[HN Gopher] Computer game play reduces intrusive memories of exp...
___________________________________________________________________
Computer game play reduces intrusive memories of experimental
trauma (2015)
Author : tnorthcutt
Score : 167 points
Date : 2021-10-08 14:34 UTC (8 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov)
| CarbonJ wrote:
| There's some overlap here with the therapy technique called EMDR
| (used to treat acute PTSD). Both EMDR and the Tetris study
| involve thinking about the traumatic event while experiencing
| bilateral stimulation.
|
| Studies on bilateral stimulation look really promising as a tool
| to manage trauma:
|
| https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5061320/ (note the
| before / after section)
| skim_milk wrote:
| I haven't considered Tetris, but I'm researching the effects of
| Osu! (a rhythm game that requires heavy eye-movement and
| tapping) on people's public speaking anxiety. I can pretty
| conclusively show that people who stream with the tag
| "Depression" and "Anxiety" on Twitch speak considerably more
| while playing Osu! compared to other games - sort of like this
| paper but with live streamers
| https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26100455/ - my interpretation
| of my data is that people streaming with tags that suggest they
| are more likely to experience speaking anxiety, speak more
| while playing games that require heavy bilateral stimulation
| because they are desensitized to their anxiety.
|
| Is there anyone else looking at or any other material on the
| subject of EMDR + video games? I can't find anything on the
| subject, which is kind of ridiculous considering how obvious
| the link is.
| ZeroGravitas wrote:
| A theory I found plausible was that EMDR was the brain
| rewarding you for moving away from a stressful situation, and
| the eye darting is something you do while moving through a
| physical space.
|
| This made me think of the various games that move through 3D
| space. Interesting that Tetris also triggers this.
| rpmisms wrote:
| Beatsaber (Osu! but in VR, essentially), has a similar effect
| on me. I just... let go. It's really cool to see research to
| this effect.
| ethbr0 wrote:
| Hmm. I'm guessing we're not talking about playing Resident Evil,
| Silent Hill, Half-Life, STALKER, etc here.
| duskwuff wrote:
| No. The research used Tetris. Their conclusions are likely to
| generalize to other similar visual/spatial puzzle games (like,
| say, Bejeweled), but probably not to more realistic games.
| dragonwriter wrote:
| Note this is specific to _Tetris_ (and probably generalizes to
| very similar tasks, but is unlikely to generalize to computer
| games _generally_.)
| omginternets wrote:
| >We investigated whether reconsolidation--the process during
| which memories become malleable when recalled--can be blocked
| using a cognitive task and whether such an approach can reduce
| these unbidden intrusions.
|
| It seems like there's nothing "special" about video games, here,
| and that anything that sustains attention over a period of hours
| ought to work. A few decades ago, this might have been prayer,
| for example. I would expect reading and coding to work as well.
| Arisaka1 wrote:
| Since everyone is posting their anecdata here's mine having to
| deal with chronic pain and the stress of lacking a diagnosis for
| its cause:
|
| Video games distract me like a cat gets distracted by the laser
| pointer. And when it's time to go to bed and get a shut eye all
| my worries, anxieties about the pain and unemployment come
| flooding in and I haven't slept more than 5 hours for months. And
| when I was younger games helped me with the lack of friends and
| cope with stuff like my parents being divorce and getting
| bullied. My grades fell apart too.
|
| So yeah, video games like all other reality escapes work, but if
| you ask me I'd rather get a diagnosis, a treatment and a job than
| shove my face in the next big game release again. I'd rather play
| video games the same way a casual/social drinker drinks alcohol,
| and not like someone doing it to avoid something that's painful.
| FooBarBizBazz wrote:
| This word "trauma" is really fucking trendy right now. Whenever a
| thing like this starts, I want to know -- how did it get started?
| Who was the first person to push this?
|
| Seems to me that it sort of started with legit PTSD from
| Iraq/Afghanistan war veterans after 9/11. And then it got taken
| up for a little in some feminist circles -- first like, "women
| who've been raped have PTSD", and then "a bad date leaves you
| with PTSD", and then, "to be born outside the privileged
| categories gives you PTSD" (so you can be forgiven for whatever
| bizarre behavior). But then it died down. Until recently, when
| there was a big resurgence on a bunch of news outlets -- "trauma,
| trauma, trauma".
