[HN Gopher] Oliver Burkeman on the flaw with productivity geek t...
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Oliver Burkeman on the flaw with productivity geek thinking
Author : ubac
Score : 64 points
Date : 2021-09-23 16:25 UTC (6 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (thebrowser.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (thebrowser.com)
| AnotherGoodName wrote:
| >And actually, more than that, lots of what goes wrong is not
| just that productivity geekery doesn't work, it's that it makes
| things worse, right
|
| A lot of good points here. I figured this out myself ages ago and
| have done well to actively halt the 'only do things that are
| maximally productive' behaviors that actually cripple any
| productivity at all.
|
| As one example amongst many: I wasn't taking the garbage out
| until the mail arrived. Because that was optimal! Maximize
| efficiency! Except it doesn't really help. Taking out the garbage
| takes 20seconds. Going to the mailbox and bringing in mail? 20
| seconds. Doing them together and juggling bins, mail and doors?
| Over a minute. Not to mention the many minutes of distraction
| from the mental weight of a chore needing to be done. It's only
| theoretically optimal and the theorizing part itself is
| crippling.
|
| Likewise I'd let myself get crippled by 'there's a meeting in
| 20minutes'. I'm sure it's a huge problem for others in the wfh
| era. I wouldn't start washing the dishes because i might be in
| the middle of it when i need meet with others and then with the
| stop and start that'd be less than optimal. But doing the dishes,
| even if slow turns out to be a 10 minute chore. I should have
| just done it. But i procrastinated because theory crafting told
| me that it'd be slightly less than optimal to do it now.
| Meanwhile i just waste those 20minutes on Hackernews. Even being
| less optimal i'm always better of doing it now.
|
| It's definitely helpful to be aware of these behaviors. I think
| the focus on maximizing productivity affects the geek types more
| but it's absolutely crippling to let yourself go down these
| paths. Don't do it and you'll be better off and more productive.
| handrous wrote:
| > Meanwhile i just waste those 20minutes on Hackernews.
|
| Practically every "productivity hack" is less effective than
| simply dropping all lowish-value Web browsing and doing almost
| anything else instead.
| ubac wrote:
| One thing that amazes me is how many of even the most-
| effective people I know seem to spend multiple hours a day
| doing low-value web browsing. Is it actually impossible to
| avoid that temptation? Or are there people who manage it but
| they're just living in a different world than I am?
| dageshi wrote:
| I think it's a case of most people have a finite amount of
| really productive time in them per day and once it's
| exhausted trying to squeeze more out is counter productive.
|
| What do you fill the rest of the time with?
|
| If you accept you have a finite limit of really good
| productive time per day in you, it becomes easy, focus on
| supporting that and making sure you achieve what you can
| during that productive time then slack off for the rest of
| the day.
| nicbou wrote:
| Personally, I find it incredibly addictive. Despite trying
| many things to keep it under control, I still struggle with
| it.
|
| The thing with mindless browsing is that it gives you an
| instant trickle of dopamine. Any other activity requires
| some ramp up time before it feels rewarding. It's a bit
| like snacking vs. cooking a meal.
| handrous wrote:
| The Web has a strange way of feeling both important and
| interesting while, on reflection, not really being either.
| There's some kind of time-eating black magic at work--and
| that's before something like TikTok or Facebook get
| involved, where there's no mystery about why they have the
| effect they do.
| leobg wrote:
| One of the most important ideas I've come across in the
| last few days while doing low-value browsing on HN was an
| insight shared by Rich Hickey: ,,A computer is the
| absolute worst place to do thinking". I think it was in
| his talk ,,Hammock driven development". I actually
| installed a hammock in my office yesterday because of it.
| It takes self-control to actually go over and use it. And
| to leave my phone at the desk, too. But once I do, I
| profit tremdenously. I get ideas. I see the big picture.
| I get energized again.
| nicbou wrote:
| I develop many ideas on my motorcycle, or on my bicycle,
| or while having breakfast. Once I have a computer, my
| brain is rarely idle enough for that.
| chasd00 wrote:
| I walk to a family dollar that's 30 min round trip from
| my house. Many problems have been solved by a slim Jim
| and diet Dr Pepper.
| ubac wrote:
| can't remember where it is but there's an amazing pg
| quote somewhere wondering whether the net effect of hn
| has been positive or negative on account of the time-
| eating aspect. (I think his conclusion was "almost
| certainly very positive, but I have moments of
| doubt....")
