[HN Gopher] New Zealand council ends contract with wizard after ...
___________________________________________________________________
New Zealand council ends contract with wizard after 23 years of
service
Author : samizdis
Score : 156 points
Date : 2021-10-15 07:59 UTC (15 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.theguardian.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.theguardian.com)
| sneak wrote:
| Glad to see that Mel found some work after Royal McBee.
| andylynch wrote:
| This is a shame - he's getting on a bit now but is and always has
| been a Christchurch institution.
|
| For those who don't know much about him, there's a good profile
| here:
| https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/eyewitness/audio/2...
| throwawaylinux wrote:
| It sounds all in great fun but as I've grown bitter and
| realistic about governments I have to wonder how was the
| contract decided and awarded, and whether other artists and
| entertainers allowed to apply and given fair and reasonable
| consideration.
|
| Might be better for all involved if he's commissioned by the
| art gallery or gets crowd funding or something.
| andylynch wrote:
| He's somewhat unique - and possibly the only state wizard in
| the world. Bureaucrats tend not to know what to do with him.
|
| Worth pointing out he was doing this for decades before the
| council started supporting him and he will probably carry on.
| throwawaylinux wrote:
| Yeah but the old "just this once because it's a unique
| situation and surely nobody would care and and everybody
| would agree it's for the best anyway and I can't even see
| how it's a problem in the first place" is how a lot of
| corruption happens.
|
| If the mayor's brother was given a no-bid contract to be
| appointed court jester or town drunk and given $368,000 for
| his services, the problem would become easier to see. Even
| if it was possibly the only such appointment in the world.
| Aeolun wrote:
| But none of those things are true. He's not a court
| jester, he's nobody's brother, he's doing it regardless
| of pay, and the amount he was paid for it was by all
| measures a paltry sum. It doesn't look like a problem
| because it isn't one.
| throwawaylinux wrote:
| Are you being deliberately obtuse, or do you actually
| think I said he was a court jester?? Do you think that
| $368,000[1] of public money for a small local government
| is a "paltry sum" , or that the amount of money changes
| whether a politician should have to follow proper
| processes?
|
| I know lots of people wouldn't think it's a problem and
| I'm an old curmudgeon. Lots of people are fine with low
| level corruption and poor practices that can lead to
| corruption or the appearance of corruption. I
| acknowledged that the very first thing I said, if that
| also wasn't clear.
|
| [1] Sure its NZD but come on that's got to be at least 80
| real dollars.
| vel0city wrote:
| Over the course of 20 years $368k isn't a whole ton of
| money for a local government budget. $1,533/mo. That's
| NZ$0.004/mo per resident.
|
| Besides, he was providing somewhat of a public good in
| terms of tourism. It wasn't like he was just collecting a
| paycheck doing absolutely nothing. It doesn't appear he
| has any family or other business connections with that
| local government from a quick glance, so honestly his
| position seems about the same as any other local
| government employee. Is hiring a gardener giving an
| appearance of corruption as well?
| lostlogin wrote:
| The population of Christchurch is 395,000ish, depending
| on what you include. How do you calculate $0.004 per
| month?
| vel0city wrote:
| 368,000 total compensation / 20 years gives annual
| income.
|
| Per year / 12 months gives per month of $1,533.
|
| $1,533 wizard's monthly income / 395,000 population is
| ~0.0038810. I originally used a population of 390,000
| which is ~0.0039308. I then just rounded to the nearest
| thousandth for the comment as I figured fractions of a
| penny that small are somewhat meaningless to my comment.
| lostlogin wrote:
| Thank you, not sure why I couldn't do that, but I
| couldn't.
| dane-pgp wrote:
| > at least 80 real dollars.
|
| By "real" you presumably mean "Bohemian":
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dollar#History
| Aeolun wrote:
| My point is that he's _actually_ providing a service (or
| has been anyway).
|
| These things become problematic when no service is
| provided, or the quality of service is lower than you
| would have gotten otherwise.
|
| Clearly service _was_ provided for going on 20 years, so
| that's just fact.