|
| I wish I could trace this meme backwards to the source.
|
| Clearly people think they can get an advantage out of this idea.
| ZeroGravitas wrote:
| etymonline suggest 'Trauma' moved from it's more literal
| meaning of 'wound' to encompass 'psychic wound, unpleasant
| experience which causes abnormal stress' around 1894.
| Razengan wrote:
| Escaping to new worlds helps you feel better than a shitty
| reality.
| devilduck wrote:
| Anecdotal, but there is a middle ground with something like
| ketamine therapy, where you induce dissociate consciously (and
| the external reality has an almost alien feeling) and it allows
| you to have all kinds of thoughts, some of which can be pretty
| unpleasant, but without the intense and immediate emotional
| reactions to those thoughts. In the past it has allowed me to
| work through issues with far less discomfort.
| filthylurker wrote:
| What exactly is experimental trauma?
| PaulHoule wrote:
| (1) Research on this has consistently used "Tetris"; who knows if
| you'd get the same effect from, say, "Xenoblade Chronicles".
| (e.g. people might not manage the controls, get sufficiently
| engaged, etc.)
|
| (2) "Experimental Trauma" looks like a problem for the Human
| Subjects Review Board. I've been thinking about a weight loss
| plan based on inducing a psychogenic fever but I think it would
| be too rough on people.
| pdpi wrote:
| This sentence from the abstract basically covers your first
| point:
|
| > We predicted that reconsolidation of a reactivated visual
| memory of experimental trauma could be disrupted by engaging in
| a visuospatial task that would compete for visual working
| memory resources
|
| The fact that it was a video game wasn't the important part,
| and completely different styles of game wouldn't have triggered
| the mechanism they're proposing. From what they're saying, I'd
| sooner expect things like or Sudoku or Minesweeper to work,
| rather than Xenoblade Chronicles.
| slothtrop wrote:
| "visuospatial tasks" describe like 99% of video games, XB is
| just on the more mindless side
| PaulHoule wrote:
| My wife would make fun of me because I'd play
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tales_of_Xillia
|
| with all of my characters on autopilot.
| taneq wrote:
| Pretty sure 10 years ago WoW would have worked. I know plenty
| of people who were hiding in that world from something IRL.
|
| > I've been thinking about a weight loss plan based on inducing
| a psychogenic fever but I think it would be too rough on
| people.
|
| Have you considered just... not feeding them? We know that
| works.
| PaulHoule wrote:
| Not feeding people is stressful for the whole experience.
|
| The psychogenic fever seems to have effects that last for at
| least a month (you're not that quick to refeed) but it is
| only stressful (but extremely so) when you initiate the
| experience.
|
| We've managed to initiate it in two people a small number of
| times but we're nowhere near a protocol that would be
| repeatable.
| SketchySeaBeast wrote:
| How do you induce this fever? And how long does the fever
| last?
| PaulHoule wrote:
| The best method I know is "have a fight with your
| spouse".
|
| If you have a good imagination you can amplify your
| emotions and reach a "fever pitch" even if you don't have
| anything real to fight it.
|
| This raises both of our body temperatures for about 48
| hours, I lose about 5 kg over the next two weeks (the
| weight loss continues after the fever is not noticeable)
| and kept it off.
|
| If I were trying to make it repeatable I'd assemble an
| encounter group and either have the group gang up on an
| individual or create a moral injury situation, maybe both
| at the same time. (e.g. the latter is the most repeatable
| way to produce harmful stress but the damage is also
| enduring, if somebody who was in the crowd felt guilty
| about participating or being complicit in the bullying
| that's the worst kind of stress you could give someone.)
|
| https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanpsy/article/PIIS221
| 5-0...
|
| Tibetans claim to have a way to do it.
|
| I have gotten uncomfortably hot when I visualized a
| phoenix and merged it with my avatar in the physical
| world but I tested it and it doesn't raise my core
| temperature.
