[HN Gopher] Huawei CFO Wanzhou Meng Admits to Misleading Global ...
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Huawei CFO Wanzhou Meng Admits to Misleading Global Financial
Institution
Author : throwaway4good
Score : 37 points
Date : 2021-09-25 02:26 UTC (20 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (www.justice.gov)
(TXT) w3m dump (www.justice.gov)
| [deleted]
| upofadown wrote:
| The coerced confession will last right up to the point that the
| person in question is clear of US airspace.
| JudasGoat wrote:
| Speaking of "coerced confessions", the 2 Michaels were
| immediately released.
| _hilro wrote:
| The person isn't in US airspace. They're being held in Canada
| and US had an ongoing extradition request with Canada. All
| detailed in TFA.
| upofadown wrote:
| It's pretty unlikely that Canada will fall for this sort of
| thing the second time. So once they are clear of US airspace
| they are pretty safe, but not entirely safe of course...
| [deleted]
| whoevercares wrote:
| Meng is returning home. 1:0
| roenxi wrote:
| The US has no business at all regulating how a Chinese company
| trades with an Iranian company or attempting to enforce their
| demands through having CFOs snatched in foreign countries.
| oriettaxx wrote:
| the sanctions against Iran
|
| "The warrant was based on allegations that Wanzhou had cleared
| money that was claimed to be for Huawei, but was actually for
| Skycom,[34] an entity claimed to be entirely controlled by
| Huawei, which was said to be dealing with Iran, contrary to
| sanctions. According to the defence lawyer, the bank involved
| in the dealings was HSBC. "
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meng_Wanzhou#Career
| _hilro wrote:
| Did you even read the article or did you just knee-jerk type
| your insightful thoughts:
|
| > In December 2012 and January 2013, various news
| organizations, including Reuters, reported that Skycom offered
| to sell "embargoed" equipment from a U.S. computer equipment
| manufacturer in Iran in potential violation of U.S. export
| controls law, and that Huawei had close ties with Skycom
|
| And the outcome was pretty muted with a Deferred Prosecution
| Agreement (i.e. a nothing happens agreement):
|
| > Under the terms of the DPA, Meng has agreed to the accuracy
| of a four-page statement of facts that details the knowingly
| false statements she made to Financial Institution 1. Meng also
| has agreed not to commit other federal, state or local crimes.
| If Meng breaches the agreement, she will be subject to
| prosecution of all the charges against her in the third
| superseding indictment filed in this case
|
| edit: to make it more obvious, it wasn't just close ties,
| Huawei wholly owned Skycom via a subsidary and then tried to
| hide that ownership by "selling" it's shares to another company
| (which also was a Huawei subsidary)
| sudosysgen wrote:
| From the Guardian:
|
| >Her lawyers argued that internal HSBC emails and memos
| showed she had been upfront with senior HSBC staff about
| Huawei's relationship with the subsidiary accused of
| sanctions-busting, Skycom. Indeed, at a hearing in August,
| the judge in the case said that the case against Meng seemed
| very unusual. No one lost money, the allegations were several
| years old, and the intended victim, a global bank, knew the
| truth even as it was allegedly being lied to. Heather Holmes,
| associate chief justice, asked: "Isn't it unusual that one
| will see a fraud case with no actual harm many years later?
| And one in which the alleged victim, a large institution,
| appears to have had numerous people within the institution
| who had all the facts that are now said to be
| misrepresented?"
|
| I don't really care about the rest. Selling US computers to
| Iran is not illegal where Skycom was operating. It's a
| travesty that the US gets to prevent people from selling
| things to Iran even if they are operating outside of the US.
|
| Even if Skycom was wholly owned by Huawei, the US should not
| get to impose their power on actions that happen solely
| outside of US territory.
|
| But beyond that, the entire case is clearly a political ploy
| by the Trump and the US administration following to extract
| concessions from China. Using extraterritorial "offences" to
| prosecute someone for purely political reasons stretches the
| credibility of the US legal system past it's breaking point,
| and morality is not even a question anymore.
|
| To be blunt, nothing of what you said even contradicts who
| you reply to. It amounts to taking the US government at their
| full word not only in facts but in spirit too.
| adriancr wrote:
| > It's a travesty that the US gets to prevent people from
| selling things to Iran even if they are operating outside
| of the US
|
| No its not while Iran has a nuclear weapons program and is
| sanctioned for it.
|
| > Even if Skycom was wholly owned by Huawei, the US should
| not get to impose their power on actions that happen solely
| outside of US territory.
|
| US imposed sanctions, company owned by huawei broke them,
| what should happen here?
|
| > Using extraterritorial "offences" to prosecute someone
| for purely political reasons
|
| They broke embargo and tried to hide it, what do you
| expect... To just let them continue to aid Iran?
| sudosysgen wrote:
| >No its not while Iran has a nuclear weapons program and
| is sanctioned for it.