|
| I also think that $18.000 NZD per year, for any local
| government, hell, even for a corner bakery, is a paltry
| amount. That's below minimum wage anywhere that I know
| of.
| amcoastal wrote:
| Have you thought this through at all? There are so many
| instances of local governments paying single artists for
| their art that isn't a problem. Have you walked around a
| city and enjoyed murals or art installations? Do you see
| those and your hair stands up on your neck worrying about
| the bidding process for those pieces? Why do you not want
| people to have nice things.
| throwawaylinux wrote:
| You didn't answer my questions, but I'll be polite and
| answer yours. Yes, yes, and yes.
|
| Have you thought about it at all? You clearly completely
| missed the point with my example when you triumphantly
| announced he isn't anyone's brother. You don't know what
| he does for the person giving him public money. Similarly
| way off the point saying he's not a jester. Why should a
| jester not be allowed to have public money but a "wizard"
| can?
|
| > There are so many instances of local governments paying
| single artists for their art that isn't a problem.
|
| Non sequitur. I can't quite fathom this thinking. There
| are lots of instances of local governments paying for
| lots of things, and lots of instances of corruption in
| local government.
|
| > Have you walked around a city and enjoyed murals or art
| installations? Do you see those and your hair stands up
| on your neck worrying about the bidding process for those
| pieces?
|
| Yes absolutely if they are or seem questionable.
|
| > Why do you not want people to have nice things.
|
| Pathetic.
| ganzuul wrote:
| People have been writing occult literature for as long as
| writing has existed. Artists and entertainers are not exposed
| to the spiritual arts (e.g. OOBEs) even though they employ
| the same state of consciousness.
|
| No one is entitled to occult knowledge because all of it is
| of a deeply personal nature. In a culture where answers are
| demanded like a privilege, the occultists are going to remain
| hidden from view.
| dr_dshiv wrote:
| Well, you can just Google it these days. If know what you
| are looking for.
|
| Check out http://www.SHWEP.net (the secret history of
| western esotericism) for a rigorous review of occult
| history & scholarship. It is fabulous podcasting. Start
| with the podcast introduction then dive into the
| Pythagorean-Platonic tradition.
| ganzuul wrote:
| This is wonderful thank you. - As for starting from the
| beginning: over my dead body. I start from the end and
| figure out how we got there, always.
| tim333 wrote:
| OOBEs? I sometimes think people shouldn't use abbreviations
| that don't come up in the first 10 results on Google. I
| assume it's not "Windows Out of Box Experience (OOBE)."
| rapnie wrote:
| Almost. Out of body experiences.
| JamesBarney wrote:
| He'd been doing it over over 20 years before he was given the
| contract.
|
| Also what does fair and reasonable consideration mean, more
| hoops of paper should have been jumped through before making
| this decision?
|
| In hindsight they obviously made the right choice. If you
| select a random artist or entertainer to give money to what
| are the chances they'll get nearly as famous as this wizard?
| bovermyer wrote:
| New Zealand definitely has a refreshing sense of whimsy.
|
| Here in the US, if there was an official government wizard,
| certain segments of the population would be up in arms.
| mbg721 wrote:
| There is; we just call the position "Chair of the Federal
| Reserve."
| someperson wrote:
| To be fair, in the US context, the term "Grand Wizard" (or
| "Imperial Wizard") is the title of the national leader of the
| Ku Klux Klan violent ethno-supremacist hate group.
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ku_Klux_Klan_titles_and_vocabu...
| gremloni wrote:
| That's not whimsy though.
| mkr-hn wrote:
| I've always been annoyed at how they ruined a name like
| "Grand Wizard."
| bovermyer wrote:
| There is that, yeah. This is why we can't have nice things.
| [deleted]
| LightG wrote:
| Gandalf will be p!ssed.
| Cthulhu_ wrote:
| You accidentally wrote an upside-down i
| dane-pgp wrote:
| Or, if they were writing to the council in New Zealand, it's
| all the other letters that are upside-down.
| pepoluan wrote:
| He actually wrote "bisseq" but upside-down.
| jordemort wrote:
| For as old as he is and as little as he costs, if I were the city
| council I might be inclined to just keep paying him until he
| died. Beats getting turned into a frog, or having your firstborn
| cursed.