|
| It is very easy to use biofeedback to control your
| peripheral temperature (that's what a "mood ring" is good
| for) but core temperature is harder. I measure core
| temperature with a thermometer that goes under my tongue
| but maybe I could get one of those in-ear thermometers to
| be wearable in a meditation session.
| TeaDrunk wrote:
| Um, this sounds dangerous and unhelpful in actually
| making long-term lifestyle and relationship with food
| changes necessary in losing weight and keeping weight
| off.
|
| Additionally, ganging up on an individual explicitly as a
| weight loss plan sounds like a great way to develop an
| eating disorder, given that simple exposure to the
| pressures of instagram is known to do this to girls.
| PaulHoule wrote:
| That's why I don't think it is ethical to do that kind of
| research.
| SketchySeaBeast wrote:
| Yeah, it seems like it would be far more effective just
| to count calories instead of enduring emotional abuse. I
| had a bad relationship where I lost weight as well, but
| that was because it was an unhealthy one that cause a lot
| of emotional harm.
| GoblinSlayer wrote:
| Well, computer games are literally made to distract, and mmorpg
| are even worse: they will outright hog your attention for
| themselves.
| zozin wrote:
| Shouldn't the goal be to deal with the psychological trauma
| rather than engaging in activities that suppress memories of the
| trauma?
|
| During the pandemic I went down the rabbit hole of the fitness
| industry. You will find thousands of videos on YouTube/memes on
| forums that teach people that they can get over an ex by just
| focusing on getting shredded and developing a killer physique. To
| me that is akin to what this study suggests: avoid the trauma by
| distracting yourself with another activity. While self-
| improvement is commendable, I don't think avoidance tactics are
| the best way to treat the root cause of the problem though.
| mellosouls wrote:
| You can only deal with psychological issues on a long term
| basis from a position of relative calm, which isn't going to be
| the case when the sufferer is in crisis.
|
| Distraction (like medication) is a tool that can help the
| individual get their head above water in those moments, but,
| yes, presumably that wouldn't be the end goal.
| moron4hire wrote:
| Sometimes you have to treat the symptoms so you can get the
| person functional enough to then start treating the root cause.
| For example, this is the point of anti-depressants and fever-
| reducing medication. They don't treat the underlying disease.
| They just keep the symptoms from killing the patient long
| enough to do something about the disease.
|
| A person with particularly bad PTSD may not want to see a
| therapist and start rooting around in those bad memories. If
| the overall anxiety level associated with those memories can be
| reduced, then maybe the therapy can start.
| kayodelycaon wrote:
| That assumes the person currently has the capacity to deal with
| it. In my own experience, trauma can be too overwhelming.
|
| Medication or other interventions may be required before
| therapy techniques become effective. Video games have fewer
| side effects than anti-depressants and aren't physically
| addictive like tranquilizers.
| amitport wrote:
| I think there has been a pradigm shift in this regard in the
| last decade.
|
| It really used to be about "dealing" with trauma. Now AFAIKT
| many psychologists believe that the end result matters the
| most. If you suppressed your trauma and now you feel fine and
| functioning, who cares? This is especially true for sever
| trauma, whatever works works, suppersion is OK. (We have plenty
| of lifetime examples. e g., Many Holocaust survivors and
| veterns who actively run away from reliving or even thinking
| about their experience, and conducted an healthy life)
|
| I'm not saying someone should avoid treatment, only that we
| should not dismiss suppression as an illegitimate tool. It
| works for many (not for all of course).
| cf100clunk wrote:
| This.
|
| Sometimes it is perfectly fine to not lift every stone to see
| what is crawling underneath, and quite alright to let
| sleeping dogs lie. The operative word is "sometimes", and a
| professional counsellor might help define when that
| "sometime" strategy is best applied. It is not avoidance; it
| is strategic limiting of analysis.
| artificialLimbs wrote:
| Sounds like they are actively encouraging suppression. I don't
| believe this will lead to 'Good'(tm) things. The way to
| properly deal with trauma, if one wants to heal psychologically
| and disable the 'intrusive' memories, is to actively encourage
| the recall of those memories until they become so unexciting
| that they no longer have a reactive emotional component.
