find something better to do
| with your time.
| chana_masala wrote:
| Maybe you could write a blog post about how people should stop
| writing blog posts about fake shutters, then when it gets
| posted to HN the contrarian crowd like yourself can complain
| and wish that you'd just fold up your lawn chair and stop
| complaining about people complaining about fake shutters.
| AnimalMuppet wrote:
| And if fake shutters are the thing that you're getting angry
| about, you aren't paying attention.
| EamonnMR wrote:
| It's not just shutters. Many aspects of modern home design are an
| attempt to look somewhat similar to older styles in ways that do
| not hold up to scrutiny. For example the siding on my house is
| vinyl but it's meant to look like wood shingles. The concrete
| foundation is covered with fake vinyl brick. This was probably
| all installed at the same time as the fake shutters.
| marcosdumay wrote:
| The "wooden" vinyl surfaces are just great. They have almost
| all the upsides of wood and ceramic at the same time.
| bserge wrote:
| I've seen those before on American houses, I always thought they
| were rather cute design choices... not fake shutters. Can't unsee
| it now :D
| lotsofpulp wrote:
| Read this website and you won't be able to unsee a lot of
| things:
|
| https://mcmansionhell.com/
| h2odragon wrote:
| Look at it differently: there's a market for more creative
| plastic window accent trim thingies. I'm thinking a pair of
| goatse hands, or T Rex heads with big fangs...
| zwieback wrote:
| The house we bought (in 95) had those and we took them off and
| right away put them back on, looks better with.
|
| Arguing against them is like arguing against painting your house
| different colors, seems silly. Also, real shutters aren't as
| practical as curtains or internal blinds.
| jessaustin wrote:
| Given the housing inhabited by many of my neighbors, to my eye
| fake shutters say "mobile home" more insistently than any of the
| statements in TFA or ITT. One suspects that if more people saw
| mobile homes more often, their tastes in adequate suburban
| exterior accents might change.
|
| As a child I lived in a mobile home for years. There's nothing
| wrong with mobile homes. However, they are not concerned with
| good taste. (This is an advantage: many residents don't have time
| for complex yet relatively lower priorities like taste.) Neither
| is any other home with fake shutters.
| MisterBastahrd wrote:
| Fake shutters exist because home exteriors look barren without
| them. Additionally, shutters predate window blinds, blackout
| shades, etc. I don't know about anyone else, but I'm not a huge
| fan of hearing shutters bang against the side of my house in a
| windy storm.
|
| At my folks' house, they've kept their fake shutters and also
| have these galvanized storm shutters which open and close from
| the top. They block out some sunlight but also keep the house
| cooler and make for less effort when securing windows in the
| event of hurricanes.
| dvtrn wrote:
| This much energy and passion about faux-window shutters is kind
| of impressive.
| pavon wrote:
| I might be misremembering, but I'm pretty sure my grandparent's
| house had bifold shutters[1], which genuinely are just 1/4 the
| width of the window, and the visible slats when open (and folded)
| face the same way they would when closed. I always assumed that
| was the style that all the fake shutters were copying, negating
| his first two points in most cases.
|
| [1] https://www.newhorizonshutters.com/new-page-321
| cesarb wrote:
| > and the visible slats when open (and folded) face the same
| way they would when closed.
|
| Looking at the diagram on that page (which matches my childhood
| memories of a similar window shutter design), the "outside
| shutter" turns 180deg when open, so the visible slats would be
| facing the opposite direction. It's the "inside shutter" which
| turns 360deg and thus would have the visible slats facing the
| same direction, but when fully open it's hidden by the "outside
| shutter".
| [deleted]
| AlbertCory wrote:
| Everyone making fun of this guy is correct.
|
| I live in a neighborhood where all the (stucco) houses were built
| in the 50s. They almost all have fake shutters, and the ones that
| don't, look stupid.
|
| Now, McMansion "pillars" -- those _do_ make me crazy (irony
| intended).
| a4isms wrote:
| "Ornament is Crime"
|
| --Modernism's rallying cry, beginning with Adolf Loos in 1910.
|
| Are we still doing this debate a century later? I think for the
| most part, not. It's fine to like ornament. It's fine to prefer
| form that follows function.
|
| But getting angry about ornament? This can't be good for
| anybody's blood pressure.
| burlesona wrote:
| The video at the end is pretty good, although the article spoils
| it a bit :D
|
| I will say this is only one of many dozen things that are very
| fake and chintzy about most architecture, and once you start to
| see them you can't unsee them. The truth is that people like
| cheap, tacky stuff, and "knowing better" just makes one
| miserable, so I would say if you want to be happy then don't
| learn about architecture. Even more so, don't learn about
| urbanism and urban design -- just so painful.
|
| (Caveat, this is mostly only true in places built after 1950 or
| so. Older places are often delightful for the architecture /
| urbanism inclined.)
| bombcar wrote:
| It's the kerning thing - once you notice it you see it
| everywhere.
|
| My house has fake shutters and I actually took one off to see
| what it looked like - I put it back on as it just didn't look
| right.
| drivers99 wrote:
| You reminded me of a video from Strongtowns I saw recently and
| now get annoyed when I see something specific out by the
| street. This video even starts with a disclaimer to not watch
| it if you don't want to be continuously annoyed by the built
| environment. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=of81YkHsv88 (59
| seconds long)
| hairofadog wrote:
| I've been considering making "real" shutters for my house (mostly
| for fun), but haven't yet thought of a way to do it that wouldn't
| be a fire hazard when they're closed.
| bombcar wrote:
| Mount the entire shutter assembly on an "oh shit" handle that
| falls off the house if pulled.
| fnord77 wrote:
| in my mom's basement, there's about 2 dozen pairs of real antique
| wooden shutters, probably maple stained dark from another house.
|
| I have no idea what to do with them. They're very nice looking
| but the house they fit is gone. I don't think there were standard
| size windows when these were made
| neverartful wrote:
| If the wood is in good condition you could probably sell them
| easily to someone who would find creative uses for them.
| bombcar wrote:
| Yeah list them on Craigslist for some stupid amount of money,
| and see what happens.
| neverartful wrote:
| Fake shutters don't make me angry (not important enough for
| that), however, I do find them quite silly and pointless.
| buggeryorkshire wrote:
| There was a thing 10-20 years ago in the UK where there'd be
| pillars in front of the front door. They didn't hold anything up
| and were purely decorative, but people loved them for some
| reason.
|
| Decorative facades have always been a thing, it's just the form
| that changes.
| Ancapistani wrote:
| Take that a step further, and you have pilasters - a facade of
| a column.
|
| Pilasters have been a design feature as far back as at least
| the Roman Empire...
| buggeryorkshire wrote:
| Yup. Turns out people love pimping their houses!
| neither_color wrote:
| This is one of those things I was better off not knowing, now
| it's going to mildly irritate me because I live in the suburbs
| and every house has these.
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