| q1w2 wrote:
| Having spent time in city council budget meetings, I can tell
| you that animosity over seemingly tiny expenditures can be
| unreal, and not at all worth the fight.
| belval wrote:
| That's my take as well, the guy is 88 years old, just keep
| paying him, for 16k$ he's a nice tourist attraction.
| X6S1x6Okd1st wrote:
| Depends on whether he is spending his time yelling about how
| men need to take over the world.
| xyzzy123 wrote:
| He's basically a professor with (>>>) 20 years of
| professional speaking and comedy experience (regular
| professors _mostly_ just speak with people who have paid to
| agree with them).
|
| I can pretty much guarantee you that if the wizard decided
| men should take over the world (HA, good luck) you would
| have a surprising amount of fun debating that position with
| him. You would do well to understand that he's pretty
| subversive and might never know if he's _actually_ on the
| side he says he 's on or not (possibly asking really nicely
| would do it).
|
| A lot of people who talk to the "wizard" are a _lot_
| stupider than the wizard.
|
| I cannot believe those idiots at the city council do not
| understand the value of what they have. Even if the guy
| starts to lose his marbles he'll still be able to provide
| directions for Americans and maybe if it gets really bad he
| could be given aspirin or assisted suicide pills (properly
| labelled, obviously) to hand out to the Dutch.
| AussieWog93 wrote:
| He's always welcome in Melbourne! Can protest outside Tecoma
| Maccas with Baba Desi.
| tenryuu wrote:
| If he comes to Melbourne, can we ask him to help stop it from
| raining every, single, goddamn, day?
| hilbert42 wrote:
| Well, well, well! I knew Ian Channell at university in the late
| 1960s, he was a lecturer in sociology although I wasn't studying
| the subject.
|
| That was the time of the anti-Vietnam War demonstrations across
| the world and one of the consequences was heightened political
| action by students - the like of which has never been seen since,
| it was then that Channell started a students' movement called Alf
| - Action for Love and Freedom. Students met in one of the
| Students' Union buildings after lectures but that's a separate
| story (and quite an interesting one at that).
|
| I caught up with him again by sheer accident in the 1980s when on
| a skiing trip in New Zealand when I managed to catch sight of him
| doing his wizard performance in the square just outside
| Christchurch's cathedral (since badly damaged in the 2011
| earthquake). Afterwards, a skiing friend and I joined him for
| afternoon tea in a local coffee shop where we reminisced and
| chewed the cud for several hours.
|
| 'Tis a very small world.
| 323 wrote:
| Michael Lewis wrote about something related in Iceland, when he
| covered the 2009 financial crisis and it's impact on Iceland:
|
| > Alcoa, the biggest aluminum company in the country, encountered
| two problems peculiar to Iceland when, in 2004, it set about
| erecting its giant smelting plant. The first was the so-called
| hidden people--or, to put it more plainly, elves--in whom some
| large number of Icelanders, steeped long and thoroughly in their
| rich folkloric culture, sincerely believe. Before Alcoa could
| build its smelter it had to defer to a government expert to scour
| the enclosed plant site and certify that no elves were on or
| under it. It was a delicate corporate situation, an Alcoa
| spokesman told me, because they had to pay hard cash to declare
| the site elf-free, but, as he put it, "we couldn't as a company
| be in a position of acknowledging the existence of hidden
| people."
| Ajay-p wrote:
| So many people are losing their jobs in this pandemic, it's very
| sad.
| hyperman1 wrote:
| So first there was the fictional Harry Dresden, the only wizard
| who advertised in the phone book. And now this.
|
| Again and again, reality is stranger than fiction. We wouldn't
| want it any different.
| boomboomsubban wrote:
| So they hired him right when Jackson would have been preparing to
| star shooting "The Lord of the Rings." I wonder if the two events
| were related.
| andylynch wrote:
| He wasn't hired so much as he turned up in the cathedral square
| with a step ladder one day and the city couldn't stop him.
| cjrp wrote:
| At some point they started paying a salary though
| Ancapistani wrote:
| The fact that the man somehow convinced the government to
| pay him for something he was already doing strikes me as
| strong evidence for his efficacy as a wizard.