|
| Depending on the magnitude of the trauma, this may not be an
| exercise one does by oneself, and in one sitting. It could take
| some time. That I know of, directly related in the western
| psychological world is one such technique called 'exposure
| therapy'.
|
| The repression suggested in this study will guarantee that the
| emotional reaction will come roaring back to the surface when
| some strange, probably unrelated situation triggers the memory
| once again.
|
| I've had 3 instances of extreme trauma in my life. After the
| 3rd, I heard about this technique. It has been completely
| transformative for me. N=1 and all that...
| amitport wrote:
| Glad it works for you, but doesn't sound like a generally
| applicabale approach.
|
| I really disagree with a couple of your statements: "The way
| to properly deal with trauma" there really isn't a proper way
| imo. Individuals have different ways.
|
| "will guarantee that the emotional reaction will come roaring
| back to the surface when some strange, probably unrelated
| situation triggers the memory once again." Not really true,
| not always. People do successfully repress, and some people
| have a really negative experience from treatments like the
| one you suggested.
|
| People are different and their experiences are different.
| pope_meat wrote:
| I think sometimes it might be necessary to create a bit of a
| buffer between the truama and "dealing with it." When it's
| still fresh it can be hard to regulate one's emotional state,
| and it's nigh impossible to "deal" when the thoughts of the
| situation/event send you in to a really bad emotional state of
| panic and endless rumination because you either lack the tools
| for emotional regulation, or utilizing them doesn't even come
| to mind in the first place. A mind under psychological distress
| is a messy dark place, and only after the fact do you look back
| on things and wonder why you spent such a long time suffering
| instead of working yourself out of it.
| artificialLimbs wrote:
| Some do need to escape from the reality to get a bit of
| relief, and can't handle the confrontation directly too much.
| That is understandable.
|
| But, the panic/anxiety surrounding the trauma after the fact
| is often due to resistance of experiencing the
| emotions/memories associated with the event. Allowing the
| 'bad' feelings in and going through those feelings is most
| always going to be healing.
| egypturnash wrote:
| I've gone through some traumatic shit and some of it just could
| _not_ be dealt with _until_ I had gained some distance from it.
| It does still need to be dealt with eventually but it helps a
| ton if it 's not something that actively makes you want to curl
| up into a ball and hide every time you think about it.
|
| Ultimately, sure, you need to sit down and open up the vault
| you've put this pain in and deal with it. But it's a lot easier
| if you don't get consumed in a wave of remembered fear and
| stress every time you even _think_ about touching that vault.
| This article suggests that distracting yourself with Tetris
| soon after the painful experience helps avoid that happening.
| cat199 wrote:
| Interesting, and I can definitely see this for tetris, but I
| doubt you'd get the same result throwing a veteran with PTSD into
| an FPS .. probably needs a few more experiments to yield
| conclusion in the title.
| duxup wrote:
| I remember when dealing with depression an felt like I didn't
| have control of my thoughts at times. Doctor told me to "do what
| you liked to do before it was this way, even if you don't like
| doing it now".
|
| For me that was video games. So I played final fantasy and other
| games a great deal and found that the issues I was thinking of
| often did start to fade over time.
|
| I don't know if it was the fact that the task required my
| attention so much or a sort of zen experience I could get with
| the game ... or just time passing, but it felt like it worked.
|
| The only downside I felt was how not "in the world" I was at that
| time. Not really socializing much and etc in favor of drowning
| myself in video games.
|
| Ultimately I think it helped me cope, but I also was aware that
| it was a very alluring sort of way of life to work, school,
| escape into video games, and nothing else.
| musingsole wrote:
| Seems to me it's retraining the network that it is sufficiently
| far from the source of the trauma which can't happen until
| experiences fill in -- not to be confused with just time
| passing; experiences are the unit of time in the mind
| lupire wrote:
| Treatment depression by engaging in activities that promoye
| depression is certainly risky.
| GoblinSlayer wrote:
| I guess final fantasy is also not exactly depressive.
| duxup wrote:
| I haven't really been able to play it since, although I think
| that has been more about the evolution of the series turning
| into a more ... teen drama as far as maturity goes.