|
| Only the US government still believes this. Which happens
| to have interests strongly opposing Iran's.
|
| >US imposed sanctions, company owned by huawei broke
| them, what should happen here?
|
| You can get a judgement against the company or even
| Huawei if you figure out a legal strategy. Why would you
| go after an employee on false pretenses? Come on, we both
| know what's happening there.
|
| > They broke embargo and tried to hide it, what do you
| expect... To just let them continue to aid Iran?
|
| Is your argument really that people in Iran shouldn't be
| allowed to have computers, and that it's fine to lie and
| imprison people for things they did well outside of your
| jurisdiction over false pretenses for it?
|
| Because right now your argument is basically that the US
| should be allowed to make law that is valid worldwide and
| to imprison anyone in the world for it.
|
| Besides, you totally ignored the entire issue with Trump
| indicating that he would be willing to release her in
| exchange for concessions. Keep in mind he's the guy under
| who she was arrested.
| adriancr wrote:
| > Only the US government still believes this. Which
| happens to have interests strongly opposing Iran's.
|
| Umm... since 2005, EU, UN, and U.S. sanctions have
| targeted Iran for violating treaties under which it
| promised not to pursue nuclear weapons.
|
| The centrifuges destroyed by Stuxnet were not for nuclear
| weapons?, how about all the assassinated nuclear
| scientists?, they're working on peaceful nuclear?
|
| > You can get a judgement against the company or even
| Huawei if you figure out a legal strategy. Why would you
| go after an employee on false pretenses? Come on, we both
| know what's happening there.
|
| Legal strategy is she is wanted for trial in the United
| States, she is fighting extradition instead of going to
| face trial. It is a valid strategy.
|
| > Is your argument really that people in Iran shouldn't
| be allowed to have computers
|
| They are under embargo for nuclear weapons program. I
| really don't want them to have nuclear weapons either. If
| this means the iranian people don't have computers they
| only have their leaders and themselves to blame. Changing
| them would solve the issue.
|
| > Besides, you totally ignored the entire issue with
| Trump indicating that he would be willing to release her
| in exchange for concessions. Keep in mind he's the guy
| under who she was arrested.
|
| Trump said a lot of worse things if you take them at face
| value, he's not in office anymore, she on the other hand
| is still wanted for extradition.
|
| The lesson here is don't break another country's laws and
| then expect to visit it or its allies without answering
| to a court of law.
| dzonga wrote:
| if you use US dollars, then it's an implicit agreement to us
| laws. hence if you break US laws, the US will persecute you.
| China, Russia etc will likely be transacting in less US dollars
| in the future. So they don't run foul of USA sanctions
| sschueller wrote:
| That's why the rest of the world needs to stop using the
| dollar when not dealing with the US.
| Leary wrote:
| Shame on the US for misusing the law to achieve its geopolitical
| objective of handicapping Huawei. Funny how HSBC, the bank that
| Meng supposedly defrauded, never said they were misled.
| lancesells wrote:
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Huawei#Controversies
| sudosysgen wrote:
| If Huawei is really so clearly in the wrong, why not go after
| them for things they did that actually matter instead of
| victimless actions that the "victim" was absolutely OK with
| and that happened between three non-US entities outside of
| the US?
| adriancr wrote:
| Huawei is on a trade blacklist because of breaking Iran
| sanctions in this case...
| dangerbird2 wrote:
| More shame on China for retaliating by arbitrarily detaining
| two Canadian citizens with no relation to the case, holding
| them as hostages in all but name, and subjecting them to
| torture while Meng had to endure a cushy house arrest in her
| mansion.
|
| https://globalnews.ca/news/8220178/meng-wanzhou-huawei-china...
| beaunative wrote:
| Torture is a strong word. You better back it up, there is no
| logical reason for the Chinese government to `torture` them.
| commoner wrote:
| > Meng is right now enjoying the freedom of Vancouver's
| lovely streets and the luxury of her own $15 million
| mansion there through privilege of bail in a free and open
| democratic society under the rule of law. The two Michaels,
| by painful contrast, suffer conditions equal to torture in
| the lawless Chinese gulag.
|
| > Pre-trial detention in China is used as a weapon of
| duress which, in its aggregate, adds up to torture. The
| accused are held in harsh conditions in a "detention
| center" designed to break resistance and crush the human
| spirit in order to extort a confession. As a result, such
| self-incriminating confessions, when they happen, are
| false. The following description of those detention
| conditions comes from my own experiences during 23 months
| in captivity, in addition to listening to and reading about
| other prisoners' experiences, including conversations with
| prisoners released in 2019.
|
| Full description: https://thediplomat.com/2019/12/the-
| cruel-fate-of-michael-ko...
| LatteLazy wrote:
| See also, the Natwest three.
|
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NatWest_Three
|
| Being foreign puts a pretty big taeget on your back in the eyes
| of US law enforcement agencies.
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(page generated 2021-09-25 23:02 UTC)