| mkl wrote:
| A very common sight in central Christchurch over the decades. He
| took on a series of apprentices for a while, but I haven't heard
| of one sticking with it to replace him:
| https://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/9647486/Wizard-takes-...,
| https://www.stuff.co.nz/auckland/108126353/auckland-apprenti...,
| https://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/editors-picks/8639255/The-...
| toyg wrote:
| This sort of character is often not the most agreeable person
| when the lights are off, so to speak. It takes a lot of self-
| confidence and disregard for the opinion of others, to put
| yourself out like that - maybe even a hint of actual mental-
| health imbalance.
|
| Where I'm from, there was this guy who basically started
| playing electric-guitar solos in the central square of the
| city, and then went on "performing" like that for about 30
| years - including various spats with local authorities (who
| didn't necessarily appreciate it when he showed up without
| permits). Everybody knew he was a proper knob in real life (or
| he'd be in a band, right?), even though he had become a bit of
| a local institution (even ran for mayor, at one point, with
| predictably bad results).
| gremloni wrote:
| That's just presumptuous and unfair to the guy.
| tim333 wrote:
| He doesn't seem super agreeable when performing but is an
| interesting character
| https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=icj5Aow_jec
| hilbert42 wrote:
| As someone who knew Ian Channell at university, I'll
| mention two things about him, the first is his overwhelming
| enthusiasm for whatever he's involved in; second, he
| attempts to get people to think outside the box and to
| figure things out for themselves (remember he used to be a
| uni lecturer).
|
| He'd often say that anally-retentive thinking was a major
| problem with the world. So don't be fooled into thinking
| that his true persona is what he's demonstrating during his
| wizard performances. His seemingly outrageous hyperbole is
| deliberately meant to make you think.
|
| The world needs more people like him.
| icu wrote:
| When I was a young child, growing up in the US, I was given a
| children's book called Bidibidi (by Gavin Bishop) by my Kiwi
| grandmother. If I remember correctly, the Wizard saves Bidibidi
| (who is a sheep). When my father, remarked that there was a real
| Wizard in New Zealand, who lived in Christchurch, it sparked a
| lot of wonder and excitement about the Wizard in a far off land.
| I can't be the only child who found out about the Wizard and was
| enchanted by the thought of him.
|
| I get that the public purse must be spent well, but I wonder how
| much wonder and excitement gets lost everytime weird and
| wonderful traditions like this end.
|
| Surely the price of child wonderment is worth more than
| NZ$16k/year?
|
| As an adult reading about the Wizard being deemed 'a living work
| of art' it seems like an appealing philosophical take on the
| human experience. I think we all should be reminded now and then
| to consider ourselves artists across the tapestry of time.
| boomboomsubban wrote:
| >Surely the price of child wonderment is worth more than
| NZ$16k/year?
|
| Even if it is, the man is 88 and becoming to old to perform his
| "duties." Imagine how you would feel if your family took a trip
| to Christchurch and the wizard was too unwell to perform.
| dylan604 wrote:
| Sounds like he needs an apprentice
| crb wrote:
| He had one: https://interactives.stuff.co.nz/2019/11/the-
| apprentice-wiza...
|
| It sounded like he didn't really choose to have one, just
| another guy showed up and said "I'm your apprentice".
| Though that's much like how Channell showed up in the 70s.
| mikub wrote:
| Then you tell your children that the wizard is away to rescue
| someone or something like that, that's what wizards do. Maybe
| that will teach your kids to be alittle bit more patient, and
| maybe it teaches you that you don't get everything you want
| "because you paid for it". Seriously, if i plan a trip to
| some 88 year old guy and they tell me he is to sick to come
| to work today, I wouldnt even think about wanting money back
| or demand that he shows up, you should just let this guy have
| a break and go on with your life.
| boomboomsubban wrote:
| So lie to your child or completely kill the wonder of the
| whole thing by telling them this is all just a huge lie
| they paid for. Seems like just employing a fitter wizard is
| a better choice.