|
| It was never drama free, lots of personal stories and
| reflections, but it felt like those topics were somewhat more
| balanced against a larger story / mature / etc. After a while
| everything seemed to get more immature / sappy / etc.
| antisthenes wrote:
| I did this after a traumatic brain injury, and ended up playing
| too much video games, neglecting other aspects of my health.
|
| Can't say that overall it was a net positive experience,
| although it did get my mind off the trauma and the traumatic
| memory and it did help moderately with depression (I am not
| depressed now, about a year later)
|
| > Ultimately I think it helped me cope, but I also was aware
| that it was a very alluring sort of way of life to work,
| school, escape into video games, and nothing else.
|
| Ah yes, that's generally the conclusion I came to as well. I'm
| scaling it down as of this moment, personally.
| akeck wrote:
| Jane McGonigal is another person doing work in this space.
|
| [1] https://janemcgonigal.com/
| tnorthcutt wrote:
| Linking the twitter thread I originally stumbled across this
| from: https://twitter.com/jelenawoehr/status/1445993073494749187
|
| And an article that looks like it's covering the same or similar
| research: https://www.npr.org/sections/health-
| shots/2017/04/09/5230114...
| lupire wrote:
| The study studied the intervention against "experimental trauma
| film" which I think means watching a horrific movie? Not real
| traumatic experiences.
| Trasmatta wrote:
| I had a very traumatic experience at the start of 2020. I
| remembered reading studies like this in the past, so after it
| happened I played Tetris on my Switch for a couple of hours.
|
| While I did deal with high levels of anxiety for a few months
| after, I haven't dealt with flashbacks or intrusive memories at
| all. At this point it feels like a distant memory that I don't
| really think about at all anymore.
|
| N of 1, but it seemed to help in my case. When possible, I plan
| to do the same following traumatic events in the future.
| tnorthcutt wrote:
| That's really great! Glad to hear you'd heard about this prior
| to the experience and were able to successfully utilize it.
| Trasmatta wrote:
| Thank you! I'd definitely recommend people keep it in mind as
| an option for potential future experiences, and to try Tetris
| specifically, because that's what the studies seem to all
| use.
| [deleted]
| celticninja wrote:
| I honestly have the same studies in my mind and the same plan
| of action should I ever be subjected to a traumatic experience
| that warrants it. So well done you, glad it worked
| pdpi wrote:
| > N of 1, but it seemed to help in my case.
|
| All things considered, I think I'd rather not find out if it
| helps in my case :(
| fendy3002 wrote:
| There was a reason behind "tetris effect" after all. Our way of
| thinking during playing video games is really different than
| when we're irl.
| motohagiography wrote:
| Even though there is controversy around his ideas, I have an
| armchair theory about why this study yielded plausibly successful
| results, and it's that Maslow's "peak experiences [0] provides a
| framework for it.
|
| The armchair premise is that we naturally orient our identity and
| sense of self according to memorable experiences, and as a
| consequence, our most intense experiences (good or bad) tend to
| become a constant reference point for who are believe we are.
|
| High and low watermarks in our life become defining to an
| identity, which our ego then adopts and does its job to defend it
| (the self) from all threats. You can "become," the trauma, and
| your sense of self, via the mechanism of ego, protects the
| integrity of that identity against all potential threats to it -
| even though the experience isn't _you_. Video games in this study
| enabled a kind of re-basing of identity from the experimental
| trauma by providing an equivalent or greater intense experience
| which memory and identity can rebind to. It 's also possibly why
| psychedelics are thought to "cure" depression, because by using
| an intense experience to rebase your identity on memories other
| than the negative ones, you in-effect redirect your ego to
| protect the right thing about your true self instead of it
| reinforcing the negative experience that had substituted itself
| into your identity because it was so intense.
|
| Utter armchair mind hacking, but it's testable. We can treat the
| ego as a kind of clutch mechanism where you can disengage it to
| switch gears, and re-engage it to apply the will of self.
| Intensity disengages it.