| r_a_d wrote:
| There's a bit in 'What I worked on' where he says
|
| "Hacker News is definitely useful. I've learned a lot
| from things I've read on HN. I've written several essays
| that began as comments there. So I wouldn't want the site
| to go away. But I would like to be sure it's not a net
| drag on productivity. What a disaster that would be, to
| attract thousands of smart people to a site that caused
| them to waste lots of time. I wish I could be 100% sure
| that's not a description of HN."
| majormajor wrote:
| Is it the social aspect? Far more people are able to hang
| out and talk with friends for hours on end than are able
| to read a book for hours on end, say.
|
| Throw in the ease of changing direction (jumping from one
| article from another in a wiki rabbit hole, say), too.
| SuoDuanDao wrote:
| I've heard that if one sets the display screen (whatever
| it is) to be black-and-white, the web gets much less
| compelling. I'm sure there are more factors than that,
| but it's funny how much bright colours in feedback play a
| role.
| AQuantized wrote:
| I've totally cut out Reddit and other sites that have
| gotten increasingly low quality over the years. That said I
| do still regularly 'waste' time on HN, although I think it
| offers enough utility that it's not a bad place to relax
| for a while now and then.
|
| One thing I've realized over the past few years is that
| it's almost impossible to get away from 'wasting' a fair
| few hours each day. It's a good idea to let yourself
| disengage and move into a more diffuse mode of thought
| instead of trying to hold your nose to the grindstone
| unnecessarily. It may be that the effective people you know
| are that way because of their willingness to take a
| extended breaks rather than in spite of.
| ironmike2111 wrote:
| Any tips for high utility websites apart from this one?
|
| Would really appreciate this thanks
| kmtrowbr wrote:
| One thing I've noticed is that, there is some value in
| stepping away from your work, and then coming back.
| Something like a "palate cleanser" for your mind. I agree
| that mindless web browsing is mostly a waste of time, but
| there might be some value in loading a little static into
| your mind, then coming back at your problem in a new frame
| of mind. So I try to not beat myself up too much. I have
| blockers and other things which I do use sometimes. I like
| https://selfcontrolapp.com/ the best for the Mac.
| leobg wrote:
| The funny thing is that, as soon as we geeks realize that
| this is a problem, we immediately want to optimize away
| the problem by building another app. Hehe.
| HPsquared wrote:
| If all you have is a computer, everything looks like a
| computation.
| 908B64B197 wrote:
| HN still has a better signal to noise than 90% of the web.
| SCUSKU wrote:
| Re: having multiple projects in the air
|
| > the reality of it is that you don't make much progress on any
| of them because as soon as one of them gets difficult, you just
| bounce over to another one that feels easier.
|
| This really rang true to me. I have so many projects, and once I
| hit a significant technical wall, I usually start looking at
| other projects where I can get things done more easily and get
| gratification quicker. It really sucks, and Burkeman's
| recommendation of focusing on only one project at a time until
| you're done makes a lot of sense.
|
| That said, it also requires a lot of determination to see
| something through. I think for me that is one of the most
| difficult things: having sufficient motivation to accomplish a
| task despite the difficulties. There has to be a great reward on
| the other side in order to push through the tough stuff. Only a
| few times in my life have I felt that sort of motivation for
| projects, and I'm not really sure what the throughline was
| between them, but I hope to capture that energy again someday.
| ubac wrote:
| Really agree with this. The whole "trying to do 8 projects at
| once is actually a coping mechanism because it lets you lie to
| yourself more easily about how little you can really finish"
| was a light bulb moment for me
| hardwaregeek wrote:
| This is especially true with books for me. I've discovered that
| I need to be exceedingly single threaded for books. Reading
| multiple books just leads to finishing none of them or dropping
| all of them except for one
| leobg wrote:
| I once read a book halfway through only to realize that I had
| already read it years before. And when I happen to stumble
| upon my notes from some book that I've read, I'm sometimes
| surprised and have zero recollection of ever having read it.
| I'm probably somewhere around the thousand to two thousand
| book mark. Sometimes I think that, even if I don't remember
| the contents consciously, the books might still be
| influencing my thinking and my judgement in some positive
| way. But sometimes I think that, perhaps, it's really just a
| chasing after wind. That ,,next book" is always as shiny as
| those new headphones from Amazon, or that new productivity
| tool. The truth is probably somewhere in the middle.
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(page generated 2021-09-23 23:01 UTC)