| krapp wrote:
| >Seems like just employing a fitter wizard is a better
| choice.
|
| The better choice is teaching children early on about the
| difference between reality and fantasy, and that often
| adults will pretend fantasy is real, sometimes for fun,
| but also sometimes to manipulate people.
| egypturnash wrote:
| I think the last time I heard anything about the Wizard
| of Christchurch it was a little human-intrest story that
| was just "hey did you know this NZ town has a wizard",
| and there was mention of an apprentice he was training to
| take over the gig when he got too old. Guess that fell
| through.
| 300bps wrote:
| The article said he plans to continue his appearances despite
| not being paid anymore:
|
| _The Wizard said he would keep up his regular appearances at
| Christchurch's Arts Centre, chatting to tourists and locals.
| The centre is hosting an exhibition of his life this month,
| which is supported by the council._
| boomboomsubban wrote:
| The article also says his appearances are less regular, and
| though he blames the council that doesn't make a ton of
| sense if he's willing to doing it unasked and unpaid.
| gsich wrote:
| Is that your assumption?
| rthomas6 wrote:
| 88 isn't that old for a wizard
| sundvor wrote:
| Yep, age is all about your fitness in the closing chapters
| of life.
|
| And a 99 year old guy just beamed into space!
| TheOtherHobbes wrote:
| And besides - a proper wizard would be immortal.
| moate wrote:
| Or at the very least, age in reverse.
| bell-cot wrote:
| I know a guy who does street performance gigs. He was a
| serious college cheerleader (doing human pyramids,
| trampoline routines, etc.) in his 20's. He is still going -
| but when only in his 50's, he talked about how physically
| demanding it was (even if doing no more than card tricks
| for kids, or riding around in costume on a "pretty
| easy"-height unicycle). You gotta stay in character, in
| your routine, with zero mistakes - hour after hour, no
| matter the weather.
| Aeolun wrote:
| That sounds reasonable? I wouldn't mind my tax dollars going
| towards retaining this wizard in the last years of his life.
| He's spent 23 years performing, we can deal with him taking a
| break these last few years.
| boomboomsubban wrote:
| I don't mind my tax dollars paying for a postal worker's
| retirement, but I would object to them keeping their route
| when unable to deliver all the mail.
| Aeolun wrote:
| I agree. They should have become wizards if that is what
| they wanted.
| booleandilemma wrote:
| That's irrelevant to the parent's point. Of course people get
| old, but the position could be filled by a new wizard when
| the old one retires. The "wonder and excitement" could be
| kept alive.
| caseysoftware wrote:
| Does he have an apprentice?
| crb wrote:
| https://interactives.stuff.co.nz/2019/11/the-apprentice-
| wiza...
| snapetom wrote:
| "The city is embarking on new tourism and promotional direction
| that will reflect its diverse communities and "showcase a
| vibrant, diverse, modern city that is attractive to residents,
| domestic and international visitors, new businesses, and skilled
| migrant workers", she said."
|
| That sounds majorly boring.
| jvanderbot wrote:
| ""It's just they don't like me because they are boring old
| bureaucrats and everyone likes me and no one likes them,'' he
| said."
| gremloni wrote:
| It's the right idea.
| mkl wrote:
| Well yes, that's what city leaders tend to sound like; trying
| to appeal to everyone sounds bland. I think they could have
| described it exactly the same way at almost any point in the
| last 30 years - it's not like the Wizard was a cornerstone of
| the city's image.
| tim333 wrote:
| When I toured NZ as a tourist it was next city - that's the
| one with the Wizard isn't it? It's the main thing I remember
| about Christchurch along with it feeling kind of Scottish.
| mkl wrote:
| Well I've never been to Scotland, so I don't know about
| that, but supposedly Dunedin is the more Scottish part of
| the country ("Dunedin" is a transliteration of the Scottish
| Gaelic name for Edinburgh, and there were many Scottish
| settlers there).
| nuerow wrote:
| > _Well yes, that 's what city leaders tend to sound like;
| trying to appeal to everyone sounds bland._
|
| To me, that PR blurb actually uses a lot of words to say
| nothing at all. It boils down to "I decided to do something
| else".