|
| If you rethink depression as a kind of mental autoimmune disorder
| where the defense mechanism for your sense of self (ego) turns
| its aggression inward, a super intense experience can unbind the
| ego from that identity long enough for your true self to re-
| establish its primacy. Suicidal ideation in that framework is a
| craving for that level of replacement intensity, and not
| necessarily death itself, just something intense enough to
| release your ego long enough to switch gears.
|
| Jumping out of a plane, graduating university, having a kid,
| winning an award, are all examples of positive peak experiences
| people remember as reference points to locate their sense of
| self.
|
| What I'm suggesting is the implied underlying mechanism behind
| the study could be applied more generally to developing more
| controlled peak experiences that "blow your mind," in a way that
| dislodges the ego defence long enough that you can overpower a
| traumatic memory with a current more intense one, so when your
| ego re-establishes itself, it is protecting the integrity of the
| new experience as a rebased identity.
|
| Crankery, probably, but if you do find a way to blow your mind
| and it improves your outlook, video games are fun, but I think we
| need to find more things that really blow minds.
|
| [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peak_experience
| nathanasmith wrote:
| I play Half Life 2 to ease depression since I won't tolerate the
| side effects of SSRI medication. It's the only video game I play
| and I've beaten it literally hundreds of time. I can fly through
| the whole thing in about 4 hours on the hardest setting I've
| played it so much. I don't know why it works and I don't want to
| even poke at it lest it stop working but when I have an "episode"
| where everything goes gray I just fire the game up and start
| waxing head crabs. Pretty soon I'm right as rain.
|
| As an addendum, the only thing I don't like about my M1 Mac is
| HL2 doesn't work on it other than through Crossover Office and
| even then it's extremely glitchy. If anybody has suggestions to
| get it running well I'm all eyes.
| TheAceOfHearts wrote:
| Playing videogames is another drug with which to escape reality.
| But at least it gives you something to do rather than spending
| all your time dwelling in depression, which is why I have around
| 2800 hours playing Heroes of the Storm.
|
| My experience has been that negative thoughts and memories are
| less likely to occur while playing, especially if you have to
| communicate verbally with teammates in order to succeed.
|
| Making creative works using your hands is another non-digital
| outlet which keeps the mind focused.
|
| Unfortunately, it's not really a permanent solution as intrusive
| thought and memories begin to show up during downtime.
| singlow wrote:
| Working with your hands is the original digital activity ;-)
| vlunkr wrote:
| > Playing videogames is another drug with which to escape
| reality.
|
| "Escaping reality" is as old as humanity, I don't see why we
| need to think of it as a drug, or even a negative thing. Are
| books drugs? movies? plays? stories told around a fire? Video
| games are just the latest (really awesome) iteration of that.
|
| Obviously there are some disclaimers. Some games are designed
| like a drug, or like gambling, and some people are more
| susceptible to addiction. But I think in general, we need to
| stop feeling guitly about taking part in something that we
| enjoy.
| basq wrote:
| After some very long bouts of self reflection, I've found
| that I have 4 primary emotional needs: social connection,
| satisfaction derived from accomplishment, breadth of
| information to learn, and excitation (something that gets my
| heard pumping and the adrenaline flowing).
|
| Most things in my life that I occupy my free time with can
| meet those needs, art and music fill the first three,
| programming meets the middle two, but only gaming fills the
| 'excited' factor. I have yet to find any other activity that
| isn't dangerous which gives me the same rush as winning a
| game of dota2 or overwatch (or what have you). What's more,
| games not only fulfill my need for excitement, they also
| fulfill -all- of the aforementioned needs to a decent degree.
| Sure, I won't feel as accomplished finishing a setup in
| factorio as I would finishing a piece of music, but the
| difference really isn't all that great. And for breadth of
| knowledge? Games are designed to be grok-able, whereas many
| more existential domains are full of hard or nuanced
| problems. Lastly, (multiplayer) games are just as social as
| my other life pursuits if not more so.
|
| Guess what I'm saying is that I've had trouble finding a
| suitable replacement for games, they really can serve as an
| omni-activity. Despite all that, they still give me a fair
| portion of guilt when I devote time to them. I can only
| assume that is my parents' sensibilities which have been
| ingrained into my conscience. As a result I've quit them
| multiple times, and the jury's still out as to whether I
| personally view them as a vice that needs to be severely
| moderated, but what keeps me coming back is that need for a
| rush. Nothing else gives it to me in such a balance of low
| risk / high reward.
| nkingsy wrote:
| Nicely put, and this is exactly what I dislike about video
| games. Adrenaline pumps, my heart goes crazy, I sweat and
| grip the controller till my hands turn white, and I feel
| totally overloaded.
|
| Put me on a mountain bike on a crazy descent, in REAL
| danger, and those same fears lead me to the highest highs.
|
| Maybe it's just the cadence. I want 5-10 minutes of intense
| fear focus followed by good long period of relative safety
| to bask in the conquest, but video games just keep pouring
| shot after shot of adrenaline.
|
| Not a scientist, but it feels like what I want is
| endorphins -> adrenaline + endorphins -> endorphins, and
| what video games gives me is adrenaline + endorphins ->
| adrenaline + endorphines -> arenaline + endorphins
| moffkalast wrote:
| Also when it comes to video game addiction it's always just
| psychological addiction, not actual physical addiction. Often
| correlated with stress or boredom, and when that's removed
| it's usually not too hard to adjust back from what I've seen.
| Pet_Ant wrote:
| But just like Ativan in gives you an out when it's overwhelming
| and other coping mechanisms aren't working.
| sinsterizme wrote:
| Umm except benzos are incredibly dangerous to take for any
| extended period. Stay away from them
| abledon wrote:
| have you considered going through the HealthyGamerGG coaching
| program or doing their course?
| scollet wrote:
| > Playing videogames is another drug with which to escape
| reality
|
| Maybe the most trivial of games. Even naughts and crosses has
| deeper implications than the physical mechanics.
|
| Most games have a grand appreciation of reality like reading
| Frankenstein or watching The Lighthouse.
|
| Perhaps it's the low stakes context that makes them more
| accessible, and thus informs our understanding of things
| outside that context.
| 9wzYQbTYsAIc wrote:
| > Unfortunately, it's not really a permanent solution as
| intrusive thought and memories begin to show up during
| downtime.
|
| Hospitals can definitely use it as a protocol to help prevent
| or minimize the establishment of the traditional semi-permanent
| traumatic stress disorders, though.
|
| Traumatic stress can often cause depressive symptoms, but this
| technique isn't directly addressing depression - it is
| addressing the prevention of traumatic stress disorders in the
| first 24 hours after a traumatic event.
| fossuser wrote:
| I've found it helps by forcing focus on a narrow task. In these
| tests they used tetris, but rockband or guitar hero is similar
| too.
|
| There's some evidence to support anxiety being tied to
| rumination, thought loops, hypervigilance and such. If you're
| able to force yourself to focus on a narrow task I think that
| can help relieve some of that in a way that lingers for a bit.
| Makes it easier to reframe stuff.
| dragonwriter wrote:
| > Playing videogames is another drug with which to escape
| reality.
|
| Perhaps, but that isn't what this research (and the related
| research it builds on); this is about a specific kind of task (
| _Tetris_ is the specific instance studied in this and some of
| the other research, but there is some on closely related,
| similar tasks) and how its use closely after traumatic events
| prevents formation of intrusive memories from the trauma, and
| how (combined with particular other techniques) it can disrupt
| established intrusive memories from past trauma.
|
| > Unfortunately, it's not really a permanent solution as
| intrusive thought and memories begin to show up during
| downtime.
|
| In the form studied, it actually _is_ a solution with permanent
| effects.
|
| EDIT: " _Tetris_ is highly-effective, unsupervised, self-
| applied first aid for psychic trauma" is actually a very big
| deal (as is the supervised treatment result for established
| trauma.)
| hart_russell wrote:
| Tangent: HOTS is a highly underrated MOBA. Mechanics that
| people find too "casual" make the game more fun in my opinion.
| FirstLvR wrote:
| IMO the best moba out there right now, well balanced, the art
| is great and the mechanics are fun
|
| if you are fan of blizzard games then this is your game, most
| of the known heroes are in the game trying to gank each other
| thedespone wrote:
| Agree on this one. Still playing this after getting into it
| on college.