| swebs wrote:
| If you had more context, its easy to read between the
| lines. Witchcraft is considered a serious issue to people
| from regions they want migrants from.
|
| https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2013/08/s
| a...
| iso1210 wrote:
| There were elements of mysogany and arguments he'd been
| 'cancelled'.
|
| > the Wizard said he liked to tease women by telling them
| they were devious, and said "they use cunning to get men
| who are thick".
|
| > I love women, I forgive them all the time, I've never
| struck one yet. Never strike a woman because they bruise
| too easily is the first thing, and they'll tell the
| neighbours and their friends ... and then you're in big
| trouble
|
| That doesn't sound like he was canned because they wanted
| to impress the Saudis.
| swebs wrote:
| That's speculation on The Guardian's part that doesn't
| really match up with the city council's statement.
| booleandilemma wrote:
| They're trying to appeal to Saudis? Is New Zealand going
| to go after LGBT people next?
| blacktriangle wrote:
| Remember, the true test of tolerance is tolerating the
| people who are so intolerant they execute the other
| people you tolerate on a regular basis.
| lostlogin wrote:
| Tolerating the intolerant is made much easier when they
| provide your oil. At least that's my take on the western
| world.
| voakbasda wrote:
| If that's tolerance, I don't want any of it.
| mensetmanusman wrote:
| The paradox of tolerance isn't as interesting when
| physical violence is involved, because you obviously
| fight violence back if possible (ie not tolerated).
|
| The discussion is more interesting when one party's
| feelings are so hurt by words (due to low self esteem,
| mental health issues, etc.) that there is a movement that
| starts not tolerating speech.
|
| E.g. I have worked with teen mentoring and some of these
| people think it is physical abuse if you ask them to do
| chores (due to privileged upbringing).
| jvanderbot wrote:
| This is exactly the world we live in: Government facilitated
| social improvement through committee-designed culture.
| travisporter wrote:
| The article also said: "The Wizard is a well-known face to
| Christchurch residents, but in recent years, his presence has
| diminished, and sightings have become rare"
|
| Can you furlough a wizard?
| temp8964 wrote:
| I doubt he would be cancelled if he had the correct race and
| gender and national origin. Apparently he is not "diverse".
| X6S1x6Okd1st wrote:
| Huh I assumed it had more to do with the misogyny. You do
| know that NZ is 71% European as per last census right?
| gremloni wrote:
| The mildest of "misogyny" is probably the best part of this
| guy.
| lostlogin wrote:
| To add to this, Christchurch is rather less diverse than
| the national average at 78% European.
| https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christchurch
| dylan604 wrote:
| What does that mean? There are more immigrants from Europe
| than native Kiwis?
| X6S1x6Okd1st wrote:
| It's whatever their census defines it as. This is
| specifically ethic group:
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_New_Zealand
| #Et...
|
| Country of birth was 72% New Zealand, 4% England 2% China
| and then lots of other countries with lower %s
| throwaway472927 wrote:
| White
| themaninthedark wrote:
| ....diverse....vibrant, diverse...
|
| So they are going from 1 wizard to 0 wizards and calling that
| diverse? Looks like they are decreasing the amount of diversity
| to me.
| cookie_monsta wrote:
| Maybe there is more to diversity than promoting every
| individual facet of Anglo culture, or subsidising old white
| guys to tell jokes about violence against women?
| asguy wrote:
| You sound like a blast at parties.
| cookie_monsta wrote:
| And you sound like you have a highly nuanced metric by
| which you measure people's worldviews
| asguy wrote:
| Doubling down. I like it.
| [deleted]
| MrZongle2 wrote:
| The real head-scratcher is how, up until now, paying $16,000 a
| year to a cosplayer was considered a responsible use of taxpayer
| funds.
| Goety wrote:
| For when people could actually travel it was likely worth it.
| prionassembly wrote:
| The Rio municipal administration has an on-again-off-again
| contract with an (Amer)indian spirit who proffers an ability to
| prevent heavy rain for specific dates (new years' eve, Carnaval,
| etc). Some private event organizers also hire Cacique Cobra Coral
| with the same purpose.
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