| nverno wrote:
| Physical outdoor work is another good activity for the mind.
| thedespone wrote:
| Good to read I am not the only one. Been depressed for a few
| months now and HOTS (especially ARAM, which is really fast-
| paced) helps me on the bad days to put my mind on ease. On the
| bad days I always feel more relieved and less stressed after a
| couple hours of HOTS. I hope Blizzard won't pull the plug on
| this any time soon, till then: see you in the Nexus sir!
| ammanley wrote:
| I can relate to this, super happy HOTS is working for you!
| Always love seeing another fan of the game, it feels
| criminally like a missed opportunity for Blizzard. As a
| chronic anxiety/depression patient, I sincerely hope this has
| helped you stay afloat during the trying times life for been
| for us lately. I'm curious, is the same therapeutic effect
| present in League/DOTA for you, if by chance you've played
| those before?
| thedespone wrote:
| Good to hear it's working for you too sir! I only tried
| DOTA in college, so don't know about that. LoL I tried but
| it wasn't that satisfying as HOTS though. Although my
| preference was always HOTS over LoL. I can imagine LoL has
| the same effects for someone who likes LoL better. I've met
| others who gain the same results with completely different
| games so I believe it all comes down to doing something you
| enjoy.
| phkahler wrote:
| Diverting your attention doesn't help long-term. Read about
| EMDR, it may be related to this video game concept. If so, the
| effectiveness will depend on the game as well as how much you
| engage the traumatic thoughts during play.
| petesergeant wrote:
| I've found freeciv to be totally immersive for me, which is
| great for times when I'm feeling unwell, physically or
| otherwise, and for travelling.
| madrox wrote:
| As someone who played video games a lot during their hospital
| stays, this has the ring of truth. I have a lot of intrusive
| memories but surprisingly 14 childhood surgeries aren't among
| them now that I think on it.
| oneepic wrote:
| My anecdata to the contrary. I feel like I've spent about 6-8
| hours of my day on average, playing videogames for the past >20
| years (I know, healthy, right?), and even during gameplay I still
| think of all the worst embarrassing moments at school and the
| shit one of my parents put me through, and the mistakes I've made
| at work... No doubt games have a suppressive effect pretty often,
| but whatever my mental process is, those memories always end up
| floating right back to the surface.
|
| I think I'd add 2 suggestions (not a scientist, but I think
| they're worth considering): 1) it matters whether your mind is
| fully engaged in the game, or you have some room to bring in
| these shitty memories (for example, I played quite a few idle
| games, or MMOs that involved a lot of waiting) and 2) if you
| still find yourself reliving this shit during gameplay, maybe
| you're better off seeking other escapes (*let's not get
| destructive though, ie cocaine/heroin/meth), or doing productive
| things (sublimation in psychology) and slowly tackling this
| problem yourself using gradual accomplishments, building your
| confidence, breaking down events one piece at a time, etc.
| SamoyedFurFluff wrote:
| I once saw something quite wise, which is the difference
| between a self soothing and self numbing. Self soothing is an
| activity you can do to handle a stressor you have at the moment
| and then you can move on from. But if you have to continually
| perform the behavior and never actually move on, you're just
| numbing and putting off the processing part of pain/trauma.
| jimbob45 wrote:
| I have that same issue with playing the piano. I think the
| problem is that your mind necessarily needs to flail around in
| the creative process in order to progress unless you're playing
| the simplest piece on the piano or Tetris on the computer. As
| such, it becomes increasingly likely over time that your
| creativity will stumble into something you didn't want to
| relive and then everything comes grinding to a halt.
|
| I'd imagine that the most brainless casual games would avoid
| this sort of thing.
| bentcorner wrote:
| As a child playing the piano became a very weird experience
| (in hindsight). I'd need to practice until a piece became
| ingrained in my memory, and the only way I could play a piece
| would be to not actually think about it, and think about
| something else. As soon as I thought about what I was
| playing, I'd forget how to play the song. I wouldn't even
| know where I was, and could only pick up again either at the
| beginning or major points in the song. Weird.
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